Trump says he could invoke emergency powers to build wall without Congress
“I can do it if I want. … We can call a national emergency because of the security of our country, absolutely,”
WASHINGTON — President Trump floated the possibility he could declare a “national emergency” in order to build a wall on the southern border during a freewheeling press conference at the White House on Friday.
“I can do it if I want. … We can call a national emergency because of the security of our country, absolutely,” Trump said, adding, “We can do it. I haven’t done it. I may do it. I may do it. But we could call a national emergency and build it very quickly.”
As he threatened to do that, Trump said:
“I’d never threaten anybody, but I am allowed to do that, yes,” Trump said.
WASHINGTON — President Trump floated the possibility he could declare a “national emergency” in order to build a wall on the southern border during a freewheeling press conference at the White House on Friday.
“I can do it if I want. … We can call a national emergency because of the security of our country, absolutely,” Trump said, adding, “We can do it. I haven’t done it. I may do it. I may do it. But we could call a national emergency and build it very quickly.”
So if he can do that-- why doesn't he just do it-- and immediately end the government shutdown?!!??
I think he will
Why is Pelosi and Schumer not honoring their vote from 2013 to enhance border security with a budget of over $40 BILLION?
Jeremy, look up the Border Security, Economic Opportunity, and Immigration Modernization Act of 2013
A: that was a 10 year budget of $40billion passed by the Senate 68 - 32
B: that the GOP House would not even consider it because
Kind of ironic isn't it?
Isn't that called major hicrospy
Because in the middle of it Trump broke his end of the deal about DACA by demanding more.
how often did the GOP cease to support, at times, their own damn ideas,
just because Obama supported it...
what a hypocritical joke the Repubs R
So now you justify Democrats' actions (not supporting the very wall they agreed to before) because Republicans did something?
Deflect much?
how about the Democratic Congress, the Republican Congress, the Democratic Senate, and The Republican Senate , all agreed on a bill the Trump , via Pence, said he would sign . ? > ?
Remember That ?
Deflect upon that Deflect a while
cause, Trump is the reason for this shutdown , as he claimed HE OWNED IT '
during his live (whatever the hell it was ) with Pelosi and Schumer. Want to explain that claim that we all witnessed ???
R U saying the Republicans did not disagree with Obama, on about everything, after the Republican Heads, had a meeting directly after he won ???
The affectations in your writings are still deflections--no matter how much you spin.
sometimes my "writings" have that effect
Yes, I have seen firsthand the deflections--intended or not.
sorry Tex, but ill take the show wherever I feel it should go
how bout them Eagles...
unbelievable last play win
Oh, yes indeed you have. Very much first hand. No question. Absolutely true.
Yes, that has been established.
I even gave an example.
Why should the American people accept a Declaration of a National Emergency based solely on Trump not getting what he wants? The fact is, the powers vesting in such a declaration are just this side of tyranny.
Perhaps if someone told Trump that Obama managed to deal with over 100,000 MORE border apprehensions without declaring a national emergency, Trump will realize just how weak this makes him look.
I say he should do it. He'll learn a little bit about how our government works. The money still has to come from Congress. Even in a war the money has to come from Congress.
You're starting to understand the concept of "trash talk".
Fortunately there are checks and balances with this "power".
The National Emergencies Act ( Pub.L. 94–412 , 90 Stat. 1255 , enacted September 14, 1976, codified at 50 U.S.C. § 1601 -1651) is a United States federal law passed to stop open-ended states of national emergency and formalize the power of Congress to provide certain checks and balances on the emergency powers of the President . The Act of Congress imposes certain procedural formalities on the President when invoking such powers. The perceived need for the law arose from the scope and number of laws granting special powers to the executive in times of national emergency.
Fortunately there are checks and balances with this "power".
So does that mean the Trump was not telling the truth?
Certainly he wouldn't lie to the people of this country-- would he?
He lies every time he opens his mouth
Sounds like a negotiating ploy. Good for him.
A ploy that is fraught with weakness. Not a good starting place for a POTUS.
Sounds like a child throwing a temper tantrum when not getting his way
Yeah, like a 4-year-old holding his breath until he gets another cookie.
Is that because only 4 year olds care about border security? While mature liberals don't care about illegal aliens, human trafficking or drug smuggling?
Human trafficking and drug smuggling will continue to occur even with a wall. Shit, before you know it the cartels will just be flying drugs in via drones (if they aren't already).
And as usual, it is a shitty tactic. Trump seriously has to be the worst negotiator I have ever seen. I don't see how his threat to declare a state of emergency will result in the Democrats giving him money for a wall.
Hasn't anyone pointed out to Trump that the Coast Guard is part of DHS which is unfunded?
That CBP and TSA are part of DHS
So the very people charged with stopping the smuggling and other trafficking are the ones being punished by Trump's "strike"?
Not quite true.
Wikipedia? Really?
While the snippet from Wiki is not false, it doesn't tell the whole story.
After 911, the Coast Guard and many other agencies were reorganized under The Department of Homeland Security.
While the Coasties are still considered a military arm ,
their pay, benefits and retirement no longer comes from the Department of Defense. ( which was fully funded )
As members of DHS they are not receiving pay due to the current partial shutdown which left practically all of the departments
responsible for border security and the President's safety at financial risk.
The POTUS really needs to rethink his position.
If the Coast Guard were getting paid, Senator Blumenthal would be crazy to introduce legislation so that they could be financed outside of the shutdown, wouldn't he?
Yes, really. If you'd researched the footnoted citations, you'd have learned that they are from US Code and USCG/DHS sources.
My purpose in comment 5.4.2 was not to "tell the whole story"; it was to merely point out the inaccuracy/omissions of your comment 5.4.1 .
Time to move on. Have a good weekend.
There was no inaccuracy or omission in my statement Jasper.
Here's another source, "Jasper" , please note the address, dcms.uscg.mil - it's still an unfunded agency within DHS whether or not it's a part of the military
Please note the message from the Deputy Commander USCG;
Based on a lapse in federal funding, all employees should click here for more information.
This website will not be actively managed.
Perhaps Mr. Trump can correct Mr. Bush's mistake and return the Coast Guard to the Department of Defense where they rightfully belong.
As I said in comment 5.4.4 , "Split Personality"...
Ahh, still suffering from having to have the last word? After all these years?
I hear it's incurable. So sad.
You have a good weekend too.
The one branch of the military facing immediate financial impacts of a partial government shutdown seems to have caught a break.
At least for now.
U.S. Coast Guard spokespeople said members would receive a paycheck Monday, Dec. 31. That's despite the shutdown, which directly affects the Coast Guard since it falls under the Department of Homeland Security, not the Department of Defense like other military branches. Funding for those branches was finalized last fall.
A reprieve til January 15
So essentially the $$ was already allocated for December.
Good for the Coasties, they deserve better. They can survive for a few more weeks at least.
Sounds like a negotiating ploy. Good for him.
Trump has surrounded himself with corrupt people. Some indicted, some plead guilty... but that's another topic.
But you comment made me think two men he chose to work for him: his former lawyer and former campaign advisor:
U.S. prosecutors have laid out in court details of what they say are lies by former top associates of President Donald Trump regarding their interactions with Russian contacts, charges that will likely lead to long prison terms for the two men.
The accusations against former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort and former personal lawyer Michael Cohen were made in separate filings late on December 7 in federal court.
So here's what I was wondering-- in court can they claim they shouldn't be punished because their lies were not "real" lies-- but merely "negotiating ploys"?
(Actually I guess his lawyer realize that pleading "negotiating ploy" wouldn't work-- he's plead guilty and has spilled the legumes!
Can you imagine the number of people who would stroke out if the President declared a national emergency? Democrats and the left would lose their collective minds.
The lack of a wall isn't a national emergency.
You should learn about checks and balances because declaring a national emergency doesn't exempt him from the Constitution.
You are referring to the same checks and balances that were absent as the last administration
- sent billions to Iran
-armed ISIS and Mexican drug lords
- negotiated with the Taliban
- spied on american citizens
Why the sudden interest in checks and balances? Oh. They want it because now things aren't going their way.
Don't know why the wall funding is such an issue. Democrats voted to fund better security in 2013 at a cost of something like $46 billion. It's a matter of where that money went. Oh, I mentioned it in my first point.
and I responded
Border Security, Economic Opportunity, and Immigration Modernization Act of 2013
A: that was a 10 year budget of $40billion ( ie' $4 billion per year ) passed by a very bi partisan Senate 68 - 32
B: that the GOP House would not even consider it because
Kind of ironic isn't it?
House inactivity led to the Obama EO on DACA....
Now I'm assuming if the current House voted for the exact same bill
Senator McConnell would refuse to bring it to the floor.
Sound familiar?
That money was theirs and had been frozen in US banks since the late 1970s. It was released as part of the nuclear agreement. Thius has been explained to you multiple times and yet you still make this farcical claim that Obama gave Iran money.
Obama didn't willfully arm ISIL.
When did Obama negotiate with the Taliban?
Why are you now interested in the USA PATRIOT ACT and not in 2002 when it was enacted?
Well, it didn't work for Obama in 2013
What makes it OK for Trump in 2018?
or are you saying it's wrong for one President but not another?
And perhaps even more to the point, he should learn the definition of an "emergency".
There have been YUGE gaps in or border security for many years-- and many people have crossed illegally. For decades.... . . .
Here's the definition of emergency:
a serious, unexpected, and often dangerous situation requiring immediate action.
If its not "unexpected" its not an emergency.
Illegal border crossings didn't just start when Trump took office-- they been going on for a long , long time. So they are hardly unexpected-- they did not become "unexpected " when Trump took office--so they're not an "emergency".
Talking about your comment, [ deleted ]
the unexpected lack of action about that known problem is what created the emergency.
we are done waiting... border security is national security.
As proof for your statement, and a touch stone for how an actual 'emergency' on the border was handled by the prior resident of the WH.
Instead of sending troops to the border and stringing razor wire, Obama created a 'Unified Coordination Group', lead by the Sec. of DHS and sent FEMA resources to provide 'humanitarian relief to the affected children, including housing, care, medical treatment, and transportation.'
Trump is addressing what Nielsen admits is a 'humanitarian crisis' by dumping hundreds of asylum seekers in the streets of cities across the border, without notifying local authorities and then decrying the fact that churches and communities can't seem to keep up with the influx of 'vulnerable families'.
