'Liberty State' Secessionists Peddle Their Christian Separatist Vision To Voters

  
Via:  john-russell  •  one month ago  •  68 comments

'Liberty State' Secessionists Peddle Their Christian Separatist Vision To Voters

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T


The people promoting the creation of a “Christianity-based” 51st state carved out of what is currently eastern Washington have begun moving beyond just talking about it and planning for it. Now they are promoting it to the voters they need to convince to secede from Washington state—talking to local reporters, setting up booths at county fairs, and adamantly denying their extremism.

Liberty State representatives held   a press conference   on Tuesday in Moses Lake in which they depicted themselves as completely mainstream conservatives who are simply tired of urban, liberal Seattle dictating politics in their conservative counties—and adamantly denied that they are far-right extremists intent on creating a religious Christian state in which nonbelievers could be put to death.

“When both are a plague to each other because of natural cultural differences, and both would be much happier without the other, there’s only one solution that works very well for both sides,” said Liberty State spokesperson René Holaday. “And that is the amiable formation of the new state of Liberty that both sides agree would be the best win-win situation.”

The proposed new state is the brainchild of Republican state Rep. Matt Shea of Spokane Valley, his cohorts in the far-right Marble, Washington, “Patriot” community, and the associated   “American Redoubt” movement   based in northern Idaho. Essentially apocalyptic in nature, Shea and his fellow Liberty State advocates see it as a necessary preparation for when the rest of the world falls apart.

Earlier this year,   reporters exposed   Shea’s ruminations about what the new state would look like, and how it would behave, in a document titled “Biblical Basis for War” that was essentially an outline for war against its fellow states. Under “Rules of War,” it stipulates that “war is not waged against nations but against man,” and that one should “make an offer of peace before declaring war.” However: “If they do not yield—kill all males.”

Shea and his fellow advocates have claimed these were just theoretical chatter, and that their purpose in seceding from Washington state is simply to create a place where guns are no longer regulated as they are currently in the state, and where there are fewer regulations generally, creating more “freedom.”

As reporter   Leah Sottile   has   documented extensively , the northeastern Washington community of Marble—dominated by a single Dominionist Christian church that at one time was affiliated with the racist Christian Identity movement—is the chief nexus of the Liberty State organizing. Much of it—with Shea’s avid participation—has entailed making preparations for violence with guns and other weapons. “Their whole thing is, ‘The world is evil and the government is evil’,” a longtime Marble resident told her. “[They want] to get back to Puritan America.”

She described how Shea led workshops for young campers: “An exercise in field skills for youth, including (but not limited to): field strip and reassemble assigned weapon; orienteering, field dressing wounds, following orders, PT, shooting skill, etc.” He titled his after-dinner session “Going Underground.”

Shea has   come under fire   from his fellow Republicans, both in the Legislature and elsewhere. “I truly believe it’s time for the leadership of the Republican Party in the state of Washington, his peers, to step up and have the courage and the integrity to do the right thing,” Spokane County Sheriff Ozzie Knezovich said. “If he will not step down, they need to work to remove him.”

However, the Liberty State spokespeople this week   attempted to create distance   between themselves and Shea. “While Rep. Shea struck the match, Liberty state is about we the people,” Holaday told the assembled reporters and campaign volunteers in Moses Lake. “And we’re just happy he was willing to introduce the bill on our behalf. He is being attacked because he and the Republican freedom agenda have worked very hard over the past decade to block Democrat actions. It is my belief that the west side would be much happier without that large group of Republicans working so hard against them all the time.”

They also claimed that there would be no religious requirements in their new state, despite Shea’s insistence that it would be founded on “Christian principles.” Holaday told the Moses Lake audience that “all religions would be welcome, Native American treaty rights would be respected and residents would have unfettered gun and property rights.”

The Liberty State website   includes an announcement   explaining that county coordinators had been manning booths at fairs all summer, and were gathering signatures for petitions asking county commissioners to place an advisory vote on their ballots in February 2020.

This past weekend, Liberty State activists manned a booth at the Spokane County Interstate Fair, selling T-shirts and yard signs and passing out flyers. However, none of them was willing to speak to   a reporter from KHQ-6 News .

