There's No Such Thing As Judeo-Christian Values — Especially Not In The GOP.
Category: News & Politics
Via: sandy-2021492 • 4 years ago • 72 commentsBy: Charles D. Dunst (The Forward)
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
"We've stopped the government's attacks on our Judeo-Christian values," President Trump said at a campaign rally and makeshift Roy Moore endorsement speech in Pensacola on December 8.
"We don't worship government, we worship God," the President continued.
Trump has used the exact same phrasing in previous speeches. "We don't worship government, we worship God," he declared in a speech in October, later adding "we are stopping all our attacks on Judeo-Christian values."
Similarly, Housing and Urban Development Secretary Ben Carson has deemed Roy Moore to be "someone who reflects the Judeo-Christian values that were so important to the establishment of our country." While Trump, Carson, and the religious right's use of "we" and "our" implies a shared ideological kinship between Jews and Christians, such an assertion, in the midst of a Roy Moore endorsement speech, is resolutely absurd. Jews are certainly not part of this "we"; Jews are overwhelmingly not supportive of the President, Roy Moore or their evangelical kin. Jews, in fact, are on the outside of the rhetorical war — and electoral politics — implied by the term.
Community | There's No Such Thing As Judeo-Christian Values — Especially Not In The GOP.
Jews, despite the rhetorical posturing embodied by the use of terms such as "Judeo-Christian values," are not part of Trump's and the GOP's contemporary coalition. The term, as used by the GOP, is not reflective of Jewish inclusion in Republican politics, but of an ideological strategy to unite two warring camps — the anti-immigrant nationalists and the evangelicals.
Ted Cruz, in an address at the Values Voter Summit, described the United States as a "center-right country, built on a foundation of Judeo-Christian values." Such values, in Cruz's mind, include the belief that religion should be the centerpiece of one's public life and that such religion should include specific ideas, such as "standing for life," "standing for marriage" and "standing for Israel." While American Jews may at time support Cruz's stance on Israel, the same certainly cannot be said for abortion and gay marriage.
In fact, despite Cruz and the Republican party's insistence that abortion and gay marriage, among other values, are a reflection of Judeo-Christian values, this is simply not the case in modern America. 89 percent of Jews say "abortion should be legal in all or most cases."Among all religious groups, American Jews are actually the most likely to support gay marriage — with 83 percent saying they do. Being anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage are clearly in no way reflective of modern "Judeo values."
If the GOP's supposed "Judeo-Christian values" have nothing to do with contemporary Judaism, then why are Ben Carson, Cruz, Steve Bannon, Donald Trump, and countless others using the term?
Sure, both Judaism and Christianity emanate from Old Testament; there certainly are shared values. hese values, however, are not what the term "Judeo-Christian values" refers to. Rather than reference traditional and contemporary shared values between the two traditions, the term is utilized to imply the existence of a contemporary cultural war and evoke the the visceral responses that come from such war.
Speaking in 2014, Steve Bannon, former advisor to the president, explained that "If we (the U.S.) do not bind together as partners with others in other countries then this conflict is only going to metastasize," — he perceived such a conflict to be between "Judeo-Christian values" and "Islamic fascism." Bannon's statement is demonstrably reflective of what the term has actually come to mean.
Donald Trump's base is not only made up of evangelicals, but of anti-immigration nationalists as well. While evangelicals saw Trump as their white knight promising to return Christian values to the mainstream, anti-immigrant nationalists saw him as a similar harbinger of American whiteness.
"Judeo-Christian values" is the term the Trump camp — and the GOP writ large — has repeatedly utilized to unite these two camps and turn out both of their votes. For evangelicals, the promise of "Judeo-Christian values" implies returning Christian morality to the public sphere. "For anti-immigrant nationalists,"the promise of "Judeo-Christian values" implies a return to American whiteness. For both of these groups, the return to such idealized norms is a return to American greatness.
The term is emblematic of the ideological divergence with the Trump White House. While evangelical Mike Pence is focused on reinstilling Christian morality, Stephen Miller is focused on the ongoing war between the "Judeo-Christian West" and "radical Islam."
Contemporary American Jewish values — values which are largely liberal — are simply not reflected in the right's usage of the term. The term is not one of Jewish inclusion and Jewish values, but of cynical Republican politics.
