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Extreme Partisanship Is Pushing America Toward a Cliff | Opinion

  
Via:  Ender  •  2 years ago  •  82 comments

By:   Omar Baddar

Extreme Partisanship Is Pushing America Toward a Cliff | Opinion
Americans across the board believe in fairness and due process, which is precisely why it's critical to maintain the independence of our judicial system.

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S E E D E D   C O N T E N T



If you're living in America today, it's hard not to notice the extent to which partisan polarization has made our politics dysfunctional. The latest and arguably most egregious iteration of this polarization is the way the Republican establishment and the right more broadly has lined up to shield Donald Trump from accountability for his assault on American democracy, for absolutely no reason other than that the former president ran on the GOP ticket. But if you take an honest look at the genesis of extreme partisanship—or perhaps partisan extremism—you'll notice that it has been years in the making, and that it is neither a uniquely Trumpian phenomenon, nor has it been one-sided.

Looking back at what has passed for a "scandal" in recent years, there is no shortage of trivial nonsense that was cynically politicized through transparently partisan and purely performative displays of patriotism. There was the Republican meltdown over President Obama's coffee salute, as well as the Dems' outrage over Kellyanne Conway's feet on the Oval Office couch, and the endless adversarial Fox News commentary on President Biden getting ice cream while president.

This isn't just about the cynical opportunism of our political class; it's also a manifestation of the mindless competition over ratings, which turned our news media into sensationalized entertainment instead of giving the public the news we need to be an informed citizenry, a degeneration that's then amplified by exploitative social media environments that rewards toxic and divisive rhetoric.

This constant state of manufactured partisan outrage isn't harmless. It seeps into the minds of Americans and impacts how we deal with issues that actually matter—like a once in a lifetime pandemic. Such an event should bring a nation together. You would expect people to be able in such extreme, life-threatening circumstances to set aside political differences and stand together as Americans.

Sadly, this did not happen. Even an infectious disease that brought the entire country to a halt couldn't shake us out of our hyper-partisan condition. Something as apolitical as science became politicized, causing Republicans to consistently underestimate COVID's risks, while Democrats overestimated them.

During the height of the Delta variant, a friend who works on Capitol Hill noted that you could easily tell Republican and Democratic congressional staffers apart by whether they wore a mask or not.

Could anyone have imagined that we would become so devoted to our ideological or party affiliation that we would effectively determine our personal disease precautions based on them?

We have reached a point where we no longer have genuine political disagreements that occasionally spill into partisan fighting; we now have partisan fighting as the lens through which we force every social, economic and political issue under the sun to use as a cudgel against the other team.

And it gets worse when you talk about trust in American democracy itself. The careless way Russia's real meddling in the U.S. election back in 2016 was talked about in many media outlets led a majority of Democrats to wrongly believe that Russia tampered with the voting machines to fraudulently install Trump as president. Meanwhile, the overwhelming majority of Republicans believe the lie that the presidency was stolen by Joe Biden from Donald Trump through election fraud, despite there not being a shred of evidence for this claim.

Worse yet, the lie was instigated and promoted by the former president himself, with deadly consequences, as his passionate and misinformed supporters violently attacked their own government on January 6, 2021.

The alarm bells about the perilous state of our democracy couldn't ring any louder, and yet we have a political and media establishment that has no qualms about proceeding down the same divisive path.

So here we are, trying to hold on to what little function remains in our democratic system by seeking accountability for that historic attack on the Capitol, and for a former president who clearly feels precisely zero sense of responsibility for the country he still wants to lead. But instead of responding to news of a criminal investigation into the former President's conduct with the seriousness and gravity it deserves, Fox News personalities immediately turn to glib partisan deflections, with one host going as far as to suggest that the FBI was probably planting evidence to frame Donald Trump, fueling calls for violence.

Is it a surprise then that, later the same week, a man connected to the Jan. 6 assault on the Capitol would attack an FBI building with an AR-15 and get himself killed in the process?

It is worth noting that many of the same people demonizing the FBI over its Trump investigation position themselves as "pro-law enforcement" in the context of liberal demands for police accountability over racial discrimination, which reveals quite a bit about the partisan motivations of so much of our political commentary.

Worse yet, the partisan divide itself as a recognizable obstacle to progress in America is being exploited to protect the worst offenders dividing America today. Some commentators go as far as to suggest that holding Trump accountable for his assault on American democracy reflects a partisan weaponization of law enforcement, as if the bipartisan and unifying course forward is to allow the Divider-in-Chief, who brought the country to the brink, to be above the law. But the flaw in that logic is self-evident: If attempting to overturn a democratic election through fraud and incitement is to be free of any consequences, then who's to stop the next attempt?

