Florida just keeps on keeping on with the Nazis and assorted White Supremisists.

There should be absolutely zero tolerance for things like this. They should have been arrested just for showing up.

I don't disagree, Doc but we have the 1st amendment which protects these POS.

Giving them a platform and having the press cover them doesn't help either. On the bright side it seems we are talking all of 15 participants in front of Disney world 

On the bright side it seems we are talking all of 15 participants in front of Disney world 

Or the other 50 or so at Altatmonte Springs, it only took one of these crazies to murder three black people in Jacksonville a few weeks ago. 

Giving them a platform and having the press cover them doesn't help either.

Not giving them a platform doesn't mean they aren't out there. 

You are correct, but that is what they count on and take advantage of. I just find their ideology so disgusting. So glad we do not have those losers in my neck of the desert. They would be run out of my town, and it would not be gentle.

Arizona has a long history of KKK and white nationalist groups, Doc. Hopefully your end of the desert doesn't have them but they are sure as hell in other parts of AZ.

In the urban and metropolitan areas more than the rural areas especially on the border. Definitely almost none in Cochise County.

Good to hear it would be good if AZ got rid of the crazy Paul Gosar.

Amen to that.

Paul Gosar.

That is one strange cat...

It only took one Hell's Angel at Altamont with a knife to change things.

He went up against an idiot with a gun and killed him with a knife.

Managed  security at concerts for many years without an issue.

Well, yes there were many issues but nobody ever died at my shows.

One of my guys actually delivered a baby one night . So +1.

That looney toon nut case Gosar is Arizona's equivalent of MTG and Boebert. The majority of Arizona both Republican and Democrat cannot stand him. I don't look to see him reelected. 

As a non citizen of the  US, but with a great deal of care & concern over what happens there, All I can say "Remove the 1st Amendment"

All I can say "Remove the 1st Amendment"

I'm sure the 9 individuals who voted this "article" up would go along with that.

I like you, but the First Amendment is very dear to me and many other Americans. Let's leave it where it is

that's bullshit and you know it

we need to strictly enforce the 1st and knee-cap religious cults that hide behind it while abusing it.

Exactly. Religious freedom does NOT mean absolute freedom of expression for religions (not even my religion of choice: Christianity) while DENYING secularists and Others equal expression of their worldviews! That it is being portrayed this way (in practice) is a lie straight out of Hell!

Likewise with me as well. Spent many years defending people's right to that.

need to strictly enforce the 1st

Right. Strictly enforce it by letting people like Neo-nazis speak freely. 

have fun yelling bomb in an airport, fire in a theater, and shooter in a school...

Perhaps a refresher course would come in handy for you 

maybe later, I'm too busy practicing head shots at the pistol range... /s

Right, because someone may knock on your door or something.

Highly doubtful. 

So glad I am not there. Me and my M4 try to avoid situations.

they're all 1K yard candidates...

I'm 61 years old. I grew up in an area where, when I was a kid, probably had one of the largest, or at least, most reported concentrations of white supremacists in the nation, or so it seemed to me. But, even then, when they would put on whatever Halloween costume they currently favored, the news segment gave them maybe something like two minutes. What we saw was a few people dressed up and standing on some steps of a courthouse or in a park or whatever. The thing I remember most is that they were always alone. There was no audience. No one paid much attention that I could see. 

Law enforcement used various laws and, these guys not being the creme of society were into all sorts of illegal activities anyway, eventually mostly ended up in prison. Also, I got the impression that these guys hated each other almost as much as they hated those not like them. Seemed like they pretty much disappeared from the news cycle across the country for years.

Then, they got help from what might at first glance seem to be the most unlikely source imaginable. It was the very people who were supposed to be in direct opposition to them in the first place. Makes sense, though. A group that seeks power quite often magnifies something they want perceived to be more of a threat than it actually is. History buffs will recognize this as especially applicable to those of Marxist thought. The people who make up a society are, to a large extent, quite dull and respond best to caricatures they don't have to think much about. Is that overly harsh? Possibly, but I think history would back me up. 

In any case, I think that's what we have here. We have elements of the left making white supremacy a problem that it isn't for the purpose of political gain. Why do I think that? Because my world is almost entirely white. It has been so most of my life and I have never met an overtly white supremacist. I have never met anyone who thought we need to preserve the white race. I have never met or spoke with anyone who hated someone not white because they were not white. 

So, here's my problem. What do I trust? My own experience or the media? Why would I trust an entity that has to redefine the meaning of words in order to make what they say seem plausible? Trustworthy? As Orwell said, "If you control the language, you control the masses." Am I not placing the chains of subjugation upon myself by allowing such? 

I think not. White supremacy is a paper tiger created for political gain. It's purpose is to stampede cattle. Nothing more. 

Because my world is almost entirely white. It has been so most of my life and I have never met an overtly white supremacist. I have never met anyone who thought we need to preserve the white race. I have never met or spoke with anyone who hated someone not white because they were not white. 

My world has been mostly white too throughout my life.   I have met quite a few white supremacists (various degrees of intensity ... none that I would consider radical).    I do not believe any are part of an organization (but who knows?).   I have seen plenty of prejudice against non-whites ranging from jokes / labels to positions ('go back to where you came from').

While these are definitely a small minority, they are out there and are influencing the next generation.    I think, however, younger folks are increasingly resistant to the bigotry due to our evolving societal norms and values.

You are not being any more specific than I, so I cannot comment specifically. What could you present as an example?

An example of what?   Rereading my comment, I seem to provide ample details.   You need names?

I was describing my experiences and my resulting opinion.

I meant examples of what you consider white supremacy. 

A white supremacist is one who thinks Caucasians (European origin, white skin; or anyone who at least looks like that) are better than others.   They need not be organized in a group (as I mentioned) to hold those positions.   

Are you asking me to name white supremacy groups?

Are you asking me to name white supremacy groups?

No. You said you met "quite a few white supremacists". I'm simply asking for more details for better understanding. If that isn't specific enough, I'm asking about your personal encounters with white supremacy. If you find that offensive, then let me know and I won't bother you further. 

I do not know what you are asking of me.   What kind of details?

I edited my prior comment but, apparently not soon enough. 

If that isn't specific enough, I'm asking about your personal encounters with white supremacy.

What would you like to know?    Do you need a quote like:  "not every n----- can own one (a Lincoln) [stated by the father of my best friend in the 70s]" or "interracial marriage is diluting the gene pool"?

Never mind. 

I think not. White supremacy is a paper tiger created for political gain. It's purpose is to stampede cattle. Nothing more. 

Well I'm not white and I'm 83 years old and I've met plenty of white supremacists and grew up next to a ''sundown town''....That is the real world not some nonsense about there being no white supremacy. What the hell do you think is happening here in Florida? Do you think that the media is imagining them?

Did the media imagine the three blacks killed in Jacksonville a few weeks ago? Did they imagine the swastika on his gun?

Are the antisemitic packets being left at people's homes throughout Florida being delivered by the media or perhaps the tooth fairy?

Three people are dead because of the crazy white supremacy, that is a FACT. Your vivid imagination isn't a fact nor is it valid.

Anyone who says that white supremacy is a paper tiger for political gain really needs to re-examine all their comments on "I don't know any white supremacists"

In any case, I think that's what we have here. We have elements of the left making white supremacy a problem that it isn't for the purpose of political gain. Why do I think that? Because my world is almost entirely white. It has been so most of my life and I have never met an overtly white supremacist. I have never met anyone who thought we need to preserve the white race. I have never met or spoke with anyone who hated someone not white because they were not white. 

I pass as white (I'm 1/8th Indian) and I am a Jew. There was barely a day growing up that I was not called a slur by white Christians. Now I'm not saying that all white Christians are racists and Jew haters, but there are plenty of them out there. That is my personal experience.

As an adult, I have run into white supremacists. They leave leaflets around our local towns, full of hate. They hold baseball bats at the entrance of Walmart and say disgusting things. 

So saying that hate is just a political device is not true. You just don't notice it, since you are not who they are going after.

White supremacy , and racism, is a spectrum. There is racism that is severe and obvious and there is racism that is more subtle. 

For, well , forever, we have heard about "colored" people, now it is "people of color". What does this mean? 

Every human being is a person of color, because we all have melanin in our skin. BUT, in America and other countries "white" is a default, so they are not considered "colored" in those societies. This is a very minor way in which white supremacy is perpetuated. 

