Michael Moore thinks he gets it!

  
By:  Vic Eldred  •  4 weeks ago  •  104 comments


Michael Moore thinks he gets it!
Every beaten down, forgotten working stiff loves Donald Trump

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We the People


The following is the explanation via progressive Michael Moore on why Donald Trump was going to win, despite polling to the contrary:





What does Moore say about the 2020 race?

"Michael Moore famously predicted Trump’s win in 2016. Today he appeared on the Hill’s show Rising and warned that the presidential race could be closer than it appears, especially in battleground states: “Trump has tightened virtually every one of these swing states to the point where—what are they saying this morning…Biden’s 5 points ahead in Wisconsin, maybe 3 points ahead in Florida, 2 points ahead in Arizona.”
“Listen, don’t believe these polls, first of all, and second of all the Trump vote is always being undercounted,” Moore said. He went on to suggest that when pollsters call Trump voters they are not likely to get the truth out of them. Moore admitted his opinion was not scientific but based on his own instincts, “Whatever they’re saying the Biden lead is, cut it in half right now in your head. Cut it in half and now you’re within the four point margin of error.” “That’s how close this is,” he added."

https://hotair.com/archives/john-s-2/2020/10/29/michael-moore-dont-believe-polls/


It is different in one sense. In 2016 the left was caught off guard. They thought Trump had zero chance. This time every one of them will vote. 

I expect record turnout for this election with both extremes fully energized. Which side is larger?  Is it the educated elite? Or the hard working, noble, middle Americans?

We shall find out in 4 days....(we hope it's only 4 days)


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Vic Eldred
1  author  Vic Eldred    4 weeks ago

Happy Friday and a shout out to the man they tell us is way behind in the polls

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Don't forget to vote!

 
 
 
Kathleen
1.1  Kathleen  replied to  Vic Eldred @1    4 weeks ago

I did! : )

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.1.1  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Kathleen @1.1    4 weeks ago

You mean - you voted!  Good Girl!

 
 
 
Kathleen
1.1.2  Kathleen  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.1.1    4 weeks ago

Yep...

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.1.3  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Kathleen @1.1.2    4 weeks ago

I think I'll enjoy election night quietly, the way I intended last year. I don't know if I told you this, but I had a good friend who was a Clinton supporter last time around. She had told me the day before the election that she wouldn't be calling me the next day because she thought I'd be in a bad mood. Fast forward to election night when it became obvious that it was Trump who was on the verge of winning - that's when I gave her a call and informed her that it was Clinton that had to run the rest of the table to win.  She said "It isn't over yet!". I hung up the phone and with a big grin, rested back in my chair, put my feet up and soaked it all in. I'll never forget it!

 
 
 
Kathleen
1.1.4  Kathleen  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.1.3    4 weeks ago

I honestly don’t know how this is going to turn out. I thought for sure Hillary was going to win and look what happened.. lol I never go by those polls, only election night. It would be nice if the one I voted for wins. : )

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.1.5  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Kathleen @1.1.4    4 weeks ago

Look at the way Trump supporters are demeaned and smeared. They've even been attacked. Do you really think they are going to take part in polls?  I wouldn't be surprised if this turns out to be a big red wave. Anything can happen. It's best to take it all with a grain of salt.


 It would be nice that the one I voted for wins. : )

I'm with ya!

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
1.1.6  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Kathleen @1.1.4    4 weeks ago

I couldn't believe it when I woke up the next morning. I went to bed earlier than I normally would and couldn't believe the news alert on my phone when I got up that morning. I just had to sit for a minute and let it soak in. I expected that it would have been the opposite. I smiled all the way to work.......................

 
 
 
Texan1211
1.1.7  Texan1211  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @1.1.6    4 weeks ago

I stayed up late, and man, was it worth it!

I had lots of fun flipping channels and seeing the utter disbelief in the newscasters faces and in their words.

 
 
 
Kathleen
1.1.8  Kathleen  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @1.1.6    4 weeks ago

I watched the whole thing, I remember running downstairs to the basement to tell my husband. He was watching a movie... lol  

We shall see......

 
 
 
JaneDoe
1.1.9  JaneDoe  replied to  Kathleen @1.1.4    4 weeks ago

I thought Hillary had it in the bag too. After all that is what we were hearing from the media for weeks leading up to election night. It was very surprising as each state was called and Trump torn down the blue wall. Time will tell what 2020 has in store for us. I really can’t wait for it to be over. All the ads, commercials etc... have become tiresome.

