House Democrats lose bid to fast-track Trump tax return lawsuit

Because previous candidates and Presidents have offered their tax returns, does that mean ALL must do so? It certainly isn't a Constitutional requirement.

Because previous candidates and Presidents have offered their tax returns, does that mean ALL must do so? It certainly isn't a Constitutional requirement.

Were previous candidates and Presidents under criminal investigation for tax fraud?

Please tell us what federal agency is investigating Trump for federal tax fraud.

Were previous candidates and Presidents under criminal investigation for tax fraud?

What criminal investigation? Might you be referring to the New York Times article in Oct 2018? Well, even the Times admitted that the line between legal tax avoidance and illegal tax evasion is blurry. New York prosecutors rushed to open investigations into the Trump Organization. However, there is a statute of limitations for criminal tax fraud charges. In New York it's five years, and Federal it's three to six years. New York can try to seek back taxes and civil penalties from 15 to 20 years ago...and proving intent, well, good luck.

As a retired Financial Analyst for a small business, it is fair to say that many business owners can and do blur the lines. Amazon and Apple probably blur the lines as well. That's not to say they don't pay any taxes...they do, but is it a 'fair share'? No, because our tax laws have wonderful loopholes that allow businesses to 'blur the lines'.

Now, is that a legal reason to request personal and business tax returns? Nope.

Please tell us what federal agency is investigating Trump for federal tax fraud.

Same agency that put Cohen in jail and named Trump as an unindicted co-conspirator.

That is unadulterated bullshit.

Prove it!

That is unadulterated bullshit.

Prove it!

Former Trump fixer Michael Cohen reports to prison for three-year term

If he's got nothing to hide, why doesn't he release them?

First, show us the law that states one must provide their tax returns to Congress, or the public.

There may not be a law, but why on gods green earth would any American be ok with a president hiding his personal information that could compromise our security because of ties to foreign money?  You don't care about transparency?  Presidential candidates can lie and hide their information?  Exactly what standards would you hold a president to?  Truth?  We know that's a big NO.  Transparency?  NO.  Intellect?  NO.  What standards should a politician have to meet?

First, show us the law that states one must provide their tax returns to Congress, or the public.

Anyone who can't recognize this ploy by Democrats as nothing more than a witch-hunt must be willfully blind or willfully ignoring reality.

There can be no other logical explanation.

The IRS audits all Presidential returns, if there were any issues...I'm sure the IRS would take care of it.

There's no doubt that if he actually did release his personal returns, everyone would be aghast over his donations of his salary. What other President donated their salaries?

Until it is a law, withholding tax returns isn't a crime and the Ways and Means Committee can be seen as harassing this President.

First, show us the law that states one must provide their tax returns to Congress, or the public.

Section 6103(f)(1) of the Internal Revenue Code (IRC)

Upon written request from the chairman of the Committee on Ways and Means of the House of Representatives, the chairman of the Committee on Finance of the Senate, or the chairman of the Joint Committee on Taxation, the Secretary [of the Treasury] shall furnish such committee with any return or return information specified in such request, except that any return or return information which can be associated with, or otherwise identify, directly or indirectly, a particular taxpayer shall be furnished to such committee only when sitting in closed executive session unless such taxpayer otherwise consents in writing to such disclosure.

The IRS audits all Presidential returns, if there were any issues...I'm sure the IRS would take care of it.

IRS does the math, they do not look for criminality (beyond the math), conflict of interest, Emolument violations, etc.

There may not be a law, but why on gods green earth would any American be ok with a president hiding his personal information that could compromise our security

"Conjecture" is like a cartoon !

Fun to read....but normal folks know it's nonsensical ! 

"Others" …… not so much.

And WHAT is the legislative purpose of requesting Trump's returns?

Yet the Treasury Department refused to furnish the returns as requested.

The Ways and Means Committee came up with the reason of wanting to determine whether the IRS is properly performing audits. Frankly, any return under audit should do...but they want six years of personal and business returns from Trump. Even the Ways and Means Committee must have legitimate legislative reason for their requests.

Well, they're certainly not going to find any of that in his personal returns now, are they.

why on gods green earth would any American be ok with a president hiding his personal information that could compromise our security because of ties to foreign money?

