Mars rover's new discoveries hailed as 'breakthroughs in astrobiology'
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
New discoveries by NASA's Mars rover Curiosity add to a growing body of evidence supporting the idea that microscopic organisms once lived on the red planet — and have some scientists considering the possibility that microbial life lives there still.
As described in a pair of scientific papers published Thursday in the journal Science, Curiosity detected carbon-containing compounds in ancient sediments on Mars and shifting levels of the organic molecule methane in the planet's atmosphere.
"Both these discoveries are breakthroughs in astrobiology," Inge Loes ten Kate, an astrobiologist at the Utrecht University in the Netherlands, said in a written commentary published along with the papers. She said "the question of whether life might have originated or existed on Mars is a lot more opportune now that we know that organic molecules were present on its surface" in the distant past.
Years ago, Curiosity found evidence that liquid water and the chemical ingredients for microbial life once existed on Mars. But in one of the new discoveries, the car-size rover found that levels of methane in the Martian atmosphere vary widely from season to season, with levels peaking at the end of summer in the planet's northern hemisphere.
In the paper about the new finding, Christopher Webster, a senior research scientist at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, California, and his co-authors conclude that "there remain unknown atmospheric or surface processes occurring in present-day Mars." Methane can be produced by nonbiological processes, but on Earth it's created mostly by microorganisms. So what's causing the varying methane levels on Mars?
The possibilities include reactions between water and rocks as well as "possible biological activity," Kirsten Siebach, a planetary geologist at Rice University in Houston, told NBC News MACH in an email.The rover also found that sediments dating back more than 3 billion years contained a variety of organic molecules, a discovery described in the other paper, which was co-authored by Jennifer Eigenbrode, a biogeochemist at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Maryland. Siebach said that while neither of the new discoveries "require life in the past or present, they present compelling evidence that Martian life could have existed in the past, that if it did we have a chance of finding evidence of it, and that there are ongoing reactions deep below the surface of Mars that could potentially be related to liquid water or life."
Curiosity, a tool-studded robotic vehicle weighing about 2,000 pounds, has been exploring Mars and conducting experiments for almost six years. It was launched from Cape Canaveral on Nov. 6, 2011, and landed on Mars on Aug. 12, 2012.
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Very cool discoveries. If only we could see what Mars was like, say 1 billion years ago. But if actual living microbial life were to be discovered on Mars, it would be quite the momentous event, even if it's not entirely surprising.
"In your veins runs iron made from the heart of a long-dead star. Such does the universe love life."
Unfortunately, it would probably look about the same as it does today. To see any life Mars might have had in its heyday, I think you'd have to go back about 4 billion years, about a half-billion years or so after planetary formation. Somewhere around there, anyway. Being so much smaller than Earth, it's supposed to have cooled much, much faster. I'm thinking most of its former atmosphere was lost to the solar wind fairly early on as well.
As for the article, reports of occasional methane detection have been getting me excited for years. I want it to be from something like seasonal microorganism 'blooms' so badly.
Can you imagine that? Microorganisms on another planet, which would have a completely different molecular biology from anything we're familiar with on Earth. Oh, the questions! How does it work? Similar at all to DNA? What does it 'eat'? How does it reproduce? Any mobility?
I would literally be freaking out if they discovered life on another planet.
Each discovery and each answer only leads to more questions. More questions to be answered with more follow-up questions. Gotta love science and curiosity.
Lol I would be joining you
Same here! I'm trying to wrap my brain around any organism that requires methane to live.
Funny to see this seed today since I just finished reading "The Mars Chronicles" yesterday
Just look at extremophile organisms that live and even thrive around hydrothermic vents in the ocean. It's amazing the myriad of conditions that organisms can exist.
I think the suspicion is that the methane is a waste product of microorganisms, like it mostly is on Earth, because it's only being detected in varying amounts during or near the end of the Martian summer (implying spurts of seasonal growth). But like the article says, there's also a possibility that it's coming from non-living chemical reactions in the summer warmth.
It's a mystery, but I really, really hope it's life.
E.A Same as the Use " Ice "and then translating that as " water " when we know that the Pressure on MARS does not allow for the formation of the water molecule, so " False Science " is leading at the moment.
