'My heart is broken': Florida teachers ordered to remove, block class libraries or face felony prosecution - Alternet.org

  
Via:  Ender  •  one week ago  •  76 comments

By:   David Badashand

'My heart is broken': Florida teachers ordered to remove, block class libraries or face felony prosecution - Alternet.org
Teachers in Manatee County, Florida, are being ordered to remove or make inaccessible libraries of books inside their classrooms or face possible felony prosecution, as the district responds to legislation Governor Ron DeSantis signed into law prohibiting any books that have not been thoroughly vett...

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Teachers in Manatee County, Florida, are being ordered to remove or make inaccessible libraries of books inside their classrooms or face possible felony prosecution, as the district responds to legislation Governor Ron DeSantis signed into law prohibiting any books that have not been thoroughly vetted by a credentialed librarian.

The law, which went into effect at the start of this year, "is based on the premise, promoted by right-wing advocacy groups, that teachers and librarians are using books to 'groom' students or indoctrinate them with leftist ideologies," according to Judd Legum at Popular Information.

He puts it simply: "classroom libraries that are curated by teachers, not librarians, are now illegal."

"My heart is broken for Florida students today as I am forced to pack up my classroom library," one teacher wrote on Facebook, Legum reports.

Calling it a "travesty to education, the future of our children and our nation," another teacher lamented they have spent 18 years "dedicated to providing students with quality literature," and helping them "connect with books and develop a love of lifelong learning," but now they will have to dismantle their classroom library.

Kevin Chapman, the Chief of Staff for the Manatee County School District, "says that school principals in Manatee County were told Wednesday that any staff member violating these rules by providing materials 'harmful to minors' could be prosecuted for 'a felony of the third degree.'"

Not only are teachers now packing up their classroom libraries, but children are being told they are not allowed to bring any books from home to school.

Books can be returned to the classroom only after vigorous review by certified librarians, whose official title is media specialist. They are also subject to felony prosecution if they make any errors.

"That review must also be consistent with a complex training," Legum reports, "which was heavily influenced by right-wing groups like Moms For Liberty and approved by the Florida Department of Education just last week. Any mistake by a librarian or others could result in criminal prosecution. This process must be repeated for any book brought into the school on an ongoing basis. But librarians and teachers are not being provided with any additional compensation for the extra work."

Earlier on Monday Gov. DeSantis defended the decision to ban advanced placement for African American history classes in Florida.

Standing in a school classroom at a podium with a sign that reads, "Florida, the education state," DeSantis declared the "issue is we have guidelines and standards in Florida."

"We want education, not indoctrination. If you fall on the side of indoctrination, we're going to decline. If it's education, then we will do."

"This course on Black history. What are one of, what's one of the lessons about? Queer theory."


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Ender
Professor Principal
1  seeder  Ender    one week ago

This is getting ridiculous.

What is next, throwing a neighbor in jail that gave a kid a book?

So these assholes say they are stopping indoctrination by having a 'specialist' of their choice decide what books kids can read or bring to class.

Want books decided by a right wing group....

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
1.1  Sparty On  replied to  Ender @1    one week ago

No one wants radicals deciding what books are used.    Conservative or liberal.

It’s pretty simple really.    

Educate, not indoctrinate.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sparty On @1.1    one week ago

Yet here we are with the supposed bias and the right wing wanting schools run a certain way.

I say politics get the fuck out of schools.

All this is going to do is hinder teachers abilities. Basically the dumbing down of the school system.

Do you really think a teacher should be stuck with felony charges just because they let a kid read Tom Sawyer?

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
1.1.2  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Sparty On @1.1    one week ago
No one wants radicals deciding what books are used.    Conservative or liberal.

Bullshit. Conservatives desperately want their brand of religion shoved down every child's throat from the moment they're born and they don't give a fuck about the means because in their small warped indoctrinated minds the ends justify the means. Radical rightwing conservatives have been fighting to decide what books will be available in public school libraries for decades.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.1.3  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Ender @1.1.1    one week ago
Yet here we are with the supposed bias and the right wing wanting schools run a certain way

So having somebody credentialed to be involved is somehow bad?

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
1.1.4  Sparty On  replied to  Ender @1.1.1    one week ago

Already noted above.    

Educate, not indoctrinate.    The knife cuts both ways.    The left can’t have it’s cake and eat it to on this topic.    Teach all history, warts and all.    Don’t try to change it, sanitized it or infuse it with unrelated indoctrination.

And trying to compare a book like Tom Sawyer to this AP class content, truly is obtuse IMO.

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
1.1.5  Sparty On  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @1.1.2    one week ago

Any supposition that progressive/liberal radicals don’t try to do the same thing is ridiculous.

That’s the real bullshit here.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.6  seeder  Ender  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.1.3    one week ago

Credentialed in what way?

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.7  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sparty On @1.1.4    one week ago

I agree. I also agree with letting kids have conversations that may make some people uncomfortable.

Tom Sawyer was just an example as I remember a time when people freaked about about the racism in the book.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.1.8  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Ender @1.1.6    one week ago

How about a credentialed librarian.  You know, like the article mentions.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.9  seeder  Ender  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.1.8    one week ago

Don't they have those already? Now you want to give Librarians authority over what kids can read...

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
1.1.10  Sparty On  replied to  Ender @1.1.7    one week ago

I hear what your saying.    

No parent wants a radical, left or right wing, deciding what is taught to their kids unless they happen to be one of those radicals.

Teach the truth, don’t embellish it, add to it or sanitize it unless absolutely necessary.

 
 
 
Hallux
Junior Principal
1.1.11  Hallux  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.1.8    one week ago
How about a credentialed librarian.

Credentialed by whom? DeSantis? He's already staffed the Florida Education Department with sycophants.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.1.12  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Hallux @1.1.11    one week ago

Is that what the Florida law states?

What it actually states is:

School library media services; establishment and 130 maintenance.—Establish and maintain a program of school library media services for all public schools in the district, including school library media centers, or school library media centers open to the public, and, in addition such traveling or circulating libraries as may be needed for the proper operation  of the district school system. Beginning January 1, 2023, school librarians, media specialists, and other personnel involved in the selection of school district library materials must complete the training program developed pursuant to s. 1006.29(6) before reviewing and selecting age-appropriate materials and library resources. Upon written request, a school district shall provide access to any material or book specified in the request that is maintained in a district school system library and is available for review. (emphasis mine)

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.1.13  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Ender @1.1.9    one week ago
Don't they have those already?

I don't know.  I imagine each state is run differently.  Although I would think it would be standardized under the Department of Education.  But we've seen how much of a failure that's been.

Now you want to give Librarians authority over what kids can read..

If it's within and supports the school curriculum why wouldn't they.  

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.14  seeder  Ender  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.1.13    one week ago

Call me an old hippie yet I don't want the state, the schools or the feds deciding what me or my kids can or cannot read.

I know that is an exaggeration but let's be real. Kids carry books with them to read in their down time. No outside books allowed? It has to be run through the Librarian who has to check a data base? Can only use approved books from the school library?

Sorry but that sounds a lot like....

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.1.15  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Ender @1.1.14    one week ago
Call me an old hippie yet I don't want the state, the schools or the feds deciding what me or my kids can or cannot read.

I agree.  But that's exactly what we are seeing.  I'm all for reading requirements that support the curriculum.  But I have seen some that are borderline pornography.

I know that is an exaggeration but let's be real. Kids carry books with them to read in their down time. No outside books allowed? It has to be run through the Librarian who has to check a data base? Can only use approved books from the school library?

I agree that is an exaggeration.  There is really no way of controlling what books are available to kids at home.  And to have a school official running around trying to keep them out of the school is insane.  The parents do have to take some responsibility in all of this.  

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.16  seeder  Ender  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.1.15    one week ago

The last part was not an exaggeration. Seriously, what are they going to do...not let kids bring in books from home?

Parents can be very fickle. On one hand they don't want to teach their kids shit and want the schools to do it, on the other hand they throw a hissy fit about them leaning simple things.

This whole it is up to the parents to decide what is taught is bullshit. There are set standards and saying you don't want your kids taught certain things is just using their own insecurities if not bigotries to dictate to the child.

Fine and dandy, keep one's child in the dark. Just don't dictate that, that is how everyone else should do it.

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Sophomore Quiet
1.1.17  afrayedknot  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.1.15    one week ago

“The parents do have to take some responsibility in all of this.”

Totally agree. If fact, it is involved parents that should be driving the school bus…so to speak.

Get to know your child’s teacher. Have a concern, meet with him or her. Unresolved, meet with your principal. Still a problem, get on the school board agenda. Still unsatisfied, look to different options.

