Putin annexes 4 occupied regions; Ukraine applies to join NATO
Category: News & Politics
Via: perrie-halpern • 3 years ago • 48 commentsBy: Alexander Smith (NBC News)
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
Russian President Vladimir Putin proclaimed the biggest annexation of territory in postwar Europe on Friday, claiming control over swaths of Ukraine in defiance of international law and in spite of his forces facing another significant battlefield setback.
In a grand ceremony at the Kremlin that was followed by a patriotic rally outside, Putin declared that the four partially occupied regions of his neighbor's south and east were joining Russia forever — even as his troops appeared on the verge of encirclement in one strategic city.
The Russian leader repeated his threats of nuclear war to defend his fragile hold over the annexed territory, a dramatic escalation of the seven-month conflict that has seen Moscow respond to heavy losses by calling up hundreds of thousands of reservists and intensifying its confrontation with the West.
The speech was met with an immediate response by Kyiv and its allies.
President Volodymyr Zelenskyy announced that he was submitting his country's formal application to join NATO, the Western military alliance Putin has framed his war as a struggle against. The United States said it was imposing "swift and severe costs" for Putin's move in the form of a new round of sanctions.
"The United States condemns Russia's fraudulent attempt today to annex sovereign Ukrainian territory," President Joe Biden said in a statement. "Russia is violating international law, trampling on the United Nations Charter, and showing its contempt for peaceful nations everywhere."
A crowd on the edge of Red Square in central Moscow gathered for a rally and a concert Friday marking the annexation of the four regions.Natalia Kolesnikova / AFP - Getty Images
In the Kremlin, the Russian leader held a grand ceremony in which he vowed to use "all available means" to defend the four regions he was co-opting.
"This is the will of millions of people," Putin said Friday, words that few outside Russia see as credible for a move condemned in the West as a brazen and illegal land grab.
His speech was followed by Moscow-installed leaders of Donetsk, Luhansk, Kherson and Zaporizhzhia signing documents proclaiming them part of Russia, before joining hands with Putin and chanting "Russia! Russia!"
Minutes later, Zelenskyy posted a surprise online video announcing Ukraine was applying for accelerated accession to NATO. He also said that Kyiv was ready for peace talks with Russia — once it has a new leader, in response to Putin's urging for negotiations that he said would not include handing back the occupied territory.
It comes after votes were staged in the four regions that were widely criticized as rigged and preordained. Russian-installed local officials were accompanied by armed personnel going door to door.
Joining the alliance has been a goal of Kyiv's for years, and would give it the protection of collective defense promised by Washington and others. In reality, its membership appears incredibly unlikely given it could accelerate a direct military clash between Moscow and the West.
Still, the U.S. and others have provided billions of dollars of military support for Ukraine, as well as multiple rafts of sanctions. On Friday, Washington responded to Putin's statement with another salvo, imposing economic and visa sanctions on hundreds of Russian officials, bankers and military suppliers.
"We strongly support NATO's open doors, we strongly support bringing into NATO countries that seek to join and that can add to NATO's capabilities," Secretary of State Antony Blinken said. "There's a process for doing that and countries will continue to follow that process."
NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg said Russia's annexation "represents the mo t serious escalation since the start of the war."
He was noncommittal on Zelenskyy's fast-track bid to join, saying alliance leaders "support Ukraine's right to choose its own path, to decide what kind of security arrangements it wants to be part of."
European Union leaders also issued a statement after Putin's speech saying they "reject and unequivocally condemn the illegal annexation by Russia" which not only violated Ukraine's rights, but also put "global security at risk."
Western governments, officials and experts have openly regretted not responding with tougher measures when Russia annexed the Ukrainian peninsula of Crimea in 2014.
Moscow-installed heads of the four partially occupied regions were in Moscow for the ceremony.Dmitry Astakhov / Sputnik via AP
As well as announcing the annexation, Putin has partially mobilized his military — prompting domestic blowback and an exodus of Russians fleeing the draft — and ramped up his nuclear threats against Ukraine and the West. The moves are seen as a wider escalation after a series of punishing battlefield defeats at the hands of a lightning counteroffensive by Kyiv.
