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2016 Trump Tower Meeting Looks Increasingly Like a Setup by Russian and Clinton Operatives

  

Category:  News & Politics

Via:  heartland-american  •  6 years ago  •  66 comments

2016 Trump Tower Meeting Looks Increasingly Like a Setup by Russian and Clinton Operatives

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T



The June 2016 Trump Tower meeting between high-ranking members of the Republican presidential  campaign staff and a Russian lawyer with Kremlin ties remains the cornerstone of claims that Donald Trump colluded with Russia to steal the election.

A growing body of evidence, however, indicates that the meeting may have been a setup -- part of a broad effort to tarnish the Trump campaign involving Hillary Clinton operatives employed by Kremlin-linked figures and Department of Justice officials. This view, that the real collusion may have taken place among those who arranged the meeting rather than the Trump officials who agreed to attend it, is supported by two disparate lines of evidence pulled together for the first time here: newly released records and a pattern of efforts to connect the Trump campaign to Russia.


Bruce Ohr and Christopher Steele, in contact before and after the election.

AP Photos/File


The first line of evidence includes  emails, texts, and memos  recently turned over to Congress by the Department of Justice. They show how closely senior Justice Department officials and the Federal Bureau of Investigation worked with employees of Fusion GPS, a Washington-based research firm reportedly paid $1 million by Clinton operatives to dig up dirt on the Trump campaign.

They reveal that then-Associate Deputy Attorney General Bruce Ohr, the fourth-highest-ranking official at DOJ, coordinated before, during and after the election with Fusion GPS founder Glenn Simpson, who did work for the Clinton campaign and Russians; and former British intelligence officer Christopher Steele, who was employed by Simpson.


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Glenn Simpson, who worked for the Clinton campaign and Kremlin-tied lawyer Natalia Veselnitskaya.

AP Photo/Pablo Martinez Monsivais


Those emails, which disclose the topics of discussions but not their details, revolve around two business executives: Donald Trump and Oleg Deripaska, a Russian aluminum magnate close to President Vladimir Putin. Steele was particularly interested in resolving issues concerning Deripaska's U.S. visa , which was revoked in 2006 because of his suspected ties to organized crime. In another sign of the overlapping strands of this story, when Special Counsel Robert Mueller was running the FBI in 2009, the bureau had asked Deripaska to contribute millions of dollars to help locate former FBI agent Robert Levinson, captured in Iran in 2007 while working for the CIA. Levinson remains missing.

The Ohr-Steele-Simpson correspondence appears to include references to the former British spy’s work for Fusion GPS on Trump’s ties to Russia. Months before the election, Steele wrote Ohr to say that he would be back in Washington soon "on business of mutual interest." 


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Resolving the visa problems of Oleg Deripaska, right, with Russia's President, Vladimir Putin, was a focus of the Ohr-Simpson-Steele correspondence.

AP Photo


The cozy relationship was bolstered by the fact that the wife of the senior DOJ official, Nellie Ohr, was employed by Fusion GPS.

After Steele was dismissed by the FBI for speaking to the press for an October 31, 2016 report , Bruce Ohr took over the work of relaying Fusion GPS’ opposition research on the Trump campaign directly to the FBI.

The culmination of their combined efforts, the 35-page dossier of unverified Trump/Russia connections, was used by the FBI to secure a warrant to spy on the Trump campaign. The Department of Justice did not respond to RealClearInvestigations’ requests for comment, nor did Glenn Simpson's lawyer, Joshua Levy.

The second line of evidence reframing the Trump Tower meeting -- after the Ohr-Steele-Simpson correspondence – was first reported in June by RealClearInvestigations. It shows that, starting in March 2016, FBI confidential sources and other figures associated with Western intelligence services and the Clinton campaign approached the Trump team promising damaging information on Clinton. The Trump Tower meeting appears to have been the most successful of these approaches, since it was the one instance where the Trump campaign signaled it was willing to receive incriminating information on its opponent.

These two strands of evidence – the DOJ’s collaboration with Clinton-paid researchers and efforts to connect the Trump campaign to Russia – came together in midtown Manhattan on June 9, 2016 at Trump Tower.

At the center of it all was Fusion GPS, which had two clients whose interests were served by the Trump Tower meeting: the Russians and the Clinton campaign.


Natalia Veselnitskaya, who employed Glenn Simpson of Fusion GPS and dined with him the nights before and after the Trump Tower meeting.

AP Photo/Alexander Zemlianichenko, File


Even though no evidence has emerged from the meeting of any dark conspiracy, appearances were evidently enough. In sworn Senate testimony last year, Simpson claimed the meeting corroborated one of the key claims made in the reports filed by Fusion GPS contractor Steele: “Trump and his inner circle have accepted a regular flow of intelligence from the Kremlin, including on his Democratic and other political rivals.”

Nonetheless, Simpson also testified that he had no knowledge of the meeting with Donald Trump Jr. and others until it was reported a year later. There is reason to doubt that account.

In fact, the Russian lawyer at the center of the meeting, Natalia Veselnitskaya, was his client.

She has publicly stated that she used talking points developed by Simpson for the Russian government in that discussion. Kremlin officials also posted the allegations on the Prosecutor General’s website, and shared them with visiting U.S. congressional delegations.

