Pelosi says House Democrats will begin process to obtain Trump tax returns
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
WASHINGTON — Nancy Pelosi said Democrats will begin to seek President Donald Trump's tax returns — a move likely to prompt outrage from the White House - when they take control of the U.S. House of Representatives in January.
The House Ways and Means Committee will "take the first steps," said Pelosi, who has the backing of her members to become the next speaker of the House in January.
"There is popular demand for the Congress to request the president's tax returns," she said, speaking to reporters. "I'm sure the White House will resist, so the question is where do we go from there."
Trump defied decades of tradition when he refused to release his tax records while running for president and after taking office. There is no law or rule compelling a president or candidate to do so, but nearly every nominee and president since 1976 has done so.
Democrats have argued that Trump's tax returns are crucial in determining whether his sprawling business operations present a conflict of interest. Trump opted not to divest from his business, but turned over control of day-to-day operations to his sons Donald Jr. and Eric.
Several committees expected to investigate Trump could find use for the returns.
The White House did not immediately respond to a request for comment about Pelosi's remarks.
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Key words: There is no law or rule compelling a president or candidate to do so.
WHat will she do? Craft a law that says presdients/candidates have to show their tax returns? Then get the senate to pass it? Then get Presdient Trump to sign it into law? Likely not happening. And even if a law like that does become law, how does one make it retroactive to the sitting president?
That's not even talking about the fact that the only plan the Democrats in Congress seem to have is to investigate the President. One has to wonder who will be doing the governing, since our elected officials don't seem to have any interest in it?
A functional democracy isn't just laws. It is also traditions, principles, standards, ... For quite some time, it was traditional, standard, for Presidential candidates to publish their tax returns, so that voters could better understand.
This was one of the first democratic standards that Trump ignored. Trump is culpable, of course... but American voters - Americans in general - deserve equal blame. They elected a man who clearly doesn't care in the least about democratic institutions.
Americans deserve what they have. They chose him.
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How do you intend to adjudicate your bet?
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[Please discuss the seeded topic, which is not Texan.]
A "tradition" that started all the way back in 1976.
Ooooo! That is a long time! /s
How did we ever manage without tax returns?
By the way, Trump has submitted extensive paperwork detailing his various holdings. In fact, that is required. There's a form for it. It's called "Executive Branch Personnel Public Financial Disclosure Report" (OGE Form 278e) . Before you get too eager about reading, it though, make sure you have lots of free time. It's 92 pages - twice the length of the form submitted by Mitt Romney. If you're really interested in conflicts of interest, this is the place to look.
His tax returns would give you his income, his effective tax rate, and the amount he donated to charity. That's about it.
Did you read my post entirely?
If so, why did you Comment on a secondary point, while ignoring the primary?
I commented on what I felt like commenting on. At least I responded to something you wrote. All you're doing is complaining.
Ya think he's filed a 1040EZ?
I'm peanuts compared to a mega business person and I have to file how and where my income derives. Including money made offshore and the source.
Since American banks won't touch him he's going to have a lot of detail of his financing.
So many on the right don't want to know about Trump's dealings in public but drooled at the thought of tearing in to the Clintons income and the foundation.
Hypocracy much?
1976 - 2018 = 42 years
1776 - 2018 = 242 years
So, 'quite some time' is only what, what 20% or so? Yeah. Again I ask, when are the Democrats actually going to govern? Seems all they plan on doing is investigating stuff. Is this what they were elected to do?
Benghazi!
So does Trump. If he didn't, the IRS would have gone after him for it a long time ago.
As for what we investigate, I just there want there to be a solid reason to justify it, whether it's Trump or Clinton. It's not right to demand documents from Trump just because others have submitted those documents and then try to claim that you're looking for a conflict of interest, but you can't name what that conflict might be.
Where Americans actually died, prompting (very appropriately) thorough investigation.
Here, the Democrats just want to go fishing through Trump's tax returns to see if there is anything they can spin as being somehow potentially problematic. They don't have a specific reason to be looking for anything in particular.