Putin delivered his barnstormingspeech Friday to hundreds of officials and other dignitaries, some in suits, some in military uniforms, at a lavish ceremony under the giant, gold chandeliers of Georgievsky Hall, in the Great Kremlin Palace.
After briefly welcoming the four new regions, he went on to discuss centuries of Russian history in which he railed against Western "colonialism" and "satanism," drawing a standing ovation.
The packed audience had earlier stood for a minute's silence as Putin hailed the Russian "heroes" who have died in the war, which he calls a "special military operation."
The Kremlin then celebrated its claim over what amounts to as much as 15% of Ukraine with a pop concert on Moscow's iconic Red Square. A stage was set up with giant video screens, and a large crowd watched musical acts followed by an appearance from Putin himself.
But it was clear that annexation does not mean control.
Thousands of Russian troops in the strategic city of Lyman in the eastern Donetsk region were on the verge of being surrounded, according to analysts and reports from both sides.
Underscoring the disconnect between Friday's ceremonies and the ongoing chaos and bloodshed of the war, hours earlier a missile attack on a convoy of cars traveling from Ukrainian-held land in Zaporizhzhia to Russian-occupied areas killed at least 23 people, local officials said.
CORRECTION (Sept. 30, 2022, 9:45 a.m.ET): An earlier version of this article misstated Antonio Guterres' title. He is the U.N. secretary-general, not its director-general.
Alexander Smith is a senior reporter for NBC News Digital based in London.
Peter Alexander, Daniella Silva, Abigail Williams and Associated Press contributed.
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He does this as the Ukrainians are actively pushing the Russian army out of these areas. A very cynical ploy by Putin to try and now frame his complete failure in Ukraine as an "invasion of Russia".
Putin and his cronies still living in their world of make-believe.
Hopefully, the Ukraine army completely surrounds the Russians in Lyman and administers another crushing defeat.
Lol, happened.
Western governments, officials and experts have openly regretted not responding with tougher measures when Russia annexed the Ukrainian peninsula of Crimea in 2014.
Why didn't they?
Why didn’t they?
barack Obama.
His entire foreign policy was dominated by sucking up to Putin so he would act as the middle man for the iran nuclear giveaway. So Obama refused to even send arms to the Ukrainians to help them defend themselves from the Russians.
Oh yes, there it is. Very good Sean. I couldn't have said it better.
So Obama refused to even send arms to the Ukrainians to help them defend themselves from the Russians.
Yup, and it wasn't until around 2016 that the democrat party suddenly saw Russia as evil. All based on a narrative they sold and later believed.
(Today is October 1st. I wondering when the site clock gets updated.)
The world ticks closer to nuclear oblivion.
Go ahead NATO- let Ukraine join and see what happens. Russia is already moving jets capable of carrying hypersonic nuclear weapons to the Ukraine border; and directly between two NATO countries. Think Putin is still bluffing?
The world has too many fucking morons is seems. It is the only explanation for how so many got into power at the same damn time. One moron can be dealt with. When there are two morons in charge of two of the world's largest nuclear stockpiles- what could go wrong? Seems that the other morons in NATO and Ukraine think nuclear war is a great idea; and are following blindly along.
There is no third party strong enough to step in and throw cold water on both sides. The world has already divided up.
This isn't a damn video game. There will be no human survivors. Wake the fuck up!
Seems that de-escalation only applies to US LEO's. Not world foreign policy.
It is unlikely to happen.
Odds are the nukes will blow up on the ground as the jets try to take off. Seriously, yes we should be concerned about Russia's nukes, because if only a handful actually work they can cause extreme damage. BUT, given the current state of Russia's military I think their high command might be more afraid that the missiles blow up in their silos or don't do anything at all. And, yes Putin is bluffing, that is all he has left.
