The Doctrine of Discovery: Why it still Matters Today - United Church of Christ

  
Via:  CB  •  2 months ago  •  34 comments

By:   United Church of Christ

The Doctrine of Discovery: Why it still Matters Today - United Church of Christ
As they reached new shores, the sailors would plant the standards of the Catholic Monarchs, . . . and would read the following notice to the curious natives, whether naked or clothed

Sponsored by group Christian State of Mind

Christian State of Mind


Within fifteen years of Columbus' first voyage, the Spaniards who continued to cross the Atlantic in search of new lands to subdue had worked out to their own satisfaction a little ritual for assuaging whatever dim objection their strangled consciences might have voiced about adventures in exploitation. As they reached new shores, the sailors would plant the standards of the Catholic Monarchs, . . . and would read the following notice to the curious natives, whether naked or clothed, who invariably ventured forth from the canopy of trees: 

[Natives who did not speak the native tongue of the Spaniards!]

In the stead of the King, Don Fernando and Dona Juana, his daughter, Queen of Castile and León, subduers of the barbarous nations, we their servants do notify and make known to you as best we can that the Lord our God, Living and Eternal, created the Heaven and the Earth, and one man and one woman, of whom you and we, and all of the men of the world, were and are all descendants, and all those who come after us.

Of all these nations God our Lord gave charge to one man, called Saint Peter, that he should be lord and superior of all the men in the world, that all should obey him, and that he should be the head of the whole human race, wherever men should live and under whatever law, sect, or belief they should be; and he gave him the world for his kingdom and jurisdiction.

Wherefore, as best we can, we ask and require that you consider what we have said to you, and that you take the time that shall be necessary to understand and deliberate upon it, and that you acknowledge the Church as the Ruler and Superior of the whole world.

But if you do not do this, and maliciously make delay in it, I certify to you, that with the help of God, we shall powerfully enter into your country, and shall make war against you in all manners that we can, and shall subject you to the yoke and obedience of the Church and of their Highnesses; we shall take you, and your wives, and your children, and shall make slaves of them, and as such shall sell and dispose of them as their Highnesses may command; and we shall take away your goods, and shall do you all the mischief and damage that we can, as to vassals who do not obey, and refuse to receive their lord, ad resist and contradict him: and we protest that the deaths and losses which shall accrue from this are your fault, and not that of their Highnesses, nor ours, nor of these cavaliers who accompany us.

Heretics and Heroes, Volume V, How Renaissance Artists and Reformation Priests Created our World, by Thomas Cahill, DoubleDay, 2013, pages 58 and 59.


S E E D E D   C O N T E N T



We've asked our staff to help us unpack the complex justice issues that we're working on. Using our General Synod pronouncements as the basis for these reflections, we hope to provide insights into the issues you care about that are rooted in our shared faith, and can inform your advocacy efforts. This month Elizabeth Leung, our Minister for Racial Justice, reflects on the Doctrine of Discovery - a theological document that originated in the early European church, and was (and is to this day) used as a legal basis for ignoring and invalidating claims to property by Native American Communities. Learn more about actions taken by General Synod 29 to address this injustice.

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The Doctrine of Discovery: Why it Still Matters Today 


"[T]he native people[s] were never lost and they are not lost now. They were exactly where the Creator put them; therefore, they cannot be discovered. They already know the Creator and the Creator knows them" - Adrian Maxey of the Dakota Association, speaking in his native language, reminded the delegates of General Synod.

Many Americans grow up learning that this continent was "discovered" by Christopher Columbus. The concept of discovery, as if the land was empty prior to arrival and its indigenous inhabitants were somehow "less than" the explorers is, at its heart, racism and cultural superiority.

The doctrine of discovery, a concept of public international law expounded by the United States Supreme Court in a series of decisions, originated from various church documents in Christian Europe in the mid-1400s to justify the pattern of domination and oppression by European monarchies as they invasively arrived in the Western hemisphere. It theologically asserted the right to claim the indigenous lands, territories, and resources on behalf of Christendom, and to subjugate native peoples around the world.