In addition, Simpson has testified that he had dinner with Veselnitskaya the night before the meeting and the night after.


Rinat Akhmetshin, Trump Tower meeting attendee, photographed at a distance in 2016 after a documentary screening in Washington. 

Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty via AP


Accompanying Veselnitskaya to the meeting was Russian-American lobbyist Rinat Akhmetshin, who had served in the Soviet Union’s military counterintelligence service. His role remains unclear, but evidence suggests he may have been the source Simpson was alluding to in December 2016 when Ohr recorded that Simpson told him, “Much of the collection about the Trump campaign ties to Russia comes from a former Russian intelligence officer (? not entirely clear) who lives in the U.S.”

Veselnitskaya hired Simpson in spring 2014 for work that lasted, according to Simpson’s Senate testimony, until “mid to late 2016.”

Fusion GPS assisted Veselnitskaya -- representing Pyotr Katsyv and his son Denis, both Kremlin-tied businessmen -- in her campaign to repeal U.S. legislation sanctioning Russian officials under the 2012 Magnitsky Act, which was named for Sergei Magnitsky, a Russian corruption whistleblower who died in police custody.  Simpson, sources told RealClearInvestigations, was tasked with running a smear campaign against the driving force behind those sanctions, Chicago-born financier William Browder, who had employed Magnitsky.


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William Browder, whose complaint to the Justice Department that Simpson was acting as a foreign agent was ignored.

AP Photo/Virginia Mayo, File


Although the Trump campaign agreed to meet Veselnitskaya to receive dirt on Clinton, she succeeded in turning the meeting’s focus instead to the Magnitsky Act and Browder – including Simpson-generated claims accusing Browder of tax evasion and embezzlement. Citing her public acknowledgement, Browder told RealClearInvestigations, “It seems to me that Simpson wrote the talking points about me that Veselnitskaya used in her meeting with Donald Trump Jr.”

Although Browder was unaware of the Trump Tower meeting, he was so concerned about Fusion GPS’s work on behalf of Russian interests that in July 2016, he lodged a complaint with the DOJ against both Simpson and Akhmetshin, for failing to properly register as foreign agents while working for the Russian government.  

Instead of raising red flags, Browder’s concerns appear to have been ignored. Ohr continued to work with Fusion GPS. Records show he quickly responded to Simpson’s Aug. 22, 2016 email whose only text was the chummy subject line “Can u ring?” And the DOJ and FBI used the dossier prepared by Simpson’s firm – which drew on Russian sources -- as evidence to obtain a warrant in October 2016 to monitor the communications of Trump team adviser Carter Page.

The warrant was renewed three times, twice after Sen. Charles Grassley, the Senate Judiciary Committee chairman, sent an inquiry to the Justice Department in March 2017 on the status of Browder’s complaint. It has still not responded to Browder’s complaint.

With Trump’s former personal lawyer Michael Cohen reportedly speaking to Special Counsel Robert Mueller about the Trump Tower meeting, congressional Republicans are pushing back on the interpretation of the meeting as evidence of Trump collusion with Russia.  They argue that the meeting shows the collusion is between Russia and the Clinton campaign.

“Simpson approached the Clinton campaign through its law firm and said he could dig up dirt on Trump and Russia,” said one congressional investigator. “The difference between the Trump and Clinton campaigns’ willingness to take dirt on its opponent is that the Clintons went through with it and paid for it. While their source, Glenn Simpson, was working for a Russian oligarch” -- a reference to the Katsyv connection. 


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Rob Goldstone, the British music publicist who enticed Donald Trump Jr. to the Trump Tower meeting.

AP Photo


A lingering mystery of the Trump Tower meeting is the man who helped arrange it, British music publicist Rob Goldstone. On June 3, he emailed Donald Trump Jr. with an offer originating in a meeting in the office of the prosecutor general—Veslenitskaya’s point of contact with the Kremlin. Goldstone promised “official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father."

Trump Jr. promptly responded: "If it's what you say I love it."

The specificity of the phrasing in  Goldstone’s email appears designed to establish the case for collusion: “This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump.” 

Even more curious than the wording of Goldstone’s email is the role he played in arranging the meeting. Goldstone, who has kept a low profile since news of the meeting broke in July 2017, testified before Congress that he now regrets his part in it.


Jared Kushner and Donald Trump Jr., to the right of Donald Trump on the campaign trail.

AP Photo/Mary Altaffer


According to the dossier, Trump himself as well as aides Paul Manafort and Carter Page were in clandestine contact with the Russian government. “If that was really the case,” former FBI agent Mark Wauck told RealClearInvestigtions, “it’s not clear why the Russian government needed a British music publicist to make an overture. And why would Moscow need to send a Russian lawyer who didn’t speak English to Trump Tower? That tends to confirm that the meeting was intended as a setup.”

On June 9, 2016, Goldstone brought Veselnitskaya to meet with Trump Jr., Manafort and Jared Kushner at Trump Tower. The senior Trump campaign officials were disappointed to find out that she wanted to talk about Browder and his associates.

Trump Jr. cut the appointment with Veselnitskaya short. But if this were a sting operation, engineered by Simpson, with likely assistance from Justice Department officials he is now known to have been in regular contact with, the damage had already been done.

