╌>

The Vaccine Coercers Are Moral Monsters

  
Via:  XXJefferson51  •  5 years ago  •  41 comments

By:   Scott Morefield

The Vaccine Coercers Are Moral Monsters
Most people who choose to remain unvaccinated - like myself - do so not because we want to spread the virus to others or are against vaccinations in general, but because we have natural immunity and/or serious, data-driven questions about this particular vaccine. The moral case for choice, and against vaccine mandates, is as clear as day and as absolute as any case for good and against evil could ever be. If the Covid-19 vaccine mandaters aren’t evil people (I am beginning to believe most...

Leave a comment to auto-join group Americana

Americana


This libertarian viewpoint about the evil of vaccine mandates under current circumstances and knowledge is right on.  The author made his choice and I made mine.  Where we are in total agreement is opposition to mandates.  He’s right that vax mandates are evil and that advocates and enforcers of them are supporting an evil act.  The author articulates well the case in opposition to coercion and force and in favor of all making an informed decision of their own free will either way.  It is time to make freedom, liberty, individual rights the arch enemy of the progressive left elites so that in order to achieve any of their agenda, be it lockdowns, masks, mandates, the economy, the environment they have to openly trample upon people’s  rights forcibly seizing them while demanding we shut up and obey each and every little step on the way.  It’s time to go scorched earth with them making them take rights and liberty to advance each goal and see we the people respond in the 2022 elections to right their overreaches and expose them for the threats to 1776 exceptional America that they truly are.  



5phszj.jpg



 


S E E D E D   C O N T E N T



f0ccf969-8b39-4c20-b7d7-906e00da59e9-500x250.jpg

Source: AP Photo/LM Otero

As a thought experiment, I  posted the following statement to Twitter last week:

“Unless you are 100% sure that this vaccine is 100% safe for 100% of those who take it (you aren’t), you have NO moral right to force or coerce it on ANYONE. In fact, choosing to do so is an evil action.”

To clarify, I added the below as a follow-up:

“You can strongly recommend it. You can explain why you think the benefits are worth the drawbacks and/or risks. What you can't do - if you want to stay on the right side of morality, that is - is impose a negative consequence for making the 'wrong' choice. THAT is coercion.”

By almost any standard, especially mine, the tweet did remarkably well, reaching hundreds of thousands of people and garnering hundreds of responses. And particularly interesting was the fact that it did so without being retweeted by any major accounts, at least as far as I could tell. That especially means that the issue, and the framing above, strongly resonated with people who are passionate enough about it to interact in some way.

If you have a few minutes, you can and should read through the comments. Though most agree with me, the ones that don’t tell you everything you need to know about where we are with the fight for bodily autonomy regarding Covid-19 vaccines in America today. The gist of most centered around the seeming assumption that the unvaccinated are automatically actively spreading the virus to everyone around them just by virtue of being unvaccinated. ‘Your right to swing your fist ends where someone else’s nose begins,’ or something, the logic typically went.

Except, as we are increasingly learning, whether someone is vaccinated or not has little to nothing to do with whether or not someone spreads or contracts this particular virus. Yes, possibly, your symptoms might be reduced and you may have a decreased chance of hospitalization or death - for the few months the vaccines actually ‘work’ - but this has absolutely nothing to do with anyone around you, who have all made their own decision about whether or not to take the vaccine. In other words, this decision is and should be a personal one and a personal one alone.

But what if it wasn’t? What if the vaccine actually did prevent the contraction and spread of Covid-19? Would the mandaters then have a point? Before we dig deeper into that question, consider this  thought experiment presented by a respondent on the thread cited above:

“It's found that spinal fluid of aboriginal men cures cancer of any stage. But, 1 in 1,000,000 extractions will cause immediate death. A law that forces them to donate is immoral.”

His conclusion: “You can't morally force anyone to take a risk of any degree for any cause.”

Indeed, it’s difficult to argue with any of that from a moral perspective. In that scenario, one could imagine plenty of freedom-respecting ways to incentivize “aboriginal men” to donate their spinal fluid, if said spinal fluid did cure cancer. And even minus incentivization or monetary compensation, many would doubtless choose to donate for the good of humanity. But one could also imagine a tyrannical government forcibly taking the spinal fluid, violating both the liberty and bodily autonomy of these men and subjecting them to a risk - even a minimal one - of death. Surely, a government that respects freedom and protects the rights of its citizens would never allow the latter scenario - something any of us could easily picture happening in a place like China or North Korea - to occur.

Back to this particular genre of vaccines, which currently boast the scariest side-effect profile in modern vaccine history and more associated deaths than all other vaccines combined, not to mention heart issues and other life-altering side effects. Even if one in a million dropped dead after taking this vaccine (it’s WAY more than that), do YOU want to be the one to choose which child has to be without a parent, or which parents have to lose their child? 

I worded my tweet the way I did - demanding 100% certainty - knowing that this number is impossible to ever reach with even the best vaccination program. Granted, if the side effect profile were better, if the disease were scarier, and if the vaccines actually did prevent transmission and contraction, perhaps a case could be made by moral people for mandates. I would disagree based on what I’ve laid out above, but the case could be made and I might have some respect for those making it. 

However, if all those factors were present, the mandates wouldn’t be needed nor likely called for. Minus those medically unable to take them along with a small number of hard-core anti-vaxxers, uptake would easily top 90%, more than enough for herd immunity, assuming herd immunity could be obtained by a vaccine against a cold virus.

