How the El Paso Gunman Echoed The Words of Right-Wing Pundits

  
Via:  john-russell  •  2 weeks ago  •  106 comments

How the El Paso Gunman Echoed The Words of Right-Wing Pundits
An extensive New York Times review of popular right-wing media platforms found hundreds of examples of language, ideas and ideologies that overlapped with the mass killer's written statement -- a shared vocabulary of intolerance that stokes fears centered on immigrants of color. The programs, on television and radio, reach an audience of millions.

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T


How the El Paso Gunman Echoed The Words of Right-Wing Pundits


https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/08/11/business/media/el-paso-killer-conservative-media.html



Tucker Carlson went on his prime-time Fox News show in April last year and told his viewers not to be fooled. The thousands of Central Americans on their way to the United States were "border jumpers," not refugees, he said. "Will anyone in power do anything to protect America this time," he asked, "or will leaders sit passively back as the invasion continues?"


When another group approached the border six months later, Ann Coulter, appearing as a guest on Jeanine Pirro's Fox News show, offered a dispassionately violent suggestion about what could be done to stem the flow of migrants: "You can shoot invaders."


A few days after, Rush Limbaugh issued a grim prognosis to his millions of radio listeners: If the immigrants from Central America weren't stopped, the United States would lose its identity. "The objective is to dilute and eventually eliminate or erase what is known as the distinct or unique American culture," Mr. Limbaugh said, adding: "This is why people call this an invasion."


There is a striking degree of overlap between the words of right-wing media personalities and the language used by the Texas man who confessed to killing 22 people at a Walmart in El Paso this month. In a 2,300-word screed posted on the website 8chan, the killer wrote that he was "simply defending my country from cultural and ethnic  replacement  brought on by an invasion."



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It remains unclear what, or who, ultimately shaped the views of the white, 21-year-old gunman, or whether he was aware of the media commentary. But his post contains numerous references to "invasion" and cultural " replacement " -- ideas that, until recently, were relegated to the fringes of the nationalist right.


An extensive New York Times review of popular right-wing media platforms found hundreds of examples of language, ideas and ideologies that overlapped with the mass killer's written statement -- a shared vocabulary of intolerance that stokes fears centered on immigrants of color. The programs, on television and radio, reach an audience of millions.


In the four years since Mr. Trump electrified Republican voters with slashing comments about Muslims and Mexicans, demonizing references to immigrants have become more widespread in the news media, the Times review found.


Sometimes the hosts are repeating the president's signature phrases. Sometimes the president appears to take his cues from television pundits. The cumulative effect is a public dialogue in which denigrating sentiments about immigrants are common.


Before the first groups of Central American migrants received heavy news media coverage in 2018, words like "invaders" or "invasion" were rarely used by American outlets. In the last year, the use of such terms has surged, with references to an immigrant "invasion" appearing on more than 300 Fox News broadcasts. The vast majority of those were spoken by Fox News hosts and guests, but some included clips of Mr. Trump using that language at rallies and other public appearances.


The Times analysis examined the last five years of show transcripts from Fox News, CNN and MSNBC to measure the frequency of terms like "invasion" and " replacement ." Segments that included this language were verified by watching clips of the shows to determine whether hosts and guests were speaking in their own words or reporting on the language of others.


"It's a bit of a vicious cycle," said the conservative writer William Kristol, a Republican critic of Mr. Trump's who has worked at Fox News and other networks. "Something is said on Fox News, and Trump repeats it, and that legitimizes it -- and then someone else goes a little further."


He added, "The use of what once would have been viewed as really extreme and inappropriate and sometimes conspiratorial, sometimes dehumanizing language is really striking."


While the notion of immigrants as a national threat was a feature of the conservative Patrick Buchanan's unsuccessful bids to win the Republican presidential nominations in 1992 and 1996 (he used the phrase "illegal invasion" then), they ran counter to the Republican Party's efforts to make itself more appealing to Hispanics and other minorities in the two decades before Mr. Trump became its front-runner.


The portrayal of immigration as a menace has returned with force, a shift brought on not just by radio and TV hosts, but by Republican leaders in Congress and the president himself. This year Mr. Trump has used the terms "invasion" or "invaded" seven times on Twitter to describe the situation at the border, at one point referring to the approach of the migrants as "the attempted Invasion of Illegals." At rallies, he has injected terms like "predator," "killer," and "animal" in his descriptions of immigrants.


The Trump-friendly media world -- from outlets like Sinclair Broadcast Group and The Drudge Report to platforms like Breitbart News and Gateway Pundit -- has used similar incendiary rhetoric. "The fact of the matter is that this is an attempted invasion of our country -- period," Boris Epshteyn, a former Trump campaign adviser, said last year in a commentary on migrants that aired on nearly 200 Sinclair television stations.


At the start of the El Paso suspect's screed, he refers to the "great  replacement ," a white supremacist conspiracy theory based on a French book that claims the migration of minority groups can lead to a "genocide" of white culture.


The El Paso suspect, who confessed to the mass shooting last week, claimed in the document he posted to be defending against a "Hispanic invasion of Texas." The words "invasion" and "invaders" appear six times in the text, a stark parallel to the language heard on conservative television and talk radio today.


Before the El Paso shootings, others with deadly or hateful motives used the same language.


The  replacement  theory was prominent in a document posted on 8chan by the suspect in the massacre that killed 51 people in a mosque in Christchurch, New Zealand, in March.


The man who is alleged to have killed 11 people in a Pittsburgh synagogue last October had expressed his contempt for "invaders" before he opened fire on the congregation with an AR-15-style assault rifle, the authorities say. During the white supremacist demonstrations in Charlottesville, Va., in 2017 that left one woman dead, marchers shouted, "You will not replace us."


Lawrence Rosenthal, a professor at the Berkeley Center for Right-Wing Studies, said that the shared vocabulary of white nationalists and many prominent conservatives was chilling. "Where that intersects with the Republican Party today," he added, "is the Republican argument that the Democrats are in favor of immigration because that will give them a permanent majority."


Mr. Limbaugh, whose syndicated radio show has a weekly audience of 15 million, has trafficked in similar themes. "Why does the left want this invasion? Why do they want it to come?" he asked in June 2018. "This invasion is a means of transforming the country."


