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Wreck of WWII 'Hit 'Em Harder' submarine, which sank with 79 crew on board, discovered in South China Sea | Live Science

  
Via:  Vic Eldred  •  5 months ago  •  22 comments

By:   Tom Metcalfe (livescience. com)

Wreck of WWII 'Hit 'Em Harder' submarine, which sank with 79 crew on board, discovered in South China Sea | Live Science
The U.S. wreck is the grave site of the 79 crew who died when the sub was sunk in battle in 1944.

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Shipwreck hunters have discovered the remains of a famous American submarine that sank with 79 crew on board while fighting a Japanese warship near the Philippines in 1944.

According to the New York-based Lost 52 Project, which made the discovery, the wreck of USS Harder now lies on its keel on the bottom of the South China Sea near the northern Philippine island of Luzon at a depth of around 3,750 feet (1,140 meters).

Naval reports of the sub's final mission say the Harder — a Gato-class sub named after a type of fish (the harder mullet) and nicknamed the "Hit 'Em Harder" — sank with all crew on Aug. 24, 1944 after it was heavily damaged by depth charges in a battle with a Japanese destroyer.

The Harder was one of the most famous American submarines of World War II. U.S. Navy records report that it torpedoed and sank five Japanese destroyers and several other enemy ships during six successful patrols in the Pacific war theater.

"This is one of the most celebrated WWII submarines and an historic naval discovery," Tim Taylor , the founder of the Lost 52 Project, told Live Science in an email.

War grave


Taylor is the CEO of a company called Tiburon Subsea, which uses autonomous underwater vehicles (AUVs) and other technologies to collect data at underwater sites. He also leads the Lost 52 Project , which aims to locate the wrecks of the 52 American submarines lost at sea during World War II and four lost during the Cold War .

The group has already located the wrecks of eight vessels, making the wreck of USS Harder their ninth discovery, Taylor said. Each of the underwater wrecks is also a war grave for the crewmembers who died when it sank, and the missing crew of the Harder were remembered for their service when the wreck was found.

"We have a protocol that, when we locate a submarine, we memorialize the crew," Taylor said. "We observe a minute of silence, ring the bell for every member of the crew and have a prayer service led by a deacon who is part of our expedition team."

The team located the wreck by studying reports of its final battle and then searching suitable areas with shipboard sonar, which can reveal objects on the seafloor, and AUVs, which can go much deeper than human divers.

But even after they take steps to make the search patterns as efficient as possible, "It is a long and arduous process, like looking for a needle in a haystack," Taylor said.

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USS Harder was one of the most celebrated American submarines of World War II. It sank several Japanese warships and received a Presidential Unit Citation. (Image credit: U.S. Navy)

Sunken sub


The extreme depth of the wreck meant that AUV searches were essential, although a period of relatively good weather in recent weeks made the search easier.

The Harder wreck is too deep to be visited by divers, and the U.S. Navy has designated the wreck as a protected site. "The wreck represents the final resting place of sailors that gave their life in defense of the nation and should be respected by all parties as a war grave," the Navy said in a statement .


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Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
1  seeder  Vic Eldred    5 months ago


The first USS Harder (SS 257) was commissioned on Dec. 2, 1942, with Cmdr. Samuel D. Dealey in command; and lost at sea with 79 souls aboard on Aug. 24, 1944.


Resting at a depth of more than 3,000 feet, the vessel sits upright on her keel relatively intact except for the depth-charge damage aft of the conning tower. Submarines by their very design can be a challenge to identify, but the excellent state of preservation of the site and the quality of the data collected by Lost 52 allowed for NHHC to confirm the identity of the wreck as Harder.

“Harder was lost in the course of victory. We must not forget that victory has a price, as does freedom,” said NHHC Director Samuel J. Cox, U.S. Navy rear admiral (retired). “We are grateful that Lost 52 has given us the opportunity to once again honor the valor of the crew of the ‘Hit ‘em HARDER’ submarine that sank the most Japanese warships – in particularly audacious attacks – under her legendary skipper, Cmdr. Sam Dealey.”

Harder's fifth war patrol was the submarine’s most successful. Harder depleted the critical supply of destroyers by sinking three of them and heavily damaging or destroying two others in four days, and her frequent attacks resulted in Adm. Ozawa's Mobile Fleet departing Tawi-Tawi a day ahead of schedule. The premature departure upset the Japanese battle plans and forced Ozawa to delay his carrier force in the Philippine Sea, contributing to the defeat suffered by the Japanese in the ensuing battle.

WWII “Hit ‘em HARDER” submarine wreck site confirmed > United States Navy > News Stories

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
2  Buzz of the Orient    5 months ago

Good article, and apt considering that there was another war going on at the same time as D Day - i.e. the war with Japan that ended a few months after D Day.

