The support for DEI was still a majority, at least as of Nov of 2024. But the support has shrunk a little from 2023. Why would that be? Could it be the incessant , relentless drumbeat from right wing media and from Trump?
DEI is not affirmative action and is not a mandate, it is a variety of programs designed to promote diversity, equity and inclusion, all of which are attributes of this society that the people ostensibly believe in.
This is a bogeyman that outpaces even the critical race theory hysteria.
. But the support has shrunk a little from 2023. Why would that be?
Because people are slowly learning the reality of what DEI is as opposed to the lies they've been told about it. DEI sounds good to the casual person, especially when it's sold as "non discrimination" or another buzzword like "anti-racist". It takes time to learn the Orwellian tactics of the left. They magically transform blatantly racist acts into "anti-racism". Once people learn about the racism inherent in DEI they object to it.
Look at racial admission in college. Even trying to soft sell it as affirmative action, people understand what it means in practice. It's why about 2/3 of people supported the Court's decision to ban racial discrimination in college admissions.
Exactly. And the practitioners of such cognitive dissonance call themselves brave for pushing the cognitive dissonance rather than rejecting it for what it is.
He would also say "Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men."
He would also tell you that "I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the father except through me."
Things he would not say.
"Sure! Go ahead and use me as an endorsement for the humanistic world you want to force on everyone around you. I mean, your heart's in the right place so that's all that really matters, right?"
DEI practices and quotas are viewed by many as a "handout" versus a "leg up"
Many who champion DEI (Affirmative Action) say that people of color, women, other racial and sexual orientation groups need preferential treatment to catch up, while those who oppose DEI (Affirmative Action) say that a person should not be passed by because they are white or male or straight.
Where is the answer?
Like the answer to all other problems and challenges facing our country - the answer is in the middle, a compromise with both sides giving in on some of their demands.
But neither side wants to give an inch.
SO policies and programs change, start, stop, appear or disappear evry time the power shifts in Washington.
I would absolutely agree with you that they are not the same or equivalent
DEI is viewed by the masses as Affirmative Action on steroids
Whether you agree with them or not is immaterial, they are the ones making the policies right now.
I know how you abhor "bothsiders", but wouldn't some compromise between the two sides be better than "all or nothing" depending on which party is in power.
I’m curious what will happen with infrastructure projects that share federal funding. There are a ton of companies across the country that would not exist were if not for stipulations in these types of contracts requiring a certain percentage of the work be performed by DBEs (Disadvantaged Business Enterprise), women-owned firms, etc. Trump will certainly try to assert his agenda into any infrastructure contract under his watch, so I expect that common stipulation will be removed and these types of firms will die. It’s a business killer like so many other horrible impulses Trump has.
It’s not “a company”, it’s an entire layer of an industry. Doing away with it would force countless employees in countless capacities over the entire country out of important and good paying jobs. Some people are wise enough to know that there are things they simply don’t know enough about to intelligently comment on. The NT right is devoid of those people.
It’s not “a company”, it’s an entire layer of an industry.
An entire layer of industry that exists solely to
Doing away with it would force countless employees in countless capacities over the entire country out of important and good paying jobs.
Contracts are still going to be awarded and workers will still be required to fulfill them. For every business that can' compete fairly, those workers will be absorbed by places that can.
The "layer of industry" we're doing away with is that of the the token owner who enables unfair competition. The idea that job is "important" and "good paying" is the crux of the problem.
Some people are wise enough to know that there are things they simply don’t know enough about to intelligently comment on. The NT right is devoid of those people.
You're imagining I don't have immediate family members involved with this issue daily.
Contracts are still going to be awarded and workers will still be required to fulfill them. For every business that can' compete fairly, those workers will be absorbed by places that can.
They exist on the fringe already. Why would anyone want to force them into unemployment and the intensive process of looking for a new job, particularly when the job market is saturated with newly unemployed people like themselves? Because the cruelty is the point. The right is horrifically cruel. Period.
I think you and I may be talking about two different sets of people. Who do you suggest is "living on the fringe"? Are you familiar with the Davis-Bacon Act?
Why would anyone want to force them into unemployment and the intensive process of looking for a new job, particularly when the job market is saturated with newly unemployed people like themselves?
Describe this "intensive process". Again, I think we're talking about very different groups of people.
Because the cruelty is the point. The right is horrifically cruel. Period.
So thank you for finally getting to the point, which consists entirely of you starting with a deep emotional bias against a group of people and then extrapolating that bias onto anything they suggest without regard to the reasonableness of that conclusion.
The jobs that this tier of the industry performs involves things like construction inspection, safety compliance, and secretarial work. It’s not the more visible engineering design and construction work that 90% of the fees go to. It’s the crumbs that prime contractors are required to delegate to more local firms that could not compete with large international firms. Wiping them out would put their staff in a competitive job market that they will be disadvantaged in. It makes no sense whatsoever, and serves only to destroy American dreams of business ownership. You guys have no idea the amount of backfire you are eventually going to be on the receiving end of.
The jobs that this tier of the industry performs involves things like construction inspection, safety compliance, and secretarial work.
OK. The point still stands that if the only way you can win work is by leveraging racism or gender bias, you shouldn't be winning work.
It’s the crumbs that prime contractors are required to delegate to more local firms that could not compete with large international firms.
Which they'll still have to delegate if the contract stipulates. They just won't have to favor subs based on race or gender.
Wiping them out would put their staff in a competitive job market that they will be disadvantaged in.
Why would they be more disadvantaged than the electricians or plumbers or carpenters that work for those companies? (all of whom will have new jobs within the week, BTW) Unless of course their jobs are part of a significant extra layer of bloat and we could really do all that work with way fewer people.....
MAGA appears to thrive on “fixing” things that are not broke. Nobody in this industry is upset or offended by the system that is in place and works quite well, it’s just the bigots and racists outside the system who know nothing about how it functions that demand it be torn down. You guys are a joke. We are in for another eternal infrastructure week, and in the meantime how many D- bridges will fall down and kill the people that are forced to fund such an inherently and hopelessly dysfunctional system?
MAGA appears to thrive on “fixing” things that are not broke.
Contracts awarded on racism and gender bias constitutes "broke".
Nobody in this industry is upset or offended by the system that is in place and works quite well,
Contractors tend to be pragmatic. They've figured out ways to work around government stupidity for decades. That's not a valid argument for continued government stupidity.
You guys are a joke.
Who do you imagine is "you guys"? I have never voted for Donald Trump. Do you just classify anybody who isn't an enthusiastic leftist as the enemy?
We are in for another eternal infrastructure week, and in the meantime how many D- bridges will fall down and kill the people that are forced to fund such an inherently and hopelessly dysfunctional system?
So.... bridges are going to fall down if we don't award contracts by race and gender....
The worm has finally turned on the progressive lefts DEI industrial complex in US business. Hopefully we gravitate to a more merit based, less divisive DEI.
The support for DEI was still a majority, at least as of Nov of 2024. But the support has shrunk a little from 2023. Why would that be? Could it be the incessant , relentless drumbeat from right wing media and from Trump?
DEI is not affirmative action and is not a mandate, it is a variety of programs designed to promote diversity, equity and inclusion, all of which are attributes of this society that the people ostensibly believe in.
This is a bogeyman that outpaces even the critical race theory hysteria.
Because people are slowly learning the reality of what DEI is as opposed to the lies they've been told about it. DEI sounds good to the casual person, especially when it's sold as "non discrimination" or another buzzword like "anti-racist". It takes time to learn the Orwellian tactics of the left. They magically transform blatantly racist acts into "anti-racism". Once people learn about the racism inherent in DEI they object to it.
Look at racial admission in college. Even trying to soft sell it as affirmative action, people understand what it means in practice. It's why about 2/3 of people supported the Court's decision to ban racial discrimination in college admissions.
Exactly. And the practitioners of such cognitive dissonance call themselves brave for pushing the cognitive dissonance rather than rejecting it for what it is.
What would Jesus say ?
I think he would agree with MLK Jr
Jesus would say treat everyone the same.
Which is absolutely NOT what DEI programs do in the real world.
He would say "Seek first the kingdom of heaven."
He would also say "Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men."
He would also tell you that "I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the father except through me."
Things he would not say.
"Sure! Go ahead and use me as an endorsement for the humanistic world you want to force on everyone around you. I mean, your heart's in the right place so that's all that really matters, right?"
DEI practices and quotas are viewed by many as a "handout" versus a "leg up"
Many who champion DEI (Affirmative Action) say that people of color, women, other racial and sexual orientation groups need preferential treatment to catch up, while those who oppose DEI (Affirmative Action) say that a person should not be passed by because they are white or male or straight.
Where is the answer?
Like the answer to all other problems and challenges facing our country - the answer is in the middle, a compromise with both sides giving in on some of their demands.
But neither side wants to give an inch.
SO policies and programs change, start, stop, appear or disappear evry time the power shifts in Washington.
Does this help anyone? Not really
DEI and affirmative action are neither the same thing nor equivalent.
How are they different?
John
I would absolutely agree with you that they are not the same or equivalent
DEI is viewed by the masses as Affirmative Action on steroids
Whether you agree with them or not is immaterial, they are the ones making the policies right now.
I know how you abhor "bothsiders", but wouldn't some compromise between the two sides be better than "all or nothing" depending on which party is in power.
I’m curious what will happen with infrastructure projects that share federal funding. There are a ton of companies across the country that would not exist were if not for stipulations in these types of contracts requiring a certain percentage of the work be performed by DBEs (Disadvantaged Business Enterprise), women-owned firms, etc. Trump will certainly try to assert his agenda into any infrastructure contract under his watch, so I expect that common stipulation will be removed and these types of firms will die. It’s a business killer like so many other horrible impulses Trump has.
If they can only survive through preferential treatment, they should die.
You guys really love putting people on unemployment and making them dependent upon the state. Interesting.
So.... a company that can't survive without government contracts it can only get by special favoritism is somehow not already dependent on the state?
Interesting.
Many of our friends here have little to no business acumen in such things
It’s not “a company”, it’s an entire layer of an industry. Doing away with it would force countless employees in countless capacities over the entire country out of important and good paying jobs. Some people are wise enough to know that there are things they simply don’t know enough about to intelligently comment on. The NT right is devoid of those people.
An entire layer of industry that exists solely to
Contracts are still going to be awarded and workers will still be required to fulfill them. For every business that can' compete fairly, those workers will be absorbed by places that can.
The "layer of industry" we're doing away with is that of the the token owner who enables unfair competition. The idea that job is "important" and "good paying" is the crux of the problem.
You're imagining I don't have immediate family members involved with this issue daily.
Contracts are still going to be awarded and workers will still be required to fulfill them. For every business that can' compete fairly, those workers will be absorbed by places that can.
They exist on the fringe already. Why would anyone want to force them into unemployment and the intensive process of looking for a new job, particularly when the job market is saturated with newly unemployed people like themselves? Because the cruelty is the point. The right is horrifically cruel. Period.
I think you and I may be talking about two different sets of people. Who do you suggest is "living on the fringe"? Are you familiar with the Davis-Bacon Act?
Describe this "intensive process". Again, I think we're talking about very different groups of people.
So thank you for finally getting to the point, which consists entirely of you starting with a deep emotional bias against a group of people and then extrapolating that bias onto anything they suggest without regard to the reasonableness of that conclusion.
The jobs that this tier of the industry performs involves things like construction inspection, safety compliance, and secretarial work. It’s not the more visible engineering design and construction work that 90% of the fees go to. It’s the crumbs that prime contractors are required to delegate to more local firms that could not compete with large international firms. Wiping them out would put their staff in a competitive job market that they will be disadvantaged in. It makes no sense whatsoever, and serves only to destroy American dreams of business ownership. You guys have no idea the amount of backfire you are eventually going to be on the receiving end of.
Hilarious, a P.E. complaining of job ending regulations....
Omg, what a moronic comment. I don’t even want to hear an explanation for such a stupid thought. This place has gone so downhill.
OK. The point still stands that if the only way you can win work is by leveraging racism or gender bias, you shouldn't be winning work.
Which they'll still have to delegate if the contract stipulates. They just won't have to favor subs based on race or gender.
Why would they be more disadvantaged than the electricians or plumbers or carpenters that work for those companies? (all of whom will have new jobs within the week, BTW) Unless of course their jobs are part of a significant extra layer of bloat and we could really do all that work with way fewer people.....
MAGA appears to thrive on “fixing” things that are not broke. Nobody in this industry is upset or offended by the system that is in place and works quite well, it’s just the bigots and racists outside the system who know nothing about how it functions that demand it be torn down. You guys are a joke. We are in for another eternal infrastructure week, and in the meantime how many D- bridges will fall down and kill the people that are forced to fund such an inherently and hopelessly dysfunctional system?
Contracts awarded on racism and gender bias constitutes "broke".
Contractors tend to be pragmatic. They've figured out ways to work around government stupidity for decades. That's not a valid argument for continued government stupidity.
Who do you imagine is "you guys"? I have never voted for Donald Trump. Do you just classify anybody who isn't an enthusiastic leftist as the enemy?
So.... bridges are going to fall down if we don't award contracts by race and gender....
Do you hear yourself?
So.... bridges are going to fall down if we don't award contracts by race and gender....
That’s a different topic. Sorry that you couldn’t discern that. I’m done with this nowhere conversation.
The worm has finally turned on the progressive lefts DEI industrial complex in US business. Hopefully we gravitate to a more merit based, less divisive DEI.