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Gazans do have another choice.

  

Category:  Scattershooting,Ramblings & Life

Via:  buzz-of-the-orient2  •  10 years ago  •  47 comments

Gazans do have another choice.

Gazans do have another choice.

In light of the Arab Spring happenings, the revolutions that rid the common folk of oppressive leadership (which unfortunately has sometimes led to "out of the pan and into the fire") Gazans did fail with the election some years ago to better their situation. Even though it was complained that Fatah was corrupt and they wanted a new leadership, they were better off with Fatah than they have been and are with Hamas.

However, they do have another choice. Revolt, overthrow the current oppressive regime and join Israel. As Israeli citizens, even though they are Arab and/or Muslim, polls have indicated that they would choose being Israeli citizens than citizens of any Arab country. Why is that, in that "apartheid, racist, discriminating, evil" country, they are better off than Arabs/Muslims anywhere else in the Middle East? I'll let the Zionist-haters try to answer that question.

Nobody can deny how humanitarian Israelis can be, whether it is setting up hospitals in places like Haiti, providing medical care to refugees of the Syrian uprising, free life-saving heart operations for Arab children, assistance in earthquake aftermaths, etc. I am positive that not only the Jewish diaspora but the majority of Israelis themselves would encourage and support a rebuilding by Israel of Gaza. The borders would open, the blockade would become non-existent, good-paying rebuilding jobs galore would be plentiful, Gaza would become the Riviera of the Middle East. A whole new life could be discovered, not unlike the fact that when I decided to move to China I created a whole new life and adventure for myself. Renewal.

However, the problem is to get rid of Hamas and the splinter terrorist organizations such as Islamic Jihad, etc. Nobody wants to be dragged through the streets by a motorcycle. So what must happen would have to be a massive and sudden uprising that would disarm Hamas and the other terrorists. Hamas has been very clever in educating its population with hatred of and blame on Israel so it will take a lot of guts to overcome their police state mentality.

Anyway, that's just my suggestion - I'm pretty sure it will never happen.


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Krishna
Professor Expert
link   Krishna    10 years ago

In many Arab countries, kids are brainwashed to hate Jews from birth. I don't think that will be easy-- or even possible-- to overcome.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
link   Krishna    10 years ago

There are about 20 Arab countries-- how many are democracies?

 
 
 
sixpick
Professor Quiet
link   sixpick    10 years ago

None are democracies. Oh, but wouldn't it be great for everyone. They say everything starts with a dream.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
link   Kavika     10 years ago

It's a great concept Buzz, but I doubt that it will happen. Hate is instilled in the kids from birth. That is one bit hurtle to overcome.

 
 
 
Jonathan P
Sophomore Silent
link   Jonathan P    10 years ago

Knowledge test for John Russell, The One Who Knows All.

What is the difference in the "fullness" of citizenship between Jewish Israelis and Arab Israelis?

Please cite specific examples in your answer.

Thank you.

 
 
 
Jonathan P
Sophomore Silent
link   Jonathan P    10 years ago

The current Arab Israelis do.

Anything else?

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Expert
link   Perrie Halpern R.A.    10 years ago

I disagree Kavika.

Just watch this:

Visit NBCNews.com for breaking news , world news , and news about the economy

 
 
 
Miss_Construed
Freshman Silent
link   Miss_Construed    10 years ago

I know this question was for JR... but I heard this on the radio the other morning

(sorry, for some reason the link function isnt working.... )

INSKEEP: He was already planning to spend a school year at the University of Illinois. And now says he might be leaving Israel for good. It's significant because this Arab man is a prominent writer in the Jewish state. He writes novels in Hebrew. He is a columnist for the Israeli newspaper Haaretz and the creator of an Israeli sitcom. Until recently, he lived with his family in an overwhelmingly Jewish section of Jerusalem.

What was it that happened in the last weeks that changed your plans?

