At least 40 babies, some beheaded, found by Israel soldiers in Hamas-attacked village
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
Israel’s military has discovered unspeakable horrors in an Israeli community that was attacked by Hamas on Saturday, including dozens of dead babies, some with of their heads chopped off, Israeli media reported.
According to local Israeli outlet i24News, Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) soldiers moved into Kfar Aza, one of the communities Hamas terrorists invaded early Saturday morning, and discovered about 40 dead babies, some decapitated — highlighting the brutality of the invading forces.
IDF were removing the bodies of victims found in the area when they found the children's remains. Israeli soldiers are attempting to use bones to identify the victims, according to the report.
"It’s not a war, it’s not a battlefield. You see the babies, the mother, the father, in their bedrooms, in their protection rooms, and how the terrorists killed them," IDF Maj. Gen. Itai Veruv said, describing the scene, i24News reported.
"It’s a massacre."
On Saturday morning, Hamas-led forces poured over the Israel-Gaza border while residents were still sleeping, dragging people into the streets, taking some hostage, while beheading and killing others. Over 700 Israelis, including men, women, children, and the elderly, were indiscriminately killed in one day — the largest terror attack in a single day in Israel’s history.
The Israeli army allowed members of the media into Kibbutz Kfar Aza, which is located less than a quarter of a mile away from the Gaza border.
In the city, residents were murdered, and their bodies left lying in the streets. Cars were completely burned, and the devastation was extended to buildings, some of which were abandoned and destroyed.
According to i24News, the destructive visuals were met with what was described as "the smell of death."
The once vibrant community is now unrecognizable by Saturday’s brutal and swift attack.
The outlet described the level of barbarity they witnessed as what the Allied forces must have experienced walking into Nazi-controlled areas during World War II.
"Many soldiers were called up for reserve service, and could be seen actively consoling each other after what they had to witness. They arrived expecting the worst, but the scenes are beyond anything that one could imagine. Some soldiers say they found babies with their heads cut off, entire families gunned down in their beds. About 40 babies and young children have been taken out on gurneys — so far," i24News reported.
The outlet added, "The atrocities that were committed with guns, grenades, knives, all targeting innocent civilians in their homes. We can see soccer nets on lawns, a sign of the bucolic life that once existed here. Doors are wide open, strollers left behind, sidewalks destroyed by artillery. There are charred houses, as terrorists burned down houses to drive the civilians sheltering inside to come out."
According to the report, 200 victims were found in the city.
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What both-sideism and support for terrorist sponsors like Iran bring. Cue the cries that this no different than Israel bombing Gaza after providing warning to residents to flee the targeted areas. Both sides are wrong!
Hard for Americans to wrap their heads around this kind of medieval savagery but barbarians still exist in the world.
You have good points and you have one completely useless point.
One of the Israeli defense leaders said to day that they will punish Hamas so this "never happens again". This is going to be the justification for whatever levels of civilian deaths occur in Gaza. It most likely will be many thousand if Israel launches a full ground campaign. The idea that such action will make sure the terrorist attacks "never happen again" is laughable. To the contrary, leveling Gaza will ensure that attacks do happen again. Repressing Palestinians in the West Bank guarantees it will happen again. No one is thinking through the ramifications of their actions 5 or 10 years from now.
Don't you feel the slightest bit of shame for not condemning these Islamic Nazi butchers?
Would it make you angry if Israeli soldiers decapitated Gaza children. All you've done here is to show support for Hamas.
[removed] I have shown no support for Hamas. If you think I have copy and paste the sentence that does so or shut the fuck up.
Of course I condemn Hamas for these attacks.
How much plainer can Hamas make it? There goal isn't "co-existence," it's extermination. People who believe decapitating babies is acceptable aren't going to turn into the tolerant liberals of progressive's dreams. They are going to keep murdering babies, kids you name it until they can no longer. Hamas has to be destroyed and Israel will have to police the Gaza and West Bank to ensure these terrorist organizations can't rebuild an infrastructure.
No one is thinking through the ramifications of their actions 5 or 10 years from now.