See Photobucket " Making Mars Habitable " for further details read the Comments from a NASA Atmospheric Specialist and Phoenix " Weather Data " as to Pressure and Temperature!
The formation of the water molecule?
H2O molecules exist in the near-vacuum of space (at a lower pressure than Mars). They are on the moon, they are in asteroids, and the Kuiper belt is chock full of them (icy comets).
They're all over the place, they just have to be protected from direct exposure to some of the higher energy solar radiation in order to stay together as H2O molecules instead of as separate H and O atoms.
In both low pressure and low temperatures, water molecules exist in the solid state as ice crystals.
Water ice has been detected all over Mars (mostly underground at lower latitudes where it's protected from all of that nasty unshielded solar radiation, but also exposed on the surface in parts of the north polar region, where it can be somewhat protected by geometry (being perpendicular to the Sun).
Google it.
E.A LOL no need to Google anything, I had this discussions with atmospheric specialist with NASA and JPL and as I said it is " recorded " I also mentioned Phoenix and its " Weather Reporting " and what conclusion Scientist made of it,, so YOU Google to your Hearts Content!!!
WARNING :: Reply Button is " CRAP " again fix the damn thing!!!!
E.A Care to share with US, a Water Phase Diagram and show us how that " Miracle " is possible.
Hint I have one Posted just google my name and it would come up click and while there read what the " foremost authority of Atmospherics " had to say on it :-p
Here's a phase diagram for water with Mars and Earth plotted on it from the Niels Bohr Institute Centre for Ice and Science at the University of Copenhagen:
Here's the article it's from: Why is there no liquid water on Mars at present?
Notice how Mars is mostly left of the triple point, over there in the green 'solid' region?
E.A Yes if you looked at My Album and also the Phoenix Data, you would have noticed that the pressure of around 8.5. that is far bellow the point where the Molecule of water can exist, do we have agreement now?
Atmospheric Pressure and electrovolts are fundamental for molecular cohesion, see mass defect
E.A if you go to My Articles one is about " Hoax of Water on Mars " the Data is show there so is the false information about " water erosion " on MARS that is all to do with Wind and Sand Undercutting Inclines, that is also explained in the Photoalbum..
8.5 what? Millibar?
According to the NASA Fact Sheet for Mars , mean radius surface pressure varies from 4mb to 8.7mb. That averages out to 6.35mb, which is equal to 0.006266963 atmospheres, and that is exactly where Mars is plotted on that phase diagram.
Also, we're talking about phases, not the existence of molecules .
Um. No.
Atmospheric pressure has nothing to do with it. Water molecules are held together by polar covalent bonds, a sharing of electrons between atoms.
Water ice exists in space. Ever heard of the Kuiper Belt? It's full of icy bodies that sometimes fall inward as comets.
You keep mentioning Phoenix. Are you aware that NASA says Phoenix actually found some of that Martian water ice which you apparently think can't exist?
s220.photobucket.com/user/Eagle_Averro/library/Phoenix%20-Mars%20Mission?sort=3&page=1
E.A http://s220.photobucket.com/user/Eagle_Averro/library/Making%20Mars%20Habitable?sort=3&page=1
E.A
' fileurl=" http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd189/Eagle_Averro/05mars-popup.jpg">
Description
Have a closer look, imagine a Storm, Sand piling up under those Boulders on the overhang, now imagine after the storm, winds from a different angle, the wind removed the sand and undercuts the Boulders, they begin to fall, where would they GO? Ahh!! Yes in those " channels" and rolling polling down those channels they cause more errosion, and THAT is WATER, hmmm, where is my Geology Book? ,,,,,,,danwill dodging the subject? your "boulder hypothesis" wouldn
Are you seriously trying to pretend that you know something NASA doesn't (not to mention the Niels Bohr Institute), that it's all in your little personal Photobucket album, and that if people would just LOOK at it they'd see what a total genius you are and how utterly and contemptibly stupid all those planetary scientists at NASA are?
E.A Ok thanks for seeing my Genius, but that aside this is what NASA has been saying for decades::
Since their discovery early during the Mars Global Surveyor's Mars Orbiter Camera investigation, as first reported in June 2000, Martian gullies have presented a puzzle for the Mars science community: what fluid was responsible for the erosion that created the channels, and where did it come from? The gullies seem to be quite young in a geologic sense (millions of years or less), yet modern and geologically-recent Mars is an extremely dry place, where water ice sublimates directly to gas when the temperature is warm enough.
E.A Note the word " Maybe " and Believe "
You seen what I have stated and been Documented for over a decade, so this is what NASA has Retracted and admitted about " Water erosion " just a few months ago::
The researchers report that air would have flowed up the crater rim (red arrows) and the flanks of Mount Sharp (yellow arrows) in the morning when the Martian surface warmed, and reversed in the cooler late afternoon. The researchers created a computer model showing that the fine dust carried by these winds could accumulate over time to build a mound the size of Mount Sharp even if the ground were bare from the start. The blue arrows indicate the more variable wind patterns on the floor of the crater, which includes the Curiosity landing site (marked by the “x”). Image by NASA/JPL-Caltech/ESA/DLR/FU Berlin/MSSS
In a newly published study, scientists from Princeton University and the California Institute of Technology suggest that Mount Sharp most likely emerged as strong windsNews | February 27, 2017
Martian Winds Carve Mountains, Move Dust, Raise Dust carried dust and sand into the 96-mile-wide crater in which the mound sits.
› Full image and caption
Faith is such a wonderful; Quality for needed in Sciences, what would Drive them to the " Unknown " if there was NO Faith?
https://thenewstalkers.com/community/discussion/36222/mars-water-and-a-hoax
Swaying Back and Forth, shall we shall we not shall we …
And then ::
Weird Dark Streaks on Mars May Not Be Flowing Water After All
Daily news
20 March 2017
Mysterious water-like streaks on Mars might be sand flows instead
Soaked in… sand?
NASA/JPL/University of Arizona
By Leah Crane
Dust to dust. The mysterious dark flows on Mars may not be water after all. Instead, they could be rivulets of sand, set in motion by sunlight on the Martian surface.
But then who am I to stand " Between some ones FAITH and Science " right?
The first thing in your post is about gullies, and if this is where you got it from , then it also says this (boldface mine for emphasis):
Are you under the impression that the article says there's no water on Mars?
The next thing in your post is about whether Mount Sharp was created by blown dust or by sediment layers in an ancient seabed. So what? What does that have to do with present day water ice?
And the last thing is just something about dust devils.
How is any of that supposed to prove there's no water ice on Mars today?
E.A Keep reading you have just started ::
Soaked in… sand?
NASA/JPL/University of Arizona
By Leah Crane
Dust to dust. The mysterious dark flows on Mars may not be water after all. Instead, they could be rivulets of sand, set in motion by sunlight on the Martian surface.
But then who am I to stand " Between some ones FAITH and Science " right?
And...in this post...so what if those streaks and flows weren't made by short-lived water effects? Both articles point out that it's all still conjecture, and that we won't really know until we send a rover (or a person) to study those features.
A few posts ago you were telling me that pressures were too low on Mars for water molecules to even exist. Setting aside how completely ignorant that idea is to begin with, haven't you noticed that none of the articles you're posting say there's no water on Mars?
Your original argument was that water couldn't even exist on Mars, right? None of this stuff your plastering all over Gordy's seed is supporting your claim.
Post links to articles if articles are what you want to show people, and then discuss what you think is supposed to be in the article that supports your claim that "pressures are too low for water molecules to even exist" or whatever the hell you were talking about, because what you're doing now is just cluttering the page up with random, disconnected junk.
E.A what ever makes you Happy, have a nice day:
Can take a Horse to water ……….
Yes, disconnected junk.
Look at what you've done to this seed. You've got shit all over the place that not only has nothing to do with Gordy's seed, but also has nothing to do with your own spectacularly incorrect claim about water molecules not being able to exist on Mars, which happens to be the only reason I even engaged with you in the first place.
Science doesn't deal in faith. Science goes with facts and evidence.
Curiosity.