Education is that unusual system that functions best from the bottom up…not from the state or federal level. 

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
1.1.18  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @1.1.14    one week ago
e state, the schools or the feds deciding what me or my kids can or cannot read.

So you think teachers should be able to display porn, KKK propaganda etc in their classroom?

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.19  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.1.18    one week ago

Do you think Mein Kampf should be off limits to teenagers?

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
1.1.20  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @1.1.19    one week ago

Probably shouldn't be in a high school library, but I wouldn't ban it. Which is the distinction you seem to be missing. Just because a book isn't purchased or displayed by a school doesn't mean its banned. 

But do you support KKK books for kids being made available to kids in 3rd grade classrooms? 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.21  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.1.20    one week ago

I don't think they are.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.22  seeder  Ender  replied to  afrayedknot @1.1.17    one week ago
Education is that unusual system that functions best from the bottom up…not from the state or federal level

I have said before that most of the problems could be handled at the local level.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.23  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.1.20    one week ago

To answer you though, no.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
1.1.24  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @1.1.23    one week ago
answer you though, no.

Then we agree you do want the the state, the schools or the feds deciding what me or my kids can or cannot read.  Pretty much everyone agrees there is some material that schools shouldn't provide to kids, particularly the youngest, and it's just a question of where the line is drawn, and 99% of material will be agreed to by everyone as being on one side or the other.  

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.1.25  devangelical  replied to  Ender @1.1.1    6 days ago
Basically the dumbing down of the school system.

where do you think most republicans come from? /s

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.2  Trout Giggles  replied to  Ender @1    one week ago
Want books decided by a right wing group....

they'll be restricted to the Bible possibly the Book of Mormon

 
 
 
arkpdx
Professor Participates
1.2.1  arkpdx  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.2    one week ago

[deleted

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
1.2.2  sandy-2021492  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.2    6 days ago

Ok, then, I want an accurate translation of the Song of Songs in that Bible.  They don't want sexual content?  They'd better have their fainting couches handy.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.2.3  Trout Giggles  replied to  sandy-2021492 @1.2.2    6 days ago

lol

I think if that Book was translated into modern English it would be labeled pornography

But I guess porno is ok if it's in the Bible

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.3  devangelical  replied to  Ender @1    6 days ago

school text books are already written and printed by those with questionable agendas. only the parents that rarely set foot in a library when they were young seem to be upset about this non-issue. what kids today haul a book around when they have access to a phone or computer? what will be the first thing they do when they see mom and dad get all jacked up over the title of a book in their school library? want to keep literature with the most vile and offensive subjects of humankind out their reach until they're mature enough to handle it? then ban the fucking bible.

 
 
 
SteevieGee
Masters Silent
1.4  SteevieGee  replied to  Ender @1    6 days ago

Churches have been indoctrinating kids for centuries.  Maybe it should be a felony to take kids to church.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.4.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  SteevieGee @1.4    6 days ago

Religious right wing wackos get bent out of shape about LGBTQ indoctrinating or worse grooming children but they never talk about their religious leaders grooming children. It happens every day in churches, mosques, and synagogues

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
1.4.2  Sparty On  replied to  SteevieGee @1.4    6 days ago

Nah but maybe it should be a felony when people try to tell other people what they should and shouldn’t do with their kids.

Be a shitload of teachers in jail if that were true ......

 
 
 
SteevieGee
Masters Silent
1.4.3  SteevieGee  replied to  Sparty On @1.4.2    6 days ago
Be a shitload of teachers in jail if that were true ......

Along with the Governor of Florida.  How is having a book in the classroom telling parents how to raise their kids?

 
 
 
pat wilson
Professor Guide
1.4.4  pat wilson  replied to  Sparty On @1.4.2    6 days ago
Be a shitload of teachers in jail if that were true ......

May not matter soon, they are quitting in droves, 300,000 in the last two years.

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
1.4.5  Sparty On  replied to  SteevieGee @1.4.3    6 days ago

Educate not indoctrinate.

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
1.4.6  Sparty On  replied to  pat wilson @1.4.4    6 days ago

Guess that 300k lost their passion for “teaching” kids eh?

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Sophomore Principal
1.4.7  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  pat wilson @1.4.4    6 days ago
May not matter soon, they are quitting in droves, 300,000 in the last two years.