A supporter did voice the underlying view, saying, “People in eastern Washington are brushed aside, disrespected, disregarded and disdained by liberals in Thurston and King County.”

It’s not clear whether or not the concept has public support. The Liberty State website directs readers to   a Facebook poll   conducted in January by an eastern Washington TV station that ended with 71% support for secession and 29% opposed, with 12,200 votes.

Comments on that poll were typical of the sentiments voiced by Liberty supporters. “Absolutely. We are tired of being disenfranchised. We haven't elected a state senator or governor for over 30 years. We are tired of being dictated to by the socialists of King County and Seattle,” one read.

Others weren’t satisfied with simply seceding from Washington. “I don’t even want a star, keep the US flag the same. I just want out,” wrote   one supporter .

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JohnRussell
1  seeder  JohnRussell    one month ago

I have an idea of how they can fulfill their destiny

5778d67fe361f.image.jpg

noahs-ark-stormy-sea-footage-006531797_p

 
 
 
Kathleen
1.1  Kathleen  replied to  JohnRussell @1    one month ago

Something about the water in that picture that looks terrifying.  

 
 
 
MrFrost
1.2  MrFrost  replied to  JohnRussell @1    one month ago

Didn't the owners of that, "ark", sue the contractor because it was damaged by water? 

 
 
 
Heartland American
2  Heartland American    one month ago

The general concept of creating a 52nd state in Eastern Washington is a good one without Shea.  I would support joining with the Oregon and California Jefferson movements to create a state from south east and north of Sacramento and the Bay Area to southern and eastern Oregon to Eastern Washington and the Canadian border.  We should all combine our efforts in the three states to make one new one of parts of all three and no Shea.  

 
 
 
JohnRussell
2.1  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Heartland American @2    one month ago

You're not getting a state.  

Feel free though,  to build an ark and light out for a deserted island somewhere. 

 
 
 
Heartland American
2.1.1  Heartland American  replied to  JohnRussell @2.1    one month ago

Chicago is largely deserted of any real human population and reachable by water.

 
 
 
MrFrost
2.1.2  MrFrost  replied to  JohnRussell @2.1    one month ago
You're not getting a state.  

They have a state, it's called, "the state of insanity". 

 
 
 
MrFrost
2.1.3  MrFrost  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.1    one month ago

Chicago is largely deserted of any real human population and reachable by water.

You do realize that all the violence in Chicago is confined to a couple of blocks in the entire city right? I have been to Chicago, it's a very nice city. If you stayed off the right wing fake news media, you would realize that...

512

 
 
 
Krishna
2.1.4  Krishna  replied to  MrFrost @2.1.3    one month ago
If you stayed off the right wing fake news media, you would realize that...

But that would take a degree of intelligence...

 
 
 
Tessylo
2.1.5  Tessylo  replied to  MrFrost @2.1.3    one month ago

I've been to Chicago many times.  Love it!!!  

 
 
 
MrFrost
2.2  MrFrost  replied to  Heartland American @2    one month ago
The general concept of creating a 52nd state in Eastern Washington is a good one without Shea.

Um, no. I live on the other side of the mountains and we are ALL glad Easterners are part of the state.

Let's be honest, none of what you are suggesting will ever happen. If you hate the USA so much the way it is now? Leave. 

 
 
 
Heartland American
2.2.1  Heartland American  replied to  MrFrost @2.2    one month ago

We don’t hate America at all.  We do strongly dislike Seattle, Portland/Eugene,  the Bay Area and LA AND the people who live there enough to try to separate politically from them while remaining in the USA as a new state(s).

 
 
 
MrFrost
2.2.2  MrFrost  replied to  Heartland American @2.2.1    one month ago
We don’t hate America at all.

Sounds like it, you keep bleating how you want to change it to YOUR liking and that's NOT going to happen. I don't much care for Southern Mississippi and most of Alabama but I am not crying that I want to change it. Accept the country the way it is or leave, not a difficult concept. 

We do strongly dislike Seattle, Portland/Eugene,  the Bay Area and LA AND the people who live there enough to try to separate politically from them while remaining in the USA as a new state(s).

Do you think anyone gives a fuck what you like and don't like? There are obviously a lot of people that DO like it there, me included. Love going to Seattle, I have never had a problem going there and the food is fantastic. 