 
 
 
shona1
Professor Quiet
3  shona1    5 months ago

Arvo... hopefully they leave the wreck in peace now it has been found..

Last thing we need is the Chinese or any other country interfering with it and desecrating and looting a war grave...

But unfortunately I have my doubts...

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
3.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  shona1 @3    5 months ago
"Last thing we need is the Chinese or any other country interfering with it and desecrating and looting a war grave..."

Was that really necessary?

 
 
 
shona1
Professor Quiet
3.1.1  shona1  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @3.1    5 months ago

Absolutely when it comes to disturbing war graves..or any other ship grave yards, including the Titanic..

The Chinese got sprung last year doing it which I assume you know about.. hopefully it puts all countries on notice to leave things alone... especially war graves...

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
Professor Silent
3.1.2  Mark in Wyoming   replied to  Buzz of the Orient @3.1    5 months ago

Buzz, you may not like it but Chinese salvagers got caught about a year ago, with salvage from 2 very important UK war wrecks , HMS Prince of Wales and HMS Repulse.

I won't pretend to tell you the importance of those two ships to the UK and the Commonwealth, or their honored places in history.

 
 
 
shona1
Professor Quiet
3.1.3  shona1  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @3.1.2    5 months ago

Arvo Mark...

And especially where it is located right in China's backyard..

Lost a rellie in a sub in WW1 in the Atlantic at least there is no concerns there of it ever been disturbed..

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
Professor Silent
3.1.4  Mark in Wyoming   replied to  shona1 @3.1.3    5 months ago

Evening Shona, I can't say many wtrecks are out of reach anymore, look up the Glomar EXplorer, the USAs version of what those scrappers did , from back in the late 60searly 70s.

Old Howard Hughes CIA  plot.

 
 
 
shona1
Professor Quiet
3.1.5  shona1  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @3.1.4    5 months ago

No true...but you hope countries have the decency to leave war wrecks well alone..

By all means find and look..but don't touch..

They still haven't found the sub my rellie was on and I hope it stays that way...

Enjoy your evening...

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
3.1.6  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @3.1.2    5 months ago

I apologize to both you and shona1.  As it happens I DIDN'T know anything about such salvaging or disturbing of the wrecks.  However, I am sensitive about the fact that China gets blamed for everything under the sun, especially since there is no reason to single them out when many do the same.  However, the article indicated that the sub that is the topic is too deep to be reached by divers, so bringing up salvaging WAS unnecessary.

 
 
 
shona1
Professor Quiet
3.1.7  shona1  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @3.1.6    5 months ago

Arvo Buzz..in this case China did disturb the two war graves...

Many do the same?? Who?? The only other mob we have heard of doing this despicable act is the Dutch disturbing war graves in Jutland and they to got sprung and condemned for it..

Any countries who do this deserve the strongest condemnation..it is a bloody disgusting act...

Because divers can't reach the wrecks DOES NOT mean they are  safe!!! Living by the sea and a harbour I know alot about the workings of it all...

The scavengers use barges with massive grabbing hooks and just keep grabbing till that find something to latch on to and haul it up..they also use underwater submersibles as well...

With abit of luck they will mistakenly grab some ordnance and blow themselves sky high..

So yes bringing up salvaging was necessary.. nothing is safe these days..

The Chinese barge in action on top of one of the British warships... caught literally red handed..

Not my photo..

256

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
Professor Silent
3.1.9  Mark in Wyoming   replied to  Buzz of the Orient @3.1.6    5 months ago

No worries Buzz, I do understand the sensitivity.

Yes I agree China gets blame for a lot of stuff world wide, but no less or really no more than the US does, or actually most other nations, I think that's the case because of the light shined on them , and people disagreeing with the way things go.

Unfortunately, when a wreck is found, the issue of salvage , or removal will come up.

Case to point, treasure ships, tell me what child that has been to the sea shore that hasn't dreamed of pirates, lost treasure,or hidden booty just waiting to be found.

Just because divers can't reach it , doesn't mean things can not be retrieved, Titanic is a good example, how much from that has been brought back up?

My real point , is it happens, and as technology and capabilities advance, what was once thought impossible to do , becomes very possible. And once it becomes possible, some one will eventually try.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
3.1.10  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @3.1.9    5 months ago

I would not have been quite so sensitive about it if had not a Robespierre-like accusation so specific been flung.  IMO, just because China or Holland were CAUGHT scavenging doesn't mean they were the only nations that do it.  You are so right that many nations get blamed for many things, and I'm sure Australia has a few things to hide as well, or maybe they just DO hide them well. 