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
1.1.10  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JaneDoe @1.1.9    4 weeks ago
All the ads, commercials etc... have become tiresome.

Agreed. I have a 30 minute drive to work and turn the radio off about 5 times on that trip cuz I just don't want to hear it anymore. It's all, or mostly, crap. I pointed out to our neighbor the other night what to look for on TV ads making bombastic claims about the opponent. So and so voted for this.............while factual, I told him to look at the fine print underneath the claim. If  it is fact, they show the date of said vote. Most of the ads I have seen the "dirty deeds" were done 5-10 and even MORE years ago. He said....."Oh never noticed that".

 
 
 
JaneDoe
1.1.11  JaneDoe  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @1.1.10    4 weeks ago
It's all, or mostly, crap.

It sure is! It’s sad to think that some people would be swayed one way or another by a BS ad.

 
 
 
Kathleen
1.1.12  Kathleen  replied to  JaneDoe @1.1.9    4 weeks ago

Me too!

I get so many emails. I have two neighbors across the street fighting with each other and I am sick of hearing it dominate the news.

 
 
 
JaneDoe
1.1.13  JaneDoe  replied to  Kathleen @1.1.12    4 weeks ago

I get phone and text messages daily. Apparently whoever had my number before me was very active in the political arena. 

 
 
 
Split Personality
1.1.14  Split Personality  replied to  JaneDoe @1.1.13    4 weeks ago

I am on both parties lists and

we are being solicited by email about 150 times a day.

Looking forward to the end of it.

 
 
 
devangelical
1.1.15  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.14    4 weeks ago

I'm getting sick of sending STOP to all the texts I receive from nazis and white supremacists.

 
 
 
bugsy
1.1.16  bugsy  replied to  devangelical @1.1.15    4 weeks ago

Yea me too, but the DNC and the Biden campaign somehow keep sending them to me, probably through different email accounts. I usually reply before I hit the STOP feature and say "Put Joe and Hunter in jail first".

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
1.2  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Vic Eldred @1    4 weeks ago
Don't forget to vote!

Don't worry, I didn't forget. Thanks for your encouragement Vic!

Vote this incompetent inept corrupt piece of shit out of the white house!

History will remember which side of this election you were on, do you really want to admit to your grandchildren that you voted for the admitted pussy grabber?

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
2  author  Vic Eldred    4 weeks ago

Do people lie to pollsters?

“Yes,”  says Robert Cahaly, Trafalgar Group's Cheif Pollster, “but they’re not necessarily doing anything wrong. If a grandmother says, ‘This is my grandson, isn’t he a handsome boy?’ and you can see he’s anything but handsome—he’s sickly and weird-looking—you don’t say, ‘No, he’s sickly and weird-looking.’ You just say, ‘He sure is.’ ”

 
 
 
JohnRussell
2.1  JohnRussell  replied to  Vic Eldred @2    4 weeks ago

Vic, you told me yesterday that I couldnt prove Trump is a liar. 

Last night I posted a seed that demonstrates a couple of Trump's bald lies from yesterday. 

You need better standards man. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
2.1.1  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  JohnRussell @2.1    4 weeks ago
Vic, you told me yesterday that I couldnt prove Trump is a liar.  Last night I posted a seed that demonstrates a couple of Trump's bald lies from yesterday. 

I'm glad I got you thinking and working. I will check it out. What' the title?

 
 
 
JohnRussell
2.1.2  JohnRussell  replied to  Vic Eldred @2.1.1    4 weeks ago

It doesnt take a lot of thought or effort to produce Donald Trump lies , they're everywhere. 

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
2.2  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Vic Eldred @2    4 weeks ago
Do people lie to pollsters?

People don't usually lie to pollster,  [DELETED]

 
 
 
JohnRussell
3  JohnRussell    4 weeks ago
Is it the educated elite? Or the hard working, noble, middle Americans?

This  is presented as an either or.  lol. 

There are plenty of "hard working, noble, middle Americans" that can't stand your president*. 

I doubt you have much in common with Michael Moore. His objection to Biden is that he isnt progressive enough.  Still Moore is telling everyone to vote for Biden and is working for it. He just wants the new administration, should there be one, to enact policies to help middle Americans as well as special interest groups. 

Those who refuse to admit Donald Trump is not fit for office are placing themselves outside the new mainstream should Biden be elected. We are not going to go through this shit with trumpster diehards for four more years. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  JohnRussell @3    4 weeks ago
There are plenty of "hard working, noble, middle Americans" that can't stand your president*. 

Doesn't it also work the other way?  Are there no educated elitists voting for Trump?


