Deadly biker crash in New Hampshire prompts motor-vehicle chief in Massachusetts to resign

  
Via:  vic-eldred  •  3 weeks ago  •  99 comments

Deadly biker crash in New Hampshire prompts motor-vehicle chief in Massachusetts to resign
Court documents allege Zhukovskyy, a Ukranian national with permanent residence status in the U.S., was driving erratically and crossed the center line around 6:30 p.m. Friday on Highway 2, a two-lane roadway that passes through the small town just north of Mount Washington. His Dodge pickup truck was towing a flatbed trailer when it plowed into the bikers.

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T


The head of the Massachusetts motor vehicle division resigned from her reported six-figure-salary gig Tuesday after her agency failed to terminate the commercial driving license of a man accused of colliding with a group of motorcyclists on a rural New Hampshire road last week, leaving seven bikers dead.

The Massachusetts Registry of Motor Vehicle’s Erin Deveney offered her resignation just hours after the alleged driver involved in the horrific crash pleaded not guilty to seven counts of negligent homicide in the Friday motorcycle tragedy in Randolph, N.H., the Boston Herald reported.

deveney.jpg?ve=1&tl=1
​​​​​​​Erin Deveney, head of the motor vehicle division in Massachusetts, speaks to reporters April 29, 2014, when she was interim head of the Massachusetts Department of Children and Families. (Associated Press)

Deveney's agency had failed to act on information received in May from the Connecticut Department of Motor Vehicles about a drunken driving arrest involving the 23-year-old suspect, Volodymyr Zhukovskyy, Massachusetts Department of Transportation Secretary and CEO Stephanie Pollack said in a statement.

Pollack said the previous arrest should have cost Zhukovskyy his commercial driving license. As a result, she accepted the resignation of Deveney, whose salary was reportedly $143,800 a year, according to the Herald.

Court documents allege Zhukovskyy, a Ukranian national with permanent residence status in the U.S., was driving erratically and crossed the center line around 6:30 p.m. Friday on Highway 2, a two-lane roadway that passes through the small town just north of Mount Washington. His Dodge pickup truck was towing a flatbed trailer when it plowed into the bikers. All of the victims were members or supporters of the Marine JarHeads, a New England motorcycle club that includes Marines and their spouses. Those killed ranged in age from 42 to 62.

motorcycle-crash-2-AP.jpg?ve=1&tl=1
New Hampshire State Police said a 2016 Dodge 2500 pickup truck collided with the riders on U.S. 2 Friday evening. The cause of the deadly collision is not yet known. The pickup truck was on fire when emergency crews arrived.

Manny Ribeiro, who survived the crash, said Deveney’s resignation was just one indication that the crash could have been prevented. But Ribeiro said it also felt "like someone was running around from the problem."

"We just get to quit and walk away and that's it," Ribeiro told the Associated Press. "Story over. See you later until the next time it happens and then the next person steps down. This is what happens every single time."

NHcrashvictims.jpg?ve=1&tl=1
The horrific crash in New Hampshire killed seven people, including a married couple.

Former Massachusetts Department of Transportation Chief Operating Officer Jamey Tesler will assume the role of acting registrar in order to conduct an in-depth review of the registry’s state-to-state data sharing system to “ensure the RMV acts as quickly as possible on any information shared by other states,” Pollack told the Herald.

Zhukovskyy was previously arrested May 11 in a Walmart parking lot in East Windsor, Conn., after allegedly failing a sobriety test. His license was not revoked  after that arrest, but in 2013 his license was taken away for 210 days and he was placed on probation following a drunken driving charge in Westfield, Mass.

Police in Texas told several media outlets that Zhukovskyy also crashed a tractor-trailer in suburban Houston earlier this month. Zhukovskyy told police that he had been cut off, causing him to lose control of the truck. He was not charged.



Fox News’ Greg Norman, Sam Chamberlain and The Associated Press contributed to this report.

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Vic Eldred
1  seeder  Vic Eldred    3 weeks ago

So Deveney, who was paid over $143,000 a year, gets to resign and just walk away?  How about all the other instances when this menace was allowed to keep his license?

 
 
 
†hε pε⊕pレε'š ƒïšh
2  †hε pε⊕pレε'š ƒïšh    3 weeks ago

Ice has already filled paper work to deport this guy whenever he gets out of prison, if he survives the prison biker gangs.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
2.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  †hε pε⊕pレε'š ƒïšh @2    3 weeks ago
if he survives the prison biker gangs.

Now there's a pleasant thought

 
 
 
SteevieGee
3  SteevieGee    3 weeks ago

So...  It's the head of the dmv's job to revoke a driver's license?  Shouldn't that be the job of a judge?

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  SteevieGee @3    3 weeks ago
Shouldn't that be the job of a judge?

In Massachusetts, a driver’s license may be revoked for:

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
3.1.1  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1    3 weeks ago

That's not an answer to StevieGee's question.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1.2  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @3.1.1    3 weeks ago

Perhaps you would like to answer it?