We are a country that no longer has a shared view of reality itself, including science and election results, and where half the population sees a civil war on the horizon.

If our media and political leaders fail to end their complicity in polarization that's pushing us to the cliff, then we have to do this work ourselves from the bottom up.

If you manage to set the hyper-partisan goggles shoved in our faces aside for a minute, you'll notice that we are actually united by a lot more than what divides us. And it's not just those overly broad features of our common humanity, like our desire for a better and more prosperous life for ourselves and our children that bring us together; it's concrete political issues that are not owned by either political faction or party. Americans across the political spectrum believe in the importance of free speech and in the necessity of getting big money out of politics so that our political representatives serve the public good instead of serving special interests.

Americans across the board believe in fairness and due process, which is precisely why it's critical to maintain the independence of our judicial system and of law enforcement, and allow them to put law and accountability above politics.

It's also why we must build the credibility of our institutions and protect the integrity of our elections, to ensure that Americans can trust their outcomes.

This is the work we must demand from our representatives and the investments we have to make if we are serious about protecting our democracy, and creating a better future for our children and a more united America for generations to come.


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Ender
Professor Principal
1  seeder  Ender    2 years ago

And this from Newsweek of all places...

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
1.1  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Ender @1    2 years ago
And this from Newsweek of all places..

Does that mean that you usually agree with Newsweek but not this time?

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @1.1    2 years ago

I think Newsweek is a partisan rag, thus my statement...

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.1.2  devangelical  replied to  Ender @1.1.1    2 years ago

I thought you were pretty obvious, and it's starting to look pretty obvious as to what I'll probably be doing here this afternoon.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
1.1.3  Jack_TX  replied to  Ender @1.1.1    2 years ago
I think Newsweek is a partisan rag, thus my statement...

What?

AllSidesMediaBiasChart-Version7.jpg

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
1.1.4  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Ender @1.1.1    2 years ago

Thanks, now I get it.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Senior Guide
2  Right Down the Center    2 years ago

As long as politicians and media keep peddling their "the other side is evil" narrative it will be up to the citizens to reject it. If NT is a representation of the general population I don't see that happening anytime soon. The inability to see the failings within their own party is staggering. 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Right Down the Center @2    2 years ago

Group think is a really strange phenomenon to me in politics.

I don't know where else you see that as much.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Senior Guide
2.1.1  Right Down the Center  replied to  Ender @2.1    2 years ago
Group think is a really strange phenomenon to me in politics.

It almost seems like people are afraid to even question a decision within their own party because of the blowback they might receive.  My hope is that the people in the center and with common sense find their voice again and stop allowing themselves to be bullied into compliance or silence.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
2.1.2  TᵢG  replied to  Ender @2.1    2 years ago
I don't know where else you see that as much.

Religion.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
2.1.3  Jack_TX  replied to  Ender @2.1    2 years ago
I don't know where else you see that as much.

Fans of sports teams?

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.1.4  seeder  Ender  replied to  Jack_TX @2.1.3    2 years ago

Nope. I will occasionally watch the Saints play.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
2.1.5  Jack_TX  replied to  Ender @2.1.4    2 years ago
Nope. I will occasionally watch the Saints play.

You've never been to the Iron Bowl then?

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.1.6  seeder  Ender  replied to  Jack_TX @2.1.5    2 years ago

I don't know what that is.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.1.7  seeder  Ender  replied to  Jack_TX @2.1.5    2 years ago

Ok I looked it up.  Haha

My brother went to Auburn. 

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
2.1.8  Trout Giggles  replied to  Jack_TX @2.1.3    2 years ago

Wives of men who like a certain rock band. Whatever he says about it, she repeats it. She probably doesn't even like the band but goes to concerts with him anyway

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.1.9  seeder  Ender  replied to  Trout Giggles @2.1.8    2 years ago

There was a family guy episode about that. Peter was a Kiss fan and she went along with it.

I really need to stop watching cartoons.  Haha

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.1.10  seeder  Ender  replied to  Jack_TX @2.1.5    2 years ago

I did finally get what you are saying...It took me a little bit...

I actually agree. That is why I call people sports fan. 

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
2.1.11  Jack_TX  replied to  Ender @2.1.10    2 years ago
I did finally get what you are saying...It took me a little bit... I actually agree. That is why I call people sports fan. 