Of course they are. It's not thinking through the policy of treating Hamas as a legitimate government for the last decade that led to this. The only way towards peace is for the Palestinian people to reject terrorist leadership. Until they do, there won't be peace. That has to come first.
Israel needs to treat Hamas like the brutal neolithic savage barbarians they are and eradicate them post haste.
With some folk, I guess if you're not willing to cut the heads off of Hamas babies you must be a Hamas supporter.
Intelligent people tend to avoid extremism.
I have no problem with destroying Hamas, I hope it happens. The idea though that leveling Gaza will ensure that this never happens again is laughable. The only way to assure it will never happen again is to resolve the "Palestinian problem" within Israel.
Fair point.
Yes. Absolutely.
The thing is, though, they don't actually wear uniforms.
So the concern is a possibly brutal retaliation against innocent civilians who had nothing to do with anything.
Hamas AND all its supporters need to be eradicated, period, full stop.
While others worry incessantly over the freaking idiots who support Hamas, those Neanderthals murdering babies solely because they are Jewish.
If someone in Gaza is holding a gun and fires at you, they are not innocent civilians and there is every justification to use deadly force and fire back.
Not with a rocket launched from Tel Aviv.
The point here is that "eradicating" any terrorist organization is very easy to say and immensely difficult to actually do, as we Americans have demonstrated for decades. They survive precisely because they make it difficult to identify terrorists from innocent bystanders.
The Israelis have a reputation for being a bit callous about civilian collateral damage, so I prefer to be a bit cautious about "eradicating" things.
Forever is a long time. No one is promising that. But the idea is to make it very hard for Hamas, or any other terrorist organization, to build up the sort of infrastructure Hamas has amassed.
Do you realize what that means? The vast majority of the ME, especially the Palestinians, are relatively uneducated peasants who know only what those who control them indoctrinate them with. The reason people like you and I support Israel is because they aren't the kind of people to just "eradicate" others.
Emotionally, I get you, but we can't go there without becoming what we hate, to my mind.
I support Israel fighting fire with fire.
There is no negotiating with terrorists, and Palestinians have aligned themselves with an abysmal group.
If you mean something like fighting according to the standards the other side sets, I can't support you. People support Israel precisely because they are not Hamas, meaning they have a different moral standard that differentiates them. If they do what Hamas does, then there's nothing to distinguish them from each other and no reason to support one over the other.
That doesn't mean I don't think Israel shouldn't go after Hamas. I think they should make every moral effort to send every last one of them they can find to their god for their eternal reward, which will not be what they think it is. But I do not think they should return favor for favor upon the Palestinian populace as a whole, even if they approve of what Hamas has done. Morality comes with a cost. It can often lead to personal suffering. To me, that is the price of morality. To be moral you cannot simply abandon it because it's too hard.
Most in the Western world back Israel because they don't use people as a human shield. Rather, their soldiers are the shield for others. The Western world backs them precisely because they don't do to the Palestinians what the Palestinians do to them. We value Israel because of what Israel values. If they fight fire with fire, all of that goes away. Justifiably.
I agree with what you've said, but also believe the savagery of the attack justifies the savagery of the response.
I mean that Israel is telling Palestinians what is coming and that they should leave before the area is overrun or bombed to hell and back.
Of course I don't think Israel should kidnap Palestinians, murder them solely because they are Muslims, or behead babies. Or place military headquarters around or under schools and hospitals.
To me, Israel has shown some remarkable restraint in the past while defending itself.
That restraint has always been met with yet more acts of terrorism.
Sometimes when things aren't giving you the desired results, its time to change tactics.
If you mean pitiless, remorseless savagery against the perpetrators of these atrocities, we're in agreement. The verdict has been reached and the sentence established. I have no qualms concerning that.
I figured, but wasn't sure. Your wording was kinda vague. I'm glad to know I was right.
One person said that-- and of course the entire Israeli High command will grovel at his feet, and do everything possible to do what any such random "Defense Leader"says!
(And if ten "Israeli Defense Leaders" say the opposite-- they will follow this one other guy.)
If anyone missed it, its my feeble attempt at sarcasm...