Those two scenarios are like millions of miles apart.
We are way past looking for conflict of interest.
Like I said, this isn't some 1040EZ or A. He has to itemize everything for the tax breaks he gets which is about $500 million a year.
I have zero doubt Mueller already has Trump's filing and his credit report.
If they pulled my filing the details of who and where are obvious. His even moreso.
I'm sure they'll get right on that and apologize...lol
It doesn't matter what you think, it's legal.
You might be, but according to the seed, that is the reason the Democrats want to see his tax returns. That's why I'm talking about it.
I just think people should be fair and reasonable. We have his financial disclosures. Read all 92 pages and come back with a reason based on what is in there to look at his tax returns. "We didn't find anything" is not a reason.
Lol....the financial disclosures he has had to amend? That alone should invite scrutiny.
From CNBC
I vote for some awesome Texas BBQ.
So scrutinize, then - where reasonable, not randomly.
I will trade you my Kobe steak for your brisket.
You don't get to make those calls the law does.
Why is that? It's a seperate investigation.
Don't know. I'm not a congress member and I've only talked to her a few times and that was several years ago.
Why don't you ask her?
Oh, but I do! I'm a voter.
Well, you just go step right up and tell them how to do this. I'm sure they'd get right on that for you.
So far the creel is filling up...
Yes, sometimes I wonder that about conservatives.
She will be flipping Nunes fish, Issa fish, Trump fish, oh and what most runs with that school....suckers.
Unfortunately they're worthless because they're bottom feeders.
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unlike Trump
ive know need to pay
i like the way certain words can go together
but
u probably never noticed
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Didn't he have to amend that to show the illegal payoff to Daniels?
I know Ivanks and her hubby has had to.
So, you are saying one side of the aisle should do the same thing that they bitched about the other side doing for years? How childish of them.
No.
I don't know, but I have heard that it's pretty common that people have to amend those things to correct errors. I would imagine that with a 92-page filing, there would be a lot of potential for that.
So, you vomited out the single word, 'Benghazi'.
What exactly is it you are trying to communicate, then?
Really?
Nope a subpeona will do just fine.
And you said I was uninformed?
That is one stupid, stupid comment.
How the fuck is Trump going to redact a tax return and a credit report that wouldn't be going through him anyway?
Don't run away, I would love to see your follow up answer.
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Another shiny object to dangle in front of the left while it saves Dems from actually having to think up ideas or solutions to real problems.
Problem no.1 = Trump.
The rest will be addressed after no.1 is taken care of.
Trump is no problem at all. Democrats standing in his way are.
Republicans have had majorities in both the House and Senate for the last 2 years, AND YOU'RE STILL BLAMING THE DEMOCRATS ?!?!?!?!
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Collusion is the LEFT'S word?? LOL! Uh, no 9mil, that is definitely Trump's word, he can't stop saying it. "No collusion, no collusion!!" As if 'collusion' is the only thing he has to worry about! You wish Donnie. 'Collusion' is the least of his problems...
fake news.
Far right wing s
Gee, I don't know.....maybe "Gruber" "marxist" "snowflake"....
The left isn't fed dog whistle words of the week for the weak" which is something I noticed and noted frequently since the days of NV.
The right are so easily led by these.
Well, the "code words" fried chicken, watermelon, and cornbread have already been overused so maybe these can replace them at least through the winter:
Uh huh....BENGHAAAAAZI
OK, this is not how we do things in this country. I don't care who the focus of the investigation is, the government does not get to demand documents from you without probably cause to suspect wrongdoing. That's the 4th Amendment. They don't get to demand your tax returns and then go hunting for possible conflicts of interest - emphasis on possible. Furthermore, no person is required to turn over evidence that might tend to incriminate him. That's the 5th Amendment. The President of the United States - like any citizen - is protected by these rights.
If Congress had a specific, articulable reason to suspect a actual conflict of interest, then asking for his tax returns could be reasonable.