KASHUA: The major thing that changed my plan was extremists in the streets of Jerusalem, the place that we live. I think that we were the only Arab family in our neighborhood in western Jerusalem. And there were groups of Jewish, extreme right-wing people beating Arabs in the streets of Jerusalem and just because they are Arabs. And when Mohammed Abu Khdeir, the young Palestinian teenager, was kidnapped and executed, I felt that I cannot really let my daughter take the buses in the streets of Jerusalem. But I think that more than anything else, it was this very strong feeling that I lost my world, in my case - because it's true. I was writing, and my writing, the novels and the TV shows and the movies, were doing huge success. But that was not the major reason that I started writing in Hebrew. It was because I wanted to create one story that both Palestinians and Israelis, Jewish Israelis sharing that land, can relate to or can live in peace with one story, not two stories, not two narratives that cannot live together.

....

INSKEEP: How are you not equal? Do you not have the same voting rights, for example?

KASHUA: Yes, we do have - we have the right to vote. But we are discriminated in everything that you can imagine. It's the investment per person; if you are Jewish and Arab, it's completely different. And there's this very strong feeling that we are a threat, that we are a national threat, that we are considered still, in Israel, like, fifth column, like a mistake. So it's - we have the right to vote, and I'm not sure for how long we are going to practice it because sometimes it looks like a fig leaf for the fake Israeli democracy. And we cannot really talk about Israel as a democracy, and even Israeli sociologists would call it ethnocracy. It's a democratic country only if you belong to the Jewish people.

This is not a call to argue over the point, but it is a call that there are two sides to a story. This man has the option to move out of the region, while others may be forced to make a decision to stay in the lesser of evils. But that doesn't mean that staying in Israel over an Arab country is wine and roses for a non-Jew. And it does a disservice to people to pretend like it is, or worse, to pretend like Israel can do no wrong because they offer a better situation.

A gilded cage with cushions is still a cage.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
link   Kavika     10 years ago

Of the thousands, ten of thousands Pali kids, only a small handful will attend something like this.

It's a great start, but in our lifetime we'll never see the end of the killing.

 
 
 
pokermike
Freshman Silent
link   pokermike    10 years ago

Sadly, this is the Hamas' idea of summer camp for children:

3734_discussions.jpg

 
 
 
pokermike
Freshman Silent
link   pokermike    10 years ago

The entire leadership of Hamas should be internationally charged with Crimes Against Humanity for the evil brainwashing of their youth to hate Israel and Jews, and for teaching them their greatest aspiration in life is to be a shahid (martyr).

 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
The idea of a Palestinian state was an alternative proposal to the Palestinian right of return. Israel has not supported a separate state in any meaningful way and has always strongly objected to Palestinians returning. That's why palestinians ended up on a bantustan in the first place. Clearly, Palestinians within Israel fare far better than those on the bantustan-like territories. Personally, I'm in favor of your idea as I have repeated said either give the Palestinians a state or let them return. But the reason your idea won't work is because Israel will flat reject it. Don't believe me? Research it and see what they have said every time the issue is brought up.
 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
Check out Israel's bizarre distinction between citizenship and nationality. This is for people within Israel, not those on the bantustans.
 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
Netanyahu sates that although every citizen has equal rights, the law should be amended to make clear that the nation itself belongs to the Jews. I wonder what he would say about increasing the Arab population of Israel.
 
 
 
Petey Coober
Freshman Silent
link   Petey Coober    10 years ago

I wonder what you would say about the lack of birth control in Gaza ?

 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
"I wonder what you would say about the lack of birth control in Gaza?The same thing I say about everything else they don't have. End the blockade.
 
 
 
Petey Coober
Freshman Silent
link   Petey Coober    10 years ago

You know as well as I that they would receive all the birth control they wanted for free . But of course you got to get in a "blockade" dig . Completely ridiculous if it wasn't so tragic .