 “The purpose of the meeting,” one congressional investigator told RCI, “was to substantiate the Clinton-funded dossier alleging that Trump was taking dirt on his rivals from the Russians.”


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XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
1  seeder  XXJefferson51    6 years ago

Russia Investigation: It's beginning to look as if claims of monstrous collusion between Russian officials and U.S. political operatives were true. But it wasn't Donald Trump who was guilty of Russian collusion. It was Hillary Clinton and U.S. intelligence officials who worked with Russians and others to entrap Trump.

That's the stunning conclusion of a RealClear Investigations report by Lee Smith, who looked in-depth at the controversial June 2016 Trump Tower meeting between officials of then-candidate Donald Trump's campaign staff and a Russian lawyer known to have ties with high-level officials in Vladimir Putin's government.

The media have spun a tale of Trump selling his soul to the Russians for campaign dirt to use against Hillary, beginning with the now-infamous Trump Tower meeting.

But "a growing body of evidence ... indicates that the meeting may have been a setup — part of a broad effort to tarnish the Trump campaign involving Hillary Clinton operatives employed by Kremlin-linked figures and Department of Justice officials," wrote Smith.

Get the new IBD Politics & Opinionnewsletter!

Smith painstakingly weaves together the evidence that's already out there but has been largely ignored by the mainstream media, which have become so seized with Trump-hatred that their reporting even on routine matters can no longer be trusted.

But he adds in more evidence that the Justice Department only recently handed over to Congress. And It's damning.     https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/russian-collusion-hillary-clinton/

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
2  JohnRussell    6 years ago

The gist of this fantasy is that so and so knew so and so and so knew so and so, therefore it is all connected to benefit Hillary Clinton. 

If all these various people and entities conspired to entrap Trump, and presumably cause him to lose the election, why was none of it revealed until afterward? Or did Hillary just plan on losing the election due to the release of material that was damaging to her campaign, and then recoup it all by incriminating trump two years later? What is her plan? To have the 2016 election nullified and herself declared queen of the USA? 

The seeded article is pure right wing nut job fantasy, fueled by the coincidences of certain people knowing one another. This is how most right wing fantasy conspiracies develop. tangential relationships that are then weaved into an elaborate conspiracy. Unfortunately the payoff for this conspiracy makes absolutely no sense. We are supposed to believe that Clinton agreed to sabotage her own presidential campaign, that she had waited all her life for, in order to "entrap" the Trumps. 

It makes no sense, which is probably one good reason Mueller is not looking into it. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
2.1  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  JohnRussell @2    6 years ago

It is a hard news investigative journalistic report.  It is real, it is serious, and it’s damning toward Hillary and the Russians. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
2.1.1  JohnRussell  replied to  XXJefferson51 @2.1    6 years ago

It is ridiculous. Why would Clinton agree to have thousands of emails stolen from the DNC and Podesta in order to embarrass her and cost her votes. In order to entrap the Trump family? For what? 

I wish some people would think for a minute before they promote junk like this. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
2.1.2  JohnRussell  replied to  XXJefferson51 @2.1    6 years ago

I'm going to give you a chance. Explain to us right now what you think the Clinton campaign was going to gain by conducting the Trump Tower meeting as an entrapment of the Trumps? 

Also, point out to me one sentence in this entire article that explains how the Clinton campaign was supposed to benefit from this conspiracy. 

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
2.1.3  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  XXJefferson51 @2.1    6 years ago
It is a hard news investigative journalistic report.  It is real, it is serious, and it’s damning toward Hillary and the Russians. 

And, it is sourced through FOX Noise and, Tucker Carlson. Until  a legitimate source picks this up it is Fake News.

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
2.1.4  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  JohnRussell @2.1.1    6 years ago

“Browder told RealClearInvestigations, “It seems to me that Simpson wrote the talking points about me that Veselnitskaya used in her meeting with Donald Trump Jr.”

Although Browder was unaware of the Trump Tower meeting, he was so concerned about Fusion GPS’s work on behalf of Russian interests that in July 2016, he lodged a complaint with the DOJ against both Simpson and Akhmetshin, for failing to properly register as foreign agents while working for the Russian government.  

Instead of raising red flags, Browder’s concerns appear to have been ignored. Ohr continued to work with Fusion GPS. Records show he quickly responded to Simpson’s Aug. 22, 2016 email whose only text was the chummy subject line “Can u ring?” And the DOJ and FBI used the dossier prepared by Simpson’s firm – which drew on Russian sources -- as evidence to obtain a warrant in October 2016 to monitor the communications of Trump team adviser Carter Page.

The warrant was renewed three times, twice after Sen. Charles Grassley, the Senate Judiciary Committee chairman, sent an inquiry to the Justice Department in March 2017 on the status of Browder’s complaint. It has still not responded to Browder’s complaint.

With Trump’s former personal lawyer Michael Cohen reportedly speaking to Special Counsel Robert Mueller about the Trump Tower meeting, congressional Republicans are pushing back on the interpretation of the meeting as evidence of Trump collusion with Russia.  They argue that the meeting shows the collusion is between Russia and the Clinton campaign.