So according to your link, it was, again, negotiating with the enemy / terrorists.
[deleted]
[Deleted]
And you actually believe the negotiations are with the Taliban? Wow. That's by far one of the most ignorant and ridiculous things I've heard in a very long time.
Well then you aren't participating online enough anymore, eh?
So all of theses varied media stories quoting the POTUS are wrong?
Or did Trump lie to the media about negotiations in Afghanistan.
Come on Jeremy, it has to be one or the other.
Taliban Appear Ready to Discuss Peace Talks, Except With Afghan Officials
Trump's envoy to Afghanistan rushes to launch Taliban peace talks ahead of possible troop pullout: report
White House Orders Direct Taliban Talks to Jump-Start Afghan Negotiations
Pakistan Says Trump Asks Khan To Help Bring Taliban To Peace Talks
Trump says U.S. in 'very strong' negotiations in Afghanistan
and on and on
Taliban seeks image makeover as Afghan peace talks gain momentum
Trump Asks for Pakistan’s Help in Afghan Peace Talks With Taliban
Of course, since the announced 'possible' withdrawal The Taliban walked out of the negotiations 5 days ago; negotiations in Qatar that only included the Taliban and the US, not Afghanistan........
Afghanistan peace talks in doubt after Taliban's abrupt walkout
I tried to include stories from across the partisan/political spectrum for your reading pleasure.
Wow, you actually do expect me to believe the negotiations are with the Taliban?
That link says no such thing. Why lie?
01/28/2019
Taliban and U.S. Agree to Draft of Peace Framework
Hahaha!
OOOOPS!
And it would take them weeks if ever to figure out what was missing.
LOL.... about the same number as those who stroked out the first time trump declared a national emergency.
I, therefore, determine that serious human rights abuse and corruption around the world constitute an unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security, foreign policy, and economy of the United States, and I hereby declare a national emergency to deal with that threat.
To Trump, a national emergency would be him missing his tee off time.
before trump is done, you will be begging for him to play more golf.
Even if he played 24/7, he would still find a way to screw this country up.
And yet somehow, with all that time playing golf he's been far more successful in 2 years than his predecessor was in 8.
To quote you...
Yup, and it is an emergency for the following reasons:
stopping the flow of:
1) drugs
2) human trafficking
3) possible terrorists and/or criminals
4) caravans & illegal migrants
All of which is incredibly difficult given the protections granted as soon as a migrant sets foot on the US side of the border. In addition congress has been incapable of solving the problem due to the democrats refusal to do anything about it. This past week the Director of Homeland Security was repeatedly interrupted and abused by democratic leaders:
"At one point during the meeting, according to the Wall Street Journal , Pelosi interrupted Nielsen, who was citing statistics related to the border, including how many criminal illegal immigrants attempted to enter the U.S. last year.
“I reject your facts,” Pelosi told Nielsen
“These aren’t my facts," Nielsen shot back. "These are the facts.”
Following the episode, Nielsen went to social media to criticize Pelosi and the Democrats for not wanting to hear about the issue of illegal immigration.
“I am disappointed that Dems did not want to hear from @DHSgov about the security & humanitarian crisis we are facing at the border,” Nielsen wrote. “They didn’t want to hear about criminal aliens, drug smugglers, smuggled & abused children or violent caravans trying to breach the border wall.”
She's just parroting trump's alternative facts
Homeland Security is using alternative facts? How so?
You won't get a cogent response. Liberals are so deranged now that they shout at clouds and say up is down.
Thanks, vic, for that concise list of most of Scumbag's lies about the Southern border. You should have seen and heard his unintentional comedy bit on the "left turns" and "right turns" that the coyotes make to smuggle people in. The stupidlying Scumbag never disappoints on the slapstick circuit.
Well first of all, CBPs 2018 data contradicts Nielsen's numbers. So there's that...
Your'e right. They are petrified that Trump might just declare the crisis a national emergency and proceed to wall construction. They'll be screaming at the sky again!
A wall won't stop any of that. And terrorists don't entire the country by wandering through the desert, what a stupid way of going about it. Why not just use the internet and recruit homegrown terrorists? Oh wait...
1,2,3,4 can't be stopped with a wall
He can declare a national emergency but if successful with that, he still won't get the money. Oh ye of little knowledge of how congress works
I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings, but it is you who donsen't know how that works:
"The funding process is an annual event. Congress is tasked with producing a budget resolution and 12 appropriations bills for each federal fiscal year, which begins on Oct. 1. Other funding legislation, such as emergency funding in response to a natural disaster, frequently occurs outside of the standard process."
Why not?
"This course of action is most commonly seen in what is known as emergency funding. Emergency funding is essentially what it sounds like: supplemental funding provided in response to an unanticipated emergency, particularly natural disasters. Over the last decade, it has also become common to fund ongoing overseas military operations—most notably those in Iraq and Afghanistan—outside of the traditional defense appropriations bill through emergency appropriations. One of the appeals of this approach to lawmakers is that funding designated as emergency funding is not subject to the limits imposed by budget resolutions or committee allocations."
ews-room/Pages/A-Brief-Guide-to-the-Federal-Budget-and-Appropriations-Process.aspx
I think someone's Google stopped working, or maybe it hasn't been figured out how to work it yet?
The drive-by "Wrong!!!" or "Make believe!!" and "Prove it!!" is getting stale from some here.
It's not worth engaging with some liberal NPCs.
Yet it's pretty clear that they ARE Nielsen's 'facts'.
This isn't the first time that the Trump DOJ/DHS fabricated 'facts'.
And gun laws won't keep bad guys from obtaining weapons, red light cameras don't stop all people that run red lights, alcohol laws don't keep teens from drinking and drug abusers are still able to get drugs. Nothing will be 100% effective ever. Do you propose we stop passing laws because they are not 100%efective?
You're entitled to your opinion.
I do however encourage you to follow the CBP and DEA links provided in the article that PROVE that Nielsen's data is BULLSHIT.
It's on you to figure out what to believe.
And "Think Progress" has it's own facts. I'm more concerned with the way the current class of liberal congressmen have abused the Director of DHS.
Really Vic? What did Think Progress get wrong in that article?
Again really Vic? Who abused Nielsen and how was she abused? Please be specific.
Kirstjen Nielsen Lied to Congress About Trump’s War on Migrant Children
Yeah....she lied.
Be careful what you wish for, once the precedent is set other presidents will be more than happy to do it too.
Trump always makes these grand claims. "Mexico will pay for the wall. I have the biggest brain. Montenegro is a dangerous-aggressive nation bent on starting WW3. I would have ran into that school and confronted the shooter." And so many more.
This wall thing is weird. Did not the Trump also promise the sea of MAGA Hats that their Trump Healthcare would be cheap and beautiful? What happened to that?
Ya, where is that trumpcare ???
Yeah. What happened to that TrumpCare? Has anyone ever asked him about it since he's been installed by the Putin crowd?
I believe it will be found when Scumbag has his next colonoscopy.
at least "you can keep your doctor"
Under Scumbag that needs to be amended to "you don't get no stinkin' doctor!"
I was always able to.
What was the Republican alternative, except to not get sick? Where is Trump's great ACA alternative that he promised was so much better?
What happened to the orange shit stain's promise of a 10% tax cut for the middle class he taunted us with before the election....same place trumpcare is...more fucking lies and sad that people are so blind to his lies
Same here, none of my doctors changed.
Will you be just as disappointed if the new Democratic Congress doesn't pass a tax cut?
You know they have talked of actually RAISING taxes, don't you?
I have a pre-existing condition, so the ACA saved my life.
Pre existing condition coverage existed prior to Obamacare.
No.
Maybe her state didn't have any provisions for people with pre-existing conditions.
There were no high-risk pools in Ohio.
Other people weren't so... privileged.
Probably the same thing that happened to his wall promise... Congress.
Remember when people complained about Obama not closing Gitmo?
Remember what the reason why he failed was?
"Congress wouldn't allow it"!!
LOL!
I am far from privileged, just have good health insurance.
My late husband had great health insurance and he didn't pay a lot for it, his company paid the bulk of it and thankfully he had great insurance since he battled pancreatic cancer and lost the battle. Otherwise I would have had to claim bankruptcy.
Did the insurance companies know this?
If they didn't, they were blind and stupidly-ran.
35 states had high-risk pools before Obamacare was passed.
It wasn't a big secret or anything.
Yes. It was the law.
So? Pre existing conditions were still covered if you maintained insurance.
That's so weird that the government would pass a 2nd duplicate law mandating insurance companies insure people with pre-existing conditions at reasonable rates.
Why would they pass 2 laws for the same requirement?
Because ACA superseded the old law? Facts are facts.
Wow - It certainly must have been a secret and one of the best kept secrets ever. It was sooooo secret that the government passed a law mandating it not knowing there was already a law requiring it.
So, what's all the fuss about the ACA if it already existing?
Before the ACA
In 2010, President Obama passed the Affordable Care Act. Before this, it was up to states and insurance companies to set regulations about pre existing conditions. Unfortunately, during this time, many insurance companies denied coverage to those with this type of condition. They also charged them higher premium rates and could offer coverage for everything except the pre existing condition. Companies were also allowed to use an annual or lifetime cap on coverage. This meant that people with chronic conditions that required expensive treatment could run out of insurance quickly. This often left them with large and unmanageable medical bills.
Many states in the country allowed insurance companies to do this and did not provide coverage for pre existing conditions. These states used exclusion periods and elimination riders so they could avoid paying for people with pre existing conditions’ health coverage. These regulations mainly applied to the individual health insurance market , not the group plans that many people join through their employer. In fact, many Americans did not even realize the individual market was different until they lost their jobs and their group coverage. A loss of group coverage meant paying the entire premium without an employer subsidy. This made it difficult to find affordable health insurance and many were priced out of affording healthcare because of a pre existing condition.
Pre Existing Conditions
Every HMO had their own list of pre existing conditions that could possibly trigger denial or higher premiums. Insurance companies also employed hundreds of underwriters whose only job was to make decisions about whether or not an applicant was suitable for coverage. If they felt an applicant would be a risk, they mailed out a rejection letter.
During the health care reform debate, Congress led an investigation into this practice. It uncovered that more than 400 medical conditions or diagnoses were used to justify a denial of coverage. Some of the conditions on the list included:
This investigation only surveyed four large insurers and covered a three year period from 2007 to 2009. These four companies alone denied health coverage to 651,000 individuals because of pre existing conditions. This translates to one in seven people who applied for health insurance. The investigation also found that the number of denials increased year after year.
