Reject Newsom’s ‘Science’ Statements: Gov’t Is Overreaching; Principled Resistance Is Necessary
By: David Lane
The resistance to the anti science edicts and demands of blue city mayors and blue state governors is on and we who are believers have belief supported justification for doing so. We will not wear face diapers in areas it’s an unreasonable expectation not backed by science. We will not lock down and hide. We won’t close our schools or churches. We will assemble in reopen the economy, back the blue, pro Trump events and outdoor worship events no matter the degree of Karen opposition. Especially when they let BLM and women’s marches out. The resistance to unreasonable restrictions to our constitutional freedoms is just beginning!
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
Surge Summary: California Governor Gavin Newsom is using alleged “science” as an excuse to clamp down on liberty and religious freedom. Freedom valuing Americans — and especially Christians — have a duty, meanwhile, to respectfully but firmly resist his brewing tyranny.
by David Lane
California Gov. Gavin Newsom labeled churches as “nonessential” in his startlingly alarmist edict of March 19, 2020, while arbitrarily deeming liquor stores, marijuana dispensaries, Costcos and Walmarts “essential.”
Equally high-handedly as off-handedly pronouncing that “56% of Californians—25.5 million people—could be infected with coronavirus in the next two months,” Newsom stated emphatically, “We are going to do the right thing, not judge by politics, not judge by protests, but by science.”
He evidently meant “political pseudo-science” as his reckless and vainglorious swagger into medical territory turned out to be off by no less than 98%.
No one will mistake Gov. Newsom’s foolhardy and absurdist stance in the name of science for rational wisdom or insightful foresight, but what is most objectionable about it is that such pseudo-science masquerades as genuine science.
Along with other blue state governors, Gov. Newsom’s dictates are a deplorable example of the devastating cultural and economical impact of health scare policies based on fallacies and factually baseless or scientifically unfounded claims.
To paraphrase 1 Samuel 17:26, we may ask: Who is this Philistine giant that he should defy the armies of the living God?
There is a thin line between compliance—the tendency of conforming with or agreeing to the commands/demands of others—and complicity, particularly when they are unjust or unjustified.
According to Daniel Dreisbach, “No question on the minds of pious Americans in the midst of a growing conflict with Great Britain”—and one could argue in the midst of the current conflict between secularism and Christianity—”was more pressing or difficult than this: ‘Do citizens ever have a right or even a duty to resist an unjust, tyrannical ruler?’ Does a civil magistrate who disregards the divinely ordained responsibilities of the office, to restate the question from the ruler’s perspective, forfeit the office and, thereby, the citizen’s duty to obey?”
The biblical texts most often cited as seemingly supporting the doctrines of compliance, unlimited submission or passive obedience and nonresistance are Romans 13:1-7 and 1 Peter 2:13-17.
The self-evident caveat in these passages is that the “governing authorities” must rule in accordance with God’s law. They must uphold divine law, protect the good and destroy the bad. Rulers who violate the law of God or whose commands are contrary to God’s law should be resisted.
Far from consenting that Romans 13:1-7 compels unlimited submission to civil authorities, congregational minister Jonathan Mayhew (1720-1766) argued that Scripture only instructs obedience to “a reasonable and just authority”—those rulers who serve the public good and fulfill the divine design of civil government.
In the words of Mayhew: “No civil rulers are to be obeyed when they enjoin things that are inconsistent with the commands of God. … All commands running counter to the declared will of the supreme legislator of heaven and earth are null and void. And therefore disobedience to them is a duty, not a crime.”
The French theologian, pastor and reformer John Calvin (1509-1564) justified defying civil rulers when obedience to the rulers compels disobedience to God. He considered those rulers to “spoil God of His right and as it were to occupy His throne.”
The New Hampshire Constitution of 1784 expressed it thus: “The doctrine of nonresistance against arbitrary power, and obsession, is absurd, slavish and destructive of the good and happiness of mankind.”
“For it is the will of God that by doing right you may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men” (1 Pet. 2:15).
This is in line with Acts 5:29, where it says, “We must obey God rather than men.”
In Matthew 22:21b, Jesus says “Render therefore unto Caesar the things that are Caesar’s; and unto God the things that are God’s.”
The biblically based political concepts that became central to the American system of constitutional government included the supremacy of higher law; law as the embodiment of reason, free from human passions; the divine source of inalienable rights; the contractual basis and, thus, limited character of civil government; the consent of the governed as the basis of legitimate civil authority; and the right of resistance against tyrannical, unjust rulers.
Pastor Rob McCoy (former Thousand Oaks mayor and city councilman) sent a clarion call to pastors at the Nonessential premiere on Oct. 18: Open California churches and put in check “tyrannical officials who have ruined our economy, closed our schools, divided our people between essential and nonessential and declared our churches as nonessential.”
Gideons and Rahabs are beginning to stand.
Tags
Who is online
77 visitors
In the words of Mayhew: “No civil rulers are to be obeyed when they enjoin things that are inconsistent with the commands of God. … All commands running counter to the declared will of the supreme legislator of heaven and earth are null and void. And therefore disobedience to them is a duty, not a crime.”
The French theologian, pastor and reformer John Calvin (1509-1564) justified defying civil rulers when obedience to the rulers compels disobedience to God. He considered those rulers to “spoil God of His right and as it were to occupy His throne.”
The New Hampshire Constitution of 1784 expressed it thus: “The doctrine of nonresistance against arbitrary power, and obsession, is absurd, slavish and destructive of the good and happiness of mankind.”