In 1823 U.S. Supreme Court case of Johnson v. M'Intosh, Chief Justice John Marshall used the doctrine to assert that the United States, as the successor of Great Britain, had inherited authority over all lands within our claimed boundaries. This decision allowed our government to legally ignore or invalidate any native claims to property.

To this day courts continue to cite this legal precedent. It is still being used by courts to decide property rights cases brought by Native Americans against the U.S. and against non-Natives. [Emphasis CB.]

In the 21st century U.S., that legacy of domination is reflected in the undermined sovereignty of our indigenous communities and through Congressional and Federal assertions of power over the tribes. We see this lived out through injustices in water rights, oil and mineral extraction on native lands, border and immigration policies which negatively affect tribal communities, and the impact of sequestration budget cuts on native communities, to name a few.

The delegates of General Synod 29 [*] decided to speak out about this historic and ongoing injustice last June. They voted overwhelmingly for a Resolution of Witness to repudiate the Doctrine of Discovery. The resolution declares and confesses the doctrine to be a shameful part of our church history and that of the U.S. We resolve to not only educate our congregations about it, but also take actions to repair the relationship with American Indians, Native Hawaiians and Alaskan Natives.

Thanksgiving is an important time for reflecting and remembering our history.

The town of Plymouth, Massachusetts has erected a plaque - erected by the Town of Plymouth on behalf of the United American Indians of New England which states: "NATIONAL DAY OF MOURNING." To many Native Americans, Thanksgiving Day is a reminder of the genocide of millions of their people, the theft of their lands, and the relentless assault on their culture. It is a day of remembrance and a protest of the racism and oppression, which Native Americans continue to experience.

In 2008, Congress passed the House Joint Resolution 62 for the Friday after Thanksgiving to be designated as "National Native American Heritage Day." It is a small step in our willingness to balance the misleading historical narrative of "discovery" and to recognize the true Native American history — of thriving economies and sophisticated systems of government which existed long before many of our ancestors came to this land, something that is rarely taught to our children or mentioned in our schools.

We can struggle, heal and work together for justice for our Native American brothers and sisters.

As we learn about the doctrine of discovery: the genocide of native peoples, the dispossession that generations have sustained as their lands were stolen, their languages destroyed, and their culture appropriated by European settlers, it can trigger different emotional responses in those of us whose ancestors are immigrants, voluntary or enslaved, to this continent.

With God's grace, may we move forward in compassion and resolve in our hearts and actions to stand in solidarity with our indigenous sisters and brothers and neighbors: learning about the histories and cultures of native peoples in the area we live and work, advocating for the public policies and social conditions that respect the sovereignty and self-determination of Native American.

*[June 28-July 2, 2013]


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CB
Professor Principal
1  seeder  CB     2 months ago
Many Americans grow up learning that this continent was "discovered" by Christopher Columbus. The concept of discovery, as if the land was empty prior to arrival and its indigenous inhabitants were somehow "less than" the explorers is, at its heart, racism and cultural superiority.

Yeah, we did grow up believing the myth of Columbus discovery America (and none of it was about sadness, death, and loss).

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
2  Kavika     2 months ago

AD 1493:   The Pope asserts rights to colonize, convert, and enslave

Pope Alexander VI issues a papal bull or decree, “Inter Caetera," in which he authorizes Spain and Portugal to colonize the Americas and its Native peoples as subjects. The decree asserts the rights of Spain and Portugal to colonize, convert, and enslave. It also justifies the enslavement of Africans.

Inter Caetera dictates almost everything in the lives of Indians. 

It's good to hear that the United Church of Christ has repudiated the Doctrine of Discovery. They join a few other Christian denominations that have done the same. 

Sadly, the perpetrator of this horrific law has not rescinded ''Inter Caetera''. They have been asked many times and representatives of various tribes have traveled to the Vatican and requested that it be rescinded and their response was no or the pope would not meet with them. 

