Border wall symbolizes security, not racism
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
The first job is look after your own personal safety. This is true of nations as well as individuals.
Somehow a Grinch always manages to show up to ruffle our Christmas spirit.
This year, the Grinch is the form of the Democratic leadership that is blocking the Christmas present that President Donald Trump wants to deliver to the nation in the form a wall to defend our southwestern border.
Trump wants $5 billion for the wall as part of a bill to continue funding the federal government. The Democrats say, "No," so now we're in another of the all too familiar standoffs, producing a government shutdown.
Why is this wall, which was a key component of the platform on which Trump ran and was elected, so important?
I spend a lot of time on airplanes. It has always struck me that when the flight crew delivers the message before takeoff about the possibility of using an oxygen mask, they note that adults traveling with children should don their mask, before helping the child.
It's counter to the instincts of most adults to do this. Which is why the instructions are explicitly given. You can't help your child, your neighbor or anybody else if you are not around to perform the task.
The first job is look after your own personal safety. This is true of nations as well as individuals.
Is building this wall on our southwestern border contrary to the message of the Statue of Liberty, which stands in New York harbor, inviting to our shores the world's "tired... poor... huddled masses, yearning to be free"
Certainly not. The wall is about protecting our nation and making sure that it continues, strong and free, so that the distressed of the world can continue to see America as a light, a refuge and a bastion of the world's greatest ideals.
It just so happens that there are those around the world who are not huddled masses, but terrorists, drug dealers and others who want to undermine our national safety and integrity.
Let us recall that those who piloted the planes on that horrible day, Sept.11, 2001, leading to the deaths of more than 3,000 Americans, trained in our country during the presidency of Bill Clinton.
Latin America is a hotbed of unstable, despotic regimes that produce the horrible conditions causing so many to want to leave. Despotism produces dangerous bedfellows, and pernicious regimes around the world see these despotic regimes in Latin America as an opportunity for adventurism in our back yard.
The Wall Street Journal's Americas columnist Mary O'Grady has been regularly documenting this.
Just last week, she wrote about Russia's penetration in Latin America, quoting head of U.S. Southern Command, Adm. Kurt W. Tidd, that "Russia's increased role in our hemisphere is particularly concerning... could eventually transition from a regional spoiler to a critical threat to the U.S. homeland."
O'Grady also has written about the penetration of Iran into Latin America. "Iran has targeted Latin America since the mid-1980s by establishing mosques and cultural centers to spread the revolution," she writes.
The point is there are real threats. Would anyone have opposed spending $50 billion or $100 billion if it could have stopped 9/11?
The federal budget is now more than $4 trillion. We are talking here about $5 billion, one-tenth of 1 percent.
For perspective, in 1958, 60 percent of our federal budget went to defense and 25 percent went to social spending. Now 70 percent goes to social spending and less than 20 percent to defense.
Some very confused people want to claim this wall is about racism. That conclusion is only possible if you think defending our nation and the core principles that make it free is racist.
The American formula for diversity is "E Pluribus Unum." Out of many, one. Defending this is what this wall is about.
Let's hope President Trump prevails over the Democratic Grinch and succeeds in delivering this important Christmas present to the American people.
Star Parker is an author and president of CURE, Center for Urban Renewal and Education. Contact her at www.urbancure.org .
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“It's counter to the instincts of most adults to do this. Which is why the instructions are explicitly given. You can't help your child, your neighbor or anybody else if you are not around to perform the task.
The first job is look after your own personal safety. This is true of nations as well as individuals.
Is building this wall on our southwestern border contrary to the message of the Statue of Liberty, which stands in New York harbor, inviting to our shores the world's "tired... poor... huddled masses, yearning to be free"
Certainly not. The wall is about protecting our nation and making sure that it continues, strong and free, so that the distressed of the world can continue to see America as a light, a refuge and a bastion of the world's greatest ideals.
It just so happens that there are those around the world who are not huddled masses, but terrorists, drug dealers and others who want to undermine our national safety and integrity.”
Trump is right to insist we build the wall. It is and always has been needed. We need to protect against gangs, drugs, terrorists, traffickers, and the common criminal who would enter our exceptional America through other ways than legal ports of entry. It is a matter of national self preservation and Trump should keep the government shilutdown Schumer started going as long as it takes to get wall funding.
Let me give you a little clue. The gangs of Mexico have enough C4 to take out any wall 10 times over.