“For it is the will of God that by doing right you may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men” (1 Pet. 2:15).
This is in line with Acts 5:29, where it says, “We must obey God rather than men.”
In Matthew 22:21b, Jesus says “Render therefore unto Caesar the things that are Caesar’s; and unto God the things that are God’s.”
The biblically based political concepts that became central to the American system of constitutional government included the supremacy of higher law; law as the embodiment of reason, free from human passions; the divine source of inalienable rights; the contractual basis and, thus, limited character of civil government; the consent of the governed as the basis of legitimate civil authority; and the right of resistance against tyrannical, unjust rulers.
https://thenewstalkers.com/vic-eldred/group_discuss/10894/reject-newsoms-science-statements-govt-is-overreaching-principled-resistance-is-necessary
https://www.instagram.com/p/CG-QhDmJ9ha/?igshid=1alaxxvbbms74
"Unjust rulers." The mere experience of the "State of Jefferson" (Shasta County, CA) aligning its congregations (but not all) with a liar, cheater, and thief like Donald Trump speaks volumes that words can not carry.
[This comment stands. MAGA, you can't post a link to a post about Trump, then declare Trump off topic. But you knew that already.]
Yeo-- a bunch of total nutcases-- no doubt about it!
We are the focal point of resistance in California to Newscum and his mandates, and not just regarding Wuhan virus.
It is your lives, and it's my faith too. I will defend our mutual faith against those who would manipulate it for ungodly and unseemly purposes. God has instructed the people who love to be the least selfish of mankind. Is that occurring is something to ponder! Had God shut down and out any of God's critics where would any one of us be?
Yes I know Xx, you and yours are resistant to everything California EXCEPT accepting STATE subsidies...
We’d rather be our own state but as long as we have to be a part of the Californication regime, we are going to take every last red cent we can get out of them. Our areas economy pre covid was at the national unemployment rate rather than the higher state numbers. We were booming and the area was greatly assisted by being the home of a mega Church that has a global impact and people from all over the world move here to attend it or it’s schools and start businesses here.
the defiance of the governors thanksgiving rules will be total and complete....I plan on openly defying them for that meal in every way shape and form.
You usually go to Aunt Maga's Buffet in town, right ? That'll show 'em !
Darwinian.
Only in your wildest 'Superman' dreams. And I can assure you that not everyone who lives in your area agrees with your wrongly imagined arrogant dreams.
Yes, I KNOW Xx. Your cause proclaims to be all about independence and all it promotes is mooching off of the 'coastal elites'.
Do you mean the megachurch with the big Covid outbreak earlier this month?
Again, Darwinian.
You seem to think everyone else "owes" the conservatives bigots in rural CA because nobody listens to their incessant whining and bitching about the rest of the State living as they wish. It's pretty sad that some rural bigots think they can't be happy in their own neck of the woods if gays are getting married in San Francisco or LA. Just being a "home of a megachurch" isn't going to be sustainable, you should think about finding a different way to support yourselves. That shit's going to dry up faster than a dustbowl farm.
No. I go to Lulu’s for a family style traditional thanksgiving food buffet/brunch. I plan to again.
The despotic dictator will have no say at all as to how I and my family celebrates Thanksgiving Or Christmas.
We have industry and had a decent economy before the mega church grew so big. Tourism will always be a key staple to sustain us with all our area has to offer. This is the mega church I’m not a member of that has strengthened our local economy. https://www.bethel.com
But the megachurch opened their School of Supernatural Ministry which attracts thousands of bat shit crazy people from all over the world, so there's that.
Of course, there is pushback, the 'Don't drink the Kool-Aid' stickers prove that.
They limited the student body to 2/3 normal and kept their cases insulated from the general population. They aren’t the source of Covid fatalities here. Two nursing homes for senior living are and that’s contained as well, thus we got the state to move us out of purple, that and that few intended to comply anyway and they didn’t want to expend the manpower to coerce. The bottom line is that that church didn’t lead in covid compliance resistance here but simply with their 1/9th of our city population mirrored the already existing tea party/pro Jefferson outlook already here. And yes there is an online publication A News Cafe that caters to the 25% here who are registered democrats and they’ve had an anti Bethel bias since way before the pandemic that generates what you describe. I don’t agree with Bethel theology in key areas but I welcome them here and their support for our economy.
Nice word dance there Xx. Bethel sure as hell IS a source of a Covid outbreak just this month and you know damn well the people in Redding are pissed off about it. Seriously Xx, I can research this shit faster than you can post lies about it.
We will not wear face diapers
Lol! Using this unusual terminology would seem to imply that you fully understand what is coming out of your mouths.
It’s only directed at deserving progressives. Actually the term came from a conservative cartoonist and I quickly saw how much blue City and Blue state leaders and their Karen supporters hate and loathe the term.
So this is simply provocation. Christianity be damned. Shame.
Correct! It is all just contrarian nonsense...
It’s simply a part of the resistance. Nothing more, nothing less.
and their Karen
It's actually non-mask wearers that are called Karens. Please get your insults straight.
There is nothing SIMPLE about a Christian, any Christian, misrepresenting this faith! And tying the faith to an abusive carnal preacher, pastor, or leader . Check this out:
A Christian man would be rebuked for impugning good people fighting to save lives. Do you agree with Trump's words here or do you rebuke him here and now?
Please get your insults straight.
