Providing A Way to Account for the Emotion of Pride.
Pride is an interesting emotion.
If the pride is about self, it is considered a negative feeling.
See Moses on it in Numbers 12:3.
Abraham view in Genesis 18:27.
Saul, First King of Israel in I Samuel 10:22.
Similarly, the term for intellectual pride in Greek is Hubris.
It is a negative ascription.
According to Augustine, "It was pride that changed angels into devils. It is humility that makes men as angels".
In both the Jewish and many non-Jewish religions there is no problem in being proud of ones family, heritage, nation, etc.
It is self pride that seems to be the sticking point.
In other words, pride as an emotion is neither good or bad intrinsically.
It is a plus or minus based on context, and egocentric versus sociocentric focus.
Scottish philosopher David Hume, in his very influential Treatise on Human Nature perceived pride as an emotion of transaction.
Characteristics given in this treatise are presented here, as amended over time by those writing commentaries about the topic.
In order to be proud of a person, group, thing, event, or action one or more of three things must be involved.
First, the object of pride must in some way be connected to the being in whom pride is felt.
Next, the entity having pride may have influenced or be influenced by the entity which produces said pride.
Finally, the interface with the pride expressing one must be knowledgeable of the reason for pride in the entity being showered with it.
Could we make any sense of someone saying, "I am proud of the nation of X, for reasons of which I know none, although I have never had any contact at all; and the values provoking the pride are ones I abhor; and I had nothing to do with these matters in equal measure to their having no bearing on my existence".
We would construe that as at least a curious declaration, would we not?
Now let's take a site real example of pride.
Let's take that odd exposition of pride, and instead show how the pride seems justified as a transactional emotion.
Three fellow News Talkers have been enormously helpful to date in making possible the on line resource room for Pastoral Care here, Chaplain's Corner by their efforts on it.
Minus the information technology, site support, Moderation and other efforts from Raven Wing, TiG and Perrie Halperin the room would not be there.
I am proud of all they have and will do for this room.
Why?
Working with or through each of them I know first hand of their successful efforts in meeting room challenges.
The values involved in working in harmony with each other to make available to site members and visitors articles in a room library for pastoral care for self and others is held by all, myself included.
We all want the site to be a place to help and be helped, when and as needed and wanted.
We already have evidence site members, visitors, and prospective members find the room a place to get information and ideas for use in meeting human needs we all have.
Does this account meet the criteria of Hume's format for pride, as amended over time by transactions?
I leave each who read this to make that assessment on their own.
I am comfortable saying that the pride I take in what these three outstanding News Talkers have and will do for the good of our on line community is justified and well earned by any way to legitimize pride.
Those who help, each according to what they bring, working together toward a common goal and meeting or exceeding it have more than earned the pride I and others feel for them.
Peace and Abundant Blessings to One and All.
Enoch.
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Be Respectful.
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Or Be Gone!
Thoughts on pride can come from any source that speaks to you.
As well your original ideas are encouraged on this matter.
Peace and Abundant Blessings Always.
Enoch, Knowing You Will Make Us All Proud of Your Contributions.
There is a need for both pride and shame
Excessive bragging is pride to point of becoming shame
Pride is one reason you do somethings
Shame is one reason why you don't do somethings
Dear Friend Charger: Good ideas.
Thanks for sharing.
We are grateful.
Peace and Abundant Blessings.
Enoch.
Great article Enoch. This reflection is very helpful.
Sometimes it is good to start the day by finding ones center first.
Dear Brother Dave: Indeed it is.
Many is the time of the sun low and rising in the sky when Mrs. E. and I sip a bowl of coffee and muse over what really matters in life.
From this we plan out our day.
A Chassidic Rabbi who was very close to and a great source of inspiration and knowledge to me, Rabbi D. G. (Of Sacred Memory) would walk with me to and back from pre-dawn and morning services together.
The first and inevitable question he would ask of me was this.
"Reb E.: Wass tun sie vor mishpuchah menschen hi yoim? Der Rebbene shel oylum vill helpfen!"
Yiddish for, "What will you do for humanity today? The Master of all wants to help!"
Super point Dave.
You already helped us out today.
Time for a coffee break?
Smiles.
Peace and Abundant Blessings Always.
Whenever someone talks of Pride I think of the saying, "Pride goeth before the fall." To me that has a double meaning,
excessive Pride of self will cause one to fall,
you lose all Pride in self just before you fall.
Either one of these will fit the statement and, both must be watched for, Pride in self is alright as long as you don't brag on it or, use it to beat others down with it. Pride in others is a natural thing, to me, I have Pride in my family and, friends, I love it when they succeed at something and, yes, I brag about their accomplishments and, congratulate them on their success.
Dear Friend Galen Marvin Ross: Great points all.
On self pride, we need to have the self-confidence to believe we can do good prior to accepting challenges.
I see that as beneficial, as it results in favorable outcomes for those helped.
I would even go an extra step here.
If we felt comfortable trying to help, we used the best we have and it failed, at least we tried.
If pride leads to good or a try for good outcomes, I see it as a virtuous use of that emotion.
If pride makes us feel we are better than others, and above the rules needed for a society to function, then it is not being used constructively.
So folks are like the denominator of a fraction.
The bigger they try to make themselves, the smaller they really are.
Taking pride in what others do when that emotion is justified is good for us and more for them.
A metaphysical pat on the back builds self esteem.
It motivates others to continue trying their best to do well.
How and why pride is felt and used is more of interest than its just being engaged and encountered.
It is that way for many emotions and things in this life.
Superior contributions dear friend.
We are grateful.
Peace and Abundant Blessings Always.
