The Tuesday deadline for the DOJ
Today, Tuesday, June 12 is the deadline set up by House Intelligence Committee Chairman Devin Nunes for the DOJ to provide documents concerning the spy/informer Stefan Halper and his mission involving the Trump Campaign. The Committee has been waiting for months for the documents. Nunes would like to know what Halper's instructions were among other things. The DOJ (Deputy AG Rosenstein) has been stonewalling, as he usually does with oversight committees.
Nunes has gone after the DOJ for almost a year over information concerning it's surveillance of the Trump campaign. The two questions now are these: Does the DOJ finally make today's deadline? And does Nunes finally make good on his threats to hold in contempt & impeach Deputy AG Rosenstein if he dosen't get the documents?
One way or another, if the documents aren't provided the DOJ, it will be considered as obstructing Congress:
http://video.foxnews.com/v/5796196331001/?#sp=show-clips
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"In a letter sent Friday to Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, Nunes said the records should be provided to all committee members "and designated staff" rather than just the so-called "Gang of Eight" -- which refers to Republican and Democratic leaders in both houses of Congress as well as top lawmakers from the intelligence panels.
"DOJ continues to obfuscate and delay its production using an array of tactics, such as incorrectly categorizing the requested documents as Gang-of-Eight-level material in order to limit access," wrote Nunes, referring to an April 30 subpoena for the documents. "Such conduct by DOJ is unacceptable because the Gang-of-Eight is a legal fiction that has no basis outside of the confines of Presidential approval and reporting of covert actions."
Nunes also wrote, "Your continued refusal to permit Members of Congress and designated staff to review the requested documents is obstruction of a lawful Congressional investigation."
I wouldn't trust those crooks to produce anything legitimate. I don't think the Obama Administration turned over all that was requested during the Benghazi investigation.
The tide is changing and more people are becoming aware of the corruption that went on during the last Presidency.
Nunes is apparently feeling left out, it's been months since he has properly kissed Trump's ass.
Hello Vic. Despite the importance of what is going on between the DOJ and Congress it's not surprising that no one on the left wants to be bothered with it. It is after all very dangerous territory for them. Obstructing Congress is a very serious charge, even more so when it is being done by an official arm of the government. I don't think either one of us needs a law to degree to know this is what the DOJ is doing.
The DOJ is a part of the Executive branch of our government. Trump's domain. Trump dosn't have a problem with all of the documents being revealed. So what is going on? Who is authorizing the obstruction? A clue. The deep state still has enough power and influence to keep things mucked up.
You might be surprised at how Rosenstein has responded to Congressional oversight - one hour ago:
Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein threatened to “subpoena” emails, phone records and other documents from lawmakers and staff on a Republican-led House committee during a tense meeting earlier this year, according to emails reviewed by Fox News documenting the encounter and reflecting what aides described as a "personal attack."
The emails memorialized a January 2018 closed-door meeting involving senior FBI and Justice Department officials as well as members of the House Intelligence Committee. The account claimed Rosenstein threatened to turn the tables on the committee's inquiries regarding the Russia probe.
“The DAG [Deputy Attorney General Rosenstein] criticized the Committee for sending our requests in writing and was further critical of the Committee’s request to have DOJ/FBI do the same when responding,” the committee's then-senior counsel for counterterrorism Kash Patel wrote to the House Office of General Counsel. “Going so far as to say that if the Committee likes being litigators, then ‘we [DOJ] too [are] litigators, and we will subpoena your records and your emails,’ referring to HPSCI [House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence] and Congress overall.”
A second House committee staffer at the meeting backed up Patel’s account, writing: “Let me just add that watching the Deputy Attorney General launch a sustained personal attack against a congressional staffer in retaliation for vigorous oversight was astonishing and disheartening. ... Also, having the nation’s #1 (for these matters) law enforcement officer threaten to 'subpoena your calls and emails' was downright chilling.”
The committee staffer noted that Rosenstein’s comment could be interpreted as meaning the department would “vigorously defend a contempt action" -- which might be expected. But the staffer continued, "I also read it as a not-so-veiled threat to unleash the full prosecutorial power of the state against us.”
It's possible that in all the back and forths I missed this. I must remind you that I have as little trust for FOX as I do of any part of MSM. In his case though, after looking a little further I find this story to probably be credible. Why wasn't it a bigger story in January or February? Sorry, silly question. Media preferences.
It was only a month ago that we were besieged with stories about how rotten it was for Nunes to be threatening the DOJ with subpoenas and if I remember right, Trump was talking about forcing the turnover of DOJ papers.
The battle lines are being drawn and we citizens have a real problem on our hands.