Conservatives are so unimaginative that they need to steal labels now. They also steal music from artists to pump up their unimaginative campaigns. Ever notice how you will never hear a Kid Rock or Ted Nugent song in a Democrat campaign? Now they are trying as hard as they can to to steal an election. It’s not inaccurate to call Trump the Commander in Thief.
We are going to win this election fair and square....
I stand with and by President Trump because despite his flaws shared by fallen humanity he stands with us believers with his actions in office, policies, and appointments.
No. Karens are the ones who go into restaurants and pour peoples drinks on their food because they are eating while not wearing a mask. Karens are the guilt shakers who try to say or act in a way to lay guilt trips upon all who dare to presume to disagree with their masks absolutely everywhere, shutdown everything pseudoscience pseudo religion mantra/ dogma.
We stand proud and tall contrary to the Newscums, Cuomos, and Bidens of the world and make no apologies for it.
Untrue.
When did God start "paling around' around with liars, cheaters, and thieves to accomplish kingdom work? What does God have to do with Donald?
Some people must think pretty lowly of God's abilities to need Donald Trump as a 'servant.' In fact, You dodged the question:
Whether "you-all" win or lose, it won't be because of respect and fair treatment of your opponents! That lie won't square with the facts or spirit of the vote!
Trump intends that mail-in ballots will be rejected, that a massive, militarized response will crush widespread protests to the overthrow of the constitution, and that he will be established as the US' führer. [deleted]
He's the mobster gangster thug grifter thief CIC
NOT POSSIBLE
Your sides leaders may well lie and cheat in order to try to win but we and our side will not.
It’s actually certain.
Well this "duck and cover" maneuver being deployed by Trump supporters is not honorable. "Salt" that has lost it savor has no recourse or remedy!
I agree that the progressive left has not shown any respect for nor fair treatment of their opposition and opponents.
No, that is what Biden would become should he actually get into office.
What’s not possible is a fair and square legitimate electoral victory by Biden and his socialist party.
One should not mock oneself!
I only mock the progressive socialist left!
Jesus is put to shame when this is done. The world looks on and inwardly laughs at this testimony.
Bull shit, according to you,
judge and ye will be judged.
Checkmate.
Everything that falls out of their 'presidents' mouth is deserving of a 'face diaper'
* and his supporters
Everything that falls out of the former VP’s mouth is deserving of a 'face diaper'
* and his supporters
You know, no offense to Jewish people, but they will like their Old Testament back for its proper application.
Flap your gums all you want, the court upheld Newsome's restrictions.
Tissue?
He’s had to modify some of them...
Here we go again. Prove it Xx.
And MAGA and "friends," you do realize that this is God's coronavirus sent out in the world to accomplish whatsoever work God has sent it to do, yes? In which case, it would prosper combative and obstinate people to heed the warning to listen and stand down (off to the side) and be saved from the experience of going through its pain and misery!
https://www.instagram.com/p/CG-A8whAjdFEM072RxKQreGSDXsbInwH4F9igs0/?igshid=1mz79myhrmrka
Can't see it: No thumbs! Help!
Another site Instagram forced to go private. Big tech censorship.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CG-dRmCHCOb/?igshid=15va3zdl04ogb
Can't do it. Fingers too short to press keys. Help!
Y'all, like everybody else, have to abide rules and regulations. Or, do like you do take the show on the 'road' yourselves and deal with the consequences good and bad!
https://www.instagram.com/p/CHA7t57lIYI/?igshid=1w3aole3mffyy
Hands 'shot' - Help!
Do you really expect that if Biden and democrats win the election and impose nationwide mandates on mask wearing everywhere outside our home and or a national lockdown that red states who had been handling things differently under federalism are going to suddenly change course and comply? I don’t. Biden and co. will literally have to send tanks into the streets China style to coerce compliance from us.
No they won't bother, they will probably sigh and be content to have the same attitude as the current administration
and let y'all infect one another with the expected consequences.
However they will make sure hospitals are better taken care of and more gloves will be coming
and they will keep tending to the survivors as "pre-existing conditions" will ensure equal
medical care for all Americans whether COVID infection was a result of
chance or deliberate neglect.
99% of you predictions about what a Biden Administration will or won't do
with or without Congressional approval
is just baseless conjecture.
Red states are screwing our Union for their own purposes from the inside. Damn.
This is not about Joe Biden or mask per se, MAGA.
@5.1.4 I am referring to your written words in @5.1.2 about going private from tech sites. Tech business have rules, and people have leaders. Abide what is good and wholesome for all without being selfish and negligent.
This impossible notion that you seem to be carving out here, that "red-states" are going to buck blue-states and maybe vice-versa, is sickening. But thank you for making it plain to me. It will help me understand what y'all are truly about going forward.
That's seriously 'whack.' Red states are screwing the union for their own purposes from the inside. Damn.
Then that makes you and your ilk unpatriotic and part of the problem rather than the solution.
No. Sadly and more to the position they hold, if Biden takes over these red-states will sabotage his administration. They will flip into the loyal opposition heat-seeking to exploit kindnesses, beg for political indulgences (and then refuse to sign off on them), revert to the do-nothing congress a second time, and try to slow process and progress.
The handwriting could not be any clearer. The republican party is no good for liberals. They see us as having 'horns.' Of devils. And they intend to have us drag them around everywhere we prosper!
They don't care. @5.1.11.
Trump did a great job in getting us ventilators, masks, PPE’s , field hospitals, persons to staff them, travel bans, 15 and 30 days to bend the curve, developing therapeutics, and record breaking progress toward a vaccine.
No. That’s what blue states and cities are doing but we won’t let them ruin us too.
Reopening the economy and in person schools are the solution we need.
That’s right. If Biden wins the script simply flips. We become the loyal opposition, you defend the regime, and we wait til the next election to undo the last one.
We all will be during a Biden regime a perfect reflection of you all during the Trump administration. There will be no honeymoon.
Health care workers are STILL reusing PPE Xx. There are currently NO Federal field hospitals, NONE.
As for staff, the NG are helping with testing in very select locations.
The travel ban was utterly ineffective.
There was NO 15 to 30 day full shutdown to bend the curve. Some states NEVER shut down.
There are no certified therapeutics, NONE.
As for the 'record breaking' bullshit that Trump is touting, and you are regurgitating, the H1N1 vaccine was being distributed within 7 months of the outbreak. We are already PAST that time period with Covid. Get educated.
there will never be a full shutdown in this country.
Based on what Fauci is saying, if we want to get control of the virus, there WILL be a California style shutdown nation wide.
What we need is a solution to Covid. Everything will fall back in place once that is done.
Oxymoron.
That's not really your call to make. And that doesn't address anything Dulay said. It's just another meaningless platitude of yours!
kintsugi
Gesundheit!
Open California churches and put in check “tyrannical officials who have ruined our economy, closed our schools, divided our people between essential and nonessential and declared our churches as nonessential.”
Gideons and Rahabs are beginning to stand.
https://thenewstalkers.com/vic-eldred/group_discuss/10894/reject-newsoms-science-statements-govt-is-overreaching-principled-resistance-is-necessary#cm1447135
Your churches ARE not essential. period. Most Catholics and Jews realize that and voluntarily avoid gatherings for any reason.
.
We saw an ad on TX 360 today beseeching Christians, Jews and Catholics
to unite and vote for Trump.
Very telling that the writer doesn't consider Catholics to be Christians
Churches seem more like a waste of good real estate.
This attacking of a fellow liberty to choose is not good. Compromise is the only way this country can work out its differences. Somehow we have got to homogenize in key areas just to continue to be relevant and expansive as a people. Else we diminish, get anemic as a people, and scatter to the 'four winds' - perish.
Friend SP, I beg your indulgence. Churches are essential to the faithful, if only for purposes of socially "blending" in one 'house.' What churches are not is free of and above science, we fall under the category of flesh like every other animal. In which case, if something infects our flesh we will become as sick, dying, and dead as a non-faithful person. These things are decreed in the body and spirituality does not attempt to overstep human cause and effect. We all have to listen to proper experts executing their duties and responsibilities.
This is why Donald taking on science is unworthy and stupid beyond belief! Who does that?1
In the old West worthy ministers went into the mines to teach the miners be they white Irish or yellow Chinese, freed blacks or native Americans sold to the mines and Railroads to pay off their sentences.
Those holy men and women required no house of worship.
In a time where we are dangerous to one another because of possible infection, I suggest that most of the ire is political and libertarian
and has nothing to do with religion.
Churches will rarely fail, like a bowling alley or gymnasium...
all it takes is the imagination of the clergy to overcome small inconveniences.
Were the Chinese or Russians able to extinguish Christianity?
No
Neither will the virus, my brother CB.
Your entire comment here is well met. I listen to an institutional church which continues to largely meet online and they have this utterance at the start of each service which I find apropo:
". . . We thank God for technology. . . ."
Peace be with you...
and with you always my brother from another mother
Peace, love, and safety to you and yours, my brother.
Trump got very substantial support from Catholics in 2016 and will again. Some Catholic and Jewish groups do meet too. Also we saw what happened to Jews for Trump in NYC last weekend. Churches are most essential!
Their existence and our attending them when and how we see fit is not in any way up to you. Thank God.
Nice face diaper there!
God will provide!
Churches have nothing to do with religion.
Lot's of religions existed without physical churches.
Shamans everywhere are laughing with me...
What will he provide? S/He certainly has hasn't protected anyone from his/her latest virus.
One wonders why.
saying churches have nothing to do with religion is akin to saying a football field has nothing to do with football.
Like democrats ever tried to compromise with the GOP and Trump the last four years?
You observed a movement of the Spirit there, eh? Do I have to ask if you felt it too?
Not for you to decide on our behalf big brother!
Donald Trump is not a peace-maker with anybody who does not tow his line. Don't toy with me, for I have eyes, ears, and a discerning spirit to see what he is and has wrought in this nation between us.
Donald Trump appears to have made an oath with his supporters to take the rights and privileges of liberals away and spread them out amongst yourselves. As you can imagine, no self-respecting liberal, progressive, or secularist is going to stand for that—nor should s/he!
The compromise I write about allows everyone to come away with respect and dignity; it is the only way our nation will survive whole. Or the split will prove to be our national undoing! America can not lead the world, or garner world support, if it thinks it can return to a 'by-gone' era. Each succeeding period in time and space brings forth its own new 'day' of experiences and challenges.
The world of our founders, died with each and every one of those men. And it is well as those men expected nothing more to occur for them! They wished to be admired as founders and not as men forfor all times! They certainly were not prophets!
Teump clearly is a peacemaker. Look at the peace deals between Israel and Sudan, UAE, Bahrain and the Serbia Kosovo deal. Trump offered democrats all sorts of deals they refused to negotiate on. One of the biggest reasons I didn’t vote for Trump last time was fear that he’d triangulate with democrats all to often at conservatives expense on all sorts of things but democrat hate made certain that would not happen.
