Do problems Need Solutions or Just Someone to Blame?
“For every problem there is an answer. Empty your thoughts and allow the solution to visit you.” Anonymous
Too many people (I included from time to time I am sure) are so focused on blaming someone for a problem, that they display no interest, enthusiasm or effort to actually solve the problem.
This is the #1 problem with politicians masquerading as public servants at all levels of government.
For example millions, possibly billions of dollars are being spent campaigning - think of the effect that these millions could have on social problems in the country.
I am sure that you can come up with more examples of publicizing the problem getting in the way of solving the problem
It is exhausting to listen to two people (one on the left and one on the right) clearly assign the blame for a problem to the "other" side without spending a bit of time putting forth a solution.
And if an independent suggest that a solution is possible if both sides give a little on what they want and acknowledge that they are both to blame - he/she is shouted down as a lunatic trying to undermine good order and discipline.
I'm assuming everyone can agree with that.
Let's see what happens.
Many are currently lurking. Maybe by 11AM we'll get some unanimity.
The word compromise might as well be taken out of the dictionary.
You got that right.
RDtC
Absolutely and sadly correct
That would be the 'right' who blame Democrats/Progressives/Liberals for everything bad in the world and they ALWAYS project, deflect, and deny.
What solutions have the 'right' offered, ever?
The vast majority of problems on this planet throughout time have been caused by far-right wing authoritarian fascists.
The last thing this world needs is another
The last thing this world needs is Trump.
Lets face it, it is much easier to place blame than actually do anything to solve a problem. Placing blame is for the lazy, not for people that want to work to solve a problem. A good example is the immigration policy. If politicians spent half the energy solving the problem as they do trying to convince people the problem is the other sides fault we would have solved immigration problems decades ago.
At the end of the day, Ron and Tip would sit down and have a beer together.
I'm afraid those days are gone forever.
Or maybe a wee bit of Irish Whiskey.
And then maybe a wee bit more
Greg
They epitomized the concept "working together" to get things done
Until we end this insanity, nothing else matters.
Frankly the most equitable solution would be to lock up both Trump and Biden. Removing Trump from the ballot doesn't solve any problems because we're still stuck with Biden.
In this situation, both Trump and Biden are to blame.
No. Projection. There is no reason to blame President Biden for anything - that's your go to - President Biden has done nothing to warrant him being behind bars but tons of things the former 'president' belongs behind bars for, for the rest of his arrogant and ignorant and hateful life.
No, actually he has done quite a bit, all of it has hurt Americans.
Not true.
That would be the former 'president' who is on his revenge and retribution 'campaign'
Denying the undeniable.
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Sounds like an excuse to get nothing done.
The right could always say until we get rid of the antisemites in congress and in the cities nothing else matters.
Being an antisemite is just one more level of far right wing fascism.
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I sorry that you don’t have friends or family that matters,
See Bob, it didn't take long.
Don't tell us about "both sides."
You cant handle the truth.
I already had my morning laugh.
Jack Nicholson you ain't!
2/3 of Republican voters yesterday told pollsters that thy think Trump won the 2020 election. This sort of total avoidance of the truth has to be addressed before we talk about "coming together".
It’s been addressed by the courts, state voting governance, state electors and media. How does it get addressed more?
Unfortunately, the has been a growing mistrust of the “system” for decades now getting us to this point were Trump lies are believed by many. He has right wing media providing supporting fires.
I don’t think we will come together until we have a real crisis across the land, like a Great Depression, a large war, or an inability to finance are growing debt.
Until then we remain on this divided trajectory.
2/3 of democrats believed the Russians changed votes in 2016 to give the election to trump. Why doesn’t that type of Total avoidance of truth ever bother you?
This is the "you made me believe a known pathological liar" defense. It is absurd.
Maybe he likes the truth, just not the whole truth or nothing but the truth.
I not defending it, but it’s not absurd, it’s the truth.
Yes. Trump didn't occur out of nowhere. The soil was well fertilized to allow his spectacular growth.
Your shtick these days is incessant whatabout ism in the service of the worst human being to ever hold high office in America. It is pointless to talk to you.
How Democrats reacted to 2016 is nothing like the insanity we have seen from the MAGA cult for the past three years.
A lake is "the same" as a backyard swimming pool in the sense that they both hold water and people can enjoy getting in the water in both. So what?
Yes and in 2015-16, it was well nurtured by mainstream media to make some more profits.
It’s always your way or the highway, that’s your shtick, JR.
When it comes to Donald Trump, you're damn right.
I don’t think that there is anything else for you.
Why would I talk about finding common ground with traitors?
I'll leave that sort of thing to you.
Playing fast and loose with the word traitor I see.
Tell us everything you know about Jan 6th and the preceding weeks. I have a minute.
That's what happens when you don't know the definition of a word.
Same old schtick ending with an insult. Shocking. Assuming I read half of what you post I know everything there is to know through your lens.
So who are the traitors you won't find common ground with, anyone that doesn't agree with you on Jan 6th?
Seems to be an epidemic with some folks, especially on the left!
You questioned me calling him a traitor. So tell us everything you know about Jan 6th that proves he isnt a traitor.
I will go with the easy one.
He sat on his ass for a couple HOURS while he was watching( on tv) a riot, ON HIS BEHALF, take place at the national legislature. Why would he sit on his ass instead of doing something to stop it? BECAUSE HE WANTED IT TO SUCCEED.
In his speech on the morning of Jan 6, just an hour or so before the riot, he once again asked Pence to "do the right thing" and follow the Eastman plan, an illegal attempt to put Trump back in office and disenfranchise tens of millions of American voters.
Instead of calling for troops and other LE to descend on the Capitol when the riot started, Trump spent his time on the phone asking congresspeople to support his illegal plan.
He is a traitor.
No I didn't. I questioned your statement "Why would I talk about finding common ground with traitors? ", as in more than one.
Ok, Lincoln also had weird ideas about providing opportunities for former Confederate soldiers and sympathizers and to be granted full pardons.
Absurd isn’t it.
No, it makes perfect sense. Lincoln was a republican so obviously he was a traitor(by todays definition). The confederates and sympathizers were all traitors. So it was just a matter of one traitor pardoning other traitors.
is that seriously the best you can do ?
Why do you think that anyone here wants to give you their best?
Lincoln didnt lead and instigate the 1861 insurrection.
So you think that he was misinformed?
do they want to give me their worst ? that would be weird
But he pardoned those who lived through it that did
So the response went totally over your head. That is OK, the response was actually not intended for you so it is no surprise it did,
Some folks actually say things not to be taken seriously or are satirical in nature. Many folks can tell by reading the comment, others need the S/.
I assumed that my sarcasm was self evident. Bad assumption wrt you.
An epidemic the rest of us have to deal with.
Hey JR, who gives a fuck! Why are they asking the question in the first place?
Robert is talking ethics. Can we forget Trump for 5 minutes?
Neither did Donald Trump.
One thing Lincoln did do in 1862 was to suspend Habeas Corpus. That allowed him to jail rebel without a trial. To this day that act has been questioned. One thing that is not questioned is Lincoln's devotion to this country, unlike Joe Biden.
According to John's logic we all should be voting against democrats on that point alone!
The former 'president' has no ethics, morals or scruples.
Yes he did, he started inciting on election night when he was told that he lost and the turd has been doing it ever since.
How in hell could he stop it after it started? It was an unplanned spontaneous disruption caused by small group of right-wing radical thugs. Why weren't the Capitol Police prepared for a crowd of thousands.
And that has nothing to do with the article.
Nope, it was incited by him since the day he lost and he's continued to incite ever since
Spontaneous is bullshit. Incited is the truth
If it wasn't spontaneous that would logically mean it was planned. That being the case, it must have been planned. ?And THAT being the case, why weren't the authorities prepared? Makes no sense.
It was planned.
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Some folks are too busy looking at their neighbors house to realize theirs is falling down.
That would be a big mistake as I will be right here should Donald Trump win the election.
In the meantime, Bob must be wondering what happened to the point of his article.
wondering but probably not surprised
Obviously the only way around that is making it clear any comment about Trump will be deleted.