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
2.1  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Kavika @2    2 months ago

It would be a huge deal if this Pope actually rescinded the Inter Caetera, or at least apologize for it. But for now, at least the United Church of Christ has done a truly good deed.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.1  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @2.1    2 months ago
It would be a huge deal if this Pope actually rescinded the Inter Caetera

Did the 1619 Project get it wrong?  Should it rightly be the 1493 Project since the Pope asserted the right to colonize the Americas and enslave both Native people and Africans?

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
2.1.2  seeder  CB   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.1    2 months ago

There is no easy out! This is evidence of a 'running' conspiracy.

In 1823 U.S. Supreme Court case of Johnson v. M'Intosh, Chief Justice John Marshall used the doctrine to assert that the United States, as the successor of Great Britain, had inherited authority over all lands within our claimed boundaries. This decision allowed our government to legally ignore or invalidate any native claims to property.

To this day [2013] courts continue to cite this legal precedent. It is still being used by courts to decide property rights cases brought by Native Americans against the U.S. and against non-Natives

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.3  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @2.1.2    2 months ago
There is no easy out! This is evidenceof a 'running' conspiracy.

Damn, another conspiracy with all the white Americans in on it for 200 years.  Unless you want to go back to 1619, then 400 years. 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
2.1.4  seeder  CB   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.3    2 months ago

Please show me where in my comment "all. . . white Americans" have been in on a/any conspiracy for 200 years. Go on proceed.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.5  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @2.1.4    2 months ago

How many people of color were part of the 1823 U.S. Supreme Court decision of Johnson v. M'Intosh?

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
2.1.6  seeder  CB   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.5    2 months ago

?

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.7  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @2.1.6    2 months ago

CoL

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.8  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @2.1.6    2 months ago

You’ve got me.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
2.1.9  Texan1211  replied to  CB @2.1.4    2 months ago

which color of people were you claiming to be in the "running conspiracy"?

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
2.1.10  seeder  CB   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.5    2 months ago

'White people' highly probable were the only people classified as citizens of this country. And yet the fact remains not all white "Americans' in the country were party to the 1823 U.S. Supreme Court decision Johnson v. M'Intosh.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.11  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @2.1.10    2 months ago
not all white "Americans' in the country were part of the 1823 U.S. Supreme Court decison of Johnson v. M'Intosh.

Tell us more about those non-white people in that decision. 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
2.1.12  seeder  CB   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.11    2 months ago

You misinterpreted my comment. "All" is 'hyperbole.' All whites largely do not agree to anything this country has ventured into or likely will do.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.13  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @2.1.12    2 months ago
You misinterpreted my comment. "All" is 'hyperbole.'

I don't remember that comment from you at all.  What is your definitive comment on the1823 U.S. Supreme Court decision Johnson v. M'Intosh?

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
2.1.14  Kavika   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.11    2 months ago
Tell us more about those non-white people in that decision. 

The case was between whites but the premise of the case was the sale of land by the Piankeshaw one of the Miami tribes to Johnson who btw was one of the first Supreme Court Justices if I remember correctly. So in effect, there were thousands of nonwhite people, I prefer Indigenous, that case revolved around. 

Of course, the Marshall decision that came right from the Doctrine of Discovery and was extremely detrimental to Indians reverberates today since it is US law.

-

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
2.1.15  seeder  CB   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.13    2 months ago

Nope. I am sorry your 'memory' failed you. You were disturbingly blaming "all" whites for the attitudes and actions of a majority of whites. You are wrong!

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.16  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Kavika @2.1.14    2 months ago
Of course, the Marshall decision that came right from the Doctrine of Discovery and was extremely detrimental to Indians reverberates today since it is US law.

Thanks Kavika, hence my comment that this was a white people decision.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.17  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @2.1.15    2 months ago
Nope

Nope what?

I am sorry your 'memory' failed you.

Me too, what did I forget?

You were disturbingly blaming "all" whites for the attitudes and actions of a majority of whites. You are wrong!

How so?