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.1.3  Split Personality  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1    3 weeks ago

You did not answer the question.

Who does the actual revoking?  The Governor? The head of DMV?

Some clerk and a supervisor?

What is the process? 

Was it reviewed?

Can it be appealed?

Are lawyers necessary ? ( trick question , cue the shark jokes )

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
3.1.4  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.2    3 weeks ago
Perhaps you would like to answer it?

It was directed to you.  Why can't/won't you?  BTW, you linked to a MA site, not NH which might have very different laws and rules (yay, federalism!!!). 

 
 
 
SteevieGee
3.1.5  SteevieGee  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.2    3 weeks ago

I saw some drivers just yesterday that I would like to revoke their licenses.  Can I do that?  Maybe if I get a job at the dmv.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1.6  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.3    3 weeks ago

The question as was stated contains a false implication, right?

"So...  It's the head of the dmv's job to revoke a driver's license?"

Steevie is implying that I said it's the "head of the dmv's" to revoke a driver's licence. Show me where I said that.

Just for your information:

When a license is revoked it comes with a letter signed by (guess who!) the head of the DMV!


 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
3.1.7  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.6    3 weeks ago
Steevie is implying that I said it's the "head of the dmv's" to revoke a driver's licence. Show me where I said that.

SG implied nothing of the sort.  It was a simple, straightforward question that you seem desperately trying to address.  You put this article up.  Don't you have some responsibility to know something about the circumstances or was this just a trolling exercise? 

 
 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1.9  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @3.1.4    3 weeks ago
BTW, you linked to a MA site, not NH which might have very different laws and rules (yay, federalism!!!). 

Ok let me explain it to you. If MA DMV did their job, the NH tragedy probably wouldn't have happened. If the Texas DMV had done their job, maybe the MA incidents wouldn't have happened. If permissive attitudes weren't the flavor of the day the nation would be much safer.

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.1.10  Texan1211  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @3.1.4    3 weeks ago

CDL Suspensions in Massachusetts
If you have a commercial driver's license (CDL), your license can be suspended whether you commit an offense while driving a CMV (commercial motor vehicle) or your personal vehicle.
All states exchange information about CDL drivers, so violations, suspensions, and other details of your driving history will follow you from state to state. Also, violations committed outside of Massachusetts will be reported to the RMV.
For more information about CDL suspensions, please see our section on MA Commercial Drivers.

From this site:

https://www.dmv.org/ma-massachusetts

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1.11  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Texan1211 @3.1.10    3 weeks ago

It really seems straightforward

 
 
 
SteevieGee
3.1.12  SteevieGee  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.6    3 weeks ago
Steevie is implying that I said it's the "head of the dmv's" to revoke a driver's licence

Oh please Vic,  You give me too much credit.  I'm really not that deep.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1.13  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  SteevieGee @3.1.5    3 weeks ago
I saw some drivers just yesterday that I would like to revoke their licenses. 

I know the feeling. Get their plate numbers, file a complaint. Keep calm, avoid road rage.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1.14  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  SteevieGee @3.1.12    3 weeks ago

I give you credit for standing up for what you believe, but you believe in a very innocent way. These politicians say anything to win.

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.1.15  Split Personality  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.6    3 weeks ago
The question as was stated contains a false implication, right?

No, you got the point.

Your first comment indicates that you think Deveney deserves more punishment.

Why?

If there's something wrong with the system, get it fixed.

Apparently, the only time the driver was punished was when he committed a DUI in his home state.

Incidents in NH, TX and Conn weren't treated the same.

Why? 

It sounds like there are no reciprocity laws or DMV sharing between the involved states?

That would be a matter for the Mass Legislatures would it not? Not the head of DMV.

And TX, NH and NH correct?

How many Mass Legislators do you want to see punished?

Again, how about the Governor or Lt Governor as a sacrificial gesture as well?

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1.16  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.15    3 weeks ago
No, you got the point.

If dereliction of duty was the point, it was poorly made.

Your first comment indicates that you think Deveney deserves more punishment.

Why?

Because either the MA DMV wasn't acting on info from other states or was negligent in carrying out it's duties.

If there's something wrong with the system, get it fixed.

No, that's not good enough when American citizens have lost their lives. That could have been your family out there. We all use the roads. Ms Deveney can shove her diploma up her ass. She failed! Her resignation is not enough.

It sounds like there are no reciprocity laws or DMV sharing between the involved states?

Not so...I once had a RI license and MA DMV knew immediately.

How many Mass Legislators do you want to see punished?

Every fuckin' one of em, but that's another story for another day!

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.1.17  Texan1211  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.15    3 weeks ago
Apparently, the only time the driver was punished was when he committed a DUI in his home state.
Incidents in NH, TX and Conn weren't treated the same.