On Wednesday, responding to the El Paso shootings, Mr. Limbaugh said, "What is it about the word 'invasion' that so bothers these people? Is it because that's what it is? Have we ever seen anything like this?"


On Fox News, Mr. Carlson has proffered a version of this idea, albeit in less extreme language than that of the 8chan message boards where the El Paso killer lurked. "I'm for Americans, and nobody cares about them," the host said on his show in March, pushing back against criticism that he was anti-immigrant. "It's like, 'Shut up, you're dying. We're going to replace you."'


Mr. Carlson, whose show averages about three million viewers a night, has featured guests who subscribe to the  replacement  theory, like Peter Szijjarto, the foreign minister to Hungary's nationalistic president, Viktor Orban. In February, Mr. Carlson and Mr. Szijjarto discussed the need to increase birthrates in their respective countries. Otherwise, Mr. Carlson said, "our plan here in the West is to just let the depressed people die off and replace them with people from other countries."


Another prime-time Fox News host, Laura Ingraham, who was considered for a communications job in the Trump administration, has used similar language. Last October, she warned viewers that their opinions "will have zero impact and zero influence on a House dominated by Democrats who want to replace you, the American voters, with newly amnestied citizens and an ever-increasing number of chain migrants."


Fox News had no comment.


The overlap between fringe ideology and the words of conservative talk show hosts is not accidental, critics say. "They're putting that into the zeitgeist," said Carl Cameron, the former chief political correspondent for Fox News, who now works for a news aggregator aimed at a progressive audience, Front Page Live. "Fox goes out and looks for stuff that is inherently on fire and foments fear and anger," Mr. Cameron added.


The use of "invasion" and "invaders" has also surfaced on outlets away from right-wing media. The Times review of demonizing terms for immigrants found a spike in such terms in 2018 on CNN and MSNBC, but almost exclusively in the context of reporting how leading conservatives had been using such language.


Fox News, it should be noted, is not monolithic. While its prime-time lineup of Mr. Carlson, Sean Hannity and Ms. Ingraham is devoted to right-wing commentary, some of the network's news reporters, like the anchor Shepard Smith, have taken pains to refute misleading language about migrants. Chris Wallace, the "Fox News Sunday" host, recently grilled the White House chief of staff, Mick Mulvaney, about the racism inherent in Mr. Trump's critical remarks about Baltimore.


Days after the El Paso massacre, Mr. Carlson said on-air that white supremacy was "actually not a real problem in America" and likened it to a "hoax." His words ignited widespread criticism, including from fellow conservative commentators like Erick Erickson and a Fox News weekend anchor, Arthel Neville.


The next night, Mr. Carlson returned to his show and urged his critics to "calm down," warning about the roiling divisions in the country, before announcing that he was leaving on a vacation that he and Fox News said had been previously planned.

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JohnRussell
1  seeder  JohnRussell    2 weeks ago

Right wing media has been stoking fear and hate for years. They are proud of that fact too. 

 
 
 
WallyW
1.1  WallyW  replied to  JohnRussell @1    2 weeks ago

Just another wacky conspiracy theory.

Get some fresh material.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
1.1.1  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  WallyW @1.1    2 weeks ago

Please dont troll my articles. 

 
 
 
XDm9mm
1.2  XDm9mm  replied to  JohnRussell @1    2 weeks ago
Right wing media has been stoking fear and hate for years.

As 'reported' by a FAR LEFT rag tabloid devoid of any sense of actually 'reporting' the news as opposed to fabricating what they want to be news.

And the left wonders why intelligent people laugh at their abject fear of Trump and the right.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
1.2.1  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  XDm9mm @1.2    2 weeks ago
And the left wonders why intelligent people laugh at their abject fear of Trump and the right

The majority of Americans are intelligent, which is why the majority has never approved of this monumental moron in the white house. And it truly is a hilarious time when many right wing conservatives view "The National Enquirer" as trusted news and the "New York Times" as a supposed "far left rag tabloid". The right truly live in their own warped universe devoid of facts, logic and reason.

 
 
 
Don Overton
1.2.2  Don Overton  replied to  XDm9mm @1.2    2 weeks ago

And what right wing rag did you get that out of

 
 
 
Jack_TX
1.2.3  Jack_TX  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @1.2.1    2 weeks ago
And it truly is a hilarious time when many right wing conservatives view "The National Enquirer" as trusted news and the "New York Times" as a supposed "far left rag tabloid".

I don't find it hilarious.  I find the lowering of standards dangerous and sad.

My father was a newspaper man from the early 1950s until he retired in 1997.  He became very senior, and so our family became friends with other very senior people in the industry.  I was the editor of my high school newspaper when the editor of USA Today told me that if he could tell the political views of a reporter by reading a story, he sent it back to be rewritten.

The NYT used to have similar standard.  Not anymore.

 
 
 
Heartland American
1.3  Heartland American  replied to  JohnRussell @1    2 weeks ago

What about the overlap between his manifesto and left wing tree hugging eco freakery found there that echos the so called pro science consensus.  Why isn’t that part of the manifesto not in your article?  Inconvenient facts?  

 
 
 
Don Overton
1.3.1  Don Overton  replied to  Heartland American @1.3    2 weeks ago

Come on boy, put you facts  down and where you got them all, should be interesting since you haven't any facts

 
 
 
Texan1211
1.3.2  Texan1211  replied to  Don Overton @1.3.1    2 weeks ago

If you actually bothered to READ the manifesto, you wouldn't need to make such inane comments.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
2  Sean Treacy    2 weeks ago

Putitng aside the silliness of basing the case of building the “analysis” on a handful of words out of a 2400 word screed, why are large parts of his political rantings ignored?

oh yeah, because they are standard progressive talking points.

Fear of automation tAking jobs, calls for a universal basic income, urban sprawl, protecting watersheds, sustainability, health care, fear that the US was being ruled by unchecked corporations,  etc.... whole swaths of the manifesto could have been lifted from The New York Times.