Oh, me, too! It would be the greatest discovery of humankind so far
Indeed. The first true discovery of extraterrestrial life.
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/Eagle_Averro/media/bWVkaWFJZDoxMTM2MDk5NA==/?ref=
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/Eagle_Averro/media/bWVkaWFJZDoxNTE5NzMwOQ==/?ref=1
And then NASA had to::
NEWS | November 20, 2017
Recurring Martian Streaks: Flowing Sand, Not Water?
This inner slope of a Martian crater has several of the seasonal dark streaks called "recurrent slope lineae," or RSL, that a November 2017 report interprets as granular flows, rather than darkening due to flowing water. The image is from the HiRISE camera on NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter. Credits: NASA/JPL-Caltech/UA/USGS
But then again the " Faithful " that Need water on MARS , would rather believe?
This is so unpalatable:::
"Full understanding of RSL is likely to depend upon on-site investigation of these features," said MRO Project Scientist Rich Zurek of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, California. "While the new report suggests that RSL are not wet enough to favor microbial life, it is likely that on-site investigation of these sites will still require special procedures to guard against introducing microbes from Earth, at least until they are definitively characterized. In particular, a full explanation of how these enigmatic features darken and fade still eludes us. Remote sensing at different times of day could provide important clues."
The University of Arizona operates HiRISE, which was built by Ball Aerospace & Technologies Corp., Boulder, Colorado. JPL, a division of Caltech in Pasadena, California, manages the MRO Project for the NASA Science Mission Directorate in Washington. Lockheed Martin Space Systems of Denver built the orbiter and supports its operations.
Media Contacts
Guy Webster
Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif.
818-354-6278
guy.webster@jpl.nasa.gov
Jennifer LaVista
U.S. Geological Survey, Denver
303-202-4764
jlavista@usgs.gov
LOL Someone thinks that Water , Hydrogen , Oxygen , has nothing to do with Methane and what the seed is about :-)
E.A Wait " Life " is a Tag, what does that mean? or " Astrobiology " does that have anything to do with chemistry?
Ahh I get is " Bigotry " they only want what they want and not what is a FACT!!
My Album on " Making Mars Habitable " would not exist had I the thought that " water is impossible on Mars " those that take the time to go through it will notice that I in numerous times stated " We can extract Water from the regolith's " I have also pointed out the " Fish Bone " other wise named " Glass Tubes " and how Lava Caverns and the Huge VENTS ( 90 X 100 Meters See NASA documentation )documented, can be used as " Distillation Towers " as different gases stratify at different levels due to their density and hence we have ready made " refineries " that use of the word insitu, is freely used, to make the point that we can built Robots on Mars using the Martian Soil, meaning we have Ceramic and not metallic robots, which would be Ideal in an " electromagnetic Soup Bowl " that Mars surface is!
Also note that NO Surface habitation is mentioned in ANY of my propositions, Only " Mad Dogs and Fools " will think that surface habitation on MARS is now possible, The Lava Tubes that would be at about 90 Deg to the VENTS when sealed on both ends would make Great Habitations Protected by the radiation!
For Further details take the time to see ALL of the Data pertaining to that!
In you own words:
E.A Yes and you think that a Human Habitation Zone will have those pressures?
Don't you understand that low pressure doesn't have anything to do with whether or not a water molecule can 'exist' or stay together? A very, very high pressure environment might have energy levels that could break the bonds, but not low ones.
Are you confusing solid ice, liquid water, and gaseous vapor with the existence of the molecule itself? Whether water is solid, liquid or gas, it's all the same molecule -- H2O, two hydrogen atoms and one oxygen. Pressure and temps affect what phase H2O is in (ice, liquid, or vapor), but it's all water molecules.
Humans on Mars would have to mine ice outside in the low pressure environment and then put it in some kind of airlock pressure vessel to bring it up to the pressure and temps inside their habitat, turning the ice into a liquid in the process. But it's all the same stuff, it's all water molecules.
E.A take this as the Last " Free Lesson "
triple point
See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
Colour Bold and Font size added by E.A
Yes, I know what a triple point is. What does that have to do with anything I just said?
You might as well have posted a picture of a fruit fly or something. It would be about as relevant.