What is he hiding? He had to turn in a financial disclosure form that totaled almost 100 pages. There is buttloads of information there. On top of that, it's Donald freaking Trump! Maybe the most famous rich guy in the last half century. It's not like people haven't been observing his financial dealings for 50 years.

And WHAT is the legislative purpose of requesting Trump's returns?

Why does there need to be one?  Legislative branch is also charged with overseeing the Executive Branch.

Why does there need to be one? Legislative branch is also charged with overseeing the Executive Branch.

Within reason.

That doesn't apply to this case.

The Democrats want Trump's returns solely because they couldn't beat him and won't impeach him.

And why on earth would "overseeing the Executive Branch" include tax returns BEFORE he was President?

That is simply ludicrous.

There may not be a law

You should have stopped there. Nothing else matters.

There may not be a law

As in -there isn't!

but why on gods green earth would any American be ok with a president hiding his personal information that could compromise our security because of ties to foreign money? 

Oh, I see, that's why we need to see his tax returns.

You don't care about transparency?

I do. I don't have any government info on a personal server in my basement!

 Presidential candidates can lie and hide their information?

It would seem so.

Exactly what standards would you hold a president to? 

Peace & Prosperity!

 Truth? 

I'd rank Judges who are committed to the Constitution above that.

We know that's a big NO. 

A little no, more a maybe.

Transparency?

Maybe

 Intellect?

To be honest, I'm more frightened of the educated than the non-educated


 What standards should a politician have to meet?

At the risk of being repetitive -Keeping America safe & secure, keeping the nation prosperous and draining the swamp!

To be honest, I'm more frightened of the educated than the non-educated

[Deleted]

That pretty much sums up conservatives. Fear driven, and not just any old fear, fear of knowledge, science, intellect, education, pretty much anything fact driven.
And its quite clear conservatives have NO STANDARDS for themselves. Thanks for clarifying, everybody.

Hogwash.

That pretty much sums up conservatives. 

Good afternoon lib, I wouldn't generalize to much if I was you.

 Fear driven

More like experienced with what some on the left are capable of as soon as they attain power via their diploma mill educations.

And its quite clear conservatives have NO STANDARDS for themselves. 

That's rich! Coming on the 50th anniversary of Woodstock - Talk about a lack of standards & values!

Thanks for another revelation.

If he's got nothing to hide, why doesn't he release them?

If you've got nothing to hide, why don't you release your tax returns?

I'm not the 'president'

I'm not obligated to Putin and his oligarchs.

I haven't inflated my wealth

I think this 'president' is worth just about nothing except for what he is raping the treasury for as fast as his fat little fingers will allow and for those who he rolled back regulations for so they can continue to rape the planet and line his pockets during his 'presidency' and for those tax breaks to multi-millionaires and billionaires who also have been lining his pockets.

I'm not the 'president'

What difference does that make?

I'm not obligated to Putin and his oligarchs.

So you claim, but are you prepared to prove it starting with showing us your tax returns? For all we know, you're a Russian spy. The fact that you're not the president doesn't make that any less dangerous. You could be trying to fly under the radar by not running for office so you can destroy our beloved republic from within. 

[Deleted]

I haven't inflated my wealth

Haven't you? How would we know? And who knows what else you're lying about?

If the 'president' had nothing to hide, he'd show his tax returns.

If you've got nothing to hide, why don't you release your tax returns?

What is in Obama's college transcripts that he is afraid to let out. If he had nothing to hide , he would have released them

What president has ever released their college transcripts?

To my knowledge all prior presidents or presidential hopefuls have released their tax returns so what does tRump have to hide?

What is in tRumps' college transcripts that he is afraid to let out. If he had nothing to hide , he would have released them

I haven't inflated my wealth

Maybe you should post your tax returns here so we can make that determination.

I'm not the one demanding people release their tax returns. Have you heard about hypocrisy?

I never demanded his tax returns for fucks sake.  

You can have the last word now.  I've got far better things to do than to have the last word regarding this shitstain thug thief grifter scumbag 'president'

I never demanded his tax returns for fucks sake.