Why-- because it would support your Agenda John!
Disregarding my sarcasm for a moment-- John: Do you not actually realize that most of us realize what you are doing? (of course you have every right to do that-- heck, you are not even going to be punished so you never do it again!
But seriously, while you every right to do it, here's some friendly advice-- you are actually weakening your own arguments.
Well WTF-- if it gets annoying enough I can just ignore you
So because Hamas uses human shields and hides its facilities and weapons in schools, mosques and hospitals and themselves among civilians they have to be left to continue their barbaric savagery?
And I suppose if you came home and found your wife blinded with her breasts sliced off and your daughter who had just been raped by 12 terrorists and your young boy decapitated you would calmly say, "Gee I hope they find those guys and charge them with offences and give them a trial before 12 of their peers."
Maybe it does, but I am certain you will not find Israeli soldiers cutting off the heads of children or raping young girls or slaughtering elderly people or parading captured women naked through the streets. However, if Israel were to completely level Gaza IMO it would be well-deserved. The caring nations can send them tents and food and medicine like they do for massive earthquake or flood victims.
Rashida Tlaib isn't angry about Hamas doing this. In fact, she refused to comment when questioned.
Do cite me saying anything like that.
Coming unhinged a bit there, Buzz?
My point is simply that the correct response for war crimes is not "more war crimes".
You just said Hamas uses human shields. There are a lot of completely innocent people trapped in the middle of this shit through no fault of their own. It's not OK to presume they're all terrorists, any more than it was OK to presume that about Arabs in America after 9-11 or beat up Chinese people because of Covid.
While I agree with your point, it's not really comparable. Hamas is the elected governing body of the Palestinian community. In my mind that means they represent at least a majority of those in Gaza.
OK. But that kind of depends on their elections being held by 1st world standards, doesn't it?
I mean, Putin is "elected" too.
What's the old Stalin quote... The people who cast the votes don't decide an election, the people who count the votes do.
Not really. It depends on whether their elections were held to the standards of the Palestinians.
Yeah, but again I don’t think that's really comparable. Russia is a sovereign nation.
No doubt...
I sincerely doubt anyone has asked her about Americans being massacred by Hamas either. Tlaib would probably ignore that question as well. She does not give rat's behind about that.
Trump would love that statement.
When the people in France and in Russia were not happy with those who governed them, they held a revolution even if it was dangerous to do so. The Gazan people threw out a reasonable government in order to install Hamas - and I'm sure it tickled their fancy that it was a Jew-hating government they installed.
I think you are making quite an assumption (that the best way to prrevent a Hamas massacre from happening again is for Israel to try to kill more people in Gaza than in previous campaigns. And also making the assumption that this guy is really stupid-- implying perhaps that all or most Israelis are really stupid.
And remember, thery had several Hamas attacks on Israel, and Israel retsaliated-- every several years!
After going through this cycle several times its obvious it doesn't work. The israeli counter attacks do stop Hamas violence-- but only for a while. So if they don't want the same results,they have to try something different.
Possibly.
But it's sadly relevant in many places in the world.
I don't know about voting in Gaza, but I know there are toddlers over there who have fuck all to do with any of this and don't deserve to have their apartment buildings collapse on them because they live near a bunch of terrorists.
That's what Hamas thinks it's doing now.
I'm not sure either the French or Russian revolutions installed "reasonable governments".
Let me be really clear here... I'm not defending Hamas or anything they've done. Once the leaders/organizers of this atrocity are captured, there is nothing you could do to those bastards that I would object to.
But I'm not going to sit quietly while people try to justify violence on people who weren't involved. If that's what we're really about, we can fuck right off with any claim to being civilized people. We'll just be the barbarians who won.
The casualties of a war started by their own. At least the Israelis would NEVER behead them.
You are aware, of course, that Israel has ALWAYS warned where they were going to hit - with dropped leaflets, telephone calls and emails. Even Hamas admitted that Israel does that by declaring that they would kill hostages if Israel did not issue warnings. Israel does NOT want to kill civilians so please stop implying that the Israelis are the same as the animals that Hamas are.