 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
An occupied people have a right to resist occupation. To blockade the entire territory and even block people from fishing constitutes collective punishment reminiscent of the Nazis and illegal under international law. If you think collective punishment is appropriate, then it is you who are tantamount to a terrorist. In fact, your thinking (justifying an indirect attack on the civilian population) provides terrorists with the very justification to retaliate against Israeli civilians.
 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
"You know as well as I that they would receive all the birth control they wanted for free ."Yeah by putting their children on the receiving end of missiles and artillery shells.
 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
"There it is. Once again a comparison with the Nazis (along with a personal attack). Not worth responding."If Israelis don't want to be compared with Nazis, then they should avoid acting like them. As for the personal attack, you ignore your own to criticize mine.
 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago

This is a quotation from the Ottawa Protocol, word-for-word with the definition of anti-Semitism adopted by the Department of State of the USA. I'm not calling you an anti-Semite, the Ottawa Protocol is:

Examples of the ways in which antisemitism manifests itself with regard to the State of Israel taking into account the overall context could include:

  • Drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis.

First of all, by its own terms, the Protocol says that you should take the overall context into account. It does not say that there are never any comparisons to be made. The issue here is collective punishment. If collective punishment is wrong, then it's wrong no matter who does it. Therefore, collective punishment was wrong when the Nazis did it and it's wrong when the Israelis do it. My comparison stands. So let me be clear. I will continue to compare Israel to the Nazis as long as they engage in Nazi-like behavior.

 
 
 
pokermike
Freshman Silent
link   pokermike    10 years ago

Yeah by putting their children on the receiving end of missiles and artillery shells.

One of the very few things to which they seem to excel.

 
 
 
Jonathan P
Sophomore Silent
link   Jonathan P    10 years ago

if something is "illegal under International Law" then why isn't the perpetrator country being prosecuted?

Because pronouncements by the UN General Assembly do not constitute "International Law". They constitute the majority vote of the member states, the majority of which are a combination of OPEC nations, and 3rd world countries who rely on OPEC imported oil to run their economy.

The "war crimes" canard comes from those countries who commit the most crimes against their own people. For a list of those countries, check the list of the UNHRC.

Glad to help, BuzzGrin.gif

 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago

One of the very few things to which they seem to excel.

It's hard not to excel when Israel murders them no matter where they are

. . . school, playgrounds, hospitals, the beach, UN shelters.

 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago

Yes it's an unproven allegation but the fact that's its unproven doesn't mean it isn't true. Such allegations can be proven in a court with proper jurisdiction. The proper court would be the International Criminal Court (ICC). However, Palestine is not a member of the ICC and the US has blocked Palestine's membership. As for libel/slander, it's only slander/libel if the accusation is false (as truth is a defense). It's not false just because the offender is able to evade being brought to justice.

 
 
 
Petey Coober
Freshman Silent
link   Petey Coober    10 years ago

The beauty of being a member on NT is you can libel anyone who is not a member . In this case it is the entire state of Israel . Have "fun" .

 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
Ah but Israel and its hacks libel everyone who criticizes it by calling them an anti-Semites or terrorist sympathizers so I guess we're even.
 
 
 
Petey Coober
Freshman Silent
link   Petey Coober    10 years ago

so I guess we're even

Since no one has called you an anti-semite , that guess would be wrong .

 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
You're not correcting anything but rather voicing an opinion. Your opinion is no better than anybody else's. I already pointed out that the Ottawa Protocol doesn't call all criticism of Israel anti-semitism and that it should be based on context. Did you see that? My comment about libeling critics by calling them anti-Semites and terrorist sympathizers was for Petey, not you. But I'll add lynch mob to my list of libelous descriptions applied to critics of Israel.
 
 
 
Petey Coober
Freshman Silent
link   Petey Coober    10 years ago

Do you know what Israelis mean when they speak about a lynching ?

 
 
 
1ofmany
Sophomore Silent
link   1ofmany    10 years ago
"Do you know what Israelis mean when they speak about a lynching ?"You mean this?
 
 

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