Cite ONE Xx.
There are no peace deals with those nations that has borne itself out. Also, are you forgetting the prophetic utterance in the Bible about the "broken contract' which leads to Armageddon (see Daniel)? Scripturally speaking there can be no 'lasting' peace between these middle eastern peoples and Israel. But if you wish to glom unto a pretense that you do not carry in your heart, go for it. NOTE: I am not qualified to say which is a production of a the 'last days,' but the book is about an establishment of contractual agreements between Israel and other surrounding nations which gets broken in the middle. . . .
Depends on your experiences and thinking outside the box of Texas.
Religions that are largely humanism like Buddhism, Jaimism and Hindu don't need churches.
The Amish don't need churches, but the few homes I have been fortunate enough to visit have enormous living rooms
because the services move from home to home, as do the pews and/or chairs.
5 major religions all have houses of worship.
Judaism, Islam, Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism
Infrastructure and immigration regarding the dreamers just to name a couple.
I never said it was. What's your point?
Nice juvenile comment.
A cop out rationalization one makes to absolve themselves of any responsibility.
That works both ways.
That we can have religion without a central church structure was never the issue. We do it in the 3rd world all the time until one can be built. Religion is about God and people but God wanted us to gather together to worship Him. We really don’t need a secularist government or individuals butting in and telling us how we need to or should do it. That a couple of Christian denominations and Islam might put way too much material effort and wealth into some of their structures is a different issue.
Trump and the GOP have repeatedly tried compromise to no avail as did the GOP during the Obama regime
Children all over the world learn to play sports, soccer in particular without the benefit of a proper pitch.
A church is not necessary for religion to exist or thrive no matter who or what you pray to.
Thank you Gordy
That is historical revision, completely distorted and totally false. The Republican Congressional leaders met on the night of President Obama's first inauguration and agreed on a plan to oppose every Obama initiative, even if they were matters they had previously supported.
I didn't claim a church building was necessary, but to pretend that churches are not part of religion is ludicrous at best.
At least, that has been my experience in the places I have lived--California, Virginia, Nevada, and Texas. And in all the places I have visited outside of Texas, which is all but 1 state in the union. You know, outside of the Texas box
You're welcome.
I understand.
If it's a day that ends in "day" you will find something to be disagreeable about whenever I comment.
The last word is yours...
You started this ridiculousness.
Now, YOU take the last word.
I'm finished.
Cite a BILL proposed by the WH Xx, Hell, cite an OUTLINE for a bill from the WH.
You can't because there isn't one. NOTHING, NADA. Pretending that Trump's blathering MEANS anything concrete is laughable. Just like the Trump/Pence promise of a Health care plan, it's smoke and mirrors with no substance.
So you don't hold to:
You can bet on that. People the world round have been worshiping their chosen deity for thousands of years, and did not and do not need a church or enclosed building or structure to worship them. If a deity will only accept prayers and adoration when performed or spoken in a church or such structure, then it is not really interested in what a person is praying or their dedication.
Being Native American, and one who practices the religion of my Cherokee ancestors, I have no need of a specific structure or location to interact with the Creator. He/She is wherever I am at any time I need Him/Her.
Nope, that was MAGA who insisted that the church was most Essential ( 6.1.12 )
One can only hope.
The truly outrageous abuse of power is the refusal to allow Disneyland to reopen - even a little. There is no science that justifies it. Disney World in Florida has been open for months and they're doing just fine. You don't think Disney, of all companies, has plans to limit transmission of the virus? And the means to enforce those limits?
Meanwhile, the park stays closed, so Disney has to lay people off and then people in government (like Elizabeth Warren ) attack them for it. Like it's Disney's fault the park is closed??
Small businesses for miles around Disneyland also rely on traffic to the park . Hotels, restaurants, etc. Many are laying people off, and some of them are going out of business. It's not necessary.
BREAKING: The Walt Disney Company Restoring Salaries of Senior Executives to Pre-COVID Levels
A MONTH later:
BREAKING: Disney Parks Announces 28,000 Cast Member Layoffs Due to the COVID-19 Pandemic
It isn’t. We had a water park open up here in Redding for a couple of months following strict precautions, distancing, and masks in lines to get in and the state still threw a fit, they salvaged two thirds of the season and stayed open until the state actually showed up and coerced compliance. That’s the only way they get it from us up here. We are 200 miles from SF and over 500 from LA so they cant micro manage us up here 24/7
Remember when the goal was merely "flatten the curve?" Now, you can't do anything until we have zero infections, which is probably never going to happen. Talk about "moving the goalposts."
Exactly! That’s our point. Too many democrats are simply using the virus as a tool or even a weapon to attempt to control the lives of others. It’s used to take away people’s economic choices, to impinge upon all of our individual rights if we disagree with them, and curtail our religious liberty in ways that they’d never dare or Dream to do prior to chinas virus coming here.
Forgive me, but this sounds so "lily-white" America to me. Black people have always had white people to contend with in every aspect of our lives from birth to death. It really must be nice to have all that special White privilege doing nice things for you, such that you can hewn and cry over the slightest indignities to a normal white experience in 'merica.
I may be coming on too strong, but I am feeling a need to be real. This bothers me. Because some people have real problems in life. I just watched a scene in a Montana(?) hospital where several virus-stricken and ventilated persons are/were struggling to breath with lungs filled with distress, wheezing, coughing, struggling, bruised inside, 'ugly' outside, and then here are you guys with everything to live for, bitching about liberty, freedom and getting along with others - as if you can have either of those "entitlements" in life apart from an ability to breath freely and at-liberty.