The revolutions I spoke of were considered necessary by the COMMON people in order to make their life bearable by taking away the power and control of the aristocracy in order to put it into the hands of the people. The voters in Gaza did the opposite, they took the power away from a reasonable government and put it into the hands of a terrorist organization. What they are experiencing now is actually their own fault for doing that.
That doesn't mean they're culpable. It's not OK to be casual or capricious with their lives.
I know. I know.
It's horrific.
And their buildings are not collapsing on their heads. They are lodged in the many UNWRA schools and other UN facilities because they were warned.
Well, they're dying anyway.
Well, as I pointed out, it's a war and Israel didn't start it and it certainly isn't going about it with the viciousness that Hamas did. Hamas is known to use human shields and they do cause casualties. I'm all for a humanitarian corridor for providing humanitarian aid to the civilians - food, water, medicines and medical equipment. Why is Israel always the one that is blamed when Egypt has a border access with Gaza as well?
Apparently, Egypt thinks it's better for the Palestinians to stay in Gaza than to come into Egypt.
Trying to figure that one out. Apparently, Egypt thinks Palestinians are better off dying in place, perhaps because of the optics (the more dead Palestinians the better) and, possibly, because they don't want to be responsible materially or politically for a people no one wants anyway. I think this tells us where Egypt's sympathy lies.
It doesn't mean they're not, either.
I get you, Jack, and I feel the same way, mostly, but how does the average Palestinian feel about Hamas? Indifferent? Heroes? Rather Hamas were somewhere else? If heroes or indifferent, then they're reaping the rewards of that. Does that make all the dead children acceptable? No. But actions, and inactions, have consequences.
Totally on board with that, too. But Israel can't be capricious with their own lives, either. If they go into Gaza, thousands of them are likely going to die. That place is not only the worst sort of urban jungle but it has tunnels all under it. Hamas could pop out anywhere, even places Israelis already pacified. They are going to go in there and figure out whether any particular Palestinian is going to try to kill them. I don't even want to think about all the traps and IED's there's going to be. I'm hoping all the bombing has the purpose of making the ground invasion safer, at least, rather than just lashing out.
Yeah, and the most horrible thing about it is, as far as I can see, all this suffering is due to pride. The most useless commodity there is. No, worse than useless, considering all the suffering it has caused throughout history.
But Hamas has to die. This can't be allowed to happen again, not simply for Israel but for the Palestinian's sake as well. But how do we find justice in this? What is the just path? Can there be one or has that horse left the barn already? All I can tell you is I'm not wise enough to know.
Like you said, it's just horrific and I'm not sure it can be anything else.
We've got kids dying, Drakk. You're gonna have a lot of work to do explaining the culpability of an 8-year-old.
If it's like everywhere else in the world, opinion is probably sharply divided. There are undoubtedly people who consider Hamas their champions. There are also undoubtedly people who wish they would piss off and not start a war they can't possibly win that will bring all of Palestine crashing down.
I get that. I really do. But Israel's intelligence operations are legendary. They are capable of beheading the monster with surgical precision. But I also get that Netanyahu needs to do something drastic as a show of force. I remember 9/11, and I remember what it feels like to watch people celebrate while you bury your children. Everybody is white hot with rage, and a leader can't sit on his hands.
I've spent most of my life teaching, coaching, and protecting kids, and that clearly influences my view on the situation. (Not sorry, BTW.) Killing their kids is not the answer, no matter how righteous the anger may be.
Hamas is just the tip of the iceberg. There is a good possibility that we've now pretty much got a proxy war with Iran.... a country that sponsors terrorism and is probably close to nuclear capability. Take a minute to think about how badly that could go.
That's fair.
Let me revisit a point here...
When the Israelis identify and capture the people who planned this attack, and most certainly anybody who has beheaded a child... there really isn't anything they could do to those fuckers that I would object to. Seriously. If they wanted to use them to demonstrate the varying effectiveness of medieval torture devices, I wouldn't bat an eyelid. If they lined them all up and flayed them, fine.. have at it. Feed them their own testicles dipped in pig's blood. I don't care.
But their kids didn't do this.