And yet they’ve never done so where 400 miles of wall/fencing currently exists. The border fencing in San Diego has reduced illegal crossings there by 90%
Well that's because no one is going to waste explosives on a job bolt cutters can do. Is that really your argument against the possibility of explosives being used to breach a larger physical barrier? That no one has blown up a fence yet? Really?
Build the wall and watch
Amen. Please do 😊
You probably need to help bugsy
Not really sure what you mean. But totally agree with your other post.
Yeah.
But I'm not convinced a wall does that better than other solutions. How many infrared drones can we buy for $5b?
Been that way for a LONG LONG LONG time. A wall will never stop them especially since most of the terrorist attacks on the USA came from within. Oklahoma comes to mind. How would trumps ridiculous waste of a wall have prevented that? Or Las Vegas? San Bernadino? Stoneman Douglas? Orlando? It would have prevented NONE of those tragedies.
Trumps wall BS is nothing more than playing on people's emotions to get elected. PERIOD. He knew it was a hot ticket item that the repubs were "worried" about so he ran on it. Now his back is against the wall, (literally), and his base is looking for him to deliver on his promise. He has had two years with a republican congress and STILL couldn't get it done. Now the Dems are taking the house and guess what? Trump just became a lame duck that will not only not get his stupid fucking wall, but nothing else he wants either.
The reality is that illegal immigration slowed almost to a stop ~4-5 years ago but leave it to the fake news reich wing media to keep pushing it to the front.
The facts say otherwise. There is a current shrinking population of illegal immigrants, the total number of which dropped by over 1 million during Obama's two terms and the trend continues. If you have some sort of other evidence to refute the facts, please do provide.
ICE's numbers say that in 2015 the number of illegal immigrants caught and removed from the country was 235,413 and that went up to 256,085 this past year. Notice, that these are just the illegal immigrants that have been CAUGHT and REMOVED. How many more are there that are actually have not been caught and how many more are there that were caught and released by sanctuary cities, counties, and states?
Figure 1 of the following link shows a nice chart of removals from 2008 to 2015:
And here is the latest report from ICE:
statistically it's been right wing extremists for the most part in America
The first lady is one. She should be deported as well.
Hey didn't donny say that chain migration needs to stop? Just curious since his in-laws used it to become US citizens.
I want secure borders too, but spending 25 billion on a wall? No. That's like putting a speed bump on top of a speed bump. It's dumb, a waste of money and pointless. FFS, it's not even a wall anymore, now it's down to a damn fence and didn't trump say Mexico was paying for it? Why aren't you screaming to trump about that little gem of a lie?
I thought you were talking about illegal immigrants?
Actually she is. She violated her work visa when she came here. Her visa did not allow her to make money here. She took a modeling job and was paid for that job. She violated her visa. That makes her a criminal illegal alien invader.
[deleted]
apparently it's a lot easier to get citizenship if your husband is a millionaire with a mushroom dick. my DIL has been in the process for over 3 years, but she has brown skin.
As many as you can imagine? Because that's all the evidence you have to support any claim that illegal immigration is rising. There is ZERO correlation between a rise in the number of deportations and a supposed rise in illegal border crossings. All those numbers mean is ICE is continuing the task Obama set for them to diligently work to humanely deport the 10 million illegal immigrants still living in our country. Stop buying into the fear fantasy right wing pundits use on their base and maybe you'll be able to start thinking for yourself.
The data says differently
FY2018 521,000 illegals apprehended making illegal border crossings
No, it doesn't.
" Arrests of people trying to cross illegally into the U.S. from Mexico plunged to the lowest level since 1971 , as fewer people attempted the trek, the Department of Homeland Security announced Tuesday."
Your link shows that overall it's been declining and this is from your link:
" In FY18, a total of 396,579 individuals were apprehended between ports of entry on our Southwest Border."
I posted the link to my data from the border patrol who actually does the arrests.
they show the lowest arrests in the past 5 years was FY2017 with 415,517 caught invading our country
and they show they arrested over 51,000 in both October and November of this year which means FY 2019 could top 600,000 invaders caught.
we NEED the Wall to defend our sovereignty
Which is down dramatically from the over 1 million a year we averaged under Bush. I know, I know, that ruins the right wing panicked narrative of the brown wave coming to wash away "white culture". Without seeing increasing numbers, why the urgent need for a wall? That's why right wing pundits lied to the gullible rubes, they had to in order to get support for a wall. And how can you create a bogey man without making it feel like he's coming for your children right now! "Ahhhhh! We have to support Trump who said he'll protect us from the brown bogey mans! Ahhhh!". It was an effective strategy, and it got all the most gullible white nationalists and xenophobes jumping up and down in support. Sad to see so many people get fooled by such an idiot.