He was, as he said himself, inspired by the Christchurch shooter.  Or one can look at his writing on automation requiring a universal basic income and write an analysis claiming he was inspired by progressives on NT, who’ve often made similar claims.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
2.2  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @2    2 weeks ago

Sean, he drove 900 miles in order to kill Mexicans on the border, not shoot up a corporate office. 

 
 
 
Texan1211
2.2.1  Texan1211  replied to  JohnRussell @2.2    2 weeks ago
Sean, he drove 900 miles in order to kill Mexicans on the border, not shoot up a corporate office.

That was necessary if he wanted to kill them on the border. Otherwise, he could have just driven a few miles.

Just further proof how crazy he was---ALMOST as crazy as people trying to blame the right wing for this lunatic's actions!

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
2.2.2  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  Texan1211 @2.2.1    2 weeks ago

In addition to driving 900 miles to murder Mexicans, I feel pretty sure he chose El Paso to insure maximum media coverage as well. It should be noted that almost all mass shootings in this country have taken place in or very near to large metropolitan areas to insure said coverage in their eyes.

 
 
 
r.t..b...
2.2.3  r.t..b...  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @2.2.2    2 weeks ago
he chose El Paso to insure maximum media coverage as well.

I don't know, if twenty plus people were slaughtered while shopping at a Wal-Mart in Douglas, or Pocatello, or anywhere else for that matter, it would garner the same coverage. His purpose and targets seem pretty clear.

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
2.2.4  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  r.t..b... @2.2.3    2 weeks ago

Eventually, you are probably correct but Douglas is two hours South of Tucson where the closest media outlets are. It would take them a while to get here. My impression is that he wanted near instant coverage but I could be wrong.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
2.2.5  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @2.2.2    2 weeks ago
In addition to driving 900 miles to murder Mexicans, I feel pretty sure he chose El Paso to insure maximum media coverage as well. It should be noted that almost all mass shootings in this country have taken place in or very near to large metropolitan areas to insure said coverage in their eyes.

I'm pretty sure that Dallas, the area he started from, is a larger metro and a larger media market than ElPaso. 

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
2.2.6  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  JohnRussell @2.2.5    2 weeks ago

That kid was totally Looney Toons to begin with. No way to really be sure what his ultimate thinking processes were.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
2.2.7  Jack_TX  replied to  JohnRussell @2.2.5    2 weeks ago
I'm pretty sure that Dallas, the area he started from, is a larger metro and a larger media market than ElPaso. 

You would be correct.   Much, much, much larger.

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
2.2.8  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  JohnRussell @2.2.5    2 weeks ago

True, but El Paso is right on the border.

 
 
 
lib50
2.3  lib50  replied to  Sean Treacy @2    2 weeks ago

It all comes down to fear.  Trump uses fear to invoke intense feelings in people, and some of them are a little off their nut.  Its the same fear certain groups fall prey to more and more over the years.  Who is more likely to act on their fears?  Trump takes full advantage and could not care less about the unintended consequences.  In this case, the shooter's fear of 'invaders' was at the top of his concerns.  No way to shine that turd.

 
 
 
MUVA
2.3.1  MUVA  replied to  lib50 @2.3    2 weeks ago

No to everything you posted it is conjecture at best.

 
 
 
lib50
2.3.2  lib50  replied to  MUVA @2.3.1    2 weeks ago

Then put up your argument.  I'm right.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
2.3.3  Trout Giggles  replied to  lib50 @2.3    2 weeks ago

Fear...the number one emotion conservatives like to use to sway people. Remember 9/11? People that I thought were strong and brave were asking for figurative blankies

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
2.3.4  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Trout Giggles @2.3.3    2 weeks ago
Fear...the number one emotion conservatives like to use to sway people.

Yup. Fear of Muslims, fear of homosexuals, fear of atheists, fear of rejection, fear of no longer being in control, fear of diversity, fear of their children not adopting their same fears.

 
 
 
Sparty On
2.3.5  Sparty On  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @2.3.4    2 weeks ago

The "fear" market is hardly cornered by the right.   In fact, the left is rockin it in that regard:

  • Fear of Christians.
  • Fear of Jews
  • Fear of white males
  • Fear of heterosexuals
  • Fear of guns
  • Fear of not being able to control others
  • Fear of teaching real history
  • Fear of teaching real civics
  • Fear of self reliance
  • Fear of accountability
  • Fear of any people who are not of like mind
  • Fear of independence from government
  • Fear of any freedom that relates to any of the topics noted above

Whole lotta fear mongering coming from the left .....

 
 
 
lib50
2.3.6  lib50  replied to  Sparty On @2.3.5    2 weeks ago

As usual those talking points are fake, and total projection.  You must have gotten that straight from Trump, who lies and accuses others of exactly what he is doing himself.  

  • Fear of Christians.           NOPE
  • Fear of Jews          NOPE
  • Fear of white males    LOL, NOPE but think gop has big fear of women.
  • Fear of heterosexuals   NOPE
  • Fear of guns       NOPE
  • Fear of not being able to control others    NOPE, live & let live, wish cons would
  • Fear of teaching real history      NOPE, total projection
  • Fear of teaching real civics       NOPE 
  • Fear of self reliance      NOPE, pay more taxes than Trump 
  • Fear of accountability    YOU MISTAKE US FOR TRUMP
  • Fear of any people who are not of like mind      UH,  FOX, FFS!
  • Fear of independence from government   WHO WANTS TO CONTROL UTERI?
  • Fear of any freedom that relates to any of the topics noted above   SPEAK FOR YOURSELF
 
 
 
Jack_TX
2.3.7  Jack_TX  replied to  lib50 @2.3    2 weeks ago
It all comes down to fear.

And anger.

  Trump uses fear to invoke intense feelings in people, and some of them are a little off their nut.

He simply tells people what they want to hear.  He's frankly stolen a page from Bernie's playbook.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
2.3.8  Jack_TX  replied to  Trout Giggles @2.3.3    2 weeks ago
Fear...the number one emotion conservatives like to use to sway people.

I really think you're underestimating anger.

 
 
 
Sparty On
2.3.9  Sparty On  replied to  lib50 @2.3.6    2 weeks ago

Wow .... the denial is strong in this one.