They see only 50 or 100 neo nazis out there so they proclaim it is not really an issue. 

The white supremacist forum Stormfront has over 1 million seeds, appx 14 million comments, and 377,000 members. 

The term "coloured was adopted here by emancipated slaves as a term of racial pride. In my late youth, it was replaced by the younger generation by "Black".  Later "African-American' was the term de jure.  

People of color is useful if you want to include more that African-Americans while excluding whites.  It also suggest an inclusive relationship of shared political goals although that might be lessening as seen in recent Chicago and LA elections.  

everyone is a person of color, because of melanin. White people are not devoid of color, but are described as such generally because white is the default in america. 

"Created by former Alabama Klan boss and long-time white supremacist Don Black in 1995, Stormfront was the first major hate site on the Internet. Claiming more than 300,000 registered members as of May 2015 (though far fewer remain active), the site has been a very popular online forum for white nationalists and other racial extremists."

"But a series of reverses — the 2008 assertion by Black’s wife that she was not a racist, a similar declaration by his son in 2010, and the Southern Poverty Law Center’s exposure of the identity of many Stormfront funders and the fact its registered users have been behind almost 100 murders — have caused a series of problems for the Web forum. Today, Black struggles with a continuing decline in site visitors, chronic financial problems and his own health issues."

splcenter

I didn't say white supremacy doesn't exist, Kavika. I said white supremacy is a paper tiger. And let me be clear. I'm not talking about the random racist like you give examples of. I'm talking about a political movement that white supremacy is supposed to be. White supremacy used to be about the notion that whites were genetically superior to other races and, because of that, had the right to rule over them. 

Now, due to efforts on the Left, it has grown to mean anything that opposes Leftist goals. 

White Supremacy

For instance:

According to an  article   by Abby L. Ferber, the  white supremacist movement  — and the related militia movement — provides ready answers for why white men feel displaced and defeated. She says “ One of the themes that underlies the foregoing conceptualization of the white supremacist movement is that it is engaged in the process of constructing difference by which Others — white women, gay men, and men and women of color — have been defined negatively in terms of their relationship to some dominant norm; that is, that ‘black’ is defined as inherently inferior to ‘white,’ Jewish to Christian, gay to straight .”

I do not believe these additions to the white supremacists platform came from the white supremacists. I believe they came from the political left for the purpose of politically categorizing their opponents as white supremacists. Listing the LGTBQ+ issue is evidence of this, for example, since opposition to that group is across racial lines. The same can be said for the others, like the role of women in society, religion, immigration and other issues. And, even if there are white supremacists for whom these things are true, it doesn't necessarily make opposition to these issues white supremacists of everyone, as there are those of all colors who do oppose those issues. 

That is why I call white supremacy a paper tiger. The left artificially enlarged the definition for political advantage. 

All a bunch of lies and defense of the indefensible

Then, they got help from what might at first glance seem to be the most unlikely source imaginable.

... the 45th POTUS, donald trump...

I'm not talking about the random racist like you give examples of. I'm talking about a political movement that white supremacy is supposed to be. White supremacy used to be about the notion that whites were genetically superior to other races and, because of that, had the right to rule over them. 

So the 50 or 75 in the last showing in Florida are random racists???? White supremacy is still about being genetically superior to other (minority races). 

Now, due to efforts on the Left, it has grown to mean anything that opposes Leftist goals. 

More nonsense but said like a true right wing believer.

I do not believe these additions to the white supremacists platform came from the white supremacists. I believe they came from the political left for the purpose of politically categorizing their opponents as white supremacists. Listing the LGTBQ+ issue is evidence of this, for example, since opposition to that group is across racial lines. The same can be said for the others, like the role of women in society, religion, immigration and other issues. And, even if there are white supremacists for whom these things are true, it doesn't necessarily make opposition to these issues white supremacists of everyone, as there are those of all colors who do oppose those issues. 

The issue here is racism/white supremacy not LGTBQ or the role of women in society. Too bad that you have to deflect to try to make a point.

As an adult, I have run into white supremacists. They leave leaflets around our local towns, full of hate. They hold baseball bats at the entrance of Walmart and say disgusting things.

You and the others don't seem to understand my point. I am not claiming these things don't occur. I am not saying there aren't any white supremacists. But, reading the news and the way white supremacy is being pushed as an existential threat to the country, it should be impossible not to experience it personally in everyday life. Look at what JR posted in 1.3.16 . That's just one site. There are others. Now look at what Drinker posted at 1.3.19 . If I had to choose which is likely the most true, I'd say Drinkers because it matches what I seen in everyday life. I don't know anyone at all, even peripherally, who espouses anything like white supremacist views. How can that be if it is the threat that its supposed to be? Where the hell is it? Where are the brown shirts? 

So, again, it's not that there are no white supremacists, it's the magnitude. It simply isn't there that I can see. 

The issue here is racism/white supremacy not LGTBQ or the role of women in society. Too bad that you have to deflect to try to make a point.

I didn't write the article, Kavika. I see, though, that you're just going to attack me rather than present a counter argument. I don't have any interest in that. 

I am not claiming these things don't occur. I am not saying there aren't any white supremacists. But, reading the news and the way white supremacy is being pushed as an existential threat to the country, it should be impossible not to experience it personally in everyday life.

It's far more prevalent than it's been in decades. The rise of alt+right populism is fueled, in part, by white supremacy and some of our elected officials are giving it an air of legitimacy. White supremacist group leaders have recently been found guilty of seditious conspiracy against the United States and have been sentenced to a decade plus in prison. The whole culture war anti-LGBTQA+ and anti-diversity initiatives are married to white supremacy and are being enacted into law in many red states. Two states have court orders to change their voting maps because of racial bias. All this emboldens the crazies. You can say - 

It simply isn't there that I can see. 

But that doesn't mean it's not right in front of your nose. 

Some refuse to see the truth.

are all the white supremacists who posted these 14 million racist messages dead, or just reformed ? 

Just because you don't 'see' it doesn't mean that it isn't rampant.

I'm comfortable with the information from the SPLC, aren't you?>

You use a whole lot of words to say nothing - and endlessly blame all the world's problems on the 'left' including white supremacy and how you've never seen it or experienced, doesn't mean it doesn't exist and that it is rampant.

BINGO Perrie, exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!

I didn't write the article, Kavika. I see, though, that you're just going to attack me rather than present a counter argument. I don't have any interest in that. 

I'm aware that you didn't write the article but you posted it as part of your comment so I have to assume that is what you believe. I pointed out to you that it doesn't have anything to do with the current article. If you chose to believe that I'm attacking you that is on you when in reality I pointed out it has nothing to do with this article. You were deflecting to be straight to the point.

If you don't see it, racism/white supremacy that could be that you are blind to the fact that it exists or you simple chose not to see it.

The rise of alt+right populism is fueled, in part, by white supremacy and some of our elected officials are giving it an air of legitimacy.

I disagree because the term alt right is so loosely defined and so broadly applied. Ben Shapiro, for instance, is often put in that category in spite of the fact he rips them just like he does the radical left. It seems most conservative commentators end being put on this alt right list at some point by the Left. 

White supremacist group leaders have recently been found guilty of seditious conspiracy against the United States and have been sentenced to a decade plus in prison.

As they should be. But I find it notable that, out of the thousands that were at the Capital that day, a fraction of a percent showed up with legally actionable intent to commit sedition. Where were the rest of them? This wasn't a surprise event. The rally had been in planning for months and all we got, sedition wise, was a bunch of cosplay wannabe's living out a fantasy. 

The whole culture war anti-LGBTQA+ and anti-diversity initiatives are married to white supremacy and are being enacted into law in many red states.

This is part of my point. What sort of twisted chain of logic would put LGTBQ+ under the white supremacist umbrella? What does it have to do with skin color? Nothing. What it actually does is allow anyone who opposes the issue to be labeled as white supremacists, which is why they altered the definition. That is how they can associate white people who oppose LGTBQ+ issues with white supremacy, even though they don't hold to white supremacy ideology. But that's like saying because most white supremacists like hamburgers, whites who like hamburgers are white supremacists. 

Two states have court orders to change their voting maps because of racial bias.

Since all parties gerrymander, this is pretty threadbare. It is more accurate to say that they arrange voting districts in a manner that favors the party in power rather than due to racial bias.