Read your own link! It's right there under the first chart.
"In FY18, a total of 396,579 individuals were apprehended between ports of entry on our Southwest Border."
It repeats it on the link to
" In November, 51,856 people were apprehended between ports of entry on the Southwest Border, compared with 51,001 in the month of October. In FY18, a total of 396,579 individuals were apprehended between ports of entry on our Southwest Border."
"the left is against making the border as secure as possible"
Wally that is the most distinguish comment of the month. However the trump wall won't help a bit.
Minorityphobes are the only one's that the trump wall will do some good.
And, just where did you get that information?
Funny how the statistics actually show a 90%+ drop in illegal border crossings in areas where there was walls/fences put up after 2006.
Look at the San Diego sector, which had a fence/wall put up around 2009 to 2010, I believe. Look at the drop there after the fence.
I heard that the tRump bought Melania at a Slovenian brothel because she gave him the best golden showers.
Hey pastor, did you hear? I heard that the tRump bought Melania at a Slovenian brothel because she gave him the best golden showers.
So they took a detour around the fence? Big deal! How does that correlate with the # crossing around the edges of the fence?
The wall is nothing but outrageously expensive security theater. You think the TSA is a waste of time, money and effort when they missed 95% of the weapons when tested? Well the wall is the TSA times 10. Completely pointless, a waste of tax dollars, a total waste of time, but it does make some dumb fucks who don't know how shit works who've been made insanely fearful by right wing pundits profiting off their fear, "feel" safe. It's not making them safer, but they "feel" safer. Why don't we just educate them instead? [deleted]
removed for context
removed for context
...being wildly off topic? "Argggghhhh, my Trumpy bear is under attack, I have to defend and deflect! I know, I'll bring up some pointless bullshit about Obama! Yeah, that'll do the trick!"...
Off topic
You’re one to talk about that. The issue is getting the wall built so that we control who comes here and when rather than having to react to acts by people who should never have been here in the first place.
Yet, you want to ignore the very real analogies that I keep using about the concept "defense-in-depth". Frankly, it is not about any one particular solution, but layers of them to divert and delay them so that they can be detained easier and then processed. That will end up reducing the costs of ICE having to round them up after they are already here. You don't want to spend the money, so why don't you do like you want everyone else and unlock your door, put up a sign that says "Illegal Immigrants Welcome Here" and open up your home to them? Because, that is what you and everyone else against the wall is arguing in favor of. I, at least, point out why the wall is a necessary layer to actual defense of this country and our Constitution.
Wow that's pushing reality a lot
And my comments are either about the topic or in response to a comment. Too bad your's arent'
And keep right on losing 800k jobs a month? You're kidding, right?
Nope, when there is an economic downturn, government intervention actually creates a longer lasting downturn than if the natural forces of the market were allowed to correct naturally. The microcosm of this is what happened with the banks and the TARP funds. Did they use that money to increase the number of loans? No, they used that money to buy other banks and pay bonuses to their employees. If the government hadn't interfered, a lot of banks would have gone bankrupt; but it wouldn't have been as bad as banks abusing a program to prop them up so they could expand their holdings.
Total baloney. What I am arguing for is spending our money on effective border security. Physical barriers are neither cost effective nor effective at preventing any substantial number of illegal border crossings. So what I'm arguing for is to spend our money wisely, not just giving in to the knee jerk reaction from dumb fucks arguing for the security theatre of a wall because they're scared xenophobes who have been lied to about it's efficacy by right wing pundits.
That is BS, otherwise Hungary, Israel, and a whole host of other nations would never have built fences or walls around their borders. Do you know one of the most effective walls was the Berlin Wall? While it wasn't meant to keep people out, it was very effective at keeping people in East Berlin.
Your 'real analogies' are ridiculous.
The entire article is just so much bs propaganda put out the GOP and their stooge Trump
I’m glad that you like the article. It’s from an African American perspective.
And that was important why?
Nevermind, I already know..
So Rump wants to use 56 billion to have a symbol?