“Simpson approached the Clinton campaign through its law firm and said he could dig up dirt on Trump and Russia,” said one congressional investigator. “The difference between the Trump and Clinton campaigns’ willingness to take dirt on its opponent is that the Clintons went through with it and paid for it. While their source, Glenn Simpson, was working for a Russian oligarch” -- a reference to the Katsyv connection.”   

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
2.1.5  Sean Treacy  replied to  JohnRussell @2.1.2    6 years ago

They could start a narrative that Trump was working for the Russians in the months before the election  and then have a story planted immediately before the election that Trump was under investigation by the FBI. 

Which is what happened. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
2.1.6  JohnRussell  replied to  JohnRussell @2.1.2    6 years ago

Waiting HA. 

According to your article the June '16 meeting at Trump Tower was  a set up to provide the Clinton campaign with 'proof' that Trump was colluding with the Russians. If that is true, why did no one in the public hear of the Trump Tower meeting until halfway through 2017? 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
2.1.7  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @2.1.5    6 years ago

So they were brilliant in entrapping trump and completely incompetent using the fruits of the entrapment. 

Sean, you don't believe this garbage. 

Fusion and Steele knew from past experience and intelligence that Trump was implicated with shady Russian entities. This was known prior to 2016. They wanted to look more deeply into it and got Trump's election opponents to bankroll it. When alarming information turned up Steele informed US law enforcement and they rightfully decided to pursue it. That is what happened not withstanding all these right wing fantasies, and that is what Mueller is investigating, Trump's ties to Russians. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
2.1.8  JohnRussell  replied to  XXJefferson51 @2.1.4    6 years ago

Your copy and paste proves nothing other than that you are promoting a conspiracy theory. If dirt was manufactured about trump why was none of it made public during the campaign? What elements of the dossier were made public during the campaign in order to smear Trump? 

None of the dossier was made public during the campaign , yet you are attempting to use the dossier as proof that Clinton colluded with Russia and Fusion and the FBI to discredit the Trump campaign. Do you understand that what you are providing us with makes no sense. 

They created dirt on trump, and then never used it. What WAS used in the campaign was dirt on Clinton, as is alleged in some interpretations of the June 2016 meeting at trump Tower. 

You want us to believe that Clinton had dirt manufactured about trump that was never used, in the meantime dirt against Clinton , which is what the Trump Tower meeting was about, was used. 

Go back to the drawing board HA. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
2.1.9  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @2.1.3    6 years ago

Fox News is a legitimate source for news and you all will simply have to adapt and begin to learn to live live with that reality.  It’s there, it’s real news and there’s nothing you can do to change that fact of life.  

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
2.1.10  Tessylo  replied to  XXJefferson51 @2.1.9    6 years ago

Faux 'news'

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
2.1.11  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  XXJefferson51 @2.1.9    6 years ago

Not according to Roger Ailes:

Objective viewers have long ago concluded that Fox News is not, and never has been, a legitimate news network. They began as a project by right-wing propagandist Rupert Murdoch and Republican media strategist Roger Ailes to spread disinformation and promote GOP politicians. And for the past 17 years they have carried out that mission with a roster of rabidly partisan hosts broadcasting provable lies.
Now, with the publication of the “Hollywood Reporter’s 35 Most Powerful People in New York Media 2015,” Roger Ailes, the Fox News chairman and CEO, has confessed that his network, despite its name, is not actually in the news business. Belittling his cable news competitors CNN and MSNBC, he gave the Reporter a statement revealing his true professional aspirations:
“In fact, Ailes, 74, no longer views those networks as rivals. ‘We’re competing with TNT and USA and ESPN,’ he says.”
So according to Ailes, he regards channels that are plainly entertainment and sports as his competition, not other news outlets. That is not really all that surprising if you have examined the Fox programming model with any depth. News Corpse has previously analyzed how Fox incorporates methods that are generally reserved for entertainment programs. As recently as last month we published a description of the hyper-dramatization Fox injects into their presentation:

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Quiet
2.1.12  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  XXJefferson51 @2.1    6 years ago
It is a hard news investigative journalistic report.

No, it's not. Its foundation rests on something we already know not to be true. The linked article says it bases its assumption on the fact that "House Republicans have claimed that the FBI used the dossier to get permission from the secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) court" but we already know this to be false as has come out after the Presidents lap dog Devin Nunes released the incomplete partisan Republican memo.

The fact is there was A LOT more evidence that was used to get the warrant to monitor Carter Page. And the dossier has not been debunked, in fact most has now been corroborated. I get why Republicans are lying and deflecting, who wouldn't after so much clear evidence of coordination between the Russians and their campaign, they're desperate. This investigation will run its course and the truth will out as they say, and it will not be pretty for Republicans. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
2.2  Vic Eldred  replied to  JohnRussell @2    6 years ago
If all these various people and entities conspired to entrap Trump, and presumably cause him to lose the election,

Stranger things have happened John. Remember, Nixon wanted info in the Watergate Hotel, even though he won an election in a landslide. Very similar, don't you think.

I think the fact that Fusion GPS would lay out all this bait was to ensnare the Trump people was an effort to simply to put something real & verifiable into the Steele Dossier

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
2.3  Vic Eldred  replied to  JohnRussell @2    6 years ago
It makes no sense, which is probably one good reason Mueller is not looking into it. 

