As a Nation, We Have Forgotten God

As a Nation, We Have Forgotten God
Via:   heartland-american
Created:   4 days ago
Comments:   312

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When I was a kid, there was an expression: “Stop the world. I want to get off.” Glancing at the headlines sometimes makes me feel that way.

For example, here are some stories highlighted on Drudge on Monday (8/6/18):

•A crackdown on free speech by Apple. They decide what is and what is not “hate.” Consequently, conspiracy theorist Alex Jones is now denied his platform.

•The #MeToo movement continues to speak out against alleged sexual predators, and CBS is working to weather a storm of allegations swirling around their CEO.

•Canada is calling for a boycott of the US.

•Sex with robots is a growing fad.

•The president is beleaguered by allegations of collusion with the Russians.

•Calls are going out for social media censorship of climate change “deniers.”

•In Chicago, 63 were shot over the weekend in a city with some of the strictest gun control laws. 44 of them were killedwithin 14 hours. As a colleague noted, “It’s like Fallujah, only worse.”

•Parkland victims protest the NRA…but the former have armed guards.

•Older Americans have money woes. The New York Times (8/5/18) reports: “The rate of people 65 and older filing for bankruptcy is three times what it was in 1991.”

Why is America seemingly sinking into the abyss? We have forgotten God. As a nation, just like as individuals, we reap what we sow.

Alexandr Solzhenitsyn, the great Russian writer and critic of the atheist USSR (who spent years imprisoned in one of Stalin’s gulags), once said: “…[W]hile I was still a child, I recall hearing a number of older people offer the following explanation for the great disasters that had befallen Russia: Men have forgotten God; that's why all this has happened.”

The Nobel-prize winning writer went on to say that he had read hundreds of books on the godless Soviet state and talked with many people about the murderous disaster it was, and he said no one provided a better explanation than those simple peasants: We have forgotten God.

Not to the same degree, but something similar could be said about America. We have forgotten God, and are reaping the consequences.

About 200 years ago, Yale University president Timothy Dwight (1752-1817) warned us against forgetting God: "Without religion we may possibly retain the freedom of savages, bears, and wolves, but not the freedom of New England. If our religion were gone, our state of society would perish with it and nothing would be left which would be worth defending."

Dwight also added: "Where there is no religion, there is no morality....With the loss of religion...the ultimate foundation of confidence is blown up; and the security of life, liberty and property are buried in ruins." 

Why? If there is no God, there is no one to hold us accountable. That is why so many deny God, when they know deep down, “Of course, there is a God.”

About 50 years after America’s independence, Alexis de Tocqueville, a notable Frenchman, came to these shores to assess the new nation. He wrote his famous observations in 1835 in Democracy in America, a book that is still in print, in which he noted: “It must never be forgotten that religion gave birth to Anglo-American society.”

One of the greatest American speakers in the 19th century was Massachusetts Senator Daniel Webster. He’s depicted in statues in DC and is the center character in a large painting in Boston’s Faneuil Hall.

Webster once declared, “Finally, let us not forget the religious character of our origin. Our fathers were brought hither by their high veneration for the Christian religion. They journeyed by its light, and labored in its hope. They sought to incorporate its principles with the elements of their society, and to diffuse its influence through all their institutions, civil, political, or literary.”

The famous orator also opined, “We live under the only government that ever existed which was framed by...deliberate consultations of the people. Miracles do not cluster. That which has happened but once in 6,000 years cannot be expected to happen often. Such a government, once gone, might leave a void, to be filled, for ages, with revolution and tumult, riot and despotism.” [Emphasis added]

Revolution, tumult, and riot are becoming almost commonplace in America. We have a U.S. Congresswoman, Maxine Waters, declaring people should publically hound out and shame members of the Trump team. The minority leader in the House of Representatives, Nancy Pelosi, is wondering why there are not more “riots in the streets” against this administration.

During the days of the Civil War, our nation faced worse challenges. But Abraham Lincoln called for a national day of repentance and prayer in 1863, in which he warned us to stop forgetting God as a nation and to remember this truth: “those nations only are blessed whose God is the Lord.”

jrDiscussion - desc
Heartland American
1  Heartland American    4 days ago

“Why is America seemingly sinking into the abyss? We have forgotten God. As a nation, just like as individuals, we reap what we sow.

Alexandr Solzhenitsyn, the great Russian writer and critic of the atheist USSR (who spent years imprisoned in one of Stalin’s gulags), once said: “…[W]hile I was still a child, I recall hearing a number of older people offer the following explanation for the great disasters that had befallen Russia: Men have forgotten God; that's why all this has happened.”

The Nobel-prize winning writer went on to say that he had read hundreds of books on the godless Soviet state and talked with many people about the murderous disaster it was, and he said no one provided a better explanation than those simple peasants: We have forgotten God.

Not to the same degree, but something similar could be said about America. We have forgotten God, and are reaping the consequences.

About 200 years ago, Yale University president Timothy Dwight (1752-1817) warned us against forgetting God: "Without religion we may possibly retain the freedom of savages, bears, and wolves, but not the freedom of New England. If our religion were gone, our state of society would perish with it and nothing would be left which would be worth defending."

Dwight also added: "Where there is no religion, there is no morality....With the loss of religion...the ultimate foundation of confidence is blown up; and the security of life, liberty and property are buried in ruins." 

Why? If there is no God, there is no one to hold us accountable. That is why so many deny God, when they know deep down, “Of course, there is a God.”

About 50 years after America’s independence, Alexis de Tocqueville, a notable Frenchman, came to these shores to assess the new nation. He wrote his famous observations in 1835 in Democracy in America, a book that is still in print, in which he noted: “It must never be forgotten that religion gave birth to Anglo-American society.”

 
 
epistte
1.1  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @1    4 days ago
Dwight also added: "Where there is no religion, there is no morality....With the loss of religion...the ultimate foundation of confidence is blown up; and the security of life, liberty and property are buried in ruins." 

Religious belief is no guarantee of morality. Televangelists and the Catholic church prove that concept on almost a daily basis.

This seed is the logical equivalent of junk food. 

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.1  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @1.1    4 days ago

The absence of religion is a guarantee that morality will ultimately fail as will our constitutional Republic.  

 
 
321steve
1.1.2  321steve  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.1    4 days ago
The absence of religion is a guarantee that morality will ultimately fail as will our constitutional Republic.  

I wouldn't worry too much about an absents of religion considering how far back it goes. The failure of our constitutional republic if and when it fails will probably be cause by internal mismanagement. That's where my concern lies. 

 
 
MrFrost
1.1.3  MrFrost  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.1    4 days ago
The absence of religion is a guarantee that morality

BS. Religions cause more problems than they solve.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religious_leaders_convicted_of_crimes

Violent crimes[edit]

Non-violent crimes[edit]

I can list a LOT more. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_terrorism

No one needs religion to tell them what is right and wrong. 

In the late 1300's Christians rounded up 85% of the Jews is Europe and executed them because, "God", told them that it was the Jews that was spreading the plague. 

"Guarantee of morality"..... Give me a break, the right wing gave up the moral high ground when they voted for trump...END.....OF.....STORY. 

 
 
epistte
1.1.4  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.1    4 days ago
The absence of religion is a guarantee that morality will ultimately fail as will our constitutional Republic.  

People have all the religion that they want because everyone has the right to believe and worship as they choose, but the state cannot force religion on any of us or base secular laws on religious ideals.

 Morality is not based in religious belief as history has shown many times over. Morality is a subjective secular idea and it always has been. 

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.5  sandy-2021492  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.1    4 days ago

What's the percentage of prisoners who are atheists, again?

 
 
Tessylo
1.1.6  Tessylo  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.1    4 days ago

You cannot legislate morality.  Religion and god are bupkis when it comes to the law, everything.  

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.7  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Tessylo @1.1.6    4 days ago
You cannot legislate morality. 

Yep, we found this out with the Civil Rights Act.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.8  It Is ME  replied to  Tessylo @1.1.6    4 days ago
You cannot legislate morality. 

Kinda like the "Choose your bathroom" laws ? 

Kennedy put man in space.

Obama put man in the women's bathroomThumbs Up 2

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.9  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.8    4 days ago
Kinda like the "Choose your bathroom" laws ? 

That was pretty much the opposite of legislating morality.  Telling transgender people they must use the restroom on their birth certificate is legislating morality.  Allowing them to use the bathroom of the gender to which they've transitioned is not.

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.10  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.8    4 days ago
Kinda like the "Choose your bathroom" laws ? 

Kennedy put man in space.

Obama put man in the women's bathroom

Man passes out..jpg

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.11  It Is ME  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.1.10    4 days ago

One good turn deserves another. 

Bush, Bush, Bush ! laughing dude

I luvs me some Balance. winking

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.12  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.9    4 days ago
That was pretty much the opposite of legislating morality. 

Hokey Pucks !

Forcing "many" to go against their own morals for a "few" others moral wants, IS doing exactly what you claim "Isn't".

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.13  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.11    4 days ago

Well, I'll tell ya what when ya'all remember that Trump is president now and, it's his rhetoric that is causing things like Charlottesville, not Obama I'll quit putting up that meme.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.14  It Is ME  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.1.13    4 days ago
it's his rhetoric that is causing things like Charlottesville

Gosh.… Is that the problem ?

Or ….…

…. is it really just Something Else ?

 
 
A. Macarthur
1.1.15  A. Macarthur  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.1    4 days ago
The absence of religion is a guarantee that morality will ultimately fail as will our constitutional Republic.  

There is no act of LOVE, FAIRNESS, COMPASSION AND/OR HUMAN KINDNESS that could not be just as well extended in the complete absence of organized religion …

WITHOUT THE MANY DOWNSIDES!

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.16  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.12    4 days ago
Forcing "many" to go against their own morals

Did somebody lock you into a women's restroom stall against your will?

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.17  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.16    4 days ago
Did somebody lock you into a women's restroom stall against your will?

Whooooooosh !

Right over your head huh.

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.18  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.17    4 days ago

Nobody is being forced to do anything.  People are being allowed (not forced) to use the restroom that coincides with their gender.

Why would you want a trans woman using the men's restroom, or vice versa?  Why do you want to endanger trans people?

You don't want to use the stall next to a man who was born female?  Tough.  I don't want to use the stall next to someone talking loudly on their cell phone.  We don't always get what we want, though, and it doesn't kill us.  It just annoys us.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.19  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.18    4 days ago
Nobody is being forced to do anything.

Yes they are ! Makes No Sense

Women who don't want "confused men" in Their restrooms, are being "FORCED" to put up with it, and vise versa !

You'd think that the feminists would be out there sticking up for "Normal" women over "Confused Men" !

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.20  Phoenyx13  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.19    4 days ago
Women who don't want "confused men" in Their restrooms, are being "FORCED" to put up with it, and vise versa !

are you telling me that those women absolutely have to be in that restroom at the exact same time as "confused men" - they have no other options ? are you telling me that you want to purposefully endanger those "confused men" by putting them in the men's restroom when they look like women and live their lives accordingly ?

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.21  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.19    4 days ago

I've also never been forced into a restroom, and therefore never been forced to use a restroom with a trans woman.

Public restrooms have stalls.  I have used public restrooms with trans women, and even used public restrooms with cis men.  None of us saw anybody's naughty bits.  Because stalls.

And nobody made me enter the restroom, at all.

Nobody is being forced to do anything, unless you're advocating for making people use public restrooms.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.22  It Is ME  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.20    4 days ago
are you telling me that those women absolutely have to be in that restroom at the exact same time as "confused men"

"Ladies", a "Confused man" just walked into the restroom we were already using. Wipe your asses quickly and get the fuck out.....NOW !"

Did that help ? Face Palm

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.23  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.22    4 days ago

And, what?

Pees?

So what?  When I use a public restroom, I generally shut the stall door like normal people.  Don't you?

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.24  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.21    4 days ago
Public restrooms have stalls.

I don't care WTF they have. There is a reason the "Sign" outside the restroom says "Men's Room" and "Women's Room".

Where are the "Feminists anyway.

So much for "Women's Rights" from them huh !

It just isn't "Prudent" at this time...….AGAIN !

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.25  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.14    4 days ago
Gosh.… Is that the problem ?

Or ….…

…. is it really just Something Else ?

Well, it is the rhetoric combined with the stupidity of ignorant people who have to blame someone for their problems, after all it isn't their fault that nothing works for them, that their marriages and, relationships fail, that they can't get a decent job because they never got a college education and, can only work labor jobs for minimum wage, I mean it has to be someone else's fault, like those darned immigrants, yep, that's it, that's who's fault it is, them there brown people who come across the border. I mean after all Trump, Merika.

And, if you can't tell this is sarcasm, I feel for ya.