I think that there are less than 200,000 teacher positions in Florida.  They have about a 3% shortage currently.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.4.8  devangelical  replied to  Sparty On @1.4.5    6 days ago

cool. eliminate all religious schools.

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
1.4.9  Sparty On  replied to  devangelical @1.4.8    5 days ago

Stalin would be so proud.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
2  Dismayed Patriot    one week ago

Rightwing religious conservatives: "It is our right to label those disgusting vile lgtbq sinners as Evil!".

Author who supports diversity: "LGTBQ persons are just as valuable and have the same rights as any other humans".

Rightwing religious conservatives: "Ban the books that dare indoctrinate children with ideas counter to our Christian indoctrination! How dare anyone challenge our God's authority!".

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
2.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @2    one week ago

Good luck with him taking stances like this nationwide. He will not win on a national stage with this crap.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
3  Tacos!    one week ago

I think the whole thing is a cynical political tactic to stoke fear in the populace so they’ll support their Republican “saviors.” 

Having said that, this is how education works in our country. The state controls what goes on at public schools. Government makes a million choices, many of which, we don’t think a lot about. What feels here like censorship is one of those choices the state can make. 

In fact, K-12 schools are not some free marketplace of ideas. We might like to imagine they are, but they aren’t. The state has the authority to determine what classes are offered, what the curricula look like, and what books are available.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Tacos! @3    one week ago

Sorry but I don't see the state as having the right to hand out felonies to teachers that decided to bring a fucking book to a school...

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
3.1.1  Tacos!  replied to  Ender @3.1    one week ago

I think they probably do have that power. I agree with you that it’s extreme, but the state can make any crime it wants into a felony.

The people do have remedies. Vote the fascists out, or move. 

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
4  Jeremy Retired in NC    one week ago

And where is Biden's Department of Education?  Oh that's right it's BIDEN's DOE, they're proving themselves to be just as competent as the rest of the Biden Administration.

 
 
 
evilgenius
Professor Guide
4.1  evilgenius  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @4    one week ago
And where is Biden's Department of Education?

The DOE doesn't have any authority to do anything to state run schools. It make rules on running federal education programs and coordinates benefits. 

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
4.1.1  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  evilgenius @4.1    one week ago

In a nut shell.  They're useless and should be cut.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
5  Sean Treacy    one week ago

Unless they are peddling child porn, they  have no reason to worry. But acting hysterically and playing the victim for sympathetic media is a favorite ploy of the left. 

Do people think teachers don't get charged with crimes if they provide child porn to kids in other parts of the country? 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
5.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @5    one week ago

Or talk about gay people....

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
5.1.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @5.1    one week ago
r talk about gay people

You can.  And to stop the other oft repeated  lies, gay teachers can display pictures of their spouse or gay family members. You just can't teach kindergarteners about gay sex, which really upsets a lot of progressives.  

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
5.1.2  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @5.1.1    one week ago

Haha   Yeah, where are all these teachers being brought up on charges for telling kids about porn...

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
5.1.3  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @5.1.2    one week ago
, where are all these teachers being brought up on charges for telling kids about porn...

Where are all these teachers being brought up on felony charges for having regular books in their classes? 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
5.1.4  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @5.1.3    one week ago

A brand new law. We shall see where it goes. I am sure someone will test it.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
5.1.5  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @5.1.4    one week ago
A brand new law. We shall see where it goes. I am sure someone will test it.

Laws against giving pornography  to kids have been on the books for a long time.  The specific law referenced by the school district as raising the possibility of felony charges has been on the books for decades.  Anything that would be a felony in a classroom this week under the law  has pretty much always been a felony. 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
5.1.6  seeder  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @5.1.5    one week ago

Say what you want, Imo this law goes beyond porn.

We are in to what DeSantis himself calls 'queer theory'.

 
 
 
Hallux
Junior Principal
5.1.7  Hallux  replied to  Sean Treacy @5.1.5    one week ago

As Lenny Bruce opined: "Depicting poor folks having sex is pornography, depicting wealthy people having sex is eroticism."

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
5.1.8  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Sean Treacy @5.1.1    6 days ago
You just can't teach kindergarteners about gay sex, which really upsets a lot of progressives. 