Oh I see. What are we supposed to make, then, of your repeated insistence that he must have something to hide if he doesn't release them?

What are we supposed to make of you "all prior presidents or presidential hopefuls have released their tax returns"? (And anyway, that is not true)

When I asked you why you don't release your returns, you said it's because you're not the president. Ergo, you think he should have to release the returns, because he is president. Sounds like a demand to me.

The real question is will you respond with a thoughtful answer or will we get a pointless emoji?

And you would be wrong, again. 

If he's got nothing to hide, why doesn't he release them?

'cause he doesn't have to.

I don't offer up anything I don't have to either !

Do you ?

So yet one more lie from the 'president' on top of a mountain of lies.  

So yet one more lie from the 'president' on top of a mountain of lies. 

What Lie ?

What Lie ?

All the things Donald Trump has said about releasing his tax returns

So far, President Trump has refused to release his tax returns while in office, breaking with a 40-year tradition.

.........

Trump's public statements about his returns have shifted subtly over the years.

At first, Trump was open about wanting to release his returns. He began citing the ongoing audit as a reason not to release them in early 2016.

Here's a selection of remarks Trump has made:

MAY 20, 2014:

More than a year before he announced his presidential campaign, Trump told an Irish television station that he would "absolutely" release his tax returns if he entered the race.

"If I decide to run for office, I'll produce my tax returns, absolutely," he said. "And I would love to do that."

FEBRUARY 25, 2015:

Trump told radio host Hugh Hewitt that he would "certainly show tax returns if it was necessary."

OCTOBER 4, 2015:

Trump said in an interview with ABC's George Stephanopoulos that he was considering releasing his tax returns.

"I'm thinking about maybe when we find out the true story on Hillary's emails," he said of Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton.

JANUARY 24, 2016:

Trump told NBC's Chuck Todd that he had "very big returns."

Asked if he would release them publicly, Trump said, "we're working on that now."

"I have very big returns, as you know, and I have everything all approved and very beautiful and we'll be working that over in the next period of time, Chuck," Trump said. "Absolutely."

FEBRUARY 11, 2016:

Trump appeared again on Hewitt's radio program and said of his returns, "we'll get them out at some point, probably."

FEBRUARY 24, 2016:

Trump told CNN's Anderson Cooper that he has a "very complex system of taxes."

"We'll make a determination over the next couple of months," he said. "It's very complicated."

FEBRUARY 25, 2016:

Trump tweeted that he's already filed public financial disclosure forms that are "great." He said that tax returns "have 0 to do w/ someone's net worth."

The disclosure forms do give wide estimates of asset value. But tax returns would reveal much more. Even the top two pages of his 1040 and Schedule A, for example, would say how much taxable income he made, how much he paid in taxes, his charitable contributions and whether he paid tax to any foreign governments.

Just for your info, tax returns have 0 to do w/ someone's net worth. I have already filed my financial statements w/ FEC. They are great!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) February 25, 2016

During a CNN-Telemundo debate later that day , Trump said he wanted to release his tax returns, but could not while he's under audit.

"I've had it for years. I get audited. And obviously if I'm being audited, I'm not going to release a return," he said. "As soon as the audit is done, I love it."

FEBRUARY 27, 2016:

Trump revisits the audit argument on Twitter.

"Tax experts throughout the media agree that no sane person would give their tax returns during an audit," he said. "After the audit, no problem!"

Tax experts throughout the media agree that no sane person would give their tax returns during an audit. After the audit, no problem!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) February 27, 2016

MAY 11, 2016:

Trump tells the Associated Press that his taxes are under "routine audit" and he will release them when the audit is done.

"I would release my tax returns when audit is complete, not after election!" he tweeted about the interview.

In interview I told @AP that my taxes are under routine audit and I would release my tax returns when audit is complete, not after election!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) May 11, 2016

SEPTEMBER 27, 2016:

Trump says during the first presidential debate that his taxes will be released once an audit is finished.

"I don't mind releasing. I'm under a routine audit, and it will be released. As soon as the audit's finished, it will be released," he said.