I doubt you have much in common with Michael Moore.

Correct. He is an obese progressive.


 His objection to Biden is that he isnt progressive enough.  Still Moore is telling everyone to vote for Biden and is working for it. He just wants the new administration, should there be one, to enact policies to help middle Americans as well as special interest groups. 

I know all that, John, but he understands Trump's appeal to middle America. You don't seem to understand that.


 We are not going to go through this shit with trumpster diehards for four more years. 

We will become as Lincoln once said "one or the other."  We can not co-exist much longer....that is for sure!

 
 
 
Sparty On
4  Sparty On    4 weeks ago

Glad my hood is finally rid of that slug.  

He's right where he belongs .... The SRC ....... Socialists Republic of California

 
 
 
Tessylo
4.1  Tessylo  replied to  Sparty On @4    4 weeks ago

[DELETED]

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5  author  Vic Eldred    4 weeks ago

Let us not forget that, regardless of the outcome next week, the media is actively at war with half of the American people and are desperately working to rig an election against them.

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
5.1  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @5    4 weeks ago

The surge in COVID this past week has made that VERY simple to do....

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.1.1  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @5.1    4 weeks ago

Don't you just love the states that won't count & verify (a tedious process) mail-in ballots until election day?

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
5.1.2  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.1    4 weeks ago

It is just wrong on so many levels .. no one needs a repeat of 2000 ... I sat there watching every hanging chad moment on MSNBC .. the station was not quite so biased in 2000....

Montana has a website where those that vote early can actually check if their ballot was received .. I am sure other states do as well .. people need to track their ballots...!

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.1.3  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @5.1.2    4 weeks ago
I sat there watching every hanging chad moment on MSNBC

Do you realize that the Gore people were contesting military ballots (supposedly they tend to go Republican). They were seeking to get them tossed if they weren't dated or witnessed!


Montana has a website where those that vote early can actually check if their ballot was received

MA as well.


people need to track their ballots...!

It is a must these days. The elites have corrupted every institution to the point where we can't trust anything......Once we can't trust the people who handle elections, it's just about over.

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
5.1.4  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.3    4 weeks ago
Do you realize that the Gore people were contesting military ballots (supposedly they tend to go Republican). They were seeking to get them tossed if they weren't dated or witnessed!

Albeit it will not be the Gore people this go round .. but I have a feeling both sides will be doing their share of contesting battle ground states depending on how close the vote is and how long it takes to count...

P.s.... Gore also made a mistake by waiting til December to request a statewide recount ... it is said he actually won .. but did not fight hard enough.  who knows!

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.1.5  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @5.1.4    4 weeks ago
but I have a feeling both sides will be doing their share of contesting battle ground states depending on how close the vote is and how long it takes to count...

If it is that close, I'm guessing that it will be PA that will become the bloodbath for the 2020 election.


P.s.... Gore also made a mistake by waiting til December to request a statewide recount 

He only looked for a recount of heavily democrat leaning districts.

That was truly an establishment v establishment election.

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
5.1.6  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.5    4 weeks ago

Good point .. I think you are correct it will be PA ... yet WI, MI could be subject to the scrutiny as well - FL will always be a battle ground with Miami Dade and Broward county .. I have read that (D)'s are already concerned about Miami Dade GOP turnout

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.1.7  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @5.1.6    4 weeks ago
I think you are correct it will be PA

It has that silly rule about letting people send in ballots right up to election day and three days after to count them. It has 20 electoral votes (a fairly good size population) and it is a crucial state for the President. I think Biden lost PA with his "fracking" flip-flops + his energy policy. The way it will all play out is that those election day ballots will be counted first, giving Trump a big lead and that will lead to the democrats sending their lawyers out for that long slow count of mail in ballots. I'm sure we'll all be asking "how many more ballots are out there?" by the following week.

 FL will always be a battle ground with Miami Dade and Broward county .

Miami Dade is home to the proud, patriotic Cuban American population, who never forgot the horrors of Castro, Socialism and one party rule. (Not to mention what JFK or Bill Clinton did). They are the backbone of the GOP in Florida. I expect Trump to win Florida by 5-10 points. There won't be any chaos there.

Also note that the 2018 midterms were a bit of a blue wave - one which Florida defied!

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
5.1.8  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.7    4 weeks ago
I'm sure we'll all be saying "how many more ballots are out there?" by the following week.

Ugghhh!  I am so ready for this election to be over .. yet now you just keep reminding me of just how long it may take to get this election over with!

