Antifa And Newstalkers

hello

putting controversial articles up for comments and then trying to restrict those comments is silly.  

controversial articles are bound to produce controversial comments.

In my opinion some people are seeding controversial articles and wanting an echo chamber.  

When thats the case, I dont participate. 

I believe both sides gone too far is insanity and if I cant point that out, why participate ? 

So I don't.

Antifa was a term promoted, really promoted by Sean Hannity on FOX News and on his radio show.  This is where I believe Trump has picked it up.  (Either Hannity or Breitbart, or both.)  The Trump Corps. (core) then  followed their leader's lead and it became the cause celeb of that group.

There were two articles on Antifa that were dominating NT.  I was in the process of writing a third anti-anti-Antifa article when one was locked by the moderators.  Before I could publish my own article it was locked down, yet I was accused of getting it "collapsed", which is untrue.  I had no part in that.  That was a decision made by someone else that I had absolutely no input in.  Yet I am blamed for it.

The other article remained up.  I posted mine.  The other article was peppered with a great deal of purple ink.  I deleted my article.  The other article was locked, unlocked and gained more purple ink.  Eventually it petered out. (But it took a long while and gained more purple ink in the process.)

Now this new anti-Antia article is out and I posted 5 comments on it initially.  Three threads went wild and I had to end them with IMPASSE.  I don't know when or why or who locked it, but that's where it stands now.  It may yet be unlocked and continue on.

That's where these articles came from.  That's where I believe the anti-Antifa sentiment and issue originated from.  That's where we are now.  I wish I could say you are done seeing Antifa articles on this site, but I can't make that prediction.  I wish you luck.

(BTW, when I first started writing this comment, there was on one comment posted here, and all it said was "Hello."  There were 4 or 5 posted in just the time it took for me to write this.  That is how interested some people seem to be in Antifa articles, I am sad to say.)

My comment was on the posts not on Antifa.

I dont normally listen to or respond to the insanity of either far wing crap from either side.   

I just mentioned controversial articles like this are bound to produce controversial posts and stifling them with rules is silly. That was my only point.

     That's where I believe the anti-Antifa sentiment and issue originated from.

I started paying attention to antiFa when they started showing up at OWS events. 

Originally, I supported them and their goals, and then I realized that it seemed like their Movement was simply being used by too many Members as an excuse to gang beat other people because they were too cowardly to go one-on-one and some are just there to commit assault. When they don't have provocation, they will just invent it.

 Before I could publish my own article it was locked down, yet I was accused of getting it "collapsed", which is untrue.  I had no part in that.  That was a decision made by someone else that I had absolutely no input in.  Yet I am blamed for it.

Squirrell, 

First of all, there is no way to lock down an article that is yet to be published and the only ones who can lock down an article is the owner of the article or a mod. 

We also don't have a "collapse" function here. So I am not sure what you are talking about. And no one is blaming you for anything. 

The owners of articles often lock them when they know they will not be around to control the discussion and will reopen them later. 

Please allow me to clarify.

Before I published my own article THE OTHER ARTICLE BY ANOTHER AUTHOR WAS LOCKED and I was accused of participating and causing HIS ARTICLE to be "collapsed" NOT MINE.

I published my article, then I DELETED MY OWN ARTICLE, and you know that to be fact because I emailed you about that and you asked if I wanted it restored.  I said no.

I hope that is now clear.  I was NOT saying my own article was pre-emptively locked.  I was saying that while I was still working on my own article THE OTHER ARTICLE THAT WAS ALREADY PUBLISHED BY THE OTHER AUTHOR WAS LOCKED, yet I was blamed for having it collapsed and I had NO PART IN THAT decision or process.

The term "collapsed" was specifically used by the AUTHOR of the OTHER ARTICLE, so you will need to ask him what he meant by that.  I am just QUOTING HIM.

Hopefully I have clarified that much.

I logged on this morning to see yet another article about "antifa" blown up into an argument gone badly off topic

Then you posted this one, and within minutes BF dipped into his vast collection of penis and anal related pictures and video, and posted more dildo stuff.  Par for the course.

"Then you posted this one, and within minutes BF dipped into his vast collection of penis and anal related pictures and video, and posted more dildo stuff.  Par for the course."  Are the ignorant and nasty photoshopped pictures of Hillary par for the course too?  Is that Hillary derangement syndrome?  

 Is that Hillary derangement syndrome?  

Nah.

It's just Bf. He has a need to expose himself something from time to time. Just ignore him. 

It's funny how the Right is completely silent about how an actual fascist actually murdered someone in cold blood. 

It's funny how that isn't true.

You just got here then.  The reason you didn't see it at NV was that most conservatives, including me, had you on their ignore list.