I feel so silly as I'm sure most people will after they learn that there was no reason to pass the ACA since an identical law already existed.
Do you have a link to the previous law that you can share.
The bottom line: If you had at least 18 months of health coverage at your previous job and you enrolled in your new employer-sponsored health plan without a break of 63 days or more, your new health plan could not subject you to a pre-existing condition exclusion. This consumer protection was already in place before the ACA, and efforts to repeal and replace the ACA (in 2017 but also potential future efforts) would not impact this provision, as it's part of HIPAA rather than the ACA.
The law was called HIPAA.
You do know that you can't buy life insurance for someone after they die, right?
You do know that you can't buy life insurance for someone after they die, right?
Cerenkov - I know you're not that gullible. The law had loopholes that the insurance companies took advantage of, that's why a federal law was passed. We can certainly discuss whether we agree or disagree with the ACA but it's a farce to say that previous laws were working for everyone.
No shit sherlock, never said ANYTHING about LIFE insurance. I was talking about HEALTH insurance.
Do you think it's amusing that my husband died
Who said anything about any law mandating it? Federal law and state law are two different things. There are some federal laws virtually identical to some state laws.
The PPACA didn't solely affect pre-existing conditions. I would suggest that much opposition to it has as much to do with the government forcing American citizens to buy a product and that doesn't sit well with some of us.
Who knew that some Americans would like a government which doesn't decide how they spend their money.
we did guess you are wrong
Prove it tex
wrong
More make believe
I am not sure why research must be provided for you, but here it is. Let me know if there is anything else I "need" to look up for you.
https://www.forbes.com/.../2018/03/09/democrats-release-tax-hike-plan
https://legalinsurrection.com/2018/04/democrats-give-us-the-house...
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/economics/09/us-parties...
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/380053-midterm-promises-dems...
Always glad to help!
Just because CNN and MSNBC didn't tell you what to think about it doesn't mean it is fake.
Spend 5 minutes of your time researching instead of accusing others of making stuff up and you may even learn something.
Seems unlikely based on past comments.
Oh poor you.....
How come you aren't telling the rest of the story?
Like you have a child born with health issues?
Or that you work in a particularly dangerous and toxic industry?
Nahhhhh, that wouldn't make a difference now would it?
Did you think some of us forgot when you made that statement?
Why are you trying to bullshit people?
I am sick to death of this incompetent and morally bankrupt ignoramus, his ridiculous family and their own morally questionable shenanigans, and the ass-kissing yes-men with whom he has surrounded himself.
Donald Trump has an impressive pre-election track record for screwing the little people out of their paychecks, and he has no problem doing that same thing now to the 800,000 government employees who are struggling to make house payments.
While I believe that border security is important, what Trump is doing now, is ringing the dinner bell for those who want to do us harm. His temper-tantrum-induced shutdown has left our physical borders and our airports understaffed to a dangerous degree.
By the way, I doubt that Trump's motivation is based entirely on national safety. He owns stock in several companies that have, or will have, a significant role in border wall construction.
Geo
Geo is a real estate investment trust that owns and operates private prisons; it has more than 100 facilities in the U.S. and abroad. Trump's plans to up immigration enforcement will almost certainly benefit Geo, which already has a relationship with U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement. (ICE accounted for 17.7% of its revenues in 2015.) And PS: Geo donated $125,000 to a Trump super-pac during his campaign.
Cemex
Cemex is a materials company that specializes in cement and concrete.
Elbit Systems
Elbit Systems is an Israel-based company that builds defense electronic systems and integrated battle systems for air, sea, land and space. They have already been enlisted to build a virtual wall at the Arizona border, in 2014 winning a $145 million contract from the Department of Homeland Security.
United States Steel
Just the name of the company speaks for itself.
Steel Dynamics
Steel Dynamics is a steel producing and metal recycling company.
Tetra Tech
Tetra Tech is a provider of environmental engineering and consulting services headquartered in Pasadena, Calif. The company has been contracted to work on border fencing projects by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers in the past.
Not to mention supposed intelligent people that back this orange traitor in chief and all his blowhard hot air.
Sorry libs. Some of us are concerned with illegal immigration, human trafficking, drug trafficking, and terrorism. You all just keep embracing open borders and party over nation.
Who wants open borders? That is a LIE by the gop. A wall is not the best or most effective way to stop the problem, it just happens to be Trumps favorite, which he said Mexico would pay for. Expecting US taxpayers to foot the bill after republicans already exploded the deficit is delusional. How exactly does a wall stop terrorism? Since they rarely come from our southern border.
How about the people who want the wall pay for it and leave the rest of America be.
No they're not. Those are just cover lies for racism. We know and they know it. No use still trying to put lipstick on that pig.
False racebaiting is about the level of rhetoric I have come to expect from the left.
Despite the bigotry of your comment, you still won't address those issues.
So the illegal alien nationals from Poland, Canada, UK/Ireland, Portugal, etc., are brown/black-skinned folks? Who knew?!
Oh, puhleeze.....is that what the wall on the southern border is for. I'll bet you couldn't even keep from laughing at yourself with that lame "argument."
That is perfect demonstration of the desperation of projection.
I view illegal immigration as a very serious threat to our nation. It is not a laughing matter when US citizens and legal immigrants are murdered by illegal aliens.
A perfect demonstration from someone who hasn't a clue of who is actually crossing the border illegally.
Here's a hint -
According to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security, the countries of origin for the largest numbers of illegal immigrants are as follows (latest of 2017):
The Urban Institute also estimates "between 65,000 and 75,000 Canadians currently live illegally in the United States."
Doesn't look like just "brown/black-skinned folks" to me.
Some folks also don't know that there are tens of millions of people in Mexico and Central/South America who are not brown/black skinned.
Would you have had the same sentiments had everyone decided that was okay with the PPACA, too?
No they don't because there are Asia folks in there. So yeah, mostly brown/black and Asian in the top ten.
You're right. It's part of the Big Lie about immigrants and racist lies are never funny.
All those victims are actually alive? Prove it please.
That's funny coming from the racebaiting party.
Ah, grasshopper, the projection is particularly strong today.
I realize facts are like poison to some, nevertheless they persist:
Time after time and study after study shows that violent crimes committed immigrants, whether here legally or illegally, are well below rates by "native-born" citizens.
[deleted]
Seriously, it amazes me that some people think this is responsive. You, doing a Goebbels impression, claimed it was a "big lie" that illegal aliens murder Americans.
And then you post data showing illegal aliens commit violent crime.
Here's a hint, if you want to back up your statement, prove that illegal aliens have never killed an American.
[deleted]
You couldn't possibly begin understand how "funny" that is coming from you and your fellow travelers who churn out lies by the tanker load on this and, well, every subject. [deleted]
I predicted how toxic the facts about immigrants and violent crime would be to the professional grade liars about this topic and, right on cue, they showed up in force to prove it.
Notice how you avoided supporting your claim and stooped to name calling? [deleted]
prove that illegal immigrants have never killed Americans. You called it a “big Lie” that immigrants have killed Americans. Try and back up with your nonsensical claim with facts, for once.
[deleted]
Are you actually trying to claim illegal aliens don't commit murder here?
LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Whoo BOY!
Can't prove it, so will ignore.
The very next sentence @ your link is as follows:
Trends
In 2017, illegal border crossing arrests hit a 46-year low, and were down 25% from the previous year.
Oh, is the deflection is ever strong. Or is it a straw-man. Same thing really. Better spell it out though just so even Tex can't twist it (oh, she'll try again, though, to be sure): N-O!
I'll put the chart up again just for fun (realizing Tex still won't accept it or even "get" it):
In short, this graph shows that where undocumented immigrants are most concentrated in the general population the rate of violent crimes committed by them drops .
Your inability to understand my post betrays you again.
You posted this.
Now, if you DIDN'T mean that illegal aliens commit murder, WTF DID you mean??????
You claimed it a LIE that U.S. citizens and LEGAL immigrants are murdered by illegal aliens.
It has been proven to you that your statement is FALSE.
Please stop digging.
Cemex will prove to be interesting. They are a Mexican company headquartered in Monterrey Mexico. One of the largest building material companies in the world.
So, the US will be paying Mexico to build the wall...LOL
They say not.
Under pressure, Mexican-owned Cemex says it won't help build Trump's border wall
Good article.
Interesting conundrum for Mexican companies.
I saw the clip where a reporter asked him if he'd thought about using executive power (which he doesn't have) to just unilaterally order the wall to be built. It was as obvious as it could possibly be that Scumbag was caught off guard by the question and had never considered that at all but, true to form, decided to fake it with one of his usual slitherings: "Oh, yeah, I've thought about it and I could certainly do that (he couldn't) but I probably wouldn't do it." What. A. Lying. Pussy.
Gotta luv the media types. Tons of non-essential fillers of everything else but an actual WHY "A presidential declaration of a national emergency to construct a border wall would likely face legal challenges".
What challenges ?
What problems ?
Which "Law" ?
What "Expert" says so ?
ETC..……………………….
The wall ain't happening...Trump's just going to have to be happy with the beaded curtain.
6 figure fines for any business per every illegal immigrant hired since the reagan amnesty
1 year in prison per hire for everyone involved in hiring illegal immigrants and forfeiture of assets
DACA approval and a rebuilt and fair national immigration policy
national e-verify policy for hiring
...or the russian puppet in the white house can bend over and pull that wall out of his fat ass
6 figure fine?
Good luck collecting from businesses in that amount! LOL
A year in prison and forfeiture of assets? LMAO! Guess some have never heard of "cruel and unusual punishment"!
DACA? Unnecessary and unwanted. Merely encourages MORE illegal aliens to come here. Ridiculous fucking policy anyway!
Rebuilt and fair national immigration policy? We HAVE one already!
National E-verify? Ding, ding, ding, FINALLY a sane solution to something!
That's a perfect laundry list for those who want to make immigration a permanent issue to rally xenophobes, white supremacists and alt-right extremists.
Why do so many liberal, progressive Democrats confuse IMMIGRATION with ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION?
LMFAO
Unlike Drones, More Boarder Agents, Sensors and other Technology......a wall is a permanent structure.....Once it is built....it would be very difficult to do away with it (Defund).....In my opinion, that is a big factor in why so many Democrats don't want a wall.....Not to mention they can't stand for Trump to get a political win....As far as him using the "National Emergency" route.....I'm not sure what would stop him....