We've been building a populace that lacks the intellectual ability to understand the nuances of nearly any subject. The limit of their capability is the familiar practice of identifying with a team and then cheering wildly for them and against their opponents, no matter what. 

Take the student loan thing. 

The reality is that we're transferring debt from a group that is mostly affluent white liberals to the taxpayers at large.  So tens of millions of blue collar workers who couldn't afford college are going to be required to pay for part of somebody's graduate degree in theology or gender studies or medieval literature or whatever.

The other reality is that it's $300billion, and we've certainly blown more money on worse ideas.  

So overall it's a "meh". But one set of morons will describe it as socialism and the other set will describe it as salvation from "an oppressive system", as though affluent white people with graduate degrees are somehow "oppressed".    The primary difference is what color jersey and foam finger they wear to the voting booth.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
2.1.12  JBB  replied to  Jack_TX @2.1.11    2 years ago

Those for whom $10,000 of debt relief in today's money will be life changing are poor working people who lack the earning power to pay. Those who borrowed extravagantly owe hundreds of thousands. The rich will not be affected. In fact, it is doubtful taxes will even be raised.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
2.1.13  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  JBB @2.1.12    2 years ago

How many future students will borrow more student loan money now with the expecting of future forgiveness?  Will universities feel that it is easier to once again raise rates?

I understand that the cost model has grown substantially from the earlier reported estimate of $330 billion.  The latest Penn Wharton Budget estimates $605 billion - $1 trillion over 10 years depending on how the proposed income based repayment program is actually set up and how many people participate.  It sure didn't take long to revise that estimate, it's always best to low ball costs originally. 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.1.14  seeder  Ender  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.13    2 years ago

My position has been community college should be free. Use the money for that. It should be part of the K-12 curriculum. 

Two years at community college then if someone wants more, they pay for it.

I don't know why more people don't use that route anyway. A lot cheaper and gets some credits under their belts.

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
2.1.15  Thomas  replied to  Ender @2.1.14    2 years ago
Two years at community college then if someone wants more, they pay for it.

I don't know why more people don't use that route anyway. A lot cheaper and gets some credits under their belts.

As with everything else, it is not just what you know, but who you know. Which college you attend figures very largely in the opportunities afforded. 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.1.16  seeder  Ender  replied to  Thomas @2.1.15    2 years ago

The wealthy will always have first pick.

Me personally, I wouldn't have any more trust in a lawyer from Harvard than I would some other school.

There are some doctors that may not have gone to ivy league yet are better at their profession than some that have. Etc.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
2.1.17  JBB  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.13    2 years ago

$10,000 is a big help towards a two year practical nursing program at a community college, if the student lives at home. But, a masters of nursing degree costs upwards of a quarter million dollars at a state university. Of course a MSN makes over $100,000 a year compared to an LPN at $30-$40,000...

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
2.1.18  Thomas  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.13    2 years ago

It is a racket,  an organized way of pulling federally guaranteed money into into companies set up for just that purpose. These companies could care less if the students go into a very large hole. What do they care? They are going to receive their money.  

I feel that the schools are complicit in this also,because, like the loan companies,they get their money. 

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
2.2  TᵢG  replied to  Right Down the Center @2    2 years ago
The inability to see the failings within their own party is staggering. 

I have to wonder if it is more a refusal to acknowledge a wrong.    Seems to me that partisans will argue the absurd and look like utter fools rather than acknowledge that their party might be wrong on an issue.

When a position is blatantly wrong, those who argue in defense know it is wrong but defending the party at all costs is the overriding force.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.2.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  TᵢG @2.2    2 years ago

How does anything ever change when people don't even want to listen to policy. Just yell and scream about wedge issues.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Senior Guide
2.2.2  Right Down the Center  replied to  TᵢG @2.2    2 years ago
When a position is blatantly wrong, those who argue in defense know it is wrong but defending the party at all costs is the overriding force.

Rationalization is a powerful thing and can often muddy reality.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
2.2.3  JBB  replied to  TᵢG @2.2    2 years ago

As if there was still a left, a right and a center.

In the Bizzaro World of current day American politics you and I and AOC and Liz Cheney are in one camp. Anyone not all in for Trump is now an enemy to the gop. Lifelong rock solid old school Republicans like James Comey, Robert. Mueller, Rod Rosenstein, Andrew McCabe, Christopher Wrey and Merrick Garland are drumbed out of the Republican Party as turncoats and traitors. Ronald Reagan proposed a welcoming Big Tent. El Trumpo's much more exclusive sideshow tent is more of Trumpo's Freak Show. Welcome to Bizzaro World.

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Junior Quiet
2.2.4  afrayedknot  replied to  TᵢG @2.2    2 years ago

“Seems to me that partisans will argue the absurd…”

Indeed. And ‘welcome my friend, to the show that never ends…”

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
2.2.5  Jack_TX  replied to  Ender @2.2.1    2 years ago
How does anything ever change when people don't even want to listen to policy. Just yell and scream about wedge issues.

Keep in mind that the wedge issues are the big vote winners.  Our elected representatives have massive incentive to keep them front and center.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
2.2.6  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  JBB @2.2.3    2 years ago

I knew sooner or later we would agree on something.

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
2.2.7  Thomas  replied to  afrayedknot @2.2.4    2 years ago

Emerson Lake and Palmer, Brain Salad Surgery I think was the album... the song: Karn-evil #9

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.2.8  seeder  Ender  replied to  Right Down the Center @2.2.2    2 years ago
Rationalization is a powerful thing and can often muddy reality.

I would honestly say I have been guilty of it myself.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Senior Guide
2.2.9  Right Down the Center  replied to  Ender @2.2.8    2 years ago

We all are. Some people really don't believe it of themselves but see it in everyone else.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
2.2.10  TᵢG  replied to  Thomas @2.2.7    2 years ago

Now that is endurance!   I never saw that solo before.

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Junior Quiet
2.4  afrayedknot  replied to  Right Down the Center @2    2 years ago

“The inability to see the failings within their own party is staggering.”

The very definition of the sword cutting both ways, dull as it is. 

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
2.5  Nerm_L  replied to  Right Down the Center @2    2 years ago
As long as politicians and media keep peddling their "the other side is evil" narrative it will be up to the citizens to reject it. If NT is a representation of the general population I don't see that happening anytime soon. The inability to see the failings within their own party is staggering. 

Not to worry.  Autocrats are busy defending democracy.  The political parties are only a sideshow that keeps the public entertained.  Representative government has actually become irrelevant.  Technocrats are in charge now.

Isn't it amazing that so much effort invested in politics accomplishes so very little?  And we're supposed to believe that's an accidental consequence of partisanship?

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
3  Ronin2    2 years ago
Is it a surprise then that, later the same week, a man connected to the Jan. 6 assault on the Capitol would attack an FBI building with an AR-15 and get himself killed in the process?

At least the author could get his facts straight.

The man who fired a nail gun into an FBI field office in Cincinnati on Thursday before he was killed by officers was at the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, officials said.

Two officials familiar with the matter identified the suspect as Ricky Walter Shiffer.

Officers fatally shot the suspect after failing to negotiate with him, an Ohio State Highway Patrol spokesman, Lt. Nathan Dennis, told reporters.

The man raised a gun and officers opened fire, Dennis said.

It wasn't clear whether he fired, Dennis said, nor was it clear who fired the fatal shot. The man was pronounced dead at the scene, which Dennis described as a rural area off Interstate 71.

No officers were injured, and a motive is still under investigation, Dennis said.

The two officials said Shiffer appeared to have posted in recent days about his desire to kill FBI agents after former President Donald Trump's Mar-a-Lago residence was searched .

Earlier, two law enforcement sources said a man armed with an AR-15-style rifle got inside the FBI building and fired a nail gun toward personnel before he fled in a car.

FBI Cincinnati said in a statement that an armed subject had tried to breach the building's visitor screening facility at 9:15 a.m. The breach triggered an alarm, and the person fled onto the interstate, the statement said.

Authorities closed the highway in both directions because of the standoff, the emergency management agency in Clinton County said.

Dennis said that just before 10 a.m., the suspect exited the highway, got out of his car — a white Crown Victoria — and opened fire on officers.

He didn't attack the FBI with an AR-15. He fired a nail gun at them. Secondly, while he may have fired a gun at officers that pursued; and raised a gun during the stand off. It doesn't specifically state it was an AR-15. Could have been the nail gun again. It just isn't quite as scary and disturbing if a lunatic with a nail gun tries to shoot up a FBI building, and fires at officers with it. Blaming a mentally disturbed individual on Fox News just doesn't have the same gravitas.

It is worth noting that many of the same people demonizing the FBI over its Trump investigation position themselves as "pro-law enforcement" in the context of liberal demands for police accountability over racial discrimination, which reveals quite a bit about the partisan motivations of so much of our political commentary.

Flip this the hell around. It is worth noting that the same leftists and Democrats that demonized law enforcement and wanted to "defund police"; suddenly got wood for law enforcement once Trump, anyone that supported him, and the Jan 6th rioters. They wanted everyone charged and thrown in prison; when the vast majority of BLM/Antifa rioters have been released w/o charges for doing far worse. But the author doesn't consider this "divisive" by omission.

As for most on the right they are still pro law enforcement. Just not pro Garland, and the heads of the FBI and DOJ. Why should they be when a two tier justice system has been implemented? The FBI lied on FISA warrants to spy on the Trump campaign that instigated the whole Russian collusion false narrative. The author also fails to mention the Hunter Biden hard drives; and the FBI efforts in covering the information up.

https://www.heritage.org/crime-and-justice/commentary/igs-report-reveals-4-spurious-allegations-basis-fbi-spying-trump 

[ deleted ]

Worse yet, the partisan divide itself as a recognizable obstacle to progress in America is being exploited to protect the worst offenders dividing America today. Some commentators go as far as to suggest that holding Trump accountable for his assault on American democracy reflects a partisan weaponization of law enforcement, as if the bipartisan and unifying course forward is to allow the Divider-in-Chief, who brought the country to the brink, to be above the law. But the flaw in that logic is self-evident: If attempting to overturn a democratic election through fraud and incitement is to be free of any consequences, then who's to stop the next attempt?

Seems the author forgot Hillary's and the Democrat's efforts to get the electors to vote for her instead of Trump. To overturn the election. That Democrats openly stated they were going to remove Trump from office before he even took the oath. 

Donald Trump isn’t even the Republican nominee yet. But his incendiary rhetoric, most notably about killing the families of terrorists and bringing back torture, has critics on the right and the left discussing the most extreme of countermeasures at an unusually early point in the race.

“Impeachment” is already on the lips of pundits, newspaper editorials, constitutional scholars, and even a few members of Congress. From the right, Washington attorney Bruce Fein puts the odds at 50/50 that a President Trump commits impeachable offenses as president. Liberal Florida Rep. Alan Grayson says Trump’s insistence on building a wall at the U.S.-Mexico border, if concrete was poured despite Congress’s opposition, could lead down a path toward impeachment. Even the mainstream Republican head of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce recently tossed out the I-word when discussing the civilian backlash if Trump’s trade war with China led to higher prices on everyday items sold at WalMart and Target. On his radio show last month, Rush Limbaugh even put a very brisk timeline on it: “They’ll be talking impeachment on day two, after the first Trump executive order,” he said.

It’s not unusual for controversial presidents to be shadowed by talk of impeachment, once they’ve been in office long enough to make people mad. But before he’s elected? Before he’s a nominee?

Then the author finally makes a real comment.

If you manage to set the hyper-partisan goggles shoved in our faces aside for a minute, you'll notice that we are actually united by a lot more than what divides us. And it's not just those overly broad features of our common humanity, like our desire for a better and more prosperous life for ourselves and our children that bring us together; it's concrete political issues that are not owned by either political faction or party. Americans across the political spectrum believe in the importance of free speech and in the necessity of getting big money out of politics so that our political representatives serve the public good instead of serving special interests.

Americans across the board believe in fairness and due process, which is precisely why it's critical to maintain the independence of our judicial system and of law enforcement, and allow them to put law and accountability above politics.

It's also why we must build the credibility of our institutions and protect the integrity of our elections, to ensure that Americans can trust their outcomes.

This is the work we must demand from our representatives and the investments we have to make if we are serious about protecting our democracy, and creating a better future for our children and a more united America for generations to come.

But this is after he spends the entire article trying to show it is the right to blame more than the left for the divide. Message received; and ignored. Obviously until some can admit that the Democrats and left are every bit as bad as Republicans the divide will only deepen. We do not have nearly as much in common as the author thinks. 

 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Ronin2 @3    2 years ago

Strike a nerve?

Seems you completely ignored every thing he tried to say.

 
 
 
cjcold
Professor Quiet
3.1.1  cjcold  replied to  Ender @3.1    2 years ago

Since most of that rant comes from the far-right wing propaganda outlet the Heritage Foundation, consider the source. 