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.26  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.24    4 days ago
There is a reason the "Sign" outside the restroom says "Men's Room" and "Women's Room".

And what is that reason?

So we're not exposed to the unwanted sight of the genitalia of someone of the opposite sex?

Stalls prevent the unwanted sight of all genitalia, so problem solved.

Does this guy belong in a women's restroom?

Image result for female to male transition photos

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.27  It Is ME  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.1.25    4 days ago
the stupidity of ignorant people who have to blame someone for their problems

That's the ONLY problem. Always has been.

"Some" folks just can't seem to get themselves out of their own created jams. They are the loudest, and the media LOVES to pick them up as an "All Folks say" Mega title to their warped reporting.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.28  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.26    4 days ago
And what is that reason?

Deleted

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.29  Phoenyx13  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.22    4 days ago
"Ladies", a "Confused man" just walked into the restroom we were already using. Wipe your asses quickly and get the fuck out.....NOW !" Did that help ?

how are you aware that there's a "confused man" in the restroom - do you regularly check everyone's genitals in the restroom ? Face Palm

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.30  It Is ME  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.29    4 days ago
how are you aware that there's a "confused man" in the restroom

It's the law !

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.31  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.30    4 days ago

It's the law that there must be a trans woman in the restrooms?

Who is funding this law?  Who's hiring trans women to stay in the restroom all the time so that you know there's a trans woman in there?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.32  Phoenyx13  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.30    4 days ago
It's the law !

we are aware that bathrooms separate by gender, again: 

how are you aware that there's a "confused man" in the restroom - do you regularly check everyone's genitals in the restroom ?
 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.33  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.28    4 days ago

I'm not aware of any moral that says I can't pee on the other side of a wall from, well, anybody.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.34  It Is ME  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.32    4 days ago
we are aware

No you're not !

Someone else had to tell you what you WILL do.....by Law !

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.35  Phoenyx13  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.34    4 days ago
No you're not ! Someone else had to tell you what you WILL do.....by Law !

we are aware of the laws and that bathrooms separate by genders - so transgender women belong in the women's restroom, again:

how are you aware that there's a "confused man" in the restroom - do you regularly check everyone's genitals in the restroom ?

why do you keep avoiding answering this question ?

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.36  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.33    4 days ago
I'm not aware of any moral that says I can't pee on the other side

Try it in "public" ...... just ONCE here ! 

You aren't in "France" anymore. Makes No Sense

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.37  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.34    4 days ago
Someone else had to tell you what you WILL do.....by Law !

Someone told me I HAD to pee next to a trans woman?

Dammit, I've been breaking the law this whole time.  I've only peed next to a trans woman once, that I know of.  Is it required every time I pee in public?  Do I have to go find a trans woman and drag her to the restroom with me?  Or will a trans woman be installed there permanently, so that I can know, as you claim to know, that there is a trans woman in there.  Cuz frankly, that would be more convenient than finding one, and if it's going to be law that I HAVE TO pee next to a trans woman, then I think a trans woman should be provided for me.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.38  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.31    4 days ago
It's the law that there must be a trans woman in the restrooms?

Face Palm

I here the circus has an opening. crazy

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.39  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.36    4 days ago

Never been to France.

I have shared a restroom with a trans woman, and cis men, and lived to tell the tale.  I even managed to get out of there without seeing anybody's genitals, or having mine seen by anybody.

Ah, the wonders of minding one's own business while peeing.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.40  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.37    4 days ago
Someone told me I HAD to pee next to a trans woman?

If you had actually paid attention to things other than the "Bachelorette" or "Naked and Afraid" ......They Did !

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.41  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.38    4 days ago

I can't help it if you got undone by your own statements.  On the bright side, watching you do so was more amusing than the last circus I saw.

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.42  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.40    4 days ago

And they were forced to be on those shows, were they?

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.43  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.41    4 days ago

My statements remain the same. Yours are the ones that are unhinged.

Now how did that happen. chuckle

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.44  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.42    4 days ago
And they were forced to be on those shows, were they?

What shows ?

 
 
arkpdx
1.1.45  arkpdx  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.23    4 days ago
Don't you?

Not when I take a leak .I usually just stand facing the wall in front of the pisser quite out in the open .

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.46  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.39    4 days ago
I have shared a restroom with a trans woman, and cis men

How do you know. There are Walled stalls.....right ?

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.47  It Is ME  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.35    4 days ago

Why can't you admit YOU were TOLD by law, what you will accept.

The "Game" is afoot ! Thumbs Up 2

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.48  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.44    4 days ago

I actually misread your statement.

Now, who has told you, or anyone, that they have to use the restroom with a trans person?

Nobody.

You do not HAVE TO, as a matter of law, enter a public restroom at all.  It might be inconvenient to avoid them, but it is not illegal.  So you are not being FORCED to pee next to anybody you don't want to.

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.49  sandy-2021492  replied to  arkpdx @1.1.45    4 days ago

Stalls are an option that you choose not to exercise.

Last I checked, women's restrooms don't have urinals, for obvious reasons, so anybody using those restrooms would be using a stall.

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.50  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.46    4 days ago

The trans woman was fairly obviously trans.

The cis men - it was a crowd, so both restrooms were open to everyone, and the lines to both restrooms were mixed evenly of men and women.  The chances that all the men in that line were trans men were slim to none.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.51  Phoenyx13  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.47    4 days ago
Why can't you admit YOU were TOLD by law, what you will accept.

sorry, doesn't apply, especially since in many places it's against the law for transgender women to use the public bathroom that corresponds with their gender identity like everyone else does. Care to try again ?

another example of your statement above being false ? look at same sex marriage - it's law and still many people don't accept it.

any other inane statements ? Face Palm

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.52  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.48    4 days ago
Now, who has told you, or anyone, that they have to use the restroom with a trans person?

Why.....President Obama and his administration did.

if a transgender guy walks in to the bathroom your in....your shit outa luck on complaining.....unless you like that kinda stuff.

Like I said, Stop watching supposed Reality shows and get out in the world.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.53  It Is ME  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.51    4 days ago
sorry, doesn't apply

Sorry.….APPLIES !

"another example of your statement above being false ? look at same sex marriage"

When one has a need to "Change" the subject being discussed, I knows you are lost ! Digging a wholeNot Impressed

We're done …...or more to the point......YOU'RE done. Disappointment

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.54  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.43    4 days ago
My statements remain the same. Yours are the ones that are unhinged.

Yours were unhinged from the get-go.  You claim to know that there's always a trans woman in a restroom, because that's the law.  We both know it's not true.

You claim you and I are being forced to go to the restroom with people of the opposite gender.  That's also not true.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.55  Phoenyx13  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.52    4 days ago
Why.....President Obama and his administration did.

so you are stating that President Obama and his administration stated - "you must use the same bathroom as a transgender individual, you cannot use a different bathroom, you cannot just wait to go to the bathroom later, in fact you must use that bathroom at the exact same time and check their genitals to make sure they are a transgender individual" ?? Face Palm

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.56  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.40    4 days ago

BTW, never seen another episode of either show.  Just like I've never been to France.  Any more assumptions?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.57  Phoenyx13  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.53    4 days ago
Sorry.….APPLIES ! Next ?

sorry, doesn't apply, especially since in many places it's against the law for transgender women to use the public bathroom that corresponds with their gender identity like everyone else does. Care to try again ?

another example of your statement above being false ? look at same sex marriage - it's law and still many people don't accept it.

any other inane statements ? Face Palm

next ? Eye Roll (btw, it's not changing the topic, topic is still transgender and bathroom use, same sex marriage was brought up as an example to disprove your inane and untrue statement: "Why can't you admit YOU were TOLD by law, what youwillaccept." - just because it's law does not mean it's accepted - most people figured that out already.)

looks like you're done chuckle

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.58  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.53    4 days ago
When one has a need to "Change" the subject being discussed, one knows the other is lost ! 

Who changed the subject to Obama?  We were talking about god.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.59  It Is ME  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.50    4 days ago
The trans woman was fairly obviously trans. The cis men - it was a crowd, so both restrooms were open to everyone, a

I believe you. Eye Roll

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.60  sandy-2021492  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.55    4 days ago
so you are stating that President Obama and his administration stated - "you must use the same bathroom as a transgender individual, you cannot use a different bathroom, you cannot just wait to go to the bathroom later, in fact you must use that bathroom at the exact same time and check their genitals to make sure they are a transgender individual" ?? 

Right?  Our local mall's restrooms are disgusting at all hours of the day.  I can hold it for hours, rather than use those restrooms.  Uncle Sam sure isn't forcing me into a restroom, if my own bladder can't.

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.61  sandy-2021492  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.59    4 days ago

Doesn't really matter what you do or don't believe.  We've all seen an example of your "reality".

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.62  It Is ME  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.28    4 days ago

But sooooo True !

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.63  Phoenyx13  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.60    4 days ago
Right?  Our local mall's restrooms are disgusting at all hours of the day.  I can hold it for hours, rather than use those restrooms.  Uncle Sam sure isn't forcing me into a restroom, if my own bladder can't.

well apparently it's set by law for all of the nation by President Obama that you must use the restroom if a transgender individual is in there  and you must accept this on every level - so i guess you better start checking everyone's genitals when you are in the restroom from now on like some other posters apparently do.

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.64  sandy-2021492  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.63    4 days ago

I have to check everyone's genitals and use a disgusting restroom?

This is why I hate shopping.

 
 
Dulay
1.1.65  Dulay  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.1.7    4 days ago
Yep, we found this out with the Civil Rights Act.

Actually, the Civil Rights Act had NOTHING to do with 'morality'. It was and IS about equity and inclusion. 

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.66  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.27    4 days ago
That's the ONLY problem. Always has been. "Some" folks just can't seem to get themselves out of their own created jams. They are the loudest, and the media LOVES to pick them up as an "All Folks say" Mega title to their warped reporting.

You mean like this guy?

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.67  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Dulay @1.1.65    4 days ago
Actually, the Civil Rights Act had NOTHING to do with 'morality'. It was and IS about equity and inclusion. 

Not the point I was making Dulay. You can make laws like the Civil Rights Act but, there will always be people who will buck the law, just like they do the Civil Rights Act, that is the point Dulay.

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.68  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Dulay @1.1.65    4 days ago
Actually, the Civil Rights Act had NOTHING to do with 'morality'. It was and IS about equity and inclusion. 

Not the point I was making Dulay. You can make laws like the Civil Rights Act but, there will always be people who will buck the law, just like they do the Civil Rights Act, that is the point Dulay.

 
 
Dulay
1.1.69  Dulay  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.1.67    4 days ago
You can make laws like the Civil Rights Act but, there will always be people who will buck the law, just like they do the Civil Rights Act, that is the point Dulay.

So how did passing the Civil Rights Act cause us to find out that we can't legislate morality? That was the posit you were replying to was it not? 

EVERY law has 'people who will buck' it, HENSE there are penalties attached.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.70  Phoenyx13  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.64    4 days ago
I have to check everyone's genitals and use a disgusting restroom? This is why I hate shopping.

sorry, but as it's been stated - this is a law apparently set by President Obama and his administration and since it's law we are all forced to accept it on every level including socially and morally Eye Roll

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.71  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Dulay @1.1.69    4 days ago
So how did passing the Civil Rights Act cause us to find out that we can't legislate morality? That was the posit you were replying to was it not? 

So, tell me, when did racism end? The day the Civil Rights Act was passed or, the day Obama was elected president or, was it more recent? Oh that's right we still have racists.

 
 
Skrekk
1.1.72  Skrekk  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.39    4 days ago
Ah, the wonders of minding one's own business while peeing.

If you were a True Christian you'd be fantasizing and fretting about the genitals of the person in the other stall.

 
 
Dulay
1.1.73  Dulay  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.1.71    4 days ago
So, tell me, when did racism end? The day the Civil Rights Act was passed or, the day Obama was elected president or, was it more recent? Oh that's right we still have racists.

First of all Galen, you failed to answer my questions yet obviously want me to answer yours.

Then you deflect from the original question of morality to one of race. BAD FORM. 

That being said, tell me Galen, is it your posit that the unless a law attains all of it's proposed goals, it is a failure?

Perhaps you can cite a law that meets your standard of completely eliminating the issue it was passed to address. 

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.74  sandy-2021492  replied to  Skrekk @1.1.72    4 days ago

Good thing I'm a nonbeliever, then.  Cuz that would be awkward when you both finish and stand next to each other to wash your hands.

 
 
Skrekk
1.1.75  Skrekk  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.74    4 days ago
Cuz that would be awkward when you both finish and stand next to each other to wash your hands.

That's a good time to grab 'em by the pussy especially if you washed your hands with cold water.