From the article:

Deveney's agency had failed to act on information received in May from the Connecticut Department of Motor Vehicles about a drunken driving arrest involving the 23-year-old suspect, Volodymyr Zhukovskyy, Massachusetts Department of Transportation Secretary and CEO Stephanie Pollack said in a statement.

Also:

https://www.overdriveonline.com/cdl-holders-no-longer-have-to-report-out-of-state...

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.1.18  Split Personality  replied to  Texan1211 @3.1.17    3 weeks ago
Deveney's agency had failed to act on information received in May from the Connecticut Department of Motor Vehicles about a drunken driving arrest involving the 23-year-old suspect, Volodymyr Zhukovskyy, Massachusetts Department of Transportation Secretary and CEO Stephanie Pollack said in a statement.

So we are talking about a maximum of possibly 7 weeks between the incident in May and today?

And Dveney's agency didn't act quickly enough?

Was he already arraigned in NH?  Convicted? 

If MA had suspended his license ( again ) would it have prevented this tragedy?

Ever watch channel 1132, live PD?

These habitual offenders don't give a damn if they have a license or not. Especially the substance abusers.

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.1.19  Split Personality  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.9    3 weeks ago
Ok let me explain it to you. If MA DMV did their job, the NH tragedy probably wouldn't have happened. If the Texas DMV had done their job, maybe the MA incidents wouldn't have happened.

Bullshit, just more hair on fire misplaced outrage.

The incident in MA in 2013 was handled properly. Deveney was the Chief of Staff for the Registrar at that time.

The incident in TX was an accident. period, full stop, he was not arrested for DUI. TX DOT had nothing more to do than report it to MA.

The incident in Conn was last month, May. For all we know he doesn't even have a court date yet in Conn.

This driver, had he lost his CDL, would still be driving his POV with or without a regular license.

If permissive attitudes weren't the flavor of the day the nation would be much safer.

Is that always your bottom line?  Permissive attitudes?

SMH...

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.1.20  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.19    3 weeks ago
Is that always your bottom line?  Permissive attitudes?

You Bet!

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2  Texan1211  replied to  SteevieGee @3    3 weeks ago
Shouldn't that be the job of a judge?

A judge in MA certainly can revoke, and so can the DMV.

I suspect for commercial license revocations, it would usually come from the DMV, as they have the info submitted to them from other states. As far as I know, no judge gets reports from other states' DMV's, unless for some reason (like a defendant being in his court on some charge) he would request such info.

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.1  Split Personality  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2    3 weeks ago
I suspect for commercial license revocations, it would usually come from the DMV, as they have the info submitted to them from other states. As far as I know, no judge gets reports from other states' DMV's, unless for some reason (like a defendant being in his court on some charge) he would request such info.

Actually 45 states are members of the DLC and all infractions are SUPPOSED to be shared.

Forty Five states are members of the Interstate Driver's License Compact. It pertains mainly to DUI and similar driving convictions. Most states do not have the capacity to link all DMV information into a single data bank. Therefore any information shared would depend on how operational procedures of that states's DMV.

As a member of the DLC member states are required to report ticket convictions received by a motorist back to the state where they are licensed to drive. Their own state then determines if this offense will be placed on their driving record and if any points will be assessed.

The members of the DLC: include Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, District of Columbia, Florida, Hawaii, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Maryland, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Dakota, South Carolina, Texas, Utah, Vermont, Virginia, Washington, West Virginia and Wyoming.

This would indicate that there are issues in MASS DMV well below the level of the Registrar of Motor Vehicles.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.2.2  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.1    3 weeks ago
This would indicate that there are issues in MASS DMV well below the level of the Registrar of Motor Vehicles.

And the person on top getting the $143,000 is supposed to address those issues. The buck stops with her. 

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.3  Split Personality  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.2    3 weeks ago
The Registry of Motor Vehicles Division is now directly administered by MassDOT. It is the equivalent of the Department of Motor Vehicles in most states, and processes driver's licenses and motor vehicle registrations.

No, the buck apparently stops with the head of MassDOT,

The Massachusetts Department of Transportation is an integrated, multi-modal transportation agency composed of Highway, Rail and Transit, and Aeronautics Divisions, as well as a Registry of Motor Vehicles. The Department of Transportation is led by Secretary and CEO Stephanie Pollack, who also sits on the Board of the Massachusetts Port Authority. Pollack has been Secretary of Transportation and CEO of MassDOT since 2015.

Should she not resign also?

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2.4  Texan1211  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.1    3 weeks ago

Commercial license holders are also regulated by the federal government.

Crashes between commercial motor vehicles and passenger cars are substantially different from “ordinary” crashes. A commercial motor vehicle’s mass and lack of mobility can create a serious road hazard sufficient to warrant federal oversight and intervention.
The purpose of the federal regulations is to help reduce or prevent truck and bus accidents, fatalities, and injuries by requiring drivers to have a single commercial motor vehicle driver’s license and by disqualifying drivers who operate commercial motor vehicles in an unsafe manner.