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
3.2  Thomas  replied to  Ronin2 @3    2 years ago

You could have just said "But what about..." and,"UH-uhhh" and you would have achieved the same amount of credibility commenting on an article that says we need to find points of commonality rather than continuously shit can the "others".

Irony, the great leveler.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Quiet
3.3  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Ronin2 @3    2 years ago
He fired a nail gun at them. Secondly, while he may have fired a gun at officers that pursued; and raised a gun during the stand off. It doesn't specifically state it was an AR-15.

"two law enforcement sources said a man armed with an AR-15-style rifle got inside the FBI building and fired a nail gun toward personnel before he fled in a car."

Seems that's just parsing hairs between "attack an FBI building with an AR-15" and "an AR-15-style rifle got inside the FBI building".

As for most on the right they are still pro law enforcement. Just not pro Garland, and the heads of the FBI and DOJ.

What a perfect example of mind numbingly insane partisanship.

Why should they be when a two tier justice system has been implemented? The FBI lied on FISA warrants to spy on the Trump campaign that instigated the whole Russian collusion false narrative.

Just more whiny piss ant partisanship that refuses to acknowledge the facts which are that the warrants were based on far more evidence than just the Steele dossier and that the Republican led Senate investigation concluded that the investigation was warranted, there were dozens of connections between Trump campaign staffers and the campaign manager and Russian agents found that "represented a grave counterintelligence threat". Just because they didn't find conclusive evidence of criminal conspiracy doesn't mean the investigation shouldn't have happened. What they did find is chilling to any true patriot.

Seems the author forgot Hillary's and the Democrat's efforts to get the electors to vote for her instead of Trump.

Perhaps you should read your own links. No where does it say Hillary was trying to get electors to change their votes (because she conceded and did not attempt to have any elector change their votes unlike dirty Donald) and the small group of Democrats who were suggesting such a thing at that time, as the article you linked states, " the group is also contemplating encouraging Democratic electors to oppose Hillary Clinton and partner with Republicans in support of a consensus pick like Mitt Romney or John Kasich."

Also, that was not an attempt to send 'false' or 'fake' electors as Trump and his criminal cabal were attempting to do, they were petitions to get State electors to base their vote on the popular vote as 15 States have already agreed to do which is not illegal and is each States right to decide. Trying to equate that to Trump and his sycophants attempted insurrection is laughable.

But this is after he spends the entire article trying to show it is the right to blame more than the left for the divide.

Any rational examination of the facts would come to the same conclusion. The divide is because those on the right refuse to accept the same set of facts and reality because they live in an alternate conservative universe where their Cheeto Benito won the 2020 election and the January 6th attack was just a peaceful tour of the capital and climate change is a hoax and the dozens of proven connections between the Trump campaign and Russian agents were all a hoax and there is some fantasy 'deep state' loyal to liberals that is running the county from the shadows and Democrats are "a bunch of Satan-worshiping pedophiles,".

If right wing conservative believe such lies, believe all other news sources are 'fake news' other than their extremely biased right wing media which give them 'alternative facts', it will be impossible to reconcile the divide. Until right wing conservatives decide to come back and join the majority of Americans who accept basic facts like Trump lost the 2020 election and that Trump supporters did in fact attack the capital with the intent of stopping the certification of the election, I can't imagine there to be any reconciliation.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.3.1  devangelical  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.3    2 years ago

seems as though there's always some technicality that can justify or nullify illegal activities for some...

personally, I hope it was a head shot by LE that took out that J6 maga clown.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.3.2  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @3.3.1    2 years ago

He's got CDS and HBDS something fierce.

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
4  Thomas    2 years ago
If our media and political leaders fail to end their complicity in polarization that's pushing us to the cliff, then we have to do this work ourselves from the bottom up.

If you manage to set the hyper-partisan goggles shoved in our faces aside for a minute, you'll notice that we are actually united by a lot more than what divides us. And it's not just those overly broad features of our common humanity, like our desire for a better and more prosperous life for ourselves and our children that bring us together; it's concrete political issues that are not owned by either political faction or party. Americans across the political spectrum believe in the importance of free speech and in the necessity of getting big money out of politics so that our political representatives serve the public good instead of serving special interests.

Americans across the board believe in fairness and due process, which is precisely why it's critical to maintain the independence of our judicial system and of law enforcement, and allow them to put law and accountability above politics.

It's also why we must build the credibility of our institutions and protect the integrity of our elections, to ensure that Americans can trust their outcomes.

This is the work we must demand from our representatives and the investments we have to make if we are serious about protecting our democracy, and creating a better future for our children and a more united America for generations to come.