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.76  sandy-2021492  replied to  Skrekk @1.1.75    4 days ago

Apparently, I have to.  I've been told that I have to pee next to a trans woman.  How else am I gonna verify that I'm abiding by the law?

 
 
epistte
1.1.77  epistte  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.8    4 days ago
Kinda like the "Choose your bathroom" laws ? 

Kennedy put man in space.

Obama put man in the women's bathroom.

Transgendered people have been using the bathroom of their identity without incident for years and nobody cared until Fox News made an issue of it because it outraged their knuckle-dragging viewers. Transgendered do not choose their gender.  They are born that way and seek treatment to align their psychological gender identity with their physcial gender. 

How many trans people have harassed people in the bathroom vs. how many religious people and conservative politicians have harassed people in the bathroom?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.78  Phoenyx13  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.76    4 days ago
I've been told that I have to pee next to a trans woman

does that mean in the stall next to the trans woman or literally right next to herlaughing dude

 
 
Dulay
1.1.79  Dulay  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.46    4 days ago
How do you know. There are Walled stalls.....right ?

So that means that 'ladies' would have to have xray eyes to see a 'confused man' walk into the restroom in order to be duly outraged.

I suppose that women COULD post 'pickets' and tag team their bathroom use. Would you suggest rock, paper, scissors or drawing straws for who takes first 'look out'? 

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.80  Heartland American  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.8    3 days ago

Obama and progressives pass immorality laws.  

 
 
epistte
1.1.81  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.80    3 days ago
Obama and progressives pass immorality laws.  

Which laws are you referring to in this bump? 

1.)

2.)

3.)

4.)

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.83  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Dulay @1.1.73    3 days ago
First of all Galen, you failed to answer my questions yet obviously want me to answer yours. Then you deflect from the original question of morality to one of race. BAD FORM. 

Actually, I did answer your question, if you bother to look at what I've written in context to what I said originally Dulay. The person I answered originally Tessylo, said, "You can't legislate morality" my reply to Tessy was an example of trying to legislate a human emotion, racism, the premise was, if you can't legislate the end of racism, how can you legislate morality or, anything else dealing with human emotion or, mind set, the fact is, you can't. Follow the string and, you will see that is what I was saying the whole time.

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.1.84  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Dulay @1.1.73    3 days ago
That being said, tell me Galen, is it your posit that the unless a law attains all of it's proposed goals, it is a failure?

No, what I am saying is that there isn't a law that legislates morality or, in my example, racism that will work the way it would be intended. In the case of the Civil Rights Act, the intention was to give folks equality across the board but, all you have to do is listen to what people say and, you will realize that the Civil Rights Act only accomplished forcing government and, business to act in a more non-racist way, people on the other hand are still racist so, using that premise making morality laws will accomplish one thing, government and, business will be more moral but, it will still remain open for people to act morally in society, which most won't.

 
 
Kathleen/Butterfie
1.1.85  Kathleen/Butterfie  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.39    3 days ago

How did you know they were? Do they tell you? Could you tell by the way they looked? 

 
 
Kathleen/Butterfie
1.1.86  Kathleen/Butterfie  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.1.25    3 days ago

Then again, we have to take responsibility for actions too. We just can't blame "society" for everything we have done to ourselves as well.  Life is what you make of it, some have to work harder then others, but you can't sit back and feel sorry for yourself. I have seen teenagers starting out on the street that end up becoming lawyers and doctors. If you really want to make something of yourself, you can do it. There is plenty of opportunity for us all, you just have to have the right frame of mind and do the right thing and take it.

 
 
Gordy327
1.1.87  Gordy327  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.1    3 days ago
The absence of religion is a guarantee that morality will ultimately fail as will our constitutional Republic.  

Considering most of the population is religious to varying degrees, there is certainly no absence of it. So the 'ski is falling" trope doesn't work! Besides, morality is not dependent on religion. Morality is also subjective.

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.1.88  sandy-2021492  replied to  Kathleen/Butterfie @1.1.85    3 days ago

To me, some trans women can be fairly obvious, probably depending on when they transition.  There are traits which are difficult to change, such as an Adam's apple.  The trans woman had a fairly prominent Adam's apple.  As for the men, I'm playing the odds. In a crowd of men, one is much more likely to encounter cis men than trans men.

 
 
Dulay
1.1.89  Dulay  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.1.83    3 days ago

That's a crap load of equivocation. 

'I replied to a comment about legislating morality with an example of failure to legislate ''human emotions'.' 

Which looks like you're admitting that your 'original reply' was a deflection by equating morality to 'human emotions', a false equivalency. 

if you can't legislate the end of racism, how can you legislate morality or, anything else dealing with human emotion or, mind set, the fact is, you can't. 

'Human emotions' and 'mind set[s]' aren't equivalent either. 

The FACT is that we HAVE successfully legislated a change in mind set. There are a plethora of examples of that FACT, starting with moving from a mindset of Monarchy to a mindset of 'a government of, by and for the people' in which 'all men are created equal', an epiphany in governance. 

Slavery was a 'mind set', Native American genocide, removal and their children being removed from their family and 'assimilated' was a 'mind set', coverture was a 'mind set', child labor was a 'mind set', personal profit at the cost of our environment and/or the lives of workers was a 'mind set', slaughtering wildlife into extinction was a 'mind set' 

Every one of those 'mind sets' were eventually changed by Acts of Congress/legislation and are now utterly rejected by our society.

Are there STILL people in our society that think women should be 'property' or that dumping toxins into our water or air is just honky dory if it makes a buck? Yes, yes there are. Yet they cannot be characterize as a 'mind set' shared by the vast majority of our society and legislation had a great deal to do with reaching that goal. 

We have never refrained from passing laws just because there is a chance that legislation won't be 100% successful.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.90  It Is ME  replied to  Dulay @1.1.89    3 days ago

"Which looks like you're admitting that your 'original reply' was a deflection by equating morality to 'human emotions', a false equivalency."

Where does "Morality" come from ? Face Palm

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.91  Heartland American  replied to  Dulay @1.1.89    3 days ago

“Why is America seemingly sinking into the abyss? We have forgotten God. As a nation, just like as individuals, we reap what we sow.

Alexandr Solzhenitsyn, the great Russian writer and critic of the atheist USSR (who spent years imprisoned in one of Stalin’s gulags), once said: “…[W]hile I was still a child, I recall hearing a number of older people offer the following explanation for the great disasters that had befallen Russia: Men have forgotten God; that's why all this has happened.”

The Nobel-prize winning writer went on to say that he had read hundreds of books on the godless Soviet state and talked with many people about the murderous disaster it was, and he said no one provided a better explanation than those simple peasants: We have forgotten God.

Not to the same degree, but something similar could be said about America. We have forgotten God, and are reaping the consequences.”

 
 
Dulay
1.1.92  Dulay  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.1.84    3 days ago
No, what I am saying is that there isn't a law that legislates morality or, in my example, racism that will work the way it would be intended.

So is your posit that the Civil Rights Act had NO beneficial effect? Do tell...

In the case of the Civil Rights Act, the intention was to give folks equality across the board but,

Actually, that's false.

all you have to do is listen to what people say and, you will realize that the Civil Rights Act only accomplished forcing government and, business to act in a more non-racist way,

By passing the Civil Rights Act, the government VOLUNTEERED to be held responsible for acting under it's provisions.

As for businesses, citizens 'petitioned the government for redress' and the Civil Rights Act was the governments method of redress. The government has the Constitutional authority to regulate commerce and people who want to run a business that is covered by the CRA are rightly required to do so in a 'non-discriminatory' way.

Note that I say 'non-discriminatory' rather than 'non-racist' because the CRA isn't JUST about race, as anyone who has ever READ it, knows.

people on the other hand are still racist so, using that premise making morality laws will accomplish one thing, government and, business will be more moral but,

The PURPOSE of the CRA isn't to wipe out the desire to discriminate, racially or otherwise in every American.

The PURPOSE is to minimize the EFFECT of discrimination on our citizens and society, to codify an avenue of redress and to PUNISH those that perpetrate unlawful discrimination with fines and penalties that will hopefully cause them, should they CHOOSE to continue running that business, to comply with the law in the future. It isn't ABOUT changing their 'hearts and minds', it's about changing their ACTIONS and holding them responsible if they don't.

it will still remain open for people to act morally in society, which most won't.

That seems to call out for legislation rather than advocate for squashing it. Unless of course your posit is that we shouldn't legislate against murder, robbery, rape, child abuse, animal cruelty, fraud and the like. In that direction there be anarchy. 

 
 
Dulay
1.1.93  Dulay  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.91    3 days ago
Not to the same degree, but something similar could be said about America. We have forgotten God, and are reaping the consequences.

Right because 'God fearing Christian' countries are doing so fucking GREAT in the world. Shall we review the level of 'moral prosperity' in some of those counties? 

You've already posited that the US is going down the shit hole because we have 'forgotten God' but there MUST be at least one country in the top 10 that are prospering from the moral bedrock of Christianity, right?

Let's review:

Brazil = Nope

Mexico = Nope 

Russia = FUCK NO

The Philippines = Nope

Nigeria = Nope

China = Nope

Congo = Nope

Germany = Nope, not according to Trump

Ethiopia = Nope

So DO tell me, where are the POSITIVE consequences of REMEMBERING 'God' for all of those 'Christian' countries?

 
 
Dulay
1.1.94  Dulay  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.90    3 days ago
Where does "Morality" come from ?

It sure as hell doesn't come from 'human emotion'. In fact, 'human emotions' are the antithesis of 'morality' in many cases. 

 
 
Skrekk
1.1.95  Skrekk  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.1    3 days ago
The absence of religion is a guarantee that morality will ultimately fail as will our constitutional Republic.

One general rule is that the more superstitious a society is the less moral it seems to be.    What you want is for the US to be more like Saudi Arabia and Russia and less like Norway.

 
 
Skrekk
1.1.96  Skrekk  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.88    3 days ago
some trans women can be fairly obvious, probably depending on when they transition.  There are traits which are difficult to change, such as an Adam's apple.

I've always wondered about Ann Coulter.   If only she had been allowed to transition earlier then fewer people would ridicule her.

On second thought most folks would still ridicule her.

 
 
Gordy327
1.1.97  Gordy327  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.90    3 days ago
Where does "Morality" come from ?

It's a social construct that developed as communities and societies grew. There is no magical single source for it.

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.98  Heartland American  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.90    3 days ago

God and God alone.  angel

 
 
epistte
1.1.99  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.98    3 days ago
God and God alone.

Your god's own employees are some of the most amoral people.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2018/03/20/memphis-megachurch-pastor-resigns-sex-abuse/443671002/
 
 
Heartland American
1.1.100  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @1.1.99    2 days ago

God has no employees.  People will follow Him by grace through faith or they won’t.  

 
 
Gordy327
1.1.101  Gordy327  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.98    2 days ago

That's nice. Prove it! 

 
 
MrFrost
1.1.102  MrFrost  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.23    2 days ago
And, what? Pees?

Sandy, some republicans think that a public restroom is a place to pick up a date... Like Larry "wide stance" Craig. 

 
 
epistte
1.1.103  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.100    2 days ago
God has no employees.  People will follow Him by grace through faith or they won’t.  

Why does it seem that you always have an excuse when religious people are exposed as amoral dirtbags? What happened to the concept of personal responsbility, or does your god give you a exemption for that too? 

 
 
Bob Nelson
1.1.104  Bob Nelson  replied to  epistte @1.1.103    2 days ago
What happened to the concept of personal responsbility, or does your god give you a exemption for that too?

The God of American Evangelicals is in the White House. They don't just support the President... They worship him.

And YES... Their God not only gives them an exemption... but encourages racism.

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.105  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @1.1.103    2 days ago

He gives no one an exemption to not live as He wills is to do.  We are all sinners who have fallen short of the glory of God.  All of us.  The church is a place for spiritually sick people to come together for healing.  It is not an assembly of perfect people.  The fact that there are hypocrites in the church though is no excuse for anyone to refuse to believe.  The wheat and the weeds will be separated at the second coming.  

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.106  Heartland American  replied to  Bob Nelson @1.1.104    2 days ago

Simply ridiculous.  We worship no mere man. Trump simply was and is for all his faults a far better choice or at least the lesser of two evils compared to Hillary. 

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.107  It Is ME  replied to  Dulay @1.1.94    2 days ago
It sure as hell doesn't come from 'human emotion'.

Really know.

What Neuroscience Tells Us about Morality”, by Patricia S. Churchland

"we seem to implicitly feel things as being right or wrong, rather than just intellectually being aware that they conform to or violate social norms. The answer is that the systems of moral reasoning and conscience tap into, or more accurately emerge from ancient neural systems grounded in emotion, in particular in attaching emotional value or valence to different stimuli, including the imagined consequences of possible actions."