Businesses use the concept defense-in-depth for their own security, and I am not just talking about network security here. They have fences, security guards, mantraps, id badges, smart cards, biometric readers, etc. to use to defend their corporate secrets and protect their personnel. So, what any opponent to the border wall is saying is that businesses need to tear down all of their fences, even if some of those fences are there to protect people from injury. Construction sites should no longer be fenced in. Weyerhaeuser should tear down the fences surrounding their Santiam Mill (aka Lebanon Lumber Mill). All, because fences and walls are racist and are useless, which are the arguments against Trump's wall.
No Tom they use those defense, which btw, is an off topic to the topic. Most of those corporate defenses are not designed to keep out harden criminals but the good guys and the idiots that don't know what they are doing.
Don,
I am point out the analogous real-world equivalents. Physical barriers are the front line of defense against intruders, which is what illegal immigrants are. They are not authorized to be in the country and did not follow the law to get here. A border wall is the first step to stopping such intrusions, just as a fence is the first step to stop someone from accessing the property of say Hewlett-Packard's facilities in Corvallis, Or off of Circle Boulevard and US 20. Do you think they are trying to keep the good guys out of there? Or, how about Selmet, Inc. which makes Aircraft parts for the military, should they tear down their fences which are there to help guide intruders to where their guards are? I was in Selmet's factory a few months ago for a job interview. Didn't get the job, though. But, the point is that some of these companies have corporate secrets/proprietary information that they cannot afford a competitor or another country to get hold of. Physical access to data is the most dangerous access any company can have used against them. It's how Bradley (Chelsea) Manning was able to leak stuff to Wikileaks about Iraq and Afghanistan:
While a fence would not have stopped Bradley Manning's actions, due to him being a "malicious insider"; it does prevent outsiders gaining access to a location. And, I know Selmet has a security guard at the access point (parking lot) to their fenced-in facilities.
Our national border security is multi faceted and a border barrier in key areas is a much needed impediment to those trying to come in here illegally.
trumps wall symbolizes stupidity and xenophobia. a 4th century BC solution to a 21st century problem. steep fines and jail time for anyone that has ever hired an undocumented worker since the reagan amnesty will fix the problem, put cash in the treasury, and white collar criminals in jail. harshly punish the employers that game the system by paying immigrants substandard wages cheating Americans out of jobs, making taxpayers subsidize the wage shortfall with entitlements, and the undocumented workers will have 1 less reason to come here illegally.
And yet the walls in Israel and Hungary work quite well in keeping out those they don’t want in.
And yet the walls in Israel and Hungary work quite well in keeping out those they don’t want in.
There are some inaccurate comparisons here as to Israel's fence:
1. The comparison with the U.S. border is inaccurate.
For decades Arabs would merely walk from an Arab village to an Israeli one and murder Israelis. There was nothing to stop them. There were numerous massacres by terrorists. However IIRC, few if any (perhaps none?) of the acts of terrorism in the U.S. were committed by individuals who entered the country by crossing the Mexican border.
How many terror attacks in the U.S. can you remember-- and of those, in how many were the perps people who entered the U.S. by crossing the mexican border?
And that's the difference-- Israel's border fence was build to keep out terrorists-- but terrorism in the U.S. by people entering from Mexico has been non-existent (or almost non-existent).
Yep by machine gun
And yet the walls in Israel and Hungary work quite well in keeping out those they don’t want in.
There are some inaccurate comparisons here as to Israel's fence:
The comparison with the U.S. border is inaccurate.
And here's the second inaccuracy with your statement-- Israel has build border fences- - they are not walls*:
(*Israel's separation barrier on the West Bank is partly a wall-- but that's only 5%. And it had to be built that way for a very specific reason.)
And we need to keep it that way. Then there are the drugs, the MS-13 gang bangers, the common criminal, the human traffickers, in addition to Muslim terrorists mixing in that we need to keep out of our country.
Symbolizes
That's all it is. A symbol.
And you KNOW trump would have a picture of himself every 10 feet for the length of the bloody thing.
Almost 23 trillion in debt and trump wants to spend 25 billion on something we don't even need. What an idiot.