To the contrary, it makes too much sense and implicates democrats & the deep state, thus Mueller is not looking into it.

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
2.3.1  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Vic Eldred @2.3    6 years ago

Exactly. It was a deep state plot to attack the new President before he ever took office.  

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
3  Galen Marvin Ross    6 years ago
RIGHT-CENTER BIAS
These media sources are slightly to moderately conservative in bias. They often publish factual information that utilizes loaded words (wording that attempts to influence an audience by using appeal to emotion or stereotypes) to favor conservative causes. These sources are generally trustworthy for information, but may require further investigation. See all Right-Center sources.
Factual Reporting: MIXED
History
Founded in 2000, and based in Chicago, Illinois, RealClearPolitics, LLC is a news aggregation political analysis and polling site. Operating under the RealClear brand, there are 14 RealClear websites that cover various platforms including RealClearPolitics, RealClearDefense, RealClearScience, RealClearReligion and more. The Founders of RealClearPolitics are John McIntyre, an options trader, and Tom Bevan, an advertising account executive.
In 2007, Forbes Media took a 51% equity stake in RealClear Holdings. In 2015, Crest Media, which owns the Middle East news outlet Al-Monitor, and the original owners bought out a large equity stake that had been possessed by Forbes Media. Crest Media was founded by the president and chairman of Houston-based Crest Investment Company Jamal Daniel. Daniel is also the founder of Al-Monitor.
Launched in 2016, RealClearInvestigations is the investigative division of RealClearPolitics. RealClearInvestigations is edited by Tom Kuntz.
Funded by / Ownership
RealClear Investors and Crest Media is the owner of RealClearPolitics. John McIntyre
is the Co-founder & CEO, Tom Bevan is the Co-founder & Publisher and Erin Waters is the President of the RealClear Media Group. RealClear is funded through paid subscriptions and an online advertising model.
Analysis / Bias
RealClearInvestigations reports and links to news from other outlets and also produces its own original stories.
In review, RealClearInvestigations frequently uses emotionally loaded headlines such as this: “2016 Trump Tower Meeting Looks Increasingly Like a Setup by Russian and Clinton Operatives” and “Mueller Still Relying on Discredited Steele Dossier.”
Generally, story selection moderately favors the Right and RealClearInvestigations takes a Pro-Trump stance. RealClearInvestigations typically sources their information to credible sources such as the The Hill, Wall Street Journal, NBC News and the Washington Examiner, however they also source factually mixed sources such as Fox News. For example this snippet from the article: “Investigation worked with employees of Fusion GPS, a Washington-based research firm reportedly paid $1 million (Fox News link) by Clinton operatives to dig up dirt on the Trump campaign.” RealClearInvestigations sourced Fox News who in turn sourced the same information from another factually mixed source the Daily Caller, owned by conservative political commentator Tucker Carlson.
A factual search reveals they have not failed a fact check, however some of the sources they utilize have failed fact checks such as the conspiracy website, Zerohedge.
Overall, we rate RealClearInvestigations Right-Center Biased based on story selection that moderately favors the Right and Mixed for factual reporting due to utilizing several sources that have failed fact checks. (1/25/2017) Updated (M. Huitsing 8/14/2018)

I wouldn't trust FOX Noise to tell me the time of day, why would I trust this source of yours?

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @3    6 years ago

That you don’t trust it means nothing to me.  Of course the source you brought here is a pile of crap  💩 source knee deep in bias itself.  And it relies on so called fact checkers that are even more pro left biased.  

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
3.1.1  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  XXJefferson51 @3.1    6 years ago
Of course the source you brought here is a pile of crap  💩 source knee deep in bias itself.

Prove it with a reliable source.

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
3.1.3  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  XXJefferson51 @3.1    6 years ago
That you don’t trust it means nothing to me.

"Me thinks Thou dost protest too much."

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
3.1.5  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  XDm9mm @3.1.4    6 years ago

Digging a whole

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
3.1.7  Dulay  replied to  XDm9mm @3.1.4    6 years ago

Yet, like it or not, it IS the designated 'go to' source for evaluating the bias of media sources for publication on this website. 

I note that I have never seen anyone recommend to the RA a more 'reliable' source for said evaluations.

I was taught by an excellent entrepreneur that if I brought up a management level issue, I should also bring a solution to the table.

Please proceed... 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
3.1.9  Dulay  replied to  XDm9mm @3.1.8    6 years ago

Please explain WTF that has to do with supplying an alternative source for NT to use for bias evaluations? Please be specific...

Your comment seems to do is bolster my posit that those that whine about our 'go to' source are unwilling or unable to offer solutions. 

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
3.1.11  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  XDm9mm @3.1.6    6 years ago
I suggest you stop digging.

Now, you know that is you digging even deeper to find the truth, but, the problem is, the truth isn't down the Trump created hole.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
3.1.12  Dulay  replied to  XDm9mm @3.1.10    6 years ago
I'm simply illuminating the extremely biased source of it's funding. 

By linking an 'extremely biased conspiracy-pseudoscience' source to support your posit? 