Let's hope that is established very soon.
It is amazing, is it not, that there can be so many human beings in modern times who would see as their champions terrorists who brutally savage innocent people and ... beyond belief ... decapitate children and babies?
It is amazing. And not in a good way.
I personally get surprised at the level of surprise here in the US when something barbaric happens in the Middle East.
I remember the hysteria when Jamal Khashoggi was killed. Like the Saudis were suddenly barbaric because Trump enabled them. The Saudis beheaded over 100 people during every year of the Obama presidency. They've been doing that for thousands of years.
Last fall we played a World Cup in Qatar in stadiums built with imported slave labor.
I'm not sure we're not just wildly optimistic to expect better.
I've been following the Middle East for years. At different times I've work on a collective farm in Israel (when I was in my 20s and 3os I was very Leftist in my views).
And I went back there for a while for a while as an assistant to a friend who was working on a photoshoot.
In addition to several Israel trips I've visited Egypt and Morocco.
I've read a lot. I've spent hours researching terrorism. (Most people are not aware of this, but there were two attacks on the WTC by Islamist terrorists. The first, unsucessful one, should've been a warning but it went unheeded.)
A lot of what keeps appearing and reappearing in the Arab world is terrorist groups-- but those having unusually barbaric practices-- they love extreme cruelty. (ISIS is a good example-- and recently as people are fining out more about Hamas they realize a lot of their excessive cruelty closely resembles that of ISIS-- and that of Saddam).
(Most people are not aware of this, but there were two . .
1993 World Trade Center Bombing
1993 World Trade Center bombing was a terrorist attack carried out on February 26, 1993, when a van bomb detonated below the North Tower of the World Trade Center complex in New York City.
The 1,336 lb (606 kg) urea nitrate – hydrogen gas enhanced device [1] was intended to send the North Tower crashing into its twin, the South Tower , taking down both skyscrapers and killing tens of thousands of people.
It failed to do so, but killed six people, including a pregnant woman, [2] and caused over a thousand injuries. [3] About 50,000 people were evacuated from the buildings that day. [4] [5]
The attack was planned by a group of terrorists including Ramzi Yousef , Mahmud Abouhalima , Mohammad A. Salameh , Nidal Ayyad , Abdul Rahman Yasin , and Ahmed Ajaj . In March 1994, four men were convicted of carrying out the bombing: Abouhalima, Ajaj, Ayyad, and Salameh.
(Full story at the above link)
This and we have a member of the government displaying flags and making statements in support of those carrying out these acts.
Wonder why Michigan is quiet.
Who is Michigan? (And just how quiet is she?)
So you don't know who has been showing support for the terrorists in D.C. and what state they "represent".
Sounds like you're thinking of one specific person. But there are several. So no, I don't know which one you are thinking of.
Sounds like you need to do some research.
If we carefully think about it, Tlaib proudly displays the Palestinian flag (current home to Islamic terrorist Hamas) along with the gay pride flag outside her office. That's hypocritical, and she cannot support both sides.
It's well known that Islamic terrorists, whether ISIS, Hamas, and other radical Muslim cults, torture and behead gay people as well as throw them off roofs to their deaths.
I've noticed that-- some of the strongest supporters of Islamic terrorists-- or even of Islam in general,also support gay rights.
Seems strange-- it would be as if a devout Muslim or very religious Jew was also working for the Porkmproducers lobby!
Ot if the head of Alcoholics Anonymous was doing liquor commercials on TV!
Or the head of the KKK was donating money to Black Lives Matter.
or...well you get the idea!
Very strange combination
Well IMO these are very strange people. ("Hypocricy" doesn't even begin to describe it).
It takes a 'special' kind of man to behead babies.
It is disturbing that some intellectual midgets are incapable of empathizing with the victims of this terrorism. I suspect in their ignorance they become receptive to the deep hatred a handful of those in Academia who try to portray these atrocities as some sort of predictable and acceptable response to as they say the apartheid. The key difference here between South Africa and this issue is that Hamas states their goal clearly, to eliminate every Jew while Israel has build a diverse country of coexistence.