Why do y'all feel better than the team we are all on?
and look at the curve, lol
Meanwhile, one European nation continues to defy European public health orthodoxy. Sweden's decision not to go into full lockdown continues to receive criticism. TIME magazine, for example, recently published an article about the Swedish experiment headlined: "The Swedish COVID-19 Response Is a Disaster. It Shouldn't Be a Model for the rest of the World."
Initially, Sweden's fatality numbers started rising fast: At one point its mortality rate was five times higher than its Scandinavian neighbor Denmark and ten times higher than Finland and Norway. It turned out that this was mainly due to one of the few lockdown restrictions Sweden did impose. Elderly people were moved out of hospitals and into nursing homes. Then, as the virus spread, the newly sick were not allowed to go into hospital for treatment. It has since eased those restrictions.
"Deaths are not so closely connected to the amount of cases you have in a country," claims Sweden's coronavirus response czar, State Epidemiologist Anders Tegnellcontroversially claims. "There are so many other things," he argues, "that the influence the amount of deaths you have. What part of the population gets hit? Is it the elderly people? How well can you protect people in your long-term facilities? How well does your healthcare system continue to function? How can we improve the treatment in ICUs?"
Tegnell's decision to keep Sweden's society largely open and rely on voluntary participation, rather than imposing reduction measures, may have allowed herd immunity to grow within its population. "What we see right now is a rapid fall in the number of cases," he says, "and of course some kind of immunity has to be involved in that as nothing else has changed."
According to worldometers.info, during the last three months from July 27 to Oct. 27, Sweden suffered 198 deaths, around two per day. To put that in perspective, the average number of cancer deaths during that same period in Sweden is 6,000.
If Sweden's small population of 10.23 million was scaled up to the U.K.'s size, that would be the equivalent of 1,290 deaths, whereas the U.K. actually suffered 4,540 deaths (over three times as many) during that time. The U.S. equivalent of Sweden's number would be 6,406, whereas worldometers.info reports there were 80,677 U.S. deaths, which is over twelve times as many.
read more: https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/coronavirus/new-lockdowns-ordered-across-europe
Race had nothing to do with anything I said above...
Sweden's testing is way behind the most of Europe.
It's a different perspective. And perhaps it's time you really hear, listen, and consider another's perspective beyond your own. We can no more be you; then you can be us. But we can all be better—together if you just lower your damn guard and share the country for once. It is reasonably clear that you can not be happy without "us" (all the others surrounding you) participating.
Sure it is...
Everybody's got their data. You're giving me graphs of countries, while I have been talking about California. These are the charts I see every day in the LA Times, which come from the state. So this is what the governor sees. There has been a bump in cases in the last week or so, but the general trend for months has been down. Deaths, even more so, and with no such bump.
This seed is about California. Should California businesses shut down because cases are spiking in North Dakota or Wisconsin?
Glad to see that you're finally agreeing with some facts.
I didn’t agree with anything you said and it’s likely that I never will.
That's FALSE Xx and you know it.
UPDATE: WaterWorks Park agrees to close, police chief says
WaterWorks Park in Redding agreed to close for the season Monday, the day the county said it needed to cease operations to avoid having its public pool permit revoked, Redding Police Chief Bill Schueller said.
Action News reported earlier Monday that the park planned to stay open until Aug. 2 and challenge an order from the county to close by Monday or have its public pool permit revoked over COVID-19 guidelines.
But later in the day, Schueller said the park agreed to close as of Monday.
So SHASTA COUNTY and the SHERIFF closed them down, NOT the state.
While making shit up about your areas 'faux defiance' may make you think that you are bolstering your ideology here on NT, the rest of us just see your comment as a desperate LIE posted by a self identified Christian.
Your disagreement merely gives my comment more credibility.
Good work, Dulay!
They acted because the state forced the issue. We blame the state and not local authorities for the shutdown.
No, I’m the one with real credibility here. The secular progressive left point of view has no credibility whatsoever and neither do any of the people who advocate for it
Not really...
So no manning up for the BS you posted. Got ya.
Nope. You just posted a comment that is a LIE Xx and refused to fess up to it. What little credibility you may have had is void.
Sweeping generalization much Xx?
BTFW, I'm talking about your comment which I PROVED was false. That isn't a POV. That's a fact.
Not to be contrary but Disney CA is a landlocked mess.
Disney FL was built in the middle of nowhere with massive parking and room for expansion if environmentalists will allow.
Florida is manageable.
California must be patient
I'll need to see data that supports that. Here is some data that I think refutes it.
That graphic also seems to refute the seed's posit that Newsom is overreaching. Looks like Newsom's 'overreaching' policies are working for California.
It shows that something is working. It doesn’t make the direct connection you want to see. What it shows me is that we have a pretty flat curve, which was supposed to be the goal.
So it's your posit that California has met some kind of 'goal' with over 4000 new cases and 50 deaths every day?
The shape of the curve was the goal. Do you dispute that? That’s what we’re talking about.
California’s Roadmap to Modify the Stay at Home Order
I made no “posit” about numbers. Don’t troll me by trying to restate my position for me so you can argue some straw man.
Specific numbers were not the goal. If you have a problem with that perspective, go back in time to April and take it up with the governor.
Governor Newsom: Curve has ‘arguably flattened,’ California nears 900 COVID-19 deaths
In late August, though, he moved the goalposts. Now , it’s about numbers, but those numbers are arbitrary.
