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Fact Check: Millions more immigrants without legal status live in Texas or Florida than in Minnesota, data shows

  
Via:  Nerm_L  •  9 months ago  •  76 comments

By:   Rae Deng (Snopes via Yahoo News)

Fact Check: Millions more immigrants without legal status live in Texas or Florida than in Minnesota, data shows
While it's difficult to provide an accurate population count, Census data offers a credible estimate.

Sponsored by group News Viners

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The political motivations for ICE operations in Minnesota are glaringly obvious.  Trump is willing to waste untold amounts of taxpayer money just to create chaos and distractions.  Trump has become the poster child for inefficient Big Government.

Minnesota is not the epicenter of illegal immigration in the United States.  Even Hizzoner Greg Abbott would dispute the claim Minnesota has more problems with immigrants than Texas.  So, deploying 3,000 Federal agents to Minnesota was always about politics and never about immigration.  ICE was sent to Minnesota to feed red meat to Trump Republicans who are too stupid to trust their own eyes.  


S E E D E D   C O N T E N T


Claim:

About 130,000 people without legal immigration status reside in Minnesota, as opposed to 2.1 million in Texas and 1.6 million in Florida.

Rating:

Rating: Mostly True

Context:

The numbers were accurate according to credible population estimates, but they reflected conditions in 2023. That was the most recent data available as of this writing. Furthermore, any statistics attempting to depict the number of people living in the country illegally are estimations; they are likely undercounts due to people not reporting their situations truthfully or at all.

As the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS) enacted a widespread immigration enforcement crackdown in Minnesota in late 2025 and early 2026, social media users circulated statistics allegedly indicating that relatively few immigrants without legal status lived in the Democratic state — as opposed to Republican states like Texas and Florida.

Posts online claimed 130,000 people without legal immigration status lived in Minnesota, whereas 2.1 million resided in Texas and 1.6 or 1.2 million in Florida. These statistics, which Snopes readers also asked us to verify, spread on X, Facebook, Reddit and Threads.

Some social media users emphasized that Texas and Florida historically vote Republican in presidential elections, as opposed to Minnesota, which leans Democratic, appearing to imply that President Donald Trump's Republican administration was targeting political opponents with immigration enforcement.

Exact totals for the number of people who live in the U.S. illegally are nearly impossible to obtain. The population has major incentives to not answer questions about their situation truthfully or at all. Demographers rely on the U.S. Census Bureau's American Community Survey (ACS), a survey of residents, for the best possible estimations.

The tallies in the social media posts (2.1 million people in Texas, 1.6 million in Florida and 130,000 in Minnesota) came from 2023 data released in 2025 by the nonpartisan Pew Research Center, as severalposts accurately noted. Pew haspublished estimates of the "U.S. unauthorized immigrant population" for more than two decades, relying on the ACS to do so. The 2023 totals were the most recent available as of this writing.

In other words, the data came from a reputable source but did not necessarily represent population estimates in 2026. Those numbers would not be available for several years, as they rely on the ACS, which takes time to tabulate. Thus, we have rated this claim mostly true.

By email, Snopes asked DHS for updated and detailed state-by-state population estimates, as well as questions about why it was targeting Minnesota for immigration enforcement in January 2026.

The department did not address those inquiries and responded with a list of people the agency said it has apprehended in Minnesota on suspicion of violent crimes. The agency also sent a link to an X post by Homeland Secretary Kristi Noem that blamed Minnesota Gov. Tim Walz and Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey, both Democrats, for refusing "to protect their own people and instead protect criminals."

Under former President Joe Biden, a Democrat, DHS acknowledged both Pew Research and another nonpartisan research organization, the Center for Migration Studies, as reputable sources for the estimated number of immigrants living the U.S. without legal status, as evidenced in an April 2024 report (see Page 10).

All three sources (DHS, Pew Research and the Center for Migration Studies) use the ACS to calculate estimates. They have similar, but not identical, estimates due to "key differences in methodological details," such as how they adjust for census undercounting, according to Page 10 of DHS' 2024 report. That doesn't mean any of the sources are more accurate than the others — just that each institution uses different techniques to estimate the population size.

Pew Research data


The numbers in the social media posts stemmed from a Pew report that published on Aug. 21, 2025. The report included a table showing "unauthorized immigrants and characteristics for states, 2023."

That table indicated Minnesota's population of immigrants in the country illegally was about 130,000, or 2.2% of the total population; Florida's was 1.6 million people, or 6.9% of the population, and Texas' was 2.05 million people, or 6.6% of the total population.

Pew rounded the population totals, but did not round numbers for the population percentages. In the published report, Pew also rounded its estimate for Texas to 2.1 million, which may explain where the social media posts got that number.

Here's the research center's map showing the estimations:

Map showing unauthorized immigrant population by state in 2023.

(Pew Research Center)

512

Other sources


DHS publishes partial estimates on what it calls the country's "unauthorized immigrant population" by state.

As of this writing, the most recent DHS report was published on April 18, 2024, depicting data between 2018 and 2022. That report includes state-by-state population statistics for only 10 states — places in the country where the most people without legal immigration status reside.

As such, DHS published numbers for Texas and Florida, which ranked No. 2 and No. 3, respectively, but not Minnesota. (The state with the largest population of people in the country illegally is California, according to the report.)

According to DHS' report, in 2022, Texas had an estimated 2.06 million immigrants living in the country illegally and Florida had 590,000 (see Page 5).

Pew's report indicated that Florida's population has had the biggest growth, adding an estimated 700,000 immigrants without legal status between 2021 and 2023, which may explain the discrepancy between DHS' estimate for 2022 (590,000) and Pew's estimate for 2023 (1.6 million).

The other organization DHS mentioned in its report, the Center for Migration Studies, has published a map showing estimates of the populations by state, using data from 2023. That map showed an estimated 104,900 immigrants living in the U.S. illegally in Minnesota, 1.025 million in Florida and a little over 2.05 million in Texas.

Sources:


Baker, Bryan, and Robert Warren. Population Estimates . Office of Homeland Security Statistics, Department of Homeland Security, Apr. 2024, ohss.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/2024-06/2024_0418_ohss_estimates-of-the-unauthorized-immigrant-population-residing-in-the-united-states-january-2018%25E2%2580%2593january-2022.pdf.

Center for Migration Studies. "State and National Data Tool." Cmsny.org , data.cmsny.org/.

Feinstein, Jonathan S., and Edward H. Kaplan. "Why Hidden Populations Are so Hard to Count." Yale Insights , 13 Dec. 2018, insights.som.yale.edu/insights/why-hidden-populations-are-so-hard-to-count.

Passel, Jeffrey S., and Jens Manuel Krogstad. "U.S. Unauthorized Immigrant Population Reached a Record 14 Million in 2023." Pew Research Center , 21 Aug. 2025, www.pewresearch.org/race-and-ethnicity/2025/08/21/u-s-unauthorized-immigrant-population-reached-a-record-14-million-in-2023/.


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Nerm_L
Professor Expert
1  seeder  Nerm_L    9 months ago

Trump chalks up another failure.  Trump Republicans have lost the narrative in Minnesota because they do not understand the heartland.  And their understanding of politics is questionable.

And here's the really strange part.  If removing immigrants improves America then Minnesota will reap benefits that are not being provided Texas.  Trump is cheating his own base out of the rewards of becoming more purely American.  The blue islands will no longer need to contend with shiftless criminal immigrants so the blue islands will become stronger, won't they?  Doesn't that seem a little odd?

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
2  Sean Treacy    9 months ago

How many more have been deported from those states?

 
 
 
George
PhD Expert
2.1  George  replied to  Sean Treacy @2    9 months ago

Look what can happen when local law enforcement cooperates and a bunch of ignorant fucktards don't interfere.

ICE says more than 600 illegal aliens arrested in West Virginia during 2-week surge - WV MetroNews

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
2.2  seeder  Nerm_L  replied to  Sean Treacy @2    9 months ago
How many more have been deported from those states?

Why isn't Trump bragging about deporting immigrants from Texas?  Why isn't the Trump administration telling us that Texas is becoming more purely American?  Doesn't Trump care about Texas?

According to Trump's political rhetoric, the blue islands are reaping the rewards of immigration enforcement.  The blue islands are becoming more purely American.  The blue islands are going to save money, have more jobs, and experience fewer drug problems and less crime because Trump is enforcing immigration law.  Why aren't Trump Republicans jealous of what Trump is giving blue islands instead of his base of support?

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
2.2.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  Nerm_L @2.2    9 months ago

Why isn't Trump bragging about deporting immigrants from Texas

i have no idea if he is or isn’t.  Who cares? What possible relevance does that have?

the blue islands are reaping the rewards of immigration enforcement

they are deporting people from Texas. Rents are going down in Miami because so many illegals have been deported (not that affordable housing matters to progressives).

those states aren’t trying to keep child predators in the country and Simply deport them. Blue islands are fighting to protect child predators and other criminals, thus the protests.  It’s not difficult to understand 

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
2.2.2  seeder  Nerm_L  replied to  Sean Treacy @2.2.1    9 months ago
those states aren’t trying to keep child predators in the country and Simply deport them. Blue islands are fighting to protect child predators and other criminals, thus the protests.  It’s not difficult to understand 

So, Trump's deployment of 3,000+ Federal agents to Minnesota has been a failure?  How can it be a success if Minnesota is protecting the 'worst of the worst'?

Minnesota has proven, with real evidence, that the state does cooperate with ICE and CBP.  Minnesota has shown that the overwhelming majority of ICE arrests for the 'worst of the worst' take place in prisons and jails, not on the street.  Trump Republican lies are not a substitute for the truth everyone can see with their own eyes.  

What's the cost of deporting a Minnesota illegal immigrant to the cost of deporting an Texas illegal immigrant?  Which one provides a bigger bang for the taxpayer dollar?  Or don't taxpayer dollars matter any longer?

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Participates
2.2.3  Split Personality  replied to  Sean Treacy @2.2.1    9 months ago
What possible relevance does that have?

The purges are politically motivated, period.

It’s not difficult to understand

Apparently it's very easy to misunderstand.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Guide
2.3  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Sean Treacy @2    9 months ago
Trump Republicans have lost the narrative in Minnesota because they do not understand the heartland.  And their understanding of politics is questionable.

There are far more ICE operations happening in Tx and Fl than any other state.  They aren't being reported on because there are do dipshits interfering with these operations like we see in Democrat run Shitholes.

 
 
 
Ozzwald
Professor Quiet
2.3.1  Ozzwald  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @2.3    9 months ago
There are far more ICE operations happening in Tx and Fl than any other state.

You mean that there are far more ICE operations FAILING in Tx and Fl than any other state.  Otherwise they would be held up showing why states that fully cooperate with ICE are so much better.  Maybe republicans should worry about cleaning up their own houses before pointing at others.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Guide
2.3.2  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Ozzwald @2.3.1    9 months ago

Did I say that?  

 
 
 
Ozzwald
Professor Quiet
2.3.3  Ozzwald  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @2.3.2    9 months ago
Did I say that?

Yup.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
2.3.4  Trout Giggles  replied to  Ozzwald @2.3.1    9 months ago
there are far more ICE operations FAILING in Tx and Fl than any other state.  Otherwise they would be held up showing why states that fully cooperate with ICE are so much better. 

That's a very good point. I never thought of it that way

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
3  Hal A. Lujah    9 months ago

I was in Dallas a couple months ago.  It was surprising to see how nonchalant the immigrant labor is there, not even concerned about ICE.  Didn’t matter if it was private property contractors or public roadway projects.  In blue states these are the people afraid to step outside.  

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @3    9 months ago

That's because ICE is concentrated on the Blue states. The red states get to carry on as usual. Red states like their cheap labor

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
3.1.1  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.1    9 months ago

Rules for thee, but not for me.  Gov. Hot Wheels has his blinders on.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
3.1.2  Jack_TX  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.1    9 months ago
That's because ICE is concentrated on the Blue states. The red states get to carry on as usual

I live in Dallas.  Ive had immigration enforcement officers on my own street.

You just don't see us in the news because we don't have people driving down residential streets honking car horns, attacking officers, blocking police cars, or otherwise attempting to obstruct.

I think there is a understanding that local law enforcement will arrest you for that kind of crime, and affluent white ladies don't want to be locked up with the real criminals in the county jail.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.1.3  Trout Giggles  replied to  Jack_TX @3.1.2    9 months ago

was I talking to you?

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
3.1.4  Jack_TX  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.1.3    9 months ago

Don't care.  It's a public forum.

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
3.1.5  bugsy  replied to  Jack_TX @3.1.2    9 months ago

Florida law says that is lunatic leftists are blocking streets and you need to get through, ESPECIALLY if they surround your vehicle, you have the right to barrel through them. if they get hit, it is their fault.

Florida does not play stupid shit with liberals,

 
 
 
Gazoo
Masters Silent
3.1.6  Gazoo  replied to  bugsy @3.1.5    9 months ago

“if they get hit, it is their fault.”

And if enough of the idiots get run over, maybe they’ll stop using the tactic of harassing and inconveniencing people they are trying to sway to their way of thinking.

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
3.1.7  bugsy  replied to  Gazoo @3.1.6    9 months ago

For some reason, we don't see any road blockages here. I wonder what that reason is.

Remember, we are home to "Florida Man"

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
3.1.8  Jack_TX  replied to  bugsy @3.1.5    9 months ago
Florida law says that is lunatic leftists are blocking streets and you need to get through, ESPECIALLY if they surround your vehicle, you have the right to barrel through them. if they get hit, it is their fault. Florida does not play stupid shit with liberals,

Texas does not have a specific statute on that, but we have pretty robust self defense laws. 

Plus, if you're pounding on a car window in Texas, there is a far better than average chance that the driver is armed.  Everybody pretty much knows that, so people behave better.

 
 
 
Bob Nelson
Professor Guide
3.1.9  Bob Nelson  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @3.1.1    9 months ago
Rules for thee, but not for me.  Gov. Hot Wheels has his blinders on.

             jrSmiley_79_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
3.2  Tacos!  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @3    9 months ago

That’s because none of this is about immigration. It’s about intimidating blue states and swing states.

 
 
 
Bob Nelson
Professor Guide
3.2.1  Bob Nelson  replied to  Tacos! @3.2    9 months ago
That’s because none of this is about immigration. It’s about intimidating blue states and swing states.

             jrSmiley_79_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
4  bugsy    9 months ago

Florida has deported over 10,000 illegals with little to no push back from leftist loons.

The only reason why Minnesota is getting the media attention it is because of an idiotic governor and Minneapolis mayor that tells their people to resist ICE any way they can and people are dumb enough to do it. 

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
4.1  seeder  Nerm_L  replied to  bugsy @4    9 months ago
Florida has deported over 10,000 illegals with little to no push back from leftist loons.

That's only because Alligator Alcatraz is located in Florida.  Moving the illegals to Florida before deportation allows making the bogus claim.  We know how Trump's administration lies.

The only reason why Minnesota is getting the media attention it is because of an idiotic governor and Minneapolis mayor that tells their people to resist ICE any way they can and people are dumb enough to do it. 

Yeah, the 3,000+ Spanish speaking Federal agents don't have anything to do with it.  The political rhetoric by Trump, Bondi, Noem, and a number of Washington bureaucrats doesn't have anything to do with it.

How can a bunch of liberal losers and lying Democrats stop an army of Federal agents?  Trump promised to overwhelm, dominate, and subdue the opposition with an army of Federal agents and threats of escalation.  So, what went wrong?  Why didn't Trump's brilliant plan work?

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
4.1.1  bugsy  replied to  Nerm_L @4.1    9 months ago

‘Moving the illegals to Florida before deportation allows making the bogus claim.’
You have no idea if that is true. I can tell from a Florida resident perspective that I have seen far less hispanics in my city than when the dementia president was in office and I live in the largest city area wise in the state. 

‘Yeah, the 3,000+ Spanish speaking Federal agents don't have anything to do with it’

You are right……they don’t

‘How can a bunch of liberal losers and lying Democrats stop an army of Federal agents?

They haven’t and they won’t. ICE will stay in the city/state as long as it is needed. 
The idiotic governor and mayor can keep using their leftist lemmings as targets as they stay behind their guarded homes. They don’t care about the people. They care because they know they are under investigation for fraud and need as much distraction as they can get.

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
4.1.2  seeder  Nerm_L  replied to  bugsy @4.1.1    9 months ago
They haven’t and they won’t. ICE will stay in the city/state as long as it is needed. The idiotic governor and mayor can keep using their leftist lemmings as targets as they stay behind their guarded homes. They don’t care about the people. They care because they know they are under investigation for fraud and need as much distraction as they can get.

So, Trump is maximizing the effort and resources to provide the most benefit to those places with idiot governors and mayors?  And Trump Republicans are applauding these blue islands sucking up most of the taxpayer dollars again?

We can all see with our own eyes that Trump is determined to provide the most benefit to Democratic run cities and states.  You'd think Trump Republicans would want areas controlled by Democrats to carry the burdens and costs of their own progressive proclivities.  But, no, Trump is going to use Big Government to intervene and bail out Democrats again.

With Trump's brilliant leadership, Democrats won't need to leave their basements to be competitive.

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
4.1.3  bugsy  replied to  Nerm_L @4.1.2    9 months ago

This entire post made zero sense based on the subject at hand.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
4.1.4  TᵢG  replied to  bugsy @4.1.3    9 months ago

Hint:  it was sarcasm

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
4.1.5  seeder  Nerm_L  replied to  bugsy @4.1.3    9 months ago
This entire post made zero sense based on the subject at hand.

Why?  You specifically pointed out "They (protesters) haven’t and they won’t. ICE will stay in the city/state as long as it is needed."

What you said reinforces that Trump is expending government resources to benefit Minneapolis and Democrats in Minnesota.  Trump is making Minnesota more purely American (according to his criteria).  The money and resources Trump is expending in Minnesota won't benefit the Trump Republican base in Texas.  Trump attacking Tim Walz won't help Gregg Abbott.  Trump pulling CBP agents away from the border and sending them to Minneapolis doesn't make the border more secure.

Outstate Minnesota (Trump country) will be losing workers and customers (along with population size).  Losing 10,000 immigrants in a city of 5 million won't blip the political needle.  But losing 1,000 immigrants in a county of 50,000 causes more damage and harm (because that's where the jobs for immigrants are located).  

So, what is Trump trying to accomplish?  Has Trump really provided the most bang for the taxpayer buck?  How does that benefit the Trump Republican base?  What does Texas get from the massive deployment of ICE and CBP to Minnesota?

 
 
 
GregTx
Professor Participates
4.1.6  GregTx  replied to  Nerm_L @4.1.5    9 months ago

Roughly 25% of all ICE arrests in Trump's second term have been in Texas. I think we'll be okay...

Thanks for the consideration though.

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
4.1.7  seeder  Nerm_L  replied to  GregTx @4.1.6    9 months ago
Roughly 25% of all ICE arrests in Trump's second term have been in Texas. I think we'll be okay... Thanks for the consideration though.

But that's only through July, 2025.  (Arrests are not the same as deportations.)

DHS is claiming 10,000 immigrant arrests in Minnesota since Jan., 2025.  Texas' population is 5.5 times larger than Minnesota's population.  Texas has 21 times more illegal immigrants than Minnesota.  But there have been only 3 times more immigrant arrests in Texas than Minnesota? 

Those fishy numbers kind of stink, don't they?  The numbers certainly hint that Trump is cheating Texas (and favoring Democrats) with his immigration policies.

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
4.1.9  seeder  Nerm_L  replied to  GregTx @4.1.8    9 months ago
Okay, I've not read anything to suggest that statistic isn't still accurate enough. Have you?

Of course the statistic is accurate.  My point is that the data is stale.  Data from Minnesota is current; data from Texas is not.  Does anybody know what is being accomplished?  The administration claims 605,000 deportations for 2025.     But the press release contains an inconsistency of 595,000 arrests resulting in 605,000 deportations.  The administration has a track record of overstating what it does, so the claims need more than a Deep State press release.  

Perhaps if other states honored ICE detainers?...

So, just trash the 4th amendment of the Constitution and trust Big Government?  That sounds like something a left wing radical would advocate.  But it seems inconsistent with anything Republicans have ever called for.  I guess the pocket Constitutions Republicans used to carry have gone out of style.

Remember when TEA Party Republicans read the Constitution aloud into the record to open the 2011 session of the House of Representatives?  Now the Trump Republicans are the anti-Constitution party.  

 
 
 
freepress
Freshman Silent
5  freepress    9 months ago

Absolutely right. If immigration was really the target go south to the border states.

Governor Abbott in Texas says he welcomes the influx of ICE and more CBP. So WHY, why why why aren't all these sweeps being done in border states?

Trump admittedly and deliberately went after blue states, Democrat governor states, and declared sanctuary cities who don't have anywhere near the same immigration numbers.

More often than not, these states and cities have more immigrants actually doing things the right way, by showing up to immigration courts, getting legal green cards, and working within the existing system.

That's why you still see these invasions of US courts with ICE going after the good ones.

You don't see ICE in seedy, crime ridden neighborhoods, they aren't heading into biker gang territory going after the really bad ones.

Instead you see ICE trolling average American neighborhoods and circling schools using the terror to strike children and families that are not criminals.

They are in nice neighborhoods, going after decent people without proper warrants or accurate information and just grabbing kids, women, men, many prove to be actual US citizens.

I really dislike Marjorie Taylor Green, but her recent takedown of how she is truly letdown because MAGA was a scam should be read by every MAGA die hard.

MTG was a true blue, Trump cheerleader and while she still sides with some of his policies, she has come the truth and realization of the scope and depth of the scam played on MAGA.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
6  Sean Treacy    9 months ago

Progressive live in a world that bears no relation to reality.

New data shows 1 in 4 ICE arrests happened in Texas under Trump's immigration

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  Sean Treacy @6    9 months ago

I stayed at a house that was having major landscaping and a pool installed.  The work took months to complete.  They came and went at will, never even concerned about their safety.  But that’s just my lying eyes.

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
6.1.1  bugsy  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1    9 months ago

How do you know they were illegal?

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.2  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  bugsy @6.1.1    9 months ago

Since when does that matter?  In blue states ICE will drag you out of your car with zero justification other than the crime of being brown.

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
6.1.3  bugsy  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.2    9 months ago

Can you show proof of someone being dragged out of their car ‘just because they are brown’? Before you answer, make sure that the ONLY reason is because they are brown. We have seen too many stories of leftists claiming this but coming to find out the person committed a crime that promoted the pulling out of the car. If Goode did not hit the ICE agents, she would have been pulled from the car for obstruction and failing to follow orders, not just because she dropped a kid off at school, as the left had you believing still today.

Did you know that the majority of ICE agents are Hispanic? Are they racist against ‘brown people’.

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.4  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  bugsy @6.1.3    9 months ago

Here we go again.  Since you refuse to consult anything but far right Trump sycophantic news sources, you are blissfully unaware of what normal people already know.  Then you demand very specific data points that you won’t look for yourself.  Put your big boy pants on and go find out about what your peers already know.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
6.1.5  Sean Treacy  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1    9 months ago

Right. Anecdotal evidence is the best. 

My dad lived into his 80s smoking two packs of cigarettes a days for 60 plus years. And people say smoking causes cancer. pfft...

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
6.1.6  bugsy  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.4    9 months ago

So you can't show proof and whine about sources that have not even been used yet.

"Then you demand very specific data points that you won’t look for yourself."

[✘] here state if you make a claim, you must show proof of that claim or admit you were wrong.

You don't want to go against the rules, do you?

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.7  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  Sean Treacy @6.1.5    9 months ago

First of all, anecdotal or not, a large group of contractors from a variety of disciplines freely arrived and left at will for months at a house in a Dallas suburb, speaking only spanish to one another, at a time when blue cities are being surged upon by ICE.  Is it possible for that to be an anecdotal anomaly?  Secondly, I asked the owner if he thought that was strange and he is the one who explained that hard working immigrants don’t have to be in fear in Texas.  What is happening there is very different than what is happening in democrat areas of the country.  I witnessed it everywhere I traveled, road crews everywhere on their absolutely huge highway system, requiring huge numbers of those people to keep it working - and they were definitely not trying to hide anything.

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.8  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  bugsy @6.1.6    9 months ago

I literally get dumber reading your posts.  

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
6.1.9  bugsy  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.8    9 months ago

I honestly don't think reading my posts have anything to do with that.

If you want to reestablish credibility, just provide sources of what you claim.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
6.1.10  Jack_TX  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.8    9 months ago
I literally get dumber reading your posts.  

Surely not...

Wait... hang on....

6.1.2     Hal A. Lujah     replied to    bugsy   @ 6.1.1       5 hours ago
Since when does that matter?  In blue states ICE will drag you out of your car with zero justification other than the crime of being brown.

Wow.  You weren't kidding.

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.11  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  Jack_TX @6.1.10    9 months ago

lol - you live in Texas.  As I’ve described above Texas is a safe haven for hard working, law abiding, immigrant labor.  Meanwhile, not speaking English, looking like an illegal immigrant, checking in with an immigration office as required - these things in blue areas will get you arrested and treated like a criminal.

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
6.1.12  bugsy  replied to  Jack_TX @6.1.10    9 months ago

Rest assured there will be no reliable sources coming

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
6.1.13  Jack_TX  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.11    9 months ago
lol - you live in Texas.

Yeah.  For 35 years.  I didn't just "stay in a house".  

As I’ve described above Texas is a safe haven for hard working, law abiding, immigrant labor.

You described what you saw.   There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, t han are dreamt of in your irrigation project.

The math tells a very different story.  Texas leads the nation in nation in ICE arrests.  

From January 20 to Oct 21 last year, Minnesota had fewer than 1800 ICE arrests. Texas had 54,267. 

You don't hear about that because our local LE organizations are cooperating with the federal groups.   Texas citizens are not obstructing, and we're certainly not stupid enough to storm into a church and try to take over the children's wing.  Most of us love Jesus but that doesn't mean we want to meet Him today.

The reason your lawn guys are not concerned about ICE is that 54,000 is a drop in the bucket compared to the 1.6 million illegal immigrants in Texas.  If they tripled the arrest rate, it would still take over 8 years to get through all of them.   

Minnesota, on the other hand, has about 130,000 illegals (Pew Research Center). So it seems like they're arresting a lot more.  If the same number of arrests are happening daily in each state, an illegal immigrant far, far more like to be arrested in Minnesota, simply because there aren't that many of them to start with.

That also explains why people in Minnesota, Massachusetts, and a whole bunch of other sheltered little places don't think illegal immigration is a problem and are horrified/outraged that somebody is actually enforcing immigration law. 

If Texas only had 130,000 illegals, we wouldn't care either. 

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.14  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  Jack_TX @6.1.13    9 months ago

What you are genuinely ignoring is the economic impact that occurs when immigrants are afraid to go to work.  By targeting democratic areas this administration is knowingly crippling their economies while literally terrorizing the citizens.  Of course I don’t claim to be an expert on Texas, but one visit is all it takes to see how glaring the difference is.  

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Guide
6.1.15  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.14    9 months ago
By targeting democratic areas this administration is knowingly crippling their economies while literally terrorizing the citizens

What they are targeting are the sanctuary shitholes.  Now the fact that they are mostly run by Democrats happens to be coincidence.  Minnesota is in the news because of the low IQ demographic interfering with ICE operations, the riots.  Now we can't ignore the fraud that was exposed by a 24 year old with an iPhone.  Maybe if they weren't stealing taxpayer money this would not be at the level it's currently at.  Well, that and these low IQ clowns rioting against safer communities.  

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.16  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @6.1.15    9 months ago

Meanwhile, if you want sanctuary as an immigrant you should move to Texas.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6.1.17  Trout Giggles  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @6.1.15    9 months ago
Now we can't ignore the fraud that was exposed by a 24 year old with an iPhone.

which was found to be mostly made up

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6.1.18  Trout Giggles  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @6.1.15    9 months ago

And in response to your "where's your evidence?" question:

The 43-minute video, posted to YouTube the day after Christmas by a 23-year-old conservative content creator, claimed with little evidence Somali-run child care centers in Minnesota were fraudulently taking funding meant to provide child care for low-income families. The video, boosted by Vice President JD Vance and tech billionaire Elon Musk, quickly racked up millions of views. This iframe is not allowed

Investigators last week visited all of the child care centers accused of fraud in the video, and all were operating as expected, state officials say.

The state’s initial findings cast doubt on the claims of fraud articulated in the viral video. Still, investigations into alleged wrongdoing are ongoing.

Minnesota officials have until Friday to provide the Trump administration with information about providers and parents who receive federal funds for child care, according to a bulletin sent Friday by the state Department of Children, Youth, and Families to child care providers and shared with CNN.

I didn't copy and paste the entire article. The link is there if you want to read the entire thing.

They are still investigating but the video filmed by the MAGA influencer wannabe was hardly truthful

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Guide
6.1.19  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.16    9 months ago
you should move to Texas

Where they are doing more operations than in Minnesota.  Or did you miss the link Jack provided in 6.1.13?

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Guide
6.1.20  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.1.17    9 months ago
which was found to be mostly made up

Odd, I don't see any link to that.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Guide
6.1.21  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.1.18    9 months ago

Your 1st link is 1 January and the second from 5 January.  And contradicts the U.S. Treasury Secretary statement on 13 January. 

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6.1.22  Trout Giggles  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @6.1.21    9 months ago

And? My link shows that the MAGA wanna be influencer still had limited evidence that those day cares were fraudulent. That's the point I'm making

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.23  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @6.1.19    9 months ago

The gaslighting here is hilarious.  As the Nazi Stephen Miller rages about ICE not meeting extraordinarily high quotas, they could just go to Texas where you can’t swing a dead cat without hitting a hard working, law abiding, illegal immigrant.  Instead they are dragging seniors in their underwear out into the snow, using five year olds as bait, showing up where immigration applicants are legally required to check in, and are told that suspicions based on ethnicity and language are fair game - all in blue areas.  It’s quite insulting that anyone should be expected to ignore this reality and support ICE.  ICE is now running ads on MS NOW.  As if that could in any way be productive.  Your tax dollars at work, lol.

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
6.1.24  bugsy  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.1.22    9 months ago

‘limited evidence’

So now it is limited evidence. Your posts above state no evidence. Which is it?

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
6.1.25  Jack_TX  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.14    9 months ago
What you are genuinely ignoring is the economic impact that occurs when immigrants are afraid to go to work.

I thought you said they weren't afraid.  None of the ones I know are afraid, so that seems to check out.

By targeting democratic areas 

I'm not sure how it's realistic to claim someplace like Minnesota is being targeted when there are 30 times as many arrests in the place you claim is getting a free pass.

The data seems to directly contradict what you appear to believe.

It's possible that cooperation of local LE agencies is making the process much smoother in Texas, so it's just not on the news.

this administration is knowingly crippling their economies 

Again, there are hardly any illegal immigrants in Minnesota.  Any economic impact is going to be really minimal.

Of course I don’t claim to be an expert on Texas, but one visit is all it takes to see how glaring the difference is. 

The difference that you correctly identified is one of perception and mentality.

Again, illegal immigration is not a new thing for us, nor is immigration enforcement.  The sheer volume of these folks in Texas means that they have been part of the fabric of our lives for decades.  Because of that, we just see it differently.

The point here is that reactions are based in large part on familiarity with the situation. 

We're not really phased by immigration enforcement, just like people in Minneapolis are not phased by 3 inches of snow.

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.26  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  Jack_TX @6.1.25    9 months ago

I thought you said they weren't afraid.

You’re not following me.  In TX they aren’t afraid, it’s the blue states where the fear is.

Again, there are hardly any illegal immigrants in Minnesota.  Any economic impact is going to be really minimal.

You guys need to get your stories straight.  When it serves the right, MN is a sanctuary state filled with illegals.  If you’d change your news channel you’d see just how bad the economic impact is in Minneapolis.  Vast networks of decent people are providing lifelines for hardworking immigrants who are terrified of leaving their homes, because there are three times the number of ICE agents as police.  Does that sound like a scenario for “hardly any immigrants”?

I’m really not trying to have a conversation with the cognitively dissonant.  Maybe you should save your ICE virtuosity talking points for your fellow Christians at after service coffee hour.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6.1.27  Trout Giggles  replied to  Jack_TX @6.1.25    9 months ago
there are hardly any illegal immigrants in Minnesota

then why is there such a large ICE presence there?

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
6.1.28  Jack_TX  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.1.27    9 months ago
then why is there such a large ICE presence there?

The first question would be define "large", and then "large relative to what?"

I don't know how many officers are assigned to Texas, but if that number turned out to be 5 times as many as are in Minnesota, do we still call that a "large" presence?

It does make logical sense that you need fewer immigration officers in places where local LEOs are cooperating.

It also makes logical sense that you can better concentrate on illegal aliens who are actually criminals if you have access to them in jails.

It makes further logical sense that if you know your officers are being attacked, you would send them in greater numbers for their own protection.

So if the ICE presence in Minneapolis is actually disproportionately large (which it may be, I dunno),  there are some fairly straightforward non-political reasons why that might be necessary. 