Good luck with that .... you're really gonna need it next year.  

2020 is going to make 2016 seem like a picnic for denial ridden liberals.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
2.3.10  Trout Giggles  replied to  Jack_TX @2.3.8    2 weeks ago

No...I'm not. I witnessed 2 road rage incidents in under an hour this morning. People are pissed off, there's no doubt about it

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
2.3.11  Trout Giggles  replied to  lib50 @2.3.6    2 weeks ago

the only thing I'm afraid of are scorpions

 
 
 
Don Overton
2.4  Don Overton  replied to  Sean Treacy @2    2 weeks ago

[Discuss articles not members.]

 
 
 
freepress
3  freepress    2 weeks ago

Fox is never going to admit the vast majority of their "news" happens to be nothing but opinion based pundits spouting off right wing talking points.

Advertisers seem to get it since when these right wing nuts go overboard on their rhetoric they pull their advertising because the  words Fox pundits use are offensive to the majority of decent human beings.

 
 
 
XDm9mm
3.1  XDm9mm  replied to  freepress @3    2 weeks ago
Fox is never going to admit the vast majority of their "news" happens to be nothing but opinion based pundits spouting off right wing talking points.

Had you said the 'New York Times', you actually would have been correct.  Although you could have substituted MSNBC, NBC, CBS, The Washington Post and a plethora of other media outlets for Fox and you still would have been correct.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
3.1.1  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  XDm9mm @3.1    2 weeks ago

"Conservatives "  regularly say that they believe Donald Trump tells the truth. 

That is really all one needs to know about which side is on the right side of right and wrong. "Conservatives" are happy that he attacks their "enemy" so they totally forgive his endless lies and hate mongering.

Then, on internet forums, we see an endless parade of bamboozling attempts to try and muddy up the issue. 

 
 
 
Don Overton
3.1.2  Don Overton  replied to  XDm9mm @3.1    2 weeks ago

[Deleted]

 
 
 
MrFrost
3.2  MrFrost  replied to  freepress @3    2 weeks ago
Fox is never going to admit the vast majority of their "news" happens to be nothing but opinion based pundits spouting off right wing talking points.

Bingo.. They are not even classified as a news source and they are banned in Canada. They are nothing but fake news. 

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2.1  Texan1211  replied to  MrFrost @3.2    2 weeks ago
they are banned in Canada.

Oh, FFS.

You actually BELIEVE that nonsense?

For real, dude?

PLEASE tell me your fingers slipped or that you had a seizure or something, not that you fell for that crap!

SMMFH

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/canadian-fox

https://www.politifact.com/.../2014/jul/14/facebook-posts/fox-news-banned-canada

What WON'T you fall for?

 
 
 
Dean Moriarty
4  Dean Moriarty    2 weeks ago

When I read the manifesto the first thing I noticed was that he was parroting much of what JR has been seeding here for years. It is possible left wing media had a big influence on him. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
4.1  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Dean Moriarty @4    2 weeks ago

see 2.2 

 
 
 
Sparty On
4.1.1  Sparty On  replied to  JohnRussell @4.1    2 weeks ago

Have you even read his manifesto John?

 
 
 
JohnRussell
4.1.2  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Sparty On @4.1.1    2 weeks ago
Have you even read his manifesto John?

I'm the person who posted the entire manifesto on Newstalkers. What do you think? 

 
 
 
Sparty On
4.1.3  Sparty On  replied to  JohnRussell @4.1.2    2 weeks ago

I don't know, you sound like you haven't.   Thats why i asked the question.

No reason to get snarky about John.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
4.1.4  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Sparty On @4.1.3    2 weeks ago
I don't know, you sound like you haven't.

Why are you making shit up? 

 
 
 
Sparty On
4.1.5  Sparty On  replied to  JohnRussell @4.1.4    2 weeks ago

I'm not.   You calling me a liar?

 
 
 
livefreeordie
4.1.6  livefreeordie  replied to  Sparty On @4.1.3    2 weeks ago

It’s obvious he only read the parts that his leftist handlers told him to read.  Otherwise he’d be aware of the quotes from the shooter in my post #5 that sound just likeJohn and the Democrats

 
 
 
Sparty On
4.1.8  Sparty On  replied to  livefreeordie @4.1.6    2 weeks ago

Yeah, now that his gambit is busted he won't respond.   Or if he does it will be this rationalization or that.

SOSDD

 
 
 
Don Overton
4.1.9  Don Overton  replied to  Sparty On @4.1.1    2 weeks ago

Have you? Or are you just blabbing

 
 
 
Don Overton
4.1.10  Don Overton  replied to  JohnRussell @4.1.4    2 weeks ago

About all he can do unfortuanately

 
 
 
Sparty On
4.1.11  Sparty On  replied to  Don Overton @4.1.9    2 weeks ago
Have you?

Yes i have and i've actually comprehended it all as well.

Such a simple task appears to out of reach for some folks here.

They prefer to pick and choose pieces/parts that might support a narrative they're pushing instead of considering the entire content.   Experts at spinning nonsensical partisan gibberish they be.

Any other questions for me today Don?   I live to help keep you well informed ....

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
4.1.12  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sparty On @4.1.11    2 weeks ago

John, sparty, lfod, and Don:

This discussion is getting too personal.  Address the topic, please.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
4.1.13  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  sandy-2021492 @4.1.12    2 weeks ago

Its funny. You feel the need to "warn" people, but fail to warn the person who started this segment of personal comments

https://thenewstalkers.com/community/discussion/47222/how-the-el-paso-gunman-echoed-the-words-of-right-wing-pundits#cm1135617 When I read the manifesto the first thing I noticed was that he was parroting much of what JR has been seeding here for years. It is possible left wing media had a big influence on him. 

How do you explain that? 

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
4.1.14  sandy-2021492  replied to  JohnRussell @4.1.13    2 weeks ago

Ok, Dean, too.  The point stands - fellow NTers are not the topic here.

 
 
 
XDm9mm
4.2  XDm9mm  replied to  Dean Moriarty @4    2 weeks ago

Apparently someone does not like the truth.  See post 4.1 immediately preceding mine here.

