Four criminal laws Trump may have broken in his call with Georgia's Brad Raffensperger
By: Ian Millhiser - Vox
No American should miss the opportunity to hear their President, successively wheedling and then threatening, to persuade an election official to change a result he has already certified .
LISTEN TO FULL CALL:
Trump, Raffensperger disagree over Georgia votes
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
President Donald Trump departs the
South Lawn of the White House, on
December 12, 2020.
Al Drago/Getty Images
Over the course of the call, which took place on Saturday, Trump raised several baseless claims that some of the ballots cast in the state of Georgia are "corrupt," as well as evidence-free claims that some unidentified person is "shredding ballots" in the state. Trump claims that Raffensperger and his office's general counsel, Ryan Germany, are taking a "big risk" — suggesting that Raffensperger and Germany are engaged in criminal conduct themselves by covering up these imagined election crimes. And then Trump drops this bombshell:
All I want to do is this. I just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have because we won the state.
Biden won Georgia by 11,779 votes, so if Raffensperger were to somehow "find" 11,780 votes, Trump would take the lead in that state. Raffensperger, to his credit, repeatedly rebuffed Trump.
Trump's call with Raffensperger wasn't just a direct attack on American democracy. It also was most likely a criminal offense. It is a federal felony to knowingly attempt "to deprive or defraud the residents of a State of a fair and impartially conducted election process" through "the procurement, casting, or tabulation of ballots that are known by the person to be materially false, fictitious, or fraudulent under the laws of the State in which the election is held."
After the recording of Trump's phone call became public, several prominent lawyers, including former Attorney General Eric Holder, suggested that Trump may have violated this statute.
Four criminal laws that Trump may have violated
There is no evidence that Georgia lost or otherwise miscounted its ballots, a point that Raffensperger made repeatedly during the call. So, in pressuring Raffensperger to "find" nearly 12,000 fake votes, Trump seemingly attempted to deprive the residents of Georgia of a fair and impartial election, and he did so by trying to procure false, fictitious, or fraudulent ballots.
Still, this statute requires federal prosecutors to prove that Trump had a particular state of mind when he pressured Raffensperger to rig the election. To convict Trump, prosecutors would have to prove that the outgoing president sought to have ballots counted that were "known by [Trump] to be materially false, fictitious, or fraudulent under the laws of the State in which the election is held."
Thus, Trump's lawyers could argue that Trump genuinely believed the various conspiracy theories that he touted during his call with Raffensperger, and that Trump thought there actually are thousands of lawful ballots that Raffensperger could "find." To overcome this argument, prosecutors would have to prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, that Trump knew he lost the election and that any "found" ballots would be fraudulent.
If Trump were convicted under this statute, he could be imprisoned for up to five years.
Another federal law makes it a crime to "conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person ... in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States." Trump was joined on the call by White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows and at least two lawyers. Thus, to the extent that he conspired with them to attempt to strip even a single Georgia voter of a constitutional right to vote, Trump could potentially be imprisoned for up to 10 years.
Georgia state law may also criminalize Trump's attempt to overthrow an election. The state's law makes it a crime to willfully tamper "with any electors list, voter's certificate, numbered list of voters, ballot box, voting machine, direct recording electronic (DRE) equipment, or tabulating machine." And while Trump did not directly tamper with the vote count in Georgia, state law also makes it a crime to, "with intent that another person engage in conduct constituting a felony," solicit another person to commit such a felony. A person convicted of soliciting a felony in Georgia "shall be punished by imprisonment for not less than one nor more than three years" (although the penalty can be higher if they solicit a crime punishable by life in prison or by death).
Georgia law also specifically makes it a crime to engage in "criminal solicitation to commit election fraud."
Another federal law makes it a crime to "willfully fail or refuse to tabulate, count, and report such person's vote," although it is less likely that Trump could be prosecuted under this statute. While Georgia law makes it a crime to solicit another person to commit any felony, federal law only criminalizes solicitation of a "felony crime of violence" — meaning that the crime must involve "the use, attempted use, or threatened use of physical force against property or against the person of another."
Ultimately, the question of whether Trump will be prosecuted for any federal crimes will rest with whoever President-elect Biden chooses to run the Justice Department and to oversee federal prosecutions in Georgia. And the question of whether Trump is charged in state court will rest with state prosecutors.
Whatever prosecutors decide, however, there is no question that Trump's actions were a significant attack on democracy. They likely were criminal as well.
There are quite a few links in the OA.
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A sleezeball mafioso...
Doncha know his supporters are already saying there was NOTHING wrong with the call...YEAH RIGHT
It happening right here on NT.
There sure are a lot of delusional Trumpettes.
Ha! Do you really imagine that any of our resident clowns took the time to actually listen?
They need no knowledge to form an opinion.
Some of it sounded like a bad imitation of Don Corleone.
I'm 17 minutes in and it's so pathetic....who are these people that went to vote but were told they voted already? What the f..ck does how many people went to rally's have a damn thing to do about voting....cuckoo.
I stopped listening and found a full transcript of the call
That's gonna be worse. With the tape, we have some comedy relief.
Once again we see people exaggerating behavior that - at worst - is merely unseemly into something “criminal.” This nonsense has been going on throughout the Trump presidency, but to be fair, it happens to some degree with almost any administration. I’m surprised Treason isn’t one of the crimes listed here. Not to worry, though. Such hyperbole is being used by others.
Calling up a government official like the Secretary of State and whining about all the injustices you imagine is not a crime. It might be misguided or embarrassing, but it’s not a crime. Neither is urging that official to take action to correct the injustices you perceive. In fact, that is actually First Amendment protected speech.
If Trump were threatening specific punishment from his end, that would be different. Just saying something like “you’ll regret this” hardly satisfies a criminal statute for intimidation or fraud.
Or if Trump were saying he didn’t care about legalities and the SOS should just make something up, that too would be criminal. But none of that is happening.
And no, it’s not inherently criminal intimidation just because he’s the president or because he had his staff in on the call.
Too often, we see hysterical politicians and media put dramatic quotes around an ordinary word like “find” and try to turn it into something criminal or otherwise scandalous. But you have to change the meaning of the word for that to be so. In fact, “find” implies something legitimate that actually exists but has been lost. Absent anything else, it doesn’t mean “invent votes” or “commit fraud.”
Trump didn’t ask the SOS to find 12,000 “fake votes.” That is Vox’s wording. Treating it like something Trump said is dishonest.
Asking that person to "find" enough votes to overturn the certified result... is a crime.
How? How is it a crime? Why do you have to put “find” in quotes?
Never mind...
Five years in jail (no parole) would do the trick. Forget the fine.
A sitting president can only be impeached. After he's gone and becomes a private citizen again, no one will give a shyt.
No one will give a shyt? What do you think the history books are going to say? Here is a quotation of Geoffry Chaucer from the movie A Knight's Tale: