He declares that GOD HATES SLAVERY because he freed the Jewish people from Egypt. Then literally a few seconds later, he re-emphasizes that GOD HATES SLAVERY and this truth is reinforced by the creation of the United States of America by the founding fathers.
Thanks for looking in on this, John.
This is not a proselytizing video and is applicable to Christians and even atheists.
God DOES hate slavery and, if you continue watching, you will see that Prager deals specifically with slavery; notably in connection with the Fourth and Eighth Commandments.
It is better to watch the whole thing in sequence but, if you cannot wait, watch these two first. You should withhold judgment till you have seen it all because many of your comments will be addressed in one place or another.
God neither caused slavery or ended it. He is primarily a teacher andHis students follow Him voluntarily.
You may recall Prager saying that not all religious people are good. But I cannot even say that the founding fathers were religious. I know the colonists treated native Americans shabbily; to say the least.
The world is far from perfected yet and you should watch Prager as a model of what has occurred in measure but more importantly what should be.
That was not my question to you Len. I think you know that. Prager is a conservative who reveres the founding fathers, so much so that HE introduced them into his discussion about GOD HATES SLAVERY, because he wanted to talk about how much the founding fathers loved freedom.
My questions are still unanswered. The 10 commandments were in force in 1776 and 1789. Why didn't the founding fathers follow them ?
I presume you refer to the following:
God declares is that He took the Children of Israel out of slavery and into freedom. That's how much God hates slavery and how important God considers freedom. The Founders of America based their entire view of America on this belief -- that God wants us to be free. That is why the most iconic symbol of the American Revolution, the Liberty Bell, has only one sentence inscribed on it -- a verse from the Hebrew Bible: "Proclaim LIBERTY throughout all the Land unto all the Inhabitants thereof."
That paragraph contains intermingled ideas for tutorial purposes. It would be more correct to say thata majority of the founders were opposed to slavery at that time and slavery was severely restricted soon after. 25 of the Convention's 55 delegates owned slaves, including all of the delegates from Virginia and South Carolina. So a majority of the founders were not slave owners.
There was a conflict between North and South about whetherslavery should be regulated by the Constitution. That conflict was so intense that several Southern states refused to join the Union if slavery were not to be allowed. Delegates opposed to slavery were forced to yield in their demands that slavery practiced within the confines of the new nation be completely outlawed. But a compromise wasreachedby whichCongress would have the power to ban the international slave trade in 1808.
The bellwas commissioned by the Philadelphia Provincial Assembly, including the biblical inscription, in 1752. It heralded the eventual eradication of slavery.
Considering the outcome, and parsing the word, "founders,"it is fair to say what Prager did.
There was a conflict between North and South about whetherslavery should be regulated by the Constitution. That conflict was so intense that several Southern states refused to join the Union if slavery were not to be allowed. Delegates opposed to slavery were forced to yield in their demands that slavery practiced within the confines of the new nation be completely outlawed. But a compromise wasreachedby whichCongress would have the power to ban the international slave trade in 1808.
If you were religious you would know that is not the way God works.
An excellent book on the subject is, "WorldPerfect -- the Jewish Impact on Civilization," by Ken Spiro:
In pursuit of an answer to the question of what would constitute a perfect world, author Ken Spiro questioned more than 1,500 people of various backgrounds and religions. His findings revealed six core elements: Respect for human life; peace and harmony; justice and equality; education; family; and social responsibility. He then set off on a journey to find out why these were such common goals across cultural, economic, social and racial lines, and in the process, traced the history of the development of world religions, values and ethics.
As a rabbi, he paid particular attention to how Judaism impacted, and was influenced by, the course of these developments. The result is a highly readable and well-documented book about the origins of values and virtues in Western civilization as influenced by the Greeks, Romans, Christians, Muslims and, most significantly, the Jews.
The history of religion, presented in Spiros highly readable style, is a fascinating and timely subject, especially in todays volatile religious climate. Spiro divides his book into five engaging parts:
Where the Quality of Mercy Was Not Strained: The World of Greece and Rome
Against the Grain: The Jewish View
A Father to Many Nations: Abraham and the Implications of Monotheism
With Sword and Fire: The Rise of Christianity and Islam
The New Promised Land: Impact of Judaism on Liberal Democracies
Readers of all faiths will find that the elements of a perfect world can only be achieved by a common understanding of our mutual backgrounds and that our diverse religions are all merely branches growing from one single tree.
In 1670 Harvard U. was founded as a training school for Puritan ministers. Many other colleges were established under the auspices of various Protestant sects including Yale, William and Mary, Rutgers, Brown, Kings College (now Columbia), Johns Hopkins, etc.
The Bible was central in their curricula with both Hebrew and Bible studies required courses. Many of these even adopted a Hebrewword or phrase as part of their logo such as Yale, Columbia and Dartmouth. In the 16th and 17th centuries several students delivered their commencement speeches in Hebrew.Many of the schools taught Hebrew though no British universities offered it.
Many of the Founding Fathers were products of these schools. Jefferson attended William and Mary, Madison, Princeton and Hamilton , Columbia. The Revolution was modeled after the Exodus. Franklin, John Adams and Jefferson proposed a US seal design that depicted the crossing of the Red Sea and contained the motto, "Resistance to tyranny is obedience to God." I have already discussed the Liberty Bell. There4 are many other examples such as the beginning of the Declaration of Independence.
The birth of American democracy clearly involved the spread of Jewish biblical ideas including the Ten. Though slavery, as an existing institution,was not wiped out immediately the seeds were planted and germinated within the first hundred years.
You obviously did not listen to Prager's five-minute discussion of each ofthe second commandment; "You shall have no other gods ---," the Third, Fourthand the Fifth, to honor parents.
I know 'cause both the Bible and science tell me so.
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. (Gen. 1:1)
From Robert Jastrow's book, God and the Astronomers:
"... scientists cannot bear the thought of a natural phenomenon which cannot be explained, even with unlimited time and money. There is a kind of religion in science; it is the religion of a person who believes there is order and harmony in the Universe, and any event can be explained in a natural way as the product of some previous event; every effect must have its cause; there is no First Cause ... This "religious faith" of the scientist is violated by the discovery that the world had a beginning under conditions in which the laws of physics are not valid, and as a product of forces or circumstances we cannot discover. When that happens the scientist has lost control. If he really examined the implications, he would be traumatized. As usual, when faced with trauma, the mind reacts by ignoring the implications -- in science this is known as "refusing to speculate" -- or trivializing the origin of the world by calling it the Big Bang as if the Universe were a firecracker.
"Now we would like to pursue that inquiry farther back in time, but the barrier to further progress seems insurmountable ... for the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance; he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries."
Satire - the use of humor, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and/or criticize people's stupidity or vices, particularly in the context of contemporary politics and other topical issues.
You just don't get it, and never will get it. Seriously, even if your fantasy based version of the "First Cause" has a shred of validity to it, we are billions of years removed from that event. That's billions of years filled with zero evidence of the continuation of your fantasy.
You are allowing yourself to be a pawn of one of countless religions that use ancient doctrines of lies as their rule book. Where is your God now? Where has it been for the last 2,000 years? According to your doctrine it used to be so evident that nobody would question it, and now it's just plain awol.
Humanity doesn't make progress by shackling itself to ancient, obsolete wisdom - particularly when that wisdom is as deeply flawed as all religions are.
OK Hal if you are so smart, "modern smart," you tell me what the first cause of the Big Bang was. Something humongous from "nothing."
What do you know that isa more"valid" less "fantastic" explanation of something amazingfrom nothing? That includes not just matter, not just lifebut intelligent life.
If someone showed you a beautiful painting, you asked for the artist's name, and were told, "Their was no artist. This painting just appeared from nothing; canvas, frame and all," you should believe him to be consistent.