From my point of view it is not enough to say these words. We must define what better credibility looks like before we can hope to achieve it. We must reconcile seemingly irreconcilable differences. How do we do this? By finding points of commonality between the disparate sides. The author noted some: Americans across the board believe in fairness and due process ... unfortunately, these look different to different people, so we have to do the legwork of getting to the point where we agree what this looks like. By definition, this means talking to people with whom we do not agree. Talking, having actual, good faith discussions with "the enemy" can be grueling work that may be personally rewarding but it also runs the risk of offending members of both groups, which partially explains why we don't do it more often. 

So, We need to talk.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
5  Sean Treacy    2 years ago

Sallust, in the middle of the Roman civil wars that destroyed the Republic noted "it is this spirit, which has commonly ruined great nations, when one party desires to triumph over another by any and every means and to avenge itself on the vanquished with excessive cruelty", that makes accepting defeat no longer an option. 

The Roman Republic didn't fall because of Caesar's lust for power, or any event in particular. It was a long, drawn out process that took generations of leaders snipping away at the norms that governed Rome for convenience and immediate advantage.  Rules were dispensed  for convenience and seemed innocent at the time. Bend a rule, ignore tradition and the country still stood and it becomes a little easier to do it the next time.  Every precedent used to suppress domestic rivals or maneuver around the traditional legislative process to  achieve a divisive goal was immediately adopted by those it was used against in an ever escalating spiral. The continuing escalation (from retirement, to banishment to execution for political losers)  changes the calculation of politicians going forward, knowing that the cost of losing keeps getting higher. 

Norms no longer mattered, only the veneer of legality.  Every power was exercised to the extreme of legality and beyond.  Right or wrong didn't matter. Just did it help "win" the issue or election  immediately at hand.  

Its depressing to see the similarities between the two Republics. 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
5.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @5    2 years ago

Nice thought out response Sean. Thanks.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
5.2  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Sean Treacy @5    2 years ago

Sean,

I know we often bicker, but this time I think you hit the nail right on the head.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
5.3  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @5    2 years ago

You do know what happened to Roman rulers who were seen as "Trump- like" back in that long ago day, I'm sure. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
5.4  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Sean Treacy @5    2 years ago

Did not think I would ever agree with a comment of yours, but I guess there always has to be an exception to a rule. 

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6  Trout Giggles    2 years ago
Dems' outrage over Kellyanne Conway's feet on the Oval Office couch,

Yeah...that was petty of us.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
6.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Trout Giggles @6    2 years ago

I don't even remember that to be honest.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6.1.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  Ender @6.1    2 years ago

I do. Some folk's here were outraged that she would be that disrespectful to a couch in the Oval Office.

Meh...it's just a couch

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
6.1.2  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.1.1    2 years ago

You know if you are looking for things to get mad about you can always find them. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.3  JohnRussell  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @6.1.2    2 years ago

Do you think that "both sides" are equally responsible for the present state of America? 

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6.1.4  Trout Giggles  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @6.1.2    2 years ago

No kidding. Why do you think I take Lexapro? It's for people with anger issues

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6.1.5  Trout Giggles  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.3    2 years ago

There's some on the left that are looney tunes. They want free stuff.

I really don't like this cancelling student debt business. My daughter managed to pull herself out of student loan debt less than 4 years after she graduated. Wanna know how? She got a degree that got her hired before she even left school. Maybe some college students should think about that before getting useless degrees in philosophy or art history

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.6  JohnRussell  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.1.5    2 years ago

Do you think we would have a better world if no one studied philosophy  or art history?

The nation has done next to nothing to lower the cost of a college education. Most parents want their kids to go to college and get a degree so the kids can have a better life than previous generations. Of course it hasnt worked out quite that way. 

Although no one likes to see someone get for free what they themselves had to pay for, something had to be done. 

Maybe change the laws to let people with too much student debt to declare bankruptcy. 

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
6.1.7  JBB  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.1.5    2 years ago

42% of eligible recipients dropped or flunked out without degrees leaving them with debts they do not have the earning power to repay...

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6.1.8  Trout Giggles  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.6    2 years ago

No, I don't think it would be a better world without philosophers and art historians...we just need fewer of them. These kids pick these worthless degrees to pursue and end up baristas at Starbucks. What the hell did they spend all that money on that fancy education if they only thing they can do is sling coffee?

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6.1.9  Trout Giggles  replied to  JBB @6.1.7    2 years ago

Then I suggest getting a job.