OCTOBER 4, 2016:

Mike Pence says during a vice presidential debate with Democratic candidate Tim Kaine that Trump has not "broken his promise" about releasing tax returns.

"Look, Donald Trump has filed over 100 pages of financial disclosure, which is what the law requires," Pence said. He added that trump is "going to release his tax returns when the audit is over."

JANUARY 22, 2017:

White House senior adviser Kellyanne Conway said on ABC's "This Week" that "the White House response is that he's not going to release his tax returns."

She added: "We litigated this all through the election. People didn't care."

JANUARY 23, 2017:

Conway clarifies her comments with a tweet: "On taxes, answers (& repeated questions) are same from campaign: POTUS is under audit and will not release until that is completed."

On taxes, answers (& repeated questions) are same from campaign: POTUS is under audit and will not release until that is completed. #nonews

— Kellyanne Conway (@KellyannePolls) January 23, 2017

APRIL 16, 2017:

A day after protestors called on Trump to release his tax returns , the president derided the demonstrators on Twitter.

"I did what was an almost an impossible thing to do for a Republican-easily won the Electoral College!" he tweeted. "Now Tax Returns are brought up again?"

I did what was an almost an impossible thing to do for a Republican-easily won the Electoral College! Now Tax Returns are brought up again?

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) April 16, 2017

APRIL 17, 2017:

Spicer, the White House press secretary, says Trump's tax returns are still under audit.

"It's the same thing that was discussed during the campaign trail, the president is under audit. It's a routine one that continues," he said.

Asked in a later exchange if we can assume Trump will never release his returns, Spicer said he would "get back to you on that."

He doesn't want to release his tax returns. SO !

Besides, your list isn't what was being talked about above. Read what was posted !

What legislative purpose have the Democrats claimed to demand Trump's personal tax returns?

Any at all?

What legislative purpose have the Democrats claimed to demand Trump's personal tax returns?

The House handles oversight of the Executive branch.  What are some of the possible reasons for wanting to looks at Trump's taxes?

1) Trump's not as rich as he says: There's very little question that Trump overstates his personal wealth -- and has done so for as long as he has had personal wealth. He's said he's worth $10 billion; Forbes said in 2018 that number is closer to $3 billion. For Trump to be exposed as one-third as rich as he had said he is would be embarrassing, sure. But remember, too, that Trump equates wealth directly with success and importance. So being exposed as less rich would be a blow to his success narrative as well.

2) He has Russia ties: While the Mueller report made clear that neither Trump nor anyone in his campaign orbit colluded with the Russians to help Trump win the 2016 election, it would still be a very big story if Trump's tax returns showed he had extensive financial dealings and ties to Russia. We know, from Michael Cohen, that Trump and his family were deeply involved in the potential construction of Trump Tower Moscow and that Cohen lied about that involvement (and how long it stretched) to protect Trump. We also know that Donald Trump Jr. said this at a 2008 real estate conference: "In terms of high-end product influx into the US, Russians make up a pretty disproportionate cross-section of a lot of our assets. Say, in Dubai, and certainly with our project in SoHo, and anywhere in New York. We see a lot of money pouring in from Russia."

3) He didn't pay many (or any) taxes: We know -- because Trump admitted as much -- that he used a more than $900 million net operating loss for his business in 1995 to avoid paying personal income taxes for a number of subsequent years. How? This, from The New York Times, explains it:
"Known as net operating loss, it allows an array of deductions, business expenses, real estate depreciation, losses from the sale of business assets and even operating losses to flow from the balance sheets of those partnerships, limited liability companies and S corporations onto the personal tax returns of people like Mr. Trump. In turn, those losses can be used to cancel out an equivalent amount of taxable income."
As the Times noted, Trump's $916 million loss in 1995 could have allowed him to pay $0 in personal income taxes for the next 18 years.

4) He donates no (or very little) money to charity: We know, thanks to the amazing reporting of the Washington Post's David Fahrenthold, that Trump long used his charitable organization to feather his own nest and collect political chits rather than for any philanthropic purposes. (Trump shut down the charity in 2018.) It's not at all clear how generous (if at all) Trump has been to other charities over the past few decades. While there is no requirement for wealthy individuals to make large charitable donations, many do. And Trump has often boasted about the depth and breadth of his charitable giving.