Psalm 19 tells us:
For the conductor, a song of David. 2 The heavensdeclare the glory of God, and the sky proclaims Hishandiwork. 3 Day to day utters speech, and night to nightdeclares knowledge. 4 There is no speech and there are no words; their voice is not heard. 5 But their precision goes forth throughout the earth, and their wordsreach the end of the inhabitedworld. In their midst He has set up a tentfor the sun 6which is like a bridegroom emerging from his chamber; it rejoices like a mightyathlete torun thecourse. 7 Its sourcethe end of the heavens and its circuitreaches theirends; nothing is hidden from its heat. 8 Theteaching of the Lord is perfect, restoring the soul; the testimony of the Lord is faithful, making the simple one wise. 9 The orders of the Lord are upright, causing the heart to rejoice; the command of the Lord is clear, enlightening the eyes. 10 The fear of the Lord is pure, enduring forever; the judgments of the Lord are true, altogether riighteous. 11 They aremore desirable than gold,more than much fine gold; and are sweeter than honey and drippings of honeycombs. 12 Also,Your servant is careful with them; for in observing them there is great reward. 13 Who understands errors? Cleanse me of hidden [sins]. 14 Also withhold Your servant from willful sins; let them not rule over me; then I will be perfect and I will be cleansed of much transgression. 15 May the sayings of my mouth and the meditations of my heart be acceptable before You, O Lord, my Rock and my Redeemer.
I showed John how the progress the USA has made in the humanities, justice and freedom since before its founding, was based on the Bible's teachings. Did you watch the Ten Commandments presentation? You should. It is transformative.
Len, I made no claim to be "so smart", I simply pointed out something that is "not so smart". Thirteen billion years ago, plus or minus, the universe came into existence. Now consider that humans have been non-existent for thirteen billion years, plus or minus. That is to say that the entire timespan of human existence is so short in relation to the scientifically accepted age of the universe, that it is literally inconsequential. Yet somehow it was all done just for us. How do you not see the absurdity of this assertion?
So go ahead, keep claiming that God created the universe. In the grand scheme of existence, it's a claim that is as inconsequential as humanity itself.
"God does not make robots" is hardly an argument for the existence of God, and a very nonsensical explanation for free will in terms of being a gift from God. Are the wetness of water and the absence of darkness in the sun also gifts from God?
OK, Hal, you recognize with science and the Bible that the universe was created ex nihilo -- from nothing. That is a start worth thinking about.
13.5 billion for the universe and about 4.5 billion or our solar system.
I also assume you believe in evolution. Science teaches that both the universe and life on earth evolved. Life could not have survived in the high-energy early millennia of the universe. our solar system evolved from a supernova; an exploding star.
You might think we are here just by luck, by random chance. But for us to be here we would not just have had to win one lottery but lotteries week after week, year after year, century after century.
We won with the strength of the electromagnetic force that is just right to cause atoms tojoin into molecules. We won at the strength of the nuclear force that is just right to hold atomic nuclei together. Were it a bit stronger hydrogen would not be the major component of the universe and, consequently, no stars.
Physicists (My son has a PhD) know that, besides the electromagnetic force, the universe contains three others with vastly different properties and strengths; gravitation, the strong force and the weak force. If you tried to bring two electrons together gravity would assist you but the electromagnetic force would fight you. You would have a hard time because the electromagnetic force is a million, billion, billion, billion, billion times as strong. The only reason it is not dominant is because matter mostly has an equal amount of + and - charges.
The strong force is 100 times as strong as the electromagnetic force and 100,000 times as strong as the weak force.
If the properties of these forces were even moderately different the universe would be vastly different and we would not exist.
More coincidences:
Goldilocks climatology: Earth is just the right distance from the sun to maintain oceans, as well as to provide a hospitable temperature and atmosphere for the support of human life. Mars is too cold, Venus too hot. A difference of just a few percent in many variables would have ended the possibility of life; possible because of a very delicate balance. If the Earth were a few percent closer to the sun, the water would boil off; a few percent farther away and the atmosphere would not be breathable by humans because of the excessive carbon dioxide. We are far enough from other stars to preclude our being subject to stellar explosions, and the consequent cosmic radiation which would sterilize us at best, and kill us at worst.
