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Manafort Folds. Now What? - The New York Times

  

Category:  News & Politics

Via:  jbb  •  6 years ago  •  153 comments

Manafort Folds. Now What? - The New York Times
His cooperation agreement with Robert Mueller is the start of a new chapter in the special counsel’s investigation. By Noah Bookbinder, Barry Berke and Norman L. Eisen Mr. Bookbinder is the executive director of Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington. Mr. Berke is a co-chairman of the litigation department at Kramer Levin Naftalis & Frankel. Mr. Eisen is the chairman of CREW. Sept. 14, 2018

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T



Manafort Folds. Now What? - The New York Times

His cooperation agreement with Robert Mueller is the start of a new chapter in the special counsel’s investigation.

By Noah Bookbinder, Barry Berke and Norman L. Eisen - September 14, 2018






Those who practice criminal law — including the three of us — have long predicted that Paul Manafort, the disgraced former Trump campaign chairman, would eventually fold to Robert Mueller, the special counsel. On Friday, we were proven right: Mr. Manafort and the special counsel have reached an extensive cooperation agreement, among the most significant developments in Mr. Mueller’s investigation to date.

The capitulation came in spectacular fashion: According to prosecutors, Mr. Manafort has already participated in a so-called proffer session, in which he described information that investigators deemed valuable. Mr. Manafort’s agreement will also require him to give further interviews without the presence of his own counsel, turn over documents and testify in other proceedings. His surrender is complete. We will soon see what it means for the president.

Mr. Manafort’s cooperation obviously represents an enormous pivot from the previous strategies he had seemed to be pursuing — trying to persuade a jury to ignore the strong evidence against him based on personal sympathies or, if that failed, to obtain a pardon from President Trump. In our estimation, this about-face represents a realistic judgment on his part, not to mention vindication of Mr. Mueller’s strategy so far.

A quick pardon was always a long shot. It would be hard for Mr. Trump to justify politically, even given his willingness to use the pardon power with seeming abandon. A pardon would not protect Mr. Manafort from the wide array of state charges that could be brought against him.


Mr. Manafort now has the ability to trade all of the valuable information he has regarding the president and those close to him for a significantly reduced prison sentence. He is the first Trump campaign participant in the now-infamous 2016 Trump Tower meeting to break with the president.

Mysteries around that meeting abound. They include whether then-candidate Trump knew about the meeting in advance and why Mr. Trump announced after the meeting had been scheduled that he would soon be giving a major speech on “ the things that have taken place with the Clintons.” Now that Mr. Manafort is cooperating, we may soon have answers.


If all that were not bad enough news for Mr. Trump, Mr. Manafort may also be able to shed light on other episodes during his tenure at the helm of the Trump campaign. Those include the 80-plus contacts between the campaign and other associates and Russia-linked individuals; the campaign’s possible collaboration with WikiLeaks; and the amendment of the Republican National Committee platform on arming Ukraine. Given Mr. Manafort’s history of working with Russian oligarchs and his close ties to Roger Stone, an informal Trump adviser, Mr. Manafort was well-placed to know about any attempts by the campaign or its allies to collude with Russian operatives and others engaged in illegal election interference.



Mr. Manafort may also be able to shed light on obstruction of justice by the president. If the reports of pardon negotiations between the president’s personal attorneys and Mr. Manafort’s lawyers are true, that raises the question of whether any of these discussions could be construed as offering a pardon in exchange for Mr. Manafort’s silence.


Cooperation can be like dominoes. Mr. Manafort’s cooperation is not limited to actions of the president, and if he can help the special counsel bring charges against others close to Mr. Trump, they too may end up cooperating and further strengthening the case that Mr. Mueller is seeking to build.

For Mr. Mueller, the plea deal and cooperation agreement represent momentum: more evidence of his continued success in bringing wrongdoers around the president to justice. It vindicates his strategy of methodically building cases against those in Mr. Trump’s circle and applying pressure on them to cooperate up the chain.

For the president, it is ominous. Yet another person who was in Mr. Trump’s immediate orbit has fallen to the rule of law. Now that Mr. Manafort is helping the investigation and may testify in future criminal proceedings — not to mention congressional ones — Mr. Trump cannot be resting easy.

But most important, for the American people, today’s outcome is further proof that no one — no matter how important or powerful — is immune from justice. Mr. Trump would do well to study the heights from which his former top aide has fallen, and the depth of his plunge.

Noah Bookbinder is the executive director of Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington and a former federal corruption prosecutor. Barry Berke is a co-chairman of the litigation department at Kramer Levin Naftalis & Frankel, where he is a partner specializing in white-collar criminal defense. Norman Eisen, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, is the chairman of CREW and author of the forthcoming “The Last Palace: Europe’s Turbulent Century in Five Lives and One Legendary House.”















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JBB
Professor Principal
1  seeder  JBB    6 years ago

Things are heating up for trump. He should resign with his last shred of, well, whatever he calls it...

The capitulation came in spectacular fashion: According to prosecutors, Mr. Manafort has already participated in a so-called proffer session, in which he described information that investigators deemed valuable. Mr. Manafort’s agreement will also require him to give further interviews without the presence of his own counsel, turn over documents and testify in other proceedings. His surrender is complete. We will soon see what it means for the president.
 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1  JohnRussell  replied to  JBB @1    6 years ago
He should resign with his last shred of, well, whatever he calls it...

Hair ? 

 
 
 
1stwarrior
Professor Participates
1.2  1stwarrior  replied to  JBB @1    6 years ago

PPPSSSSSTTTTT - I know you don't like to follow the rules - but - "SEEDS THAT ARE OP-EDS SHOULD BE CLEARLY MARKED AS SUCH IN THEIR TITLE"!!!!!!!!!

Little thing called the CoC.  Your actual title "should" have read

Opinion - Manafort Folds. Now What?
Oh yeah - FYI - Manafort DID NOT plead guilty.  "For Mr. Mueller, the plea deal and cooperation agreement represent momentum:" - two entirely different ballgames.  The "cooperation agreement" IS NOT an admission of guilt, but it is an issue of stipulation that - if I do this, you will do this - period.
Writing false information is also a violation of the CoC - "Manafort, Trump's Campaign Manager, Has Plead Guilty" is a lie - Manafort has NOT plead guilty.
 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
1.2.1  seeder  JBB  replied to  1stwarrior @1.2    6 years ago
Manafort has NOT plead guilty.

What in fuck are you bitching about? You are dead wrong. Manafort has plead guilty. Even Fox News says so...

Paul Manafort pleads guilty, agrees to cooperate in deal with Mueller team

 
 
 
A. Macarthur
Professor Guide
1.2.2  A. Macarthur  replied to  1stwarrior @1.2    6 years ago

Manafort has plead guilty to a charge of conspiracy ... and a pardon will do Trump no good since, should one be offered, acceptance is agreeing to guilt, the pardoned individual can be subpoenaed by a grand jury with no fifth amendment right ... 

It is not at all likely that Manafort could have made such a deal without understanding that he must now answer all questions in conjunction with the investigation. 

I believe he is still incarcerated, likely to emphasize what life will be should he renege.

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
1.2.3  Studiusbagus  replied to  1stwarrior @1.2    6 years ago

Psssssst....OOOOOPS!

Paul Manafort conceded to committing several federal crimes and agreed to cooperate with the Justice Department, including in special counsel Robert Mueller's investigation of Russian interference in the 2016 presidential election. Manafort pleaded guilty in federal court in Washington, DC, on Friday to one count of conspiracy against the US and one count of conspiracy to obstruct justice due to attempts to tamper with witnesses.

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
1.2.4  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Studiusbagus @1.2.3    6 years ago

What gives Trump a problem with the pardon thing is that Manafort pled guilty to the 10 remaining charges out of Virginia as well.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
2  seeder  JBB    6 years ago

Manafort, Trump's Campaign Manager, Has Plead Guilty to "Conspiring Against The United States". Let that sink in...

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
2.1  Studiusbagus  replied to  JBB @2    6 years ago

I just read a bulletin from NBC...

Seems now it's Pence's ass that's feeling some heat. Manafort picked the running mate and has information on him and Flynn that may get a bit sticky for holy roller boy.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
2.1.1  Tessylo  replied to  Studiusbagus @2.1    6 years ago

I'm sure he's on his knees praying to Putin right now

 
 
 
A. Macarthur
Professor Guide
2.1.2  A. Macarthur  replied to  Studiusbagus @2.1    6 years ago

I hate to say “I told everyone so,” but ...

I did more than once.

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
2.1.3  Studiusbagus  replied to  Tessylo @2.1.1    6 years ago

Ohhhh. Can you imagine a twofer? AFTER the Dems take the house? 

President Warren and VP Pelosi....

And we thought they went nuts from the last president????   LOL

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
2.1.4  seeder  JBB  replied to  Studiusbagus @2.1    6 years ago
Seems now it's Pence's ass that's feeling some heat.

Ideally, Manafort gets Pence to fall on his sword first so a non-tainted new VP can be confirmed...before.

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
2.1.5  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  JBB @2.1.4    6 years ago

Well, since technically there is no Speaker of the House until after the election, we will have to see who that will be. If it's Pelosi then heads will explode on the Right since it is the Speaker who is next in line if the VP can't serve.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
2.1.6  seeder  JBB  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @2.1.5    6 years ago
If it's Pelosi then heads will explode on the Right since it is the Speaker who is next in line if the VP can't serve.

I like the way you think...

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
2.1.7  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  JBB @2.1.6    6 years ago
I like the way you think...

JBB you know as well as I do, "Facts is facts".

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Participates
2.1.8  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Studiusbagus @2.1.3    6 years ago
President Warren and VP Pelosi..

Oh, yes. Wingnut heads would  explode (luckily the blast will have little or no effect on bystanders)

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
2.1.9  Tessylo  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @2.1.8    6 years ago

Giggle

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3  Kavika     6 years ago
Manafort, Trump's Campaign Manager, Has Plead Guilty to"Conspiring Against The United States". Let that sink in

Talk about being up shit creek, Manafort is up that creek in a lead canoe and no paddle. 

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
3.1  seeder  JBB  replied to  Kavika @3    6 years ago
Manafort is up that creek in a lead canoe and no paddle. 

Manafort has agreed to talk and he was in the room, literally. It is time to stock up for the Take Off Party...

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
4  JohnRussell    6 years ago

The biggest bit of info Manafort can give is whether or not Trump knew about the Trump Tower meeting of Jun 9 2016 in advance. 

If they can nail that down trump is finished. 

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
4.1  Studiusbagus  replied to  JohnRussell @4    6 years ago
If they can nail that down trump is finished. 

If they put the Russians in Trump's Tower office....hoo boy!

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
4.2  livefreeordie  replied to  JohnRussell @4    6 years ago

Nonsense. It’s meaningless. There is NO crime

why do you love the KGB and hate America

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
PhD Quiet
4.2.1  igknorantzrulz  replied to  livefreeordie @4.2    6 years ago
love the KGB and hate America

sounds like Trump or a Trump defender to me

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
4.2.2  Tessylo  replied to  livefreeordie @4.2    6 years ago

Keep telling yourself that 'pastor"

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
4.2.3  seeder  JBB  replied to  livefreeordie @4.2    6 years ago
Nonsense. It’s meaningless. There is NO crime

Tell that to Manafort. He was found guilty of eight felonies and has now plead guilty to a dozen more...

By all rights, Paul Manafort should spend the rest of his life in prison. We will see if he redeems himself.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
4.2.4  livefreeordie  replied to  JBB @4.2.3    6 years ago

I’m not talking about about Manafort’s crimes (although they are typical statist nonsense). I’m referring to the supposed crimes of Trump.

the “collusion” charges and the obstruction of justice charges are both laughable

 
 
 
A. Macarthur
Professor Guide
4.2.5  A. Macarthur  replied to  livefreeordie @4.2    6 years ago

Remember when they used to call us “snowflakes” ... revenge is best when served cold.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
4.2.6  livefreeordie  replied to  A. Macarthur @4.2.5    6 years ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
4.2.7  JohnRussell  replied to  livefreeordie @4.2.6    6 years ago

The rules of this site require us to tolerate your endless "eccentricities" without the ability to respond to your "misunderstandings" of this country in any pointed detail. 

My guess would be that maybe 5% of Americans would have notable sympathy with your political positions, and that's probably stretching it quite a bit. Your views are on the outside looking in for a reason. 

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
4.2.8  livefreeordie  replied to  JohnRussell @4.2.7    6 years ago

Your views are typical of the extremist left that despises our Constitution and individualism 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
5  Tessylo    6 years ago

The dominoes are falling.  Yes!  Where is the latest rant from the Twitter in chief about the fake news New York times?

laughing dude

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
6  Kavika     6 years ago

Damn, Trump has surrounded himself with more felons than a Mafia Don...Happy  That maybe why he is known as the ''The Donald''....LOL

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
7  livefreeordie    6 years ago

Trump should not only pardon Manafort, he should fire Mueller, Rosenstein, and Sessions. This is the biggest political farce in our nation’s history. It is a collaboration of the deep state and Establishment politicians against Americans.

the FBI, Justice Department, and Mueller are no different than the KGB and have been in this conspiracy against America and Americans for over 50 years.

time to dismantle the Deep State and start the return to liberty.

the left used to share this view until their hatred of Trump became greater than their hatred of the deep state

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
7.1  Tessylo  replied to  livefreeordie @7    6 years ago

The deep state?  Oh FFS.  crazy

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
7.1.1  livefreeordie  replied to  Tessylo @7.1    6 years ago

Not surprised you like having KGB and Gestapo in America as long as it’s Trump they are after 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
7.1.2  Tessylo  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.1    6 years ago

crazyyellingnot listeninggoofy

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
PhD Quiet
7.1.3  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Tessylo @7.1    6 years ago

"The deep state"

of Denial

 
 
 
Phoenyx13
Sophomore Silent
7.1.4  Phoenyx13  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.1    6 years ago
Not surprised you like having KGB and Gestapo in America as long as it’s Trump they are after 

maybe you can tell everyone exactly who is in this "deep state", where they meet, what their agenda is etc ?

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
7.1.5  livefreeordie  replied to  Phoenyx13 @7.1.4    6 years ago

The deep state who are enemies of the liberty of the people are the IRS, the Justice Dept, the FBI, the ATF, elements of the State Dept, and the CIA (when it gets involved in domestic affairs as it did with John Brennan). 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
7.1.6  JohnRussell  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.5    6 years ago

DnEPPPVUwAA5guW.jpg

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
7.1.7  livefreeordie  replied to  JohnRussell @7.1.6    6 years ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
7.1.8  JohnRussell  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.7    6 years ago

Not being a Trump supporter or campaign aide, I don't have any awards or commendations from the KGB

See the source image

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
7.1.9  livefreeordie  replied to  JohnRussell @7.1.8    6 years ago

So you can post the proof of this John. [Removed]

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
7.1.10  JohnRussell  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.9    6 years ago
So you can post the proof of this John.

?????

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
7.1.11  Tessylo  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.9    6 years ago

[No value]

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
7.1.12  livefreeordie  replied to  Tessylo @7.1.11    6 years ago

Simple.  The Deep State and the rest of the bureaucracy only serve to control and limit the liberty of the people. They are no different than the KGB or Gestapo

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
7.1.13  livefreeordie  replied to  JohnRussell @7.1.10    6 years ago

Show us who has received these awards and commendations John

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
7.1.14  Split Personality  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.9    6 years ago

In 2012, Putin presented Tillerson with a Russian medal at an award ceremony of heads and employees of energy companies at the St. Petersburg economic forum in St. Petersburg, Russia.

maxresdefault.jpg

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
7.1.15  livefreeordie  replied to  Split Personality @7.1.14    6 years ago

CB1E3E3277834FA49B922EDA0A642869.jpeg Ooh, the Secretary of State shaking hands with a foreign leader. That’s truly incriminating.  You’ll love this one of Schumer and Putin

 
 
 
Phoenyx13
Sophomore Silent
7.1.16  Phoenyx13  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.5    6 years ago
The deep state who are enemies of the liberty of the people are the IRS, the Justice Dept, the FBI, the ATF, elements of the State Dept, and the CIA (when it gets involved in domestic affairs as it did with John Brennan)

why not throw in the Dept of Education or Agriculture or just the entire government while you're at it so you can have your dream of theocracy or anarchy ( which are two of the consequences of getting rid of your version of the "deep state" ). Let me guess - your list doesn't include the President, Vice President or any other conservative who's views you agree with, right ? Face Palm  ... so from what i gather - the "deep state" is anyone who doesn't lockstep with your beliefs or viewpoints .. ( sounds eerily familiar from a historical standpoint... )

 
 
 
MrFrost
Professor Expert
7.1.17  MrFrost  replied to  livefreeordie @7.1.12    6 years ago
The Deep State and the rest of the bureaucracy only serve to control and limit the liberty of the people.