There is no other side except those in the west who have a bone to pick with the perceived patriarchy are total and complete idiots who suffer from their own deep seeded moral depravity and an array of unfixable character defects. These disturbed people should be avoided as they have nothing to offer.
The accusation of apartheid is false. And there's another groupwho gets annoyed by that: some Black South Africans who suffered the horrors of real actual Apartheid.
So by implying (falsely) that any mild action of Israel are Apartheid-- it belittle the actual horros of Apartheid, makes what some Black South Africans experienced seem relatively mild.
Yeah, SOME apartheid - Arabs in Israel have parliamentary parties and have served as members of the full government parliament, Arabs are mayors and other high officials in Israeli towns, serve in the IDF, and one sits as a justice in Israel's Supreme Court. When I was Director of Development of Canadian Friends of Laniado Hospital, which is located in Netanya, I visited the hospital to witness complete cooperation between the Jewish and Arab staff - doctors, nurses, administrators, etc, and during Jewish High Holidays the Arab staff have complete control of that Orthodox Jewish hospital. I believe 20% of Israel's population is Arab - SOME apartheid.
Time for Israel to take the gloves off that Hamas believes Israel will never do, and Islamic terrorists do not want to see when that happens. Israel has two things that Hamas does not. They have more manpower and much more sophisticated weaponry. Iran had better take note that after Hamas and Hetzbolah, they are next in line for Israel to take on.
True that that is-- Hamas does have one advantage-- they are not afraid to die. In fact many relish the thought of death.
Why?
Because they've been brainwashed. They actually believe if they die defending Islam they will be guaranteed entry into paradise. Yes-- they actually believe it.
Apparently, 72 virgins is a big attraction. I think virginity is over rated and I could never remember 72 names.
if they die defending Islam
Unless they are killed by a female. Then Paradise ain't gonna happen.
That's why some of these terrorist crazies really fear the YPJ:
The Women's Protection Units [a] or Women's Defense Units is an all-female militia involved in the Syrian civil war . [9] The YPJ is part of the Syrian Democratic Forces , the armed forces of Rojava , and is closely affiliated with the male-led YPG . [10] While the YPJ is mainly made up of Kurds , it also includes women from other ethnic groups in Northern Syria. [11]
History
Women have been involved in Syrian Kurdish Resistance fighting since as early as 2011,
Well, then, I hope that if any of the Hamas are going to be executed, that they get female IDF soldiers to do it. But one of the problems is that Hamas knows they are NOT going to be executed - they will be tried and imprisoned if they are captured. The only execution that I can think of that was carried out by Israel was Adolph Eichmann - a very famous trial of the Nazi official who was in charge of the death camps of The Holocaust.
IIRC, Israel considers the Death Penalty to be inhuman-- and is not used. Rather, even the most brutal terrorists, when captured, are imprisoned. (And the conditions in Israeli prisons are nowhere near as bad as those in other Middle Eastern countries.)
(In fact there are imprisoned terrorists who have taken correspondence courses and received college degrees)
IIRC, Israel considers the Death Penalty to be inhuman-- and is not used.
Of course there is one exception to this--mass murders such as Nazi war criminal are tried and excecuted.
Not only that, the Palestinian government supports them and their families financially (using money donated to them by stupid nations). Got a problem getting a job and need some money? Kill a Jew.
This is as despicable as they can get, there are no words for it or them (Hamas).
Yes, Israel will do everything it can to destroy Hamas and any other group involved (Islamic Jihad, Hezbollah). If they undertake a ground operation in Gaza, it will be costly to Israel and deadly to Hamas, urban warfare is hell on earth. Israel did this in 2004 I believe it was but this time it will be, IMO a scorched earth policy by Israel and rightly so. The problem will always be like an octopus if you cut off one tentacle another grows to take its place. Israel has no other choice now but to do everything it can to destroy Hamas and probably Hezbollah and Islamic Jihad.
A ground invasion would be difficult, but maybe necessary.