What I am getting from you is that people with differing political views shouldn't be entitled to vote the way they want and they should vote the way YOU want? 

Quick reality check:

Since before GWB, the GOP has been losing voters. It's been the party of old white males and that demographic is shrinking. And since the GOP only wants to cater to ONE demographic, they will keep losing voters as the country becomes more diverse. Funny thing is? Nothing you can do to stop it. The GOP learns slowly and now it's too late to start catering to other demographics. Think I am wrong? 

The only demographic where trump is above 50%, (54%)? White males. In literally every other demographic, trump is under 50%. Black females? 3%. Black males? A blistering 13%. 

Without gerrymandering, the GOP knows they will never win another presidential election. 

The GOP is now down to accepting help from other countries to win elections. They also have thrown their hat in Russia's corner, McConnell is proof of that. And to this day, Trump has never once even come close to insulting Putin. He insults everyone else, (usually American citizens), but never Putin. Can you explain that? "America First"? Bullshit. McConnell is so tied to Russia that when Putin bends over all you can see is McConnell's feet sticking out. 

...........

Again, you don't like America the way it is and respect people's right to vote for who they want? Move to Russia where all ballots have one name on it. Your version of fascism is not welcome here. 

 
 
 
arkpdx
2.2.3  arkpdx  replied to  MrFrost @2.2.2    one month ago

"Without gerrymandering, the GOP knows they will never win another presidential election. "

Do tell, how does gerrymandering effect the presidential election? Please be specific!

 
 
 
arkpdx
2.2.4  arkpdx  replied to  MrFrost @2.2.2    one month ago

" you don't like America the way it is and respect people's right to vote for who they want? Move to Russia where all ballots have one name on it. Your version of fascism is not welcome here"

No quite the contrary. We like America as it is. We don't want the left to turn it into another Venezuela. We are resisting the fundementally changing of America as wanted my Obama and the rest if the antiamerican leftist and progressives want.

It is not conservatives that are calling for the boycotting of businesses that appear to support conservatives. It's not conservatives that demonstrate in the streets to keep those that disagree with them from speaking.

 
 
 
MrFrost
2.2.5  MrFrost  replied to  arkpdx @2.2.4    one month ago
No quite the contrary. We like America as it is. We don't want the left to turn it into another Venezuela. We are resisting the fundementally changing of America as wanted my Obama and the rest if the antiamerican leftist and progressives want.

I was talking to HA, read what HE said then read my reply, it will make more sense. 

Oh yea, fundamentally changing America? Let me guess, this is all bad for America, right? 

512

 
 
 
arkpdx
2.2.6  arkpdx  replied to  MrFrost @2.2.5    one month ago

I see you have failed to answer my question.

 
 
 
nightwalker
2.2.7  nightwalker  replied to  Heartland American @2.2.1    one month ago

Stop voting your own stuff up.

 
 
 
katrix
2.2.8  katrix  replied to  arkpdx @2.2.4    one month ago
It is not conservatives that are calling for the boycotting of businesses that appear to support conservatives

No, they call for the boycotting of businesses that appear to support liberals, but for some reason, that's perfectly fine with you.

That's called hypocrisy.

 
 
 
Dulay
2.2.9  Dulay  replied to  arkpdx @2.2.3    one month ago

Gerrymandering has caused the GOP to get outsized representation in the states. GOP Legislations pass restrictive election laws. GOP SoS runs elections, decides on which polling places get closed and decides who to purge from the voting rolls. 

 
 
 
Krishna
2.2.10  Krishna  replied to  MrFrost @2.2    one month ago
If you hate the USA so much the way it is now? Leave. 

Now that would be something most intelligent people would gladly pray for! :-)

 
 
 
Tessylo
2.2.11  Tessylo  replied to  MrFrost @2.2.2    one month ago

Now the turd in chief is trying to appeal to Latinos.  Look at my Latin Americans over there!!!!!!!

 
 
 
bbl-1
2.3  bbl-1  replied to  Heartland American @2    one month ago

go.