Congress and elected officials are easy targets when it comes to focusing on lies, obstruction, cheating and screwing the public. They are appalling. By being so, they have provided a smokescreen to distract prying eyes from paying attention to who is doing what within our bureaucracies. Not just the appointees but including supervisory and managerial Civil Service staff. Many of whom I suspect of being practitioners of the Manifesto.
Who gets the blame for a computer glitch? A mis-filing? An accidental eraser? How hard is it for a person considered to be not much more than office staff to "accidentally" make these things happen? Civil Service employees are primarily good people with honest intentions. It doesn't take a great number of people to manipulate our bureaucracies, just enough in the right places.
What I believe we may have now is Deepers
(deep state people) in our bureaucracies, working with other Deepers in other branches of government including Congress to attack each other. Ludicrous is the first word to come to mind . Not to anyone who understands the methodology and purpose of the manifesto.
No one to trust except ourselves. President Trump is about the only politician in recent years that has shown at least the willingness to keep promises that he makes. Yes, I am a Trump supporter. I don't want to trust anybody that much if you know what I mean.
Upcoming midterm elections are important. The only part of government we can have a direct hand in regaining control of is Congress. We are actually pretty close to achieving that. The Republican establishment is quickly losing it's hold and numbers. The Democratic leadership is the most vulnerable to losing out to more moderate American liberals. We should actually have a better crop of candidates to choose from this time.
I have been all over the place in this comment. It's all connected. String theory.
It took place in private hearings. However, the AG appeared on Fox News to say that, although he wasn't there, he doubted that his deputy AG would say something like that. Right now, it is strictly a "he said/she said".
Unfortunately, it is well into this clip:
I believe Trump has the ultimate authority to have the documents and memos released, and without redactions. Wonder what the left keeps trying to hide? I thought the Democrats were all about transparency.
Aren't you the one who reminded another poster that the DOJ works for Trump? I thought he was a Republican, when did he become a leftist?
You must not realize how much comprehension is needed to keep up in the political world.
Trump is a registered Republican. Before that he was a registered Democrat. He wasn't the first to switch Parties for an opportunity to run for the White House. Trump didn't "join" the Republican Party he took it over and away from the dunderhead Republican leadership.
Trashing the Republican leadership of yesterday has always been one of my favorite activities. Go for it. Pretending that Trump is one of them is blatantly disingenuous.
The President does have the authority. Push President Trump into a corner and he will turn to the use of Mandates. That is not the way he wants to do things, his name is not Obama.
The President has also said he wants to drain the swamp. Even though we occasionally grow bored and frustrated and wish he would just do it, consider that the longer these various investigations continue, the more bad apples are being outed on both sides.
You are correct here. The republican party is now the trump party. Moderates are kicked to the curb.
Yep, Trump likes people like Kim because, in his words, "They are strong", the problem here is, he doesn't understand true strength, he wishes he could be like him but, as he has said there is something standing in his way, it is called the Constitution, if it wasn't for the pesky little piece of parchment he would be able to do what he really wants, be just like Kim Jung Un and, Putin, jail his critics, kill Mueller and, anyone else who stood in his way of being the dictator that he so wants to be.
He was also the one that said Donald Rump should be King. My mistake - or was it Tacos below?
That was greg who then pretended it was a joke.
Somebody needs to be reminded who they work for.
You hit the nail on the head.
They DON'T WORK FOR DONALD RUMP.
Actually they do. The DOJ is part of the Executive Branch.
No, they do not. See Galen's comment below. They work for the people - NOT DONALD RUMP.
Yeah, they work for the American people, not Donald Rump.
Deadline? Schmeadline! For weeks now Vic has told us, "Any Day Now". Nothing. Not one damn thing...
Mueller has indicted twenty conspirators and issued 100 indictments, so far. Or, didn't you all know that?
While the righteous righties falsely claim Obama was corrupt zero ranking Obama officials ever indicted.
You seem a little confused. Are you talking about the IG report? That will be released Thursday!!! And it was held up by the Justice Department making redactions.
So we will here from you Thursday, right?
The smelly substance will begin hitting the whirling device.
Yep, and, it's going to hit Trump and, the Republicans square in the face.
We won't see certain people here
Well, the IG's report is out. Nothing New. Nothing Illegal. Nothing Burger...