Ummmm, not sure what you are arguing here. Ukraine most likely will not be admitted, but NATO will absolutely arm the shit out of Ukraine and rightly so. If the Russian's decide that is worth using nukes and committing suicide, then so be it. The alternative is letting tyrants do whatever they want if they have nukes and the rest of us just capitulating.
Yeah, Everyone v Russia (and kinda China but maybe not so much as this thing progresses). I am okay being on the everyone side.
And your solution is...?
We have no choice other than aiding and supporting Ukraine. Putin's insanity cannot be allowed to prevail.
Isolationism and pacifism didn't work during WW2 and it won't work now. I'm sure Trump would have followed this same course of action had he been reelected
Didn't somebody recently offer to broker peace?
Agreed until you mentioned Trump.
Trump would never have armed Ukraine to hold off Putin and the Russian military. Trump has already praised Putin multiple times over his invasion of Ukraine.
Now the war in Ukraine becomes dangerous. Putin has declared victory. Putin is celebrating that Russia has done what Russia said it would do. This is the Russian government's ticker tape parade. The special operation in Ukraine is over; now the war has become a defense of Russia. That means the gloves can come off.
From the beginning, Putin was laying out justifications for partitioning Ukraine. A partitioning of Ukraine was Putin's claimed impetus for the invasion. And the Russian military has pretty much achieved that objective. The question all along has been how far west the borders of the Luhansk and Donetsk oblasts (republics?) would extend.
Now there are recriminations over not responding to Russia's annexation of Crimea. How quickly everyone forgets. The Obama administration did respond to the Crimean annexation with punitive economic sanctions, aid to the Kiev government, and meddling in the Kiev government to prepare it for joining the EU and NATO. Joe Biden was directly involved in that response to the Crimean annexation. And Biden has relied upon the Obama playbook in his response to the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Obama set the stage for gradual escalation of the war in Donbas into a regional war. But it was Biden that escalated the regional war in Ukraine into a global conflict reminiscent of the Cold War.
It's true that Obama did not provide the Kiev government with lethal military arms but it's unclear if that was Obama's decision or reticence by Congress. Obama had entangled the United States in Libya, Syria, a simmering war with Iran in Iraq, support for the Kurds in northern Iraq as an expediency, low level fighting with Boko Haram in Nigeria, and ramped up the war in Afghanistan. Obama was over committing United States military support and protection throughout the Middle East, North Africa, and the Asian subcontinent. The United States had a lot on it's plate but that doesn't justify rewriting history to claim that Obama did not respond to the Russian annexation of Crimea. Obama's response to Russia's annexation of Crimea was the same as Biden's response to the Russian invasion of Ukraine; that's the real unvarnished history.
The Kiev government in Ukraine has immediately responded as it has since 2008 by using NATO as a threat. Ukraine brandishes NATO as a club to threaten Russia and avoid diplomatic efforts. Even now Zelensky is writing checks that NATO won't cash. And as long as we allow Ukraine to use NATO (and the United States) as a threat, the war in Ukraine will continue. We either follow the west's normal practice of kicking the can which will prolong the war or we ignore Ukraine and begin diplomatic talks with Russia. Russia has declared victory and vindication so now seems like an auspicious time to take steps toward winding down the war. Otherwise we'll be involved in Ukraine for another decade. But that would be an admission that the Obama (and now Biden) doctrine of economic isolation, Cold War style, doesn't work in today's world. We'd have to admit that the war in Ukraine really hasn't been about Ukraine at all; that we had used Ukraine to achieve other geopolitical objectives.
How many lies are we willing to tell ourselves? And how many wars are we willing to fight to protect ourselves from confronting our own lies? Are Biden's actions on the world stage the culmination of a failed doctrine built on lies or are Biden's actions an escalation that threatens to destabilize the world? That's our choice. And that has always been our choice.
Lol and there it is! I knew while scanning your book(post) that I would come across the ultimate "let Russia win" line you are so fond of throwing out, and I was not disappointed. Let Putin get away with it has been your position from the start. Since, you know, letting warmongering dictators do as they please has always worked well.