Enoch.
I couldn't agree more friend Enoch but, as you stated here,
This can cause what I was talking about in my post, as you've said in your seed, there are two types of pride, both are listed here, self pride to the point of narcissism and, pride of others and, self but, the self pride in this example is healthy, it helps one grow and, accomplish their goals. The narcissistic pride is the one that will cause you to fall.
Again, I couldn't agree more. When a person accomplishes something and, feels that moment of joy at the accomplishment then that is the pat on the back from the metaphysical but, if someone takes that joy and, turns it into something that isn't meant to be then that is when they enter the negative of pride.
Peace and, abundant blessing my friend.
Galen
Dear Friend Galen Marvin Ross: No daylight between us.
Not a surprise. Smiles.
Thanks for all you presented here.
Practical advice that is most real world helpful.
E.
I am sorry (belly laughing won't stop), mildly off-topic, but I read your avatar and though I tried to not be affected; I could not contain myself. The mind goes on a "doggie" journey! I will get to the topic after this.
LOL, that's why I used it.
Dear Friend Galen Marvin Ross: I Showed this to Mrs. E. last night.
She good a good chuckle out of it.
Thanks.
E.
Gotta love dem puppies. Tell Mrs. E hi for me.
Done and Done!.
We are having breakfast soon.
I sent your greetings.
They are warmly reciprocated.
Thanks.
Enoch (Looking forward to an omelette on a toasted Bialy and a bowl of fresh brewed decaf coffee).
Decaf?
I'm sorry to hear that.
Dear Friend Sandy: LOL.
As a veteran now of open heart surgery, my surgeon and doctors don't permit me caffine.
As a stimulant it works against the beta blockers I take to keep the heart speed from going too fast.
Past a certain age, its all about the trade offs, it seems.
P&AB Always to You and Yours.
Enoch.
I figured that was the reason. Anything to keep you around, with your ticker ticking.
Peace and abundant blessings to you, too, Enoch.
Dear Friend Sandy: Many thanks.
Until recently, I thought "Maxwell House" was a half way house for full strength coffee addicts.
Live and learn.
E.
Hey, that's what I drink. Maybe that means I'm not an addict yet? Good to know I won't be out on the streets, strung out, looking to score my next hit of Starbucks.
Dear Friend Sandy: Laughing so hard I fell off my chair at the computer.
By the bye, I signed up to attend a Howard Schultz for President Town Hall rally.
To my surprise, they served Tim Horton's at the concession stand.
Talk about reaching across the aisle.
E.
Across the northern border, even.
Reaching across the aisle, or possibly just cheap? How much is Tim Horton's coffee compared to Starbucks', anyway? I don't go to either often enough to know more than this - Starbucks is some pretty expensive coffee. I don't know how people afford to go there regularly.
But both sell delicious hot chocolate.
Dear Friend Sandy: Among the big three, Dunkin Donuts, Tim Horton's and Starbucks going from cheapest to most expensive.
Of course, the best way to go is buy a bag of whole beans at a store who will custom grind, or let you customer grind them on the premises.
That is most affordable.
What is your favorite hot chocolate?
One of the questions proposed for the next census is just that.
Inquiring minds want to know.
Enoch, reach for some mini marsh mellows in anticipation.
None of our local grocery stores has a coffee grinder. I remember they all had them when I was a girl. Something we've lost.
My favorite hot chocolate is Ghirardelli cocoa mix. Adding a bit of Bailey's makes it even better. Note to self - must try this with caramel Bailey's.
Dear Friend Sandy: Ghirardelli and Bailey's.
A party on the palette.
Great call.
Enoch, Salivating Like A Pavlov's Dog with A Sweet Tooth.
Great article niijii,
A way to center ones self is always a good thing.
Pride, a good emotion but one to be careful of since, IMO, too much of it can be harmful.
Dear Brother Kavika: Too much of a good thing isn't good (in general).
Frybread, blueberries, wild rice are exceptions that prove the rule.
E.
I could go for that.
"Adam and Eve on a raft. Wreck 'em".
Jay's Diner.
Zaasakokwaade, ininimin, manoomin.
Major Yum!
E.
Would you eat it with your fingers or, would you use a fork?
Sammies, even open faced belong in the hand.
Forks are for things you cannot hold.
Your thoughts?
Enoch, Twirling chop sticks.
I agree whole heartedly, I was going to give you a hard time if you said a fork.
Enoch! I have a question. One for which I have been waiting to pan out on its own and it has not of yet. Where is "Chaplain's Corner"? For the life of me, if I am in it at any point and time I am not aware of it.
In addition, there are three sources of pride I feel when I am on this site.
cb.....at the top of the Home page you will see Groups. Click on that and you will see Chaplain's Corner listed there. Or click on the link below and it will take you to Chaplain's Corner.
It is also sometimes displayed in the Recent Groups section.
We hope to see you there soon. (smile)
Raven ~
Dear Sister Raven Wing: Thanks for helping our our brother CB.
Great work.
E.
Thank you Raven I have followed directions and joined! STELLAR!
You are most welcome CB. Glad that I could help. (smile)
And we are happy to have you join us.
You're most welcome Dear Brother Enoch. (smle)
Dear Brother, Friend and Treasured Writing Partner CB: What Raven Wing said in post 6.1 is correct.
I too am proud of you.
You add so much to this site.
The courage you display when you are there all alone is outstanding.
You bring a perspective to the News Talkers which needs representation. May live by it. This you do very well.
It was and shall be my honor to co-author original articles with you going forward.
Peace and Abundant Blessings Always.
Enoch.
Of course, Enoch! (Smile.)