Basically it says government employees may have personal political opinions but it reflects badly on their agencies when they become public one way or the other though, again, there is noting illegal about being a human being holding or expressing personal opinions. As far as Comey? Well, no doubt he could have handled things differently but the IG certainly didn't question his motives which seem pure and if anything ? Maybe, but hind sight is 20-20. Nothing Comey did as regards the Russiagate is even an issue in the report. Anyone expecting any bombshells that would delegitimize Mueller or his investigation got nothing. They IG's report doesn't even go there. Call it whatever you want but there is getting around it. This IG's report is bad news for Trump. Hilary's e-mail shit has been investigated to death and no laws were broken but even if they had been it has zero to do with and is no excuse for Trump and Company teaming up with Vlad Putin and his Troll Army to thwart the will of the American electorate during our last election cycle. Mueller has already indicted twenty conspirators in Russiagate including over 100 indictment and that was just for starters. The principals have yet to be charged so hold onto your seats because it is gonna make the gop sick...
Where did it say that? When the lead investigator say's we will stop Trump from becoming President, it's serious. let's see what FBI director Wray has to say about Strzok any minute.
As far as Comey? Well, no doubt he could have handled things differently but the IG certainly didn't question his motives which seem pure and if anything ? Maybe, but hind sight is 20-20.
I thought it was devastating for Comey. What it tells us about Comey is that he created serious questions via his actions, which imo, have led to political narratives. Do you agree?
Nothing Comey did as regards the Russiagate is even an issue in the report.
The report wasn't about the Russia investigation. The IG is investigating that now, that will be the next report.
Hilary's e-mail shit has been investigated to death
This looked at FBI conduct of that investigation.
There is still a lot here to be mined, plus I want to hear from Wray tonight
People who read the report for themselves rather than relying on your liberal spin crib notes will quickly recognize your lack of accuracy and attempts at distraction and distortion. Startig with : Q What was this IG investigation about?
Ahhh come on ya'll can still come and chat about the good old pre indictment days.
Both sides should wait for the convictions then they can cry together. With circumstantial evidence, innuendos and secret testimony, indictments are easy to achieve. All an indictment means is that something should be looked into further The more somebody tries to make an indictment the final proof, the less likely it is to hold water.
Actually a grand jury indictment means there is sufficient evidence for the prosecution and trial of a defendant.
Well that happened too. I for one have looked for your in depth analysis of the report that you've been hyping for weeks. Perhaps your taking the time to annotate you copy of the report and will get back to us tomorrow.
In a Grand Jury investigation/hearing only the prosecution presents uncontested evidence. I for one would not want an issue of serious proportions finalized in such a fashion.
It isn't over yet. There is certainly nothing in this report or what has been said on public television that puts the FBI in a position of being trustworthy. Comey? I would rather not give that bum more air time. He was insubordinate. That's enough for a firing.
From what I have learned about the report so far there is a possibility that the IG is keeping it close to the vest. Let me interject here that I think he should. A lot of finger pointing but no recommendations for criminal charges. A rather strong chewing of the rear end but no condemnations. The IG has kept his office above reproach. He has left the door open for further investigations. He has also given us a strong indication of where we should be looking and what for.
This is not a pro or anti Trump issue. This is not a Rep v Dem item. It isn't even a left versus right spy v spy escapade. It's not even truly political.
Would the average person know what I mean when I say the " Practice of Battle is a cover for the "Art of War"?
Well since a trial usually follows, the indictment is just a step in the process.
Actually, from everything I have read and heard, including Wray's press conference, there is PLENTY to believe that the FBI was and IS trustworthy.
Yet THAT isn't why the right desperately wanted this investigation, is it?
The IG released the whole report today. It's online, go read it.
Which I have no doubt irks most of the conservatives here to no end. They were counting on it so.
Oh it condemns the hell out of Comey.
Save me some reading and cite which pages have those tidbits.
Actually it is ALL of those things.
Not being 'the average person', I wouldn't know.
Actually within the context that I am speaking in it is highly probable that you are more average than you think. I consider myself average and I don't find that a bad thing.
You obviously are only out looking for raucous argument. Based upon previous comments by yourself I can only conclude that that is your favorite pastime.
Happy to disappoint you.
Corruption within the very foundations that support our government has been revealed. A ray of transparency. Does anyone believe this is a one off affair? Does anybody believe it is only relegated to the FBI - DOJ - and other more politically involved Departments?
The corruption is there and it shouldn't be regardless of who the President is.
I'm sure you are
Perhaps your taking the time to annotate you copy of the report and will get back to us tomorrow.
Saturday.
That right there, will hurt any obstruction case based on Comey's firing.
Stick your conspiracy nonsense where the sun don't shine. Reasonable people are tired of this crap.
Reworking your previous discredited conspiracy theories is a constant theme of conservative "thinking" these days.
What a tragedy for our country that right wing media has brainwashed so much of the population.