Dude, Russia is fucking losing, and badly. There is no question about it, and your position is "well, they are getting the shit beat out of them, we better wave the white flag."
FFS, you would be the worst sports coach ever.
Russia won before the invasion. Ukrainian separatists controlled at least a third of Luhansk and Donetsk oblasts. The Kiev government has not had control over eastern Ukrainian borders since 2014. The Ukrainian separatists had already claimed a partition of Ukraine.
The only thing Russia had to do to win was to ensure the Ukrainian separatists maintained control over the areas they claimed. Any expansion of those areas would be vindication for Russia. Russia recognized (not imposed) independence of Luhansk and Donetsk before the invasion. Putin's recognition of Luhansk and Donetsk as independent republics was the win before the invasion.
If the goal was getting their asses kicked, then yes.
And no one recognized it as anything more than a Russian PR campaign.
Which is not happening and as Russian soldiers retreat, Ukranian soldiers are being hugged, kissed, and showered with praise. The Ukranians are being treated as liberators.
Russia said some bullshit that everyone else called bullshit on and now they are trying to make this war some sort of defense of Russia after their "elections" that no one outside of the Russian government accepts. Your boy Vlad is fucked, he sucks a waging wars, and will ultimately be the downfall of Russia.
Whose ass is being kicked? Russia has claimed a victory and can point to tangible results to back up that claim.
Biden can't claim victory until Russia is expelled and the Ukrainian separatists are subjugated.
You don't think propaganda plays a role in warfare?
Which is also has propaganda value.
And more propaganda. Putin's bullshit wasn't meant for Ukraine, NATO, or the United States. And calling Putin's justifications bullshit won't hide the fact that Ukraine has been de facto partitioned since 2014.
The Kiev government has been calling Ukrainian separatists 'terrorists' and using NATO (and the United States) as a threat. The Kiev government has been using its own propaganda to encourage support by the United States, NATO, and Europe. Zelensky has been playing the same PR game as Putin; only the audiences are different which requires different propaganda.
That is like saying because you got the first punch, you won the fight.
No, Russia had a win before any punches were thrown. Everyone wants to forget that Ukraine had already partitioned itself. Ukrainians had been fighting Ukrainians for eight years on Russia's border. Ukrainians had fought Ukrainians to a stalemate.
Everyone wants to forget that the United States has been providing non-lethal military aid to the Kiev government since 2014. The Obama administration was supplying humvees, drones, body armor, medical supplies, and a variety of other equipment. The United States began supplying Javelin anti-tank weapons to Ukraine in 2019 (remember the first Trump impeachment?) The United States had provided Ukraine around $2 billion in aid over the six years prior to the Russian invasion. The United States had a contingent of military trainers and advisors in Ukraine prior to the Russian invasion. The claim that the United States has not been involved in the Ukrainian war prior to the Russian invasion is pure fiction.
[Deleted]
Sadly, there is a fairly large group of conservatives who continue to lick Putin's feet.
"The Conservative Political Action Conference ( CPAC ) on Friday tweeted — and then hours later deleted — a message that called on Democrats to “ end the gift-giving to Ukraine ” while featuring a fluttering Russian flag . The tweet also referred to “ Ukraine-occupied territories ,” appearing to legitimize Russian President Vladimir Putin’s claims to annex provinces based on a referendum that the U.S. and allies view as illegal."
" CPAC is not alone among American conservatives in opposing Ukrainian aid despite Putin’s invasion. Fox News host Tucker Carlson has alleged U.S. sabotage for leaks in a Russian gas pipeline to Europe, baseless claims that have earned him airtime on Russian state television . Former president Donald Trump also posted a message on his Truth Social platform offering himself as a negotiator for the conflict."
At a Trump rally in Michigan on Saturday, Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.) reiterated her opposition to U.S. aid to Ukraine and said Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky should negotiate a peace settlement with Russia.
“We have so many problems here at home, I cannot even think about sending our money over to fund a proxy war with Russia,” she said in an interview. “ Zelensky doesn’t run the United States government . He is not our president, but for some reason Joe Biden bends over every single time. … The American people don’t care about that war over there .”