The Moon: Frequently neglected, the specific structure and movement of the moon, is a major determinant of the weather, as well as the seasons. Without the moon, we would not have the mild climate that permitted human cultural, intellectual and technological development, notwithstanding the factors above.
Our moon was formed from a planetary collision because the colliding body just happened to have the required mass, just happened to have the required velocity and angle of collision, and just happened to have the required composition for its core and mantle.
Origin of Life: There is no satisfactory explanation for the origin of life from inanimate matter. A chicken/egg situation exists. All living cells require nucleic acid for replication. They also require proteins which can be produced only by nucleic acids. But nucleic acids can be produced only in the presence of proteins. Inanimate matter contains neither proteins or nucleic acids.
Steven Jay Gould, writing in the Oct. 1996 Discover, wrote: "To produce a creature with our structural and neurological complexity evolution must be creative in the vernacular sense of this word -- that is, evolution must be able to develop novel structures with previously unrealized functions. ... Yet if evolution worked simply by fashioning exquisitely adapted creatures in an ascending series, humans could never have originated at all. Precise adaptation, with each part finely honed to perform a definite function in an optimal way, can only lead to blind alleys, dead ends, and extinction. ... The key is flexibility, not admirable precision. Ironically, then, to make us at all, evolution must work by processes contrary to the prejudicial hopes that we invest in Darwin's legacy..." Gould then goes on to explain his own theory of adaptability rather than specialization and concludes: "We are quirky, if glorious, accidents not to be repeated on this planet."
Thanks for looking in on this, John.
This is not a proselytizing video and is applicable to Christians and even atheists.
God DOES hate slavery and, if you continue watching, you will see that Prager deals specifically with slavery; notably in connection with the Fourth and Eighth Commandments.
It is better to watch the whole thing in sequence but, if you cannot wait, watch these two first. You should withhold judgment till you have seen it all because many of your comments will be addressed in one place or another.
Did you follow my suggestion yet?
God neither caused slavery or ended it. He is primarily a teacher andHis students follow Him voluntarily.
You may recall Prager saying that not all religious people are good. But I cannot even say that the founding fathers were religious. I know the colonists treated native Americans shabbily; to say the least.
The world is far from perfected yet and you should watch Prager as a model of what has occurred in measure but more importantly what should be.
The Ten Commandments are a road map.
I presume you refer to the following:
That paragraph contains intermingled ideas for tutorial purposes. It would be more correct to say thata majority of the founders were opposed to slavery at that time and slavery was severely restricted soon after. 25 of the Convention's 55 delegates owned slaves, including all of the delegates from Virginia and South Carolina. So a majority of the founders were not slave owners.
There was a conflict between North and South about whetherslavery should be regulated by the Constitution. That conflict was so intense that several Southern states refused to join the Union if slavery were not to be allowed. Delegates opposed to slavery were forced to yield in their demands that slavery practiced within the confines of the new nation be completely outlawed. But a compromise wasreachedby whichCongress would have the power to ban the international slave trade in 1808.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitutional_Convention_(United_Stat...
The bellwas commissioned by the Philadelphia Provincial Assembly, including the biblical inscription, in 1752. It heralded the eventual eradication of slavery.
Considering the outcome, and parsing the word, "founders,"it is fair to say what Prager did.
Dear Friend Len: There is a reason why Congress passed the Ten Commandments.
Let's all give them a try.
Smiles.
Enoch.
P.S. Chag Channukah Sameach.
Sorry friend Enoch but in a secular society such as ours, the first four or five commandments are not applicable, depending on how you look at it.
Dear Frei
There was a conflict between North and South about whetherslavery should be regulated by the Constitution. That conflict was so intense that several Southern states refused to join the Union if slavery were not to be allowed. Delegates opposed to slavery were forced to yield in their demands that slavery practiced within the confines of the new nation be completely outlawed. But a compromise wasreachedby whichCongress would have the power to ban the international slave trade in 1808.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitutional_Convention_(United_Stat...