 
 
 
Don Overton
4.3  Don Overton  replied to  Dean Moriarty @4    2 weeks ago

Prove it  with actual media comments

 
 
 
livefreeordie
5  livefreeordie    2 weeks ago

The El Paso shooter is clearly a psych case who equally rants “talking points” from both left and right.

last time I checked my Constitution, freedom of Speech was still a fundamental American right.   

[ Deleted ]

conservatism embraces freedom of speech up to the point where “your fist hits my nose”.   Then we believe that someone who violates another’s freedom must be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

that said, let’s look at some of the shooters manifesto [ Deleted - sweeping generalization ]

Excerpts from the Manifesto

“The takeover of the United States government by unchecked  

corporations. I could write a ten page essay on all the damage these corporations have caused”

“In the near future, America will have to initiate a basic   universal income to prevent widespread poverty and civil unrest as people lose their jobs. Joblessness in itself is a source of civil unrest.”

“The American lifestyle affords our citizens an incredible quality of life. However, our lifestyle is destroying the environment of our country. The decimation of the environment is creating a massive burden for future generations. Corporations are heaing the destruction of our environment by shamelessly over harvesting resources. This has been

a problem for decades. For example, this phenomenon is brilliantly portrayed in the decades old classic “The Lorax”. Water sheds around the country, especially in agricultural areas, are being depleted. Fresh water is being polluted from farming and oil drilling operations. Consumer culture is creating thousands of tons of unnecessary plastic waste and electronic waste, and recycling to help slow this down is almost non-existent. Urban sprawl creates inefficient cities which unnecessarily destroys millions of acres of land. We even use god knows how many trees worth of paper towels just wipe water off our hands. Everything I have seen and heard in my short life has led me to believe that the average American isn’t willing to change their lifestyle, even if the changes only cause a slight inconvenience. The government is unwilling to tackle these issues beyond empty promises since they are owned by corporations.”

“Corporate America doesn’t need to be destroyed, but just   shown that they are on the wrong side of history. That if they don’t bend, they will break.”

So the next logical step is to decrease the number of people in America using resources. If we can get rid of enough people, then our way of life can become more sustainable.”

“The environment is getting worse by the year.”

“People who are hypocrites because they support imperialistic wars that have caused the loss of tens of thousands of American lives and untold numbers of civilian lives.”

https://drudgereport.com/flashtx.htm

 
 
 
Heartland American
5.1  Heartland American  replied to  livefreeordie @5    2 weeks ago

Quite a number of secular progressive and far left talking points in that shooters manifesto.  Sounds like a pro science consensus man to me.  

 
 
 
lady in black
5.1.1  lady in black  replied to  Heartland American @5.1    2 weeks ago

Better to be pro-science then faux christian

 
 
 
lib50
5.1.2  lib50  replied to  Heartland American @5.1    2 weeks ago

His TOP FEAR was 'invaders' from Mexico.  Trump has been playing on the fears of people since he was born.   Shooter drove hundreds of miles to shoot Mexicans.  That is why Trump and gop are complicit.  They use fear to motivate the base and anybody else weak and fearful.  Trying to deflect from the main point of the manifesto won't work.  Fear and hatred of immigrants drove this bus.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
5.1.3  livefreeordie  replied to  lib50 @5.1.2    2 weeks ago

Only the shooter is responsible for his actions. [deleted]

Then we’re supposedly responsible for what everyone else does 

 
 
 
Heartland American
5.1.4  Heartland American  replied to  lady in black @5.1.1    2 weeks ago

Even when they shoot people as a result of given manifesto?  

 
 
 
Don Overton
5.1.5  Don Overton  replied to  livefreeordie @5.1.3    2 weeks ago

removed for context

 
 
 
Heartland American
5.1.6  Heartland American  replied to  Don Overton @5.1.5    2 weeks ago

You mean that the shooter wasn’t responsible for his actions.  

 
 
 
lib50
5.1.7  lib50  replied to  Heartland American @5.1.6    2 weeks ago

Nobody says shooter isn't responsible.    But conservatives seem to feel Trump isn't responsible for ANYTHING he says and does.  Try dealing with 'both sides'.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
5.1.8  livefreeordie  replied to  lib50 @5.1.7    2 weeks ago

Neither Trump nor anyone else are responsible for the actions of others.   Thanks for validating my point

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
5.1.9  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  livefreeordie @5.1.8    2 weeks ago
Neither Trump nor anyone else are responsible for the actions of others.

So if you had someone show up on your front door step and say "Hey, there's some rapists trying to cross your property line! What are you gonna about it?" what are the chances you would rush to your fence line gun in hand?

Now, if they said "Hey, there's some poor immigrant families are trying to cross your property line!" you might head to the fence still toting your gun, but I'd guess you'd be less likely to shoot if you just thought it was a poor family instead of "rapists", right?

Crossing the border illegally is a misdemeanor, we should treat it no different than we do other similar misdemeanors. We do not spend millions on locking up misdemeanor offenders. We should not be telling the American people that those Mexicans, "They're rapists" as Donald Trump has done. Our President should not "assume" "some are good people", he should know most of them are good people. His words were directed at xenophobic Americans who were already riled up by the thought of brown immigrants coming into the United States, they were already radicalized to believe their imagined "white culture" was under attack. The white supremacists and violent bigots are just waiting for an excuse to act, and in this latest El Paso shooting, Trump gave it to him. Trump called them an "invasion", called them an "infestation", called them "rapists" "bringing drugs" and committing other felonies. To imagine that the heated rhetoric didn't have any effect on this right wing white supremacist extremist terrorist is to simply ignore all the facts, logic and reason. I have to wonder why anyone would defend Trumps words or the violence they inspired.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
5.1.10  livefreeordie  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @5.1.9    2 weeks ago

Sure! We should treat misdemeanors by US citizens as misdemeanors.  Illegally coming into our country by law entitles you to be immediately be deported out of our country. They are illegal invaders who do not merit the rights of citizens or legal residents.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
5.1.11  livefreeordie  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @5.1.9    2 weeks ago

Illegal immigration and helping illegal immigration are crimes subject to imprisonment.