Many Republicans have followed Trump’s lead in waffling on Putin, whom Trump avoided condemning and sided with over his own intelligence agencies in doubting Russian interference in the 2016 election .
CPAC backpedals on pro-Russia tweet as some U.S. conservatives back Putin (msn.com)
The Russian Army sucks.
Who in this discussion is cheerleading for war and demanding more war? Who wants war and who doesn't?
I'm not the one who led the United States into another quagmire. I'm not the one ignoring that the United States is currently committed to spending about $10 billion per month so that the war can continue.
I'm not the one ignoring that Biden has screwed another pooch.
Maybe so. Why has Europe and the United States claimed the Russian army is the world's greatest threat?
Biden has committed the United States and NATO countries to a prolonged war contained within Ukraine. How long would Ukraine continue fighting without support from the United States and NATO countries?
Biden has deliberately transformed a regional war into a global conflict. Biden has been making threats to allies and adversaries alike. Biden has committed the United States, NATO, Europe, and most of the developing world to wrecking the global economy in order to defeat Russia.
But what is Biden's endgame? What does Biden consider victory? Has Biden explained how the war ends? How will the United States know it has won?
The United States economy is 13 times larger than Russia's. The European Union's economy is 11 times larger than Russia's. The United States military is by far the largest in the world both in personnel and capability. Yet Biden doesn't believe Ukraine is important enough to utilize that overwhelming military capability. Biden refuses to commit to fighting and expects Ukraine to bleed for him. Biden appears to be a passive-aggressive warrior.
If the Russian army sucks then the United States should be able to force that Russia army out of Ukraine without much risk. But is that Biden's endgame? Is that what Biden considers victory?
“Why has Europe and the United States claimed the Russian army is the world's greatest threat?”
Perhaps their nuclear arsenal and a besieged leader that has already made thinly veiled threats in utilizing such?
The United States has a nuclear arsenal. The UK and France have a nuclear arsenal. Are those nuclear arsenals just bling? Hasn't the United States used its own nuclear arsenal as a threat?
The military planning of the United States following WWII has been to conduct nuclear war against the Soviet Union. First strike planning was US policy until the Soviet Union developed its own fission and thermonuclear weapons. And Ukraine played a key role in developing the Soviet nuclear arsenal. Ukraine was the third largest nuclear power in world during the Cold War. US military planning since the end of WWII has been to completely and utterly destroy Russia using nuclear weapons. The United States has not abandoned that military planning, policy, and doctrine. Ignorance of the Cold War doesn't excuse jingoism.
We see China as a bigger threat:
“Taken together, this agenda will strengthen our enduring advantages, and allow us to prevail in strategic competition with China or any other nation. The most effective way
for America to out-compete a more assertive and authoritarian China over the long-term is
to invest in our people, our economy, and our democracy. By restoring U.S. credibility and reasserting forward-looking global leadership, we will ensure that America, not China, sets the international agenda, working alongside others to shape new global norms and agreements that advance our interests and reflect our values. By bolstering and defending our unparalleled network of allies and partners, and making smart defense investments, we will also deter Chinese aggression and counter threats to our collective security, prosperity, and Taken together, this agenda will strengthen our enduring advantages, and allow us to prevail in strategic competition with China or any other nation. The most effective way for America to out-compete a more assertive and authoritarian China over the long-term is
to invest in our people, our economy, and our democracy. By restoring U.S. credibility and reasserting forward-looking global leadership, we will ensure that America, not China, sets the international agenda, working alongside others to shape new global norms and agreements that advance our interests and reflect our values. By bolstering and defending our unparalleled network of allies and partners, and making smart defense investments, we will also deter Chinese aggression and counter threats to our collective security, prosperity, and democratic way of life.democratic way of life.”
This reads as though you believe it is the intent and desire of the USA to obliterate Russia with nukes.
