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Federal appeals court upholds Texas ban on standard abortion procedure

  
Via:  Gordy327  •  3 years ago  •  67 comments


Federal appeals court upholds Texas ban on standard abortion procedure
 

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S E E D E D   C O N T E N T



A federal appeals court on Wednesday upheld a 2017 Texas law banning an abortion method widely considered to be a standard procedure in second-trimester pregnancies, a decision that could eventually be brought before the Supreme Court. A majority of the judges from the 5th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals  ruled in favor  of Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton (R) and other defendants in the case, defending the law that prohibits certain procedures without first making sure if the fetus is alive.

Supporters of the law, which has never been enforced, refer to the standard abortion practice as a "dismemberment abortion," while it is known medically as dilation and evacuation.

While a three-judge panel of the same appeals court blocked enforcement of the law last year, the judges in Wednesday's majority opinion said that viewing the law, ​​known as SB8 in court records, "through a binary framework-that either D&Es can be done only by live dismemberment or else women cannot receive abortions in the second trimester-is to accept a false dichotomy."

"Instead, the record shows that doctors can safely perform D&Es and comply with SB8 using methods that are already in widespread use," the judges added.

Abortion advocates have argued that dilation and evacuation is one of the safest abortion methods in the second trimester of pregnancy, and that fetuses are not able to feel pain during the pregnancy period specified in the Texas law.

Amy Hagstrom Miller, president of Whole Woman's Health, which is one of the plaintiffs in the case, on Wednesday argued that the Texas ban "is about cutting off abortion access, and nothing else."

"In no other area of medicine would politicians consider preventing doctors from using a standard procedure," she said in a statement. "It should never be a crime for doctors to use their best medical judgment and follow the most current science."

She went on to say, "Texans deserve the best care available, and this law prevents that."

"As the six-week ban is looming, it's even more apparent that these abortion laws are about making abortion completely inaccessible," she added, referring to the new Texas law set to take effect in September that would ban nearly all abortions after a fetal heartbeat is detected, which can occur as early as six weeks after a woman becomes pregnant.

Planned Parenthood President and CEO  Alexis McGill Johnson also condemned Wednesday's appeals court ruling, calling it "a discriminatory attack against people of color, people with low incomes, women, and those in rural communities."

"Bans like these create a world where your ability to control your life depends on who you are and how much money you earn," she added, vowing to work with the other organizations involved in the case to "continue fighting this dangerous ban in every way possible."


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Gordy327
Professor Expert
1  seeder  Gordy327    3 years ago
In no other area of medicine would politicians consider preventing doctors from using a standard procedure," she said in a statement. "It should never be a crime for doctors to use their best medical judgment and follow the most current science."

This is absolutely true. This is a bad decision by the Circuit court.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.1  Tessylo  replied to  Gordy327 @1    3 years ago

When they're not passing voter suppression/restriction laws, I guess it's time to pass laws against women and their choices.  Hmm, where have I heard 'My Body, My Choice' recently??????????????????

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
1.1.1  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  Tessylo @1.1    3 years ago
I guess it's time to pass laws against women and their choices.

The old fall back, right?

Hmm, where have I heard 'My Body, My Choice' recently??????????????????

The old double standard too, right?

 
 
 
TOM PA
Freshman Silent
1.1.2  TOM PA  replied to  Gordy327 @1.1.1    3 years ago

"My body, My Choice."  I've been wondering that myself.  

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
1.1.3  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  TOM PA @1.1.2    3 years ago

I suppose to some, it only applies to certain things.

 
 
 
TOM PA
Freshman Silent
1.1.4  TOM PA  replied to  Gordy327 @1.1.3    3 years ago

I guess the "...Blessings of Liberty to ourselves..." only last so long.  

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
1.1.5  XXJefferson51  replied to  Gordy327 @1.1.1    3 years ago

Nope as said in my article on this topic in a different group there is an alternative procedure.  It’s illegal to dismember a capital offender or a live animal.  No reason to tolerate it being done to a 2nd trimester preborn human baby. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
1.2  XXJefferson51  replied to  Gordy327 @1    3 years ago

Dismemberment is not a standard procedure and is self evidently gruesome.  

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
1.2.1  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  XXJefferson51 @1.2    3 years ago
Dismemberment is not a standard procedure

That statement shows you have no idea what the procedure is, how, when, or why it's performed. Educate yourself first!

and is self evidently gruesome.  

Emotionally based rhetoric.

 It’s illegal to dismember a capital offender or a live animal.  No reason to tolerate it being done to a 2nd trimester preborn human baby. 

A D&C is an established, valid medical procedure. Who are you to say otherwise? You're not a medical doctor nor do you understand why it's done.

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
2  seeder  Gordy327    3 years ago
She went on to say, "Texans deserve the best care available, and this law prevents that."

Apparently, the Texas Legislature doesn't care about that. They also seem quite ignorant as to why a D&C is likely to be performed. The law also flies in the face of established legal allowances for abortion.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
3  CB    3 years ago

2nd Trimester Surgical Abortion: Dilation and Evacuation (D & E)

(Warning: Cartoon and Graphic!)

NOTE: I will start out my discussion of this topic by introducing video taken from the "opposing" pro-abortion perspective first. It appears to me this doctor (above) is arguing for life of the fetus.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
3.1  CB  replied to  CB @3    3 years ago

I think it is CRUCIAL at this point to out that this video above, which does an "okay" job of getting its pro-life point across may be EXAGGERATING the state of the fetus. In that, the animation shows a "alive and kicking" fetus throughout. However, there is are after 2nd Trimester procedure videos on Youtube which evidentially show tissue and physical lengths which are nearly as magnified in this animation.

It is important to understand this. I choose not to publish the aborted tissue here but if you care to see for yourself go to this link:

https: //www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sp-756-aMo 

Do not include the space after "https:" put there to keep the video from showing here.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
4  CB    3 years ago

What It’s Like to Have A Second-Trimester Abortion

Pro-choice perspective.

Notable quotes:

1. 6:36 minutes (in video): "I was not recovering from an abortion, I was recovering from the loss of my child."

2. 10:11 minutes: "All pregnancies are not rainbows and roses. People should think about the real and not just the story about abortion."

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
4.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  CB @4    3 years ago

This video made me cry.

I don't know of anyone who goes into the 2nd or 3rd trimester and then wants to abort just because. There's always a reason behind it. These families wanted their children. They made gut and heart wrenching decision to ensure their children didn't suffer.

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
4.1.1  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  Trout Giggles @4.1    3 years ago
I don't of anyone who goes into the 2nd or 3rd trimester and then wants to abort just because. There's always a reason behind it.

Indeed. When a D&C is performed, it's usually due to a miscarriage which leaves fetal parts still attached behind, which can cause severe bleeding. It's also done in the case of severe fetal abnormality or demise. Even if it were done because a woman chose to have an abortion, it's still performed before or at viability, which is still legal under SCOTUS precedent. There is no rational or legal reason to prohibit the procedure, which itself is also an established and approved medical procedure.

 
 
 
Veronica
Professor Guide
4.1.2  Veronica  replied to  Trout Giggles @4.1    3 years ago

My sister had a pregnancy that resulted in a still born in her 8th month.  When she had the remains studied she found out that there was chromosomal abnormalities and that the fetus had actually died in the 7th month.  This was way back in the early 80s and the fetal monitoring was not as good then. She was devastated.

Ten years later I had a pregnancy and after an ultrasound I was told there was no fetal material in the sac.  I was heartbroken.  I was scheduled for a D&C.  They did an ultrasound before the procedure and found nothing remained in my uterus - the sac was gone.

No one wants to talk about pregnancies that go wrong (pre-eclampsia) and fetuses developing abnormally.  They just want to talk about the "nasty" women that should keep their legs closed.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
4.1.3  Trout Giggles  replied to  Veronica @4.1.2    3 years ago

I've been blessed. Two normal pregnancies and 2 normal children. I would have liked to have had a third but I was already 35 and didn't want to chance it.

My heart goes out to all the women who wanted that pregnancy to end with a child birth and sadly, it did not

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
4.1.4  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  Veronica @4.1.2    3 years ago
They just want to talk about the "nasty" women that should keep their legs closed.

Indeed. They don't even understand or care why a D&C might be necessary. They're too tunnel visioned on "abortion" and that's all they see without comprehending to broader circumstances or ramifications. I'm sure there are certain individuals here on NT who are just like that too. My condolences to you and your sister Veronica.

 
 
 
Veronica
Professor Guide
4.1.5  Veronica  replied to  Trout Giggles @4.1.3    3 years ago

I was very lucky.  I had already had my daughter - although she was born 6 weeks early due to my preeclampsia.  Which is why with my second pregnancy I had so many tests & ultrasounds.  After my spontaneous abortion I waited the 6 weeks and began trying again.  This time I got my son who decided to stay in an extra 10 days to put on a few more pounds.  He came out at 10.5...

I feel for women that try and try to carry a pregnancy to term, but it just doesn't happen.  I also feel for the women that are facing unwanted pregnancies (for whatever their PRIVATE reasons) that are made to feel that they should be a brood mare for other women.  

 
 
 
Veronica
Professor Guide
4.1.6  Veronica  replied to  Gordy327 @4.1.4    3 years ago
I'm sure there are certain individuals here on NT who are just like that too

I can name 2 right off the top of my head (but I won't) and also one that is no longer here that told me that my daughter should carry a pregnancy to term even if could kill her because the "baby" is innocent and my daughter is not.

My condolences to you and your sister Veronica.

Thank you.  Even though decades have passed I still think of what might have been.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
4.1.7  Trout Giggles  replied to  Veronica @4.1.6    3 years ago
ne that is no longer here that told me that my daughter should carry a pregnancy to term even if could kill her because the "baby" is innocent and my daughter is not.

I have a pretty good idea who that was

 
 
 
Veronica
Professor Guide
4.1.8  Veronica  replied to  Trout Giggles @4.1.7    3 years ago

I will say I do not miss him.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
4.1.9  Tessylo  replied to  Veronica @4.1.2    3 years ago

My one sister lost her baby in her 9th month.  I think there were some fetal/chromosomal abnormalities.  She had to give birth to a deceased baby.  How gut/heart wrenching.  

No one makes these decisions lightly - like TG says - they wanted these children.  She wanted this child.  I can imagine how anxious she was when she got pregnant again.  But went on to have three healthy lovely children.  Two of them are now mommas.  One with a beautiful baby girl.  The other with twins, an adorable boy and a lovely girl.  

 
 
 
Veronica
Professor Guide
4.1.10  Veronica  replied to  Tessylo @4.1.9    3 years ago
I can imagine how anxious she was when she got pregnant again.

I know my sister was a wreck when she got pregnant again.  The stress took it's toll on her, but popped out my beautiful niece and another niece 2.5 yrs later. Both of whom have beautiful families.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
4.1.11  CB  replied to  Trout Giggles @4.1    3 years ago

I can understand that, Dear Trout G'.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
4.1.12  Tessylo  replied to  Veronica @4.1.10    3 years ago

jrSmiley_93_smiley_image.jpg

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
4.1.13  CB  replied to  Veronica @4.1.6    3 years ago
I still think of what might have been.

Of course you do (and my spirit walks with you in such times). It is one reason why "wombless" men should tame their aggressive words and actions about this one area of life which eludes us. The abortion itself is not the end to the story! How can it be?

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
4.1.14  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  Veronica @4.1.8    3 years ago

Neither do I.

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
4.1.15  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  Veronica @4.1.6    3 years ago
I can name 2 right off the top of my head (but I won't) and also one that is no longer here

It's ok. We know who you mean. jrSmiley_9_smiley_image.gif

Even though decades have passed I still think of what might have been.

Of course. It's normal to think about what could have been, had thigs gone even a little differently.

I know my sister was a wreck when she got pregnant again.  The stress took it's toll on her, but popped out my beautiful niece and another niece 2.5 yrs later. Both of whom have beautiful families.

A well deserved happy ending.

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
4.2  XXJefferson51  replied to  CB @4    3 years ago
IMG_5969.jpgChurchPOPIMG_5970.jpg
 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
4.2.1  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  XXJefferson51 @4.2    3 years ago

Do not spam my article with your tripe.

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
6  charger 383    3 years ago

If it a choice on vaccine, then it has to be a choice on abortion 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
6.1  CB  replied to  charger 383 @6    3 years ago

Charger, please consider @5.1 and let me know your thoughts. (Smile.)

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
6.1.1  charger 383  replied to  CB @6.1    3 years ago

It seems,  the "My body, My choice" saying and position has now been taken by those opposed to requiring the vaccine.  Before "My body, My choice" was position of those pro choice on abortion.  

It looks like the anti Vaxers are trying to use the position pro choice abortion side was using in stating their case. 

the same argument should apply in both cases.

Personally, I don't understand why people don't want the protection the shot gives  

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
6.1.2  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  charger 383 @6.1.1    3 years ago
Personally, I don't understand why people don't want the protection the shot gives  

Neither do I.

It looks like the anti Vaxers are trying to use the position pro choice abortion side was using in stating their case. 

Probably. But it's really 2 different scenarios.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
6.1.3  CB  replied to  charger 383 @6.1.1    3 years ago

I do not understand either. Especially if fear is not the motivator! Well said, Charger 383!

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
6.2  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  charger 383 @6    3 years ago

While they're not really comparable, there are still choices on both.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
7  Buzz of the Orient    3 years ago

Texas is trying desperately to bring back the middle ages.  Next step will be to legalize the drowning of witches.

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
7.1  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7    3 years ago
Texas is trying desperately to bring back the middle ages

Texas, along with certain other states, certainly seem to be stuck in the Middle Ages sociologically. Attempts to restrict or circumvent abortion rights is an indication of that.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
7.1.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  Gordy327 @7.1    3 years ago

They should invite the Taliban in to give them pointers on how to subjugate women

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
7.1.2  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  Trout Giggles @7.1.1    3 years ago

They don't need any more tips. Trying to restrict abortions is more than enough.

 
 
 
Veronica
Professor Guide
7.2  Veronica  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7    3 years ago
drowning of witches.