I just want to remind those who are turning their cheek while Trump redefines executive privileges that he will not be President forever and the republicans will not always be in charge.
There have been one dangerous precedence after another set during this Administration and future leaders may continue this practice and disregard the other EQUAL branches of government when they get in charge.
This presidency will be haunting our country for generations to come and long after his base is gone.
You do bring up a good point PJ....but this has been going on long before the Trump Presidency......as far as Trumps Legacy.....that remains to be seen.
Respectly, no, what this man and his administration are doing is not business as usual. That's why there's a special investigation. That's why so many cabinet members have been fired or left because of unethical misuse of their positions, that's why so many have resigned their posts because they don't trust this president and that's why this administration cannot attract good people.
No, both sides don't do these things and it's false to say they do. Truth still matters to most Americans.
most Americans don't no who ruth is, and this would be how one of there attacks on Truth could start.
Ruthless Truthless Trump, has continued to lie to America, and the world, without regard for the consequences of such careless behavior, and it is truly concerning, that so many continue to support and defend
The LIAR in Chief
Actually, Trump is being investigated because the left would love to do nothing more than to negate the election of Donald Trump....the rest is subjective and highly opinionated....IMHO.
I agree there are those that just hate this man but the investigation has real results as is evident by the prison sentences and indictments.
I also understand that there are those who support this man no matter what and don't care about truth and decency.
This is not business as usual and I'm not going to allow his base to suggest it is.
Facts matter. I'll give you the last word.
Every Presidency is different....as far as "results" from the Probe....Has anything come of it with regards to it's "supposed" original intent.....Trump Russian Collusion?....Dig deep enough and squeeze hard enough and there will almost always be indictments when dealing with our Government officials...
And don't feel like you can't comment because of you giving me the last word....This is a free respectful discussion we are having.....Please continue.
I feel sorry for whoever has to fix the damage done by Trump.
Full employment, rising wages.......it's a shitstorm.
Only as to how corrupt and destructive.
at what cost, A shitstrom may really be the result, we'll see what his deregulations effects are later.
Otherwise known as the continued extension of the Obama presidency's gains. There's a shitstorm all right when the "president" of this country was colluding with Russian fascists to get elected during the campaign and continues to march to the orders of Putin now. Most recent cases in point: bizarre comments about the Russian invasion of Afghanistan in 1979, the idea that Montenegro (Montenegro!?!?!?!) is a dangerous Balkan nation and this false claim that Poland is threatening to invade Belarus. Each of those claims come directly from Putin's false propaganda machine in Russia to justify either past Russian disasters or current and future false justifications for more militaristic involvement in former Soviet satellites à la Ukraine. He's Putin's puppet and you can actually see the strings.
It's amazingly "convenient" how everything that ever goes right in this country is somehow the work of a Democrat, while everything that goes wrong is somehow the work of a Republican.
And by "convenient" I mean brainless and intellectually lazy.
Why hasn't Trump thought about the military to build the Wall. Sea Bees are amazing and probably could do it for 1 billion
I think he has thrown that option on the table.
as a SeaBee I concur
the difficult we do at once, the impossible takes a minute longer
The Seabee unit down the trail from us in DaNang had a sign posted - "We can and do fix everything - except being able to weld the crack of dawn or put wheels on miscarriages."
I am SteelWorker (SW2) and would gladly give it a try... LOL
Build the wall and a correctional facility on the other side. Get rid of this court nonsense if your not a citizen the constitution don't apply to you
The rights of the Constitution apply to all people regardless of their citizenship status. Geo W. Bush was slapped in the face by the SCOTUS on this concept.
Way to slap down the big bad bear!
Declare them enemy combatants.....and don't let them enter the country in the first place.
only on this side of the fence.
people not from here only get in if we let them. they have no "right to enter.
that said...
I would like to see every country in the world adopt a bill of rights exactly like ours.
(word for word.)
if they had free speech backed up by the right to bear arms their countries would not be shit-holes worth leaving.
That is a very high legal standard. Where is your evidence?
Read #6....." 6. As the commander-in-chief, the president has the authority to determine whether someone is an enemy combatant, according to CFR."
The Supreme Court disagreed with Geo W. Bush. Do you want to try that same argument again, but this time with unarmed immigrants that are seeking refuge from human rights abuses in Central America?
Are they all seeking refuge from human rights abuses in Central America?.....Also, didn't Mexico say they could stay there and work?......There are plenty of places in Mexico that they can apply for refugee status....and spare themselves the long trip to the wall....
What are you afraid of happening if they come to the US and begin the process to US citizenship?
Where did your family emigrate to the US from?
You do know that most of them will never show for their court hearing.....Are you afraid of a Wall and Stopping Illegal Immigration?
My Family immigrated from all over the world Legally.....and some of them were here long before Columbus.
Most illegal immigrants came here legally and overstayed their visa, so the wall won't stop that. Do you want to close all road border crossing, airports and water ports with Mexico? Do you understand that thousands of Mexicans come to the US every day to work and then go back home at night? Most of the drugs come to the US in truck trailers, so the silly wall doesn't stop that.
The support for the wall is driven by both ignorance and xenophobia.
New technology is going to make it easier to detect drugs in Tractor Trailers......and when that happens .....they will go to the open boarder more than they already do......The wall is just one component of boarder security......we need it all.....
Yet the GAO report on Trump's WALL found that the CBP has yet to come up with a plan to integrate Trump's WALL with EXISTING technology.
I find it hard to fathom that a wall would make things more difficult for the CBP.....Unlike technological barriers....like sensors, drones etc.....a wall is hard to defund once it is built.....it's a permanent structure....My fear is that as soon as Trump is out of office.....Funding for these "Tech Barriers" will be pulled.....I think you would have to admit that there is folks on both the left and the right that want nothing more than essentially open borders......One side see's potential voters....and the other see's cheap Labor.
It never fails to amaze me how these self-styled "patriots" and constitutional egg-spurts can be so abysmally ignorant of that document.
You have it all wrong about us. Why would they be likely voters when we are hard pressed to get more than 75% of American citizens to cast a ballot? It would be 10-15 years before they are able to vote.
How would they be cheap labor when us wacky progressives support a progressive living minimum wage and unions?
The fact that most of them are Christian and a lot are Catholics should suggest that the Christian population would welcome them as new members.
Who they would have to cultivate for decades to bring to fruition.
Immediate gratification.
75-80% show up for their hearings.
Seeking asylum isn't illegal...
Hey Dulay.....Long time no debate....How have you been?
Now back to the debate......I looked up your numbers and I think you are correct....and I was wrong. Thanks for clearing that up......Now....I have a couple questions....What keeps a Terrorist from claiming they seek asylum? Are these "Asylum Seekers" eligible for Government Aid?
CIA, NATO and Interpol lists. Individual governments can request persons be added to the lists.
Of the 4,000 'terrorists' claimed to have been stopped by the Trump Administration
only 6 or 8 were detained at the southern border by CBP because they were on THE list.
The majority have been arrested in airports either on arrival or prevented from boarding planes to the USA while in foreign countries.
How many have crossed and were not even questioned or put through any scrutiny?
Everyone that get's on a plane and goes through our airports get's checked out before they are released into our Country.....can you say the same for our Southern Border? Do you think that Terrorist don't know about this?
Is foreign-born terrorism a major worry for you? Most terrorist attacks in the US are committed by white male citizens.
The libertarian Cato group a has a few thoughts and facts in the subject.
And yet, ironically, of the terror attacks on U.S. soil-- how many of thoseterrorists entered the U,S. by crossing the Mexican border?
In contrast, how many entered the U.S. by plane (or boat) or other ways that did not include crossing the Mexican border?
Everyone that get's on a plane and goes through our airports get's checked out before they are released into our Country.....can you say the same for our Southern Border?
There have been allegations that about 4000 potential terrorists were apprehended trying to cross the mexican border into the U.S. !!!
But there's a lot of dis-information about what's really going on in that regard.
I recently came across an excellent interview by by Chris Wallace of Fox News that really sets the record straight-- an incredible video!!!
Without doing a Google search I am not aware of any that cross into the US from the SW Mexican border. The cost-benefit analysis of the wall just doesn't work. This is an emotional policy and a very expensive mistake. The US-Canada border in the central and western US is wide open by comparison.
Good to see you again too True Pat.
It's refreshing to have a discussion with someone that acknowledges facts.
Yes. that's what the CBP does. BTW, they're the ones that do it at airports too...
Yes, pretty sure they do. Yet as CBP data shows, there is NO evidence that terrorists have come over the southern border. Unfortunately, Trump and his minions saw fit to LIE about the data in order to fear monger...
Ironically, there IS evidence that terrorists HAVE crossed the northern border. Can you help me figure out why Trump is laser focused on the southern border while the real threat of terrorism has historically come from the north? I've tried to come up with one that isn't based on xenophobic racism but I have failed...
I try to be fair.....and I do make mistakes (as we all do)......Are you saying that the CBP checks out everyone that crosses the Southern Boarder?.....
I don't believe we have the human traficking, drugs, illegal guns and Gangs that are exploiting our Northern Border......This is just my assumption (could be wrong)....but I believe that Illegal Border Crossing from the North is significantly lower than from the South......Also, I have been to places like Juarez, Mexico.....It is like a war zone.....there are many places along the Southern Border that I don't think we want spilling over to our side......Unlike Canada. Hope that helps....
The reporting indicates that those 6-8 were 'encountered' NOT detained and there is NO evidence that any of them was taken into custody or charged with ANYTHING.
All Terrorism is a Concern for me.....and for the Record.....I don't think we do enough to stop Domestic Terrorist Either.....
This 5 Billion is a drop in the bucket......to say that this fight is worth fighting for is really silly....to me this all boils down to the left refusing to let Trump have a political win.....I would have to say that if Democrats really want to help Americans and truly believe that Trump is a lunatic.....they should do what is best for Americans.....and give him the 5 Billion and Live to fight another day.......My Guess is that this Shutdown has already cost the Economy more than $5 Billion.....and I don't believe that a wall makes life easier for Drug Traffickers, Human Traffickers and Gangs.....
So they were allowed to enter the Country?.....also I noticed that the article states that these "Encounters" were at Ports of Entry......what about all the open ground in between these Ports of Entry?