We can easily take 25 billion from the unconstitutional Department of Education
take the 39 billion balance of dept of education funds and use it for ICE to ramp up deportations
then lets repeals Medicaid and it’s monstrous budget 581 billion and rapidly growing and use that money to pay down the debt
[Removed]
That way we can look at the youth of America and say "Well, they might be dumber than a ton of bricks, but at least they're all white and can sort of speak English. Sure, they can't spell, believe science is a forbidden art like alchemy and believe "Al Gebra" must be an Islamic terrorist, but at least they're not Mexican..."...
You do realize that we educated our kids before the 1970's, right?
Matter of fact, looking at our test scores in relation to the rest of the world, we were performing better on tests than AFTER we formed the D of E.
Like most on the left you resort to Strawman arguments. I said nothing about no education. Education falls under state, local governments and families. There is no authority for federal involvement in education in our Constitution
Sadly education back then had a hard time reaching all kids in America equally. Sure, in some instances it worked out great, usually for the middle to upper income whites living in the new white neighborhoods they fled to after the 1960's endemic of "white flight". As old white neighborhoods were opened up to minorities looking for a better life, it prompted the white families living there already, distraught at the thought of living in an integrated neighborhood, to sell and move to new more expensive neighborhoods that virtually no blacks could afford. A phenomenon known as financial segregation which is still alive and well today.
The fact is the department of education has done some great things for students and opened up opportunities for millions of children, but it did attempt to level the playing field which of course doesn't feel good for those who had already been experiencing a privileged status. "When You’re Accustomed to Privilege, Equality Feels Like Oppression".
Still kind of amazing how our scores lowered AFTER we formed a huge government bureaucracy to "fix" everything, huh?
We managed to educate kids just fine. We could have made a few tweaks without forming a waste of money like the Dept. of Education.
Of course as anyone with even a rudimentary knowledge of statistics can tell you-- correlation does not necessarily imply causation.
(No, I'm not goinng to explain that to you-- if you don't understand that,-- and how it applies here-- google it!
Oh, sorry, I do understand.
I didn't ask you to explain it to me.
But the simple fact is what I wrote is true.
Do you honestly believe students today are getting a better education than pre-D. of E.?
And of course that will be so easy!
Guess where he has to go to move that money?
Can't just flip that switch.....Wonder what sort of mood Pelosi is in?
So?
Almost 23 trillion in debt and trump wants to spend 25 billion on something we don't even need. What an idiot.
And I wouldn't be at all surprised if the next thing you know Trump might start cutting federal salaries-- yup, government workers! What the heck, many aren't working anyway-- thanks to Trump's gov't shut down.
Heck, he even admitted it-- in fact he's proud of it:
Saw a meme on twitter...
"Never take a Mike Pence to a gun fight..."
And I’m proud that he is standing up to Schumer and Pelosi on our behalf. The Schumer shutdown continues....
Nope, Trump's shut down and he's proud of it.
"Never take a Mike Pence to a gun fight..."
LOL!
Actually the video I posted is only part of the entire meeting. If anyone is interested, you can watch the longer version on YouTube.
The first thing that's obvious is how Pelosi really embarressed Trump. But the second thing that I found blatantly obvious-- dueing the entuire thing Pence didn't say a word-- gave me a few good laughs!
And I’m proud that he is standing up to Schumer and Pelosi on our behalf. The Schumer shutdown continues....
Based on your comment, its obvious you saw only the brief segment aired on Fox. (While watching on Fox it I wasn't surprised at how tFox slanted it-- both by editing out important parts as well as their absurd commentary).
Basically it was a big win for Pelosi & Schumer..
Why?
Because not only did they get Trump to say that he is willing to take responsibility for the shut-down, but that he acually wants to do that!
(And perhaps the high point: when he says that in addition taking total responsibility for the shut-down, he's not going to blame the Democrats!!!
Nope, Trump's shut down and he's proud of it.
Well, unlike some people here who are shooting off their mouths inaccurately (because they only watch the short highly edited version shown on Fox).. its obvious that you saw the video with the more relevant parts.
At first I was surprised that he admitted he was responsible-- and even went to great lengths to say he wasn't going to blame the Democrats! Certainly that seemed to be politically self-defeating with the majority of voters.
But I am starting to realize that Trump actually doesn't care-- all he really cares about is pleasing his base (which of course is a minority of the population-- they seem to be about 35% of the voters-- occasionally coming close to 40%).
It would be interesting to speculate as to why he only tries to curry favour with only his base-- and doesn't try to win over the majority of voters. (I have a theory but I could be wrong, so I'm curious as to what others here think about why de does this...).