 But that doesn't mean it's not right in front of your nose.

True, but it doesn't mean that it is. It may be I just have to accept the changed definitions to make it all fit. 

All nonsense and made up ignorance

Drak,

They aren't in the habit of announcing their presence. But let me show you a photo:

npr

Now granted this was the 1930's, but these were regular people or at least they seemed to be. Enough Nazi's to fill Madison Square Garden. I am sure their neighbors felt about them the way you do. But they are still there. They just have gotten smarter. Oh and for the record, I knew many people who held their beliefs. 

WTF? You are writing this. . . crap like someone who lacks a fundamental understanding of a "swatika flag" on a gun which is held by a man gunning down living black people! Or, the topic title: "Neo-nazis parade swatiska flags in Florida chanting we are EVERYWHERE." 

Of course, "Nazis" are not everywhere as true Nazis are dead and resting in their German graves.

The whole point of the parade is EXPOSURE. To be SEEN. To be HEARD. To be existentially ACKNOWLEDGED as a group. And finally, to answer questions from all comers who see, hear, acknowledge the exposure.

This. . . overworking of the thought process with intention to "nuh-uh" and have a place to come from with contrarian positions designed to "explain away" the obvious simply because you refuse to confront LIFE as what it is INSULTS thinking people.

I will not indulge you!

The media takes pictures of white supremacists and you "don't trust the Media." (It's their fault you don't. . .can't trust them.) The president says there are white supremacists. (You count him to be dishonest and a liar.).  Trump speaking of Jew-hating Tiki torch carrying racists dressed in khakis says: "There are some very nice people,. . ." or words to that effect, . . . "on both sides." (You say Trump is not your first choice for president in 2024 but that he is infinitely better than Biden-a, any liberal.) 

Shall I go on?

Central to the latter argument is a journal that prosecutors say [Dylan] Roof wrote in after his arrest. In the journal, excerpts of which were presented to courtroom reporters, Roof allegedly says that "African-Americans have to pay for what they've done."

"I created the biggest wave I could," Roof allegedly wrote. "I did all I can do, now it is in the hands of my brothers."

npr

What had these church people done, besides letting this "kid" into their prayer service. They were sitting sheeps, and still the 'lone wolf' mowed them down without remorse even today.

And you have the gall to try to parse words with your fellow NTers and discount white supremacy groups as a given?

What exactly do you need to convince you of the racists at Large in this country? What kind of a display would satisfy you, specifically? May be if you put it in words. . . some group of racists might oblige you. . .you think so?!

The fact is racism haunts this country like a bad case of 'Clap.'  Whether it is a parade or the lone wolf trying and failing to start a his or her race war or "storming the capital" because what they want in a leader is OBVIOUSLY what is best for the country (sarcasm ) your efforts to redirect the focus onto something. . . mitigating is at the same time disturbing and insulting.

As always, you don't have to respond to me because I really don't give a care anymore if you do or don't. But when you try to GASLIGHT us by looking for the good in people who are bad through and through and who want anything but unity and friendship with their fellow citizens—folks they have been around all their damned lives I have no choice but to write something to let you know that you can't, shan't, and never will get away with putting in out there for public consumption. 

And for the record, white supremacists are in your political party of choice voting right along with you for the Republican candidate who promises to suppress and hold back the heathens-anyone who is not WASP/Christian/Conservative who won't bow down to a so-called, "whiteness standard" as the gauge of civility in this land we all call home.

I hope this doesn't sound rude but I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish here. It seems as if you are trying to convince me white supremacists and neo-Nazis exist. If so, I already know they do. They will always exist. 

My point is that I think they are being made a larger threat than they really are for the purpose of political gain. More specifically, that they are an existential threat, poised to turn the United States into a fascist country and action needs to be taken. 

We hear from the President and the FBI that white nationalism is the biggest threat to our country. My question is, how? In what way? What do they think is going to happen? That white nationalists actually have a snowballs chance in Hell of taking over the country? Does anyone with a working IQ actually believe that? Just look at what happened to those idiots who attended the Unite the Right rally in Charlottsville. They didn't unite the right. They were rejected by the right. Most of them ended up in prison, losing their jobs, sued six ways to Sunday or some combination of the three. That's why I don't think we're going to see anything like that again for quite a while. These people probably aren't bright, but they're probably bright enough to not want that to happen to them again. These guys ruined their lives for nothing. 

The nation is very different from what it was in the photo you shared, but even then, although there were 22,000 Nazis in Madison Square Garden, there were 100,000 outside who were protesting it. I'm honestly asking, do you really think the magnitude of today's white supremacy compares to what it was then? 

Since I'm conservative, most of you would put me on the right. And what I see from there are people who are not white nationalists or extremists being labeled as that anyway. For many, just being on the right makes me a white nationalist. So does my not supporting LGTBQ issues. Not supporting Critical Race Theory. That's complete bunk. So much crap has been put under the white nationalist umbrella that doesn't actually belong there that it's obvious why it's there. To lump as many people under that umbrella as possible, even if they aren't white nationalists. Charges of fascism are thrown out so much that it's pretty much lost any meaning anymore.  

There was barely a day growing up that I was not called a slur by white Christians. Now I'm not saying that all white Christians are racists and Jew haters, but there are plenty of them out there.

I meant to say something earlier about this. I'm sorry that happened to you. I've never understood that sort of thing coming from purported Christians. The NT makes it pretty clear that God is never going to abandon the Jews so it seems to me that those who treat Jews that way are setting themselves in opposition to God. 

Some of them may even be in his church of choice

I disagree because the term alt right is so loosely defined and so broadly applied.

Disagree all you want. The people that coined the term were anti-sematic, white supremacist douchebags and proud of it.

This is part of my point. What sort of twisted chain of logic would put LGTBQ+ under the white supremacist umbrella?

It's not twisted at all. The same exact people are espousing the same idea - a straight white evangelical alpha male patriarchy. 

...that's like saying because most white supremacists like hamburgers, whites who like hamburgers are white supremacists. 

Are hamburgers being discriminated against? Are they going to lose their jobs or their lives? Who's twisting logic now?

Since all parties gerrymander, this is pretty threadbare. 

It's part of larger pattern when it's done along racial bias. Diluting the vote, removing their local governmental voice, removing programs that insure equity in hiring and education is all part and parcel of incremental cuts to ensure that a certain group of people retain power. 

True, but it doesn't mean that it is.

WTF??? You admit it's true, but don't accept it? This is the kind of logic that lets the worst of human kind seep through the cracks and go everywhere.

Where would the country be if there had been no civil rights movement, if blacks and other racial minorities had remained submissive and subject to legal discrimination, segregation, and racial prejudice?  You act as if whites willingly, en masse, moved into a more enlightened racial era.  Sorry, many had to be dragged kicking and screaming. My point? "White supremacy" is a continuum with many facets, including subtle ones. There is still a sizeable part of the white population that either believes this is a "white" country or wishes it still was. We are , at best, two generations away from the era of widespread open racial prejudice. That is not even close to enough time passed to put this issue behind us. Just deal with it. 

We hear from the President and the FBI that white nationalism is the biggest threat to our country. My question is, how? In what way? What do they think is going to happen?

They are organizing, recruiting, being trained in the military, being hired on police forces and elected to office. They think they can get enough people in enough positions to start a new civil war. There are a few of them that think they can put people in all positions of power and get a President to suspend the Constitution without firing a shot. That is absurd. 

That white nationalists actually have a snowballs chance in Hell of taking over the country?

It's not that most people think they can take over...yet. It's a growing movement again after seeing how it all played out once before should give anyone pause. Ignoring it isn't a solution. Standing against it is. Rooting out of our police forces, armed forces, governments and classrooms is the only solution.

And now I can present evilgenius at 1.3.43 and 1.3.45 as evidence of what I'm talking about. 

Nice straw man, John. 

I dont think you understand white supremacy. 

Since he isn't a democrat he probably doesn't, why don't you explain it to him. What is it like to think people of color are inferior? that they can't get into college or jobs without the democrats help. that they just aren't capable of making it without democrats to take care of them, why don't you explain that to him John.

I've never understood that sort of thing coming from purported Christians

I guess the last 8 years have been pretty rough then, huh?

If you don't see it, racism/white supremacy that could be that you are blind to the fact that it exists or you simple chose not to see it.