Pretty sure they aren't the ones trying to ban abortions Larry. 

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
7.2  Studiusbagus  replied to  livefreeordie @7    6 years ago

Wow! How many times a day do you have to wipe the spit off that screen?

Gonna be fun watching the "every channel live" resignation in disgrace of Trump. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
7.2.1  Kavika   replied to  Studiusbagus @7.2    6 years ago

Deep in the bowels of the Pentagon the deep state stirs. 

624.jpeg

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
Senior Quiet
9  Colour Me Free    6 years ago

I do not know if there were any 'advanced interrogation techniques' used .. but there is certain smell of strong arm tactics when dealing with a federal counterintelligence investigation.  Just saying..

I am curious about something... Manafort was the goal from the beginning, wasn't he?     so the investigation must be over and now the framing of the charges will begin against the president?  or is this still going to continue?  I know that no one has the answer - I am interested in what some think the next step will be....

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
9.1  Tessylo  replied to  Colour Me Free @9    6 years ago

You're talking torture?  Give me a break.  Just saying.

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
Senior Quiet
9.1.1  Colour Me Free  replied to  Tessylo @9.1    6 years ago

 I was being sarcastic …..  just saying .. but you probably knew that already

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
9.1.2  Tessylo  replied to  Colour Me Free @9.1.1    6 years ago

A sarcasm tag would have been helpful. Just saying

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
Senior Quiet
9.1.3  Colour Me Free  replied to  Tessylo @9.1.2    6 years ago

Have a nice day, going to be a beautiful one I am thinking...

 
 
 
SteevieGee
Professor Silent
9.1.4  SteevieGee  replied to  Tessylo @9.1    6 years ago

Trump did express an interest in bringing back torture.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
9.2  seeder  JBB  replied to  Colour Me Free @9    6 years ago
I am interested in what some think the next step will be....

I expect multiple felony indictments will be issued against Roger Stone, Jarrod Kushner and Donald Trump Jr...

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
Senior Quiet
9.2.1  Colour Me Free  replied to  JBB @9.2    6 years ago

Never thought of those 3 as of much significance in the scheme of things .. going to be interesting to watch things unfold..

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
9.3  bbl-1  replied to  Colour Me Free @9    6 years ago

No.  The goal of 'this investigation' is the extent and the manner in which a foreign power infiltrated the US electoral process. 

Manafort had Russian connections.  It remains to be proven, however----it is possible and very likely---- that 'the Trump' business also has Russian connections.  Nothing illegal about that, of course depending on what those connections were and with whom those connections were with and what the purpose those connections were to achieve.

 
 
 
A. Macarthur
Professor Guide
9.3.1  A. Macarthur  replied to  bbl-1 @9.3    6 years ago

This will all take us to Trump's involvement with the Russia Mafia, years of money laundering through real estate deals … and other criminal conspiracies.

The most prominent figure in American takedowns of Russian mafia figures is … guess who?

BRUCE OHR!

Bruce Ohr Fought Russian Organized Crime. Now He’s a Target of Trump.

Connect the dots.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
9.3.2  Tessylo  replied to  A. Macarthur @9.3.1    6 years ago

Jesus, the American mafia, who Rump has been involved with for years wasn't bad enough and he has ties with the Russian mob and their leader, Putin. Who is next?

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
Senior Quiet
9.3.3  Colour Me Free  replied to  bbl-1 @9.3    6 years ago
No.  The goal of 'this investigation' is the extent and the manner in which a foreign power infiltrated the US electoral process. 

Not originally I don't think it was .. there was not proof of collusion with the Russians, Robert Mueller had broad range of power in this particular counterintelligence investigation, so he went for the low hanging fruit first and worked his way up to Manafort - which should lead to the President... (?) ... Why would an investigation into the extent a foreign power infiltrated the US election require a special counsel?  Have to look that up..