Trump has gained ground among Latino voters in FL  TX and CA depending on the site one reads ... Trump received 22% of the FL Latino vote in 2016 ... up to 35 to 44% (once again depending on the site) for 2020 ... big jump if it turns out to be true ..

P.s... did not Obama end Dry foot Wet foot immigration for Cubans?  

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.1.9  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @5.1.8    4 weeks ago
Ugghhh!  I am so ready for this election to be over .. yet now you just keep reminding me of just how long it may take to get this election over with!

I think most people feel that way.


Trump has gained ground among Latino voters in FL  TX and CA depending on the site one reads ... Trump received 22% of the FL Latino vote in 2016 ... up to 35 to 44% (once again depending on the site) for 2020 ... big jump if it turns out to be true ..

I believe it will


P.s... did not Obama end Dry foot Wet foot immigration for Cubans?  

Not that I know of

 
 
 
JaneDoe
5.1.10  JaneDoe  replied to  Colour Me Free @5.1.8    4 weeks ago
did not Obama end Dry foot Wet foot immigration for Cubans?

Yes he did.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.1.11  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  JaneDoe @5.1.10    4 weeks ago

And he did it on his way out the door!

Thank you Jane.

 
 
 
JaneDoe
5.1.12  JaneDoe  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.11    4 weeks ago

You’re welcome.

And he did it on his way out the door!

Yep, and the Miami Mayor Tomás Regalado called the the policy change “a gift” from Obama to Castro. 

 
 
 
Jasper2529
5.1.13  Jasper2529  replied to  JaneDoe @5.1.12    4 weeks ago
 the the policy change “a gift” from Obama to Castro. 

Obama certainly loved his totalitarian, Socialist, Marxist, Communist pals before and during his tenure. In retrospect, it seems that was what he meant in 2008 when he said he would fundamentally transform America.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
5.2  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Vic Eldred @5    4 weeks ago
Let us not forget that, regardless of the outcome next week, the media is actively at war with half of the American people

Not really, it's about a third of Americans who are at war with reality. [DELETED]

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6  Colour Me Free    4 weeks ago

This is the second time that I have agreed with Michael Moore - in 2016 it was rather apparent that many were simply staying silent as to whom they would be voting for .. I witnessed it repeatedly at the gun club on league nights, words were coming out of their mouths, but their body language did not support that they would not be voting Trump (especially among women) .. 

2020 is a different beast .. one would / should think Biden is a shoe in because of the pandemic - but people are pandemic weary .. ultimately the economy may be what undecided individuals will be looking at when casting their vote .. who knows ........ it is however quite exciting to see the voter turn out.   

I voted a mixed ticket on state and local elections, my vote is more important on this level - Montana will go to Trump .. as I have said many times, I support the Electoral College .. so I cannot bitch about our 3 votes going to Trump.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6    4 weeks ago
it is however quite exciting to see the voter turn out.   

It is in some places off the charts, however I think this is an important stat going into this very unusual election:

State % of Population   Number of Registered Voters
Maine 77.10% 828,000
Mississippi 72.90% 1,599,000
Michigan 71.20% 5,453,000
North Dakota 70.90% 397,000
Kentucky 70.90% 2,389,000
Minnesota 70.80% 3,000,000
Missouri 70.60% 3,299,000
Wisconsin 70.50% 3,129,000
Montana 70.40% 579,000
Iowa 69.80% 1,658,000
Oregon 69.10% 2,274,000
Ohio 68.30% 6,062,000
Vermont 68.10% 343,000
Kansas 67.40% 1,449,000
New Hampshire 67.20% 726,000
Washington 66.70% 3,852,000
Alabama 66.40% 2,490,000
Maryland 66.30% 3,095,000
South Dakota 66.20% 429,000
Louisiana 65.40% 2,263,000
Pennsylvania 65.20% 6,469,000
North Carolina 65.20% 5,160,000
Virginia 65.10% 4,159,000
Alaska 64.40% 337,000
Utah 64.20% 1,443,000
Rhode Island 64.20% 532,000
West Virginia 63.40% 892,000
Indiana 62.50% 3,131,000
Wyoming 62.40% 268,000
Illinois 62.40% 6,068,000
Delaware 62.40% 472,000
South Carolina 62.10% 2,430,000
Oklahoma 62.00% 1,777,000
Nebraska 61.90% 883,000
Georgia 61.70% 4,840,000
New Jersey 61.30% 4,297,000
Massachusetts 61.30% 3,345,000
Tennessee 61.20% 3,183,000
Connecticut 60.90% 1,726,000
Colorado 60.80% 2,645,000
Arizona 60.80% 3,262,000
New Mexico 58.10% 916,000
Idaho 57.20% 743,000
Florida 56.00% 9,435,000
Arkansas 55.80% 1,262,000
New York 55.30% 8,553,000
Texas 55.20% 11,634,000
Nevada 55.00% 1,277,000
California 51.90% 15,690,000
Hawaii 49.50% 523,000

Number Of Registered Voters by State 2020

HOW CLOSE WILL SOME STATES GET TO 100% PARTICIPATION?