These racist. . . people for lack of a better word, are running around trying to incite a race war in their little groups and are picking blacks off one by one or in series and this. . .person. . . wants us to sit around tapping our fingers or getting on with our lives, until white supremacists take over the foundations of the republic? Is this person blind to the fact that white supremacy is only in decline and suppressed because the prevailing interests of society don't/won't permit it to flower/flourish?!

And yet, the root of white supremacy is allowed to live in the ground of the first amendment free speech clause. All those. . . people. . .need do is find a way to excite the minds of the citizenry. I don't know, how about just going around 'blasting' innocent minorities to death with guns in lone wolf scenarios—hoping to FINALLY go 'viral' and get an avalanche of bloodletting going?

This. . .person. . . wants us to wait for that? 

Where is the wisdom in doing so?

 I am going to stop here. . . because I am so disturbed by that. . . person's remarks. . . that I might start just cursing and only cursing. Coffee time.

Coffee time.

CB, hun...If coffee is what you want...maybe you need a decaff or a nice cuppa chamomille?

As you and others may know and agree, not all white supremacists want and need Blacks and Others to leave the country or die a violent death. They want Blacks and Others to know what white supremacists have decided is their place under white leadership, doctrines, and holding control over the country.

It's fundamentalist Christians. And they fault Jews for Jewish leadership in the times of Jesus for giving him a sham trial and conspiring to have Romans crucify him. It is only RECENT HISTORY that Fundamentalists have turned to looking to the "end-times" as approaching more now than ever (no proof of any of that though) that the "fundies" are jumping on the Jews and Christians together bandwagon.

the "fundies" are jumping on the Jews and Christians together bandwagon.

Well, they have to, don't they? They need the Jews to return to Israel so the End Times can commence.

Did you read those Left Behind books? I remember something that Jenkins and LaHaye were trying to convey about the Christians needing the Jews to fulfill their prophecy

HA! 

No chamomile or any other tea (pleas) and I forbid DECAF!  Oddly, coffee is calming for me (psychologically). It helps me feel complete in the mornings.  Love you, Sugar-Sister!

They are not 'coming' for Fundamentalist Christians. That said, Christians are "mega-churching" and they are on TBN Christian television talking about how Christians are to take over the culture (again) before the Heathens (Others) break loose and take away Christian liberties, freedoms of expression/actions, and privileges. Although, the true power of religious expression is within the confines of the Churches and not in the outside world. 

First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist

Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist

Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist

Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew

* Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me.

Author: Martin Niemöller

* I grayed out the "Me" segment of this brilliant poem, because White Supremacy is highly probably never coming for the fundamentalists as they 'ride and abide' together in aspiring to again control the lives of the Others.

And now I can present evilgenius at 1.3.43 and 1.3.45 as evidence of what I'm talking about. 

And now you go from denial to deflection... 

If the Christian fundamentalists would get it thru their thick skulls that us Heathens are happy to live and let live. Go worship in your mega churches, but don't expect me to attend or give you money so you can add another wing. If I want to drink beer on Sunday, I will. Stop trying to turn my beloved United States of America into a Christian Nationalist theocracy because I will fight you every step of the way.

You used here does not mean, you, dear CB. It's used as the collective you

Your comment is disconnected from reality, "George." 

I don’t think you’re being rude, but I think you’re kind of missing my point. I know you know that white supremacy exist and I know you know they will always exist. But I don’t believe people make a fuss because of political gain. I also don’t think we’re turning into a fascist country right now. What happens in the future it’s hard to tell. Do you think that Germany for sure the Nazis? Of course not it happens slowly in increments.

I do believe that the Internet has contributed to the growth of white supremacists. Of course the exact number can’t be determined since it happens in the privacy of their homes in growing groups of like minded people. I’m not saying that our government is rolling over and letting this happen. Of course not. but that still doesn’t mean that it can’t happen. 

As for our nation being very different from the picture that I shared with you I’m not so sure. Before the Nazis took over, I am sure most good. Germans would say that something like that could never happen. All you need is the rights of conditions for something like that to happen. And for the record, I actually think there are more white supremacists now in the US because the Internet has added to that.

Now as for you being conservative, I don’t think that being a conservative equates being a white supremacist. I also don’t think not supporting LGBTQ issues or critical race theory makes you a white supremacist. As for comments about conservatives being fascists, it is thrown out commonly, but the same thing could be said about comments about the left being communists. These are things that people do for political gain and for hyperbole. Sadly, it diminishes the real danger that’s out there, and it is indeed out there.

Yeah, that whole hamburger argument was a real head scratcher, like, WTF???????

The whole 'argument' is a real head scratcher, like, WTF?????????

What the fuck exactly ARE you talking about?????????

He understands it quite well.  He defends the indefensible.

What the fuck exactly ARE you talking about?????????

He understands it quite well. He defends the indefensible.

Emphatically. Diversity is what this country has purposed from the first immigrant insistence on calling this country: "Home."  While some of us, apparently not all of us, understand that a republic will have its cultural ups and downs and dynamics, some other of us, thought that their time as dominating the cultural themes should have been the be all that ends it all. I, we, had no idea that conservatism was so stuck on itself that it began to believe its own press and suffer the delusion that this country belongs to them and their worldview is the only 'view' that should matter to the whole of the "grand experiment" in democratic republicanism.

Now as for you being conservative, I don’t think that being a conservative equates being a white supremacist. I also don’t think not supporting LGBTQ issues or critical race theory makes you a white supremacist. As for comments about conservatives being fascists, it is thrown out commonly, but the same thing could be said about comments about the left being communists.

You know I am not one to step on someone else viewpoint. But, I would not encourage Drakkonis to believe a delusion. No! This is not absolutism and he knew that before he suggested it. The fact of the matter is. . .MAGA conservatives have gone the extra distance of alienating people who simply want to live, enjoy, and prosper alongside of them but they won't have ANY of it.  

As far as I can tell their real 'joy' in life is trying to suppress or repress some categories of innocent citizens of this country or if that fails get rid of us altogether. In any case, they don't want us to have ever-increasing political power or to be a force of contention in the scheme of ideology. They don't care that homosexuals, blacks, women or Others have not done anything to conservatives or MAGA, they simply want us to be beneath them in every significant endeavor in this life.

I won't stand for it. I will not appease any of them. Damn that.

And no I don't hate conservatives or MAGA, I simply won't abide APPEASING them. . .because they will take it as approval to be more 'dickish' than they already are being. Trump being the dumbest, biggest, DICKish man who can't EVER take a clue that I can remember reading about or 'encountering' in my lifetime. Yes, that is saying something, because there have been some real dickish people throughout recorded history. And some conservatives support that foolish dickish man to the extreme.

The Jews formed the state of Israel in 1948 and it is their homeland. And yes, Christians. . .especially fundamentalists Christians have been pining away about the "the Apocalypse" ever since. Remember all the movies in the 20 century with shots of men wearing "The End is Near" billboards? Well, that was own them. God did not feel pressure in any way to fulfill their version of a return 'advent.'

I watched (in a church even) the Left Behind movie back in the 90's. Can't remember its ending though for some reason. 

What does our US Census say?

You tell us John, they are your numbers.

I don’t think you’re being rude

Thank you. 

I do believe that the Internet has contributed to the growth of white supremacists. 

Not impossible, but I think making such a determination would be difficult to quantify. As an example, take JR's post at 1.3.16 . 

The white supremacist forum Stormfront has over 1 million seeds, appx 14 million comments, and 377,000 members.

As Drinker pointed out shortly after, Stormfront seems to have fallen on hard times which, to me, argues against growth. Stormfront should be doing better, not worse. 

Instead, rather than a significant increase in white supremacists, I see what has been true of us all along. We're a lot freer with sharing what we already think because of the degree of anonymity social media affords.  

I’m not saying that our government is rolling over and letting this happen. Of course not. but that still doesn’t mean that it can’t happen.

Yes, it can happen. But there's a world of difference between possibility and probability. To me, one test of that possibility began in Charlottsville in 2017 and the Unite the Right rally. It was the biggest gathering of white supremacists in decades. I thought at the time, this is it. This is where we're going to begin to find out how bad the problem is. 

What the media did was take one event and then declare that Nazis were in serious danger of taking over the country. Nonsense. No way to tell that from just one event. I knew then that what would prove the extent of the problem is that if such rallies kept happening and kept getting bigger. It never happened. 