Using Judaism to posture to two groups - nationalists and evangelicals - whose values diverge so emphatically from those of the contemporary Jewish community is outrageous. The term has nothing to do with Judaism and it certainly has nothing to do with the overwhelming majority of American Jews.
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Let's stick to the topic, which is a political group spinning their position as reflective of the values of a religious group when it's not, please. Not other NTers past or present.
Misrepresentation in order to pander is dishonest. I'm glad this article calls it out.
To the gop, god is green and he folds.
You are correct. We all see the evangelicals, fanatics and religious fundamentalists supporting Trump, but not so much the mainstream faiths. We have seen the damn gop abusing the name of God to advocate for wars and torture and lying. For giving more to the rich and powerful at the expense of the poor and the powerless. Some of the faithful are finally catching on...
Some of the faithful has always known. That's why Jewish support has been lacking for the GOP well before now.
There seem to be some quite willing to lie about Jewish beliefs to gain support, but also willing to ignore the "Jews will not replace us" chants by some of their members. Embracing Judaism and its followers when it's convenient, and neglecting them when they're unpopular, is antisemitic.
You are preaching to the cantors now...
So they have the exact same god as Democrats.
Is that a joke? I thought everyone has the same god. just not the same texts.
Evangelicals and right wing Christian extremists that make up a large part of Trumps base traded their values and morals for what they imagine is a "win". All they really wanted was to get their way and regain the power that white Christian nationalists used to wield in this country. The growing diversity of faiths and cultures which should be warmly welcomed by any who understand America is a melting pot and better when celebrate our diversity was rejected by the white Christian patriarchy and seen as a usurper of their former power. It's what has led to so many white supremacist groups along with the illogical support for a serial adulterer and accused sexual predator by the supposedly "moral" religious right. They eagerly forgive him of his many obvious faults and sins because they see him as standing up for the white Christian patriarchy they are desperately clinging to.
What they want, is the ability to burn at the stake, anybody with different beliefs than themselves.
And I will bet that you can't provide 3 quotes from anyone wanting to do what you claim.
I suspect you will have trouble even finding one after searching the bowels of the internet.
And I bet you will post claims to 3 more comments threads with nothing that pertains to them and nothing to back up your claims.
I responded directly to your claim, which you seem unable to document
Do you understand metaphors? Should I use smaller words?
Here is a link , so you can read up on them.
a claim and a metaphor are different things
Very good you read the link!!!
So now perhaps I should explain it to you?
Texan and Ozzy, keep it civil, please.
Yes, please explain how you determine the difference.
I'm confident you'll figure it out on your own.
But I am not confident that YOU can tell the difference on your own, or are willing to do so.
What you are confident in is no concern of mine.
Then why do you keep replying????
My choice, not yours.
Yes, it certainly is and not at all surprising that it's being used by the GOP.
I have to agree with this article. I don't think that the present GOP represents what is mainstream Jewish values. Putting Judeo into their tag is very misleading, especially when talking about the separation of Church and State.
In 2016 American Jews voted 71% Democratic. By the midterm elections of 2018 that percentage was up to 75%. But, recent polls indicate the Democratic Jewish vote may be 80% or more this November...
It's just an attempt to pander to the religious base.
A small portion of it is correct:
"Sure, both Judaism and Christianity emanate from Old Testament; there certainly are shared values."
What is wrong is the premise:
"These values, however, are not what the term "Judeo-Christian values" refers to."
It is exactly what the term "Judeo-Christian value" refers to. The GOP, however, is not pandering to the Jewish-American vote. That is a vote the GOP can never have for in my opinion, many American Jews are more committed to liberal ideology that anything else - including religious values.
I would say that is attempting to define for Jews what their values are, rather than deferring to Jews themselves on the matter. Surely they are the best narrators of their own story.
All parties pander, Vic including the GOP. It's what I don't like partisanship. But you can't speak for a people you are not a member of. Jews are as diverse a population as any, and while some are just liberals, others are deeply religious and liberal, and some are not liberal at all nor religious. That would be like defining Catholics. Some of the biggest liberals are Catholics. I would hesitate at defining their faith, though, since I am not one.