There is over 1200 miles of Border that doesn't even have a Fence.....The entire boarder is only about 1900 miles.....
Obviously they don't.
CBP has NO data that proves that a WALL will curtail human trafficking and they refuse to go on the record about it.
Anyone who has seen Trump's 'steel slats' knows that kilos can be packaged to fit between them. BTW, we have drug smuggling from Canada too:
Gun trafficking is overwhelmingly from north to south. Straw sales are rampant in Texas.
The MS 13 gang that Trump uses to fear monger originated in the US.
Data? BTW, I don't accept the argument that asylum seekers are entering the country 'illegally' so the numbers are skewed for the southern border. Also, since fact checking has caught up with the GOP, I've heard them stating that 'One is too many'.
If Juarez is a 'war zone', so is St. Louis, which ranks higher in the most dangerous city category.
Juarez spills over into El Paso [and via, versa] every day. Workers and students cross the bridges, back and forth, by the hundreds. El Paso is one of the safest cities in the country, at least according to the data and Beto...
Yet CBP data proves that more terrorists come from Canada than Mexico.
And what does El Paso and Juarez Have between them? And if the CBP doesn't need to check out everyone that crosses the border....then why does the TSA have to check out everyone?.....The CBP also doesn't have any data that proves that a wall Wouldn't curtail human trafficking.....as far as data goes.....it is hard to compare the two borders apples to apples.....conceptually Canada has a similar culture and standard of living as the United States...I would also argue that many of the illegal crossings from Canada are from Mexican Citizens going to Canada and Crossing the Border.... ....illegal crossings need to stop....and I also think we need to limit the amount of "asylum seekers". We cannot take on the Entire Southern Hemisphere's Problems.....nor it's people....Until we fix some of the major problems that are occurring here First. Homelessness and Drug Addiction for starters.....
The data that you requested.....pretty clear where most of the illegal immigration is taking place....
She lies because she is following her boss's lead and has learned from the best.
and most of it's in Texas and it's private property, well within the border.
Some 5,000 parcels that will have to be dealt with and 85 cases still pending in Courts from the last round.
Our Federal government is trying to outspend and outlast those 85 holdouts who do not want their ranches/farms/property condemned or split in half with no access to their property located in the sovereign state of Texas & the USA but beyond their reach.
Do you blame them?
Since there is no data on arrests of terrorists @ the southern border, we have to presume they were.
There is no data on terrorists being arrested at the southern border PERIOD.
That's 'in total' data, NOT from current immigration.
Secondly, your link shows that those number reflect only 18% have been here less than 5 years. Doesn't reflect a current 'emergency' Pat.
A FENCE that was built in 2010 yet hundreds of citizens from Juarez 'invade' El Paso every day and it's STILL one of the safest cities in the country.
I didn't make that claim Pat. Strawman?
Though the CBP DOES have data on programs that they KNOW have been working and they ain't a WALL.
Yet they funded and built 8 prototypes to do JUST THAT and they chose NONE OF THE ABOVE.
Conceptually, Mexicans and Central Americans have a similar culture to Southwestern America because much of it is THEIR culture.
Please proceed. Data please.
Illegal crossings have been declining every year. Trump HAS reduced the amount of asylum seekers. Unless and until we repeal our international treaties, we are obligated to accept asylum seekers @ our border.
Another strawman.
Neither is being addressed by Trump or his WALL. It seems that his base aren't adequately enthusiastic about those issues.
"BUILD THAT SHELTER", "BUILT THAT REHAB" must not have polled well...
When you say "invade"....are you saying that they are crossing the "Fence" or are you saying they are entering legally through a port of entry?
Trump doesn't make a distinction, why should I? /s
Seriously, hundreds cross in both directions every day over the Juarez/El Paso POE for work and school. They are major contributors to the economy on both sides of the border. Many of the managers and supervisors in Juarez factories are US citizens. Many service workers and college students are Juarez citizens. It's a symbiotic relationship that has been working for a very long time.
BTW, just outside of El Paso, @ the NM border, the 'pedestrian fence' ends and the 'vehicle barrier' starts, a day hike from Juarez to El Paso around the end of the 'pedestrian fence'.
I think you made my case for me......The scenario you describe in El Paso is what I want......I want people entering our Country through POE for work and school.....And as you pointed out El Paso is one of the safest Cities in America.....Despite have one of the most violent Cities Right across it's border fence.....and I think that Fence is about 18' high in places if I recall.....Fences/Walls do keep people from entering our Country Illegally.....and this scenario Proves it.....Now it is time to apply this winning combination to the rest of the border.......Fence/Wall....WITH..Strong border patrols, Drones....Electronics...etc....and The People who want to come here to participate in our Economy .....can do so .....after they have been checked out by Border Patrol.
Fences sure. We don't know if 'WALLS' work because there are NO WALLS on the southern border.
BTW, I NEVER said that FENCES don't work. My posit has always been that they DO and that is why we don't need no stinkin' wall.
Trump is the one that insisted, until last night, that it HAD to be a WALL and who has been LYING about a WALL being built. As someone who has built many a WALL, I can't imagine trying to pass a 'steel bollard barrier' off as a WALL. The only reason Trump is tap dancing and obfuscating is that he is incapable of MANNING UP, admit he was full of shit, that Mexico was never going to pay a dime and that the barriers that we have been building along the border for years do the fucking job.
Even in Big Bend?
A fence is NOT a WALL and no matter how many times you try to conflate them, that will remain true.
OK...in the spirit of good debate.....Big Picture.....Fund a Fence Similar to what is in El Paso.....Since a Fence isn't a wall....Mexico shouldn't have to pay for it....We can debate what is best in Big Bend....but a provision needs to be in place that if illegal border crossing eclipse a set number in that area......a fence shall be built.....Fund the Fence and open the Government........How does that sound?
Just for my info.....Did the Democrats last proposal include Funding for a Fence?...If so...How much money?
You wouldn't be splitting hairs there, now, would you?
So how about this: Fence or wall?
Or this: Fence or Wall?
Or this:
Do tell.
Without doing a Google search I am not aware of any that cross into the US from the SW Mexican border.
I used to follow terrorism stories very closely after 9/11, but while I still do to some degree, I really haven't kept up the way I used to.
So I could be wrong-- but I don't think there was even a single domestic terror attack from someone who entered the country via the Mexican border-- not one.
IIRC, all terror attacks on U.S. have been perpetrated by people who have entered on commercial airline flights...or who have actually been born here.
So Trump's claim's are blatant lies...
Those are ALL FENCES and ironically, since nothing can be passed THOUGH two of them, those are MORE 'impenetrable' than the 'steel slats' that Trump is building.
OK. If you say so. Suuuuuuure.
Well there we have it. Dulay has solved our crisis. Simply use 6' privacy fencing with Mexican labor. We can get the whole thing done for $2000.
"Fences" ONLY work on the "Law Abiding person".
Have you never seen those cop shows, where the Bad Folks "hop the Fences" of Neighborhoods to get away from the law ?
YOU just said so:
Oh the irony...
Then WHY is Trump wasting money building fences. Review the photos and articles posted here that show what Trump is building right now on the border. NOT ONE shows a WALL.
There was a seed earlier where multiple members spent days figuring out how to use ropes and ladders to scale the fence. I kept saying that they don't need no stinking ladders. Sheriff Deputy Magoffin proved my point. 18' and up and over in seconds...
So since it's obvious that fencing out in the middle of nowhere DOES NOT WORK, why does Trump want to spend BILLIONS to build it anyway?
Are there areas were fencing works? Yes. Do we need another 200+ miles of fence? NO.
But, But, But ………….. Liberals and Liberal politicians tell us Trump hasn't built a thing ! (rolling eyes face)
Your QUOTE:
"BTW, I NEVER said that FENCES don't work. My posit has always been that they DO and that is why we don't need no stinkin' wall."
Your photo is Old, Old, Old, which.....by the way....it shows "Fences Don't work ! (Facepalm Face)
Time for a WALL ! (LOL Face)
Link?
Trump said that he has been building the WALL and that is almost done.
I have said that what HAS been built isn't a WALL.
The fences I have separating my neighbors property, 50' and 75' from my house and in line of sight, work GREAT. I have never seen a sign that anyone has entered my property on those fence lines.
The one I have on the back property line, 250' away in the woods, not so much.
Beer bottles and other garbage tells me that someone hung out back there and that they were pigs. I sat in wait for a week and saw lights back there one night. The sound of me yelling and chambering a shotgun shell caused much chaos and scampering.
Since then I added battery powered motion detector lighting that alarms in my house.
So the more remote fence line has to be POLICED to be effective.
GET IT YET?
Actually, the photo is from 2018 and the fence was installed in 2012.
Why didn't Donald, Mitch and Paul get the funding passed in the last two years?
This was waaaaaay too easy. (Laughing Face)
NOW....as to this: (snicker)
"The fences I have separating my neighbors property, 50' and 75' from my house and in line of sight, work GREAT. I have never seen a sign that anyone has entered my property on those fence lines. "
"Legal" folks don't hop "Neighborhood Fences". LOL !
NOT ONE of those links supports your claim that:
In FACT, as far as I could find, not one even quotes a "Liberal". If one of them does, QUOTE the statement.
Guess it isn't as easy as you think...
Wait WHAT? When you were watching those cop shows you MUST have seen the cops hopping neighborhood fences chasing after 'Bad Folks' right? Cops are "Legal" RIGHT?
BTFW, I live in the country where 'small' residential lots are an acre and most are 5+, 12 residents along a mile of road, NOT in a 'neighborhood'. Deer hop my fences and they're welcome.
Comprehension eludes some I guess !
Does this help you any, or is this not within the realm of thought either.
"BTFW," I live in the country where 'small' residential lots are an acre and most are 5+"
And ?
neigh·bor·hood
[ˈnābərˌho͝od]
NOUN
a district, especially one forming a community within a town or city.
Yep.....your in a Neighborhood.
Actually, I comprehend that you posted links that don't support your BS.
Good faith eludes some.
From YOUR link:
So Trump is claiming to have built a WALL and that it's working GREAT and YOUR link states he's full of shit.
Then there's what 'Liberal Politicians' actually said. Again from your link:
So WHERE is the part where they say 'Trump hasn't built a thing'?