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.1  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1    4 weeks ago

Thanks Vic ... some of those numbers of percentage of population is surprising  NY at 55.3% ... CA at 51.9% do not know why I thought that the voter numbers would be higher ... have always been proud of Montana's numbers - we have same day registration.. have a hunch our numbers will be higher this year.  There are a large number of foreign invaders moving into my state this year, said invaders are driving the cost of housing up - time to fence Montana!

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.2  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.1    4 weeks ago

I'm assuming the CA numbers reflect the huge non-citizen population, however I suspect those people are voting out there. NY may also reflect some of that. It is an immigration center of a slightly different stripe.


  There are a large number of foreign invaders moving into my state this year, said invaders are driving the cost of housing up - time to fence Montana!

I hear ya. Florida and Texas are in the same boat!

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.3  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.2    4 weeks ago

My good friend in Dallas has been telling me CA is invading TX - isn't FL's population always in flux?

Soooo frustrating .. it would not be quite so bad if the invaders left their politics where they came from ... one cannot come from NY or CA and keep their politics intact - things are just not the same in Montana or Texas (I know so lil about FL) as they are on the left and east coast!

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.4  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.3    4 weeks ago
My good friend in Dallas has been telling me CA is invading TX

Oh yes, CA has taxed the middle class right out of the state. Texas is booming. Just close enough. Some bring their bad habits with them.


 isn't FL's population always in flux?

Florida, because of it's climate and amenities has been a desirable location for a while. In 1940 the population of Florida was 1.8 Million. Today it is 21.4 Million.




Soooo frustrating .. it would not be quite so bad if the invaders left their politics where they came from ... one cannot come from NY or CA and keep their politics intact - things are just not the same in Montana or Texas (I know so lil about FL) as they are on the left and east coast!

It seems they never learn. They vote for the same things that made life unbearable.

Those are supposed to be the two Republican bastions, yet they cannot be colored red immediately, unlike CA and NY which are perpetually blue.

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.5  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.4    4 weeks ago
In 1940 the population of Florida was 1.8 Million. Today it is 21.4 Million.

Population is one of FL's biggest downfalls .. so busy filling in natural wetlands in order to accommodate growth - that when the hurricanes hit, there is no place for the water to go but up... same is true about the wetlands in the Houston TX area .. our natural wetlands are so important - yet so disrespected!

Ooops I strayed from topic....

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
6.1.6  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.4    4 weeks ago
Oh yes, CA has taxed the middle class right out of the state. Texas is booming. Just close enough. Some bring their bad habits with them.

Basically the same thing is happening here in NC. And not just California people. Those from the northeast, particularly NY, NJ, MD, and PA are and have been moving here in droves bringing their liberal ideals with them. 

256

 
 
 
Texan1211
6.1.7  Texan1211  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.6    4 weeks ago

What amazes me is that many of those same folks fleeing overtaxed liberal states continue to vote for the same party and policies they fled from.

Illogical.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.8  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.5    4 weeks ago

The Army Corps of Engineers basically straightened an entire river. The size of the Everglades was reduced by as much as half. All to alter a state for development.


our natural wetlands are so important - yet so disrespected!

Agreed. Can we save what is left?


Ooops I strayed from topic....

I'm leaving this one wide open

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.9  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.6    4 weeks ago
Ooops I strayed from topic....

NC was affordable - I guess it was inevitable!

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.10  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.8    4 weeks ago
Agreed. Can we save what is left?

YES!  by just stopping further development and protecting said lands.. sadly states are so desperate for revenue getting said lands protected is not an easy task .. In Montana land owners are leaving large swaths of their property in land trusts that can never be developed (this is key to saving wide open spaces and wetlands) 

When I worked for the NRCS (Natural Resource Conservation Service) the federal government was offering 99 year government leases for ranchers / farmers lands to leave the land natural or returning to original .. all said farmer and ranchers had to do was follow guidelines on grazing and water use.  Gov.co was also assisting ranchers and farmers with pivot purchases for irrigation .. once again taking the pressure off of the wetlands.. 