Who are you to decide what religious values are for Jewish people, or what religious values Jews should have? Are you Jewish? For the vast majority of Jews, what you demonize as "liberal ideology" embodies Jewish religious values at their core. Your comment smacks of blatant anti-Semitism.
They have defined it - when they vote. Liberal values are obviously their priority over their religious beliefs and/or whatever they think of Israel.
I am not speaking for them. I am making an observation.
Jews are as diverse a population as any, and while some are just liberals, others are deeply religious and liberal, and some are not liberal at all nor religious.
True, that is why I said "many American Jews." Sandy admitted the fact in post 2.1.3 "That's why Jewish support has been lacking for the GOP well before now."
Sandy told us in that post why she thinks American Jews tend to vote democrat and I am giving you my opinion on why they vote democrat.
That would be like defining Catholics. Some of the biggest liberals are Catholics. I would hesitate at defining their faith, though, since I am not one.
We are entitled to our opinions on that as well, however Catholics don't tend to vote one way or the other, so it wouldn't be quite the same kind of conversation, would it?
I'm offering an opinion. I'm not deciding what anyone should do.
what religious values Jews should have?
Liberalism is not a religion. It is an ideology. Religious values are separate and should be!
Are you Jewish?
No.
For the vast majority of Jews, what you demonize as "liberal ideology" embodies Jewish religious values at their core.
Do tell. My second wife was Jewish. I'm very interested to hear hoe "liberal ideology" embodies Jewish religious values "at their core."
Your comment smacks of blatant anti-Semitism.
And your comment smacks of anti-gentileism
I'm very interested to hear hoe [sic] "liberal ideology" embodies Jewish religious values "at their core."
See Perrie's comment 4.4.4 as a start.
And your comment smacks of anti-gentileism
That is complete and total B.S. and you know it. I made no mention of non-Jews nor did I presume to characterize them or their beliefs, unlike your foul comments about Jews.
My wife of 26 years (my only wife) is a devout Catholic and I have always encouraged and supported her in her religiosity in every way.
Vic,
Most Jews I know, be they religious or not, are Zionist. I don't know where you get your ideas from.
Here is my observation. Irish Catholics tend to be liberal while Italian Catholics tend to be conservative. Of course, nothing is absolute and the Pope definitely leans liberal.
I think it's their loyalty to the constitution and the rule of law over their religious beliefs that lead them to vote for liberal causes.
I hate liver. I think it taste gross and has a disgusting texture, but I'd vote for the freedom to eat it if anyone wants to. What others eat is not my business.
I'm not gay and could never even think of being intimate with someone of my same gender, but I'd vote for anyone else's freedom to love who and how they want. It's not my business.
I think abortion is very sad and I wish no one was in a situation where they had to make that decision, but I'd vote for the right of women to be able to make that choice for themselves. Not my uterus, not my business.
A truly faithful person can live up to their beliefs in their own lives while not forcing their religious beliefs on others by trying to legislate morality.
Our constitution demands a separation between church and State. I just wish more religious Americans took that seriously.
That is true. However, what we do resent tremendously is people like Trump telling American Jews that Israel is "your country". We strongly support Israel, but for American Jews, AMERICA IS OUR COUNTRY. We have no divided loyalties and believe in America always and forever.
I call total BULLSHIT on that comment.
DP, I agree with everything you have written in your comment with the exception that I believe that for most Jews, their religious beliefs and values are what lead them to vote for liberal causes.
I agree, though I think many recognize that their religious beliefs shouldn't trump others rights so even when they personally wouldn't do something, like perhaps eating bacon, they don't slap the ham out of their neighbors mouth.
Yes, that is absolutely true. I don't believe that almost any Jews think their religious rights should trump others' rights. That would be considered totally unacceptable.
And I know you were just using it as an example, but I do hope you realize that very few Jews today "keep Kosher". None of my family ever did, from my grandparents on down. Even my great grandparents from what I understand. Most Jews do eat pork and ham. There's nothing like a good BLT sandwich! Or pork chops... Or ham and eggs... Now I'm getting hungry.
I just made a ham sandwich for lunch, seriously... and I dare ANYONE to try to slap that delicious thing out of my mouth!
I learned something new today. That few Jews observe dietary laws. Thanks!