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.108  It Is ME  replied to  Gordy327 @1.1.97    2 days ago

"A social construct or construction concerns the meaning, notion, or connotation placed on an object or event by a society, and adopted by the inhabitants of that society with respect to how they view or deal with the object or event."

con·no·ta·tion
[ˌkänəˈtāSH(ə)n]

NOUN
an idea or feeling

no·tion
[ˈnōSH(ə)n]

NOUN
1. a conception of or belief about something.
2. an impulse or desire, especially one of a whimsical kind.

 
 
Dulay
1.1.109  Dulay  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.107    2 days ago

So you hang your hat on the REVIEW of a book and attribute your quote to the author of the book rather than to the author of the review. Wow, BAD FORM.

Interesting that you chose not to include this part of the review in your quote:

This does not imply that morals are innate. It implies that the capacity for moral reasoning and the predisposition to moral behaviour are innate. Just as language has to be learned, so do the codes of moral behaviour, and, also like language, moral codes are culture-specific, but constrained by some general underlying principles. We may, as a species, come pre-wired with certain biological imperatives and systems for incorporating them into decisions in social situations, but we are also pre-wired to learn and incorporate the particular contingencies that pertain to each of us in our individual environments, including social and cultural norms.

I posit that the we convey 'social and cultural norms' 'in our individual environment' via the content of legislation and history jurisprudence. 

BTFW, the posit of the book refutes the posit of the seeded article since it argues, in part, that morality is 'chemical' versus 'spiritual'. 

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.110  It Is ME  replied to  Dulay @1.1.109    2 days ago

EVERYTHING you just put up in your post deals with an "Emotional" level of society. Makes No Sense

Hence:

"moral codes are culture-specific"

Not every culture thinks the same.....right ?

Each has it's own "Emotion" as to what would be considered Moral in "Their Society" !

 
 
Dulay
1.1.111  Dulay  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.110    2 days ago
EVERYTHING you just put up in your post deals with an "Emotional" level of society.

Society as a whole DOES NOT HAVE emotion. Sheesh...

"moral codes are culture-specific"
Not every culture thinks the same.....right ?
Each has it's own "Emotion" as to what would be considered Moral in "Their Society" !

Judging from your other post in this thread, you like definitions. Here's one for you:

Culture: the customs, arts, social institutions, and achievements of a particular nation, people, or other social group.

So as you see, 'culture' isn't predicated on 'emotion', it is based on the history of the people and what they embrace as 'custom' over time. If it were 'innate',  'cultures' would not evolve over time and history shows that every culture HAS and DOES. 

The customs, social institutions and achievements of a particular nation/people are documented in the laws they write to govern themselves. 

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.112  It Is ME  replied to  Dulay @1.1.111    2 days ago
Society as a whole DOES NOT HAVE emotion.

Face Palm

"Society" IS an "Emotional" cauldron. sheeeeesh !

"So as you see, 'culture' isn't predicated on 'emotion', it is based on the history of the people and what they embrace as 'custom' over time."

Did you MISS this part on purpose ?

"and what they embrace as custom "

laughing dude

“So far, about morals, I know only that what is moral is what you feel good after and what is immoral is what you feel bad after.”

― Ernest Hemingway, Death in the Afternoon

EVERYTHING ONE DOES IN LIFE "COMES FROM ONE EMOTION OR ANOTHER"Big hugs

Unless you think EVERYONE is a "God". winking

 
 
cjcold
1.1.113  cjcold  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.5    2 days ago

Funny how rapists, murderers and thieves find jebus behind bars.

 
 
cjcold
1.1.114  cjcold  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.112    2 days ago
Unless you think EVERYONE is a "God

I Grok that.

 
 
It Is ME
1.1.115  It Is ME  replied to  cjcold @1.1.114    2 days ago
Grok

thumbs up

 
 
Dulay
1.1.116  Dulay  replied to  It Is ME @1.1.112    2 days ago
"Society" IS an "Emotional" cauldron. sheeeeesh !

Which refutes my statement how exactly? 

"So as you see, 'culture' isn't predicated on 'emotion', it is based on the history of the people and what they embrace as 'custom' over time."

Did you MISS this part on purpose ?

"and what they embrace as custom "

It would be pretty hard for me to miss it since I WROTE it. [insert appropriate emoji]

“So far, about morals, I know only that what is moral is what you feel good after and what is immoral is what you feel bad after.” ― Ernest Hemingway, Death in the Afternoon

I wouldn't site Hemingway as a touchstone on the subject of morality. 

EVERYTHING ONE DOES IN LIFE "COMES FROM ONE EMOTION OR ANOTHER"

Where are you quoting that BS from? Link please. 

Unless you think EVERYONE is a "God".

Judging from the writing attributed to "God", many of 'his' demands and actions are motivated by emotion. 

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.117  Heartland American  replied to  cjcold @1.1.113    2 days ago

Some do, the vast majority sadly do not.  Are you suggesting that prison ministries not try to reach out  to that prison population?  

 
 
epistte
1.1.118  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.105    2 days ago
He gives no one an exemption to not live as He wills is to do.  We are all sinners who have fallen short of the glory of God.  All of us.  The church is a place for spiritually sick people to come together for healing.  It is not an assembly of perfect people.  The fact that there are hypocrites in the church though is no excuse for anyone to refuse to believe.  The wheat and the weeds will be separated at the second coming.  

This is an example of religious apologetics.

How can god will you to do anything or give you sin when he doesn't exist?  What happens in church is brainwashing.

The Bible is the work of man so it can no more be proof of god than J.R.R. Tolkien's books are proof of Orcs. 

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.119  Phoenyx13  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.100    2 days ago
God has no employees.

ever notice that God recruits quite a lot of psychotics to do his bidding ?

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.120  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.119    2 days ago

Do you believe in God? Or are you just saying that you believe He 'recruits" people to do bad things?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.121  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.120    2 days ago
Do you believe in God?

my beliefs are completely irrelevant to the context of whether i believe in God or not - if i think you should know what they are then i will gladly tell you. Outside of that, it's completely irrelevant, especially to my comment.

Or are you just saying that you believe He 'recruits" people to do bad things?

you tell me, since you are a believer in God.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.122  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.121    2 days ago

I think you do believe in God, otherwise, your post doesn't make much sense. Surely you wouldn't think that some God who you believe doesn't exist does anything.

Right?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.123  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.122    2 days ago
I think you do believe in God, otherwise, your post doesn't make much sense. Surely you wouldn't think that some God who you believe doesn't exist does anything. Right?

you are allowed to think what you want about my beliefs - but i've noticed you've been dancing around the comment and question in the comment:

ever notice that God recruits quite a lot of psychotics to do his bidding ?

that speaks volumes that you've been dodging and deflecting :)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.124  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.123    2 days ago

I don't believe that God recruits anyone to do anything.

Can I possibly be more plain?

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.125  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.123    2 days ago

I didn't dodge anything.

Just because a poster asks a question does not mean they dodge something.

I still don't understand why a belief in God is supposed to be shameful somehow, or makes one "different".

Most people I know freely admit to believing in God, and don't think He recruits people to do bad things. That doesn't sound like the God I know.

Perhaps your God is different for you.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.126  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.123    yesterday

Thank you so much for allowing me to think as I wish.

What a relief!

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.127  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.124    yesterday
I don't believe that God recruits anyone to do anything. Can I possibly be more plain?

that's odd considering many statements from the religious who claim that God told them to do certain things or that God endorses them.... Do you believe in a different God ?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.128  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.125    yesterday
I didn't dodge anything. Just because a poster asks a question does not mean they dodge something.

if a question is asked and you reply to that question comment - but never answer the question, sounds like a dodge to me. Maybe we define things differently...

I still don't understand why a belief in God is supposed to be shameful somehow, or makes one "different".

gosh.. i don't believe i've said that - but i'm sure you will now point out to me where i've stated such a thing.

Most people I know freely admit to believing in God, and don't think He recruits people to do bad things. That doesn't sound like the God I know. Perhaps your God is different for you.

perhaps those who believe in God just believe in different Gods while claiming it's the same one under the umbrella of their same religion

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.129  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.127    yesterday

Why would that be odd to you?

DO you believe everyone thinks and believes in the same things?

That isn't realistic.

I don't speak for others on matters of God and religion, and don't let them speak for me.

Do you?

Do you believe in a different God than those you are asking me about?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.130  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.126    yesterday
Thank you so much for allowing me to think as I wish. What a relief!

oh you are quite welcome - i wouldn't want you to worry your little head about that, i grant you permission to think as you wish, hopefully you feel better and can sleep better at night :)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.131  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.128    yesterday

Maybe so. What does your God say about it all?

I would love to hear you define your God.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.132  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.130    yesterday

I sleep like a baby every night!

Thanks for your concern, though!

Wink

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.133  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.129    yesterday
Why would that be odd to you?

DO you believe everyone thinks and believes in the same things?

That isn't realistic.

I don't speak for others on matters of God and religion, and don't let them speak for me.

Do you?

Do you believe in a different God than those you are asking me about?

now where would i get the idea that everyone who claims to be a Christian would believe in the same singular God of that religion ? My beliefs on God are irrelevant to the discussion - as i've stated before, if i want you to know my beliefs then i will gladly tell you them :)

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.134  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.131    yesterday
Maybe so. What does your God say about it all? I would love to hear you define your God.

and maybe one day you will hear how i define God and/or my beliefs on/in God - but today isn't that day, sorry ! :)

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.135  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.132    yesterday
I sleep like a baby every night! Thanks for your concern, though!

oh that's wonderful to hear ! i was just so concerned /s :)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.136  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.133    yesterday

Talking about Christians now?

Why, when no religion has been specifically mentioned until now?

And in response to 1.1.134, I refer you to your own previous post 1.1.128. Sounds exactly like you must think you are dodging the question!

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.137  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.135    yesterday

I didn't bother to put the sarcasm tag on my post.

I thought people can tell sarcasm, I guess I was wrong.

I won't be making the same mistake with you again!

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.138  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.136    yesterday
Talking about Christians now?

Why, when no religion has been specifically mentioned until now?

And in response to 1.1.134, I refer you to your own previous post 1.1.128. Sounds exactly like you must think you are dodging the question

that would definitely be an example - you could substitute any monotheistic religion in place of the word "Christian" (you seem to take personal offense to this... hmmm...) Of course, in this country, since Christianity is the most prevalent religion - it's most often used as an example (i'm surprised you didn't pick up on that...)

i didn't dodge any question - i answered your question, you just happened to not like the answer and that would solely be on you. Unlike what you did - ignored and didn't answer the question which is when i brought up you dodging the question. 

Anything else ?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.139  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.137    yesterday
I didn't bother to put the sarcasm tag on my post.

I thought people can tell sarcasm, I guess I was wrong.

I won't be making the same mistake with you again!

i'm sorry - you wanted me to assume and try to trap me in a "gotcha!" moment ? gosh.. i never play the games right...

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.140  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.139    yesterday

Trap you?

Please!

You seem to wish to tell me what you think I wanted you to do. You are not correct.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.141  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.138    yesterday

There was absolutely no need to bring any specific religion into the discussion, as that wasn't the topic we were discussing, but yet you did.

Is there a motive behind that?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.142  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.140    yesterday
Trap you?

Please!

You seem to wish to tell me what you think I wanted you to do. You are not correct.

if this helps you sleep better at night laughing dude

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.143  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.142    yesterday

Please, pay attention.

I already told you I sleep like a baby every night!

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.144  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.141    yesterday
There was absolutely no need to bring any specific religion into the discussion, as that wasn't the topic we were discussing, but yet you did. Is there a motive behind that?

um... did you read the seed ? it's all about God... in fact that's a comment i replied to - about God... are you trying to separate the two now ?

in fact if you would have read the seed you would have seen this:

Webster once declared, “Finally, let us not forget the religious character of our origin. Our fathers were brought hither by their high veneration for the Christian religion. They journeyed by its light, and labored in its hope. They sought to incorporate its principles with the elements of their society, and to diffuse its influence through all their institutions, civil, political, or literary.”

which is in the seed.. do you see the word Christian or Religion in that segment from the seeded articlepatience

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.145  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.143    yesterday
Please, pay attention. I already told you I sleep like a baby every night!

i already know since you told me this but it seems you need to tell yourself more justification - which is why i made the comment :)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.146  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.144    yesterday

I hope your God blesses you and yours.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.147  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.145    yesterday

What you think it seems like and what it is seems to be two different things.

But unless you know me, and you don't, you really have no idea what my "justification" requirements are.

Please don't think you know me and knw what I think or mean.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.148  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.147    yesterday
What you think it seems like and what it is seems to be two different things.

But unless you know me, and you don't, you really have no idea what my "justification" requirements are.