 
 
 
lady in black
2.4  lady in black  replied to  Heartland American @2    one month ago

Ain't going to happen, no matter how much you wish it so.  Don't like the US, then leave

 
 
 
Krishna
2.5  Krishna  replied to  Heartland American @2    one month ago
The general concept of creating a 52nd state in Eastern Washington is a good one without Shea.  I would support joining with the Oregon and California Jefferson movements to create a state from south east and north of Sacramento and the Bay Area to southern and eastern Oregon to Eastern Washington and the Canadian border.  We should all combine our efforts in the three states to make one new one of parts of all three and no Shea.  

Excellent idea-- I totally agree!

And then we could send all the religious nutcases there-- and be free from their crazy bullsh*t once and for all!

 
 
 
Split Personality
3  Split Personality    one month ago

What is in the water up there in the far North West?

Shea wants to be the next Moses. Even proponents of Liberty & Jefferson are avoiding him.

Maybe the Liberty group can file useless lawsuits like the Jefferson hopefuls.  ( Lawyers need the work )

That's not working out so well either.

https://www.uniondemocrat.com/localnews/6760732-151/federal-judge-tosses-lawsuit-brought-by-state-of

Oh well, just another week of crazy....

 
 
 
MrFrost
3.1  MrFrost  replied to  Split Personality @3    one month ago
What is in the water up there in the far North West?

Not sure, but damn glad I am on my own well. 

 
 
 
Kavika
3.2  Kavika   replied to  Split Personality @3    one month ago
What is in the water up there in the far North West?

The Hanford Nuclear plant may help explain it. 

http://themillenniumreport.com/2015/09/hanford-a-nuclear-disaster-in-slow-motion/

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.1  Split Personality  replied to  Kavika @3.2    one month ago
Workers poured at least 450 billion gallons of radioactive or chemically contaminated liquid wastes directly into the soil at numerous sites, according to the DOE, which ran the complex for much of its history. The resulting contaminated groundwater plume, covering 230 acres, continues to leach deeper into the ground and stream down slope towards the Columbia. At least 70,000 drums of plutonium-contaminated waste, plus uncounted metal, wood and cardboard boxes of solid wastes disappeared into more than 40 miles of unlined trenches scratched into Hanford’s powdery soil. The three billion metric tons of contaminated soil could fill a standard football field-sized container 2,000 miles high, as journalist Michael D’Antonio visualizes in his narrative history of Hanford’s effects on the surrounding community, Atomic Harvest.
...
Starting in the 1950s, the tanks began to rupture and leak. By 2000, 68 tanks had leaked at least a million gallons of highly radioactive liquid into the ground, contaminating water in the vadose zone between the ground’s surface and the saturated zone or aquifer. Between 1968 and 1986 engineers built 28 million-gallon-plus double-shelled tanks (DSTs) and began pumping wastes in from the SSTs, a laborious, time-intensive process than involves shooting high-pressure, low volume streams of water into the tanks to break up precipitated material and hard crusts.
...
At the same time, the riverside nuclear reactors and other facilities released waste streams into the river. Seeps containing radioactive strontium 90, tritium and uranium found their way into the pools of the Columbia Reach, the final free-flowing section of the river above Bonneville Dam and the spawning grounds for perhaps 80 percent of the river’s remaining salmon.

Holy crap, Batman !

 
 
 
Heartland American
3.2.2  Heartland American  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.1    one month ago

Us distant exurb, small town, and rural portions of these blue states are in open defiance of Sacramento, Salem, and Olympia.  They suck and we know it. 

 
 
 
nightwalker
3.2.3  nightwalker  replied to  Heartland American @3.2.2    one month ago

People who want to create their own dictatorship country because you know federal laws would not allow the "freedoms" to re-write the Constitution to fit [Deleted] would not be permitted in ANY U.S. state. And sooner rather than later they'd just have to expand their private country (excuse me, STATE) to the surrounding areas by force as will be required, most people who live in this country actually kind of like it. I'd also like to point out a rather large portion of the population has sworn a oath to protect this Nation and it's Constitution against ememies foreign or domestic.

What is that old conservative saying about the U.S.? "Love it or leave it", isn't it?

And since you're always jaw-jacking about how you need to take over part of this country so that you could rule it in the manner you like, I'm sure they'd be delighted to include you in their crew, such a valuable person such as yourself, so these idiots and your anti-American Jeffersons can all board a ship and start your very own country in the middle east (since religious preferences don't matter) or South America. HEY, I have a great idea, go to Russia and stake a claim on some of their Country it's huge, they'll never notice or won't mind if you take over a little piece.