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
2.1.18  Kavika   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.16    2 months ago

The decision was between whites but the core of the case was about Indigenous people and land. Most cases that involved Indigenous land titles were between whites. I believe that first case to arrive at the Supreme Court that had indigenous people was Cherokee Nation vs Georgia sometime in the 1830s or 40s.  

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
2.1.20  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Kavika @2.1.18    2 months ago
but the core of the case was about Indigenous people and land

Absolutely.  The Court upheld the colonialists' claim to the contested property and based their  decision that the Piankeshaw were not actually able to convey the land because they never "owned" it in the traditional sense of the word. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
2.1.21  Kavika   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.20    2 months ago
the land because they never "owned" it in the traditional sense of the word. 

LOL, the traditional sense of the word. It was the word of the Pope in the Doctrine of Discovery and the interpretation of Marshall to keep the indigenous from owning their own land. That is why Indigenous land can only be sold to the US government hence most of the land on reservations is not ''owned by the tribe'' it is held ''in trust'' by the US government for the tribe.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
2.1.22  seeder  CB   replied to  Kavika @2.1.21    2 months ago

CRT is a problem for conservatives who want to forget the past and in doing so recreate the past all over again through their children. Am I wrong?

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
3  seeder  CB     2 months ago

This is a small (and very important) portion of what CRT opponents do not want their children to discuss in a classroom near 'you.' If conservatives have to hide their shame from their children and future generations wouldn't it fare better for them going forward not to ordeal to further the insult with political 'warfare'? Go figure.

This is some bad behavior.  I can understand why opponents of CRT want to 'run and hide' and pretend not to know about any of it!

The tragedy is what you 'forget' - can be done yet again. And the cycle repeats itself!

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
4  seeder  CB     2 months ago
With God's grace, may we move forward in compassion and resolve in our hearts and actions to stand in solidarity with our indigenous sisters and brothers and neighbors: learning about the histories and cultures of native peoples in the area we live and work, advocating for the public policies and social conditions that respect the sovereignty and self-determination of Native American.

A church with a social conscience. Must be a liberal 'thing.'  Why do conservative churches have to contrast 'everything'?

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
5  seeder  CB     2 months ago

The Bull Inter Caetera (Alexander VI) May 4, 1493

“Alexander, bishop, servant of the servants of God, to the illustrious sovereigns, our very dear son in Christ, Ferdinand, king, and our very dear daughter in Christ, Isabella, queen of Castile, Leon, Aragon, Sicily, and Granada, health and apostolic benediction. Among other works well pleasing to the Divine Majesty and cherished of our heart, this assuredly ranks highest, that in our times especially the Catholic faith and the Christian religion be exalted and be everywhere increased and spread, that the health of souls be cared for and that barbarous nations be overthrown and brought to the faith itself.

Wherefore inasmuch as by the favor of divine clemency, we, though of insufficient merits, have been called to this Holy See of Peter, recognizing that as true Catholic kings and princes, such as we have known you always to be, and as your illustrious deeds already known to almost the whole world declare, you not only eagerly desire but with every effort, zeal, and diligence, without regard to hardships, expenses, dangers, with the shedding even of your blood, are laboring to that end; recognizing also that you have long since dedicated to this purpose your whole soul and all your endeavors – as witnessed in these times with so much glory to the Divine Name in your recovery of the kingdom of Granada from the yoke of the Saracens [Muslims] – we therefore are rightly led, and hold it as our duty, to grant you even of our own accord and in your favor those things whereby with effort each day more hearty you may be enabled for the honor of God himself and the spread of the Christian rule to carry forward your holy and praiseworthy purpose so pleasing to immortal God.

We have indeed learned that you, who for a long time had intended to seek out and discover certain islands and mainlands remote and unknown and not hitherto discovered by others, to the end that you might bring to the worship of our Redeemer and the profession of the Catholic faith their residents and inhabitants, having been up to the present time greatly engaged in the siege and recovery of the kingdom itself of Granada were unable to accomplish this holy and praiseworthy purpose; but the said kingdom having at length been regained, as was pleasing to the Lord, you, with the wish to fulfill your desire, chose our beloved son, Christopher Columbus , a man assuredly worthy and of the highest recommendations and fitted for so great an undertaking, whom you furnished with ships and men equipped for like designs, not without the greatest hardships, dangers, and expenses, to make diligent quest for these remote and unknown mainlands and islands through the sea, where hitherto no one had sailed; and they at length, with divine aid and with the utmost diligence sailing in the ocean sea, discovered certain very remote islands and even mainlands that hitherto had not been discovered by others; wherein dwell very many peoples living in peace, and, as reported, going unclothed, and not eating flesh.