Nope, I live in an UNINCORPORATED area, NOT 'within a town or city'. [laughing face]
ALWAYS Using the words "I WON'T see it" on anything you disagree with is just "LAZY THINKING" !
[Deleted]
First of all, I NEVER used those words. It's impossible to SEE what doesn't exist.
Perhaps you forgot what you were supposed to be supporting.
Perhaps you should re-read my comment that stated:
Instead of blathering, post a quote a statement from one of your links that PROVES your claim that "Liberals and Liberal politicians tell us Trump hasn't built a thing !"
You make a lot of personal statements when you can't address the topic huh.
I SEE what is ALWAYS invisible to Liberal types.
Yet you're incapable of posting even ONE quote that allege you SEE in your links. Why is that?
None so Blind as those that WILL NOT see ! (Facepalm face)
No matter how many times that absolute truth is stated the haters will never accept it.
There is a fence around the US Capital building, if Congress does not want to secure the border then Congress does not deserve to have it's fence and security
It doesn't make sense to me that if we have walls and fences on part of the border.....then what good is that when it doesn't go all the way......to me it's like building a dam part way and expecting it to hold water......
There ARE areas along the border where a fence isn't necessary.
Big Bend is an example.
It's no wonder that CBP apprehensions are the lower in this area.
Looks Beautiful and doesn't look nearly as ominous to cross as this does.....and yes....cbp aprehensions are lower there.....there are much easier places to cross....and once those are closed up......then what do you think will happen to the cbp apprehensions in the big bend?
I sure as hell wouldn't want to try to install precast concrete barriers in Big Bend Pat. Guess you could use helicopters to fly them in, can't see a crane working there.
Ever set forms to pour concrete on a 10 degree graded driveway? Imagine doing it on a 45 degree grade or more. Even the CBP knew that was 'prohibitive'.
The fence needs a minimum 4' foundation, 6' even better.
Big Bend looks like it has quite a bit of bed rock. THAT'S even MORE fun...
BTW Pat, the Israeli concrete wall only runs 19 miles...the rest of the barrier is FENCING.
Sorry man. That's ugly as hell.
That "looks beautiful" in the same way Harvey Weinstein "looks beautiful".
Like I said.....we could debate the big bend area.....but the rest....build a "Fence".....
BTW......Wall and Fence are considered Synonyms.....and really isn't worth all the hub bub....shutdowns.....if this is truly about the difference between a wall and a Fence....That is really a shame.....and Trump has already said that we can build a fence....but to my knowledge Chuck and Nancy won't have nothing to do with it.....
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.....LOL.
It would be a real shame to mar that beauty with an ugly fence/wall
That's all fine.....and I'm good with that.....I trust your judgement....and I have looked into it as well...and now agree......I wish that all we had to debate was weather or not we needed a fence in the big bend area......I think Trump would concede on that point....and he has conceeded to building a "Fence".......So why no funding for a "Fence" .....Democrats?
Lowers property value.
Who wants to live on the Rio Grande and look at a wall instead of a river.
Dumb.
Not familiar with that part of the country, I see.
Then please enlighten us. I understand it's a state park? Is that correct?
The river runs through Big Bend National Park. However it runs the souther border of the US from El Paso to Brownsville. The total length is about 1900 miles, most of which are in Texas.
Very few people live on the border sections of the river. Most of the land adjacent to it is ranch land, and frankly cows don't particularly mind how ugly a concrete or steel wall is. Ranchers on the river have reported problems with illegal immigrant caravans running across their land, and it's been going on for decades.
Now again...I'm not sold on the idea of a wall. But it's not going to drive down property values to any significant degree. Nobody wants to live there anyway.
It is probably worth looking into what, if any, wildlife migration patterns might be interrupted.
Same link as above.
Link?
The difference between a wall and a fence is in the BILLIONS of dollars. It would be a shame to waste BILLIONS.
$5.7 billion dollars is nothing in the scheme of US Govt expenditure. Medicare/Medicaid loses $5.7 billion to fraud and incompetence every 19 days.
The US govt spends $5.7 billion every 9 hours.
The ONLY reason to fight about this is for the sake of the fight.
Nor can they DRINK from a concrete or steel wall. So unless you think that they are talking about building down the center of the river, you should consider how ranchers feel about their livestock being cut off from the river. I know damn well that my Great Grandfather would have been apoplectic had they cut his cows off from the Lemonwier River. My cousin still owns that land and runs horses on it.
The price tag is nothing but a red herring for some Democrats.
Government auditors studied all federal programs and found that 22% of them have no positive impact on the populations they serve at the cost of over $123 Billion per YEAR.
I have yet to see either political party actually BE fiscally responsible despite claims by both sides to the contrary.
Anyone complaining about $5 Billion for something that actually accomplishes something is pulling your leg.
Link.
Then why is Trump doing it?
I think Trump would be fine with your "Fence"....I don't think that he cares if it is called a fence or a wall.....we need a physical barrier that is adequate to keep people from crossing it........So I guess I have to ask.....What is the Problem? I'm not sure what the disagreement is about here.....I think we might be in agreement on a "Fence".....
Good question. I suppose because he made such a big deal about it during the campaign.
The better question is why he didn't get behind the $25billion package last year when Republicans were running both houses.
They should have passed it. It only didn't because of the republicans themselves. Only 8 of them voted for it.
They should have made him veto it. Why they keep giving him cover, I don't know.
It had everything trump wanted yet he didn't want it. Now it is supposedly a crisis and he has to have less money than he would have originally received.
Which is why I say, he makes up a crisis. Just to boost himself.
He should have made them pass it. Campaign promise #1 done. Commence victory lap.
The president cannot force the legislative branch to do anything because they do not work for him. He is not the president of the USA Corp.
According to the republicans, they didn't pass it because trump said he would veto it.
trump said he was against it.
I say they should have passed it to find out.
Please do explain that to the seemingly endless parade of panicking liberals who claim to be utterly convinced Hitler is reincarnated with every new day of Trump's presidency.
That said, a new president can usually strong arm his party into passing legislation he wants, especially if it's reasonably bipartisan...which comprehensive immigration/path to citizenship immigration reform would be.
No, I get that. I just think it was stupid.
I honestly think that if the republicans voted for it, with the Democratic help at the time, they could have over ridden his veto.
It would be done now.
I don't blame the Democrats for getting tired of the lies and misdirection.
That is why I say they pander to trump.
Cowards.
The funny thing is, if they had done it, even over ridden a veto, trump would probably be claiming success right now.
But then he would have to come up with something else to rile up his base with...
Thank-you, Jack.
BTW Pat, the Israeli concrete wall only runs 19 miles...the rest of the barrier is FENCING
Correct.
Anti-israeli propaganda shows that picture as an example of the horrible "border wall" Israel has constructed-- but IIRC, its less than 5% of that total separation barrier.
The other 95% of that so-called "Israeli Wall" looks like this:
So why did they built a tiny portion as an actual wall (and a very high one!) but only build the other 95% as a fence? (Hint: in that area there was a fairly unique problem that didn't exist to any significant degree along most of that fenced barrier-- nor is it a problem that exists on our Mexican border.
The more appropriate synonym for Trump's WALL on that list is 'façade'.
Well, by definition IF that happened, then yeah, the veto would have been overridden.
But that was never going to happen. You don't override the veto of a relatively new president in your own party.
It isn't MY fence Pat.
While in reality, Trump might have backed off of his WALL, he has insisted from day one that it isn't a fence, it's a WALL. In fact, he chastised a reported for calling it a fence.
Even yesterday, Trump and his minions called it a WALL.
The 'problem' is that Trump refuses to negotiate in good faith. As I said, the first thing he needs to do is STOP calling it a WALL when anyone with a brain KNOWS it is a FENCE. Trump would do well to STOP insulting the America people's intelligence.
If Trump would have walked into that meeting yesterday and said:
OK, we need to get on the same page. You've voted in the past to build fencing and to add technology and personnel. I promised a wall but I can sell my base on a 'steel slat barrier'. Let's meet in the middle. You said 1.6 and I said 5. Let's agree on 3.5 for border security, include the term 'barrier' in the bill and I'll sign it on Friday to reopen the government and you are all invited.
There would have been a JOINT news conference and high fives all around.
Remember that the 25 billion was a package that included DACA protections.
Here's your answer.
Stephen Miller is the man behind the curtain but instead of being benevolent, he's malevolent.
WASHINGTON ― Democrats on Capitol Hill said Tuesday they won’t allow President Donald Trump to use undocumented young people as leverage to get support from the lawmakers for building a border wall, locking up more immigrants and cutting legal immigration.
Democrats are nothing more than "Anti-Wall and Pro-Illegals" !
Campaign promise #1 was to build a WALL that MEXICO would pay for.
The link I posted was from Jan. 2018, yours was from Aug. 2017. Grassley and Durbin went to Trump with a deal and Stephen Miller and Trump ambushed them.
"Crying for ILLEGAL Refugees" Schumer and "Illegals are voters" Pelosi run the LIBERAL show !
Don the Con, Turtle man and the Young gun ran the WHOLE SHOW for 2 years and failed miserably.
He's got the Dem's whining and crying AGAIN. Not a failure in my eyes.
Trumps Presidency has hurt YOU.....How ?
They've got Chronic Butt-hurt ...... which is very painful i've heard .....
Democrats seem to luv to "Parade" about it !
Gee, I just checked C-Span and didn't see anyone crying...
IOKIYAR
Off the top of my head:
Conspired with a foreign power to game our electoral process.
Neutered the GOP.
Neutered the EPA.
Auctioned off Federal land and Monuments.
Put two RW judges on the SCOTUS.
Targeted the rule of law.
Stoked racism and xenophobia.
Embarrassed our nation in the eyes of the world.
Continued his campaign to repeal the ACA without a replacement.
Kept National Parks open during the shutdown allowing damage that will take years to repair, if EVER.
In better words:
He hasn't physically or monetarily hurt YOU one bit. Just your "Feelings" were hurt !
Not for lack of trying.
The deterioration of America's standing in the world, the rule of law, water, air and the beauty of our National Parks and Monuments isn't about my 'feelings'.
So you just did the "Bluster" thingy ?
"The deterioration of America's standing in the world, the rule of law, water, air and the beauty of our National Parks and Monuments"
Sheeeeeesh…..we're ALL gonna die.
Let me know when that actually happens....won't you ?
Well...DT said he wanted a path to citizenship.