What is being proposed here is the very kind of tyranny our founders sought to protect us from when they wrote the Bill of Rights. The notion that Congress can just start demanding documents and records from people so they can look for a crime should offend anyone who values the rights enshrined in the Constitution.
They actually can but they can't reveal anything they have found. That is why it is a stunt to appease the loons.
The other reason it's a stunt is because he has already filed 92 pages of paperwork detailing all of his holdings. If they wanted to find conflicts of interest, they could simply look there.
That's why it IS NOT a stunt. If they can't reveal anything, it is no stunt, however it is a method for an investigative committee to determine any conflicts of interest, OR violations of the Emoluments Clause, OR signs of someone being bought and paid for by a certain hostile country.
The New York Times demonstrated convincing evidence of tax fraud by the Trump family. Congress has every right to look into it.
It's annoying that everything that Trump has destroyed must be rebuilt... but it will be fun to watch the law gradually consume Trump..
I remember Watergate...
How convincing!
You do know that's literally the job of the IRS , right? Are you suggesting the IRS isn't doing its job? Why would Congress be more qualified to conduct such an investigation?
Me too. Ironic how much worse folks have done and gotten away with it.
That's the same question I had. Especially, the IRS under the Obama Administration couldn't find anything.....and yet, Congress Critters? Maybe they need to have Occasio-Cortez be the lead congressional investigator...oh wait, she doesn't know how to pay for an apartment.........
The IRS is tasked with accounting, not forensic investigation.
It always kind of blows me away when someone comments in direct contradiction to a fact that's right there in front of them. Did you follow the link you ended up quoting? Did you notice it was an IRS website entitled "Criminal Enforcement?"
IRS has the same issue as so many other government agencies, not enough resources to do their job thoroughly. Criminality would have to stand out like a sore thumb before the IRS starts any criminal investigation, wealthy people hire lawyers to hide any questionable tax practices from being looked at that closely.
Are you suggesting the IRS is incapable of catching someone like Trump and needs Congress to help them out?
Except for very rare occasions, yes. IRS generally needs Congress, or more commonly the FBI, to bring them into a criminal investigation.
You seriously need to stop contradicting yourself in the same comment.
Because of budgetary shortcomings. Thank you for confirming my statement.
Never said they are incapable of it, merely said that they don't have the staff or budget to examine all returns that closely. The same thing you stated in your 1st sentence.
Which comment? The one you confirmed, or the one you didn't address?
Never said they couldn't, merely said that they normally "DIDN'T", because "the IRS only investigates roughly 2% of tax returns for POSSIBLE illegalities" because they don't have the budget or manpower to do more.
What makes you think this?
Here's how it's done, according to the IRS (tl;dr, the word "Congress" does not appear in this document):
How Criminal Investigations Are Initiated
So, it's the IRS, who calls DOJ, not the other way around. Now, of course that doesn't the DOJ couldn't alert the IRS to the possible subject of an investigation. These agencies cooperate with one another. But to suggest that the IRS generally needs DOJ to bring them into an investigation for tax fraud to be investigated just isn't true.
For more information, see the IRS Criminal Enforcement page.
Why do you keep arguing about something I never stated???
I quoted you. That's all I have to go on. Not trying to misrepresent you or anything.
Yes you quoted me, but your responses are not about anything I actually said.
Well, then maybe you can clarify. The discussion seems to be about whether or not it is warranted and/or necessary for Congress to investigate Trump's tax returns. I am content to let the IRS do its job until I have a solid reason to believe they aren't. You do seem to be arguing that the IRS needs Congress to step in. Is that wrong?
Perhaps you should simply scroll up and refresh your on my original comment.....I'll wait.
Sorry, I only hunt in the mountains.
Never heard of Al Capone?
I have. Funny thing about that. From 1924 through 1929, Al Capone failed to file a tax return of any kind. Makes it kind of easy, doesn't it? That's what you call some solid "probable cause." And do you know who brought him down? It wasn't Kevin Costner and Sean Connery. I t was IRS investigators .