“For the first improper entry offense, the person can be fined (as a criminal penalty), or imprisoned for up to six months, or both.

For a subsequent offense, the person can be fined or imprisoned for up to two years, or both. (See 8 U.S.C. Section 1325, I.N.A. Section 275.)

But just in case that isn’t enough to deter illegal entrants, a separate section of the law adds penalties for reentry (or attempted reentry) in cases where the person had been convicted of certain types of crimes and thus removed (deported) from the U.S., as follows:

1 People removed for a conviction of three or more misdemeanors involving drugs, crimes against the person, or both, or a felony (other than an aggravated felony), shall be fined, imprisoned for up to ten years, or both.

2 People removed for a conviction of an aggravated felony shall be fined, imprisoned for up to 20 years, or both.

3 People who were excluded or removed from the United States for security reasons shall be fined, and imprisoned for up to ten years, which sentence shall not run concurrently with any other sentence.

4 Nonviolent offenders who were removed from the United States before their prison sentence was up shall be fined, imprisoned for up to ten years, or both.

What’s more, someone deported before a prison sentence was complete may be incarcerated for the remainder of the sentence of imprisonment, without any reduction for parole or supervised release.

(See 8 U.S.C. Section 1326, I.N.A. Section 276.)

https://www.alllaw.com/articles/nolo/us-immigration/crime-enter-illegally.html

  This is the immigration reform signed by Clinton in 1996 that provides for imprisonment for helping someone come here illegally (which is every adult illegal with a child)

“Title 8, U.S.C. § 1324(a) defines several distinct offenses related to aliens. Subsection 1324(a)(1)(i)-(v) prohibits alien smuggling, domestic transportation of unauthorized aliens, concealing or harboring unauthorized aliens, encouraging or inducing unauthorized aliens to enter the United States, and engaging in a conspiracy or aiding and abetting any of the preceding acts. Subsection 1324(a)(2) prohibits bringing or attempting to bring unauthorized aliens to the United States in any manner whatsoever, even at a designated port of entry. Subsection 1324(a)(3).

Penalties -- The basic statutory maximum penalty for violating 8 U.S.C. § 1324(a)(1)(i) and (v)(I) (alien smuggling and conspiracy) is a fine under title 18, imprisonment for not more than 10 years, or both. With regard to violations of 8 U.S.C. § 1324(a)(1)(ii)-(iv) and (v)(ii), domestic transportation, harboring, encouraging/inducing, or aiding/abetting, the basic statutory maximum term of imprisonment is 5 years, unless the offense was committed for commercial advantage or private financial gain, in which case the maximum term of imprisonment is 10 years. In addition, significant enhanced penalties are provided for in violations of 8 U.S.C. § 1324(a)(1) involving serious bodily injury or placing life in jeopardy. Moreover, if the violation results in the death of any person, the defendant may be punished by death or by imprisonment for any term of years. The basic penalty for a violation of subsection 1324(a)(2) is a fine under title 18, imprisonment for not more than one year, or both, 8 U.S.C. § 1324(a)(2)(A). Enhanced penalties are provided for violations involving bringing in criminal aliens, 8 U.S.C. § 1324(a)(2)(B)(i), offenses done for commercial advantage or private financial gain, 8 U.S.C. § 1324(a)(2)(B)(ii), and violations where the alien is not presented to an immigration officer immediately upon arrival, 8 U.S.C. §  1324(a)(2)(B)(iii). A mandatory minimum three year term of imprisonment applies to first or second violations of § 1324(a)(2)(B)(i) or (B)(ii). Further enhanced punishment is provided for third or subsequent offenses.”

https://www.justice.gov/jm/criminal-resource-manual-1907-title-8-usc-1324a-offenses

Many of these illegals have been deported repeatedly. The penalties are appropriately more severe

“1912. 8 U.S.C. 1326 -- REENTRY AFTER DEPORTATION (REMOVAL)

After the amendments made by the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act (IIRIRA), subsection 1326(a) now makes it an offense for any alien who has been denied admission, excluded, deported, or removed, or has departed the United States while an order of exclusion, deportation or removal is outstanding and thereafter enters, attempts to enter, or is at any time found in the United States, unless prior to the alien's reembarkation at a place outside the United States or his application from foreign contiguous territory, the Attorney General has expressly consented to such alien's for admission, or such alien shall establish that he was not required to obtain such advance consent under the Immigration and Nationality Act or any prior Act.

The basic statutory maximum penalty for reentry after deportation is a fine under title 18, imprisonment for not more than 2 years, or both. However, with regard to an alien whose "removal" was subsequent to a conviction for commission of three or more misdemeanors involving drugs, crimes against the person, or both, or a felony (other than an aggravated felony), the statutory maximum term of imprisonment is 10 years. Moreover, if deportation was subsequent to conviction for an aggravated felony, the statutory maximum term of imprisonment is 20 years.”

https://www.justice.gov/jm/criminal-resource-manual-1912-8-usc-1326-reentry-after-deportation-removal

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
5.1.12  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @5.1.9    2 weeks ago
spend millions on locking up misdemeanor offenders

Tell that to all the potheads from the 60's 70's 80's and 90's...and even now in a lot of places.

I bet they will disagree.

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
6  igknorantzrulz    2 weeks ago

Who the hell would of ever thought, or even guessed, harping on peoples replacements, would/could end in violence...

Yea, no stokin of fear around here.

.

Trump n cump on Fux n other Far Right Conspiracy crappola,

are guilty of murder, at least accomplices, but hey, kumba ya Kelley Ann

 
 
 
Tacos!
7  Tacos!    2 weeks ago

I must have missed the episode where Tucker Carlson said we should take a rifle to the mall and spray the place with bullets.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
7.1  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Tacos! @7    2 weeks ago
I must have missed the episode where Tucker Carlson said we should take a rifle to the mall and spray the place with bullets.

Inspiring violence takes no suggestion of what violence to use, it just requires demonizing a group of people, telling everyone "They're rapists" "criminals" "drug dealers" and "MS-13 gang member". If you keep lying about a group in general, painting them all with the broad brush of villainy, it won't take long before one of the dumbest among the rabid crowd decides to take what they see as "the law" in their own hands. I've no doubt the El Paso shooter sees himself as a vigilante willing to do what so many of his conservative fellows weren't.