Nothing illegal about that, of course depending on what those connections were and with whom those connections were with and what the purpose those connections were to achieve.

Seems like there is still a great deal of 'if'n' going on .. but I guess it is early .. Manafort did just cave - What if there is nothing on Trump that Manafort can give that links him to anything directly .. 'we' will prob still hear about it. just as 'we' do about White Water and emails etc..

Thanks for you opinion bbl-1 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Expert
9.3.4  Dulay  replied to  Colour Me Free @9.3.3    6 years ago
Not originally I don't think it was .. there was not proof of collusion with the Russians

There sure as hell IS evidence of people in the Trump campaign conspiring with the Russians. Papadopoulos, Page, Jr, Manafort, Flynn, Cohen and Kushner all met with Russians BEFORE the election. Trump signed a letter of intent with a Russian investor in Oct, 2015, while campaigning...

Why would an investigation into the extent a foreign power infiltrated the US election require a special counsel? 

The AG recused, the DAG was appointed by a principle of the investigation. You should go read Mueller's appointment letter. 

Seems like there is still a great deal of 'if'n' going on

Much of that is because Mueller has been mum. Mueller isn't 'feeding the beast' and isn't trickling out information like Starr did. 'We' didn't know until the minute Manafort elocuted that there was a cooperation agreement. 

As bbl-1 said, if the connection between Manafort weren't for corrupt purposes, it would have been all good. The corrupt and clandestine acts are what put Manafort's gonads in a vise. The same will be true for Trump et. al.

IMHO, in order to qualify for a plea and a reduced sentence, Manafort has either corroborated what Mueller already has evidence of or he has already ADDED information to fill in the blanks. 

What if there is nothing on Trump that Manafort can give that links him to anything directly

Remember, Manafort's Ukrainian sugar daddy was a Russian puppet. Manafort knows a shit load about the ins and outs of what the Russians have done for over a decade, he knows their contacts that were here and who are STILL here. 

Secondly, the charging information cites a conspiracy with the Ukraine, the Israelis and American journalists to disseminate false information in the US.   

Those are both counterintelligence gold mines. 

So despite Trump's narcissism and the obsession of his supporters, it doesn't have to be ALL about him. 

It looks like a few more of Trump minions, including his son, are on the block. Stone is almost a shoe in for jail, and Jr. is next, especially if he lied to Congress. 

Kushner has an EXCELLENT lawyer so maybe he told the truth to Mueller and will get out to this unscathed, at least Federally. The charges in NY are a different question altogether. 

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
9.4  Studiusbagus  replied to  Colour Me Free @9    6 years ago
am curious about something... Manafort was the goal from the beginning, wasn't he?   

I'm of two minds on this.

I think these were the needed steps to close him in a corner so they could use him. And now he will buy himself out.

                  OR

They made a deal with Manafort long before the first gavel was thrown down.

Make him look stressed in public view...lessens the chances that he'll keel over doing body shots in St. Petersburg.

 
 
 
A. Macarthur
Professor Guide
9.4.1  A. Macarthur  replied to  Studiusbagus @9.4    6 years ago

Such investigations generally start at the edges and work their way to the center(piece); along the way, those who might "flip" are informed that the "first one in the door" usually gets the best deal. As each flipper, pleader of guilt, etc. is indicted, convicted, sentenced, etc., a message is thus sent to others who may fear that they are next, and tend to come forward, hoping for a better outcome than if they were (i.e.) subpoenaed.

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
10  bbl-1    6 years ago

The real 'stick up the arse' is this:  Manafort, a really-really rich guy except the money wasn't really-really his.

The Trump:  Exactly the same thing.  The Trump is 'broke arse.'  The Trump simply has too many 'real estate deals' that were money laundering services for criminal entities.  Remove that factor and the Trump is one 'broke arse' dude. 

Ivanka for pole dancer.

 
 
 
Skrekk
Sophomore Participates
10.1  Skrekk  replied to  bbl-1 @10    6 years ago

At this point it seems like all the "best people" Trump surrounds himself with are either going to jail and/or testifying for the prosecution.....

Up next are Don Jr and Jared.