Trees are my passion .. 'we' have to begin cleaning out our forest to help during wildfire season and with 'climate change'..  protecting our wetlands in order to help prevent such severe devastation of hurricanes and 'climate change' .. sadly there is no way to stop the tornado .. no matter what we do....

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.11  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.9    4 weeks ago

Think this is the same thing happening in Montana .. it is affordable to live here .. wide open spaces and public lands are drawing people - especially the land developers!

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.12  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.10    4 weeks ago
Trees are my passion .. 'we' have to begin cleaning out our forest to help during wildfire season and with 'climate change'.

Get the message to Gov Newsom


  protecting our wetlands in order to help prevent such severe devastation of hurricanes and 'climate change' .. sadly there is no way to stop the tornado .. no matter what we do

And to protect the balance of nature. Those are breeding grounds for certain species.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.13  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.11    4 weeks ago
especially the land developers!

Please keep them away from where members of the 7th Calvary are buried.

 
 
 
r.t..b...
6.1.14  r.t..b...  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.13    4 weeks ago

Agreed.
That should be an area dedicated to the sheer arrogance and ultimate repudiation of our belief in Manifest Destiny. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.15  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  r.t..b... @6.1.14    4 weeks ago

That is one way of looking at it. Others may say it was more about protecting citizens who had flocked into the Black Hills searching for Gold.

The General may have put it best when asked where the 7th was going?  Custer told him -to Hell or to Glory, you see, it depends upon one's point of view!


I guess this really has become wide open!

 
 
 
r.t..b...
6.1.16  r.t..b...  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.15    4 weeks ago

Perspective is indeed relative.

One can look at the historical record and make excuses to fit any number of narratives...while another may look at the same record and see the injustices taken at the expense of many to justify the benefits to the few, yet powerful.

It seems an age old dilemma that we have yet to rectify. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.17  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  r.t..b... @6.1.16    4 weeks ago
that we have yet to rectify. 

What do you mean?

 
 
 
Kavika
6.1.18  Kavika   replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.15    4 weeks ago
That is one way of looking at it. Others may say it was more about protecting citizens who had flocked into the Black Hills searching for Gold.

This was illegal since the Fort Laramie Treaty of 1868 specified that the Black Hills belonged to the great Sioux Nation. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.19  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Kavika @6.1.18    4 weeks ago

Correct!  Yet those people did run in there after the Gold.  What was the government to do?

Another question raised involved "rectifying the past."  I'm still trying to understand that.

 
 
 
r.t..b...
6.1.20  r.t..b...  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.17    4 weeks ago

An honest question that deserves an honest answer.
Our country was founded upon the principle of equality for all its citizenry. While we have made strides and some may contend the opportunity has always existed, it still exists on an uneven playing field. To truly level the playing field is to rectify our past indiscretions and achieve all we were promised. The concept of equality does not guarantee the reality of equity...and the disparity between the two will only be diminished in rectifying our past and not making the same mistakes going forward. 

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
6.1.21  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.7    4 weeks ago
What amazes me is that many of those same folks fleeing overtaxed liberal states continue to vote for the same party and policies they fled from. Illogical.

They're not really "fleeing" so much as moving to rural States and communities now that they can work from home with their tech jobs, and they move there to take advantage of the dirt cheap housing prices and the fact that their vote will now weigh three times more. Now that triple strength vote will be going towards liberal and progressive Presidential candidates to turn those deep red electoral college pockets at least purple if not blue. Once progressives spread out all across America we won't have to suffer from brainless religious conservatives getting elected and can finally move our nation into the 21st century.

 
 
 
Texan1211
6.1.22  Texan1211  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @6.1.21    4 weeks ago

I defy you to show where anyone moved because of voting. thats stupid.

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.23  Colour Me Free  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @6.1.21    4 weeks ago
Once progressives spread out all across America 

Just like a deadly pandemic....!

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.24  Colour Me Free  replied to  Kavika @6.1.18    4 weeks ago

Grant is the one that did the most damage .. started an illegal war, then lied about it .. sold mining rights  ... never understood how Grant has not gotten a blacker eye in history for the things he did...

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.25  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.15    4 weeks ago
I guess this really has become wide open!

My bad ...  : )

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.26  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.13    4 weeks ago
Please keep them away from where members of the 7th Calvary are buried.

Montana takes preservation very seriously .. the battle field is well preserved .. the visitors center / museum has expanded, Native Americans now have far more representation..

When I was in college a group excavated part of the battle field .. it was very interesting .. the Native Americans out gunned the soldiers, it was discovered that they had weapons that the military did not have.... 