How do you know?
Were you there?
Gam l'cha, Enoch.
They are applicable to those who choose to follow them and be rewarded thereby.
He did not say ALL the founding fathers.
Were you expecting a miracle?
1) You shall have no other gods before Me. - Except money.
2) You shall not make idols. - Except money.
3) You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain. - Except when cursing at homosexuals, blacks, Latinos and other undesirables.
4) Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. - Except when it comes to making money.
5) Honor your father and your mother. - Unless they are broke, them put them in a nursing home.
If you were religious you would know that is not the way God works.
An excellent book on the subject is, "WorldPerfect -- the Jewish Impact on Civilization," by Ken Spiro:
In 1670 Harvard U. was founded as a training school for Puritan ministers. Many other colleges were established under the auspices of various Protestant sects including Yale, William and Mary, Rutgers, Brown, Kings College (now Columbia), Johns Hopkins, etc.
The Bible was central in their curricula with both Hebrew and Bible studies required courses. Many of these even adopted a Hebrewword or phrase as part of their logo such as Yale, Columbia and Dartmouth. In the 16th and 17th centuries several students delivered their commencement speeches in Hebrew.Many of the schools taught Hebrew though no British universities offered it.
Many of the Founding Fathers were products of these schools. Jefferson attended William and Mary, Madison, Princeton and Hamilton , Columbia. The Revolution was modeled after the Exodus. Franklin, John Adams and Jefferson proposed a US seal design that depicted the crossing of the Red Sea and contained the motto, "Resistance to tyranny is obedience to God." I have already discussed the Liberty Bell. There4 are many other examples such as the beginning of the Declaration of Independence.
The birth of American democracy clearly involved the spread of Jewish biblical ideas including the Ten. Though slavery, as an existing institution,was not wiped out immediately the seeds were planted and germinated within the first hundred years.
You obviously did not listen to Prager's five-minute discussion of each ofthe second commandment; "You shall have no other gods ---," the Third, Fourthand the Fifth, to honor parents.
Please do so and then comment again.
I know 'cause both the Bible and science tell me so.
From Robert Jastrow's book, God and the Astronomers:
Satire - the use of humor, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and/or criticize people's stupidity or vices, particularly in the context of contemporary politics and other topical issues.
Who are you ridiculing and why?
You are allowing yourself to be a pawn of one of countless religions that use ancient doctrines of lies as their rule book. Where is your God now? Where has it been for the last 2,000 years? According to your doctrine it used to be so evident that nobody would question it, and now it's just plain awol.
Humanity doesn't make progress by shackling itself to ancient, obsolete wisdom - particularly when that wisdom is as deeply flawed as all religions are.
OK Hal if you are so smart, "modern smart," you tell me what the first cause of the Big Bang was. Something humongous from "nothing."
What do you know that isa more"valid" less "fantastic" explanation of something amazingfrom nothing? That includes not just matter, not just lifebut intelligent life.
If someone showed you a beautiful painting, you asked for the artist's name, and were told, "Their was no artist. This painting just appeared from nothing; canvas, frame and all," you should believe him to be consistent.
Psalm 19 tells us:
I showed John how the progress the USA has made in the humanities, justice and freedom since before its founding, was based on the Bible's teachings. Did you watch the Ten Commandments presentation? You should. It is transformative.
To paraphrase the late, great Louis Armstrong;
I loved Louis.
But I have also found that knowing the question to ask often shows more wisdom than the nonexistentanswer.
I don't like wasting precious electrons.
Len, I made no claim to be "so smart", I simply pointed out something that is "not so smart". Thirteen billion years ago, plus or minus, the universe came into existence. Now consider that humans have been non-existent for thirteen billion years, plus or minus. That is to say that the entire timespan of human existence is so short in relation to the scientifically accepted age of the universe, that it is literally inconsequential. Yet somehow it was all done just for us. How do you not see the absurdity of this assertion?