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
10.1.1  bbl-1  replied to  Skrekk @10.1    6 years ago

This too.  It seems that everybody that gets 'too close' to the Trump gets singed, screwed, cheated, frauded or indicted. 

And through it all the Trump still stands.  Yeah well, in the game of Russian Roulette there are six chambers.  The Trump has played this game for too long.  Soon, the chamber will be his and Putin will let him flail in the wind.  The Trump is 'used goods.'

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
10.1.2  Studiusbagus  replied to  bbl-1 @10.1.1    6 years ago

The nail in the coffin will be Putin's poison pill video tape. Then the reality that Trump lied to all his gophers and he't not worth anything.

And we'll still get a bunch of "true believers" defending him while still in a trance.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
10.1.3  seeder  JBB  replied to  Studiusbagus @10.1.2    6 years ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
10.1.4  bbl-1  replied to  Studiusbagus @10.1.2    6 years ago

Not sure.  The 'poison pill tape' will be meaningless to the rabid base.  After all, Vanessa Williams could not be Miss America but Melania Trump can be First Lady about sums it up. 

Dirty money will draw support from the Trump.  When America learns that 'the Trump' is not rich and a 'true king of debt' like he claimed and has been floated by money laundering for decades---------then they will know.

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
10.1.5  Studiusbagus  replied to  bbl-1 @10.1.4    6 years ago

Just the fact that American banks nor Wall St. will touch him should have warned them but....when you can't see the trees...

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
PhD Quiet
10.1.6  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Studiusbagus @10.1.5    6 years ago
trees...

on

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
11  Galen Marvin Ross    6 years ago

I heard last night that Manafort will be Mueller's bitch for as long as Mueller says so and, then he gets to be sentenced, the paperwork in the plea deal indicates that Manafort's sentence won't start until Mueller is satisfied with the information that Manafort gives him, in the mean time Manafort gets to enjoy club fed in Washington.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
11.1  seeder  JBB  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @11    6 years ago
Manafort will be Mueller's bitch

Well, that is what he gets for "Conspiring Against the United States". What did Manafort expect? Roses? A parade? 

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
11.1.1  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  JBB @11.1    6 years ago
Well, that is what he gets for "Conspiring Against the United States". What did Manafort expect? Roses? A parade? 

Sure, isn't that what Trump wants? A parade down Pennsylvania Ave. to honor HIM?

 
 
 
Rmando
Sophomore Silent
12  Rmando    6 years ago

It's almost sad to see the liberals and the Trump haters get their hopes so worked up on this. Manafort isn't going to be a nail in Trumps coffin anymore than Flynn, Popadopolous, Rick Gates or anybody else. I've been hearing for the last two years how all these guys will "flip" and that Trumps impeachment is imminent.

The funny thing is that nothing at the Trump Tower meeting was illegal. Do Democrats really believe GOP senators will vote to remove Trump when we know for a fact the DNC and Hillary actually BOUGHT Russian propaganda and then inserted it into the FISA process to spy on the Trump campaign??

There are people who belong in jail and they are all Democrats. The double standards are so obvious they are blinding.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
12.1  Tessylo  replied to  Rmando @12    6 years ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
livefreeordie
Junior Silent
12.1.1  livefreeordie  replied to  Tessylo @12.1    6 years ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
12.1.2  bbl-1  replied to  livefreeordie @12.1.1    6 years ago

Uh.  Yeah sure.

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
12.2  Studiusbagus  replied to  Rmando @12    6 years ago

That was a dumbass comment...they all have flipped.

Just because Mueller hasn't told you anything doesn't mean he hasn't got anything.

When this all gets laid out on a table you'll be searching for a new screen identity and denying you were Rmando.

 
 
 
Skrekk
Sophomore Participates
12.2.1  Skrekk  replied to  Studiusbagus @12.2    6 years ago
...they all have flipped.

One thing I found astounding but not surprising was Trump's statement that "flipping should be illegal."   So the guy who took an oath to faithfully enforce our laws is saying that it should be illegal for witnesses to cooperate with the government.

We really do have a mob boss for prez.