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.27  Colour Me Free  replied to  r.t..b... @6.1.20    4 weeks ago
.and the disparity between the two will only be diminished in rectifying our past and not making the same mistakes going forward. 

Hello razing ...

How can it now be rectified? .. not making the same mistakes going forward I understand, it is def time to make the needed changes so that all have the same representation and opportunities in the United States .. but as to rectifying the events of the past / reparations .. that I do not understand. 

My great great grandfather was born in the Montana territory and was an individuals accepted by the Crow Nation .. his family was allowed to farm ..  my great grandfather was 2 years older than the state - showed me as a child the wild horses of the Pryor Mountains - taught me to respect the ways / cultures of others ... not all whites treated the natives or blacks as other did...

 
 
 
Kavika
6.1.28  Kavika   replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.19    4 weeks ago
What was the government to do?

Follow the treaty which SCOTUS called the highest law in the land.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.29  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.25    4 weeks ago

It's fine, I want it that way.

 
 
 
r.t..b...
6.1.30  r.t..b...  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.27    4 weeks ago

Hello to you, friend.

Perhaps acknowledge would be a more appropriate word than rectify in this discussion.
Kudos to your ancestors for bestowing their respect upon those who came before. If only that was the lesson we had all learned and applied.
As our families have blended race and culture perhaps we are more sensitive (in the positive connotation) to the biases still ingrained in our society.

Peace, as always, and in all ways. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.31  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  r.t..b... @6.1.20    4 weeks ago
Our country was founded upon the principle of equality for all its citizenry.

True.


While we have made strides and some may contend the opportunity has always existed, it still exists on an uneven playing field. 

The opportunity did not exist until after "reconstruction." It has been an evolving process. Today the playing field is level.


To truly level the playing field is to rectify our past indiscretions and achieve all we were promised.

"our" past indiscretions? I'm sorry, that's not true. There is nobody alive today who was part of that. It is divisive to promote such an idea.


The concept of equality does not guarantee the reality of equity...and the disparity between the two will only be diminished in rectifying our past and not making the same mistakes going forward. 

I don't see most of us making the same mistakes. There are those who seem to want some form of retribution. That would be a mistake.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.32  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.26    4 weeks ago

I don't know if I'll ever get out there, but I'm glad to hear it.


 the Native Americans out gunned the soldiers, it was discovered that they had weapons that the military did not have.... 

Along with the mutilation of the bodies.... I understand there are body parts mixed up in various graves.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.33  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Kavika @6.1.28    4 weeks ago

That we shall.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
6.1.34  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.22    4 weeks ago
I defy you to show where anyone moved because of voting. thats stupid.

I've had multiple central California clients tell me they were moving to rural red states to try and boost progressive voting in swing States that has been recently going to Republicans so I know it's happening, but you can be in denial all you want. I've also had many wealthy Republicans moving to California from States like Texas because they have the money and they want the California lifestyle of comfortable temperate climate and beautiful coastal scenery. I live in a little town on the California coast and the average 1200 sq ft fixer-upper goes for around $900k (the remodeled homes run $2-$7M). So middle income progressives have been moving out while wealthy conservatives have been moving in. The difference now is that the conservatives aren't really importing their conservative values, they turn into ecological warriors when it's their beautiful coastline and backyards that are at risk of offshore drilling and inland fracking. Funny how that happens.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
6.1.35  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.23    4 weeks ago
Just like a deadly pandemic....!

[DELETED]

 
 
 
Texan1211
6.1.36  Texan1211  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @6.1.34    4 weeks ago

that's hilarious!

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
6.1.37  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.36    4 weeks ago

I'm glad you think so.  [DELETED]

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
6.1.38  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.33    4 weeks ago
That we shall.

[DELETED]

 
 
 
Kavika
6.1.39  Kavika   replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.33    4 weeks ago
That we shall.

Then it will be a first.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.40  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @6.1.34    4 weeks ago
I've had multiple central California clients tell me they were moving to rural red states to try and boost progressive voting

That's funny.

 
 
 
Texan1211
6.1.41  Texan1211  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.40    4 weeks ago

have you ever heard of something as far-fetched as THAT?

maybe they smoke too much there!

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.42  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.29    4 weeks ago

A good discussion is always nice to have .. sometimes defining the topic does not allow individuals to see other sides...

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
6.1.43  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.40    4 weeks ago

Wow. I guess statements of truth are considered "taunting" now. I guess you'll be locking this seed soon so no one can respond as per your usual tactic. Thanks for proving me right Vic. I'll have fun commenting on your mindless seeds next Tuesday [DELETED]

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.44  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.42    4 weeks ago

Sometimes the best ones are without borders.