Here you go: Trump proud to shut down the government. #trumpshutdownandproudofit
I’m proud of the shut down let it continue
I watched it live. Trump was simply outmatched. Pelosi even tried to save trump the embarrassment by taking it private but trump is too stupid to realize that he was getting owned..big time.
They owned the fat POS
Pelosi is an enemy of the US and I watched the whole thing. Trump owned both those anti American Demoncrats
Yea, it wasn't Pelosi that is putins puppet.
Explain this to me Larry, why is it that trump has insulted almost literally every world leader with one exception... Putin. Never EVER a bad word about Putin. Can you explain that? Trump is a russian puppet, but you want to call Pelosi anti-American? Fucking laughable.
I don't know what you were watching but Schumer and Pelosi owned the pos traitor in chief
You should pay for it then, since most Americans don't want one cent for the unnecessary wall. The shutdown takes from the economy and causes lost revenue and productivity. And harms contractors and some employees. Glad you are at least owning it, while Trump is once again lying and whining, blaming others like a baby. And America suffers.
Funny.
I remember the majority of Americans were against the PPACA, but I don't recall any of the people for it offering to pay for anyone's health insurance.
Funny.
I remember the majority of Americans were against using Russia to win an election.
Very good.
I would say the majority of Americans are still against it, too.
What's next?
Oh, here--I'll bet the majority of Americans are against murder.
Me too! Let it continue as long as it takes to get some funding specifically for a border wall, even if it means the entire rest of the fiscal year.
Yes he did and support for the wall is growing.
No, support of the wall is NOT growing, most of the population does NOT want to fund it, it's a waste of billions of dollars and won't deter shit, they can still go over it, under it or around it.
yea, but besides those paltry reasons,
do tell,
do Tell us Y Trump n cump,
should really not build the wall, please...
Even funnier.
I remember when Trump and his sycophants clearly said, over and over and over and over, MEXICO WILL PAY FOR THE WALL. I don't recall any republican saying it would fall to US taxpayers.
And catch up, more Americans support Obamacare now they know the gop lied about it all.
Of course you are. Obviously you have no problem with people not getting pad.
I thought pastors were supposed to be compassionate and empathetic to others?
Why all the concern about funding ??? MEXICO IS GOING TO PAY FOR THE WALL. trump promised, over and over and over.
Why all the concern about funding ??? MEXICO IS GOING TO PAY FOR THE WALL. trump promised, over and over and over.
Correct!
Yet just another one of many cases of Trump's PROMISE MADE-- PROMISES KEPT!
In fact not only is Mexico going to pay for the The Wall--- but they're glass to do (they even said so).
i think former prezident FOX, said it Best
.
"Mexico ain't gonna pay for no FUCKEN WALL"!
The Best way to stop illegals is to send a strong message of deterrence
either post military or citizen militias at the border. Spray warning shots near these invaders. Word will spread and it will stop
We need to follow John F Kennedy’s call to arms
JFK Nation of Minutemen
January 29, 1961
“In my own native state of Massachusetts, the battle for American freedom was begun by the thousands of farmers and tradesmen who made up the Minute Men -- citizens who were ready to defend their liberty at a moment's notice. Today we need a nation of minute men; citizens who are not only prepared to take up arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as a basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom. The cause of liberty, the cause of America, cannot succeed with any lesser effort.”
Don't any of that applies to current trump repubs
The Best way to stop illegals is to send a strong message of deterrence
either post military or citizen militias at the border. Spray warning shots near these invaders. Word will spread and it will stop
Nope. Won't work.
In fact that was the original idea behind forceably separating kids from their parent and putting them in cages (that severely mistreating these peopel would stop the flow).
Government video released today shows the inside of a child detention center in Texas where hundreds of immigrant children have been locked inside cages like animals.
The hope was that "word would spread" and the flow of would-be immigrants would stop.
How's that been working out so far?
How is separation comparable to armed presence at the border and firing warning shots at these invaders.
do you really think they will continue if we start shooting?
Yes.
Look at it from their point of view-- we've already taken children away from mothers-- some can not be located to ever be returned to their mothers. Yet that doesn't stop them from entering the country. (Some mothers are like that-- their primarily goal is to protect their children-- even if it means putting their lives at risk).
Look at it from their point of view-- we've already taken children away from mothers-- some can not be located to ever be returned to their mothers. Yet that doesn't stop them from entering the country. (Some mothers are like that-- their primarily goal is to protect their children-- even if it means putting their lives at risk).