Please don't think you know me and knw what I think or mean.

LOL i can only gather information based upon your postings - so if there's miscommunications then i'd advise looking in the mirror for the source and stop blaming everyone else - take "personal responsibility". Have a great day :)

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.149  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.146    yesterday
I hope your God blesses you and yours.

thanks ! same to you ! :)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.150  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.149    yesterday

He does, every day!

Thanks again!

/S

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.151  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.148    yesterday

No one placed any blame. Why would you write that?

Blame for what, exactly?

Please elaborate.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.152  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.149    yesterday

After all of this, I am still left wondering about what kind of God would "recruit" people to do bad things.

Must not be an all-powerful God if He couldn't simply order people to do evil things.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.153  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.152    yesterday
After all of this, I am still left wondering about what kind of God would "recruit" people to do bad things. Must not be an all-powerful God if He couldn't simply order people to do evil things.

well, talk to Robert Dear Jr - he felt God ordered him ... among many others.. maybe you could do some research and wouldn't spend so much time wondering, eh ?

No one placed any blame. Why would you write that?

Blame for what, exactly?

Please elaborate.

hmmm...

But unless you know me, and you don't, you really have no idea what my "justification" requirements are. Please don't think you know me and knw what I think or mean.

based upon the conversation - almost looks like blame, eh ? is this like you not knowing the word Christian was in the article ?

He does, every day!

Thanks again!

/S

oh you are quite welcome ! /s :) (do you plan on doing this all day ? it's pointless)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.154  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.153    yesterday

If Robert Dear already answered your question, why ask anyone else?

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.155  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.153    yesterday

No answer as to who placed any blame, I see.

or blame for WHAT?

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.156  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.153    yesterday

I am not comfortable telling you what my plans are.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.157  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.154    yesterday
If Robert Dear already answered your question, why ask anyone else?

wait.. you didn't catch on that it was rhetorical ? seriously ? laughing dude

i should have put that /s tag since you couldn't tell it was rhetorical (or possibly sarcastic) huh ? Face Palm

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.158  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.155    yesterday
No answer as to who placed any blame, I see. or blame for WHAT?

you should figure that out - i can only gather information based upon your postings, so don't blame me for not pegging your positions correctly or misinterpreting what you state - look in the mirror for the source.

I am not comfortable telling you what my plans are.

ok :)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.159  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.157    yesterday

You should probably do whatever makes you feel good.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.160  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.158    yesterday

There you go again with the blame game thingy.

No one has placed any blame for anything.

Seriously, where is it coming from?

The plans thing was just because you asked nicely.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.161  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.160    yesterday
There you go again with the blame game thingy.

No one has placed any blame for anything.

Seriously, where is it coming from?

The plans thing was just because you asked nicely.

were you not paying attention ?

i can only gather information based upon your postings

i'll let you solve the mystery.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.162  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.161    yesterday

I pay attention, it is just that you have been dodging the question.

No big deal. I would have been more surprised had you actually answered the question.

You have a good day!

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.163  Heartland American  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.126    yesterday

A novel concept around here for sure.  

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.164  Heartland American  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.141    yesterday

It’s a derailing off topic diversion when they have nothing else to say on the seeded subject.  They attack our faith.  

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.165  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.162    yesterday
I pay attention, it is just that you have been dodging the question.

No big deal. I would have been more surprised had you actually answered the question.

You have a good day!

i've answered your questions - i'm sorry you didn't like the answer, that's solely on you, but unlike you - i did answer the question: my beliefs are irrelevant :) have a great day ! :) (i would have been more surprised had you actually answered the original question right off the bat instead of playing these little games)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.166  Texan1211  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.164    yesterday

Funny thing is, I believe she believes in God.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.167  Phoenyx13  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.164    yesterday
It’s a derailing off topic diversion when they have nothing else to say on the seeded subject.  They attack our faith.  

i'm sorry, didn't you read the article that you seeded ? let me help you:

Webster once declared, “Finally, let us not forget the religious character of our origin. Our fathers were brought hither by their high veneration for the Christian religion. They journeyed by its light, and labored in its hope. They sought to incorporate its principles with the elements of their society, and to diffuse its influence through all their institutions, civil, political, or literary.”

 do you see the word Christian or Religion in that segment from the seeded article that you seeded ? thinking

looks like it's you who made your "faith" the seeded subject - stop blaming others and take personal responsibility for yourself, ok ? Besides, i didn't attack anything - i just pointed out a simple fact, unless you think Robert Dear Jr was mentally stable ? (it wouldn't surprise me if you think he was)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.168  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.165    yesterday

I can find answers elsewhere, since you fail to answer.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.169  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.168    yesterday
I can find answers elsewhere, since you fail to answer.

well in case you have a hard time with reading comprehension - i'll help you and repost my answer again: 

my beliefs are irrelevant 

did you figure it out yet or will you still try to get me to answer however you want me to answer your irrelevant question ?

 
 
epistte
1.1.170  epistte  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.166    yesterday
Funny thing is, I believe she believes in God.

Are you referring to me and hinting that I do believe in god? 

I most certainly do not believe in god and I never did.  Religious belief is offensive to me because it is illogical. 

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.171  Texan1211  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.164    yesterday

Do you find it the least bit strange or unusual that someone who believes in God would ask if He "recruits" people to do bad things?

As weird as a non-believer asking the same question, which would be utterly ludicrous?

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.172  Texan1211  replied to  epistte @1.1.170    yesterday

Certainly wasn't referring to you.

What makes you think that?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.173  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.166    yesterday
Funny thing is, I believe she believes in God

i've never stated my gender nor my beliefs - what an odd statement that assumes both. I think someone once stated:

Please don't think you know me and knw what I think or mean.

gee... could be sound advice for you, eh ? laughing dude

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.174  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.169    yesterday

Nope, I understood your post very well.

I also understand dodging and evading, from past experiences on forums such as this.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.175  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.173    yesterday

A logical person who doesn't believe in God would never see a need to ask if God recruits people. That would be extremely illogical, to ask if something they don't believe exists does anything.

It would be like a kid who no longer believes in Santa Claus asking if he had come on Christmas morning.

illogical.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.176  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.174    yesterday
Nope, I understood your post very well.

well then i guess you can't claim i never answered your question, because as i stated, i clearly did:

my beliefs are irrelevant 

i'm sorry, it seems i have to keep rubbing your nose in it like one does with a naughty puppy until they understand.

I also understand dodging and evading, from past experiences on forums such as this.

LOL i'm quite sure you do understand the practice which your comments have shown to partake in.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.177  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.173    yesterday

You can be a she, or a he. It doesn't matter.

Some of your comments I have read on other matters has led me to believe you are a woman.

Feel free to correct me if that isn't the case.

And if you ARE a man, I apologize for calling you a woman.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.178  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.176    yesterday

A non-answer isn't a real answer.

No matter how it gets spun.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.179  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.175    yesterday
A logical person who doesn't believe in God would never see a need to ask if God recruits people.

well that's not true - someone would want to question those who do believe in God (whether or not they are believers themselves) and ask for the reasons as to why God would "recruit" people like Robert Dear Jr., it's the same as asking a religious leader for the reasons God does things.

That would be extremely illogical, to ask if something they don't believe exists does anything.

you seem to misunderstand logic. someone who doesn't believe would certainly be well within their rights to ask someone who does believe, to try to understand their "logical" thinking as to why they believe given the evidence that this mystical entity seems to recruit psychotic people like Robert Dear Jr to do it's bidding - yet many still persistently believe and defend it --- very illogical, so of course one (whether they believe or not) could ask that question.

It would be like a kid who no longer believes in Santa Claus asking if he had come on Christmas morning. illogical.

you seem to be misunderstanding logic - you should ask your version of God to grace you with some insight, eh ?

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.180  Texan1211  replied to  epistte @1.1.170    yesterday

And for the record, I specifically stated I thought the person believed in God.

There is certainly NO "hinting around" in that statement.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.181  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.179    yesterday

Well, I will agree to disagree with you on what I understand logic and your posts to mean.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.182  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.178    yesterday
A non-answer isn't a real answer. No matter how it gets spun.

ah, so now you feel it's a non-answer ? is that how you are justifying your whole childish argument of me supposedly not answering your question ? you are quite amusing to say the least ! laughing dude

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.183  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.181    yesterday
Well, I will agree to disagree with you on what I understand logic and your posts to mean.

that sounds good to me :) hope you have a great rest of your night (and no /s)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.184  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.179    yesterday

No, a logical person wouldn't ask if GOD did anything, because in their mind, if it is logical, they would say God doesn't exist and therefore can do NOTHING.

Unless you believe non-existent things magically do stuff, of course.

Or do you believe that a non-existent Being can do something?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.185  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.184    yesterday
No, a logical person wouldn't ask if GOD did anything, because in their mind, if it is logical, they would say God doesn't exist and therefore can do NOTHING.

exactly the point - yet many others (like yourself) still believe in that God and if God is real - well then your God sent people like Robert Dear Jr to do it's bidding and you still persistently believe in and defend your God - so that's where the questions come in. If God is real - this is the evidence given (as per Robert Dear Jr's claim) and yet you still persistently believe and defend your God - why ? (understanding it now ?)

Unless you believe non-existent things magically do stuff, of course. Or do you believe that a non-existent Being can do something?

i don't think any non-existent being could do something - but God has not been proven one way or the other. Do you believe, that if this being exists, that it sends people like Robert Dear Jr to do it's bidding (as Robert Dear Jr claims) ?

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.186  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.185    yesterday

prove God sent anyone to do anything.

I'll wait.

 
 
Heartland American
1.1.187  Heartland American  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.185    yesterday

God never sends humans to do evil things.  Humans have free will to follow him or to do evil.  Since we are all sinners sometimes people we look at as a “godly” person really isn’t.  Sometimes otherwise Godly people make mistakes.  The God deniers try to use both against us.  

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.188  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.186    21 hours ago
prove God sent anyone to do anything. I'll wait.

gee, prove God didn't send anyone to do anything.

I'll wait.  Face Palm

Are you done with your ridiculous little games ?  Eye Roll

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.189  Phoenyx13  replied to  Heartland American @1.1.187    21 hours ago
God never sends humans to do evil things.  Humans have free will to follow him or to do evil.  Since we are all sinners sometimes people we look at as a “godly” person really isn’t.  Sometimes otherwise Godly people make mistakes.  The God deniers try to use both against us.  

so are you stating that every single religious person who claims that God sent them to do something or that God wants them to be something - are all lying ?

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.190  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.188    20 hours ago

It isn't a problem if you can't.

I wasn't really expecting you to anyways.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.191  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.190    19 hours ago
It isn't a problem if you can't. I wasn't really expecting you to anyways.

It isn't a problem if you can't either, i wasn't really expecting you to anyways - and like usual, you completely missed the point of my statement. i wish i could state i was surprisedEye Roll

again - Are you done with your ridiculous little games ? 

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.192  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.191    19 hours ago

Once again, I missed nothing.

You were the one who originally asked if God sent people to do things. 

That assumes God is real, otherwise, there is no point whatsoever in asking such a thing.

So prove it.

or not.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.193  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.192    19 hours ago
Once again, I missed nothing.

you absolutely did and i've spelled it out for you repeatedly Face Palm

You were the one who originally asked if God sent people to do things. 

yes, asking religious people - people who posit that God is real and believe that God is real.

That assumes God is real, otherwise, there is no point whatsoever in asking such a thing.

yes, asking religious people - people who posit that God is real and believe that God is real - people like yourself who profess God is real due to their beliefs. Do you understand it better now or do i need to try to simplify it further for you ?

So prove it. or not.

yes, prove it or not - be my guest since the question is being asked of people like you, a believer who posits that God is real.

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.194  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.193    19 hours ago

If you don't believe in God, then no answer will ever suffice for you. And absolutely no point in you asking it.

If you do believe in God, I would love to hear what religion or book taught you that God sends people to do bad things.

I don't care much either way.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.195  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.194    18 hours ago
If you don't believe in God, then no answer will ever suffice for you. And absolutely no point in you asking it.

If you do believe in God, I would love to hear what religion or book taught you that God sends people to do bad things.

I don't care much either way.

oh dear.. you must have missed this earlier:

my beliefs are irrelevant 

or maybe you just don't understand it ? my beliefs are completely irrelevant to your answer to the question. The question is asked of believers who posit God is real - like yourself - to get your thoughts and opinion on the matter, that's all. i'm sorry you are sorely struggling with this very simple concept but i can't explain it any simpler to you. If you can't answer the question - then just say so and move on. It's really that simple :) (this isn't an effort to prove nor disprove God or anything of that nature, understand now ? you seem to struggle with people being curious)

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.196  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.195    18 hours ago

I already answered your question.