 
 
 
Heartland American
7.1.1  Heartland American  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @7.1    2 weeks ago

Except he was much more an eco freak progressive than anything else based on what he wrote.  

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
7.1.2  Sean Treacy  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @7.1    2 weeks ago
Inspiring violence takes no suggestion of what violence to use, it just requires demonizing a group of people

So progressives are to blame for inspiring right wing violence. Demonizing groups of people is about all progressives  do anymore.  This site proves that.  

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
7.1.3  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.1    2 weeks ago

“The Democrat party will own America and they know it. They have already begun the transition by pandering heavily to the Hispanic voting bloc in the 1st Democratic Debate,”, “the Hispanic population is willing to return to their home countries if given the right incentive. An incentive that myself and many other patriotic Americans will provide.” - El Paso shooter manifesto

Doesn't sound like a progressive Democrat to me. Sounds more like a self-declared right wing vigilante who stepped up to Donald Trumps call to push back on what they see as the "browning" of America and a diminishing of their perceived "white culture".

 
 
 
livefreeordie
7.1.4  livefreeordie  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @7.1.3    2 weeks ago

Sounds like all of the Democrat candidates and leftists like AOC

Excerpts from the Manifesto

“The takeover of the United States government by unchecked 

corporations. I could write a ten page essay on all the damage these corporations have caused”

“In the near future, America will have to initiate a basic  universal income to prevent widespread poverty and civil unrest as people lose their jobs. Joblessness in itself is a source of civil unrest.”

“The American lifestyle affords our citizens an incredible quality of life. However, our lifestyle is destroying the environment of our country. The decimation of the environment is creating a massive burden for future generations. Corporations are heaing the destruction of our environment by shamelessly over harvesting resources. This has been

a problem for decades. For example, this phenomenon is brilliantly portrayed in the decades old classic “The Lorax”. Water sheds around the country, especially in agricultural areas, are being depleted. Fresh water is being polluted from farming and oil drilling operations. Consumer culture is creating thousands of tons of unnecessary plastic waste and electronic waste, and recycling to help slow this down is almost non-existent. Urban sprawl creates inefficient cities which unnecessarily destroys millions of acres of land. We even use god knows how many trees worth of paper towels just wipe water off our hands. Everything I have seen and heard in my short life has led me to believe that the average American isn’t willing to change their lifestyle, even if the changes only cause a slight inconvenience. The government is unwilling to tackle these issues beyond empty promises since they are owned by corporations.”

“Corporate America doesn’t need to be destroyed, but just  shown that they are on the wrong side of history. That if they don’t bend, they will break.”

So the next logical step is to decrease the number of people in America using resources. If we can get rid of enough people, then our way of life can become more sustainable.”

“The environment is getting worse by the year.”

“People who are hypocrites because they support imperialistic wars that have caused the loss of tens of thousands of American lives and untold numbers of civilian lives.”

https://drudgereport.com/flashtx.htm

 
 
 
Sunshine
7.1.5  Sunshine  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @7.1.3    2 weeks ago

Well if we are going to use his words...

My opinions on automation, immigration, and the rest predate Trump and his campaign for president. I putting this here because some people will blame the President or certain presidential candidates for the attack. This is not the case

https://thefederalistpapers.org/opinion/el-paso-shooters-entire-purported-manifesto

 
 
 
Heartland American
7.1.6  Heartland American  replied to  Sean Treacy @7.1.2    2 weeks ago

That’s for sure...

 
 
 
Heartland American
7.1.7  Heartland American  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.4    2 weeks ago

“So the next logical step is to decrease the number of people inAmerica using resources. If we can get rid of enough people, then our way of life can become more sustainable.”                                 The shooters manifesto...seems like an over population motive to me.  

 
 
 
Sparty On
7.1.8  Sparty On  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.7    2 weeks ago

Just remember ...... Soylent Green is people ..... it's made out of people ........

 
 
 
Tacos!
7.1.9  Tacos!  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @7.1    2 weeks ago
it just requires demonizing a group of people

So, if you tell people that Republicans/Democrats are ruining the country, we should just expect that someone is going to get shot? I hear a lot about "toxic masculinity" lately, should I expect be gunned down in the mall just for being a man?

it won't take long

It should take forever. It should be never. Don't make excuses for these people. Nothing justifies murder. Nothing. And nobody's words "inspire" murder either. The moment you start saying this or that speech leads to a shooting, you begin to justify murder. The murderer alone is responsible for his action - not somebody else.

 
 
 
Don Overton
7.1.10  Don Overton  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.1    2 weeks ago

And you know this HOW, because you can see beyond your nose

 
 
 
Don Overton
7.1.11  Don Overton  replied to  Sunshine @7.1.5    2 weeks ago

Good Lord are you making a stretch with that piece of hooy

 
 
 
Heartland American
7.1.12  Heartland American  replied to  Don Overton @7.1.10    2 weeks ago

Because I read the parts of his manifesto that are more than a little inconvenient for the pro science consensus gang when it comes to his views on those substantial parts of his manifesto.  

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
7.1.13  Trout Giggles  replied to  Heartland American @7.1.12    2 weeks ago

Methinks that's all you read

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
7.1.14  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Sunshine @7.1.5    2 weeks ago
some people will blame the President or certain presidential candidates for the attack. This is not the case

So a direct defense of the President is supposed to prove he wasn't motivated by the Presidents words? He's basically admitting that he was motivated by the Presidents right there. He's just saying the problem he perceives existed before Trump, but the facts shows this guy didn't act on his anger towards immigrants until after Trump called them an "invasion" and an "infestation" and called all Mexicans "rapists".

 
 
 
Sunshine
7.1.15  Sunshine  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @7.1.14    2 weeks ago
So a direct defense of the President is supposed to prove he wasn't motivated by the Presidents words?

You can not cherry pick the shooters words to support your own delusional opinions. 

He said Trump was not a factor, plain and simple.