Consider that in politics, blame is used to justify a solution in search of a problem. Political blame is capable of creating problems out of thin air. What's the point of legislating a solution if a problem doesn't exist? And if a problem exists there must be a cause.
Sadly true - well said
Not at all. He thinks the former 'president' is a good 'president' and that President Biden is not. Many here are under the delusion that President Biden belongs behind bars and the former 'president' does not - again, delusional.
Aren't those people usually drooling on themselves?
I thank the vast majority of respondents for offering enlightening input to the question.
As usual an attempt was made to hijack the topic and transform the discussion to the usual "I Hate Trump" rant rather than discuss the topic presented, some of you engaged but I chose not to based on the following advice from my favorite author
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Tell me Robert, who on the right, including Congress, do the Democrats have available to find common ground with? Comer? Jordan? Greene? Gaetz?
Are you a never trumper , or will you go in the voting booth and pick "the lesser of two evils".
The kindest thing one can say about your seeds like this is that in 2024 they are pollyanish.
So you are here to bring it down?
You did try to hijack his article.
Bob always tries to look at things as a centrist. Even back at NV I would ask him which side gives him the most angst.
No, he didn't.
Who cares?
Sorry Bob.
He tried to make the article about Trump.
Denying the undeniable
I called no one a name
I merely quoted a distinguished author for context.
I am somewhat surprised that my quote was deleted, but not that you think as usual that everything is about you and continue to rant and never actually participate in this or any other discussion.
You receive special treatment in that you are allowed to berate and demean people are protected as if by a shield from any feedback.
I can deal with that
I love having you comment on my articles, when you are able to address the topic presented, but would rather you not share your off topic vitriol.
No one is ranting here. John does actually participate very often in this and many other discussions. What special treatment? Why are you attacking him?
What did you do?
Isn't that the point of forums? Discussing/debating the topic raised?
I have been around NT and its predecessor site for some time and have been verbally stoned and chained by more than one contributor - I will endure I appreciate the positive participation too much to let a few derail me.
Thanks
I have been suspended here at least 5 times, and regularly get as many or more tickets than anyone else.
What I do is try to post factual material about topics that interest me, and are of general interest to the country. I have no doubt whatsover that I have posted more links to source material than anyone in the history of this forum. I am prepared to back up anything I say with links , quotes, or book sources, when necessary and appropriate. Your new found friends here almost never do ANY of that. I would surmise that they as, a group, get flagged more for trolling than any other group of 4 or five random other people do.
Your comment about "idiots" was directed specifically at me. That is why you got a coc violation.
Why dont you tell everyone how two political sides are going to work together when we have Marjorie Taylor Greene's , Matt Gaetz's , and over 100 other Republicans in Congress who voted to NOT certify the 2020 election on Jan 6 2021. Why dont you address something specific like that ? ,
"attacking"
I thought i was quite polite in making my point
No.
It is a hoot to watch some of the people commenting on this seed act like they are examples of wanting to work "across the aisle".
Exactly, you on the other hand make it crystal clear that you have zero interest.
It's hilarious!
[Deleted]
By having adults in the room work together across the aisle. If they do that and ignore the people you mentioned (and people like the squad and other antisemites you forgot to mention) they will see they don't have to be held be held hostage by the fringe wackadoodles. If you are saying the people that voted for not certifying the election can not be worked with it is you and people that think like that are dooming this country.
[From the CoC:]
JR, you seem to think Republicans are the only ones to object to Certifications.
Since 2001, Democrats Objected 3 Times to Electoral College Certification (dailysignal.com)
So true.
That is a good one but my favorite is still “Before you argue with someone, ask yourself, is that person even mentally mature enough to grasp the concept of different perspectives? Because if not, there is absolutely no point.”
It stays away from name calling but is definitely worth considering in general.
Good point
Subtle dismissal works with sane and rational people but it escapes others
No, not a good point and it's not true.
[deleted]
So you're saying I'm not sane and rational. Sounds like another attack.