What context is that?
I didn't say that it was.
Which of my questions led you to that conclusion.
You could have concluded a lot of things. My favorite pastime has nothing to do with this site.
What's disappointing is that instead of answering my relevant questions, you make ad hominem comments.
Another unsubstantiated proclamation. Cite the corruption that was revealed in the report please.
Please be specific about WTF 'affair' you are talking about.
'It' what?
The report found NO corruption. PERIOD, full stop.
Most of the conservatives here stated that Horowitz was a stand up guy and insisted that they would accept his findings. In fact, they challenged liberals to make that same vow.
Now, instead of admitting that 'there was NO there, there' they desperately cherry pick single sentences from the 500+ page report in a desperate attempt to prove that the report finds what they wanted it to find. It doesn't and pretending that it does is disingenuous and juvenile.
You can post proclamations all you want but I prefer to base my comments and arguments on the FACTS in front of us. It becomes a 'raucous argument' [which some people call a debate] when certain members insist on being willfully obtuse about those facts. I have found that after meticulously picking apart their fallacious argument, and supporting my own with facts, they either lock/remove their seed or disappear from the seed.
Based on just this comment by yourself, I can only conclude that you think that your uninformed opinion about the report is more relevant than the actual findings in the report.
Have you downloaded the full document yet? All 500+ pages?
I doubt that I am any less informed and qualified to form an opinion than anybody else here.
Nobody is locking down or disappearing from this thread. At least Vic and I aren't. You know the two people you are head hunting for on this thread. Fact is you are doing it all over the place. A desperate attempt at deflection.
What are you afraid of? I don't see how any patriotic "American" can consider investigating corruption in our infrastructure as being all political. Your position is tenuous. The only people who stand to benefit from the smokescreen of politics are those that support the deep state.
For those who wish to form their own opinions here is a https://www.lawfareblog.com/document-justice-department-inspector-general-final-re..."> link to a location where you can download (pdf) the complete document. There is nothing like having the exact words right in front of you. It's lengthy but please don't skim or cherry pick. Corruption in our government is to important an issue to take lightly.
Vic, I'm not the one that has been ticking down the time clock on this report for weeks. Nor am I the one that stated:
The onus is on you.
Yep.
Never said you weren't.
Never said you would.
Bullshit.
Well gee owl, it seems to me that any review of you reply to my post will show that you haven't answer even one fucking question I asked and instead have dedicated yourself so far on ad hominem comments. I also note that you failed to support your assertion that corruption was part of the findings.
Where EXACTLY did I say it was. Please quote my comment.
Again with the proclamations, sans substantiation.
Please cite the pages that contain findings that there is 'corruption' in 'our infrastructure'.
Iv'e submitted the article for your approval
Nunes needs investigated for obstruction. He has made his committee irrelevant for future investigations, it is now nothing more than a political tool of the Trumpublicans, who are trying to protect Trump by trashing the DOJ and putting out fake reports. What a traitor, party over country.
Obstruction?
How so?
What Justice Dept. investigation has he shut down, or attempted to end? What, if any, authority does he have to shut down one??
You should know by now, any time a Republican controlled Congress tries to do their job and duty, it is obstructing the corruption of the Leftists in government and their desire to run a Communist state with the supposed Rights of the People being only on paper, ala the Soviet Union.
The repukes are the obstructionists - hiding all their own corruption.
Tick, tock, tick, tock.
Let's compare shall we?
Looks like the Republicans have a slight lead in that.
Cloture is not the same as obstruction. Cloture is the current procedure that the Senate is using to allow the minority party to have a major say in legislation. Frankly, they should go back to the original rules of "Moving the Previous Question".
Cloture is 1 form of obstruction, not all of them, but one that is easy to count. Some other forms of obstruction would be refusing to bring bills up to a vote, and blocking votes on open supreme court nominees.
Cloture is available to both the minority and the majority and is an individual practice that can be overturned when 60 votes are available in the Senate. Just because each party uses it as a club at times to get their way does not mean they are obstructing.
what a dreamer, watch out you could be deported! Trump loves Putin and now Kim who loves a communist dictator again?
Crackpot nonsense.
This is supposed to be out Thursday.
Funny though, ever since Gowdy and Ryan have come out and said that spygate was false, all eyes now fall on this.
From what I have read about it, the report is going to be more about actions and etiquette about FBI agents and not so much about Hillary herself.
I see neither side being happy with this, getting what they want or what they think it will be.
Nunes is nothing more than a lackey, his credibility was lost long ago via his own buffoonery.
Nunes campaign contributions and expenditures should be audited. Something is going on here behind the radar.