And as difficult as takingout Hamas and islamic Jihad may be, Hizb'Allah ("The Party of Allah") may be next to impossible. A major proxy of Iran, they are in Southern Lebanon right on Israel's northern border. They are excellent fighters but worse yet-- the number of rockets they have is astounding. (I looked it up years ago, IIRC it was in the tens of thousands)> And they can reach far into Israel.
There have been some minor skirmishes lately, but probably both sides don't want escalation.
When a terrorist group goes this far, they lose any moral standing. They are to be condemned. The entire planet should work to eliminate this cancer on humanity.
How that is done is of course incredibly complicated. But if we (the civilized world) could just kill these sick fucks, I would support it.
A terrorist group never has any moral high ground, period.
I am talking about their ability to argue they are acting on moral grounds.
Most terrorists argue justification for their actions. Whether I (or you) buy their argument is another story.
But when terrorist groups engage in the kind of pointless slaughter, mutilation, torture, etc. that we see here, they lose any hope of justifying such actions to the rest of the world. The world (at least rational minds) will unconditionally condemn them and their acts.
Comprehend? In very simple terms, what they did to these civilians precludes any justification argument they might make to the world.
No.
No one ever understands anything like you do.
Terrorists have never had any moral high ground no matter what excuses they give for despicable acts of terror.
Saying terrorists have gone too far is stating the freaking obvious even without the latest atrocities being considered, so it is pointless to say they have gone too far.
Clearly you did not (will not) comprehend what I wrote. And I am confident that no matter how I rephrase, you will continue with your misrepresentation.
There are different levels of terrorism. (Amazing this needs to be explained.) If a terrorist group bombs abandoned government property (no loss of life) to make their point that is terrorism and it is wrong. Now that you have that example, compare it to the other extreme — this case of terrorism where innocent people are targeted and are raped, tortured, murdered, mutilated, etc. Where babies are murdered and beheaded.
Can you comprehend any difference in these extremes? Yes they are both terrorism and yes they are both unacceptable and wrong. Now, what is the difference that you see?
Funny how somehow I am expected to read your words and comment on them until I'm not.
And gee, since clearly I am not intelligent enough to comprehend YOUR words, why not break every word down in your sentence:
Just go right ahead and tell me how I am expected to interpret your exact words, since CLEARLY standard meanings don't apply to YOUR words.
@7.1.1 and @7.1.3
It is okay to interpret one's words differently than intended. Normally, when that happens, one asks for clarification. You just leaped into a nutty misinterpretation.
In response to your misrepresenting my point, I gave an explanation @7.1.1 You ignored it so I gave another @7.1.3
When someone refuses to accept the correction given by an author that almost certainly means they are engaging in intellectually dishonest tactics.
[deleted]
There are different levels of terrorism. (Amazing this needs to be explained.) If a terrorist group bombs abandoned government property (no loss of life) to make their point that is terrorism and it is wrong. Now that you have that example, compare it to the other extreme — this case of terrorism where innocent people are targeted and are raped, tortured, murdered, mutilated, etc. Where babies are murdered and beheaded.
Can you comprehend any difference in these extremes? Yes they are both terrorism and yes they are both unacceptable and wrong. Now, what is the difference that you see?
I condemn all terrorism and am intensely disinterested in debating whether some terrorism should be viewed as somehow more favorable or acceptable.
I hope that is plenty CLEAR enough.
And for God's sake, please stop asking me if I comprehend stuff as though you are addressing a 10 year old. It is very annoying and condescending.
I condemn all terrorism. But I recognize that terrorism varies in tactics, intentions and brutality. You are insisting that there can be no difference in terrorism so that you can continue your misrepresentation of my post.
You refuse to answer my question which illustrates differences in acts of terror and how some could be argued as justified with some people buying it while others (like that of this seed) have no possible argument for justification.
Given I have provided a clear explanation of my meaning and even offered, by example, a way for you to comprehend what I am saying, and you still blindly continue with your dishonest misrepresentation of my post, there is no doubt that you are pushing an intellectually dishonest tactic.
What exactly do you think is the moral standing Hamas had before it's latest atrocious acts of terrorism?
You should quote me making that argument. Purely to prove intellectual honesty.
What moral standing do you think Hamas had before it's latest atrocious acts of terrorism?