1) Trump's not as rich as he says: There's very little question that Trump overstates his personal wealth -- and has done so for as long as he has had personal wealth. He's said he's worth $10 billion; Forbes said in 2018 that number is closer to $3 billion. For Trump to be exposed as one-third as rich as he had said he is would be embarrassing, sure. But remember, too, that Trump equates wealth directly with success and importance. So being exposed as less rich would be a blow to his success narrative as well.

That is NO legislative purpose. Trump could claim to be a billionaire a hundred times over and it STILL wouldn't have any legislative purpose.

2) He has Russia ties: While the Mueller report made clear that neither Trump nor anyone in his campaign orbit colluded with the Russians to help Trump win the 2016 election, it would still be a very big story if Trump's tax returns showed he had extensive financial dealings and ties to Russia. We know, from Michael Cohen, that Trump and his family were deeply involved in the potential construction of Trump Tower Moscow and that Cohen lied about that involvement (and how long it stretched) to protect Trump. We also know that Donald Trump Jr. said this at a 2008 real estate conference: "In terms of high-end product influx into the US, Russians make up a pretty disproportionate cross-section of a lot of our assets. Say, in Dubai, and certainly with our project in SoHo, and anywhere in New York. We see a lot of money pouring in from Russia."

Is there any US law prohibiting US citizens from having any financial dealings with Russia? Please cite such law. Just the SPECIFIC US Code will do.

3) He didn't pay many (or any) taxes: We know -- because Trump admitted as much -- that he used a more than $900 million net operating loss for his business in 1995 to avoid paying personal income taxes for a number of subsequent years. How? This, from The New York Times, explains it:
"Known as net operating loss, it allows an array of deductions, business expenses, real estate depreciation, losses from the sale of business assets and even operating losses to flow from the balance sheets of those partnerships, limited liability companies and S corporations onto the personal tax returns of people like Mr. Trump. In turn, those losses can be used to cancel out an equivalent amount of taxable income."
As the Times noted, Trump's $916 million loss in 1995 could have allowed him to pay $0 in personal income taxes for the next 18 years.

Even your own damn source tells you it was ALLOWED. Geez, man read what you list first. 

4) He donates no (or very little) money to charity: We know, thanks to the amazing reporting of the Washington Post's David Fahrenthold, that Trump long used his charitable organization to feather his own nest and collect political chits rather than for any philanthropic purposes. (Trump shut down the charity in 2018.) It's not at all clear how generous (if at all) Trump has been to other charities over the past few decades. While there is no requirement for wealthy individuals to make large charitable donations, many do. And Trump has often boasted about the depth and breadth of his charitable giving.

Last time I checked, no US citizen is required to donate to any charity. Unless he claimed a charitable deduction that he didn't make, not a thing wrong with that.

There it is. Not ONE damn legislative purpose in ANYTHING you wrote or quoted.

Ultimate FAIL.

Try harder to answer the question--WHAT IS THE LEGISLATIVE PURPOSE FOR DEMANDING TRUMP'S RETURNS?

1. It is not against any law to exaggerate ones wealth. He may have more or less than he says. So what?

2. It would be more unusual for someone in Trump's profession not to have international contact including some from Russia. It is not illegal to have Russian friends or colleagues.

3. If the way he did his taxes showed that he took legal means to reduce his tax liability to 0 , more power to him. The IRS certainly checked those returns already and found no irregularities or criminal violations.

4. Whether or not he donated to charityand how much is no one else's concern but his. Again but he improperly takes the as a deduction the IRS would have found it already.

He was asked for a legislative purpose for asking for Trump's returns and he responded with that clattle-trap nonsense.

I see the usual internet CPAs and tax experts are weaving their little tale of how Trump MUST be "hiding" something in his tax returns.

Amazing how the govt. publishes all sorts of forms for tax returns.

Any of those forms allow "hiding" anything?

If so, please, all you so-called self-proclaimed "experts", show us.

Back up your RIDICULOUS claims--if you can, of course.

Should I hold my breath waiting for actual proof?