One thing to keep in mind is that no matter the topic of an article or blog, some people can't control themselves and have to bring certain completely unrelated topics up. It's almost like a Tourette Syndrome tick.
And when you attempt to correct them and get them back on topic they start name calling, crying and spamming the article with nonsense.
Unfortunately there isn't.
I think you may have offended people with Tourette's Syndrome without meaning to
Yes, some take it as an admission of defeat or you can't answer because you don't have a valid argument. A very fifth grade reaction. Nothing you say is going to change their mind so you can save alot of time if you just let them believe what they want since that is what they are going to ultimately do anyway.
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Since he never said that it almost seems like an attempt to be a victim
Good point
He didn't offend me, I must have thick skin
Again, no, not a good point.
It is a good point, an excellent point. Probably ranks among the top five best points of all time.
That is what I was thinking but I wanted to seem humble.
And here I am all out of "Give a Shit". These are the same people who can't define what a woman is and think there are 500 - 600 genders. They'll get over it.
You may as well stop with this one. He will just spam your blog with nonsense. It's the perfect example of what I was talking about in 6.2.4
So back to the article.
Have you ever not personally watched something( like a speech or riot coverage) except the left and right media coverage of it. It is often like they are not talking about the same event. The spins are ridiculous. If you only get your news from one side it is easy to see why the sides feel the other side is ignorant and evil. And the media just keep shoveling the propaganda shit wrapped in a cover saying news and their minions actually consider it news. How can anyone compromise if they think the other side is evil and to blame for all their issues??
I enjoy trying to instigate actual discussion of issues and will likely continue to do so, even though there are some here that wish no discussion, wish no debate, wish no exchange of ideas with respect.
To those that attack and hijack any attempt at discussion - I say go for it, as you are protected it seems from honest feedback on your actions.
I guess I will not quote Mr. Twain again as it seems that I regard him more highly than others.
Until my next offering I bid you all good day
Isn't that what these forums are about? Debating and discussing? I just see you attacking John, I don't see him hijacking [deleted] or any attempt at discussion.
Sounds like you're playing the victim here of nothing.
Why are you attacking Robert for correctly pointing out that a few people insist on making this about Trump even though the article is not about him?
If we're talking pollitics then all that's needed is someone else to blame
unfortunately, you appear to be correct
Thread @6.2 locked for slap fighting. Play nice, please.
Okay, what is the exact number for
?
Succinctly, pi—which is written as the Greek letter for p, or π—is the ratio of the circumference of any circle to the diameter of that circle. Regardless of the circle's size, this ratio will always equal pi. In decimal form, the value of pi is approximately 3.14. But pi is an irrational number, meaning that its decimal form neither ends (like 1/4 = 0.25) nor becomes repetitive (like 1/6 = 0.166666...).
What Is Pi, and How Did It Originate? | Scientific American
That is a description, somewhat of an explanation, but it doesn't answer the question, i.s. solve the problem. The problem, which cannot be solved, is that the exact number cannot be reached, the numbers go on to infinity.
Actually if you read it, you will discover that it is support for conclusion that pi is an irrational number which cannot be described as a ration between two integers, but nonetheless pi is the answer to many questions in the world of mathematics.
If that is your response to the question "do all problems need solutions" then you sound like a hard "no" and the deft way you shifted to the abstractness of pi would make you a great politician.
I mena that as a compliment
So all of the calculations involving pi are wrong because there is no "answer" to the "problem"? The problem here is the definition of a problem. (Are you dizzy yet?
) 3.14 will get you close on a first approximation. Add a few digits and that will suffice for most engineers. Physicists might need many more to get their calculations to be more accurate. I think the problem of pi is dependant upon the application, and as long as it's irrationality is taken as a given, there is no problem, especially when represented symbolically in a formula.
Ah but if irrationality is taken as a given, that could solve a lot of problems, could it not?
Well, thank you.
A little double entendre there, eh?
If you think so, then I plead guilty.
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To answer the question, "Do Problems Need Solutions Or Just Someone To Blame?" one first needs to define what problems exist and their reason for existence. That is, one must answer the begged question, "Is the problem really a problem?"