 
 
 
XDm9mm
7.1.16  XDm9mm  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @7.1.14    2 weeks ago
He's basically admitting that he was motivated by the Presidents right there

Maybe in Bizzaro world, where up is down, good is bad, light is dark and a plethora of other BIZZARO 'isms', but in the real world, nope.  He PROCLAIMED LOUDLY that the President or "certain presidential candidates" were NOT the cause of his insane attack.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
7.1.17  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  XDm9mm @7.1.16    2 weeks ago
Maybe in Bizzaro world, where up is down, good is bad, light is dark

Well that is apparently the world many conservative Trump supporters live in, a place where up is down, less people at an inauguration is actually more people, where a minority is a majority, where 12,000 lies and counting are considered truth, and where calling Mexicans "rapists" and an "infestation" isn't considered racist. This guy, using Trumps own words and citing Trump then says "But it wasn't Trump" and the gullible sycophants believe a domestic terrorist over their own eyes and ears. If you believe that I've no doubt you believe Trump never cheated on any of his three wives, never paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to keep porn stars quiet during his campaign, never ran multiple businesses into bankruptcy, never got caught refusing to rent to black Americans, never got caught running a fraudulent "University", was never accused by more than nineteen women of sexual assault, never called ally countries "shit holes", never said he and an authoritarian dictator "fell in love" and never said he believed the giant lying piece of shit murderer Putin over our own American intelligence.

That is the Bizzaro world many conservatives choose daily to inhabit and its fucking insane.

 
 
 
Heartland American
7.2  Heartland American  replied to  Tacos! @7    2 weeks ago

I missed that too.  

 
 
 
Don Overton
7.3  Don Overton  replied to  Tacos! @7    2 weeks ago

Use google

 
 
 
Tacos!
7.3.1  Tacos!  replied to  Don Overton @7.3    2 weeks ago

Zero results. Thanks for playing. Any more useless suggestions?

 
 
 
†hε pε⊕pレε'š ƒïšh
7.3.2  †hε pε⊕pレε'š ƒïšh  replied to  Tacos! @7.3.1    2 weeks ago

Yes, can you refer me to a GED class?

 
 
 
Sparty On
7.3.3  Sparty On  replied to  †hε pε⊕pレε'š ƒïšh @7.3.2    2 weeks ago

I can.

Look up Uncle Buds GED trainers and Bait shop.

Brush up on your GED knowledge and pick up some leaches to catch dinner in the same stop.

What could be better?

 
 
 
MrFrost
8  MrFrost    2 weeks ago

Even fox fake news admitted he is a white supremacist. 

 
 
 
Heartland American
8.1  Heartland American  replied to  MrFrost @8    2 weeks ago

Who is also an environmentalist nut job and secular progressive.  He’s clearly a liberal fascist.  

 
 
 
lib50
8.1.1  lib50  replied to  Heartland American @8.1    2 weeks ago

He is first and foremost a white supremacist who is afraid of Mexicans.  If environment was his first priority, explain how and why he ended up in El Paso to shoot immigrants.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.2  livefreeordie  replied to  lib50 @8.1.1    2 weeks ago

Because they are leaving filth and trash near the border

https://cis.org/Sussis/Trash-Border-Highlights-Environmental-Cost-Illegal-Immigration

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.3  livefreeordie  replied to  lib50 @8.1.1    2 weeks ago

Let American ranchers on the border speak to the reality of these invaders

https://www.usatoday.com/border-wall/story/us-ranchers-deal-with-migrants-border-crossers-mexico/559702001/

Let the truth come into the light  

Read the testimony of a woman rancher  

“Margie Damon

My ranch is 50 miles from the border. I used to see illegals every day walking thru the ranch, now not so often. I am sick & tired of repairing my fence that they have damaged, having items stolen, water faucets left on, gates left open, break ins to home & out buildings, knocking on doors at 3 am, etc. Big aggressive dogs have helped, but I still have to be armed all the time. My neighbors feel the same! We want a big wall with armed border patrol!”

https://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2018/05/arizona-border-ranchers-live-fear-illegal-immigration-crisis-worsens/

And this  

https://www.azbordertrash.gov/about.html

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
8.1.4  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  lib50 @8.1.1    2 weeks ago
If environment was his first priority, explain how and why he ended up in El Paso to shoot immigrants.

Because if he shot up a bunch of smokestacks nobody would care...

 
 
 
MrFrost
8.1.5  MrFrost  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.2    2 weeks ago
Because they are leaving filth and trash near the border

Wait, so that justifies the shooting? Really? 

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
9  Trout Giggles    2 weeks ago
A few days after, Rush Limbaugh issued a grim prognosis to his millions of radio listeners: If the immigrants from Central America weren't stopped, the United States would lose its identity. "The objective is to dilute and eventually eliminate or erase what is known as the distinct or unique American culture," Mr. Limbaugh said, adding: "This is why people call this an invasion."

Just what is distinct or unique about American culture? We are a nation of immigrants, people who brought their culture to America. Now we're a potpourri of cultures and identities and that's been going on for about 400 years

 
 
 
katrix
9.1  katrix  replied to  Trout Giggles @9    2 weeks ago

So true. Hell, the culture is very different from one part of America to the next - based in large part about which immigrants lived there first (since we're all immigrants), geography, climate, and other things.

Rush of course is referring to the distinct culture of bigotry, hatred, ignorance, anti-science, racism, fake news, misogyny, adultery, and drug use to which he subscribes.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
9.1.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  katrix @9.1    2 weeks ago
Hell, the culture is very different from one part of America to the next

I've lived in 4 distinctly different regions of the United States. Cultural differences is an understatement

 
 
 
It Is ME
10  It Is ME    2 weeks ago

" It remains unclear what, or who, ultimately shaped the views of the white, 21-year-old gunman, or whether he was aware of the media commentary."

But the likes of the New York Times is sure gonna "Plant-a-seed" in their little "Children's" heads to ponder jrSmiley_97_smiley_image.gif ....

......hmmmmmm. jrSmiley_87_smiley_image.gif

The New York Times is such a Bad Parent. BAD, BAD, BAD PARENT ! jrSmiley_92_smiley_image.png

BAD PARENT ! jrSmiley_22_smiley_image.gif

 
 
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