The intent and desire of the United States was to obliterate Russia with nukes prior to the Cuban missile crisis. That's why the United States was creating a nuclear arsenal before the Soviet Union had developed nuclear weapons. That really was the military doctrine of the United States.
The United States maintained first strike readiness to attack the Soviet Union (primarily Russian targets) until nuclear negotiations began in 1963 following the Cuban missile crisis. Curtis LeMay created the Strategic Air Command for the express purpose of attacking and destroying Russia with nuclear weapons. SAC was conducting nuclear strike exercises on American cities throughout the 1950s to prepare for a first strike attack on Russia. The Strategic Air Command was not established to serve as a deterrent; SAC was created to be an attack force utilizing nuclear weapons.
That is quite the conspiracy theory. We intended and desired M.A.D., eh? Do you believe that is still our intent?
LeMay was SAC’s 2nd commander.
Download the recorded history and read it yourself.
The history has been carefully revised to suggest that LeMay was motivated to create a nuclear capable force as a deterrent but the inconsistencies are fairly obvious. LeMay was a vocal proponent for first strike use of nuclear weapons.
Bombs Away LeMay.
You seem to be defending Russia every chance you get.
It's like non-stop Russian bot. Just non-stop pro-Russian Putin toe sucking propaganda.
The United States isn't in a quagmire, we are supporting a European ally after they were ruthlessly attacked without provocation by a sniveling little dick piece of shit dictator who has illusions of grandeur. I hope the Russian people overthrow the little authoritarian prick and send him to prison to spend the rest of his life as a prison blow up doll.
Lots of negative things to say about the American President and nothing but praise for a violent murderous Russian authoritarian.
United States Constitution, Article III, Section 3, “Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort.
Pointing out what should be obvious isn't defending Russia. And the attempt to make me the topic of discussion only demonstrates that the reality on the ground is too obvious to be overcome by wishful thinking.
What's the endgame? How do we know when the war is over? The length of the war depends upon the endgame. If our expectation is that war will be over when the fighting stops then freeze the battlefield where it's at and begin talking peace to stop the fighting. But talking peace before the war began might have avoided the fighting altogether.
War planning requires some understanding of the endgame before the first shot is fired. The endgame provides justifications for fighting. And the endgame determines when the fighting stops. So, what's our endgame?
I do not live in Russia. I do not live in Ukraine. I live in the United States. So, where the President leads the country is of more importance to me. Ukraine is not the only (or most important) issue confronting the United States. Resources devoted to Ukraine will not be available to address other more important issues.
Biden has not explained what the endgame in Ukraine looks like. Biden has not explained why Ukraine is of such importance to the United States that it is necessary to take resources away from addressing other issues. Biden has committed the United States to expending resources to support a war that is of little importance to the United States and has no defined end. Biden has created a perception that his interest in the Ukrainian war is about political optics and scoring political points. That raises questions about Biden's competence as President.
Biden's leadership or lack of leadership affects me more than does Putin or Zelensky. If Biden can't explain why we are involved in Ukraine and cannot explain what the endgame in Ukraine looks like then there is a real risk that Biden's incompetence will escalate the situation and draw the United States more deeply into a regional war of no real importance to the United States.
But regurgitating Russian propaganda certainly is. You claim its obvious but refuse to see what's going on from any other view than Russia's. You're stating the "obvious" from an indoctrinated Russian Putin supporter who believes they are "rescuing" Ukraine and simply "recognizing" these regions that previously had small separatist groups wanting to join Russia but not enough of the actual citizens to have a real vote in Ukraine to do it. You refuse to admit that Russia invaded unprovoked and killed off thousands of Ukrainian citizens then held a sham referendum to declare the regions part of Russia.
If we turn our backs on the allies of western democracy when they are attacked by an authoritarian government we empower those authoritarians to believe they can get away with anything. Assassinating dissidents, murdering journalists, jailing anyone who speaks out in opposition, invading neighboring nations without provocation, bombing civilians, torturing and killing captured civilians, threatening to use nuclear weapons to achieve their invasion objectives, yet you seem to not be able to condemn them for anything and apparently think our support for Ukraine is worthless.