Then at least we wouldn't have to put up with the continuous complaining about how nobody listens to you OR them as ya'll whine about how nobody listens to ya'll about how ya'll should rule this Nation or whatever Nation you want to start in another part of the world.

At least, until as a foreign citizen and foreign minister in a new Country your S.S. or retirement and Medicare are canceled, but I'm sure your new "state" will have a exelent health and retirement plan.

And the west coast would have a few less problems and expenses and a lot more peace.

I'm delighted, let me know when you're setting sail and I'll send my "thoughts and prayers" with your holy... butts.

 
 
 
JBB
3.2.4  JBB  replied to  nightwalker @3.2.3    one month ago

Would it be wrong for me to add an, "Amen"?

 
 
 
Kavika
3.2.5  Kavika   replied to  Heartland American @3.2.2    one month ago

Your constant ''bragging'' is nothing more than false bravado, XX.

After all the years of telling us about Jeffersonia, it has yet to make it on the ballot. 

And each one of the cities you mentioned above still has control of the whining dissidents know as Jeffersonians/Liberty 51st. 

 
 
 
Heartland American
3.2.6  Heartland American  replied to  Kavika @3.2.5    one month ago

They have no control outside the boundaries of their dirty polluted cesspools of human debris.  We have our own local boards, county supervisors, city councils, and county sheriff so most aspects of our lives are out of their reach. We pretty much live our lives as we see fit and if they aren’t physically here 24/7/365 we defy/ignore them at every opportunity.  We are Californians in name only.  Proudly CINO’s! 

 
 
 
Kavika
3.2.7  Kavika   replied to  Heartland American @3.2.6    one month ago

If all that is true, which it isn't, what in the world are you constantly whining about...

Try not paying CA sales tax, CA state income tax....LOL, that's where the power is at and you have no power. 

 
 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
3.2.8  The Magic Eight Ball  replied to  Kavika @3.2.7    one month ago
Try not paying CA sales tax, CA state income tax

worked in cali for 4 yrs... never paid them a dime in income tax.

 
 
 
Dulay
3.2.9  Dulay  replied to  Heartland American @3.2.2    one month ago
Us distant exurb, small town, and rural portions of these blue states are in open defiance of Sacramento, Salem, and Olympia.  They suck and we know it. 

Yet as you've previously admitted, your 'State of Jefferson' gladly accepts millions in California taxpayer funds to update and build infrastructure that your tax base can't afford on it's own. 

 
 
 
Heartland American
3.2.10  Heartland American  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @3.2.8    one month ago

Not sure how you did it, but bravo 👏! 

 
 
 
Heartland American
3.2.11  Heartland American  replied to  JBB @3.2.4    one month ago

Yes, it would be wrong to do that.  

 
 
 
Heartland American
3.2.12  Heartland American  replied to  Dulay @3.2.9    one month ago

We can afford all that we need if we are a state with our own tax structure.  As to money from Californication that comes here, it’s the only reason that the few who want to remain California do so. They owe it to us.  They have screwed us, bent our region over a hot fender w/o Vaseline with their policies and it’s like reparations. 

 
 
 
Dulay
3.2.13  Dulay  replied to  Heartland American @3.2.12    one month ago
We can afford all that we need if we are a state with our own tax structure.

Nope, I already proved that to be false in a prior seed. 

 As to money from Californication that comes here, it’s the only reason that the few who want to remain California do so. They owe it to us.  They have screwed us, bent our region over a hot fender w/o Vaseline with their policies and it’s like reparations. 

Delusional. 

Oh and BTFW, I thought you were against reparations. 

 
 
 
Krishna
3.2.14  Krishna  replied to  Heartland American @3.2.2    one month ago
They suck and we know it. 

"We"?

 
 
 
Krishna
3.3  Krishna  replied to  Split Personality @3    one month ago

What is in the water up there in the far North West?

Probably the same infernal stuff that the gubmint is putting in the water in Southern California?