 
 
 
GregTx
Professor Guide
3.1.11  GregTx  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @3.1.10    5 months ago

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shona1
Professor Quiet
3.1.12  shona1  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @3.1.10    5 months ago

Morning...We have lots of things I am certainly not proud of but certainly don't hide it...from the treatment of Kooris to some of our Governments legislation...and to some of our so called leaders..

We get critized, complained about brought up before the United Nations, Human Rights, the Kiwis sook about us, China complains about, Americans not sure what they think and as for the Brits..etc etc..the list is a mile long...

 
 
 
shona1
Professor Quiet
3.1.13  shona1  replied to  GregTx @3.1.11    5 months ago

Morning Greg... actually we are running detention (not quite concentration camps) centres right at this moment..they aren't for Australian citizens though..they are in Nauru and PNG and Christmas Island if needed...

We get illegal immigrants rolling up in boats from Indonesia sent by people smugglers on our shores carrying illegals from Iran, Afghanistan, India, Sri Lanka etc...but the funny part the last three boat loads came from China..not had them before...

So they are given medical check ups, food etc put on a plane and sent out to the two centres...where they stay until either they decide to go back home or on to another country..they are not allowed to settle here..

We have the UN complaining about it, Human Rights complaining about it, but we ignore them and tell them to stop interfering in our country's affairs as we hear so many other countries use this phase...it works for us..

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
3.1.14  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  shona1 @3.1.12    5 months ago

Every nation has its warts, shona.  I wasn't aware that Australia did until I started to teach Australian Law to Chinese students (besides teaching them English) and saw how the native Australians' rights were curtailed by the colonials and their descendants.  But I would realize that throwing that in your face would humiliate you and wouldn't have posted it, especially when it is not the actual topic or its purpose. 

 
 
 
shona1
Professor Quiet
3.1.15  shona1  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @3.1.14    5 months ago

Morning.. nothing to get humiliated about..why would you think that? I find out history fascinating and enthralling warts and all..

It's history can't change it much as you would like to..you learn from it and move forward and hopefully don't repeat it..

Yes racism, discrimination still goes on here but the Kooris are a powerful force now as it should be..from Parliament to small bush towns, I for one are damn proud of them..

What you taught in Chinese schools is way out dated now and things have changed an awful lot and by far for the better..

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
3.1.16  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  shona1 @3.1.15    5 months ago
"What you taught in Chinese schools is way out dated now and things have changed an awful lot and by far for the better."

The "warts" I seem to recall, though it was more than a decade ago, had to do with limited rights the natives had with respect to ownership of realty, although of course that could have changed.

 
 
 
shona1
Professor Quiet
3.1.17  shona1  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @3.1.16    5 months ago

Yes things have changed massively..calling Kooris natives you would now be hauled before the courts and charged...that is racist and would be termed as discrimination..it is not done now..

Kooris own land, buy land, own houses, cars and everything else..the same as any other person here if they want too..

They have their own housing co-op strictly for Kooris only. They have their own flags hence when you come here you will see three flags flying on all government buildings..

There is welcome to country at every major sporting event, walk into hospitals, dentist, doctors and you will see signs acknowledgment of country for the traditional owners of the land Australia wide..

Ownership of realty what you were teaching is well and truly defunct as it should be..

There is the Australian flag, Koori flag and Thursday island flag.. acknowledging the traditional first land owners... not my photo..

256

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
3.1.18  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  shona1 @3.1.17    5 months ago

I'm glad to see that there is no longer any discrimination in Australia, if that is so right across the board.  However, I'm pretty sure that the Native Americans and Native Canadians are quite happy to be referred to as such since what it means is that is where they are from and that is where they belong, maybe even more-so than anyone who colonized THEIR "native" lands.  I'm somewhat surprised that in Australia it is wrong to call the Kooris natives, but so be it.  I guess that there, in Australian English lingo, it's considered a slur. 

As for Australian land law. of course I assume that the Kooris have the right to own land, but do I detect a bit of a qualification in your comment?  Do they have the right to own land ANYWHERE and EVERYWHERE in Australia? 

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
Professor Silent
4  Mark in Wyoming     5 months ago

One of the explanations I have heard used for such salvage operations is for the pre nuclear metals,used in highly sensitive devices,that the same metals today have a nuclear signature that throws the devices off.

Of course to make the most of the endeavor, it  makes perfect sense to try and salvage what has the most metal, unfortunately a warship with all it's armor, makes a very tempting target for salvage, irregardless of the fact they are considered war graves.

Funny thing is even though sunk , be it in times of peace or war , warships still belong to he country that commissioned them , forever.

 
 

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