Some do, especially Orthodox Jews, and maybe some others. By far, most Jews do not follow Kosher dietary laws. I know a lot of Jewish people, and at the moment, I can't think of any who do. Some Jews may chose not to eat pork or ham for their own reasons, but the Kosher dietary laws are very strict in a lot of aspects, and I doubt that any of the people who choose not to eat pork or ham follow all of the rules.
I can see why some people don't eat pork these days. The pork one gets doesn't taste right. Of course, I'm spoiled, because I raised pigs and ate them.
Ham will always be one of my favorites
Ham with melted swiss cheese in between layers of ham, smeared with spicy mustard, lettuce and tomato, on a hard roll.
Yum, but hold the tomato, and give me a bit of red onion, instead.
When Thomas Sowell was young he wrote a book called "Ethnic America." In that book he goes into detail regarding the cultures of the various people who came in great waves to the United States. There is no doubt that each group has been influenced by their experiences. The Jews who emigrated to the US from Russia valued Civil Liberties - the very thing they were denied in Russia. Cuban Americans are wary of Socialist ideology - the very thing they fled (many of them losing their land to Castro). It's really not that hard to understand.
Really?
You have to use the word "tend" very carefully with those groups.
The beauty of Irish Americans and Italian Americans is that you really can't predict how they will vote. That is as it should be!
Of course, nothing is absolute and the Pope definitely leans liberal.
For sure. He is destroying his own Church. Peter was the Rock and the current Pope is the sand storm.
No way.
Red onion works too. And pickles. Double down on the pork and add bacon too. Because bacon makes everything better.
I agree with you 100%. Most Jews reject the contemporary Republican Party.
G, I would have to disagree. There are Jews who are conservatives. It's the definition of Judeo-Christian values that has become a mosh mash of meanings and doesn't represent the Judeo part well.
He said most which bears out in the numbers.
Yes, there are Jews who are what are referred to as political "conservatives", but I believe that, by far, most Jews are not. I believe, as I stated above at 4.3.3, that "liberal ideology", for most Jews, is at the core of their religious values.
There I would have to agree with you since that is very much part of the idea of being your brother's keeper and charity. Kind of the opposite of what Ayn Rand believed (she was Jewish), since she was an ardent atheist, which goes to show you can not mix those concepts and get a full perception.
'We've stopped the government's attacks on our Judeo-Christian values.'
Alternative translation:
In its quest for earthly glory, evangelicals reversed Jesus' reply to Satan's 'best offer.'
The only thing donald worships is himself.
100%
So religious conservatives do have something in common with the gold painted con-man.
I think modern day religious conservatives and evangelical leaders are much like Aaron, Moses brother. They have been waiting and waiting for their savior to return and have lost patience so they built their own golden God to worship.
"When the people saw that Moses was so long in coming down from the mountain, they gathered around Aaron and said, “Come, make us gods who will go before us. As for this fellow Moses who brought us up out of Egypt, we don’t know what has happened to him.” 2 Aaron answered them, “Take off the gold earrings ( that your wives, your sons and your daughters are wearing, and bring them to me.” 3 So all the people took off their earrings and brought them to Aaron. 4 He took what they handed him and made it into an idol ( cast in the shape of a calf, fashioning it with a tool. Then they said, “These are your gods, Israel, who brought you up out of Egypt." - Exodus 32:1-3
Angry and bitter at the nation leaving they and their white Christian patriarchy behind and their expected savior still not arriving after 2000 years they have fabricated their own golden calf to worship, and worship him they do.
"Comparing Trump to Jesus, and why some evangelicals believe Trump is God’s chosen one"
To be fair, the Jewish religion has their fundamentalists just like the Christian religion.
But yeah, it seems like a concerted effort at pandering for votes.
They are a minority in the faith. But you are correct.
I think the the Conservative and Orthodox communities tend to be more conservative, but I don't really know. They probably are against abortion and same-sex marriage
As I said in another thread, conservative evangelicals see the Jews as a means to the End. They embrace Israel for without it, the temple won't be rebuilt and Jesus won't be coming back. Then they will just have to live with the rest of us sinners for all eternity
exactly. after that it's bend a knee or else.
Trout,
That is very true. The more Jews in Israel, the closer to "end times" for the evangelical. They are the biggest funders of West Bank expansion, and that is because you need a lot of Jews in Judea and Sumeria for the second coming.
Why do they need so many?