Moreover, as your aforesaid envoys are of opinion, these very peoples living in the said islands and countries believe in one God, the Creator in heaven, and seem sufficiently disposed to embrace the Catholic faith and be trained in good morals. And it is hoped that, were they instructed, the name of the Savior, our Lord Jesus Christ, would easily be introduced into the said countries and islands. Also, on one of the chief of these aforesaid islands the said Christopher has already caused to be put together and built a fortress fairly equipped, wherein he has stationed as garrison certain Christians, companions of his, who are to make search for other remote and unknown islands and mainlands. In the islands and countries already discovered are found gold, spices, and very many other precious things of divers kinds and qualities.

Wherefore, as becomes Catholic kings and princes, after earnest consideration of all matters, especially of the rise and spread of the Catholic faith, as was the fashion of your ancestors, kings of renowned memory, you have purposed with the favor of divine clemency to bring under your sway the said mainlands and islands with their residents and inhabitants and to bring them to the Catholic faith.

Hence, heartily commending in the Lord this your holy and praiseworthy purpose, and desirous that it be duly accomplished, and that the name of our Savior be carried into those regions, we exhort you very earnestly in the Lord and by your reception of holy baptism, whereby you are bound to our apostolic commands, and by the bowels of the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ, enjoin strictly, that inasmuch as with eager zeal for the true faith you design to equip and despatch this expedition, you purpose also, as is your duty, to lead the peoples dwelling in those islands and countries to embrace the Christian religion; nor at any time let dangers or hardships deter you therefrom, with the stout hope and trust in your hearts that Almighty God will further your undertakings.

And, in order that you may enter upon so great an undertaking with greater readiness and heartiness endowed with the benefit of our apostolic favor, we, of our own accord, not at your instance nor the request of anyone else in your regard, but of our own sole largess and certain knowledge and out of the fullness of our apostolic power, by the authority of Almighty God conferred upon us in blessed Peter and of the vicarship of Jesus Christ, which we hold on earth, do by tenor of these presents, should any of said islands have been found by your envoys and captains, give, grant, and assign to you and your heirs and successors, kings of Castile and Leon, forever, together with all their dominions, cities, camps, places, and villages, and all rights, jurisdictions, and appurtenances, all islands and mainlands found and to be found, discovered and to be discovered towards the west and south, by drawing and establishing a line from the Arctic pole, namely the north, to the Antarctic pole, namely the south, no matter whether the said mainlands and islands are found and to be found in the direction of India or towards any other quarter, the said line to be distant one hundred leagues towards the west and south from any of the islands commonly known as the Azores and Cape Verde.

With this proviso however that none of the islands and mainlands, found and to be found, discovered and to be discovered, beyond that said line towards the west and south, be in the actual possession of any Christian king or prince up to the birthday of our Lord Jesus Christ just past from which the present year one thousand four hundred and ninety-three begins. And we make, appoint, and depute you and your said heirs and successors lords of them with full and free power, authority, and jurisdiction of every kind; with this proviso however, that by this our gift, grant, and assignment no right acquired by any Christian prince, who may be in actual possession of said islands and mainlands prior to the said birthday of our Lord Jesus Christ, is hereby to be understood to be withdrawn or taken away.

Moreover we command you in virtue of holy obedience that, employing all due diligence in the premises, as you also promise – nor do we doubt your compliance therein in accordance with your loyalty and royal greatness of spirit – you should appoint to the aforesaid mainlands and islands worthy, God-fearing, learned, skilled, and experienced men, in order to instruct the aforesaid inhabitants and residents in the Catholic faith and train them in good morals.