 
 
 
Texan1211
6.1.45  Texan1211  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.40    4 weeks ago

Perhaps conservatives are smart enough to not uproot their families and moving to a different state to affect voting?

like one family will make a difference in a state with millions!

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.46  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @6.1.43    4 weeks ago
I guess statements of truth are considered "taunting" now.

Nope - Truth has nothing to do with taunting and smearing. Over here it will be those who provoke who gets the ticket - not the person you incite.

 I guess you'll be locking this seed soon so no one can respond as per your usual tactic. 

Believe it or not, it is at my discretion, not yours or even Bill Ayers.


Thanks for proving me right Vic. 

You are not right. Your endless trolling should have been ended long ago.


I'll have fun commenting on your mindless seeds next Tuesday as you gnash your teeth in anger and frustration over a pitiful ass kicking of Trump and his whole worthless cadre of bigots and money grubbing enablers.

I wonder if you'll even be here after the election.

 
 
 
Gazoo
6.1.47  Gazoo  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.45    4 weeks ago

Truth be told they are most likely fleeing california because it is a high tax, crime infested, liberal shithole.

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.48  Colour Me Free  replied to  r.t..b... @6.1.30    4 weeks ago

Hi again...

Southeastern Montana was not an overly friendly environment back in the day .. winter comes on hard in the eastern side of the state.  great grandad told many stories about his (my moms) side of the family (was tapped for information by more than one historian).. the prejudices / stereotypes here are against the Native population .. grandad would hear nothing of it .. "Custer's last stand" was not overly far, as the crow flies, from the original homestead .. the stories I learned were a bit different than the history I was taught in school .. if not for my grandad I am sure that I would be guilty of the same stereotypical thoughts ..

I am a child of the 70's in Montana - my Social studies / state history teachers and I argued often, starting in the 5th grade .. that and a guy I went from 1st  grade to 8th grade with, his dad was our little league coach and the brother of Leonard Peltier .. learned a great deal at a young age. 

I know you read ... I recommend the book In the Spirit of Crazy Horse by Peter Matthiessen

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
6.1.49  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.46    4 weeks ago
it is at my discretion, not yours or even Bill Ayers.

[DELETED]

I wonder if you'll even be here after the election.

[DELETED]

I'll be here on NT commenting regardless of who wins [DELETED]

 
 
 
Texan1211
6.1.50  Texan1211  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @6.1.49    4 weeks ago

calm down, nobody called you a terrorist.

no one threatened to kill you. either.

no need for histrionics

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.51  Colour Me Free  replied to  Vic Eldred @6.1.44    4 weeks ago

Just ask razing or Just Jim .. I am a derailer - not really intentionally (most of the time) but I like asking questions, especially of those that have no true agenda .. but plenty of knowledge to share..

With everything that has been taking place in society at this time .. paired with the upcoming election ... a good conversation is needed..

Ooo and about the mutilation on the battle field .. I am not certain that it has been really proven what was story and what wasn't ... it is not something I have much knowledge of .. however, by that point in history, I think there was plenty of carnage to go around...  

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.52  Colour Me Free  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.48    4 weeks ago

P.s... hope you had a great visit  : )

 
 
 
Gazoo
6.1.53  Gazoo  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @6.1.49    4 weeks ago

”Is that a death threat?”

Lmao, where did that drama queen of the decade statement come from? I took it to mean that if trump wins you’ll stay away from nters for a bit. That’s all.

 
 
 
Texan1211
6.1.54  Texan1211  replied to  Gazoo @6.1.53    4 weeks ago

skyscreamers are so delicate and melodramatic!

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
6.1.55  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.50    4 weeks ago

Thanks for trying to calm me down, but I wasn't really upset, [DELETED]

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
6.1.56  Colour Me Free  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.48    4 weeks ago
brother of Leonard Peltier

I could be wrong .. may be cousin .. but I am thinking brother

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1.57  author  Vic Eldred  replied to  Colour Me Free @6.1.51    4 weeks ago
Ooo and about the mutilation on the battle field .. I am not certain that it has been really proven what was story and what wasn't ... it is not something I have much knowledge of .. however, by that point in history, I think there was plenty of carnage to go around...  

I'm sure. Fair enough.

Interstate 90?

 
 
 
Gazoo
6.1.58  Gazoo  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.54    4 weeks ago

Lol, that was quite bizarre!

 
 
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