Sprinkler Rainbow Conspiracy 

2,143,759 Views

Sprinkler Rainbow Conspiracy 2,143,759 views Published on Aug 5, 2008 
 
 
 
bbl-1
4  bbl-1    one month ago

christianity is dead.  Guyana destiny.

 
 
 
Heartland American
4.1  Heartland American  replied to  bbl-1 @4    one month ago

Christianity will never die and before the end because of the 2nd coming, all then living will accept it or reject it.  

 
 
 
nightwalker
4.1.1  nightwalker  replied to  Heartland American @4.1    one month ago

[Deleted]

 
 
 
Raven Wing
4.1.2  Raven Wing  replied to  nightwalker @4.1.1    one month ago
removed for context

jrSmiley_81_smiley_image.gifjrSmiley_79_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Kavika
4.1.3  Kavika   replied to  Heartland American @4.1    one month ago
Christianity will never die and before the end because of the 2nd coming, all then living will accept it or reject it.  

How, exactly is that going to work. Evangelicals  support Israel and if this second coming is, in fact, true, what becomes of the Jews? They do not believe in the 1st or 2nd coming.

 
 
 
Heartland American
4.1.4  Heartland American  replied to  Kavika @4.1.3    one month ago

People will all everywhere in the world have heard the gospel message by then and a point in time where all have made up their mind one way or another, and then the tribulation/trouble begins that will be cut short by the 2nd coming whether people believe in it or not. [Deleted]  That is the answer as I understand it to your inquiry. 

 
 
 
Kavika
4.1.5  Kavika   replied to  Heartland American @4.1.4    one month ago

So if people don't believe as Evangelicals do then your god is throwing them into the trash bin...

Hard to believe that some Christians have so little respect for billions of people...

 
 
 
dave-2693993
4.1.6  dave-2693993  replied to  Kavika @4.1.3    one month ago
Evangelicals  support Israel and if this second coming is, in fact, true, what becomes of the Jews? They do not believe in the 1st or 2nd coming.

Just to clarify,

The Jews believe in the anointed one. The mashiach aka many equate to the Christian messiah. Which really are not the same. Though many think are.

Anyhow, the anointed one has not arrived in the end days yet.

I am sure Enoch can explain in greater detail.

 
 
 
Kavika
4.1.7  Kavika   replied to  dave-2693993 @4.1.6    one month ago

dave, my question remains the same. If Jews do not convert and the millions or billions of other religions do not convert, are they thrown in the trash bin?

And are the Evangelicals to inherit the holy land by default.  

 
 
 
lady in black
4.1.8  lady in black  replied to  Kavika @4.1.7    one month ago

Everyone but the evangelicals will inherit the [earth...Deleted]

 
 
 
dave-2693993
4.1.9  dave-2693993  replied to  Kavika @4.1.7    one month ago

Your point stands Kavika.

My statement was not a challenge to your statement, but clarification to many who will not understand your reference to the 1st and 2nd comings of the Christ as understood by most Christians.

What you stated was correct, but many may miss that and simply say or think Jews are still waiting for the 1st coming of the messiah. 

Their perception misses the mashiach or anointed one is not the messiah. 

In all actuality, the mashiach might be more like the Christian 2nd coming of the messiah, or Christ.

That is all.

 
 
 
Kavika
4.1.10  Kavika   replied to  dave-2693993 @4.1.9    one month ago

Thanks for the clarification, dave.

 
 
 
Heartland American
4.1.11  Heartland American  replied to  Heartland American @4.1.4    one month ago

[Deleted]

 
 
 
nightwalker
4.1.12  nightwalker  replied to  Kavika @4.1.3    one month ago

"How, exactly is that going to work. Evangelicals  support Israel and if this second coming is, in fact, true, what becomes of the Jews? They do not believe in the 1st or 2nd coming."

I'm not sure if they believe in the second coming, I'm sure they believe in Armageddon. If I understand correctly from various bits and pieces of information, they believe that after the Armageddon not everyone will be dead. I think the belief is that God will come down and rule from a throne in the rebuilt Solomon's temple (temple has to be rebuilt before Armageddon can happen.)

After Armageddon, they belief only the Israelites, the chosen tribe, will have survived for God's direct rule. Tough  cookies for everyone else, no matter how helpful or good they may have been, they're not of the faith so look out below.