I see or hear daily of people stressing things that they define as being problems. When examined, it turns out that these things might be problematic for certain individuals, but they do not rise to the level of actual problems in as far as they require the search for and implementation of a solution.
For example: Voting is something that has been done in this country for over 200 years. Over these years, we have gotten fairly good at ensuring that voter registrations are accurate and that the counting of ballots is done accurately and securely. Then, all of the sudden, people started complaining about election integrity. Why? Because they wanted an issue to give them traction to run for office on. Now, I am not saying that we could not improve upon our systems, but those improvements are marginal at best. We are really good at the voting thing because we have been doing it for a long time and the people in charge of maintaining the systems and procedures are dedicated to making sure of an accurate counting. But the people who started questioning the system (with no really good evidence of fraud) continued to question. Fast forward and we find many politicians and everyday people who have lost confidence in the system not because of inaccurate counts, but because of a fictional perception of inaccuracies. Did this problem require a solution in the first place? No. But it has gotten to the point that now we need to change this misperception because it is corrosive to our democracy.
Most of the cultural war issues that are occurring now do not rise to the level of needing solutions, except in cases where there are people who are discriminated against.
So, quite a few issues are not "problems" and therefore do not require solutions. We just need people to stop being such bigoted assholes. I guess that would be a solution... ¯\_( ツ)_/¯
Some issues do rise to the level of problems in need of a solution. For instance immigration. Republicans use this issue as a foil and do not wish it to be resolved, because then they would not be able to continually bring it up as a problem. As evidence, I present the current state of affairs regarding the passage of a border control bill and funding to the conflicts in Ukraine and Israel. Personally, I think that the focus on the immigration issue is stilted from the start. I think that money should be spent on the system of entry into the country for people seeking asylum. The demonization of immigrants is counterproductive. We should be focused on getting them legally into the country and working. Right now all efforts seem to be directed at keeping the immigrants out, which in my estimation is the wrong way to go about it, but some people only know how to use power bluntly and end up exacerbating the problem. Oh, yeah, they need the problem so they can get elected.
You seem to be saying that the factor in determining if something rises to the level of a problem and then as to whether it is in need of a solution is one's political/social point of view on the issue rather than the issue itself.
That is where we find ourselves today with one side demanding a solution to an issue and the other side dismissing the issue as not being a real or the real problem.
Appreciate the input
What I am saying is we need to be aware of issues and investigate them to see if they are actual issues and not merely devices machined out of little bits of fact and much hyperbole to give someone traction so they can gain/maintain power. I do not believe that we have done this as a country. There are ways to objectively quantify issues to see if they rise to the level of problems.
Of course, quantification does not matter if all sides regard the other political players as "the Enemy" and right now that is the perception being pushed. So regarding the pushing of that perception, the largest problem facing the country is the maintenance of the view of the other as the enemy. If we accept this premise, then we can objectively ask ourselves how to fix the problem. Unfortunately, we haven't figured out how to get off of the wheel because when the problem has been defined we go back to the yammering blah-blahs, misinformation, and outright lies, all in the service of the maintenance of power.
The population needs to realize that opinions are not facts and even though individuals believe they are "right", that does not give them the authority to discriminate against people who may feel differently. It would appear that this is still a work in progress because people still want to impress their value systems upon others whether it be wanted or not. There are examples of this impression coming from all points of the political compass.
The population needs to realize that opinions are not facts and even though individuals believe they are "right"
I try to convince people on the far left, left of center, center, right of center and far right of that simple truth all the time and it seldom works with any of those groups.
Unfortunately, we haven't figured out how to get off of the wheel because when the problem has been defined we go back to the yammering blah-blahs, misinformation, and outright lies, all in the service of the maintenance of power.
And this is why Democrats and Republicans, and some outside those two cults/cliques/groups want to keep that wheel spinning.
Appreciate the back and forth
Absolutely. The country needs to have primary and general elections controlled by a non-partisan source with no party affiliation allowed. The two "teams" have run their course. I see very little chance of something like this happening because of the degree to which the parties have insinuated themselves into the fabric of the current system.
Likewise