Guess I never visit there.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
7.2.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Veronica @7.2    3 years ago

You're right - don't take the chance.  LOL

 
 
 
Veronica
Professor Guide
7.2.2  Veronica  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.2.1    3 years ago

jrSmiley_4_smiley_image.png

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
7.3  seeder  Gordy327  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7    3 years ago
Next step will be to legalize the drowning of witches.

I wouldn't be surprised. I wonder how they would react to a heathen like me? jrSmiley_18_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
8  Buzz of the Orient    3 years ago

Actually I do have fond memories of Texas, but that goes back a long time, to when Anne Richards was governor and even before that.  I watched her speak at a conference I was at.  I think I would have followed her anywhere, even campaigned for her.  I'll never forget the biggest tender steak I was ever able to consume at the Traildust in Dallas (I didn't wear a tie), sleeping over in a trailer in Arlington, buying boots in Sheplers and the most delicious brisket sandwich I ever ate in my life in a little hole-in-the-wall restaurant in Fort Worth. 

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Expert
9  seeder  Gordy327    3 years ago

Since there are some who do not seem to understand what a D&C is or the circumstances when it's performed (and react out of ignorance and/or knee-jerk emotional response, considering the subject matter), here is a little information about it. 

From the Am erican Pregnancy Association

D&C , also known as dilation and curettage, is a surgical procedure often performed after a  first-trimester  miscarriage. In a D&C, dilation refers to opening the cervix; curettage refers to removing the contents of the uterus. Curettage may be performed by scraping the uterine wall with a curette instrument or by a suction curettage (also called vacuum aspiration). The procedure is done to:

  • Remove tissue in the uterus  during or after a miscarriage or abortion or to remove small pieces of placenta after  childbirth . This helps prevent infection or heavy bleeding.
  • Diagnose or treat abnormal uterine bleeding.  A D&C may help diagnose or treat growths such as  fibroids , polyps, hormonal imbalances, or uterine cancer. A sample of uterine tissue is viewed under a microscope to check for abnormal cells.

About 50% of women who miscarry do not undergo a D&C procedure. Women can safely miscarry on their own with few problems in pregnancies that end before 10 weeks. After 10 weeks, the miscarriage is more likely to be incomplete, requiring a D&C procedure. Choosing whether to miscarry naturally (called expectant management) or to have a D&C procedure is often a personal choice that is best decided after talking with your healthcare provider.

From the Mayo Clinic

Dilation and curettage can diagnose or treat a uterine condition.

Your doctor might recommend a type of D&C called endometrial sampling to diagnose a condition if:

  • You have abnormal uterine bleeding
  • You experience bleeding after menopause
  • Your doctor discovers abnormal endometrial cells during a routine test for cervical cancer

To perform the test, your doctor collects a tissue sample from the lining of your uterus (endometrium) and sends the sample to a lab for testing. The test can check for:

  • Endometrial hyperplasia — a precancerous condition in which the uterine lining becomes too thick
  • Uterine polyps
  • Uterine cancer

When performing a therapeutic D&C, your doctor removes the contents from inside your uterus, not just a small tissue sample. Your doctor may do this to:

  • Clear out tissues that remain in the uterus after a miscarriage or abortion to prevent infection or heavy bleeding
  • Remove a molar pregnancy, in which a tumor forms instead of a normal pregnancy
  • Treat excessive bleeding after delivery by clearing out any placenta that remains in the uterus
  • Remove cervical or uterine polyps, which are usually noncancerous (benign)

And from Johns Hopkins Medicine

A D&C may be used as a diagnostic or therapeutic procedure for abnormal bleeding. A D&C may be performed to determine the cause of abnormal or excessive uterine bleeding, to detect cancer, or as part of infertility (inability to become pregnant) investigation.

Causes of abnormal bleeding include the presence of abnormal tissues, such as fibroid tumors (benign tumors that develop in the uterus, also called myomas) polyps, or cancer of the endometrium or uterus. Tissues obtained from the D&C can be examined under a microscope. Abnormal uterine bleeding may also be due a hormone imbalance or disorder (particularly estrogen and progesterone) especially in women approaching menopause or after menopause.

A suction D&C uses suction to remove uterine contents. A suction D&C may be used following a miscarriage to remove the fetus and other tissues if they have not all been naturally passed. Infection or heavy bleeding can occur if these tissues are not completely removed.

Occasionally following childbirth, small pieces of the placenta (afterbirth) remain adhered to the endometrium and are not passed. This can cause bleeding or infection. A D&C may be used to remove these fragments so that the endometrium can heal properly.

Hopefully this will clear up any confusion, misinformation, and/or willful ignorance regarding the D&C procedure. When it comes to such issues, it's better to use facts, reasoning, and critical thinking over bias, ignorance, and emotional reactions!

 
 

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