Sure. Small groups here and there did their attention seeking thing but the Unite the Right had different groups all in the same place and time, and that hasn't happened again since. In other words, they did not unite themselves and they certainly didn't unite anyone on the right to their cause. It failed on every level except giving the Left and media ammunition to create a problem that isn't any larger than it has been over the last 40 years. 

So, if white supremacists are growing, if it is the existential threat we're being told it is, why haven't there been more and bigger Charlottsvilles? 

As for our nation being very different from the picture that I shared with you I’m not so sure. Before the Nazis took over, I am sure most good. Germans would say that something like that could never happen. All you need is the rights of conditions for something like that to happen. 

Okay, but I need something more convincing than it simply being possible if you want to change my mind. I'm open to that. Show me how they are gaining power. Show me what they are doing politically that is actually showing results. Show me who's listening to them. Show me how they are doing it. 

Now as for you being conservative, I don’t think that being a conservative equates being a white supremacist. I also don’t think not supporting LGBTQ issues or critical race theory makes you a white supremacist.

I appreciate that, thank you. Unfortunately, the political environment doesn't share your opinion. Just look at how what I am saying is being received by nearly all of everyone else in this discussion. I haven't said one thing in support of white supremacy, yet it's as if I'm asking people to sign up for it or something. They are attacking me simply for questioning the narrative. Contrast that with your actually trying to discuss this with me civilly. You're telling me what you think about the issue, not judging my position. 

As for comments about conservatives being fascists, it is thrown out commonly, but the same thing could be said about comments about the left being communists.

True. More, the fascist charge is closer to being true of some elements on the right, even though those elements aren't white supremacists, than that white supremacists are an existential threat to the country, in my opinion. I think the same charge is true of the Left as well. Oh, btw, when I capitalize Left, I'm speaking of what I think of white supremacists opposite number on the left, not simply being on the left politically. 

These are things that people do for political gain and for hyperbole. Sadly, it diminishes the real danger that’s out there, and it is indeed out there.

Well, while we may not agree on the magnitude of threat white supremacy currently presents, I agree totally with the hyperbole comment. I think that there are way greater threats to our country right now than white supremacy. Inner city crime, poverty, inflation, housing markets, open borders and other such things that are demonstratable threats. 

The ending left no doubt what LaHaye and Jenkins wished for

there's only one efficient and effective way of of dealing with white supremacists and nazis...

dropping and flopping...

Curios. What happened in the end? I watched it in 93-94 years and can't for the life of me recall the story ending!

Thanks, good value added, devangelical.

Right-wing activist Laura Loomer was harassed by them and endured antisemitic slurs. She      posted on X  : "Very vitriolic and irrational behavior. "

lol. she's trying to criticize them in the mildest way possible. 

However, they still have a right to free speech and freedom of association, even if they are irrational Nazi trolls (and possibly even Feds).

Oh FFS another fricking nut case is all these right-wingers conspiracy nuts, it sure seems so.

She should have smacked one of them with her purse

she took them all out for cocktails that night... >wink<

... in a party bus, with a brass pole.

LMAO

xtian conservative women are trained to submit, on demand...

I used to know the latin mass phrase that put them on their knees when I was in high school...

And the POS are back to spreading their BS to homes in the area. This happened twice in Gainesville in the last couple of months and here we go again. 

Another Florida Community Targeted by Antisemitic Packets

msn

What the heck goes on in Florida?

What the heck goes on in Florida?

Much of Florida has lost their minds.

South Florida is just way too close to the triangle. Weird shit happens there. 

At first I thought you said "lost their meds"....

That could be true as well, Trout.

... off their meds.

nucking futs

A bunch of pathetic, fucking creeps.  I wish them only the worst.

Have met good folk in the keys. Just like anywhere else, some are good.

[removed] 

[removed] 

I'm referring to the Nazis.  Nothing good about any of them.  Not a single thing.

[Deleted]

I'll go gone till about noon so I'm locking the article and will unlock it when I return.

The article is now unlocked.

There aren't all that many of them, and they aren't everywhere.

Your opinion is based on what? How would you know?

maybe those that can't see the white supremacists have their hoods on backwards...

There aren't all that many of them, and they aren't everywhere.

Thank you for the insightful comment, but there are certainly enough of them to kill three innocent black people in Jacksonville. It only took one for you information.

Well, sensationalizing a story about handful of racists doing their stupid shit is just gives them unwarranted publicity and further enables them. 

The underlying insinuation is that this kind of behavior is widespread and a major problem in the US, of which there is no proof

Well, sensationalizing a story about handful of racists doing their stupid shit is just gives them unwarranted publicity and further enables them. 

I guess you're not aware of the number of times different white nationists/supremacists groups have demonstrated in Florida or the overall number of hate groups here. 

The underlying insinuation is that this kind of behavior is widespread and a major problem in the US, of which there is no proof.

I see that you're not up to date on the various reports from government agencies on this movement including the FBI or the number of violent actions they have taken. 

Or perhaps since you're not a minority you have no idea what the hell is going on in the underbelly of our Republic since it's possible that it doesn't concern you.

It's like these neonazi scum said Greg 'we are everywhere' except to those who don't see it/pretend it is not a major problem and just refuse to see the truth

The underlying insinuation is that this kind of behavior is widespread and a major problem in the US, of which there is no proof

Is this one of those Clark Kent can't be Superman because he wears glasses? Like, if one wears a tie instead of swastika tattoo they can't be a white supremacist? The proof is everywhere. For fuck's sake the former President had white supremacists on staff. Several current and former Republican Congress Critters have spoken at conservative events where white supremacists were featured and even promoted them. The Oath Keepers and Proud Boys are famously filled with white supremacists and have been convicted for seditious conspiracy. The only way to NOT see the problem is to not pay any attention past the end of one's own nose. 

but there are certainly enough of them to kill three innocent black people in Jacksonville. It only took one for you information.

True and the guy that did it went out as a coward. To a point, he was not from Jacksonville. He was from Orange Park...Oakleaf to be exact, an upper middle class large development.  Not surprisingly, lived with his parents.

However, back in Jacksonville, there have been 75 homicides here so far this year, all of them but 7 black victims, and all but 5 black killers. \Now, where is the outrage of all black on black killings? Yea, we get black pastors every rare moment saying a few words, then back into the shadows they go.

White supremacy exists in small numbers, however, black hate on other blacks FAR overshadows anything these white idiots do.

True and the guy that did it went out as a coward. To a point, he was not from Jacksonville. He was from Orange Park...Oakleaf to be exact, an upper middle class large development.  Not surprisingly, lived with his parents.

Orange Park is a suburb of Jacksonville about 20 minutes south and I don't know what that has to do with the article.

However, back in Jacksonville, there have been 75 homicides here so far this year, all of them but 7 black victims, and all but 5 black killers. \Now, where is the outrage of all black on black killings? Yea, we get black pastors every rare moment saying a few words, then back into the shadows they go.

The outrage is probably the same place as the white on white crime which is substantial. This is a link to an interesting article about just that on a broader scope.

usatoday

Jacksonville does have a crime problem and Duval County has the highest crime rate in Florida even higher than Miami Dade that has two million more people. 

Perhaps you could seed an article about it and the crime stats per city/county/state/ by demographic.

Orange Park is a suburb of Jacksonville

Not a suburb but a whole different city in a different county.

The reason I brought it up was because you have a knack knowing I am from Jacksonville and figured this would be a subtle hit. If not...then , meh.

I didn't focus on nationwide statistics as the article was about Florida. Maybe you read it?

"Jacksonville does have a crime problem and Duval County has the highest crime rate in Florida even higher than Miami Dade that has two million more people. "

You made my point. By far the largest group by demographic of perps are black, not white.

Not a suburb but a whole different city in a different county.

But listed as a suburb of Jacksonville, maybe it's a haven for white supremacists.

The reason I brought it up was because you have a knack knowing I am from Jacksonville and figured this would be a subtle hit. If not...then , meh.

Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep.

I didn't focus on nationwide statistics as the article was about Florida. Maybe you read it?

Of course, I read it unlike you who it seems didn't read my comment about it where I said: The outrage is probably the same place as the white on white crime which is substantial. This is a link to an interesting article about just that on a broader scope.

You made my point. By far the largest group by demographic of perps are black, not white.

Actually, I didn't make your point, but keep swinging away.

Anyhow, have a great evening and I'll be looking forward to you seeding or writing an article on this. 

Wow. Ugly WHATABOUTISM rears it stupefying head once more. Assuming your numbers are correct, . . . so what?

However, back in Jacksonville, there have been 75 homicides here so far this year, all of them but 7 black victims, and all but 5 black killers.

There is no, "however" relevant here. The three dead victims in a Dollar Tree store mass murder were killed by a white supremacist who drew swastikas and racial slurs on his firearms. The thing speaks for itself!

Why do you need distractions?

I am willing to bet the black on black homicides you referred to did not occur simply because the victims were wearing black skin. Do you agree or disagree? Of course! You have to agree. Why? Because it would be stupid to think that a black person will go after blacks because of skin color alone as it would be silly to think that a white person would shoot a white person or persons merely for being "white."

There is no, "however" relevant here.

Yes, actually, there is. That's rather the point, CB. One guy with swastikas on his gun kills three black people and it completely overshadows the far, far larger problem of black on black shootings and murders. I think it was meant to do exactly that. 

Otherwise, what is the message here? That it's okay because a) they're only blacks and b) it's just a cultural thing? Yeah, they're killing each other but at least they weren't killed by a white supremacist so it's okay? How does it make sense to prioritize the rabid fox over the rabid grizzly?

Over 100,000 deaths due to drug overdoses in 2021 alone. People in cities are losing access to food and other necessities because of store closures. Housing crisis. Homelessness keeps getting worse and worse. There are way bigger issues we need to be dealing with here. But we're wasting our time on an issue that just isn't there in any significant way. It's simply being used as a political cudgel. 

Now, go ahead and do the usual straw man rant about MAGA and whatever stuff you bring into your fantasy. 

s, actually, there is. That's rather the point, CB. One guy with swastikas on his gun kills three black people and it completely overshadows the far, far larger problem of black on black shootings and murders. I think it was meant to do exactly that. 

So you've stooped to the old bullshit trope of black on black crime. Here are the real facts and my question is when are you going to stop the white on white crime? If you can't produce some facts always jump to a racial trope. 

Between 1980-2008, the U.S. Department of Justice found that 84% of white victims were killed by white offenders and 93% of Black victims were killed by Black offenders. In 2018, the   Federal Bureau of Investigation   reported that 81% of white victims were killed by white offenders, and 89% of Black victims were killed by Black offenders.

The key difference is the disproportionate numbers of victims:

In 2021, the FBI reported that there were 8,488 Black murder victims in the United States and 5,500 White murder victims. In comparison, there were 312 murder victims of unknown race, 187 murder victims who were American Indian or Alaska Native, and 150 murder victims who were Asian.

Good to know that all races kill each other, but WTF let's only point out the blacks. And of course, let Drakkonis use the trope to excuse his bs comment which has nothing to do with the article or white supremacy which is the topic of the article. 

Excuses are like assholes everyone has one, Drinker including you and our good Christian, Drakkonis.

Here is an idea instead of you posting questions why don't you write an article on this subject being that you have some expertise in research let's see you give us an article instead of your usual crap. Are you up to it or is it going to be more of your BS? 

Excuses are like assholes everyone has one, Drinker including you and our good Christian, Drakkonis.

I wasn't trying to make an excuse.

No? Either way it's deflection from the issue of the article, unless you want to tie it into how the dim witted neo-nazi fucks sometimes like to shoot each other.

what is the message here?

Your only message seems to be to deflect from the article. 

I don't need you to tell me what I can or can not talk about, Drak—usual or unusual. What is needed is MAGA to mind its conservative business and leave liberals to mind liberal business.

Now as the rest of your attempt to redirect this discussion on to black on black violence. As I mentioned to that other individual. The two things are separate and distinct by definition. You need them intermingle them, because of well, . . . its convenience as a WHATABOUTISM.

But you won't get away with it. 

In a court of law, bringing up strange and 'exotic' forms of defense is not allowed. Talking about overdoses, store closures, housing crisis, homelessness and "worsening" cities would get you laughed at before it would be stricken from the proceedings as not relevant to the case. 

Now can you tell me, us, why it is so important that we place the value of your private experiences (anecdotal stories) about white supremacists over the reporting of a white racist with a racial words and epitaphs and a swastika who walked into a Dollar General and picked out black citizens of this country to murder?

And can you speak on the root cause of racial hatred and be more relevant than trying to steer away to issues on the periphery such as black on black crime. 

As for the "limited scope" of the problem. . .as you imply.

First, as you well know it is better to fix a problem or check and keep tabs on a recurring problem before it metastasizes. That is, while it is a trickle, or a hose worth of 'work' instead of waiting for it to become a *full-alarm* happening where all hands on deck are called for!

Second, we owe the three Dollar General victims more than some "snooze" analysis masquerading as deep "clinical" thought, because those people are dead and done so for absolutely nothing. I am sure they would wish for more from you—us!

Finally, since you like taking the last ditch "dig" in your comments. . . here's one for you: This is not a discussion about second amendment gun rights and so I, we, won't allow these victims of racial violence to be collateral damage like the little Sandy Hook kids and adults who died in vain because people like you love to side-line and waylay discussions about real issues of race-interactive harm and those who promote it as a dangerous and deadly worldview! 

Lastly, I see no need to interject discussion about white on white violence into this, either!

No? Either way it's deflection from the issue of the article, unless you want to tie it into how the dim witted neo-nazi fucks sometimes like to shoot each other.

So you've stooped to the old bullshit trope of black on black crime.

Just knew someone was going to say something like this. I thought about mentioning something about white on white but... let's see. You guys brought up the deal with a white supremacist killing three black people, as if their being black was the significant portion of that data. I can't know of course but I wonder how many of you would have cared if he'd killed three white people?

Further, since the Left loves the word "disproportionate" so much, the problem is disproportionately larger and worse for blacks than it is white. If you look at the math, black people are about 13% of the population and suffered, according to Drinker's contribution, 8,488 murders, while whites make up around 59% and  suffered 5,500. As a fraction of populations, the black murder rate is the more serious problem by far. 

Um, and as for it being "bullshit", you yourself confirmed that it is true, so in what way is it bullshit? How is it a trope? Perhaps you're using the word wrong? Or maybe you're just creating a straw man argument, trying to insinuate that I made some claim that suggests white people don't kill other white people? 

Good to know that all races kill each other, but WTF let's only point out the blacks. And of course, let Drakkonis use the trope to excuse his bs comment which has nothing to do with the article or white supremacy which is the topic of the article.

Again, it appears you don't know what the word "trope" means. My comments do in fact relate directly to the article. What you are upset about is that I am questioning the narrative the Left wants us to believe about the issue. 

Excuses are like assholes everyone has one, Drinker including you and our good Christian, Drakkonis.

Yes. How unchristian of me to want to see politicians deal with the much bigger problem of the disproportionately larger numbers of black people being killed by other black people rather than inflate a problem that isn't that big. If you find it unchristian of me to be far more concerned with all the ruined lives in the black community rather than a few white supremacists, well, opinions are like assholes as well, right? 

You guys brought up the deal with a white supremacist killing three black people, as if their being black was the significant portion of that data. I can't know of course but I wonder how many of you would have cared if he'd killed three white people?

White supremacist is what the murderer is. He took the life of three black citizens. Why can't you care about three black people who are dead and the subject of discussion?

This is the crap that spews from the pen of MAGA conservatives which is inauthentic and makes matters worse instead of 'healing.' The white supremacy problem in this country hides in its 'folds' and festers while every attempt to put it under a microscope and focus on how to end it is thwarted by those who act as casual defenders of raw hatred and Others subordination.

As to the rest of that REDIRECTION dribble. . . .

Spin "bitches". . . spin.

Just knew someone was going to say something like this. I thought about mentioning something about white on white but... let's see. You guys brought up the deal with a white supremacist killing three black people, as if their being black was the significant portion of that data. I can't know of course but I wonder how many of you would have cared if he'd killed three white people?

A white supremacist killing three black people because they are black is a significant portion of the data, in fact, it is the data. A white supremacist killing three white people because they are white is delusional.

Further, since the Left loves the word "disproportionate" so much, the problem is disproportionately larger and worse for blacks than it is white. If you look at the math, black people are about 13% of the population and suffered, according to Drinker's contribution, 8,488 murders, while whites make up around 59% and  suffered 5,500. As a fraction of populations, the black murder rate is the more serious problem by far.

The article is about a white supremacist killing three blacks because they were black. The black-on-black crime that you deflected to is trying to escape the real fact that blacks were killed by a white because they were black. At the same time, there is no mention from you of the 5500 whites that were killed by other whites because it was not disporportionate. Amazing mental gymnastics and deflection on your part.

Um, and as for it being "bullshit", you yourself confirmed that it is true, so in what way is it bullshit? How is it a trope? Perhaps you're using the word wrong? Or maybe you're just creating a straw man argument, trying to insinuate that I made some claim that suggests white people don't kill other white people? 

It's best you don't try to put words in my mouth, you are very poor at it.

Yes. How unchristian of me to want to see politicians deal with the much bigger problem of the disproportionately larger numbers of black people being killed by other black people rather than inflate a problem that isn't that big. If you find it unchristian of me to be far more concerned with all the ruined lives in the black community rather than a few white supremacists, well, opinions are like assholes as well, right? 

Being unchristian is your words. If you are so concerned with black-on-black crime what have you done besides trying to deflect from this article to address it, have you written your congressman, or joined groups protesting black-on-black crime? Have you done anything about white-on-white crime or isn't that disproportionate enough for you?

What you have done repeatedly in this article is deflect and not accept the fact that three black people are dead because of a white supremacist. There is no way around it nor is there any way to sugarcoat it, Drakkonis. Try as you might you simply show that you have no understanding of the problem and deflection is your best tool.

How unchristian of me to want to see politicians deal with the much bigger problem of the disproportionately larger numbers of black people being killed by other black people rather than inflate a problem that isn't that big.

Trump supporter, how dare you? UnChristian? UnChristian? After all is said and done - you will rally around, support, and for the second time vote for the biggest, crudest, amoral, unChristian "creature" to ever have once been a president and you imagine you have a place to come from with this fake ass appeal to redirect the topic of discussion.

Question: How UNCHRISTIAN is it for a Christian to practice manipulation?

What [Drakkonis has] done repeatedly in this article is deflect and not accept the fact that three black people are dead because of a white supremacist. There is no way around it nor is there any way to sugarcoat it, Drakkonis. Try as you might you simply show that you have no understanding of the problem and deflection is your best tool.

Some conservatives are using manipulation. It is a form of deceit. It is UnChristlike. But when it is allowed to work its "expedient" and a means to get a desired result: Readers running down rabbit holes and becoming 'breathless' and worn out from the chase!

Moral: Readers must not fall through the hole which opens up right in front of them! Stay above ground no matter what!

A white supremacist killing three black people because they are black is a significant portion of the data, in fact, it is the data. A white supremacist killing three white people because they are white is delusional.

Not sure whether Governor Witmer of Michigan would agree with you, but that's me.

The article is about a white supremacist killing three blacks because they were black. The black-on-black crime that you deflected to is trying to escape the real fact that blacks were killed by a white because they were black. At the same time, there is no mention from you of the 5500 whites that were killed by other whites because it was not disporportionate. Amazing mental gymnastics and deflection on your part.

The article! The article! You do realize, don't you, that people make various comments relating to the article. Like how there's apparently a Nazi under every bed or something. So, as to the article, please quote me where I said anything that could be considered denying this killing occurred. Good luck with that. 

My comments are directly addressed to comments you apparently approve of because they support the narrative that white supremacy is this overarching problem in the US. You object, calling my argument deflection. Seems to me that unless one participates in an echo chamber, anything said that stands in opposition to your preferred narrative is a deflection. 

Now, imagine I write an article, or post someone else's, that says the same thing I've been saying. That the white supremacy issue is being inflated for political purposes. Apparently, according you your rules, anything you say against that article or comments made by others would be deflection rather than advancing your point of view? Don't insult our intelligence and say you would categorize your own opposition to the narrative as deflection. 

Um, and as for it being "bullshit", you yourself confirmed that it is true, so in what way is it bullshit? How is it a trope? Perhaps you're using the word wrong? Or maybe you're just creating a straw man argument, trying to insinuate that I made some claim that suggests white people don't kill other white people? 

It's best you don't try to put words in my mouth, you are very poor at it.

Except that I didn't have you saying anything you didn't say. I didn't rephrase anything you said. I actually asked you questions about what you said and what your intent was for saying them. You know, so I don't put words in your mouth? 

Being unchristian is your words.

But it was your implication. 

If you are so concerned with black-on-black crime what have you done besides trying to deflect from this article to address it, have you written your congressman, or joined groups protesting black-on-black crime? Have you done anything about white-on-white crime or isn't that disproportionate enough for you?

Pointing out that the murder rate among some black communities is a far more serious and immediate threat than white nationalism is not a deflection. It is part of the argument against the idea that white supremacy is the existential threat to the US it is made out to be. That is directly relevant to the article and comments made here. It is actually your straw man that I am trying to divert the conversation to black on black murder. I simply point out it's the bigger problem. The actual deflection is you trying to claim I'm trying to change the subject. 

As far as what I have done? Hmm. Maybe I should give money to BLM? Or maybe I should start getting behind Democrats, funding them, because they've been in charge of the worst areas for decades and things are just getting worse? Those sound doable, don't they? But really, what does it matter what I am doing or not doing? How does it add or subtract anything to the discussion? This question, Kavika, would be an actual deflection, since it suggests (falsely) that someone can't have a view unless they pass some arbitrary standard of yours. 

What you have done repeatedly in this article is deflect and not accept the fact that three black people are dead because of a white supremacist.

Repeatedly? How about you show me just one instance where I denied such? 

There is no way around it nor is there any way to sugarcoat it, Drakkonis. Try as you might you simply show that you have no understanding of the problem and deflection is your best tool.

Typical. No argument, just strawman arguments and no real ones. 

Typical. No argument, just strawman arguments and no real ones. 

Good to know you recognize that you have no real arguments only deflection and blaming everything on the left, sad commentary on your partisan bs, but it is what it is as you have proven once again.

lucky for us there's somebody here that knows about florida nazis and where they all are...

There aren't all that many of them, and they aren't everywhere.

How many does it take before it's wrong, Greg? 

I think very few if anyone here does not think it is wrong

There is a difference between being wrong and not buying into inflating the problem to try and make it seem it is much more widespread than it actually is.

Clearly white supremacy/supremacists are not coming after some conservatives, because they vote and support the same 'establishment' and political party! And no one is telling the so-called, "lone wolves" to nibble at minorities apparently, but if it was you or me being randomly shot at, injured, or killed, that is they are coming after you then. . . let's just say that changes the game in a big way, eh?  

I have no clue what point you are attempting to make or what your response has to do with my comment at all.

I'm sure you don't. The comment stands. The "clue" may hit in the middle of the night! Sending you thoughts and prayers on the matter!

[deleted]

"As in previous years, the neo-Nazi movement continued to struggle under significant setbacks to in-person organizing in 2022. In some regions, groups, such as Nationalist Social Club (NSC-131), have staged small demonstrations targeting LGBTQ populations, immigrants, people of color, Jews and other religious minorities with intimidation and hatred. Longstanding, more traditionally organized neo-Nazi organizations have continued to flounder, including the National Socialist Movement, a decades-old group with roots in the American Nazi Party, which was rocked by the 2019 departure of its longtime leader. The Neo-Nazis’ failure to revive pre-2019 membership numbers have not stopped its members or leaders from making headlines through acts of violence."

"Much of the momentum behind the neo-Nazi movement today continues to come from smaller, more decentralized cadres and online social networks with a terroristic focus. Still, these groups, which embrace a tactic known as white power accelerationism, have proven to be susceptible to the same disruptions from law enforcement, journalists and activists throughout 2020 and into 2022, as the more traditional membership-based organizations they claimed were outmoded"

splcenter

Darn it, Drinker! You're ruining the narrative!!!

It’s a calling.

Oops. Don't know how that quote got in there.

Birds of a feather flock together! Emphatically. Clear presentation of some conservatives not taking anything to do with Others seriously. Some conservatives are dismissed!

Oh, and it must not escape this discussion that you STILL won't defend the dead black citizens of Dollar General in your statements on other extraneous matters or call out the white supremacist for the crime of serial murder.

You really don't have to at this point. We SEE you "loud and clear"!

Alas, some conservatives really can't criticize the white supremacists voting bloc, because they are in the republican party right alongside the rest-helping elect repressive conservative "throw-back" regimes and putting out repressive policies you approve.

Why don't you just move to a state that more fits your leftist ideals?

I have explained that to you a couple of times, your inability to comprehend it is not my problem, but yours, bugsy.

Conservatives don't own states, bugsy. In fact, conservatives don't own  politics in any state, either. It's all up to the citizenry. And they can change minds or fight the power that be.

sounds like Florida is being overrun by hateful, impotent no good evil neonazi scum

that's funny!

funny but true...

It’s what happens when you let so many NY’rs and NJ folks in.

nah, it's much more prevalent among the shallow gene pools in the south, but there's been a lot more sightings in the upper midwest.

gated communities, gated gene pools...

dixie swastikas...

Most of this article deals with organized white supremacy and antisemitism.  I don’t see any comments here supporting that.

The last paragraph deals with the recent killing in Jacksonville by an unorganized white suprematist. Not only was this dysfunctional young man a racist, but he was mentally ill.  Sheriff Waters (Jacksonville) characterized his manifestos as “the diary of a madman” during a press conference.

I don’t believe that a physically healthy 21 year old commits suicide unless they are mentally ill.

Government can clearly work on more than one problem at a time, but from a risk management perspective, black-on-black crimes create far more black victims than white supremacy does.  

Where do you want your federal crime dollars and efforts proportionally focused?  Is reducing victimhood a priority or is that in the to-hard-to-do box.

Who are you addressing this comment to?

To anyone reading these comments.

Most of this article deals with organized white supremacy and antisemitism.  I don’t see any comments here supporting that.

No one said there was but there are the usual deflection re black-on-black crime.

The last paragraph deals with the recent killing in Jacksonville by an unorganized white suprematist. Not only was this dysfunctional young man a racist, but he was mentally ill.  Sheriff Waters (Jacksonville) characterized his manifestos as “the diary of a madman” during a press conference.

Unorganized or organized the three people are still dead. Most racists/murderers are mentally ill and his manifesto being characterized by the sheriff as ''the dairy of a madman'' is standard most manifestos are bizarre.

Government can clearly work on more than one problem at a time, but from a risk management perspective, black-on-black crimes create far more black victims than white supremacy does.  

Seems that you're stuck on the same tune of black-on-black crime, so let's just forget the three dead black people because fewer are killed white supremacy.

Where do you want your federal crime dollars and efforts proportionally focused?  Is reducing victimhood a priority or is that in the to-hard-to-do box.

I want people to stop killing others be they black/red/yellow because of their skin color, pretty simple but then again I am a minority and have experienced the ugly end of white supremacy, you haven't nor will you so don't throw shit out that you have no idea what you talking about. The victimhood you're talking about seems to be more whites trying to deflect from the fact that three black people were killed because of their skin color. 

Seems that you're stuck on the same tune of black-on-black crime, so let's just forget the three dead black people because fewer are killed white supremacy.

I’m not stuck at all.  I look at risk analysis and since we can’t fix everything thing at once, where should the focus be.

I want people to stop killing others be they black/red/yellow because of their skin color, pretty simple

Of course, who doesn’t, but wanting doesn’t translate into policies and funding.

The victimhood you're talking about seems to be more whites trying to deflect from the fact that three black people were killed because of their skin color. 

I have no idea what this means or what actions should be taken in response.

I don’t believe that a physically healthy 21 year old commits suicide unless they are mentally ill.

would that include enlisting in the army in the early 70's?

Depends on how much you wanted a paycheck and what your other options were.

I’m not stuck at all.  I look at risk analysis and since we can’t fix everything thing at once, where should the focus be.

Ah, yes the risk analysis factor we certainly need to have risk analysis, never mind the killing. Perhaps we can hold a government meeting to determine what analysis structure should be used that should be done sometime in 2026. Then they can move on to determine when to hold the meeting, knowing the politicians they'll probably want to do it in Monaco in 2029. 

Of course, who doesn’t, but wanting doesn’t translate into policies and funding.

Of course, it doesn't especially when it comes to minorities.

I have no idea what this means or what actions should be taken in response.

No response is necessary since it will be more bullshit.

Ah, yes the risk analysis factor we certainly need to have risk analysis, never mind the killing.

Never mind the killing?  The killer is dead, what do you want the government to do to prevent the next mentally ill killing?

No response is necessary since it will be more bullshit.

Perhaps expressing outrage on NT is sufficient to assuage our feelings.

Never mind the killing?  The killer is dead, what do you want the government to do to prevent the next mentally ill killing?

Here is my full comment: Guess the sarcasm went over your head.

Ah, yes the risk analysis factor we certainly need to have risk analysis, never mind the killing. Perhaps we can hold a government meeting to determine what analysis structure should be used that should be done sometime in 2026. Then they can move on to determine when to hold the meeting, knowing the politicians they'll probably want to do it in Monaco in 2029. 

Perhaps expressing outrage on NT is sufficient to assuage our feelings.

You would have no idea of my feeling or experiences so don't think you do, perhaps making excuses for killing blacks will assuage your feelings. 

Here is my full comment: Guess the sarcasm went over your head.

Not at all, while sarcasm makes us feel good, it doesn’t address our problems.  

You would have no idea of my feeling or experiences so don't think you do,

I’ve never assumed to know your feelings or experiences.

perhaps making excuses for killing blacks will assuage your feelings. 

I’ve never made excuses for killing Black people and I apologize for somehow confusing you.

Not at all, while sarcasm makes us feel good, it doesn’t address our problems.  

Neither do your deflections.

I’ve never assumed to know your feelings or experiences.

Ah, but you have, simply read your own comments.

I’ve never made excuses for killing Black people and I apologize for somehow confusing you.

Don't apologize it isn't authentic just like the rest of your daily nonsense. 

Neither do your deflections.

I’m ignorantly unaware of them, please identify.

Ah, but you have, simply read your own comments.

No, again I’ve never assumed to be able to feel you experiences, perhaps my comments have been carelessly written.

My question is what do we want the federal government to do differently towards the white supremacy threat while balancing actions against all the other threats that people of color face.

what do we want the federal government to do differently towards the white supremacy threat

infiltrate and exterminate.

Hey thanks again for your insightful and valuable comments. You really further the discussion and keep us on track..

... and leave them where they fall.

so, how many actual Nazis have you met and exterminated?

[deleted]

none, yet...

they're pretty scarce here because they know what will happen to them. same thing with those flying the dixie swastika

none, really?

lmao!

The badass ran them out of town?

that's the job of the FBI and DHS...

too many liberals, with guns...

too many liberals, with guns…

Where, when did you and your badass friends embrace the Mao Zedong philosophy that political power grows out of the barrel of a gun?

what friends?

the 2nd is a two way street ...

what friends 

I’m sorry that you don’t have friends

I’ll send you a friend request.

2nd Ave or 2nd St?

it'll get the same response as the last 6 or 7 friend requests you've sent me...

Damn, I’ll keep reaching out though, friend.

I’m ignorantly unaware of them, please identify.

Yes, you are and your self-awareness is lacking as well.

No, again I’ve never assumed to be able to feel you experiences, perhaps my comments have been carelessly written.

I don't know if your comments were carelessly written or not. Either way, it doesn't change them.

My question is what do we want the federal government to do differently towards the white supremacy threat while balancing actions against all the other threats that people of color face.

As you stated in a prior comment, the government is capable of doing more than one thing at a time. You, being a government employee should have an answer to your own question and even write an article on it. The first thing whites on this thread could do is stop deflecting to black on black crime and the nonsense that there isn't ''that many'' of them, them being white supremacists.

Now, I'm done with the question and answer game.

Now, I'm done with the question and answer game.

Well we will both be thankful that regardless of changing things we can at least be happy to vent our spleen here.

Well we will both be thankful that regardless of changing things we can at least be happy to vent our spleen here.

Don't make assumptions, venting my spleen here isn't something that I consider making change, I get involved in causes and put myself out there for what I believe in. You can make your own choice if you want to sit behind a keyboard and kibitz or actually do something that could make a change. 

The article has been up for two weeks, that's long enough.

The article is now closed/locked.