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Is America’s Messy Debate a Strength or a Weakness? You Answered.

  

Category:  Other

Via:  hallux  •  last year  •  8 comments

By:   Lingling Wei - WSJ

Is America’s Messy Debate a Strength or a Weakness? You Answered.
The current mess, in other words, is the norm, not the exception.

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T


Last week,   I wrote about the chasm   separating the “socialism” of a New York City politician from the “socialism with Chinese characteristics” used to justify one-party state control in China. I laid out why equating the two was to misunderstand the nature of American freedom.

I then asked our readers a question that clearly hit a nerve: When you look at American politics today, do you see that messy debate as a fundamental strength, or do you worry it’s a sign of dysfunction?

The response was overwhelming, passionate and deeply thoughtful. You wrote from across the country and around the world, from Kansas to Canada, from Virginia to Chongqing, China.

The answers you gave weren’t simple, but they clustered around three main ideas: those who see the debate itself as America’s salvation, those who fear the debate is already dead, and those who believe it is both the greatest U.S. strength and a dangerous defect.

‘A Fundamental Strength’

For many, the mere existence of the debate is the answer. This sentiment was echoed by readers who view the “mess” as the non-negotiable price—and privilege—of liberty.

Vivianne Kyazze from Canada   argued that the freedom to have opinions publicly “is a fundamental strength. Whether those debates get you answers or not, that discourse is very important ... The moment we get rid of that freedom, a society begins to die.”

Junbin Wu from Rhode Island   wrote, “In China, political debate is largely a privilege of party elites ... In contrast, in the U.S., political debate is a universal right that belongs to everyone.”   Jin Sun from New York   offered a biological metaphor. “The American political ecosystem,” he wrote, “is more like a living organism with self-repairing capabilities.”

And for those worried that things have never been worse,   George Gaudioso from Delaware   offered a dose of historical context of American division, reminding us of the Whiskey Rebellion, the Jefferson-Hamilton feud, and Lincoln’s 1860 election win, a key trigger of the Civil War. “Throughout our nation’s history,” he wrote, “there have been differences of opinion on how our nation should be governed.” The current mess, in other words, is the norm, not the exception.

‘There Are No Real Debates Anymore’

A second group of readers agreed the U.S. isn’t China, but they worry the quality of the debate here has become dangerously toxic.

“I think a lot of Americans see us going in the one party direction,” wrote   Colin Smart from Michigan .   Eugene P. Grace from Pennsylvania , argued the U.S. is on a “slippery slope,” where governmental mandates—like city-run grocery stores—represent a “form of communism” that removes consumer choice.

Joe Pupel in Puerto Rico   put it even more starkly: “There are no real debates anymore...only dysfunction.” He argued that political tribalism has destroyed any common ground. “There are no boundaries or rules of engagement. Anything goes...and ANY lie or hypocrisy...can be spun by the liar and his accomplices (who are 50% of the country)...on both sides!”

Benjamin Carlson-Peters from Maryland , offered that the “messy debate” in the U.S. and the lack of debate in China are “two sides of the same coin.” He argued both are opposing methods used by those in power to preserve an unequal status quo.

Perhaps the most provocative challenge came from   Dieter H. Blattler , who splits his time between   Hawaii and Chongqing, China . “After I moved to the U.S., I felt the de facto two-party system is a terrible way to run a democracy,” he wrote. “Spending a lot of time in China ... gave me the impression that people here in general are happier than most Americans. The vast majority … don’t care about politics; they are happy if they have a decent income and are able to play mahjong.”

‘It Is a Little Bit of Both’

Most of you, however, landed in the nuanced, difficult middle. You see a system that is fundamentally strong but currently operating with crippling dysfunction.

“Both,” wrote   Brad Holmes of Missouri . “The ability to protest without the fear of being run over by an Abrams tank is a fundamental strength. The lack of civil discourse and no compromise by participants is a troubling sign of dysfunction.”

Bill Lechner in Texas   agreed. “It is a strength when we are allowed to fully express our views,” he wrote, while the dysfunction arises “when one side or the other does not want to have the debate and resorts to violence.”