Commercial Driver’s License Standards; Requirements and Penalties (49 C.F.R. Part 383)
American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators Commercial Driver Licensing
Commercial License Guide
Commercial Motor Vehicle Safety Act of 1986 (CMVSA) (49 U.S.C. §313111 (a))
State Compliance with Commercial Driver’s License Program (49 C.F.R. Part 384)

And: See 3.1.17 link

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.2.5  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.3    3 weeks ago
Should she not resign also?

Nope.  I'm afraid this one belongs to the Registrar.  You don't like seeing agency officials held accountable, do you?  I wonder why that is?


I happen to believe in punishment for all of them from Lois Lerner to Erin Deveney

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.6  Split Personality  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.4    3 weeks ago

Apparently his accident in Houston was just that, an accident. 

Not unbelievable if you have ever driven down 45 or 10 or went around Houston using 610.

One thing is almost certain. If alcohol had been involved in the Houston incident this guy would have been arrested that day and lost his CDL.

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2.7  Texan1211  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.6    3 weeks ago
Apparently his accident in Houston was just that, an accident.

Yes, as I stated in 5.2.6.

He should have lost his license when Connecticut reported to MA that he had been arrested for DUI.

MA failed to suspend his license, which is why I think she resigned, as her agency was responsible to suspend it.

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
3.2.8  Mark in Wyoming  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.2    3 weeks ago

Since I do not see MA listed as a signatory to the DLC, it would be up to the state legislature to answer why they are not , and to rectify their missing from the list. The registrar will only do what state law allows them and funds.

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2.9  Texan1211  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @3.2.8    3 weeks ago

The DLC is just a compact between states, and is not mandatory for any state to join.

The feds regulate commercial drivers, and that is mandatory for states.

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.10  Split Personality  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @3.2.8    3 weeks ago

Exactly.

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.11  Split Personality  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.9    3 weeks ago

So which Federal Registrar should resign?

jrSmiley_82_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
3.2.12  Mark in Wyoming  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.9    3 weeks ago

The DLC is just a compact between states, and is not mandatory for any state to join.

very true , it is voluntary for states if they wish to sign the compact, but one can see how a non signatory can let reports slide if they so choose to if a report came from a signatory state, all signing would do is say the state would honor the other states judgment .

The feds regulate commercial drivers, and that is mandatory for states.

To a certain degree yes, there are always exemptions ,  like you have to be 21 to get a CDL , lots of states allow someone to get one at 18 as long as they don't cross state lines. another exemption is log books , every CDL driver needs to keep a logbook , unless they work within a certain circumference of where they start their day of driving  and they end their day in the same place, another exemption is the use of electronic logs , if the truck is old enough , it doesn't have to comply with those regs and a paper log is good enough, and if they do not travel on roads no CDL required at all , that's one of the AG  exemptions hell they don't even have an age restriction with that one , and they can cross highways to get from field to field .

This kid is 23 , don't know if the pick up and flatbed he was hauling were registered as comm, could be the company he worked for looked at what his past history was and put him in a little truck until the other matters were cleared up, could be it was his own private vehicle and trailer and they were not comm vehicles , just he held a CDL, there is quite a bit of information missing , but its safe to say this guy wont be driving for a while , and likely will never hold a CDL again in his life.

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2.13  Texan1211  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @3.2.12    3 weeks ago

He had a commercial license, and MA was informed of the Connecticut offense and did nothing.

Whether he was driving his own private vehicle or not, he was still using a commercial license and was subject to all that entails, both at the federal level and at a state level.

MA failed to follow its own protocols, and federal protocols as well.

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.14  Split Personality  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.13    3 weeks ago
He had a commercial license, and MA was informed of the Connecticut offense and did nothing.

As stated many times throughout this seed and these comments, just when last month ( MAY ) was he arrested in Conn?

Just exactly when did Conn notify MA?

Was he arraigned? Did the CONN magistrate or judge demand his CDL license the day he was arrested?

Does he have court date and a lawyer in Conn?

Did he choose to fight it or take some courses to make the case go away?

If his license was suspended, would he actually stop driving his POV and presumably not have caused this tragedy?

Too many questions for all the outrage against the Registrar IMHO.

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2.15  Texan1211  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.14    3 weeks ago
As stated many times throughout this seed and these comments, just when last month ( MAY ) was he arrested in Conn?

May 11.

Just exactly when did Conn notify MA?

May 29.

Was he arraigned? Did the CONN magistrate or judge demand his CDL license the day he was arrested?
Does he have court date and a lawyer in Conn?
Did he choose to fight it or take some courses to make the case go away?

Just the arrest for DUI should have triggered the suspension of his license when reported to MA. Doesn't matter about much else in that paragraph.

If his license was suspended, would he actually stop driving his POV and presumably not have caused this tragedy?

I don't know, but suspect not. I blame the guy driving, but won't overlook the responsibilities of MA authorities.

Too many questions for all the outrage against the Registrar IMHO.

I haven't expressed any outrage against her.