He won't be required to turn over anything, a subpeona will take care of his tax returns and credit report. No need for Trump's involvement at all.
It is true that...….."There is no law or rule compelling a candidate to reveal their Tax History."
However...…..There are laws concerning honest, legal and 'non-criminal' tax filings.
Remember the 'good ole' right wing argument concerning The Patriot Act, "You have nothing to hide--You have nothing to fear?
Well Mr. Trump...……………….,"Did you pay your fair share to assure that the grounds of Arlington National Cemetery were cared for?"
My only problem is how insufferable the assholes are going to be.....
"Nancy Pelosi said Democrats will begin to seek President Donald Trump's tax returns"
That's such an IMPORTANT matter for this countries welfare !
As was Benghazi.
More important than Tax returns.
Your opinion only.
I'd say "Death" is more important than "Paperwork"....wouldn't you ?
Can't bring those people back to life, sorry. But the right tried to put the gun in Clinton's hand didn't they?
I'll take what we can rectify.
Aaaaahhhhh….. The easy stuff.
I see answering the question is a bit ……. Taxing ?
Seems "Politics" has got you in it's web !
I already did answer it.
But carry on governor.
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Don't know…..
Can you fill me in on that Insider Knowledge you have ?
Using the word "BUTT".....is a Merry-Go-Round response used by those that have no "REAL" response, on "the grounds It might Incriminate themselves" !
I'll ask the same question as I did above. So it's okay for one side to do the exact same thing they bitched about the other side doing for years? How childish.
Apparently the 'gorilla in heels crowd' are overly thin skinned, ya think?
If I had insider knowledge, why would I be asking????
While it’s no surprise to democrats abuse their power and will destroy someone’s privacy in their pursuit of power( see Clinton taking fbi files of opponents) , the reality is no one will care. His tax returns have already been illegally leaked and the public couldn’t have cared less as the stories dissappeared within a news cycle. He takes deductions, minimizes liability and borrows money. Wow!
This just reinforces the fact that democrats have no respect for the individuals privacy rights.
That's because they knew Trump was the one that leaked them.
Didn't see him looking for thr leaker did ya?
That makes no logical conenction and is unsupported by any facts.
So, you're just guessing at stuff. Typical throw it against the wall in hopes it sticks. Gotcha.
Guess you don't remember when maddow had that old return?
He leaked that out to show he paid some taxes. Everyone but you figured that out.
The kicker was Trump wasn't jumping up and down to look for the leaker...because it came from him.
(emphasis mine) As pointed out by many others, there is no law for a candidate or office holder to release their tax returns.
Aside from that, with all the shit with the Obama administration and the IRS, it's safe to say that they had looked into President Trumps taxes. If there was something, they would have tried to exploit it during the campaign. Their silence should tell everybody that there is nothing there except Democrats continuing with their temper tantrum.
This is nothing but political theater to feed their radicalbase. The Dems know they won’t get anything from Trump’s tax returns if they even get them
Trump’s returns will show them nothing of interest. Most of his income on his personal return comes from K-1s which merely indicate how much money he received from profits or negative income from business losses. It will NOT show any detailed info from those businesses.
so keep wasting time on something you will never get
it shows the wisdom of FDR and JFK who also refused to make public their tax returns
Then why is he putting so much effort into hiding them?
Have you seen them? Didn't think so, and refer back to my first response...why is he putting so much effort into hiding them?
Once again, you haven't seen them, so you don't know anything about them.
Mueller already has them and Pelosi will after the 1st of the year.
Did they also have business deals with hostile foreign countries?
No need. Mueller has access to everything, including the tax returns and doesn't need permission. Of course he has them. He has the legal right to them and they are most definitely pertinent.
Then you're saying that he lied each time he promised to release them? You seem to suffer the same memory problems ( selective ) that Trump has.
Of course he was lying. Trump is a highly practiced liar. IMO his method for advancement is based on lying and cheating.