Furthermore, under penalty of excommunication late sententie to be incurred ipso facto , should anyone thus contravene, we strictly forbid all persons of whatsoever rank, even imperial and royal, or of whatsoever estate, degree, order, or condition, to dare, without your special permit or that of your aforesaid heirs and successors, to go for the purpose of trade or any other reason to the islands or mainlands, found and to be found, discovered and to be discovered, towards the west and south, by drawing and establishing a line from the Arctic pole to the Antarctic pole, no matter whether the mainlands and islands, found and to be found, lie in the direction of India or toward any other quarter whatsoever, the said line to be distant one hundred leagues towards the west and south, as is aforesaid, from any of the islands commonly known as the Azores and Cape Verde; apostolic constitutions and ordinances and other decrees whatsoever to the contrary notwithstanding.

We trust in Him from whom empires and governments and all good things proceed, that, should you, with the Lord’s guidance, pursue this holy and praiseworthy undertaking, in a short while your hardships and endeavors will attain the most felicitous result, to the happiness and glory of all Christendom. But inasmuch as it would be difficult to have these present letters sent to all places where desirable, we wish, and with similar accord and knowledge do decree, that to copies of them, signed by the hand of a public notary commissioned therefore, and sealed with the seal of any ecclesiastical officer or ecclesiastical court, the same respect is to be shown in court and outside as well as anywhere else as would be given to these presents should they thus be exhibited or shown. Let no one, therefore, infringe, or with rash boldness contravene, this our recommendation, exhortation, requisition, gift, grant, assignment, constitution, deputation, decree, mandate, prohibition, and will.

Should anyone presume to attempt this, be it known to him that he will incur the wrath of Almighty God and of the blessed apostles Peter and Paul. Given at Rome, at St. Peter’s, in the year of the incarnation of our Lord one thousand four hundred and ninety-three, the fourth of May, and the first year of our pontificate.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
5.1  seeder  CB   replied to  CB @5    2 months ago

Wow, in 1493, just like 'that' peaceful natives of lands were sold into the sway of a king who wielding these "so-forths and so-ons" of a religious leader's (Pope) scented words! Just like that.

I can only wonder about something similar happening today with Russia's Putin getting those presents of "so-forths and so-ons" from the Russian Orthodox Church Patriarch Kirill!

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
5.1.1  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @5.1    2 months ago
just like 'that' peaceful natives of lands were sold into the sway of a king

Is there any archaeological evidence that the indigenous societies here regularly practiced warfare before the arrival of European settlers?

.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
5.1.2  seeder  CB   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @5.1.1    2 months ago
Christopher Columbus , a man assuredly worthy and of the highest recommendations and fitted for so great an undertaking, whom you furnished with ships and men equipped for like designs, not without the greatest hardships, dangers, and expenses, to make diligent quest for these remote and unknown mainlands and islands through the sea, where hitherto no one had sailed; and they at length, with divine aid and with the utmost diligence sailing in the ocean sea, discovered certain very remote islands and even mainlands that hitherto had not been discovered by others; wherein dwell very many peoples living in peace, and, as reported, going unclothed, and not eating flesh.

My statement is an observation from the third paragraph in The Bull Inter Caetera.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
5.1.3  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @5.1.2    2 months ago

Of course Chris wasn't an archeologist and saw only a small amount of our indigenous people.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
5.1.4  seeder  CB   replied to  Drinker of the Wry @5.1.3    2 months ago

It appears "Chris" is not responsible for the papal bull.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
5.2  seeder  CB   replied to  CB @5    2 months ago

One thing I have noticed about Catholic writings is just how 'potently' wordy they can be. Those (popes, cardinals, and et ceteras) can truly put word to paper! Even when it is detrimental to others.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Expert
5.2.1  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @5.2    2 months ago
One thing I have noticed about Catholic writings is just how 'potently' wordy they can be. Those (popes, cardinals, and et ceteras) can truly put word to paper!

Probably parchment back then. 

 
 

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