I've gotten that much from the news on american zionists and the few Jewish people I do know well enough to discuss such things and it's hard to get them to give a straight answer on the subject, perhaps because I'm up front about being an agnostic. Who knows?

Maybe it's hard for anybody to discuss their religion with somebody NOT of their religion but that's what I've come up with.

 
 
 
Drakkonis
4.1.13  Drakkonis  replied to  Kavika @4.1.7    one month ago
And are the Evangelicals to inherit the holy land by default.  

As I understand it, many, if not most Jews will believe in Jesus as the Messiah before the end. As for who get's "thrown in the trash bin", that would be those who do not accept Christ as savior. Essentially, they send themselves there. 

 
 
 
Heartland American
4.1.14  Heartland American  replied to  Raven Wing @4.1.2    one month ago

How can a direct quote of a coc skirting with applause be left standing? Isn’t it also skirting since it not only repeated it but applauded it? Wouldn’t it normally at least be removed for context.  

 
 
 
Heartland American
4.1.15  Heartland American  replied to  Drakkonis @4.1.13    one month ago

👏👍😇

 
 
 
nightwalker
4.1.16  nightwalker  replied to  Heartland American @4.1.14    one month ago

Is there anything you DON'T feel obligated to complain about?

 
 
 
nightwalker
4.1.17  nightwalker  replied to  nightwalker @4.1.1    one month ago

SOME people are living proof that most of the people (not all, thank g) and a lot of the decision makers  (also, not all) that are big on religions have given up on god and have reduced him to a logo, a threat or a EXCUSE and have reduced religion to just another mega-corporation. Shea is a prime example.

From the article, in case anybody missed it.

"Earlier this year,   reporters exposed   Shea’s ruminations about what the new state would look like, and how it would behave, in a document titled “Biblical Basis for War” that was essentially an outline for war against its fellow states. Under “Rules of War,” it stipulates that “war is not waged against nations but against man,” and that one should “make an offer of peace before declaring war.” However: “If they do not yield—kill all males.” "

My opinion, which I hope I will be allowed:

Sounds like using god as a excuse AND a threat to me. Speaking of threat..a lot of "christians" talk about "god wants this,"  "god wants that"  and "god doesn't like that, them or those." I'm sure Shea has his own take on the bible that benefits himself too. References to "the second coming" and "Armageddon" is also using god as a threat. (oh, you guys are gonna get it for not listening and obeying ME.)

And  all under the logo of a face with long white hair and a long white beard looking through the clouds with a "god is love" caption(tm).

I'd LIKE to believe in god, but not the mega-corp one. I'd like to think there would be justice and peace at the end of all things and If there is a god I don't think he'd judge on your religion, but on what kind of person you were.

And that should scare the snot out of some people, but they'd have to believe in god for that to happen.

FOR IT IS WRITTEN (by me) it takes more then dragging yourself to church once or even twice a year and sleeping through the service to be a actual Christian. (note the capitalization, I have respect for the real, but oh so rare thing.)

Gee, hope at least a FEW people get to read this before a moderator decides it skirts the CoC somehow. jrSmiley_4_smiley_image.png

 
 
 
Krishna
4.1.18  Krishna  replied to  Heartland American @4.1    one month ago
Christianity will never die and before the end because of the 2nd coming, all then living will accept it or reject it.

jrSmiley_88_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
4.1.19  Trout Giggles  replied to  Krishna @4.1.18    one month ago

That's those stupid "Left Behind" books talking

 
 
 
Krishna
4.1.20  Krishna  replied to  Heartland American @4.1    one month ago
Christianity will never die and before the end because of the 2nd coming, all then living will accept it or reject it.

One question: where can I get some of that stuff that you are smoking?

 
 
 
Steve Ott
5  Steve Ott    one month ago

If you want to see how a theocratic state would work, just look at Liberty University.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
5.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  Steve Ott @5    one month ago

How would a theocratic state work? Even if Shea could cut out part of WA to create one, it would still be part of the USA and by law would be under obligation to the US Constitution.

He may want to discriminate against people not of his faith, but he ain't gonna get away with it

 
 
 
devangelical
5.1.1  devangelical  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.1    one month ago

on the flip side, having born again scum all in one place would prove to be very convenient in the near future.

 
 
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