If you're speaking to me ausmith - no worries - whenever I saw something you posted - I didn't even bother to read it anyway.  So it's all good hon.  

I was talking to Wheel but the same goes for you.  Wheel and I use our NV names.  What was yours?

"I was talking to Wheel but the same goes for you."  How could that be if you don't know who I was on Newsvine?  

"The HANDFUL of violent instances involving Antifa are turned, through propaganda into a nationwide frenzy of hordes of "communists" raging through neighborhoods beating down grandmas and innocent homebodies who make the mistake of wandering out on their front lawn. The horror !"

I was thinking the same thing of Trump rallies.

FACTS:

1.  There was no organized "Antifa" involvement at Occupy Wall Street, September 17, 2011.  (Do a Google Search and prove me wrong.  I have done a Google Search and more research and found NOTHING.)

2.  There were "anarchists" at the Occupy Wall Street protest, and other similar protests, including the WTO protest in Seattle, November 30, 1999.  There were no "antifa" at that protest.  (The term did not exist in 1999 or 2011.)

3.  "antifa" is a term created within the past 2 or 3 years, nobody is exactly sure when or where or by whom it was created.

4.  "antifa" is a term most promoted by Sean Hannity and Right Wing sources such as Sean Hannity, FOX News, Breitbart, etc... as a means to label all those active protestors, violent or non-violent, who they disagree with.

5.  There were "anarchists" at both the 1999 WTO protest, and the 2011 OWS, and other events, but "anarchists" are NOT the same as "antifa".  Anarchists acted out violently long before antifa even existed as a term.

6.  There is a member here on The NewsTalkers who claims to be "a conservative who leans towards being an anarchist", which is a contradiction in terms.  Conservatives believe in strong centralized law and order, anarchists believe in little or no law or government at all.

7. Many formal Antifa members of today, who openly claim to be Capital 'A' Antifa emerged initially from the ranks of the anarchists.

Those are FACTS, not opinions or false recollections or rewritten histories.  Just FACTS.

cnn

You need to improve your Google skills. This was easy.

Again, I stated for a FACT that REVISIONIST HISTORY is not proof.  An article written in August 2017 is NOT PROOF of anything.  An article written in August 2017 is simply REVISIONIST HISTORY.

It is necessary to go back to the date in history nearer the actual event and find articles written then.  If you do that, and make an HONEST attempt to seek out the TRUTH, you will find there was NO MENTION of "antifa" in 1999 or 2011.  

Let's do try to be honest, shall we?

Because the article was written/reported in 2017, it is revisionist history?  Does the article's contents stand for nothing?  So anything that anyone writes about that happened prior to today must be 'revisionist'?

Seems so. A bit disingenuous when proven wrong...

IMPASSE

There is a member here on The NewsTalkers who claims to be "a conservative who leans towards being an anarchist", which is a contradiction in terms.  Conservatives believe in strong centralized law and order, anarchists believe in little or no law or government at all.

Yeah, that was me.  I've said that from day one that I've been here.  Why?  Because I know it's a contradiction in terms.  It's an attempt at humor.  And whenever I have said it in the past, people have laughed at the irony in the statement.  It was said to you in order to perhaps bring a smile to your face.  It was said when I knew you were frustrated.  It was a bit of humor to try and put you at ease. 

Not everyone on this site is out to get you.  Not every conservative is gunning for you.  Some of us want the debate, the discussions, the outpouring of ideas, views and opinions.  And some of us welcome new members, Liberal, Moderate, or Conservative.

Yeah, I call Perrie Cupcake from time to time.  From time to time I tell PJ to get back in the kitchen and make us some sammichs.  Both of them know that it's humor.  Humor to break up the vitrol that many times drips from the discussions.

I can't make you trust me.  I can't make you like me.  But I can tell you honestly that you should lighten up just a bit.  I'm a little brash at times, but I'm easy to get along with.  And I can help you get used to the Thunder-dome we know as NT.

My apologies to the author, I just wanted to tell @Therealbruce I have accepted his FR but still cannot send a private note.

I will now "Get lost" from here.

Squirrel, when I said "get lost" it was not directed to you.

It was a glitch in the system for displaying the comments. I was talking to Cerenkov, as he well knows.

Okay.  It is kind of difficult to follow the thread with the way comments are indented here.  Thank you for the explanation.

"It was a glitch in the system for displaying the comments. I was talking to Cerenkov, as he well knows."

Yep. Still here though.

Excellent point Bruce!

Yes stick around a while, most of us conservatives don't/won't bite, we just nibble a little.