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
3.2.16  Mark in Wyoming  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.13    3 weeks ago

Makes me wonder if it was being waited on to see if there was a court conviction then , the Conn DUI happened in may , is it done going through their courts ? was there a conviction? or a plea deal? a continuance?

back when I got my CDL the CDL and driving lic were considered separate and it depended on what you were driving when the violation happened , I could lose the CDL portion and keep the driving priviliges , it hasn't been that way now for quite some time .

You may think I am disagreeing with you and I am not , I see it as a case of hindsight always being 20/20 after the fact, he should have lost his lic until it was determined and a conviction occurred because of the CDL , but that didn't happen. as it usually doesn't .

 
 
 
Jasper2529
3.2.17  Jasper2529  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.6    3 weeks ago
Apparently his accident in Houston was just that, an accident. 

Seems that crack plays a part in his substance abuse and "accident" history:

Zhukovskyy was also arrested earlier this year in Texas, where he was accused of possession of drug paraphernalia.

Lt. Steve Dorris, of the Baytown, Texas police department, said officers were called to a Denny’s around 2 a.m. on Feb. 11 for a report of an intoxicated person.

Volodymyr Zhukovskyy was at the counter. Officers believed he was under the influence of some type of drug — which he denied, the lieutenant said. Officers found a crack pipe in Zhukovskyy's pocket, according to the police report.

The Texas arrest report lists Zhukovskyy’s occupation as truck driver and his hometown as West Springfield, Massachusetts, Dorris said.

https://www.masslive.com/news/2019/06/volodymyr-zhukovskyy-driver-in-new-hampshire-crash-that-killed-7-motorcyclists-arrested-on-drunken-driving-charge-last-month-in-connecticut.html

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2.18  Texan1211  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @3.2.16    3 weeks ago
Makes me wonder if it was being waited on to see if there was a court conviction then , the Conn DUI happened in may , is it done going through their courts ? was there a conviction? or a plea deal? a continuance?

Just the arrest is enough to trigger the suspension. If you beat it in court, then you can get your license back.

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
3.2.19  Mark in Wyoming  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.18    3 weeks ago
Just the arrest is enough to trigger the suspension.

true enough, I see this as a case of 20/20 hindsight , its never wrong , in practice , things are never always that clear, now whether the issuing state will suspend over an accusation , is another matter.

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2.20  Texan1211  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @3.2.16    3 weeks ago

I think that when you get a CDL nowadays, you are automatically agreeing to take tests to determine sobriety, and failure to do will result in suspension automatically. Some states do the same for regular drivers holding regular licenses--suspend for failure to take test--even if you somehow manage to beat it in court.

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
3.2.21  Mark in Wyoming  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.20    3 weeks ago

that's the way it is here , and I don't disagree with that one bit. driving anything is a privilege , priviliges come with conditions.

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.22  Split Personality  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.20    3 weeks ago

from more up to date accounts on MSNBC

According to MassDOT, Zhukovskyy's 2013 OUI charge would not have disqualified him from receiving the commercial license under state and federal law. He was under the age of 21 at the time of the violation and served suspensions and attended education classes including a youth alcohol program as a result of the violation. 

But MassDOT said the May 11 OUI violations – in which he refused a chemical test – should have triggered his commercial license to be automatically revoked under Massachusetts law. His non-commercial driver's license should have been subject to a seven-day notification process for suspension.

The Registry of Motor Vehicles follows state and federal guidelines regarding license suspensions or revocations for various types of licenses, according to MassDOT. When an incident occurs out of state, the department said, that state is supposed to provide information to the state where the individual is licensed. 

But MassDOT's statement says that "to the RMV’s knowledge, Connecticut failed to provide sufficient information" through the federal commercial driver's license system following Zhukovskyy's May 11 arrest. Doing so would have automatically applied the charges to his Massachusetts driving record and result in the immediate termination of his commercial driver's license, according to MassDOT. 

Instead, MassDOT said the Connecticut DMV on May 29 sent a communication to the Massachusetts RMV through the the American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators messaging system – the state-to-state messaging system for registries – regarding Zhukovskyy’s May 11th OUI.

A communication breakdown

According to MassDOT, Connecticut's May 29 online communication did not contain sufficient information to automatically input Zhukovskyy’s OUI into his Massachusetts driving record and, therefore, did not automatically trigger the seven-day notification process for his non-commercial license suspension.

"While the RMV system could not automatically process the communication, it generated a notification requiring manual review," the statement reads. "This review had not been performed by RMV personnel as of June 23, which is why the May 11 chemical test refusal does not appear on Zhukovskyy’s driving record and why his license had not been suspended in Massachusetts."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/head-of-massachusetts-registry-of-motor-vehicles-resigns-after-fatal-new-hampshire-crash/ar-AADrtns?ocid=spartanntp
 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.23  Split Personality  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.22    3 weeks ago

Who at Conn DMV should resign next?