Why?
Because as they see it, the odds of entering the U.S. (whether legally or not) and surviving are better than the odds of surviving in their own countries. (If you are unaware of how bad it is there, google it).
This reminds me of Jewish refugees trying to escape Nazi Germany-- in many cases they also faced the prospect of getting murdered. Yet they still tried.
Because they felt that while both staying and attempting to escape were risking their lives, in many cases their chances for survival were greater if they attempted to escape.
You may not know much about that situation (if you want to know more there are several good books on the subject-- or you can google it. That is-- if you really want to know the facts...).
But that reminded me of another situation. Life if Communist East germany was a living hell for many Germans. Many in East Berlin tried to escape by getting over or otherwise getting through the Berlin Wall. Most of these were shot to death by the East german border guards.
But did that stop attempts? Nope.
Neither alternative was great (remaining under brutal Communist rule in East Germany or trying to escape and probably getting shot) many took their chances.
Why?
Again, life was so terrible they werwe willing to risk trying to cross the Wall and possibly getting shot. So that didn't stop them!!!
For us armchair quarterbacks here in present day U.S., it might be difficult to understand the dilemma facing these people from Central America-- or the dilemma facing Jews (and some other) in Nazi germany-- or more recently Germans living under Communist barbarism in East Berlin.
Comparing those murdered in the holocaust to people invading a nation for better jobs and free benefits paid for by others is an insult to both those who were murdered and survivors of the holocaust
[Deleted]
Are you serious? Do you actually believe none of those people are trying to escape widespread child rape, murder, extremely brutal attacks by drug gangs, etc, etc?Do you think mothers would risk having their kids forceably taken away from them just to get a better job?
[Deleted] (I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume its because you only get your news from an extremely biased source-- i.e. Fox News).
None of those are justifiable for legal refugee status. If we use that as the criteria we will be admitting 10s of millions from around the world every year.
and I mostly watch the commie MSNBC. It’s important to know what the enemy is thinking.
for news (not political commentary) I go to independent News reporting from both ends of the political spectrum
Nope. There isn't even a mass migration. Remember that huge caravan trump was screaming about and deployed the military to the border over? It was about 150 people. And those 150 or so people just walked almost 3,000 miles....do you REALLY think they would WALK that far to "invade" the USA? My god, you really need to get away from the fake news right wing media.
And you claim to be a pastor following the word of Jesus. If Jesus were to return today, do you see him taking up arms and firing warning shots at people just trying to make a better life for themselves? Unbelievable.
According to the bible, God commanded the Israelites to illegally immigrate to Egypt after they got hit by a famine
And Israel was then just one large family at that time and one of them was the 2nd to the Pharoh ruling it. It also says this:
In making his case for Trump, the Baptist minister referenced the Old Testament book of Nehemiah. According to the Scriptures, God instructed the Jewish leader to build a wall around Jerusalem to keep its citizens safe.
And his reference to “a wall” in heaven is likely from the New Testament book of Revelation. In the book’s 21st chapter, John described heaven, writing, “It had a great, high wall with twelve gates, and with twelve angels at the gates.”
https://www.faithwire.com/2019/01/10/evangelical-pastor-robert-jeffress-defends-trump-heaven-itself-is-gonna-have-a-wall/
Yes. He did.
Actually, the Pharaoh gave Joseph power second only to his own. Joseph, after tricking his brothers, invited his family into Egypt. So, there was nothing illegal about it. They had the approval of the Egyptian government and therefore were LEGAL immigrants. Reread the Bible, please.
How was it illegal when they were asked to go there by the 2nd to the king in all of Egypt and Pharoh gave Joseph permission to invite his extended family there?
Just another day at the wall.
Car Jack used to Breach Border Fence
Just another day at the wall.
Thanks for posting that video-- it makes an excellent point: A Wall will not stop determined immigrants!
That is part of the wall that DHS wants to replace. Hmmm - wonder why?
That was the first tool I thought of when I saw this:
I wonder if oval wheels on Border Patrol vehicles is another genius Trump idea.
As you can see from my avatar, Trump's idea of a border wall looks like an upside down afro pick !
There must be 1,000 ways to breach that idiotic design. Trump clearly did not excel at STEM.
Trump has a weird idea of what "beautiful" is.. Maybe he should put that shit around his golf course.