No one was teaching children about "gay sex" and no progressives were upset by teachers not being able to teach about gay sex. If you believe differently than first, prove it. Show where any teacher was trying to go into the details of gay sex to a classroom. Then, if you're successful, please do provide evidence of progressives being upset that kids aren't being taught about gay sex.

The reality is that apparently many mentally lazy dipshit right wing religious conservatives imagine that just by a teacher acting like the kid with two mommies is 'normal' means they are teaching the rest of the class about lesbian cunnilingus. Of course it's complete bullshit, but that's what rightwing religious conservatives sell everyday, gold painted bullshit.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
5.1.9  Sean Treacy  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @5.1.8    6 days ago
aching children about "gay sex" and no progressives were upset by teachers not being able to teach about gay sex.

Then why are you so upset about a law prohibiting it? 

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
5.1.10  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Sean Treacy @5.1.9    6 days ago
Then why are you so upset about a law prohibiting it? 

The only real problem I have with the law is that besides being completely useless and unnecessary, it is spending time and money on a non-problem that could be better spent on programs that actually help students and public schools.

Other than that it's of course somewhat annoying listening to fucking worthless religious conservative liars who make claims they can't back up at the expense of many American parents who happen to be lgtbq and are just trying to live in our society unmolested.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
5.1.11  Trout Giggles  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @5.1.8    6 days ago

I wish I could give you 10 votes up on this comment. I laughed all the way thru it. I have the mentality of a 13 year old boy

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
6  Trout Giggles    one week ago

They don't want children learning to think for themselves or discovering new things. They want them kept in the dark and fed horseshit. Children are not mushrooms...they are sponges. Let them be sponges

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
6.1  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Trout Giggles @6    6 days ago

For religious conservatives, sex is something you never talk about because if you do you could go to hell. So even when Pastor Pete starts rubbing you in an inappropriate way, don't talk about it because A. talking about sex makes you a sinner, and B. no one will believe you anyway because Pastor Pete is so popular... You just have to 'suck it up' like the numb little inexperienced religious conservative spunk sponge you are, then go vote for DeSantis when you're old enough...

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
6.1.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @6.1    6 days ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
6.1.2  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Sean Treacy @6.1.1    6 days ago
So put you down as an adult who wants to talk about sex with six years olds.

Not sure where you got that personal attack from because there is nothing in my comment about wanting to teach six year old's about sex.

It's not up to me as to which age a parent decides to talk to their kids about sex, but for me as a parent it didn't seem appropriate till about eight years old. Of course that's a job for parents and not any school teachers, but I'm not seeing any teachers doing that anywhere but in rightwing religious conservatives fevered fantasies after they've spent too many hours listening to poisonous mentally ill right wing conservative media. That's what really gets religious conservative parents so fucking fearful they're willing to do anything, even voting for known sexual predators and liars, to protect their toxic rightwing religious conservative ideology.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Sophomore Principal
6.1.3  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @6.1    6 days ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7  Buzz of the Orient    6 days ago

Guess what?  I read D. H. Lawrence's Lady Chatterly's Lover when I was a kid and I didn't turn out to be a sex maniac.  Of course I may be biased in my opinions on this since I majored in English Literature to earn my B.A., but IMO the Republicans are doing whatever they possibly can to "dumb down America" in order to guarantee their continuing being elected.  Their biggest victory so far as I can see is that they have created an ultra-conservative SCOTUS which is going to help divide Americans enough to make the Grand Canyon resemble a crease in a piece of paper in comparison.  

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
7.1  seeder  Ender  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7    6 days ago

I was an idiot. I just read things like Ender's Game and Lord Of The Rings.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Ender @7.1    6 days ago

Nothing wrong with those, Ender.  I spent a lot of my time reading science fiction and fantasy. 

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
7.2  Trout Giggles  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7    6 days ago

I have that book. I've had it for years but still haven't read it. I need to go find it

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.2.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Trout Giggles @7.2    4 days ago

Considering the level to which pornography has advanced to these days, what might have been sensational when it was written is not so glaringly lewd now.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
7.2.2  Trout Giggles  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.2.1    4 days ago

That was written in the 50's wasn't it?

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.2.3  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Trout Giggles @7.2.2    3 days ago

It was written in the late 1920s.  A few movies have already been made of the story - one as recently as 2022.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
8  Buzz of the Orient    4 days ago

Considering the level to which pornography has advanced to these days, what might have been sensational when it was written is not so glaringly lewd now.

 
 

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