 
 
 
Texan1211
3.2.24  Texan1211  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.22    3 weeks ago

Well, THAT certainly makes this statement unusual and rather weird:

Deveney's agency had failed to act on information received in May from the Connecticut Department of Motor Vehicles about a drunken driving arrest involving the 23-year-old suspect, Volodymyr Zhukovskyy, Massachusetts Department of Transportation Secretary and CEO Stephanie Pollack said in a statement.
Pollack said the previous arrest should have cost Zhukovskyy his commercial driving license. As a result, she accepted the resignation of Deveney, whose salary was reportedly $143,800 a year, according to the Herald.

Gee, I wonder why a state official would admit that the agency did something wrong when they didn't?

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
3.2.25  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.5    3 weeks ago
I happen to believe in punishment for all of them from Lois Lerner to Erin Deveney

Good to know.  I look forward to you demanding the heads  of ICE,  HHS and any of the other pertinent agencies  for their massive incompetence for the way border crossers have been held, particularly children and including at least 6 deaths of those children under their "care."  

 
 
 
Split Personality
3.2.26  Split Personality  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.24    3 weeks ago

I wonder what the relationship was between Pollack and Deveney?

They are both lawyers.....

Why the knee jerk reaction?

Maybe Pollack gets her information from TV and not through slow inter state channels?

and maybe the first story published about something just isn't always that accurate...

and maybe Pollack has something higher than CEO of MassDOT in mind, like a run for Governor or Senator?

Who knows.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.2.27  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @3.2.25    3 weeks ago

Yo may have to settle for Comey, Brennan, Clapper and McCabe - all former Agency heads!

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
3.2.28  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.27    3 weeks ago
Yo may have to settle for Comey, Brennan, Clapper and McCabe - all former Agency heads!

I see there's a definite preference for only those who are not of your political liking.  So much for even-handedness that you claim to "try" for.  Might either want to "try" harder or lose that claim. 

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
3.2.29  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Split Personality @3.2.26    3 weeks ago
Why the knee jerk reaction?

Default? 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
3.2.31  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @3.2.28    3 weeks ago

Sorry, but they happen to be the criminals who leaked & lied and spied.

 
 
 
Tacos!
3.3  Tacos!  replied to  SteevieGee @3    3 weeks ago
It's the head of the dmv's job to revoke a driver's license?  Shouldn't that be the job of a judge?

It can be either or both. The DMV can - and should - suspend or revoke a license under certain circumstances, but a judge can do it, too, if there is a court case. The two actions will be independent of each other, so even if the suspended driver satisfies the DMV and they are prepared to reinstate him, the judge may still order the license suspended for his/her own reasons.

 
 
 
katrix
3.3.1  katrix  replied to  Tacos! @3.3    3 weeks ago

Exactly.  In my state, there is a weird disconnect between the DMV and the courts as well. The DMV can suspend a license while the court issues a PBJ and doesn't suspend the license, or vice versa (I may be getting it wrong but that's the gist of it).

I know two people who thought they were legally allowed to drive because they had a valid license per the DMV ... but they weren't because of the court. I'm guessing in both cases they (or their lawyers) should have done their due diligence, but it is confusing that the departments don't work together.

 
 
 
Tacos!
3.3.2  Tacos!  replied to  katrix @3.3.1    3 weeks ago
I know two people who thought they were legally allowed to drive because they had a valid license per the DMV ... but they weren't because of the court.

I've seen that, too. What often happens is DMV suspends the license immediately for a period of 4 months based on BAC. Then right about the time this suspension is up, you have a trial, which can take several months to get around to. Then the driver is found guilty and the judge suspends the driver's license for 6 months as a term of probation. So the license ends up being suspended for 10 months.

Unless, apparently, you're a commercial driver in Massachusetts, in which case, they just say "ah, screw it!"

Ironically, even though as a matter of public policy, we say we are more concerned about commercial drivers, the enforcement authorities often look the other way or cut these guys a break because they know that penalizing them in any way could potentially cost them their jobs. They don't want to be the person that gets a guy fired.

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
3.3.3  Mark in Wyoming  replied to  Tacos! @3.3.2    3 weeks ago
authorities often look the other way or cut these guys a break because they know that penalizing them in any way could potentially cost them their jobs.

I think its a little more complicated than that , and that has not been my experience , usually when the dot guys come out wearing their coveralls with a creeper for an inspection , there will be a fine .

something I think goes through the DOT peoples minds is that those semis pay a pretty hefty fuel tax and they only get those taxes based on the miles driven in state , not just at the pumps . so their DOT funding depends on the drivers driving in that state, at least from semis. that's not saying those fines don't help either.