I seriously doubt that the President of the United states designed a wall or fence.
It is amusing to see people who do, though.
What does it say that the moron in chief tweeted such a stupid rendering? Once again, you have unfailing defended the world’s biggest moron with knee jerk precision.
probably not as much as it does about people who don't realize that there is a difference between tweeting a picture and designing a wall or fence.
Oh, well, at least I can sleep at night knowing that I can tell the difference.
You know this how 1st? Where in Arizona was that video taken?
BTW, if it's all about drug trafficking, what would stop them from just passing packages THROUGH the pickets Trump is installing?
Yuma - by buddies of the jackers who were apprehended by one of my BP neighbors.
The spacing between the slats would "reduce" the flow. NOTHING will stop the Cartels from trying to find ways to transport.
So what gives you the idea that the Yuma FENCE is scheduled to be replaced by Trump's WALL? Link?
BTW, it doesn't look like that video was made in an urban area like Yuma.
Migrants run as tear gas is thrown by U.S. Border Protection officers to the Mexican side of the border fence after they climbed the fence to get to San Diego from on Tuesday. Discouraged by the long wait to apply for asylum through official ports of entry, many migrants from recent caravans are choosing to cross the U.S. border wall and hand themselves over to agents. (AP Photo/Daniel Ochoa de Olza)
The new year brought continued tensions along the U.S.-Mexico border as U.S. authorities fired tear gas at migrants from the Central American caravan that has gathered there.
Authorities fired the gas into Mexico to keep roughly 150 migrants from breaching the border fence in Tijuana.
An Associated Press photographer witnessed at least three volleys of gas launched onto the Mexican side of the border near Tijuana’s beach early Tuesday. It affected the migrants, including women and children, as well as members of the press.
Migrants who spoke with AP said they arrived last month with the caravan from Honduras.
U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) said in a statement that the gas was aimed at rock throwers on the Mexican side who prevented agents from helping children being passed over the concertina wire. The agency says 25 migrants were detained.
Katie Waldman, a Homeland Security spokeswoman, said: “Once again we have had a violent mob of migrants attempt to enter the United States illegally by attacking our agents with projectiles. As has happened before - in this and previous administrations -- our personnel used the minimum force necessary to defend themselves, defend our border, and restore order. The agents involved should be applauded for handling the situation with no reported injuries to the attackers."
According to her, "initial reporting indicates that once the attempted illegal entry was thwarted by agents, the mob began pushing women and minors to the front, forcing minors to climb dangerous concertina wire, and encouraged conveniently invited media to begin filming their illegal acts."
Such clashes have been common as the migrants, who have put their names on a waiting list that is thousands of names long, have grown restless, with some opting to force their way across the border. https://www.foxnews.com/world/authorities-use-tear-gas-to-stop-migrants-at-southern-border
Gee 1st, that sure looks like a fence to me...
BTW, I've always wanted one of those kind of jacks for my jeep but they are dangerous as hell. I'd probably poke my eye out.
Yeah I believe that .
One can argue whether or not tens of thousands of people trying to enter the US across the southern border represents " a lot" or "a small" amount of people, and it is relative, but what we do know is that border crossings have been down in the last 5 or 6 years from what they were previously. If it wasn't a hair on fire emergency in the Bush years when there were many more illegal immigrants entering, why the hell is it one now?
Because Trump wants it to be. It's just about that simple.
Ignorance and stupidity have gained a foothold , along with "fear of a brown planet" nationalism stoked by the "president*".
Say John - c'mon down here and visit us in the SW for 'bout a month - yeah, that's the ticket.
Illegals aren't my problem. I am way to the North, so it doesn't affect me and I don't want my tax dollars going to solve your problems. You want a wall, you pay for it..
(For similarities see: health care)
Have a super day!
So in essence, what you saying is, screw the U.S. citizens and legal residents on this side of the border that are victims of illegal immigration? I do not live down there so it is not my problem? Do not spend my tax dollars to keep illegals out? If so, that is pretty sad.
You sum the opposing side up really well. And yes, it is sad.
the federal govt has very few duties listed in the constitution. the security of our nation is one of them
once the feds forfeit those duties = we don't need them / and will remove them.
a federal govt that does not secure our border is like being married to a person who lets the house get robbed daily.
that relationship is not gonna last long
cheers
The time has come.......to build the wall!