California’s Newsom deploys new coronavirus reopening framewor k, most counties under strict orders
For a guy who claims to be basing his decisions on the science, he doesn’t seem to be citing any that says Disneyland shouldn’t reopen.
What I AM disputing is YOUR posit that 'the goal' has somehow met. BTW, your link is from APRIL and some shit HAS changed in the meantime.
You sure as hell DID by posting this:
Are you trying to insist that IGNORE the numbers cited on the charts that YOU posted and that YOU commented on?
Ridiculous.
Secondly, either flag my comment as trolling or STOP accusing me of trolling. PICK ONE.
Yet YOU cited 'a bump in cases in the last week' and that deaths showed 'no such bump' and while you're desperate to pretend that the goal isn't 'specific numbers', those 'bumps' you speak of are based solely on SPECIFIC NUMBERS.
Trying to pretend that you can separate the 'specific numbers' from the 'shape of the curve' is juvenile.
Well, you're doing a poor job of it. I said the goal was to flatten the curve. You can't dispute that, though you won't admit it, either. I posted graphs that clearly show flattened curves. You can't dispute that either, and again you won't admit it. Basically, you have nothing. You're pestering me to no purpose.
Yes. I said nothing about numbers. How hard is that to understand? Are you intentionally ignoring the words in front of you?
You don't like the truth and you won't discuss the facts, so you resort to personal attacks. Like I said. You bring nothing to this topic. Good day.
Actually NO Tacos. you do NOT want me to ignore the numbers because if I did I would also have the ignore the 'flattened curve' that represents those very numbers. Again, your pretense that the graph isn't based on numbers is juvenile.
I posted the truth and discussed the facts Tacos. You want to talk about graphs while desperately trying to ignore what those graphs illustrate.
Characterizing your posit as juvenile isn't a personal attack. Insistence that is, is juvenile.
Oh and BTFW, either flag my comment or stop the bullshit about 'personal attacks'.
I thought you were averse to resorting to personal attacks...
Please stop with these dishonest straw man tactics. I never said the graph had no connection to numbers. You have made NO points that contribute to the topic. Unless you have something to add, please stop talking to me. It's just harassment at this point.
I have told you before not to use the F word on me in any form. You know this.
Still playing the victim and still calling someone else a troll.
smh
Oh FFS, what are you going to do, quit responding?
Not likely.
I didn't call anyone a troll. But I see you don't mind posting a completely off-topic personal attack instead of commenting on the topic.
YES let me start the month off with a bang.
Yes that is skirting.
I have treated you fairly every time we interact and tried to show you that YES you are a TRUMP supporter
as evidenced by months and months of hair splitting essays written by you
as to why you are not a Trump supporter but that there is a perfectly
plausible reason for every nasty Trumpism, Trump lie or investigation or folly that he misstates.
Try as you might to stay under the radar, you have failed.
Flag away my friend.
PLEASE learn the proper use of the term strawman.
Yet you cite the graph ad nauseam while insisting that you haven't said anything about numbers which that very graph is based on.
I've made the point that you argument isn't cogent.
I'll post any replies I damn well please. That is the THIRD CoC violation you have accused me of, ALL of which are bullshit. Nobody is forcing you to read anything. Your victim card bullshit is ridiculous.
Another victim card. I have used nothing ON you Tacos. I used an F in an acronym. Next time you see an F, assume it means Freaking if that fits better with your sensibilities.
Now, if you have a issue with the 'F bomb', I suggest you avail yourself of the handy dandy filter that is provided to you by NT to block such wording. If you do NOT avail yourself of said filter, it implies that you are open to viewing such wording. So it's on YOU and YOU know this.
Or just hit the ignore button. Either way I could not care less.
I will NOT alter the content of my comments. PERIOD full stop.
[This link with advertising has been repeatedly spammed in defiance of several mods and the RA.]
[deleted]
The bottom line is that there is such strong disagreement on this issue that there will never be any consensus on it. It is literally stupid to believe that government can control a virus. There is no way that those who want a nationwide one size fits all federal lockdown and everywhere outside of ones home national mask mandate can cram it upon those who do not.
There you go again with the graphs.
Y'all have been whining about one size fits all mandates and then when decision are made county by county they whine about that.
Disneyland is in a hotspot. Get over it...
Fine Xx.
Biden can just do what you have supported for the sanctuary cities.
Redding doesn't want to comply with Federal mandates, no soup for you...
Your little corner of the RW world will dry up like a raisin.
Triage will be necessary and those that refuse to comply with mitigation attempts go the the end of the line on therapeutics and vaccines. Wallow in the virus if you wish.
You're bothered by published facts and data? That might be telling right there.
I don't think I said anything about one size fits all mandates in this thread. Maybe I'm wrong. But I would think most sensible people would see that such things are often a bad idea. I would say that targeted responses based on specific data are probably more useful.
I have seen no evidence that Disneyland is in a hot spot or is a hot spot itself (not sure which you meant).
By a quirky coincidence, both Disneyland and Disney World are in Orange County. In Orange County, California , this is what the cases look like (you'll hate this part. It's another graphic based on actual data):
Clearly new cases have decreased quite a bit over the last few months. Based on this graphic, I would say this spot was a lot hotter a few months ago.
But would it suddenly get worse if Disneyland were to reopen? There is strong evidence that it probably would not be a new hot spot. Disney World (same kind of place as Disneyland, and run by the same company, if you weren't aware) has been open for months in Florida and it isn't being blamed for new outbreaks.