One can measure this by determining how many rational, humane individuals would claim that Hamas, prior to this act of terrorism, was right in some way; had moral ground to stand on. That is, how many would say that their struggle has some justification.
My point is that what they just did removes any justification for Hamas. That they have no moral ground to stand on per the view of any rational, humane individual. They have illustrated to the world that nobody should be suggesting they are right in any way.
My post condemned Hamas in the strongest possible language. It distinguished this act of terror as the pinnacle of terrorism.
Note how I ended it:
Your words indicate you thought they had some moral high ground and then lost it because of the latest act.
Why do I think that, you may ask?
Dumb old me thinks that you can only lose something you actually had to begin with.
If you don't think they had any moral standing before these acts, then your choice of words was very poor, and I suggest you choose more carefully in the future.
[Deleted]
What moral standing do you think Hamas had to lose?
@7.1.13
See Texan, you either comprehend what I have written and are playing a dishonest game or you cannot comprehend in spite of the abundance of clarity I have provided.
Which is it?
If you don't want to answer what moral standing Hamas had that led you to believe they lost it, its okay, I understand.
Either you comprehend the question and want to answer or you don't.
I see what your choice was.
You refuse to comprehend my posts. You refuse to recognize that I answered your question. I suggest you cease the charade.
I understood every word and you have NEVER answered what moral standing you think Hamas had to lose.
Intellectual dishonesty indeed.
I have never stated that I personally supported HAMAS or personally bought their moral justifications.
I told you that my comment was regarding those who DID (and DO) hold that HAMAS had a moral standing. You know, individuals who buy the Holy Land claims, etc.
It is intellectually dishonest for you, given that I have thoroughly answered your questions and gave several very clear explanations of my point, to continue pretending that I have been anything less than forthright.
So, in short, you asking what moral standing I held for HAMAS totally missed the point I made. At this point, it is clearly your intention to repeatedly do just that.
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Unfortunately its not only terrorists:
facebook.com/reel/181384911607515
When you write posts like this, it makes it seem like you were okay with a known terrorist organization until they went "too far".
I am not okay with any form of terrorism. Your reading between the lines absolutely sucks.
Well, it was your very own words I read.
You stated very specifically:
Which leads a reasonable person to think if they only hadn't gone so far, you would have been just fine with the terrorists.
If you meant something else, you can always clarify your comment.
I did clarify my comment @7.1.1 and @7.1.3. You are ignoring it to repeat your spin. Intellectual dishonesty.
Oh, God, that tired old "intellectual dishonesty" crap AGAIN???????
Don't do it and nobody will call you out on it.
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Good idea but I wonder. How can we expect other countries to oppose them when there are so many of our Americans supporting them? MassiVe street demonstrations chanting:
PALESTINE SHALL BE FREE
FROM THE RIVER TO THE SEA!
(Heck. I've even seen a few nutso Americans-- real haters-- attempt to defend this barbarism online! So how can we expect other nations to take action?)
At this point, there should be no support from any rational,humane individual on the planet.
I realize that is idealistic, but I have a difficult time imagining an act of terrorism worse than this (as reported) other than increasing the volume of murders.
What kind of mind would hold that this is even remotely justifiable?
Exactly, many our our best educated university students have analyzed this and concluded that Hamas is a righteous, brave liberation force.
All that proves is there are plenty of dumb asses with college degrees.
Hopefully the courts will allow tax payers to pay for their substandard education.
People supporting Hamas and other radical Islamic terrorists continue to make the mistake of trying to call them "freedom fighters", which they most certainly are not. They are unable to make the distinction that said freedom fighters only attack military and not civilian targets, while terrorists repeatedly attack civilian targets exclusively. Safe to say Hamas and their ilk have repeatedly proved they are not freedom fighters.
Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose
Nothin' ain't worth nothin' but it's free
Feeling good was easy, Mohamed , when Yousef killed the Jews
Feeling good was good enough for me
I've seen that. And some of the sneakier ones refer to them as "militants".
They are terrorists, period. Freedom Fighters, Militants is sugar coating the terrorists they are.
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