I believe that's because to the vast majority of Americans helping to defend an ally and their innocent civilians from a murderous genocidal authoritarian aggressor is obviously the right thing to do. Only a minority of fascism supporting, Russian defending white nationalists in America would be defending the murderous genocidal authoritarian aggressor.
Nope. That's just more anti-American Russian propaganda that is desperate to make the current administration look weak and incompetent which is clearly what Putin hopes for and no doubt gives him aid and comfort when he sees groups of fascist loving Americans repeating it.
Just more Russian propaganda downplaying the seriousness of Russia's unprovoked invasion of a European ally. If only Hitler had such friends in America. Oh, that's right, he did at first... and they seem to be almost identical to those defending Russia today.
Before World War II, the German-American Bund was one of the most successful pro-Nazi organizations in the United States. On February 20, 1939, American Nazis gathered at Madison Square Garden for a mass rally for “true Americanism. ”
At its height, the Bund had organized 20 youth training camps. Promoted as family-friendly summer camps .
The height of the German-American Bund’s popularity was marked by the February 1939 rally at Madison Square Garden. Kuhn and other American Nazi leaders called the event a “mass demonstration for true Americanization” and used patriotic imagery alongside Nazi imagery and antisemitic rhetoric. Twenty-two thousand Bund members carried signs and banners with messages such as, “Wake up America! Smash Jewish Communism” and “Stop Jewish Domination of Christian Americans.”
In Fritz Kuhn’s keynote address, he demanded that “… our government be returned to the American People who founded it .”
Today, the “Alt-Right” have taken up the mantle of white supremacy and Nazism in the United States . The Unite the Right Rally marched in Charlottesville, Virginia in 2017 chanting Nazi and antisemitic slogans while carrying torches, Nazi flags, and white supremacist imagery. Most recently, at the siege of the US Capital in January 2021 , cameras caught Americans in “Camp Auschwitz” and “6MWE” (6 Million Wasn’t Enough) shirts and an abundance of antisemitic, fascist and hate speech, conspiracy theories, and propaganda. The enduring Nazi and white supremist ideologies and rhetoric in the United States remains a lasting and dangerous legacy of the 1939 German-American Bund Rally at Madison Square Garden and the larger American Nazi Movement of the 1930s.
American Nazism and Madison Square Garden | The National WWII Museum | New Orleans (nationalww2museum.org)
Looking at recent events, the progressive's antisemitism continues unabated.
By all means, avoid saying anything against Soviets. Joseph Stalin was as ruthless and bloodthirsty as Hitler, if not more so. And Ukraine played a prominent role in that Soviet history. Ukraine was second to Russia in the Soviet Union. And Ukraine wanted to be first. Ignore that during the Soviet era Ukraine annexed portions of Poland, Belarus, Russia, and what is now Moldova. Ignore that Ukraine deported Poles from the area it annexed. Ignore that Ukraine wasn't nearly the size it currently is before the Bolshevik's took control of Russia. Ignore that Ukraine supported and participated in the Bolshevik uprising and overthrow of the Russian government. Completely ignore the blood on Ukrainian hands.
The attempt to portray Putin as another Hitler is rather bizarre. Putin is following in the footsteps of Stalin. But then so is Zelensky. Don't dare point out Ukraine's history is as bad or worse than that of NAZI Germany. Never, ever, speak ill of Soviets. And Zelensky is a Soviet in word and deed, if not in name. Zelensky isn't any less Soviet than Putin.
Anyone who has read and understood your linked article know that to be a bunch of horse shit. Just because a handful of student groups at a liberal University law school said they would no longer host "Zionist" speakers doesn't somehow prove progressives are anti-Semitic. And there are many Jews who do not consider themselves "Zionists" and some who have been openly critical of the more extreme Zionist movements.
" although many Jews identify with Zionism, there are still many different points of view. That is reason enough not to mix up the words 'Jew', 'Israelis' and 'Zionists'."