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
6.1.29  Jack_TX  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.26    9 months ago
You’re not following me. In TX they aren’t afraid, it’s the blue states where the fear is.

Ah.  Got it.

You guys need to get your stories straight.

Which "guys" is that? 

When it serves the right, MN is a sanctuary state filled with illegals. 

Hasn't Minnesota said they were a sanctuary state?  Haven't they instructed their LEOs not to cooperate with federal authorities?  This seems to be something they're quite proud of.

If you’d change your news channel 

*eyeroll*. 

OK, if we've reached one of those points where you can't handle the actual data so you start trying to insult people, just say so.

 Vast networks of decent people are providing lifelines for hardworking immigrants who are terrified of leaving their homes, because there are three times the number of ICE agents as police. 

Are we taking about immigrants or illegal immigrants?  There is a difference.

Does that sound like a scenario for “hardly any immigrants”?

You're assuming that these people have any clue how many illegal immigrants there are and would give a solitary shit if they did.

This is about their emotions and perception.

I’m really not trying to have a conversation with the cognitively dissonant.

It appears at this point like you're just desperately trying to cling to your feelings of moral superiority in spite of what the actual data might say.

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.1.30  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  Jack_TX @6.1.29    9 months ago

No, at this point I’m attempting to converse with a brick wall.  Bye now.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
6.1.31  Jack_TX  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.30    9 months ago
at this point I’m attempting to converse with a brick wall.

Interesting way to describe "official data that should challenge your views", but OK.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Guide
6.1.32  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.1.22    9 months ago
My link shows that the MAGA wanna be influencer still had limited evidence that those day cares were fraudulent.

And he was effective.  Maybe that's what you dislike about him.  He exposed what the left doesn't want exposed.  And he was more effective than the likes of your bloggers at CNN, MS Now / MSNBC, etc..

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Guide
6.1.33  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Hal A. Lujah @6.1.23    9 months ago
The gaslighting here is hilarious.

I know.  I've been openly laughing at the lefts pathetic attempts at it for years.  

law abiding, illegal immigrant.

"law abiding, illegal immigrant".  And you don't see what's wrong with those 4 words strung together like that.    

The rest of your statement is evidence you fell for the gaslighting.  It's obvious you really haven't been paying attention to what is actually going on.  Just parroting what somebody told you.

ICE is now running ads on MS NOW.  

OH THE HORROR!!!!!!!!  Did you call the FCC about it?

As if that could in any way be productive.  Your tax dollars at work, lol.

It is productive to the removal of the criminal element that were given free pass across the border.  That is exactly what I want my tax dollars spent on.  Instead of somefeel good motto that amounts to absolutely nothing.

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
6.1.34  seeder  Nerm_L  replied to  Jack_TX @6.1.29    9 months ago
Hasn't Minnesota said they were a sanctuary state?  Haven't they instructed their LEOs not to cooperate with federal authorities?  This seems to be something they're quite proud of.

No, Minnesota officials have never claimed to be a sanctuary state.  That is a lie being told by Trump's corrupt Deep State.  DHS claims Minnesota is a sanctuary state because the state judiciary and jail systems uphold the 4th amendment.  

Trump Republicans hate those who abide by the Bill of Rights.  Minnesota coordinates with ICE to both uphold the 4th amendment and facilitate ICE arrests.  Kristi Noem has pissed that cooperation away with lies to score suck-up points with Trump and coerce Minnesota into giving up its voter rolls (which has nothing to do with immigration).

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
6.1.35  Jack_TX  replied to  Nerm_L @6.1.34    9 months ago
No, Minnesota officials have never claimed to be a sanctuary state.

OK.  I wasn't sure. 

How about Minneapolis, specifically?  It looks like they have their own sanctuary situation.

 
 
 
Nerm_L
Professor Expert
6.1.36  seeder  Nerm_L  replied to  Jack_TX @6.1.35    9 months ago
OK.  I wasn't sure.  How about Minneapolis, specifically?  It looks like they have their own sanctuary situation.

Minnesota had a problem with over zealous prosecutors violating the 4th amendment.  Prosecutors would place a hold on a prisoner's release and then run to the standing grand jury.  (A hold is like an ICE detainer.)  Holding a prisoner beyond eligible release violates the 4th amendment.  The only way law enforcement can legally retain custody of prisoner beyond eligible release is with a court issued warrant.  Minnesota honors the Constitution; not the political whims of Donald Trump.

Just because ICE violates the 4th amendment as routine procedure does not make Minnesota a sanctuary state.  What your linked article (published by the Hill) does is push Trump propaganda that adhering to Constitutional limits and constraints is somehow wrong.  That's nothing but lies stacked on lies which seems to have become the modus operandi  of the newly deformed Trump Republican Party.

 
 
 
Bob Nelson
Professor Guide
7  Bob Nelson    9 months ago

Great seed.

 
 

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