Above Top Secret

CONSPIRACY-PSEUDOSCIENCE
Sources in the Conspiracy-Pseudoscience category may publish unverifiable information that is not always supported by evidence. These sources may be untrustworthy for credible/verifiable information, therefore fact checking and further investigation is recommended on a per article basis when obtaining information from these sources. See all Conspiracy-Pseudoscience sources.
Factual Reporting: LOW
Notes: Above Top Secret is a right wing bias conspiracy site. It has all the themes you would expect. Mostly though, Above Top Secret, does not like liberal politics and demonstrates a strong right wing bias in reporting and wording. (1/13/2017)

Claiming that is not a biased source is similar to claiming Hillary Clinton is President. It's simply untrue and laughable.

What's simply untrue and laughable is your misrepresentation of the content of my comment. NOWHERE did I opine on whether our 'go to' source for bias evaluations, is bias or not.

The FACT is, the question is moot. It has been chosen as the 'go to' source for this site. PERIOD, full stop. As I said, and you haven't denied, no one whining about that choice has offered a viable alternative and argued for a change. That leads me to believe that whining is all they've got...

If the source you cited is an example of the 'quality' of the alternative sources available, I'd just keep whining if I were you.

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1.13  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @3.1.1    6 years ago

Nothing that you read and present here is a reliable source.  The fact that you use your sources as some kind of gospel to attack our sources isn’t going to cut it here.  We conservatives have and use our sources and we no longer give a darn about what the left thinks of them and totally ignore the bs from the so called fact checkers and so called media bias rater.  They are biased and dead to us as a so called objective source.  We hold your sources with the same contempt you have for ours.  

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1.14  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  XDm9mm @3.1.4    6 years ago

Interesting....so much for that.  

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1.15  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Dulay @3.1.12    6 years ago

We are talking about Real Clear here.  Not some conspiracy site on either side.  

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
3.1.16  Dulay  replied to  XXJefferson51 @3.1.15    6 years ago
We are talking about Real Clear here.  

Actually no, NO we are NOT. 

Not some conspiracy site on either side.  

Yes, YES IT IS a conspiracy site. DO try to keep up.

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1.17  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Dulay @3.1.16    6 years ago

Stay on the topic of the seed from Real Clear Investigations.  No other subject or attacking the seed, source or seeder can be considered on topic.  

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
3.1.18  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  XXJefferson51 @3.1.13    6 years ago
Nothing that you read and present here is a reliable source.

It's good to know you don't consider history books a reliable source. laughing dude

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
3.1.19  Dulay  replied to  XXJefferson51 @3.1.17    6 years ago
Stay on the topic of the seed from Real Clear Investigations.  No other subject or attacking the seed, source or seeder can be considered on topic.  

Bullshit HA. The validity of the seed and the quality of the source are ALWAYS on topic. 

First of all, YOU replied to the first comment in this thread and DID NOT flag it as off topic. 

Secondly, YOU up voted ALL of XD's comments, NONE of which have a fucking thing to do with the 'Real Clear Investigations' seed. Your comment to me reveals a bias. 

Thirdly, flag my comment as off topic and refrain from replying to it per the CoC. It's BAD FORM, to characterize my comment as off topic while failing to flag it. It leads me to believe that you know damn well that I was on topic and just need to lash out. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1.20  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Dulay @3.1.7    6 years ago

It may be what you describe but we are impeaching it as that trusted and respected site you want to impose upon us.  It is in fact a joke not to be given any credibility at all by any objective sensible observers.  Consider it nuked.  

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1.21  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Dulay @3.1.19    6 years ago

Right now destroying the credibility of media bias checkers and impeaching its reliability and objectivity is more important than the topic.  The info provided above in 3.1.4 will be referred to each and every time a liberal uses it to attack an alternative media site. I’ll simply put that below their rating of whatever conservative media source is being challenged by the left.  

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
3.1.22  Dulay  replied to  XXJefferson51 @3.1.21    6 years ago
Right now destroying the credibility of media bias checkers and impeaching its reliability and objectivity is more important than the topic.

Then I suggest you write a meta about it rather than whining incessantly. 

 
 
 
A. Macarthur
Professor Guide
3.1.23  A. Macarthur  replied to  XXJefferson51 @3.1.21    6 years ago
The info provided above in 3.1.4 will be referred to each and every time a liberal uses it to attack an alternative media site. I’ll simply put that below their rating of whatever conservative media source is being challenged by the left.  

In other words you are IMPLEMENTING A DEFAULT CENSORSHIP AGAINST LIBERAL ATTACKS REGARDLESS OF THE SPECIFICS OF FORTHCOMING REBUTTALS FROM LIBERALS!

No way.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.1.24  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  XDm9mm @3.1.8    6 years ago

Your source is a conspiracy outlet. There is no way to evaluate it for it's accuracy, since according to rational wki: 

Above Top Secret  is the internet's beehive for all things  conspiracy UFO paranormal  and just about anything  crank -related. The domain was registered in 1997 by Simon Gray, but he didn't actually start developing the site until 1999. [2]  Initially it was a compilation of various documents and texts concerning shadow government, the  New World Order , and related theories, but it primarily focused on  extraterrestrial  life and alleged attempts by the government to  cover up  its existence. Following the  9/11 attacks , the site received a boom in popularity, has since undergone several major layout changes (the current one being quite GFX-laced, rather odd for such a website, don't you think?), and eventually mutated into one of the largest and most popular conspiracy theory discussion boards on the internet with over 9.5 million posts of, apparently, "substance".