Frankly I didn't pay attention to the proposal at the time, so there may have been some problems with it, but it certainly seems to me that he would have wanted to strike while the iron was hot.
It's real easy to say the renegotiated trade deal will generate more than $5.7 billion over some number of years. That's just traditional smoke and mirrors with govt money.
The "deterioration of America's standing in the world" is most definitely all about your 'feelings'.
How obtuse. For almost 9 years the RW's hair was on fire because they were SURE that Obama would take their guns away.
Now, millions of Americans, including my wife and I, are worried about Trump repealing the ACA and leaving us without health coverage because of our preexisting conditions.
I already did.
Perhaps it's an example of Trump's inexperience governing and lack of understanding of how the Congress has historically 'moved on'. Being a business guy, he still thinks that the deal is still there to be had. I doubt he even understands that the House appropriation committees are now run by the Dems and that ship has sailed. No more House rubber stamp.
What's been interesting lately is that McConnell is giving Trump the cold shoulder. Mitch is STILL pissed that Trump reneged on the CR. It looks like Mitch is DONE with letting Trump hanging him out to dry. Mitch insists now that unless Trump PUBLICLY states that he'll sign the funding bill, he won't bring it to the floor.
You must not have read Gen. Mattis' resignation letter.
It's only easy for a habitual liar like Trump.
Government money that doesn't even exist yet since the treaty hasn't passed the Congress.
"I'll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today"
Just for you It.
Also BTW, Scumbag repeated umpteen times during the campaign and since that it would be concrete (I believe he even said "beautiful concrete) and, of course, entirely paid for by Mexico. Is there be no recognition of lying from his supporters?
If he leaves office and Mexico doesn't pay for the wall.....it will be a Major Campaign Promise that he didn't keep.....Would this be the first President to do something like this.....I don't think so......That being said....I wouldn't like it any more than Obama telling me I can keep my Plan, My Doctor etc...etc....etc....
Trump has known that Mexico would never pay a dime for his wall since Jan. 27, 2017. Trump BEGGED Peña Nieto not to tell the press that Mexico would not pay for the wall, telling him that it would hurt him politically. The transcript is very enlightening. I was surprised that Trump realized just how precarious his position really was.
Just like Obama promising to close Gitmo, right?
and so did everyone who voted for him... LOL
why is it only the left thinks trump actually meant they would write a check up front or pay a bill 30 days after completion? no one I have met IRL actually thought that... what gives?
I mean seriously... we all knew he means they would pay in other ways. they are paying now and will pay more before it is all over. the new trade deal and just stopping those caravans has cost mexico millions with millions more spent securing their own southern border as result. they are paying thru the nose as we speak and it is not even over yet.
I guess, like brevity, "reading between the lines" is becoming a lost art.
cheers
What an utter load of bullshit. The 'new trade deal' hasn't even gone through Congress yet.
So are the caravan's INVADING or did Mexico stop them? Pick ONE.
As for securing their OWN southern border, exactly HOW does that pay for Trump's WALL?
BTFW, here's a little document for your perusal.
It gets funnier...
The difference, of course, is Obama's goal was to stop crimes against humanity while Scumbag's trying to expand them.
Gitmo is a crime against humanity?
LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Quick question. In order to be a crime against humanity, wouldnt it have to involve actual human beings as victims?
Have to ask him---I have no clue what he is going on about.
I suspect I am not alone.
Sadly, true.
C.I.A. Torture Left Scars on Guantánamo Prisoner
If you think waterboarding is fun and funny, I heartily encourage you to get someone to do it to you.
What qualifies a person as being a human being? Your beliefs that others are less deserving of respect and human rights protections is what causes atrocities such as the Holocaust. How many people will be irreparably harmed before you stop listening to your emotions and be driven by an instinct for revenge? Can others do the same to you, or is this action a one-way street?
I never said it was fun.
And it was never necessary for Obama to close Gitmo to accomplish that.
All it took was an order from him.
The victims of the Holocaust were not animals and subhumans but the perpetrators certainly were . Those that would cut off someones head or burn them alive or crucify children certainly are. Those that hijack and fly airplanes into buildings killing thousands of victims, those that plant bombs in crowded market places to kill innocent people are subhumans. I have no problem locking the terrorists for eternity . I have no issue with them living under harsh conditions. I often wonder why you and others like you can have sympathy and compassion for the terrorist scum
Seems we have an "Axe" problem. Time to pass legislation banning "Long Handled" axes huh !
Gosh ….. Hindsight ?
Seems ya shoulda been paying for Health insurance BEFORE you all got sick.
What a concept huh !
Procrastination at it's finest I'd say.
Axes don't chop down trees, people do.../s
Time to post a reward and prosecute.
Presume much?
We DO pay for health insurance.
What's the term people who classify another group of people non-human and therefore deserving of extermination, again, episette? There's a word for them. I just can't think of it right now.
By perpetrators, you're referring to those who decided their victims weren't human and therefore deserved extermination. These were monsters who would say of those victims, for example:
Look familiar, ark?
There you go defending terrorist scum again . It that since they hate America so much you consider them al
Just Now ?
If you had led with DID and DO, I might have believed you !
Not so much based on that response.
Adding lies to the horrible self-portrait you've already given us doesn't help your case much, ark, but it's completely reduced you to pure babbling in that second mess of what was meant to be a sentence above.
Funny how you think that to be a sarcastic statement !
People are never at fault. The Tool ALWAYS tell "People" them what to do.....right ? (Facepalm Face)
Just like a wall ALWAYS "Draw" people in. LOL !
[Deleted]
You are still standing up for terrorists.
Why?
Actually no, been with the same plan since the ACA passed.
I could not care less whether you believe me or not.
BTW, perhaps reading more carefully would help.
I knew it !
You weren't paying Shit until then.
Were you "Sick" before ACA …….. Or did you just become "Sick" after ACA ?
That's not necessarily the case. Do remember that the ACA forced insurers to cancel millions of perfectly good plans at the time.
Ahhh, hysterical and ridiculously false smears--the last desperate gasp of a completely failed case. It's become your trademark, ark.
Nothing hysterical nor false in my statement but your lack of a specific denial does speak volumes .
I believe calling your desperate smear false is a denial but comments from you don't really merit any response. I did you a courtesy you did not deserve. NFO.
Just because you say it's false does not make it so. It seems like a very accurate statement to me
The "case" I was commenting with....Didn't bring up any such thing....sooooo…..I commented based on information given.
Let me quote and paraphrase someone whom you might know: " Just because it seems very accurate to you does not make it so."
ark, I don't know why you like to make it so easy for me to take you apart but don't think I'm not appreciative.
Again, I suggest you READ MORE CAREFULLY! I said we had been on the same plan since the start of the ACA, NOT that we weren't COVERED before the ACA. In FACT, my wife worked for the Federal government before the ACA.
No but my wife was and NOW we don't have to worry about paying higher premiums because of EITHER of our 'pre-existing' conditions.
BTFW, put your air quotes were the sun don't shine.
Not even close not even a scratch on me. I think I'll end this now and I am tired of waiting for you to disprove the truth of my comment .
Did you hear, there's now a caravan forming in the Honduras and they'll be here soon, according to the shitstain in chief
Dulay was looking for a link to Jack's fraudulent claim about Medicare fraud and you posted a link to the thesaurus.
Duh
Not quite that much, but LOADS of lost money, for sure.
https://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/medicare-fraud-costs-taxpayers-60...
https://www.forbes.com/sites/merrillmatthews/2012/05/31/medicare...
www.medicare.gov › Forms, help, & resources
EXACTLY !
"NOT that we weren't COVERED before the ACA."
There was a reason for that huh. (Snicker Face)
Did you hear ?????
The "Media" is reporting it without naming Trump at all ! (Facepalm Face)
You stated:
That was a lie.
There is a reason for that huh.
No it wasn't.
If it truly was, it wouldn't have taken you this long to think up an "EXCUSE" to call it a lie ! It would have been the first thing you posted as a retort and THEN....said it was a LIE !
Are you LYING to me now ?
Oh sweetie...... calling widely publicized factual information "fraudulent".....bless your heart.
Medicare fraud and waste in 2016 was $60 billion, according to the Kaiser Foundation.
That doesn't include Medicaid. DHS says that loss rate is 11-12% also.
Some studies put the combined number as high as $272 billion.
No, it was Rump who said it, the caravan from the Honduras and the media reported it.
So TRUMP was RIGHT !
Got it !
Choices were made by insurance companies if their plans didn't cover basic things, the same things that were missing from worthless policies people paid for but didn't cover things when they came up. It happened all the time. But don't call the CHOICES made by many companies compulsory, it is far more complicated than that. Here is a link to some of the lies and myths. This kind of thing happens when corporations and individuals value profit from sick people over healthcare, and have no moral qualms with that choice. Overall the ACA benefited far more Americans than it screwed. Some states mucked it up purposefully, hurting their people. Far more egregious.
Insurers were not allowed to continue offering non-grandfathtered plans sold between the signing of the act in 2010 and the implementation of the exchanges on 1-1-14.
Most of the plans covered basic things. Everything from the flu to cancer to heart disease to prescriptions to broken bones to mental health. Most plans did not cover maternity or covered it as an option. Most plans did not offer unlimited lifetime benefits (because it's totally unnecessary) and preventative care usually had a copay. No plans offered $700 of pediatric dental coverage.
But the real issue was that those plans were all medically underwritten, so the risk pools were full of reasonably healthy people and therefore the premiums were less. The Obama Administration would not allow people to keep those plans because the premiums on "metallic" plans would have been even higher.
The idea that policies were "worthless" is just idiotic DailyKos style nonsense. Insurance has been a highly regulated industry for decades. People were covered for the things detailed in the policy itself....like cancer, heart disease, accidents, immune disorders and the vast majority of other conditions. Millions of Americans are still on grandfathered policies, issued prior to the signing of the ACA, and those policies cover all sorts of ailments quite nicely. Nobody seems to call the "worthless"..... Hmmmmmm.........
It certainly did not happen all the time. ACA supporters frequently point to policies being rescinded, but that has only ever been legal if the insured has made material misrepresentations when obtaining the coverage in the first place, and was never a widespread practice.
If you purchased an individual health plan between March 23, 2010 and December 31, 2013, your insurer did not have the option to renew that policy on Jan 1, 2014. When the "choice" in question is to "comply with federal law or not", that's officially "compulsory.