Good Americans repay their debts

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
6.1.10  Jack_TX  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.6    2 years ago
The nation has done next to nothing to lower the cost of a college education.

You're completely correct, we've done everything to increase the cost.

I've put two through college in the last 10 years.  The federal student aid system gives colleges a massive incentive to raise their pricing.

Although no one likes to see someone get for free what they themselves had to pay for, something had to be done. 

Probably a different something would have been better, though. 

We could very easily cap the maximum loan amount as a ratio of the median household income or median wage for that industry, so nobody could borrow $300k for an elementary education degree in the first place.  We could then amortize these loans over the expected career (30 or 40 years) instead of the 10 years we use now.   We'd have smaller loans and more time to pay them off.

I'd also require a minimum passing score on a mandatory personal finance test.

The problem with any of that is that at some point, we have to tell people "no", and politicians don't like to do that. 

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
6.1.11  bugsy  replied to  JBB @6.1.7    2 years ago
dropped or flunked out

No one's fault but their own.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
7  JohnRussell    2 years ago

I found the seeded article neither good or bad, right or wrong, it is more bland than anything else. 

The current rabid dysfunction of politics and the publics perception of it can be reliably traced back to the advent of "conservative media" . Which means the year that Rush Limbaugh went national. Before Limbaugh there were very few of these hyper partisans who were angry with the other party all the time. When other talk show hosts started aping Limbaugh in the mid 90's the ball was already rolling and its been all downhill. 

I'm sorry, but all bs aside, Democrats , or rather liberals, are nowhere near as prone to conspiracy thinking, misinformation, hyper "patriotic" hyperbole, and well, dishonesty , as the Republicans and conservatives are.

Yet, in the name of "getting along" , we are supposed accept that those who espoused racist birtherism have just as much to offer the country as anyone else. Sorry, I cant get there. 

NOW is the time for everyone of good will in this country to unite TO END TRUMPISM, not to say both sides are at fault. Never for one second in 2016 was Donald Trump fit to hold office, never, but to this day we have media that bends over backwards to suggest we all need to "understand" white grievers and Christian nationalists, and make compromises. 

I dont think so. 

 
 
 
GregTx
PhD Guide
7.1  GregTx  replied to  JohnRussell @7    2 years ago

I disagree, I think it can be traced to the dramatically sharp uptick of use and popularity of internet based social media around that same timeframe roughly.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
7.1.1  JohnRussell  replied to  GregTx @7.1    2 years ago

Although Limbaugh used to talk a lot about his computer in the early days, high speed internet did not arrive for most Americans until the early 2000's. Social media, as we know it today , is about 15 years old. The first i phone, which predicated modern social media, arrived in 2007 I believe. 

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
7.1.2  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  JohnRussell @7.1.1    2 years ago

I think that I got off of dial-up and onto a cable around 1999-2000.  I went to Verizon Fios in 2007.

 
 
 
GregTx
PhD Guide
7.1.3  GregTx  replied to  JohnRussell @7.1.1    2 years ago

I'm not saying that Rush Limbaugh didn't have a major effect on the conservative movement. But to think that some 'conservative media' hosts, 'radio jocks', are ultimately the origins of the hyper partisan society we find ourselves in is, well, partisan. Internet social media has been around as long as the internet has, the 1970s. Yes widespread high speed internet is a fairly current thing relatively speaking and as the technology has developed and expanded so has social media usage. It's far easier to berate or dismiss somebody else's opinions anymously over the internet than in a face to face discussion. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
8  Buzz of the Orient    2 years ago

The seed says exactly what has been my opinion for a while, especially noticeable as I kept on quoting the bible and Lincoln, about a house divided against itself cannot stand.  As the divide continues to widen, widening on various issues, even to the extent of dividing neighbours, even dividing families, I shudder to think of the future.  

As I've said before, Scotty, please beam me back to the early 1950s, before the days of personal computers, internet, social media sites, back to the days of Walter Cronkite and Paul Harvey, back to the days when false news was almost non-existent and when it happened it was a universal joke, like "Dewey Defeats Truman". 

So what can America do to escape the present dilemma, to return to unity?  Maybe start a new world war?  America is doing its best to keep the Ukraine one going.  After all, war not only unifies, but for America it is good business otherwise it would not have been continually involved in them for decades.  As much as Pelosi and other American lawmakers have been trying to provoke a new world war, I think the intended enemy is too smart to take the bait. 

 
 

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