Nowadays the site can be considered oxymoronic. It advertises itself as and embraces the beliefs of the alternative conspiracy media, but it is all very stylized and the site utilizes all sorts of gimmicks to attract viewers, which really doesn't seem like a good presentation for "classified" information. One might say this is so it can be accessible to the brainwashed  sheeple , so the "truth" can set them free, but is it necessary for it to almost  satirize itself?

See, we can all find something on the internet to support our POV. 

Our standard stands and will be respected. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1.25  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  A. Macarthur @3.1.23    6 years ago

How is putting that below their post censorship of their post.  I didn’t say I’d erase their post.  By your standard them putting a media fact check post on my seed would be a form of censorship of my seed.  

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1.26  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @3.1.18    6 years ago

Which ones?  

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.1.27  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  A. Macarthur @3.1.23    6 years ago

Disclaimer

The information contained in this website is for general information purposes only and is the opinion of individual reviewers for Media Bias/Fact Check. The opinions expressed on Media Bias/Fact Check are protected under “Fair Comment.” The information is provided by Media Bias/Fact Check (MBFC News) and while we endeavor to keep the information up to date and correct, we make no representations or warranties of any kind, express or implied, about the completeness or accuracy of opinions/information on the website for any purpose. Any reliance you place on such information is therefore strictly at your own risk.

Source: https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/disclaimer/

 
 
 
epistte
Junior Guide
4  epistte    6 years ago

So now the GOP claim is that Hillary infiltrated the Trump administration and colluded with the Russians? You have got to be kidding!

Is the Onion now working for Fox News to write this nonsense?

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
5  JBB    6 years ago

Utter Balderdash. A krazy conspiracy theory for the weak minded and those who cannot handle the truth...

Every American in that Trump Tower meeting was obligated to inform law enforcement. None of them did.

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
5.1  Studiusbagus  replied to  JBB @5    6 years ago
Utter Balderdash. A krazy conspiracy theory for the weak minded and those who cannot handle the truth...

Yep....first it was "never happened, you're just posting lies because of your hate"

"So what? Jr. Met with the Russians to talk about adoptions" you're just posting this because you're a hater...fake news"

"Trump had nothing to do with that memo, you're just posting he wrote that because you're a hater"

"Ok, Jr. posted the emails, he didn't get anything so, no crime" you're just posting this because of you're hate"

"Ok, so Trump's lawyers admitted Trump dictated the memo, he was protecting his son, any father would do that. You're hate is driving you to post fake news"

"Collusion is not illegal!"

"You're just jealous of all his accomplishments!"

But when pressed, they can't tell you what his involvement led to his accomplishments. 

The poster boys for empty right wing rhetoric.

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
5.2  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  JBB @5    6 years ago

Cornhusker4Palin got a good laugh 🤭 out of your post.  Said to say hello.  

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
6  bbl-1    6 years ago

Mr. Heartland, you're barking up the wrong tree, as usual.

The Hillary/Russian connections were in Benghazi.  I thought everyone knew that.

Besides, the Trump's biggest problems aren't the Russians---its that 'sticky' Russian money and all of those strings that came attached to it.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
7  Dulay    6 years ago
After Steele was dismissed by the FBI for speaking to the press for an October 31, 2016 report, Bruce Ohr took over the work of relaying Fusion GPS’ opposition research on the Trump campaign directly to the FBI.
The culmination of their combined efforts, the 35-page dossier of unverified Trump/Russia connections, was used by the FBI to secure a warrant to spy on the Trump campaign.

Bullshit.

Your author should have kept a timeline in front of him while he wrote his 'conspiracy theory'. It may have helped him sound a bit less deluded. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
7.1  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Dulay @7    6 years ago

The seeded article is right on and accurate on all counts.  

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
7.1.1  Dulay  replied to  XXJefferson51 @7.1    6 years ago

False. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
7.1.2  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Dulay @7.1.1    6 years ago

angelAbsolutely Positively True.  Big hugs

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
7.1.3  Dulay  replied to  XXJefferson51 @7.1.2    6 years ago
Absolutely Positively True.

Really. Fine. Prove that Bruce Ohr had anything to do with the content of the Steele dossier. Links please. 

I have more questions after you post your first answer. 

BTW, if you fail to answer I will presume that you admit that statement in the seed is bullshit. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
7.1.4  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Dulay @7.1.3    6 years ago

It didn’t say he had anything to do with the content. It said he relayed whatever the contents were from Fusion where his wife worked by the way to the FBI.  

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
7.1.5  Dulay  replied to  XXJefferson51 @7.1.4    6 years ago
It didn’t say he had anything to do with the content.

Yes it does: 

The culmination of their combined efforts, the 35-page dossier of unverified Trump/Russia connections, was used by the FBI to secure a warrant to spy on the Trump campaign.

As any thinking person can see, the article infers that the CONTENT of the dossier was 'the combined effort' of Ohr and Steele. 