Pay attention!

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.197  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.196    18 hours ago
I already answered your question. Pay attention!

well if you feel you answered the question - then we're done :) have a nice day

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.198  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.197    18 hours ago

See post 1.1.124.

"I don't believe God recruits anyone to do anything".

19 hours ago.

Sounds EXACTLY like an answer to me.

Sorry if it doesn't to you.

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.199  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.198    18 hours ago
See post 1.1.124.

"I don't believe God recruits anyone to do anything".

19 hours ago.

Sounds EXACTLY like an answer to me.

Sorry if it doesn't to you.

ok - so let's post this again:

well if you feel you answered the question - then we're done  :) have a nice day

so you posted your thoughts/opinion/feelings on the matter... which means... we're done ! :) have a nice day (this isn't hard to grasp)

 
 
JBB
1.1.200  JBB  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.1.26    18 hours ago

That one example shows the stupidity and ignorance of most righties regarding the bathroom issue...

Transsexual men in the lady's or transsexual women in the men's would cause the biggest commotion.

In a panic I once accidentally just made it to the stall in a lady's room at a large department store. My first clue was the little waste basket between the stalls. Never seen that before. I looked inside and found, horror of horror, tampons. About that time two ladies and a little girl came into the bathroom. The little girl exclaimed, "Mama, look at that lady's feet. Man-o-man she sure does have some big olde feet". The mother scolded the little girl saying, "Haven't I told you not to comment on people's appearance? It is so rude". The little girl replied, "Well, she does have big feet". It took a while to clear out so I could exit unseen. Trust me. There was absolutely nothing tantalizing about me being in the lady's room. I was terrified I'd be found out and humiliated. I could just imagine the news story...

 
 
Texan1211
1.1.201  Texan1211  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.1.199    11 hours ago

Was the answer inadequate somehow?

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.1.202  Phoenyx13  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.201    10 hours ago
Was the answer inadequate somehow?

i never stated it was - are you done with your ridiculous games now ? we are done - so you are welcome to respond and have the last word, i'm moving on :) have a great time by yourself ! :)

 
 
Skrekk
1.2  Skrekk  replied to  Heartland American @1    4 days ago
Why is America seemingly sinking into the abyss?

Because of Trump voters.

 
 
Heartland American
1.2.1  Heartland American  replied to  Skrekk @1.2    2 days ago

Trump voters are standing up for America trying to save her for future generations.  

 
 
MrFrost
1.2.2  MrFrost  replied to  Heartland American @1.2.1    2 days ago
Trump voters are standing up for America trying to save her for future generations.

By destroying the environment? Great plan HA! [eye roll]

 
 
Skrekk
1.2.3  Skrekk  replied to  MrFrost @1.2.2    2 days ago
By destroying the environment? Great plan HA! [eye roll]

And by voting for a traitor.

 
 
Dulay
1.2.4  Dulay  replied to  Heartland American @1.2.1    2 days ago

Yet I seem to recall that you said that YOU didn't vote for him...

 
 
Heartland American
1.2.5  Heartland American  replied to  Dulay @1.2.4    2 days ago

An honest mistake on my part.  

 
 
Dulay
1.2.6  Dulay  replied to  Heartland American @1.2.5    2 days ago

A rare admission. I presume then that you won't be taking 'credit' owed to 'true believers'. 

 
 
Heartland American
1.2.7  Heartland American  replied to  Dulay @1.2.6    yesterday

The left of center members here played a huge role in turning me from never Trump/ never Hillary to pro  Trump.  His pursuit of policy, taxes, judicial appointments helped too.  

 
 
Dulay
1.2.8  Dulay  replied to  Heartland American @1.2.7    yesterday
The left of center members here played a huge role in turning me from never Trump/ never Hillary to pro  Trump.  

I have never viewed your position on anything as mailable so that sounds like an empty excuse. 

His pursuit of policy, taxes, judicial appointments helped too.

Why would his bullshit now be any more convincing than his bullshit during the campaign. In fact NOW, his incompetence is even more stark. 

 
 
WallyW
1.3  WallyW  replied to  Heartland American @1    4 days ago

Speaking of religion....why is that bit of ugly nastiness down in New Mexico being ignored by the media?

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/09/us/new-mexico-compound-georgia-wahaj.html

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.3.1  sandy-2021492  replied to  WallyW @1.3    4 days ago

They haven't.  It's been in the news.  You realize that the NYT is part of the media, yes?

 
 
A. Macarthur
1.3.2  A. Macarthur  replied to  WallyW @1.3    4 days ago
Speaking of religion....why is that bit of ugly nastiness down in New Mexico being ignored by the media? https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/09/us/new-mexico-compound-georgia-wahaj.html

How is it then that you know about it and are able to post a link to a MEDIA story?

 
 
sandy-2021492
1.3.3  sandy-2021492  replied to  A. Macarthur @1.3.2    4 days ago

Right?  "Here's a link to the newspaper article about something the newspapers aren't writing articles about." 

 
 
Dulay
1.3.4  Dulay  replied to  WallyW @1.3    4 days ago

Cognitive dissonance. 

 
 
Heartland American
1.3.5  Heartland American  replied to  WallyW @1.3    yesterday

You mean that Islamic extremist with ties to an un indicted co conspirator of the first World Trade Center bombing who was training kids to shoot up our schools?  

 
 
Tessylo
1.4  Tessylo  replied to  Heartland American @1    4 days ago

No worries HA, Jeff Sessions' Religious Liberty Task Force I'm sure will solve all your morality issues.  

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.4.1  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Tessylo @1.4    4 days ago
No worries HA, Jeff Sessions' Religious Liberty Task Force I'm sure will solve all your morality issues. 

Yep, with "re-education" camps like these,

 
 
Heartland American
1.4.2  Heartland American  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.4.1    2 days ago

No.  That picture is what the obama regime had in mind for the bitter clingers and deplorables if only they could have. This is what happens when Nazi and holocaust images are brought into and allowed to remain in domestic political debate.  I’m sure Hillary had she been elected would have had the ovens in the place pictured above hot and ready for us.  

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
1.4.3  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Heartland American @1.4.2    2 days ago
No.  That picture is what the obama regime had in mind for the bitter clingers and deplorables if only they could have. This is what happens when Nazi and holocaust images are brought into and allowed to remain in domestic political debate.  I’m sure Hillary had she been elected would have had the ovens in the place pictured above hot and ready for us.

It wasn't Hillary or, Obama who said that Neo-Nazi's and, KKK members were "very fine people".Man passes out..jpg

 
 
XDm9mm
1.4.4  XDm9mm  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.4.3    2 days ago

Al least TRY to be honest and show his COMPLETE quote......   even if it's contrary to your guilty until proved innocent belief.

“You had some very bad people in that group," Trump said, referring to thewhite nationalist groups rallying against removal of a Confederate statue. "But you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides.”

Source: https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-blame-sides-charlottesville-now-anniversary-puts-spot/story?id=57141612

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.4.5  Phoenyx13  replied to  Heartland American @1.4.2    2 days ago
That picture is what the obama regime had in mind for the bitter clingers and deplorables if only they could have. This is what happens when Nazi and holocaust images are brought into and allowed to remain in domestic political debate.  I’m sure Hillary had she been elected would have had the ovens in the place pictured above hot and ready for us.  

you honestly believe that Obama would have put the "bitter clingers" and "deplorables" in those kinds of camps ? You honestly believe that if Hillary would have been elected that you would have been placed in an oven ? seriously ?

 
 
Heartland American
1.4.6  Heartland American  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @1.4.3    yesterday

No one said that.  Trump certainly never did.  

 
 
Heartland American
1.4.8  Heartland American  replied to  Phoenyx13 @1.4.5    yesterday

Exactly to the extent that whoever posted the picture in the first place believed that about what the AG was going to do with the religious liberty commission.  Nothing more nothing less.   You all make a Hitler related comment about one of ours and I’ll be sure to make the same about two of yours.  Balls in your court.  Back off or double down?  

 
 
Phoenyx13
1.4.9  Phoenyx13  replied to  Heartland American @1.4.8    yesterday
Exactly to the extent that whoever posted the picture in the first place believed that about what the AG was going to do with the religious liberty commission.  Nothing more nothing less.   You all make a Hitler related comment about one of ours and I’ll be sure to make the same about two of yours.  Balls in your court.  Back off or double down?

you think i'm playing your little "conservatives vs liberals" game you invented in your imaginationlaughing dude keep on trying !

i'm sorry your fantasy of being able to legally discriminate against people you find "icky" based upon their sexuality or gender or who don't share your religious beliefs is still - a fantasy. Just like your fantasy of being locked up in a concentration camp or put in an oven (as stated in your previous comment) is still - a fantasy. any other inane comments ?

 
 
Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III
1.5  Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III  replied to  Heartland American @1    4 days ago

Do the sex robots have long or short hair?

 
 
epistte
1.5.1  epistte  replied to  Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III @1.5    4 days ago
Do the sex robots have long or short hair?

Which do you prefer? Do you like bleach blondes with dark roots?

 
 
Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III
1.5.2  Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III  replied to  epistte @1.5.1    3 days ago

Rusty colored with a wet oily look.

 
 
epistte
1.5.3  epistte  replied to  Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III @1.5.2    3 days ago

Long or short?

 
 
Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III
1.5.4  Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III  replied to  epistte @1.5.3    3 days ago

Long enough to reach the motherboard.

 
 
epistte
1.5.5  epistte  replied to  Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III @1.5.4    3 days ago
Long enough to reach the motherboard.

The motherboard could be between her ears.

 
 
Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III
1.5.6  Farnsworth Horatio Clapstonestacker III  replied to  epistte @1.5.5    3 days ago

We're going to need standards and definitions.

 
 
Tessylo
1.6  Tessylo  replied to  Heartland American @1    3 days ago

The Parkland victims, those protesting being murdered in their schools need bodyguards because they have been getting death threats and some nuts such as Alex Jones have been claiming it's a hoax.  

The media who have been reporting accurately what is happening at Rumps 'rallies' and otherwise need bodyguards because they have been getting death threats also.  On air one of Rumps supporters said "if I see 'em I'm going to shoot 'em."

 
 
epistte
2  epistte    4 days ago

How can you possibly forget what does not have any evidence of existing?

Did we also forget Zeus, Ra, and Oden?

 
 
MrFrost
2.1  MrFrost  replied to  epistte @2    4 days ago

Someone else posted this before, think it was Skrekk...

7ACyY.jpg

 
 
Heartland American
2.2  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @2    4 days ago

“Abraham Lincoln called for a national day of repentance and prayer in 1863, in which he warned us to stop forgetting God as a nation and to remember this truth: “those nations only are blessed whose God is the Lord.””

 
 
MrFrost
2.2.1  MrFrost  replied to  Heartland American @2.2    4 days ago
those nations only are blessed whose God is the Lord

Like Allah?

 
 
321steve
2.2.2  321steve  replied to  Heartland American @2.2    4 days ago

A lot of presidents have said a lot of things, not all accurate. 

 
 
epistte
2.2.3  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @2.2    4 days ago
“Abraham Lincoln called for a national day of repentance and prayer in 1863, in which he warned us to stop forgetting God as a nation and to remember this truth: “those nations only are blessed whose God is the Lord.””

The religious beliefs of Lincoln are far from certain. He spoke of religion publically but privately the situation was much different. He was never a member of any church, he was accused of being an atheist when he ran for the Senate seat and he was opposed to organized religion. 

 
 
JohnRussell
3  JohnRussell    4 days ago

•A crackdown on free speech by Apple. They decide what is and what is not “hate.” Consequently, conspiracy theorist Alex Jones is now denied his platform.

This is supposed to be a bad thing?  rofl.  It should have happened a long time ago. 

 
 
JohnRussell
3.1  JohnRussell  replied to  JohnRussell @3    4 days ago

•The president is beleaguered by allegations of collusion with the Russians.

Probably should have told his son to ignore that email. 

I actually don't think God will protect the guilty in this case. Plus Trump doesn't really believe in God. In other words, God doesn't care about Donald Trump's legal problems. 

 
 
Bob Nelson
3.2  Bob Nelson  replied to  JohnRussell @3    4 days ago

... not to mention that "free speech" is not applicable to a private space like Apple. Apple may do as it pleases within its territory.

 
 
MrFrost
4  MrFrost    4 days ago
•Sex with robots is a growing fad. •The president is beleaguered by allegations of collusion with the Russians.

The fact that these two items are listed together? fail... LOL 

 
 
MrFrost
5  MrFrost    4 days ago

As a nation we have forgotten God...

I doubt trump can spell, "God". Cheated on all of his wives, paid off porn tars, raped his fist wife, sexual assault against 19 different women... Lies constantly, has defrauded millions of people out of money....Yea, he is a GREAT representative for the, "moral right". 