At Disney World, ‘Worst Fears’ About Virus Have Not Come True
Here is another one of those graphs full of facts that you seem to disapprove of so much. In case it's not clear, the amber (dark yellow) line is the new covid cases in the state of Florida and the orange line is the cases for Orange County, Florida where Disney World is located. (Lines going down means less new cases than before - that's a good thing) The gray area shows when the park opened in July, and it has remained open for over three months.
Across the state, and around Disney World, new cases are declining. Impact of Disney World reopening? Apparently, very little. Not what I would call a "hot spot."
No but I am bothered by members that truncate a comment in order to pretend they're making a cogent point. That IS telling right there.
Is that 'actual data' based on specific numbers Tacos?
Another post with no point. Nothing on topic. It's pretty clear you have nothing to offer in that regard.
Another desperate attempt at obfuscation.
Another off-topic comment. Do you have anything at all to say about Disneyland and the data presented here? Or will it just be more personal garbage?
Ok, it's not a hot spot right now when it's closed. That makes sense.
Care to guarantee each visitors safety when they reopen?
They don't just sell tickets to Orange County residents do they?
What percentage of their guests are from CONUS?
How much is international?
Apparently unknown but feared?
That qualifies as an opinion.
Speaking of off topic, why are we now looking at Disney World Florida graphs when the
topic of the seed is what a horrible person Gavin Newsome is as Governor of MAGA's home state?
Guaranteed safety? No. Since when is that the standard for anything ? And that was never supposed to be the standard for reopening businesses, was it? We were supposed to flatten the curve so that hospitals could handle the load of sick people. It was never supposed to be "we guarantee you won't get sick." That would be an impossible standard for anyone at any time.
No, it's actually well known. If you look at the links and data I provided in my comments above, you will see that. In fact, some workers at Disney World have gotten sick, but based on their contact tracing, they didn't get sick because of working at Disney World. They got sick out in the regular world.
From the NY Times article, I linked:
And to show how arbitrary and frustrating Governor Newsom's shifting policies are, there is this also from that story:
There is no science justifying the continued closing of Disneyland, and ample evidence that it could reopen safely. The governor claims he is basing his decisions on science, but cites none. It looks far more like he is operating based on his own sense of panic or his need to exercise control.
That goes, by the way, for the commenters here, including yourself, who support the governor with no reasoning offered.
Because of the direct comparison between choices made by this governor contrasted with people elsewhere. That's a perfectly valid framework for analysis.
In California, the governor has decided, in spite of the available evidence, that it is unsafe to open Disneyland. In other places, Disney has demonstrated that it can reopen safely. That would seem to make the governor's edict an unreasonable one in that it literally is not based in reason.
Oh and BTFW, I said DisneyLAND's Orange county is a hotspot, NOT Disneyworld's Orange county.
Oh and FYI, THAT was a strawman...
Yes I know. I never claimed you said anything about Florida, so there is no need for you to even mention it. Do you have anything to contribute on the topic?
Yet it IS a standard that Disneyworld has set for itself. It's all over their website. They are at 25% capacity.
Oh and BTFW, over 11,000 of those 28,000 that were laid off were from Disneyworld in FLORIDA.
And that all means what about Governor Newsom’s policy?
Then this part of your comment:
Is moot.
Pointing out the strawman in your comment is a contribution.
Which policy are you asking about? The CHD set the standards that counties have to meet to be reduced from a red to orange tier county. That's how shit works when elected officials rely on health professionals.
Orange county CALIFORNIA is STILL a red tier county. Your graph doesn't illustrate that, does it?
You either don’t understand the concept of comparing similar things or you are deliberately doing it. Either way, you don’t seem to be up to the challenge of this topic. And yet you keep coming back. What for? I’ll ask for the bazillion this time: Do you have anything to contribute to the topic, or not? A simple yes or no will suffice.
There has been no straw man. I just denied it and you accepted it. Again: Anything about the governor and his policy vis a vis Disneyland? No? Maybe you should try a thread where you actually have something to say.
Well thanks for telling me who I support in California....
I was speaking within the context of this thread. Do you have anything to offer on that or did you just come here to be hostile to me?
removed for context
https://www.instagram.com/p/CG-7tojhX0d/?igshid=12g6btkusf71s
Does anyone really think that the people of this state are going to obey Newscums micromanaging of our religious holiday this Thanksgiving?
Oh now Thanksgiving is a religious holiday?
It isn’t the religion. The religion is that it’s a day that we give thanks to God for our manifest blessings as a nation, for safety, health, for our individual blessings, for friends, family, etc. There would be no such thing as a thanksgiving day holiday were it not created by our founders and other later leaders for us as a people and nation to give thanks to God. That is the only reason there is for it. So we give thanks to God. There is no place in Thanksgiving for atheists.
We give thanks to God every day and continuously. So there is that! Thanksgiving is a set aside day for observance by observers. Nothing more or less.
Times change, get with the program ... it is called societal evolution. It has religious roots, but Thanksgiving has been secular for years.
What a sanctimonious and ignorant statement. But not surprising either. Sorry, but you don't get to say which holidays are for whom!
Don't forget, certain individuals ignorantly do not accept "evolution," scientific or otherwise.
You are welcome to thank God for all that you have at any time.
I'll consider it just as soon as you prove there's a god. In the meantime, I'll thank myself for all I have, considering I'm the one who worked for and earned it.
alleged “science” as an excuse to clamp down on liberty and religious freedom.
Science is not the enemy. Science is the solution.