It said he relayed whatever the contents were from Fusion where his wife worked by the way to the FBI. 

It says that AFTER Oct, 31, 2016 'Bruce Ohr took over'. Here it is right here HA:

After Steele was dismissed by the FBI for speaking to the press for an October 31, 2016 report, Bruce Ohr took over the work of relaying Fusion GPS’ opposition research on the Trump campaign directly to the FBI.

So Oct. 31 the Mother Jones article comes out and AFTER that the FBI admonished Steele in NOVEMBER. 

Yet it is DOCUMENTED FACT that the CONTENT of the dossier cited in the FISA application was WELL KNOW by the FBI BEFORE October 31, 2016. The FISA application was WRITTEN and processed during September/October of 2016 and the warrant was AUTHORIZED sometime in OCTOBER. 

So AFTER Oct. 31, 2016, nobody had to 'take over the work of relaying' ANYTHING to the FBI because the FBI ALREADY HAD the document in hand and FBI leadership and teams of FBI Agents had already READ it and corroborated parts of it.

As I said, the author should have reviewed a timeline of the events BEFORE he wrote the bullshit in his article. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
7.1.6  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Dulay @7.1.5    6 years ago

The article is right.  It stands and I stand by it.  

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
7.1.7  Dulay  replied to  XXJefferson51 @7.1.6    6 years ago
The article is right.  

Nope, already proved that it isn't but I know facts don't matter to you...

It stands and I stand by it.

Mores the pity. 

 
 
 
A. Macarthur
Professor Guide
8  A. Macarthur    6 years ago

Conservative Website First Funded Anti-Trump Research by Firm That Later Produced Dossier

  • Oct. 27, 2017

WASHINGTON — The Washington Free Beacon, a conservative website funded by a major Republican donor, first hired the research firm that months later produced for Democrats the salacious dossier describing ties between Donald J. Trump and the Russian government, the website said on Friday.

The Free Beacon, funded in large part by the New York hedge fund billionaire Paul Singer, hired the firm, Fusion GPS, in 2015 to unearth damaging information about several Republican presidential candidates, including Mr. Trump. But The Free Beacon told the firm to stop doing research on Mr. Trump in May 2016, as   Mr. Trump was clinching the Republican nomination .

Hillary Clinton’s campaign and the Democratic National Committee had begun paying   Fusion GPS in April for research that eventually became the basis for the dossier.

The Free Beacon informed the House Intelligence Committee on Friday that it had retained the firm. That committee is one of a number of congressional committees investigating Russian attempts to disrupt the 2016 election and whether there was any collusion with Mr. Trump’s associates.

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
8.1  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  A. Macarthur @8    6 years ago

Talk about ancient news.  We all knew that.  What was done in the primary campaign in an internal primary contest does not in any way absolve Hillary for what she did later.  The fact that some GOP factions dug for dirt and didn’t use it doesn’t help Hillary and her use of Steele and his connections to Russia.  

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
8.1.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  XXJefferson51 @8.1    6 years ago

The "dossier" is solely the work of the Christopher Steele, who was only paid by Clinton. The website paid for a search of public records of Republican candidates. It shows how desperate some on the left are as they conflate the two separate projects to mislead gullible liberals into thinking the Free Beacon helped paid for the Russian collusion, which was solely the Clinton and the DNC.

 
 
 
A. Macarthur
Professor Guide
8.1.2  A. Macarthur  replied to  XXJefferson51 @8.1    6 years ago
Talk about ancient news.  We all knew that.  What was done in the primary campaign in an internal primary contest does not in any way absolve Hillary for what she did later.  The fact that some GOP factions dug for dirt and didn’t use it doesn’t help Hillary and her use of Steele and his connections to Russia.  

"Ancient" doesn't mean false nor insignificant …  and nothing in the Dossier has yet to be found untrue; Steele's "connection to Russia" makes him a unique resource for information …

Christopher Steele
Born 24 June 1964   (age 54) Aden ,   South Arabia   (now   Yemen )
Residence Farnham, Surrey [1]
Alma mater Girton College, Cambridge
Occupation Private intelligence consultant
Spying career
Service Secret Intelligence Service
Active 1987–2009
Other work Orbis Business Intelligence Ltd

Christopher David Steele   (born 24 June 1964) is a former British  intelligence officer  with the  Secret Intelligence Service  MI6 from 1987 until his retirement in 2009. He ran the Russia desk at MI6 HQ in London between 2006 and 2009. In 2009 he co-founded Orbis Business Intelligence, a  London -based  private intelligence firm . He authored  a dossier  that claims Russia collected a file of  compromising information  on  U.S. President   Donald Trump . [2] [3]

It takes a true sycophant to talk anyone's connection to Russia other than that of Trump himaelf!

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
Professor Guide
9  Thrawn 31    6 years ago
2016 Trump Tower Meeting Looks Increasingly Like A Setup By Russian And Clinton Operatives

Looks to me like Trump and his kids are fuckin retards, little else. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
9.1  seeder  XXJefferson51  replied to  Thrawn 31 @9    6 years ago

Not at all going to happen.  It is the deep state, Hillary, Obama, and their underlings who are in deep doo doo 💩. 

 
 

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