All intelligent discourse is welcome here, (and respected) the rules are designed to accentuate this. Stick around and come play and don't take it too seriously.

But understand non-intelligent discourse gets fairly rude treatment, so ergo sum if you feel your being treated rudely check it out first it may be intelligent humor disguised as rudeness.

All of us here are opinionated people, very successful in life's endeavors with powerful egos and sufficient intelligence (in most cases) to solidly stand on our own and make our case.

Don't fall into the trap of misjudging us.

We are a family. Treat it as such and enjoy it as such.

There is a member here on The NewsTalkers who claims to be "a conservative who leans towards being an anarchist", which is a contradiction in terms.  Conservatives believe in strong centralized law and order, anarchists believe in little or no law or government at all.

There are two wings of anarchism , at least. Right wing anarchism is known as anarcho-capitalism.

I've been keeping my comments to a minimum on these seeds, trying to figure out what the deal is between the conflicted streams of thought.

I think I've got it.

The reason why we see so many of these seeds and articles - from both sides - is the result of some kind of attempt by one to be heard OVER the other. There is no desire or attempt to come to some kind of conclusion. No, it's just continued screaming, one over the other.

The Nazis are bad.

Antifa is bad.

They're bad, all of them.

That fact said (in 12 words, mind you) is not enough, because there is some kind of one-upmanship competition going on.

If Trump didn't say "both sides", would this have stopped sooner? Probably. So maybe it's not about antifa, maybe it's about Trump. So, because we all love Trump so much, let's talk about him more, and keep repeating ourselves ad nauseum. Yeah, that's it.

The Nazis are bad, but it's not about the Nazis either, is it? It's about Trump saying "both sides" again.

Soooooooooo, is it both sides that are bad? Again, yes.

Is Trump an A-hole? Sure.

Can we be done now?

i take it 2020 cant come fast enough for you

the washington post has catalogued over 1000 lies trump has told in public since he took office in jan.

he should be forced out of office tomorrow

John, 

I don't even get your reply to Jon. 

Jonathan P,

It's about ludicrously false equivalence.

(Five words.) 

Hi Bob,

I don't believe it should categorized as a false equivalency. They are more alike than they are different. And yes, one group is more well established, but to consider this a false equivalency paves the way for discussion about one group "not being as bad as the other". They're both bad. Period.

It's like having a debate on who was worse - Hitler or Stalin...

The difference is simple: one side has murdered thousands of innocents, the other has killed no one.

Do you see those two cases as equivalent? 

These two sides are not "equivalent."  And not just because one side has killed thousands of people and the other side has killed none. In my opinion that is the secondary consideration. 

The historical (and current )  support for the 'ideologies' of the two sides is not equivalent. Their potential for support is not equivalent.

53 years ago, which is a short time in a historical context of a mature nation, 29 % of the US House of Representatives and 27% of the US Senate, in other words elected officials of the highest order, voted to deny civil rights to people of color. They voted to deny people of color the right to attend "white" public schools, to eat in "white" restaurants, and to stay in "white" hotels and motels, and of course , to live in "white" neighborhoods. Many people in America who had reached adulthood when that vote was taken are still alive today, that's how recently it was.

America has a long history of elected officials being racist. That would be a whole separate article. Today, the governor of Maine is widely considered to be a racist. There are others who are less clear throated in voicing their beliefs, but they are there. In fact , the president of the United States repeatedly dog whistled to racist voters in the campaign, as can be seen by new polling which shows pretty clearly that Trump supporters are more racially biased than other Americans.

There is no such constituency, either historically or presently, for anarchism or communism, in the United States. To my knowledge there has never been an anarchist member of the House or Senate or state governorships nor even statehouse legislatures. Nor have there been communist government officials in the United States. There is no constituency for these ideologies.

The messages of these two sides are not "equivalent" in their danger , at all.

The Nazis are bad, but it's not about the Nazis either, is it? It's about Trump saying "both sides" again.

Soooooooooo, is it both sides that are bad? Again, yes.

Is Trump an A-hole? Sure.

Can we be done now?

-

the washington post has catalogued over 1000 lies trump has told in public since he took office in jan.

he should be forced out of office tomorrow

We will be "done" when Trump is gone.

Does that clear my reply to Jon up for you Perrie?

A

Nonsensical

Toddlers

Irruption

From

Asperger syndrome

Wow, how many hours did that take you?

It would take you hours to think something up like that for the baby menagerie ?

It was so simple, even a simpleton like me didn't have any trouble !

To be honest, it is kind of a "simpleton" comment that has no basis in fact at all.  Just a simpleton slam is all it is.  TO BE HONEST with you.

This article is being closed. It is no longer a discussion but a series of insults. You can do better folks.