 I have been hearing for 20+ years that there is a professional driver shortage , look at some of the sign on bonuses some companies offer for experienced drivers ,with the right endorsements.

thing is experienced drivers are not cheap, and cheap drivers are usually not experienced, and right now experienced drivers can pick and choose the jobs they want . personally even after holding a CDL for 25+ years , driving over the road , construction and agriculture, I choose to not drive across state lines , or out of state. I would rather be home every night in my own REAL bed. Talk to a driver that's got 15, 20, 25 years , and they will likely say that a lot of the younger drivers are nothing more than steering wheel holders and likely wont be around driving in 5 to 10 years .

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
4  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו    3 weeks ago

Apparently this official feels responsible for her agency's failure.  If only more public officials at all levels of government  had the same integrity maybe we'd see less corruption, malfeasance and plain old incompetence. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
4.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @4    3 weeks ago
integrity

Lol!  This was a dereliction of duty. In no way should that POS had a drivers license!

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
4.1.1  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @4.1    3 weeks ago
Lol!  This was a dereliction of duty. In no way should that POS had a drivers license!

So, you know for certain that the head of the department is the one who failed to act and this didn't happen at a lower level.  The article indicates only that the agency failed to take action.  It seems unlikely that the head of the DMV is personally checking each case of license cancellation. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
4.1.2  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @4.1.1    3 weeks ago

As Harry Truman used to say "the buck stops here!"

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
4.1.3  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @4.1.2    3 weeks ago
As Harry Truman used to say "the buck stops here!"

If only you applied that standard to everybody, vic (if is the "key word" there)

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
4.1.4  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @4.1.3    3 weeks ago

I always try

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
4.1.5  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @4.1.4    3 weeks ago

jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif

Thanks for the laugh, vic. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
4.1.6  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @4.1.5    3 weeks ago

I guess it was a big day for everybody. Steevie finally got his answer, Ms Deveney resigned, the people who cared about the victims checked in and you had your laugh!

 
 
 
Split Personality
4.1.7  Split Personality  replied to  Vic Eldred @4.1.2    3 weeks ago

So, it's the Governor's fault?

Or are you aiming higher than that?

Perhaps the US Senators from MA?

Or higher than that, like another President?

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
4.1.8  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Split Personality @4.1.7    3 weeks ago

They don't run DMV. Somebody was supposed to be doing that, wasn't she?

 
 
 
Texan1211
4.1.9  Texan1211  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @4.1.1    3 weeks ago
So, you know for certain that the head of the department is the one who failed to act and this didn't happen at a lower level. The article indicates only that the agency failed to take action. It seems unlikely that the head of the DMV is personally checking each case of license cancellation.

So why did she choose to resign if she did absolutely nothing wrong and wasn't responsible for people under her?

 
 
 
katrix
4.1.10  katrix  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @4.1.1    3 weeks ago
So, you know for certain that the head of the department is the one who failed to act and this didn't happen at a lower level. 

She may have not even been aware of it - it could have been a lower level employee who received the notification and didn't handle it properly.  However, in agencies, it's customary for something like this to happen, where the higher-up takes responsibility. Part of being at such a high level is that you sometimes get credit for things you had nothing to do with, and also are the scapegoat sometimes for things you had nothing to do with. I remember at a past job, a very high level official got fired when something happened which she had repeatedly warned everyone about, and wasn't given funding or permission to resolve - but it was still her fault officially when the shit hit the fan.

I'm sure some lower-level employees got the axe or at least a reprimand as well, but those don't generally make the news.

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
4.1.11  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Split Personality @4.1.7    3 weeks ago
Or higher than that, like another President?

Of course....he's going to end up blaming Obama before he locks this discussion down--which is his MO whenever it gets uncomfortable.  

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
4.1.12  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Texan1211 @4.1.9    3 weeks ago
So why did she choose to resign if she did absolutely nothing wrong and wasn't responsible for people under her?

There's a long tradition (not Republican, though---never Republican) of heads of departments at all levels of government for taking responsibility for errors made by their departments even though they personally did not commit the error.  But, of course, I fully understand why that type of integrity would be unfamiliar to a Republican.  

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
4.1.13  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @4.1.6    3 weeks ago
Steevie finally got his answer

But not from you, I note.  

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
4.1.14  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @4.1.13    3 weeks ago

From a much nicer man than I.

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
5  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו    3 weeks ago

ICE must be too busy abusing children and woman at the southern border to bother with real criminal elements in the country. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @5    3 weeks ago

ICE stands for Immigration and Customs Enforcement and is therefore OFF TOPIC!

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
5.1.1  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1    3 weeks ago

Then so should Fish's comment (#2 above).  If you delete mine, his must go as well. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.1.2  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @5.1.1    3 weeks ago

The key word is "IF"....I haven't deleted anybody!

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
5.1.3  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.2    3 weeks ago

That's why I used it.  

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.1.4  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @5.1.3    3 weeks ago

I know.

 
 
 
Texan1211
5.2  Texan1211  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @5    3 weeks ago
ICE must be too busy abusing children and woman at the southern border to bother with real criminal elements in the country.

can a permanent US resident be deported for traffic offenses?