Every time I hear him say, "God bless America", I think, "Ok, but Donny, "God" is sending your ass to hell". My guess is that if there is a, "God", he wants NOTHING to do with trump. 

 
 
Heartland American
5.1  Heartland American  replied to  MrFrost @5    4 days ago

you don’t know that.  Trump could repent and be saved at any point in his life before he passes.  Whatever sins he committed would be forgiven.  For all we know, it may have already happened.  All those preachers he has been hanging around with the last three years may well have had a positive effect over that time and none of us who are believers would dare to question God as to why He would forgive and save him.  People in the Bible who did much worse things than Trump did were reached by God and they repented and were saved.  Don’t limit God’s ability and willingness to forgive.  

 
 
321steve
5.1.1  321steve  replied to  Heartland American @5.1    4 days ago

Isn't part of being "born again" turning away from and not continuing to sin ? 

Not judging but from my observations trump hasn't made much effort in that front. So, yep maybe another day  but if it was yesterday... I'm not sure it stuck.... 

insults, grandiose promises, intimidation and threats are still a few of the presidents common "tools" It's been awhile but I dont remember that being part of what is considered a "born again" experience. 

Maybe times have changed.

lol

 
 
321steve
5.1.2  321steve  replied to  Heartland American @5.1    4 days ago
Don’t limit God’s ability and willingness to forgive.

So true and dont underestimate president trump. I sure dont. 

 
 
MrFrost
5.1.3  MrFrost  replied to  Heartland American @5.1    4 days ago
you don’t know that.  Trump could repent and be saved at any point in his life before he passes.  Whatever sins he committed would be forgiven.

Well isn't that convenient. So you are saying that marriage vows are completely meaningless because even if you violate the vows....over and over and over again, all you gotta do is say, "oops", to thin air and all is forgiven? 

It's so weird, because that means that anyone can literally do ANYTHING they want, and God will never ever hold anyone accountable for a DAMN thing! I's sorry, exactly what do we need god for again? I mean, pretty meaningless to have him around if he forgives everything, no matter what! "Cheated on your wives? NO problem!!!!!!!

Tell me HA, where is the "moral teaching" in telling the flock they can bang anyone they want, married or not, and there are NO consequences? That's not morality HA, that's making excuses for really AMORAL behavior. 

 
 
bbl-1
5.1.4  bbl-1  replied to  Heartland American @5.1    4 days ago

Bull

 
 
321steve
5.1.5  321steve  replied to  MrFrost @5.1.3    4 days ago
Well isn't that convenient.

LOL Now ya understand religion !!! 

( At least what I think about it.)

 
 
epistte
5.1.6  epistte  replied to  MrFrost @5.1.3    4 days ago
Tell me HA, where is the "moral teaching" in telling the flock they can bang anyone they want, married or not, and there are NO consequences? That's not morality HA, that's making excuses for really AMORAL behavior. 

I've always found that the idea of penitence to be morally and logically questionable. People can do anything they want and as many times as they want, as long as they claim that they believe in God, say that they are sorry, and occasionally drop a few dollars in the collection plate their sins are wiped clean.  Catholics need to share their moral failures with a priest and say a few prayers before they get a pass on their sins. 

If god is all knowing and all powerful then why didn't he stop them from sinning in the first place?  Why do you have to publically confess your sins of god is all knowing because the current idea serems to be a bit like bragging?  Wouldn't he already know if you were truly contrite or weren't?

 
 
MrFrost
5.1.7  MrFrost  replied to  epistte @5.1.6    4 days ago

Excellent post! 

 
 
Heartland American
5.1.8  Heartland American  replied to  MrFrost @5.1.3    4 days ago

There is a difference between forgiveness and salvation and the consequences of our actions.  People still have consequences of their sins to deal with in life even if forgiven and their eternal salvation is assured.  I remember the woman in Texas who was a murderer who while on death row, was converted and did good things with her remaining time in prison and didn’t ask for clemency or a stay of execution because even though she was forgiven and had salvation assured, she had to pay the earthly consequences of what she’d done.  

 
 
epistte
5.1.9  epistte  replied to  MrFrost @5.1.7    4 days ago
Excellent post! 

I asked similar questions to a Nun when I was 7 years old and being prepared for First Holy Communion. She sent a note home to my mother saying that I asked too many questions.  

Prayer is illogical on many levels. Why do we have to pray to god when he is both omnipotent and omniscient? He is supposed to know when we have been morally good or bad, even when they were just thoughts, but apparently, he doesn't know when we need help and he wants us to beg him to help us, even when he fails to answer the prayer 99.999% of the time.  The fact that Christians believe that he has a plan for us before we are born (determinism) means that prayer is also irrelevant.

But somehow Heartland thinks that we need more of his god in our lives or the country will fail from a lack of morality :faceplam:  What we need to do is to teach logic and critical thinking skills instead.

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
5.1.10  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Heartland American @5.1    4 days ago
you don’t know that.  Trump could repent and be saved at any point in his life before he passes.  Whatever sins he committed would be forgiven.  For all we know, it may have already happened.  All those preachers he has been hanging around with the last three years may well have had a positive effect over that time and none of us who are believers would dare to question God as to why He would forgive and save him.  People in the Bible who did much worse things than Trump did were reached by God and they repented and were saved.

I'll tell you how I know this is wrong and, it is using not only the Bible as a guide but, Trumps own actions. He still is lying his ass off everyday, 16 times a day, he has never admitted that Russia and, Putin are meddling in our elections, he's never apologized for his language during the election and, he hasn't admitting assaulting all those women and, asked for their forgiveness so, he has never accepted Jesus as his savior by these standards which all Christians admit is what is needed to repent, Trump is on his way to Hell on the fast train.

 
 
Tessylo
5.1.11  Tessylo  replied to  epistte @5.1.6    4 days ago

'I've always found that the idea of penitence to be morally and logically questionable. People can do anything they want and as many times as they want, as long as they claim that they believe in God, say that they are sorry, and occasionally drop a few dollars in the collection plate their sins are wiped clean.  Catholics need to share their moral failures with a priest and say a few prayers before they get a pass on their sins.' 

I think that Pope Borjia was the one who came up with paying for your sins and being absolved to bring all that wealth into the Vatican coffers.  

 
 
Dulay
5.1.12  Dulay  replied to  Heartland American @5.1    4 days ago
Don’t limit God’s ability and willingness to forgive.

So that renders your seed moot...thanks for playing...

 
 
Skrekk
5.1.13  Skrekk  replied to  Heartland American @5.1    4 days ago
Trump could repent and be saved at any point in his life before he passes.

That's the best part about your peculiar superstitions.....Trump can refuse to rent to black folks then "repent and be saved", then rape his wife and "repent and be saved", then grab the pussy of some random woman and "repent and be saved", then refuse to pay his workers and "repent and be saved", then run a campaign based on racism and xenophobia  and "repent and be saved", then conspire with Russia to thwart the will of the American people  and "repent and be saved", then lie constantly because it's convenient and "repent and be saved", then praise neo-Nazis as "very fine people" and "repent and be saved", then separate children from their parents and ship the parents out of the country  and "repent and be saved", then crash Turkey's economy because he's a sociopath and "repent and be saved".    Heck, he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th Avenue and "repent and be saved".   It's all cool if you're a True Christian.

 
 
Dulay
5.1.14  Dulay  replied to  Skrekk @5.1.13    4 days ago

That is what I recognized as a child after a couple Catholic Church services. The assholes in our neighborhood, I mean the really mean bastards, the wife beaters, the guy how owned a store and used racial slurs every day, the ones that left their kids at home alone while they hit the bar every night; went to confessional, received absolution and communion and hours later were right back at being assholes. Rinse and repeat. 

The Church knew all of the issues but it didn't keep them from passing the basket and passing out communion biscuits. 

I've seen it in Baptist churches too so it isn't about Catholics. Pastors and Deacons are infamous philanderers. 

 
 
MrFrost
5.1.15  MrFrost  replied to  epistte @5.1.9    yesterday
But somehow Heartland thinks that we need more of his god in our lives or the country will fail from a lack of morality

The right said that when the slaves were freed, when women were allowed to vote and own land. They said it when segregation was thrown out and Black people were allowed to vote. They said it after Loving vs. Virginia, and when same sex marriage was passed. All of these things, they insisted would destroy the country.... Last I checked? Morally, we are doing just fine. Add to the fact that the right voted for a guy that cannot even SPELL morality means their argument falls flat. 

 
 
321steve
5.2  321steve  replied to  MrFrost @5    4 days ago
My guess is that if there is a, "God", he wants NOTHING to do with trump. 

Without bad examples we wouldn't know what good examples would be. lol

 
 
bbl-1
6  bbl-1    4 days ago

The nation has not forgotten gawd.  Gawd has forgotten the nation when he heard "Jews will never replace us" by the 'rising cancer' in the nation.

 
 
lib50
7  lib50    4 days ago

It's really an insult to the truly spiritual when religion is used to manipulate the masses.  Trump gives zero fucks about religion except how he can use it for his benefit.  To imply he can repent is ignoring his entire life of not repenting, and if he does it won't mitigate what he has already done.  In fact, he has repented NOTHING, so why bring it up?  He lies, he is an adulterer, he makes himself the idol,  he swears, 'holy day' is yet another golf day,  he himself said he could murder someone and get away with it,  he steals (not paying his bills, cheating many),  he HAS given false evidence against someone,  and he is one of the most insecure and envious people in the country.  That pretty much covers breaking the commandments.  Why do the religious ignore that and protect and defend him instead?  He's also racist and a hypocrite.  Trying to figure out exactly what you find so pious about him.  Please elaborate.

 
 
Heartland American
7.1  Heartland American  replied to  lib50 @7    4 days ago

His saving grace is that he’s not Hillary.  The other is his promises regarding the federal courts and protecting religious liberty.  We realize that had she won and she replaced Scalia or the GOP confirmed Garland in the lame duck session as the lesser evil, that all of our recent wins at the Supreme Court would have been losses.  

 
 
epistte
7.1.1  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @7.1    4 days ago
The other is his promises regarding the federal courts and protecting religious liberty.  We realize that had she won and she replaced Scalia or the GOP confirmed Garland in the lame duck session as the lesser evil, that all of our recent wins at the Supreme Court would have been losses.  

The SCOTUS didn't side with the baker regardling the claimed right to refuse to serve people because of supposed religious liberty.  They kicked the can down the road on that issue when they ruled that the Colorado state commission shouldn't have called Jack Phillips a relgious bigot.

What did you fear that conservative Hillary Clinton might do if she were elected POTUS?

 
 
Heartland American
7.1.2  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @7.1.1    4 days ago

You forget the government union case and the California crisis pregnancy center case.  Also, we would have outright lost the baker case had she won.  Now we will likely get something like the California judges ruling in the next session.  

 
 
Skrekk
7.1.3  Skrekk  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.2    4 days ago
Also, we would have outright lost the baker case had she won.

Actually you did outright lose it as SCOTUS noted.    The only thing the bigoted baker won is a retrial if the state wants to pursue it.

 
 
epistte
7.1.4  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.2    4 days ago

The SCOTUS pick was Obama's to make but the GOP decided to ignore 200 years of Constitutional precedent and put Gorsuch on the bench instead. Dont tell me about complying with the Constitution in the future because it is obvious that the GOP only care about obeying the Constitution when it is in their favor.  Conservatives are hypocrites, both politically and religiously. 

 
 
Heartland American
7.1.5  Heartland American  replied to  Skrekk @7.1.3    3 days ago

Four justices made clear they would have voted against the baker.  No precedent was set.  Had Hillary won, five would have voted against him.  Now they will have to decide the case without Kennedy when someone appeals to them again from either side.  

 
 
Skrekk
7.1.6  Skrekk  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.5    3 days ago

None of that is true.   In fact the court affirmed the applicability of public accommodations laws to these cases by 7-1.   And as the court majority said:

“it is a general rule that [religious and philosophical] objections do not allow business owners . . . to deny protected persons equal access to goods and services under a neutral and generally applicable public accommodations law.”

So your side lost big time.    In fact the Masterpiece ruling has been cited in several state and federal rulings since then to uphold these non-discrimination laws in LGBT-related cases.    By the way the same anti-LGBT hate group was on the losing end in those cases too, the vile ADF.

 
 
Heartland American
7.1.7  Heartland American  replied to  Skrekk @7.1.6    3 days ago

The ADF are all great Americans.  

 
 
Tessylo
7.1.8  Tessylo  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.7    3 days ago

Yeah right, just like the fine white supremacists marching in Charlottesville last year?

 
 
Skrekk
7.1.9  Skrekk  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.7    3 days ago
The ADF are all great Americans.