Most people who choose to remain unvaccinated - like myself - do so not because we want to spread the virus to others or are against vaccinations in general, but because we have natural immunity and/or serious, data-driven questions about this particular vaccine. The moral case for choice, and against vaccine mandates, is as clear as day and as absolute as any case for good and against evil could ever be. If the Covid-19 vaccine mandaters aren’t evil people (I am beginning to believe most are), they are certainly engaging in an evil act. As such, they should be opposed using every non-violent measure at our disposal.


Tags

jrGroupDiscuss - desc
[]
 
Thrawn 31
Professor Participates
3  Thrawn 31    5 years ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Professor Participates
4  Greg Jones    5 years ago

"Unless you are 100% sure that this vaccine is 100% safe for 100% of those who take it (you aren’t), you have NO moral right to force or coerce it on ANYONE. In fact, choosing to do so is an evil action.”

That's not how vaccines or the science of medicine work. But mandates are illegal and immoral.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Quiet
4.2  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Greg Jones @4    5 years ago
But mandates are illegal and immoral.

Vaccine Mandates in Schools Aren’t New. They’ve Been Used Since 1850

The first vaccine mandate in U.S. schools was enacted in Massachusetts in the 1850s to prevent smallpox transmission. By the 1900s, nearly half of all states had the same requirement.

“Initially when mandates were started, the idea was to prevent epidemic spread of diseases, and to essentially control epidemics,” Shen said. “Through the decades, it evolved to increasing vaccination coverage that was deemed important for public health in the absence of an epidemic.”

According to the CDC , by 1963, 20 states, the District of Columbia, and Puerto Rico had mandates requiring a variety of vaccines to enter school. But enforcement was uneven.

By the late 1960s, there was a renewed focus on vaccinating school children because of measles outbreaks across the country.

“We knew that transmission in schools was a really big problem,” Shen said. “When we took a look at jurisdictions that were strictly enforcing mandates that excluded unvaccinated kids, it showed that mandates were really effective because the states that strictly enforced the school entry requirements had lower incident rates.”

In 1977, the U.S. federal government set up the 'Childhood Immunization Initiative'   aimed at increasing vaccination rates in children against the seven diseases for which vaccines are routinely given in childhood, including:

  • diphtheria
  • measles
  • mumps
  • pertussis
  • poliomyelitis
  • rubella
  • tetanus

This is when all 50 states widely adopted mandatory school vaccinations.

Today, all states, the District of Columbia, and U.S. territories have vaccination requirements for children to attend school and childcare facilities. State laws establish vaccination requirements, as well as mechanisms for enforcement and rules for exemption.

Most school requirements adhere to the CDC vaccine schedule   for children, including vaccination against measles, meningitis, polio, chickenpox, whooping cough, and hepatitis. Some states also require vaccination against the human papillomavirus (HPV) and an annual flu shot.

Those who keep lying about vaccines and claiming their freedoms are at stake are Nucking Futs. And trying to blame an immunologist who is merely the messenger is beyond ignorant, it's pure unadulterated childish stupidity.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
5  Tacos!    5 years ago
“Unless you are 100% sure that this vaccine is 100% safe for 100% of those who take it

100%? How can you prove anything is 100%? That’s an impossible - and made up - standard. So let’s not pretend it’s a reasonable standard. It’s not.

Yes, people have died after being vaccinated. Why? Because people die. They have heart attacks. They get in car accidents. They’re old.  There is no evidence that anyone has died as a direct result of receiving either the Moderna or Pfizer vaccines. And at this, point, they have vaccinated billions of people!

How much more of a sample size do you need?

No clear evidence that COVID-19 vaccines have caused any deaths in the US

By almost any standard, especially mine, the tweet did remarkably well, reaching hundreds of thousands of people and garnering hundreds of responses.

Congratulations! You’re winning Twitter. What a fuckin’ hero!

consider this  thought experiment presented by a respondent on the thread cited above:

“It's found that spinal fluid of aboriginal men cures cancer of any stage. But, 1 in 1,000,000 extractions will cause immediate death. A law that forces them to donate is immoral.”

His conclusion: “You can't morally force anyone to take a risk of any degree for any cause.”

Indeed, it’s difficult to argue with any of that from a moral perspective

It’s actually really easy to argue against that nonsense. Three reasons:

First: It’s an inappropriate analogy. Why? Because cancer is not CONTAGIOUS! You. Fucking. Moron!

Second: The aboriginal men in this example are not spreading cancer.

Third: Look at the odds. I bet you thought 1 in 1,000,000 was an impressive standard. Well, it’s not. 1 in a Million? How about 8 BILLION? That’s how many vaccine doses have been administered. EIGHT BILLION.

I’m so weary of these bullshit, selfish, deluded arguments against doing the right thing. Grow a fucking pair and get vaccinated.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
6  Tacos!    5 years ago
assuming herd immunity could be obtained by a vaccine against a cold virus.

OMG so much ignorance. Or lies. It’s not a cold virus. Holy shit!

This is Bob. Bob isn't vaccinated and apparently has superpowers which enables him to infect and kill vaccinated people while preserving his own life.

Have people never heard of Typhoid Mary? For crying out loud, get educated! We have outstanding evidence that people get infected with the coronavirus, have no symptoms, and spread the disease. This is real. Why in God’s name would you go around denying this?

 
 

Who is online





156 visitors