Certain misdemeanors (including any drug offense and any offense related to domestic violence) do, however, make a lawful permanent resident removable. Traffic offenses other than leaving the scene of an accident, driving without insurance, and driving while suspended will generally not lead to removability.
Can a green card holder be deported for a misdemeanor ...
www.quora.com/Can-a-green-card-holder-be-deported-for-a-misdemeanor-traffic-violation

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
5.2.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Texan1211 @5.2    3 weeks ago

That was an important question. One that you answered. 

Maybe Ms Deveney should read it on her way out?

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
5.2.2  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Texan1211 @5.2    3 weeks ago
can a permanent US resident be deported for traffic offenses?

This was a bit more than a "traffic offense" wasn't it?  And BF seems to think so (see comment #2) and don't you always believe everything BF says? 

 
 
 
Texan1211
5.2.3  Texan1211  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @5.2.2    3 weeks ago
This was a bit more than a "traffic offense" wasn't it?

Yes, it certainly was. 

WTF does that have to do with ICE deporting him BEFORE the tragedy?

And BF seems to think so (see comment #2) and don't you always believe everything BF says?

Instead of sniping at BF through posts to me, why not man up and address him directly if you have a fucking problem with him?

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
5.2.4  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Texan1211 @5.2.3    3 weeks ago
WTF does that have to do with ICE deporting him BEFORE the tragedy?

Previous offenses in CT and TX.

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
5.2.5  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Texan1211 @5.2.3    3 weeks ago
Instead of sniping at BF through posts to me, why not man up and address him directly if you have a fucking problem with him?

How is merely pointing out how he brought up ICE first "sniping at him" and why do you get so agitated at the slightest thing?  Have you overdone that SMMFH thing for too long? 

 
 
 
Texan1211
5.2.6  Texan1211  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @5.2.4    3 weeks ago
Previous offenses in CT and TX.

Connecticut reported the offense to MA.

Tx was an accident, according to the driver and police.

Kind of interesting that you are advocating for legal residents to be deported for traffic offenses and DWI's but don't mind sanctuary states like California harboring criminal illegal aliens convicted of violent crimes.

I just don't understand people with such screwed-up priorities.

 
 
 
Texan1211
5.2.7  Texan1211  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @5.2.5    3 weeks ago
How is merely pointing out how he brought up ICE first "sniping at him" and why do you get so agitated at the slightest thing? Have you overdone that SMMFH thing for too long?

Take your petty little beef with BF up with him.

Leave me out of your childish bitching.

 
 
 
Tacos!
5.2.8  Tacos!  replied to  Texan1211 @5.2    3 weeks ago
can a permanent US resident be deported for traffic offenses?

Generally, no. It usually needs to be a crime of violence or a "crime of moral turpitude." A simple DUI won't do it.

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
5.2.9  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Texan1211 @5.2.6    3 weeks ago
Kind of interesting that you are advocating for legal residents to be deported for traffic offenses and DWI's

You have this thing about putting your words in other people's mouths.  Who said anything about deportation for "traffic offenses and DWI's[sic]"?   And why are you still stuck on "traffic offenses and DWI's[sic] anyway.  This article has nothing to do with "traffic offenses and DWI's[sic].

I just don't understand people with such screwed-up priorities.

You seem to understand almost nothing.  

 
 
 
Tessylo
5.2.10  Tessylo  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @5.2.9    3 weeks ago

jrSmiley_12_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
5.2.11  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Texan1211 @5.2.7    3 weeks ago
Take your petty little beef with BF up with him.
Leave me out of your childish bitching. 

You always seem to hit 11 on the rage scale for the least little thing.  

 
 
 
Kathleen
6  Kathleen    3 weeks ago

This made me sick. 

I feel so bad for the victims and their families..

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Kathleen @6    3 weeks ago

You & I

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
7  Mark in Wyoming    3 weeks ago

There is another level of reporting that it looks like it failed as well that is rather concerning , CDL drivers also fall under federal level DOT regulations and reporting , and many of the states state level policing are also to report to them when a cdl driver is in violation and most fall under their states DOT not just the MVD. It looks like this is a driver that regularly crossed state lines as a driver  irregardless of where his lic was issued .

And another little nice to know thing , those that hold a CDL are held to different standards , most people without CDLs are not charged with DUI unless they blow an .08 unless they do something real stupid , CDL drivers that limit is lowered to a .02 no matter what vehilcle they drive. and I am not saying that's a bad thing .

 
 
 
Texan1211
7.1  Texan1211  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @7    3 weeks ago

Connecticut reported the DUI to MA but MA failed to suspend his license, which is why I believe the official resigned.

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
7.1.1  Mark in Wyoming  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1    3 weeks ago

your likely right , but that also hinges on if the guy was convicted of the DUI in Conn., until convicted it is simply an accusation, 35 yrs ago I got a rolling stop ticket in conn. on a Ma lic . never paid the ticket and never went back through conn. Mass blew it off . this was before I had a CDL and was a young yonker.

 
 
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