A better PotUS would be nice. Will 2020 deliver?
2020 deliver?
How about Sheldon Whitehouse D RI?
I’m a tax preparer and I’m well aware how business owners report income. Secondly we have seen at least one of his tax returns and it confirms what I stated.
Then why did he demand that everyone else release THEIR tax returns?
Given that the IRS never comments, confirms or denies, do we really have any proof other than President Trump's words,
that he ever was or is currently under audit.
Maybe someone should ask Cohen...or Weisselberg.
Do you rememebr Leona Helmsley? They filed charges against her for essentially cheating on her taxes. We all heard abot that. How about Martha Stewart? Why would they not do the same against President Trump, especially before he was president,o r even before he was a candidate?
Generally speaking the IRS always gives tax payers a chance to amend a return. LH took tax avoidance to new levels.
Leona Helmsley ( "We don't pay taxes. Only the little people pay taxes." ) could have settled but she was too mean, lol.
Guess who her lawyer was? The Alan Dershowitz.
Sounds remarkably similar to what Realtor Trump has been accused of, must be something in the New York water.
Martha Stewart, another new Yorker. She started out as just a stupid small time state tax evader, arguing that because she didn't spend any time in her New York home, she shouldn't have to pay New York taxes, the State of New York disagreed to the tune of $220,000.00. The IRS was not involved.
Her SEC troubles are well known, but as the Feds could not prove insider trading, they convicted her of lying and the stock loss of $45K she tried to avoid
turned into much, much more in restitution, fines, a brief imprisonment and house arrest and of course damage to her reputation.
As she rehabilitated her image afterwards, having retained 60% of the stock in her comany, she became even wealthier, possibly because of the good/bad publicity.
Now if you want to talk about kings of tax evasion
We can always drag out Democratic favorites
Wesley Snipes On November 1, 2018, the United States Tax Court ruled that the Internal Revenue Service did not abuse its discretion in rejecting an offer in compromise made by Snipes and in sustaining the filing of a notice of federal tax lien in connection with approximately 23.5 million dollars in Federal tax liabilities for tax year 2001 and years 2003 through 2006.
Willy Nelson Nicholas Cage and Marc Antony all blamed their managers for mismanagement.
Nelson repaid 16 million, Cage 6 million plus fines and Anthony over 5 million.
No sympathy for any of them.
Yeah, sure you are. And all my years of business I didn't take my taxes to H&R Block.
Business people like myself use CPA's not some guy that's good at filling out 1040EZ forms for granny.
I'm not sure I understand. Are you saying that he is not a tax preparer? Or that Business people only use CPA's?
Neither do I, I own my insurance, tax and accounting business. I’m registered with the IRS and am a bonded CETEC registered preparer in the State of California.
more than 75% of my clients are small business owners, partnerships, and independent contractors. My clients are in 7 states
i haven’t done a 1040 EZ for a client in more than a decade when I was doing volunteer returns at a senior center in my free time
Whether you are or not, and frankly I don't really care that you have clients in 7 states.
All your clients are mom n' pop businesses.
I just retired and sold my import/export company this year.
Clients in 22 COUNTRIES, employees in 4, and gross sales north of 40 mil. I imported in to L.A., Jacksonville, Miami and NYC.
You ain't preparing shit if you don't have a CPA license.
I'm peanuts in comparison and none of my competitors would even come near you let alone Trump.
I never claimed they would. But that doesn’t negate your false accusation that I don’t know tax procedures, rules, or tax law.
and in my prior career in the corporate world, I ran companies or served in an executive position in companies in the US and Asia. Your bragging is meaningless. I had as many as 4000 employees under me and operating budgets up to several billion dollar. I met regularly with NASA, military leaders, Congressional members of the Defense Appropriations Committee, foreign government cabinet members and their staff.
Hahahaha!
Uh huh...
There should be. If you want to be the president then I damn well feel I have a right to know what financial shit you are in.