Yeah, they're "Great Americans" who try to harm other Americans as well as people in other countries, and they have the same views about LGBT folks as the Nazis did.

 
 
Gordy327
7.1.10  Gordy327  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.7    3 days ago
The ADF are all great Americans.

It figures you would think that. It's rather telling too, considering the ADF has been labeled a hate group.

 
 
Heartland American
7.1.11  Heartland American  replied to  Gordy327 @7.1.10    2 days ago

Only by the terrorist hate group SPLC.  Those are the real hate filled extremists who incite domestic terrorism upon whom they wrongly label a hate group.  

 
 
Gordy327
7.1.12  Gordy327  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.11    2 days ago

Looks like that's your version of "I know you are but what am I?" Doesn't change the fact that you're wrong and seemingly admire a recognized hate group. That's not suprising either.

 
 
Bob Nelson
7.1.13  Bob Nelson  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.11    2 days ago
... the terrorist hate group SPLC...

It's impossible to respect anyone who can write a sentence like that.

Everyone has the right to disagree with whomever... but using words that are absurdly wrong reflects much more on the speaker than on the topic.

 
 
Heartland American
7.1.14  Heartland American  replied to  Bob Nelson @7.1.13    2 days ago

What you respect is irrelavent.  The facts are as I stated in my prior post.  There is no longer anything positive or good about the SPLC.  

 
 
Heartland American
7.1.15  Heartland American  replied to  Gordy327 @7.1.12    2 days ago

The SPLC actually is far worse than what you all accuse the ADF of being.  

 
 
Motherlessgoat
7.1.16  Motherlessgoat  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.14    2 days ago

Please stop conflating your opinions with facts, they sit on opposite ends of the spectrum. You have, of course, every right to hold any opinion, and it is abundantly apparent that facts had no part in its formation.

Question: Has the ADF ever stood in court to seek the protection of my daughter's constitutional rights?

 
 
Dulay
7.1.17  Dulay  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.14    2 days ago
What you respect is irrelavent.

Yet your every seed demands that others see relevance in the views you respect. Guess that golden rule thingy is lost on you.

 
 
Heartland American
7.1.18  Heartland American  replied to  Motherlessgoat @7.1.16    2 days ago

Please stop conflating your opinions with facts, they sit on opposite ends of the spectrum. You have, of course, every right to hold any opinion, and it is abundantly apparent that facts had no part in its formation.  Of course I won’t threaten to leave if you continue in posting your viewpoints here or seed articles that support your wrong point of view.  I have a tolerance for a diversity of political and religious beliefs being expressed here.  

 
 
Motherlessgoat
7.1.19  Motherlessgoat  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.18    2 days ago

So, you know how to copy and paste my posts. Woot! Good for you! 

Now let's see if you can find any facts to back up your opinions.

 
 
Heartland American
7.1.20  Heartland American  replied to  Motherlessgoat @7.1.19    2 days ago

When will you stop trying without success to present your opinions as if they were actually facts?    The Supreme condescending arrogance of the secular progressive left when it comes to their stating their opinion as fact knows no bounds.  

 
 
Gordy327
7.1.21  Gordy327  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.15    yesterday
The SPLC actually is far worse than what you all accuse the ADF of being.  

So an organization that fights for civil rights and fight against racism is worse to you? That speaks volumes about you! And what did I accuse the ADF of being exactly? I didn't accuse them of anything. I simply pointed out how they're labeled.

What you respect is irrelavent.

Considering you have none, it's not surprising you would think that.

The facts are as I stated in my prior post.

What "facts" would those be? Your posts are typically factually bankrupt!

 
 
Phoenyx13
7.1.22  Phoenyx13  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.20    yesterday
When will you stop trying without success to present your opinions as if they were actually facts?    The Supreme condescending arrogance of the secular progressive left when it comes to their stating their opinion as fact knows no bounds.  

that surely sounds like what many of the religious do - presenting their opinions (like this seed among other things) as if they were actually facts. The Supreme condescending arrogance of many of the religious when it comes to stating their opinion as fact knows no bounds.

 
 
MrFrost
7.1.23  MrFrost  replied to  Motherlessgoat @7.1.16    yesterday
Please stop conflating your opinions with facts, they sit on opposite ends of the spectrum. You have, of course, every right to hold any opinion, and it is abundantly apparent that facts had no part in its formation.

giphy3.gif

 
 
Motherlessgoat
7.1.24  Motherlessgoat  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.20    10 hours ago

I have given you no opinions at all. I merely called you out on yours, and the fact it was formed without a fact foundation.

Also, a big conclusion jump there to call me, what was it? "A secular progressive left." From whence do you come to that opinion, for it is an opinion based solely on not liking the points made in my posts.

 
 
Heartland American
7.1.25  Heartland American  replied to  Motherlessgoat @7.1.24    2 hours ago

You said you with your opinion disagreed with the facts as presented by the seeded article and osts in support of the facts there in.  

 
 
devangelical
8  devangelical    4 days ago

Proselytizing.

 
 
Heartland American
8.1  Heartland American  replied to  devangelical @8    4 days ago

You can’t deny our history or what Lincoln and  the founders said or what de Tocqueville said and wrote about our in God we trust nation, one nation under God.  

 
 
epistte
8.1.1  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @8.1    4 days ago

I'm not denying it because it never existed. 

Jefferson to John Adams,

The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus by the Supreme Being in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. ... But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with all this artificial scaffolding....

 
 
ArkansasHermit-too
8.1.2  ArkansasHermit-too  replied to  epistte @8.1.1    4 days ago
I'm not denying it because it never existed. 

Jefferson to John Adams,

The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus by the Supreme Being in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. ... But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with all this artificial scaffolding....

.

Just a guess but I don't believe that Jefferson would have thought very highly of the shoddy thinking behind seeds such as this one.

.

Jefferson's letter to John Adams, from Monticello, April 11, 1823. 

The truth is that the greatest enemies to the doctrines of Jesus are those calling themselves the expositors of them, who have perverted them for the structure of a system of fancy absolutely incomprehensible, and without any foundation in his genuine words.
 
 
Split Personality
8.1.3  Split Personality  replied to  Heartland American @8.1    4 days ago
n God we trust nation, one nation under God.

"In God we trust",  added in 1956.

"one nation under God', added in 1954.

the nation was just fine for 178 years without religious references  in our anthems, pledges or currency, just as the Founders expressed repeatedly.

 
 
Dulay
8.1.4  Dulay  replied to  Heartland American @8.1    4 days ago

Let's not forget what Lincoln said:

Springfield, Illinois
August 24, 1855

I am not a Know-Nothing. That is certain. How could I be? How can any one who abhors the oppression of negroes, be in favor or degrading classes of white people? Our progress in degeneracy appears to me to be pretty rapid. As a nation, we began by declaring that "all men are created equal." We now practically read it "all men are created equal, except negroes" When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read "all men are created equal, except negroes, and foreigners, and Catholics." When it comes to this I should prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretence of loving liberty -- to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure, and without the base alloy of hypocracy [sic].

Yours friend forever
A. Lincoln
 
 
Skrekk
8.1.5  Skrekk  replied to  Dulay @8.1.4    4 days ago

Excellent citation and rather appropriate for the current state of the country.

 
 
Dulay
8.1.6  Dulay  replied to  Skrekk @8.1.5    4 days ago

Thanks, I thought so too.

 
 
Bob Nelson
9  Bob Nelson    4 days ago
Why is America seemingly sinking into the abyss? We have forgotten God. As a nation, just like as individuals, we reap what we sow.

No.

"We" have not forgotten God. Unless of course Dr. Jerry Newcombe's "we" refers only to America's Evangelicals... in which case he is perfectly correct! (The doctor's website is... enlightening...  jrSmiley_35_smiley_image.gif  )

The leadership of the Evangelical movement has been taking its flock deeper and deeper into partisan politics, for the last several decades. With Donald Trump, that leadership... and all American Evangelicals... were faced with a choice between God and political expediency. They chose political expediency, blindly following a man who has demonstrated over and over that he does not follow Christ.

I, personally, am not part of that "we".

 
 
Heartland American
9.1  Heartland American  replied to  Bob Nelson @9    4 days ago

because God wanted all evangelicals to vote for Hillary....,laughing dudeLOLGiggle

 
 
lennylynx
9.1.1  lennylynx  replied to  Heartland American @9.1    4 days ago

If there really is a God who cares about humans having good morals, I'm sure that He DID want everyone to vote for Hillary over Trump, absolutely, and He would have been a HUGE Bernie Sanders fan.

 
 
Bob Nelson
9.1.2  Bob Nelson  replied to  Heartland American @9.1    4 days ago

... thus demonstrating complete ignorance of both God and Evangelicals...

 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
9.1.3  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Heartland American @9.1    4 days ago
because God wanted all evangelicals to vote for Hillary...

I don't believe Yahweh or, any of the other Pantheons care a flying flip about who we vote for or, about who leads America, I think if they are interested in anything it is the individual, not the country.

 
 
Kathleen/Butterfie
10  Kathleen/Butterfie    4 days ago

I think God has forgotten us.

 
 
Skrekk
10.1  Skrekk  replied to  Kathleen/Butterfie @10    4 days ago

Senility is common in elderly gods.

 
 
Freefaller
11  Freefaller    4 days ago

I certainly didn't forget god rather I came to the logical conclusion that he doesn't exist.  Morals have existed since before our earliest ancestors climbed out of the trees not because god poofed them into existence but because groups, tribes, villages, societies need them in order to function. 

 
 
Phoenyx13
12  Phoenyx13    4 days ago
•A crackdown on free speech by Apple. They decide what is and what is not “hate.” Consequently, conspiracy theorist Alex Jones is now denied his platform.

wait... Apple is the government now ? i always thought Apple was a private entity that could do as they please in concerns to their rules on speech and if the conservative minded didn't like it then they could just stop patronizing Apple and "let the market punish them" as per the capitalistic system they revere.

•Sex with robots is a growing fad.

do you have any stats on this ? i don't know anyone that is having "sex" with robots - of course those people could be out there but i'm skeptical on stating it's a "growing fad" unless i have more stats.

•The president is beleaguered by allegations of collusion with the Russians.

yes, we know you'll state it's because of whining or conspiracy theories etc, without ever looking further and asking "why would this be happening if the 'collusion' or anything illegal involving Russia never happened ?", then logically thinking the situation through. (btw, i'm not stating there is nor isn't any collusion or anything of that nature)

•Calls are going out for social media censorship of climate change “deniers.”

again - private entity that can make it's own rules regarding speech, correct ? there are "conservative" alternatives, so i suggest you use the capitalistic system you revere and go to those sites instead and let the "market" punish those "evil" social media companies, and you can stop seeding articles whining about it.

•In Chicago, 63 were shot over the weekend in a city with some of the strictest gun control laws. 44 of them were killedwithin 14 hours. As a colleague noted, “It’s like Fallujah, only worse.”

ever notice there are other cities with worse murder rates ?

•Older Americans have money woes. The New York Times (8/5/18) reports: “The rate of people 65 and older filing for bankruptcy is three times what it was in 1991.”

why are they having money woes ? i thought once Trump was in charge this country would be rich beyond our wildest dreams and everyone would be doing great financially since he's "Making America Great Again" - are you telling me this isn't working ?

so far, none of these things have to do with God unless God gives people guns and tells them to kill people, or God takes away money randomly from people or God is in charge of Apple and limiting speech or that God is gifting everyone with sex robots and demanding they use them for sexual purposes ? Ever notice that most of the religious are all about being held accountable to "someone else" instead of taking personal responsibility and holding themselves accountable ?

 
 
badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη
13  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη    4 days ago

I Just saw God in June on his farewell tour.

IMG_9826copyL.jpg

 
 
Hal A. Lujah
14  Hal A. Lujah    4 days ago
 
 
Thrawn 31
15  Thrawn 31    3 days ago

Meh, never a big Harry Potter fan to begin with.

 
 
A. Macarthur
16  A. Macarthur    3 days ago

Don't you just love it when self-ascribed Christians, Creationists, Evangelicals and the Pro Life Holier-Than-Thous …

• Support politicians who do the pimping for profiteer energy companies that are raping God's Green Earth … 

• Do not utter a word of condemnation of a POTUS who rolls back clean air and water standards

• Aren't marching in the streets in protest of children and families that are illegally incarcerated, separated from one another, caged in FOR PROFIT PRISONS, the corporate entities of which made $4 billion in 2017 and, contributed $225,000 to a Trump-supporting PAC?

… And still have the hypocritical balls … TO DECLARE THAT "WE AS A NATION HAVE FORGOTTEN GOD?"

Proverbs 11:29 

Please don't spit in my face and tell me "it's raining"!

 
 
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