So go ahead, keep claiming that God created the universe. In the grand scheme of existence, it's a claim that is as inconsequential as humanity itself.
John, they are 5 minutes each.
I am glad you took the plunge. It is worth watching them all.
We are not robots and were created tohave free will unlike animals which are instinctive.
Just as we can decide to watch or not we can decide to be good or not.
Now if I can only get Hal and Aon to watch:-)
Then use your gluons, bosons or gravitons:-)
OK, Hal, you recognize with science and the Bible that the universe was created ex nihilo -- from nothing. That is a start worth thinking about.
13.5 billion for the universe and about 4.5 billion or our solar system.
I also assume you believe in evolution. Science teaches that both the universe and life on earth evolved. Life could not have survived in the high-energy early millennia of the universe. our solar system evolved from a supernova; an exploding star.
You might think we are here just by luck, by random chance. But for us to be here we would not just have had to win one lottery but lotteries week after week, year after year, century after century.
We won with the strength of the electromagnetic force that is just right to cause atoms tojoin into molecules. We won at the strength of the nuclear force that is just right to hold atomic nuclei together. Were it a bit stronger hydrogen would not be the major component of the universe and, consequently, no stars.
Physicists (My son has a PhD) know that, besides the electromagnetic force, the universe contains three others with vastly different properties and strengths; gravitation, the strong force and the weak force. If you tried to bring two electrons together gravity would assist you but the electromagnetic force would fight you. You would have a hard time because the electromagnetic force is a million, billion, billion, billion, billion times as strong. The only reason it is not dominant is because matter mostly has an equal amount of + and - charges.
The strong force is 100 times as strong as the electromagnetic force and 100,000 times as strong as the weak force.
If the properties of these forces were even moderately different the universe would be vastly different and we would not exist.
More coincidences:
Goldilocks climatology: Earth is just the right distance from the sun to maintain oceans, as well as to provide a hospitable temperature and atmosphere for the support of human life. Mars is too cold, Venus too hot. A difference of just a few percent in many variables would have ended the possibility of life; possible because of a very delicate balance. If the Earth were a few percent closer to the sun, the water would boil off; a few percent farther away and the atmosphere would not be breathable by humans because of the excessive carbon dioxide. We are far enough from other stars to preclude our being subject to stellar explosions, and the consequent cosmic radiation which would sterilize us at best, and kill us at worst.
The Moon: Frequently neglected, the specific structure and movement of the moon, is a major determinant of the weather, as well as the seasons. Without the moon, we would not have the mild climate that permitted human cultural, intellectual and technological development, notwithstanding the factors above.
Our moon was formed from a planetary collision because the colliding body just happened to have the required mass, just happened to have the required velocity and angle of collision, and just happened to have the required composition for its core and mantle.
Origin of Life: There is no satisfactory explanation for the origin of life from inanimate matter. A chicken/egg situation exists. All living cells require nucleic acid for replication. They also require proteins which can be produced only by nucleic acids. But nucleic acids can be produced only in the presence of proteins. Inanimate matter contains neither proteins or nucleic acids.
Steven Jay Gould, writing in the Oct. 1996 Discover, wrote: "To produce a creature with our structural and neurological complexity evolution must be creative in the vernacular sense of this word -- that is, evolution must be able to develop novel structures with previously unrealized functions. ... Yet if evolution worked simply by fashioning exquisitely adapted creatures in an ascending series, humans could never have originated at all. Precise adaptation, with each part finely honed to perform a definite function in an optimal way, can only lead to blind alleys, dead ends, and extinction. ... The key is flexibility, not admirable precision. Ironically, then, to make us at all, evolution must work by processes contrary to the prejudicial hopes that we invest in Darwin's legacy..." Gould then goes on to explain his own theory of adaptability rather than specialization and concludes: "We are quirky, if glorious, accidents not to be repeated on this planet."