 
 
 
lennylynx
Sophomore Quiet
12.2.2  lennylynx  replied to  Skrekk @12.2.1    6 years ago

President Soprano don't like rats!! tough guy

 
 
 
MrFrost
Professor Expert
12.3  MrFrost  replied to  Rmando @12    6 years ago
It's almost sad to see the liberals and the Trump haters get their hopes so worked up on this.

Funny, I remember the right saying the same thing when Flynn, Cohen, Popadopalous, Gates, etc. were arrested. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
13  Kavika     6 years ago

Now that Manafort is singing like a canary he'll no longer be the good guy that Trump has been touting. It's under the bus for Manafort. 

trump-bus-co-go-ahead-throw-em-under-there-trump-26430331.png

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
13.1  Tessylo  replied to  Kavika @13    6 years ago

'Now that Manafort is singing like a canary he'll no longer be the good guy that Trump has been touting. It's under the bus for Manafort.'

So true, wasn't the turd in chief saying - before Manafort flipped - he and his family are good people?  

chuckle

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Participates
13.1.1  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  Tessylo @13.1    6 years ago

Yep, he did give a rambling explanation of "flippers".

I wonder if he was talking about this?

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
14  bbl-1    6 years ago

I'll add this too.  Manafort is between a rock and a hard place.  But, considering his 'Russian financial dilemmas', something drew him and opened the door to Trump.  Could it be that the pathways into the Russian oligarch 'money cows' were already cut and traveled by Trump Enterprises?  Thusly, Manafort saw a clear and free path back into the 'den'? 

 
 
 
Skrekk
Sophomore Participates
14.1  Skrekk  replied to  bbl-1 @14    6 years ago
Could it be that the pathways into the Russian oligarch 'money cows' were already cut and traveled by Trump Enterprises?  Thusly, Manafort saw a clear and free path back into the 'den'? 

Almost certainly that's the case.    Heck, Trump was renting apartments to the very same Russian mobsters both he and Manafort had borrowed money from.

The part I really love about this is Manafort's plan to repay the $10 million loan from Oleg Deripaska by giving him "inside information" from the Trump WH.    It's also not clear if that $10 million is in addition to the $18.9 million he already owed Deripaska.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
14.1.1  Kavika   replied to  Skrekk @14.1    6 years ago

And Manafort just forfeited his condo in Trump Tower...Hmmmmm 

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
14.1.2  bbl-1  replied to  Kavika @14.1.1    6 years ago

"Forfeited his condo in Trump Tower." 

I certainly hope the DOJ rents it out to some FBI agents.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
14.1.3  Kavika   replied to  bbl-1 @14.1.2    6 years ago
I certainly hope the DOJ rents it out to some FBI agents.

What could be better. 

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
14.1.4  bbl-1  replied to  Skrekk @14.1    6 years ago

Who knows?  Trump claimed he's worth $10 Billion.   He must of had some windfalls after his 'casino deflations and bankruptcies.

And by the way.  Wasn't the casino failings occurring at about the same time Stone introduced Melania to the Trump?    

 
 
 
SteevieGee
Professor Silent
14.1.5  SteevieGee  replied to  bbl-1 @14.1.4    6 years ago

So... Melania was an arranged marriage to unite the Trump, Putin, and Jackmeov families?  Wow it all makes sense now.

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
14.1.6  bbl-1  replied to  SteevieGee @14.1.5    6 years ago

Don't know.

But Melania's "I really don't care---Do You" jacket is already conveniently forgotten forever.

I still wonder what that was all about.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
14.1.7  devangelical  replied to  SteevieGee @14.1.5    6 years ago

if Jackmeov is Melania's last name, you just made my week.

 
 
 
ghostly bear
Freshman Silent
15  ghostly bear    6 years ago

 Dear Noah Bookbinder, Barry Berke and Norman L. Eisen Mr. Bookbinder. All three of you should resign from practing law. Are you familar with the fruit of the posiness tree.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
15.1  devangelical  replied to  ghostly bear @15    6 years ago

derpity doo duh

 
 
 
ghostly bear
Freshman Silent
16  ghostly bear    6 years ago

Everyone that signed those fisa warrants will be indicted. 

 
 
 
Studiusbagus
Sophomore Quiet
16.1  Studiusbagus  replied to  ghostly bear @16    6 years ago

Ahhhh. More derp.

 
 

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