It's exceedingly complicated, yes.
Good link. You'll notice it does not address this specific issue.
Canceling perfectly good medical policies on generally healthy people is in fact the antithesis of what you describe.
It certainly helped some people. It hurt many more, in ways that most casual observers will never realize. It has created a system that violates sound actuarial principles. ACA defenders bury their head in the sand and pretend this didn't happen, but had the tables been reversed they'd be screaming.
Yes it was.
I haven't posted any 'excuses'.
Yes. /s
"Half a truth is often a great lie."
Benjamin Franklin
Zero truth is always a lie.
Me.
Meet Dulay !
I'm not your sweetie.
The entire country should prove a point by starting a campaign to send millions of individual Lego bricks to the White House.
Then get a high school team to build a model of the southern border and take the Legos and try to build a "wall" over the various harsh terrain.
Just to prove in real time that it won't work on any scale.
Seizing private lands across several states and looking at thousands of lawsuits is the biggest deterrent of all.
We should not allow reality to get in the way of Trump's current self-made fiasco,
We should not allow congressional Democrats, American haters, and illegal invaders to get in the way of national security
national security ?
How many americans die each year at the hands of illegals ?
over 540,000 people die each year in America from alcohol and tobacco that's your national crisis right there unless your into securing the dead.
[Deleted]
I think my sacrifice has been quite enough I lost ALL of my immediate family to alcoholism including my two younger siblings. I see no one too upset about my losses and No one doing a damn thing to stop it from happening over and over to others.
Just the opposite, deadly booze and cigs at every convenience store in America. Meanwhile the non deadly alternative marijuana is still illegal in most of america and not properly integrated anywhere in america.
Go figure. Build a wall, Build it huge... people will still be dropping dead more from booze and tobacco in this country than even if ya let in anyone who wants to come here.
I lost respect for America and our leaders long ago. They all play us against each other for their gain. Money is king here and we are but pawns in the rich people's world.
Good Luck America.
[Deleted]
My dad, one of my uncles and youngest brother died as a direct result of alcoholism, my dad at age 53 chocked to death while passed out on his own vomit after a night of heavy drinking. My brother ( 23 years old) hit a tree after he decided to drive home drunk from a bar. My uncle died ( 58) from Cirrhosis of the liver due to alcohol.
Do you seriously think that's an excuse for not having stricter border security?
It's not my fault or yours we both had alcoholic family members.
First I'm sorry for your losses. Alcoholism sucks. I'm fortunate not of have been one of the millions it's claimed myself perhaps you are as well.
As far as the border I'm all for having a secure border and always have been,
I'd actually like to see a joint effort between us and mexico to fund a long lasting secure border, with fencing where reasonable and good surveillance where the physical fence is unreasonable. I think most Americans would also agree.
The Problem is in how we pay for it all, that's really always been the problem. Many leaders have tried to raise the funding and many have succeeded in raising Part of what is needed overall. As time goes on of course it t gets more expensive so it gets harder to raise the funds. also we really do have less people crossing illegally.
But here comes trump the's gonna fix it. anyway he think he needs to do it. Always a grandiose fix though, TRUMP.
First it was the WALL now its build it TODAY... when this man actually backs off of his grandiose ideas and actions his solutions can be made to be realistic,
Funding is whats really needed, But how trump is out to get that funding I do not agree with, neither his ways or means of accomplishing it. (I rarely do with this man)
My hope is that that is once again that is the case with immigration. He'll back off somewhat and reason will prevail. We'll see. Time will tell.
DAMN
I hate it when someone says something to me and I can't "Hear"it.
(I looked back I think I did, Thank you for not "poofing" my reply)
That's why I dont like stuff taken down against me, I reply for myself just fine.
Got it though, COC... nuff said.
Due to alcoholism being prevalent in my family I never touched it not going take a chance on becoming an alcoholic
Medicare for all would cost Nearly $1.4 trillion a year, Democrats are all for it, but can't come up with Trumps request of $ 5 billion for a wall,
"I'd actually like to see a joint effort between us and mexico to fund a long lasting secure border, with fencing where reasonable and good surveillance"
Then you say "the physical fence is unreasonable" Does that mean you were for a fence before Trump wanted it?
whats amatter, can't someone use the GOP's playbook on Obama /?
Too bad people dont use the words that actually mean what they want to say.
Trump calls for a wall. even the border patrol does not want a wall they can not see thru.
you say "the physical fence is unreasonable" Where ?
I have always thought a fence where reasonable was a good idea, that along with patrols and technology should be able to stop almost any thing or anyone crossing illegally.
IF and when trump starts using proper wording he may have more of a chance of succeeding without alienating so many.
In reality: An apple is still an apple, a wall is still a wall and a fence is still (Ya guessed it) A FENCE.
Every single Homeland Security, CR or Consolidated Appropriations bill has had funding for border fencing, including the on that Trump signed by Trump in March of 2018.
The sad irony about funding is that neither the DHS or CBP has chosen a 'barrier design' nor have they put a COST on building that barrier. The 2018 GAO report on 'the WALL' eviscerates the CBP for it's failure to follow DHS's OWN funding processes and procedures.
You forgot the 'most of the WALL has been built and it's doing a great job' despite the FACT that NO WALL has been built.
IMHO, what's needed to happen BEFORE funding is a NONE partisan evaluation on what REALLY works and a cost/benefit evaluation be conducted. Unless and until Trump and his minions STOP 'parsing' words, stops cherry picking data and stops basing national security decisions purely on campaign promises, it will be impossible to trust there posits on this issue.
I would agree, but I think that really has pretty much been done already. Border Portal knows what they need and where. trump don't care, he's got to reinvent the wheel, preferably wth the trump name stamped somewhere on it.
Yet the GAO reports states clearly that it hasn't been. Trump and the CBP spent MILLIONS on prototypes of 'a WALL' that didn't meet it's own stated specs. They spent MILLIONS more on prototypes that STILL didn't meet their specs. That tells me that they didn't do a 'cost/benefit evaluation' on the prototypes and from everything that I have read, merely rubber stamped the funding as a Trump vanity project.
Yet Trump brought the head of the CBP Union to his 'news conference' and this, in part, is what he said:
I wholeheartedly agree with you that people should use the words that the mean. Trump says WALL, the head of the CBP union says WALL, yet we ALL know it's a FENCE, even in Naco, AZ.
So IMHO, Trump and the head of the CBP union need to STOP insulting the intelligence of the American people. As you said: "a wall is still a wall and a fence is still (Ya guessed it) A FENCE."
Exactly. For Trump, as long as his base believes the BS he slings, FACTS don't matter. The LAST thing Trump want's to admit is that every foot of border FENCING that has been built under his watch has been of the SAME design and material as the FENCING that was built in 2013. All of his 'grandiose' blathering has had NO EFFECT on what is actually being built on the border. Trump has done little except to waste funds and lie.
I dont doubt that, I was actually talking pre-trump when the border patrol used the correct words like most of us do. They know what works, they just need more of it.
every foot of border FENCING that has been built under his watch has been of the SAME design and material as the FENCING that was built in 2013.
That is the "NONE partisan evaluation" I was referring to that I think has pretty much been done worked out.
Seems we're pretty much on the same page. LOL
Dump trump, go back to sanity.
If only it were that easy. It pissed me off that Trump traipsed CBP agents into the press conference. They should not be so partisan and should NEVER pretend that their members support Trump's vanity project. Especially when their own documents PROVE that to be a lie.
Just another flaw of the mans personalty, he manipulates anyone around him to his will. as any good dictator does. trump may not be a dictator but he plays one in the oval office. and worse yet this really isn't just a reality show on network television, its real life folks.
What BS
Has Trump come up with a way to PAY for the 5 BILLION? I'm not talking about his fabricated crap about trade deals, I'm talking about a REAL proposal.
No he has not, he just WANTS it and HE WANTS IT NOW, male version of Veruca Salt
They passed some laws, but the illegal invaders kept a coming because the liberals wouldn't enforce the laws the said they were for.
The prez made rules but the liberal courts overturned them, they were convinced illegals had to stay.
They spread some lies to make illegals look good guys, Our problems aren't coming from a place called Mexico. they're coming from congressional Democrats bend on making America fall
A wall is grandiose, unrealistic , unneeded and unwanted by the people who actually protect this county. trump wanted a monument, let his ass buy it then. We already owe our government too much as individuals each and Mexico told trump to go fuck himself and his wall long ago.
We already approved, are building and are paying for a fence. IF trump wants a wall, he can pay for it.
I'll buy it for him,
10' x 10' with a shtter n a bunk bed and a BUBBA
Just start a Go Fund Me Page.
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Rollin in.....
LOL
ICE wants it, border patrol wants it and the majority of people living on the Mexican border want it. Have you seen the walls around Nancy Pelosi's and Chuck Schumer's homes? I haven't heard of either one of them leaving the gates open for uninvited guest.
If Trump wanted a 3 foot high wood picket fence Democrats would say that's racist
ICE has nothing to do with it. The Border Patrol wants more agents first, and a mixture of fence and technology
The "people on the border" are not united in what they want, but generaly want to control these projects locally.
No, because they don't have walls.........
This is Pelosi's real home, complete with protesters, not some picture of a walled palace meme circulating on the internet.
Chuck Schumer has an apartment in the Park Slope Apts much to the chagrin of his neighbors in Brooklyn NY. Again, no wall.
It's a high rise apartment building, but there are tiny fences around the street side trees
This is the "Queen Anne" a mansion a few blocks away from Pelosis home but within view.
Pelosi and her husband Paul own a vineyard on Zinfandel Lane in St. Helena, California.
The above and below is a Google satellite view of the property:
Sorry I cant help what your opinion of their opinion is.
Thanks for playing though, have a nice rest of the night, I'm off here for a time.
Good info but this is a better image.
I would not bet that that low stone wall goes around all 65 acres.
Looks like something decorative and judging by the mail box, something an average person could step over.
BTW it's only along Zinfandel Lane, not the rest of the property although there is deer netting around many of the grape vines.
Trump Says He Could Invoke Emergency Powers To Build Wall Without Congress
“I can do it if I want. … We can call a national emergency because of the security of our country, absolutely,”
Please do, stop pussy footing around grow a pair and get that pen out.
You are president do what ever you feel like.... PLEASE !
Of Course there will be no negative reaction you are king.
Americans loved to be forced.
LOL, ass hat ! maga