Many readers, like   Michael Rau in Virginia , pointed to gridlock as the primary symptom of dysfunction. “I see messy debate as a fundamental strength, but we need to be able to make decisions ... Everyone agrees that immigration laws should be reformed but nothing happens.”

This inability to find common ground, some argue, is the feature, not a bug, of the U.S.’s current system. “The current polar divisions are a problem,” wrote   Clark Beebe from Colorado , who blames a primary system that rewards extremists “and we end up with bad choices.”

Steve Nelson in Michigan   believes the dysfunction is even deeper, rooted in American culture itself. Unlike Scandinavian countries that fund a more generous social safety net, “our country is far more selfish as regards their fellow man,” he wrote, making consensus on big issues nearly impossible.

The Debate About the Debate

So where does this leave us?

Jim Lowder from Kansas , who called the lack of debate in China a “fundamental sign of dysfunction,” offered a path forward. “The debate need not be messy!” he argued. “The key ... was to hear everyone out and gradually come to a VOLUNTARY consensus.”

In the end, this is the central challenge our readers identified. The problem isn’t the debate; it’s the absence of consensus, compromise and civil discourse.

And the very act of your responses—critical, concerned, and freely given—proves that people can have this open and public argument about the U.S. system. It's a freedom that a state-controlled system doesn’t allow.


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Hallux
Professor Principal
1  seeder  Hallux    last year

Ms Wei writes a weekly article for the WSJ on US/China affairs.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
1.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Hallux @1    last year
Perhaps the most provocative challenge came from   Dieter H. Blattler , who splits his time between   Hawaii and Chongqing, China . “After I moved to the U.S., I felt the de facto two-party system is a terrible way to run a democracy,” he wrote. “Spending a lot of time in China ... gave me the impression that people here in general are happier than most Americans. The vast majority … don’t care about politics; they are happy if they have a decent income and are able to play mahjong.”

I live in Chongqing and agree entirely with Blattler.  Not only does it appear to me, even from the commentary on NT, that the people in China are generally happier, I'll add to that they are safer (think of gun violence), and the fact that the government gets things done for the betterment of the people - prime example being the 4 decades-long task that succeeded to eradicate abject poverty bettering the lives of about half the population, and compare that to the American government allowing homelessness to increase to about three quarters of a million people. 

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
2  Jack_TX    last year
This sentiment was echoed by readers who view the “mess” as the non-negotiable price—and privilege—of liberty.

Yes

A second group of readers agreed the U.S. isn’t China, but they worry the quality of the debate here has become dangerously toxic.

Also yes.

Most of you, however, landed in the nuanced, difficult middle. You see a system that is fundamentally strong but currently operating with crippling dysfunction.

Good compromise, but I'm not sure I'd say "crippling".   

We're Americans.  We've been shouting at each other since the 1700s.  We'll be fine.

 
 
 
Hallux
Professor Principal
2.1  seeder  Hallux  replied to  Jack_TX @2    last year
We've been shouting at each other since the 1700s.

True enough, America's earliest leaders self-pupblished derogatory pamphlets re their oponents that would have shamed today's "fake news" as whimps.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
Professor Quiet
2.1.1  Jack_TX  replied to  Hallux @2.1    last year

Let's don't forget what happened to Aaron Burr.  

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3  Trout Giggles    last year

I like what Bill from Texas had to say:

Bill Lechner in Texas   agreed. “It is a strength when we are allowed to fully express our views,” he wrote, while the dysfunction arises “when one side or the other does not want to have the debate and resorts to violence.”

I want people to express their views. I don't want people lunging for each other's throats. I have had to restrain myself at times. I fantasize about jumping thru my screen and grabbing certain members' testicles and squeezing until they run dry. Fortunately, it's just a fantasy.

The violence is unnecessary. And that goes for both sides. You don't squeeze my testicles I won't squeeze yours

 
 
 
Hallux
Professor Principal
3.1  seeder  Hallux  replied to  Trout Giggles @3    last year

If you sport testicles, there's a spot for you on Southpark.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.1.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  Hallux @3.1    last year

metaphorical testicles, ok?

 
 

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