Are all Jews Zionists? | Anne Frank House
Now the large crowd of white right wing confederate monument defending conservatives marching through the streets wielding tiki torches shouting "Jews will not replace us!" is clear anti-Semitism but strangely I never hear other right wing conservatives condemning them for it and instead right wing conservative Republicans welcome them into their party and thank them for their votes and support while defending them and claiming there were "good people on both sides" and saying Heather Heyer deserved what she got for daring to protest. These are clearly the same folk who now defend Putin and his unprovoked invasion and murder of innocent civilians in Ukraine.
Yes, we all (hopefully) know about the Soviet Union and its history, but most of the world including western democracies were willing to leave that history in the past if they adopted representative governments that embraced capitalism and granted citizens certain rights and freedoms. Since the iron curtain fell there has been a lot of turmoil but the former soviet nations that have embraced western democracy were given a chance to reform and become global allies instead of enemies. Russia under Putin, however, has chosen to take Russia back to their old authoritarian ways, the new FSB is nothing but the KGB with a new name and Russia is a 'democracy' in name only.
Stalin joined Hitler in the invasion of Poland in 1939 and they were essentially allies under the Ribbentrop-Molotov pact until Germany decided to break the pact and attack the Soviet Union in 1941. Seems Stalin, who Putin reveres, and Hitler would have gotten along fine with Putin.
Putin Praises Alliance Between Hitler and Stalin - The American TFP
How the fuck is Zelenskyy following in the footsteps of Stalin? That is one of the most insane things I've seen you say and that's saying something when the vast majority of your statements are thick with unmitigated crazy.
More complete nonsensical Russian propaganda. While they were both born in what was the old Soviet Union, the differences in policies and politics are stark. Trying to paint Putin's opponent as "bad as Putin" is just another tired piece of rightwing fascist Russian propaganda sadly being regurgitated by clearly gullible rightwing dim wits and dip shits here in America who with they had a 'strong man' like Putin running our country stamping down on liberals, progressives, women's rights, lgtbq persons and personal freedoms and privacy rights.
For emphasis, since this fact does not seem to be recognized.
We were wrong. We did not understand just how badly the mafia culture in Russia had degraded its military capabilities. We were wrong in that we GREATELY overestimated Russia in ever way, shape, and form. Obviously now that isn o longer the case.
Good.
Who cares? They have it and are pushing the Russians back in all theaters, they are winning. Why are you hating on the west winning? Do you really just hate western democracy that much and want to see a Russian version of fascism succeed?
No... Putin did that when he invaded. I am now wondering if you are not actually Putin himself with all the horseshit excuses.
Threatening adversaries, yeah no shit, that is kinda what you do...
Threatening allies, how so?
Because the alternative is letting countries like Russia dictate world affairs. Fuck that.
No clear answer to that from us, the Ukranians, or the Russians.
Okay, are you just trolling or are you actually retarded?
And mods, that is not an insult but a genuine question given the sentence I just copied. I am not trying to be insulting, but am legit curious.
Dude, NUKES, an d Russia's self-defense policy. Even if only 5% of Russian nukes actually work that would devastate the planet. How in the fuck do you not get this? We are not afraid of conventional Russian forces, at all, just that a small percentage of their nuclear forces actually work and we can't intercept them all.
Honestly, the problem is that we did not factor in corruption into our assessments. And corruption within the Russian military is basically the order of the day. Sure, given the parades, demo videos and everything they looked impressive, but western planners did not look beyond those videos, or the numbers of equipment and soldiers, and that wad where the west failed.
We just did not anticipate how terrible the Russian army was. We looked ta their weapons and said "if our guys had these, how would we do?" and of course we did extremely well. But that was based on military personnel on the same level as the US or other allied militaries. Russia is the opposite of that.
Unwilling and unsupported conscripts unlikely to fare any betterment than Putin's "elite" troops.
More russians to die in a war they don't want.
So is this Putin's backdoor way of becoming a NATO member?
Very clever.
I guess that Putin isn't aware that you cannot annex territory you don't control.