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The Trump Indictment: Where Do You Stand?

  
Via:  John Russell  •  3 years ago  •  19 comments


The Trump Indictment: Where Do You Stand?
 

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www.theatlantic.com   /ideas/archive/2023/03/donald-trump-indictment-republicans-2024-election/673574/

The Trump Indictment: Where Do You Stand?


David Frum 3-4 minutes   3/30/2023






Trump’s indictment presents Republicans, and all Americans, with a clear choice.




Michael M. Santiago / Getty



March 30, 2023, 7:19 PM ET

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The first Catholic. The first African American. Someday, maybe soon, the first woman. The history of the presidency is a history of firsts. Now there is one more: the   first former president to be indicted .

It’s a solemn and sad moment. It’s also a fiercely just moment.

Remember that although Donald Trump’s indictment in New York has been   confirmed   by one of his attorneys, we do not yet know, as of the evening of Thursday, March 30, what he has been indicted   for . When Trump himself circulated the first rumors of his pending indictment, many reacted with rapid comments on the inadvisability of indicting a former president for offenses arising from a sexual affair, a reservation I share. But it’s also possible that this reported indictment arises from the Trump Organization’s decades-long practices of criminal tax fraud.


David Frum: Trump’s reckoning with the rule of law

In 2018,   The New York Times   reported   that the Trump family had allegedly evaded hundreds of millions of dollars in estate taxes through complex schemes of false invoicing. In 2022, a New York State court   convicted   the Trump Organization of evading income taxes through false invoicing. When it came time to pay off women who claimed to have had sexual connections with Trump, he allegedly reverted to long-standing practice.

This is how the Trump case might diverge from that of John Edwards, the former Democratic presidential candidate   charged   with diverting campaign funds to a former lover. The case against Trump might not be a sex-payoff case, or even a campaign-finance case. It could fundamentally be a tax-fraud case, the latest installment of a multigenerational criminal practice that has cheated the people of the United States and New York of huge amounts of money.

More indictments by more states in more cases may be filed soon. Donald Trump is not an occasional lawbreaker. He incited the mob that ended the American tradition of the peaceful transfer of power—and that inflicted unnecessary injury and avoidable death both upon law-enforcement officers and Trump’s own deceived supporters. He tried to intimidate state-level election officials to manipulate vote totals to fraudulently preserve his hold on office. The jeopardy will only accumulate.


Trump may regard the present indictment and those to come as a political resource. He has surged in Republican polls since he announced the indictment was on its way. His leading party rival has deflated in the polls. Trump has raised millions of dollars on the news, and may in the next hours raise many more. There’s no denying that he’s now the overwhelming favorite to be the next Republican nominee, and therefore stands an excellent chance of winning the presidency in 2024.

Atop all the other questions on the ballot in that election, therefore, will be this: Crime and violence and Trump, or law and the Constitution—where do you stand?

Good God, where does his Republican Party and mine now stand? The wrong is overwhelming and the shame is crushing—but the only decent choice for the honest and patriotic American is now starker, purer, and more certain than ever.



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JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1  seeder  JohnRussell    3 years ago
  it’s also possible that this reported indictment arises from the Trump Organization’s decades-long practices of criminal tax fraud.

In 2018,      The New York Times       reported       that the Trump family had allegedly evaded hundreds of millions of dollars in estate taxes through complex schemes of false invoicing. In 2022, a New York State court      convicted       the Trump Organization of evading income taxes through false invoicing. When it came time to pay off women who claimed to have had sexual connections with Trump, he allegedly reverted to long-standing practice.
 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
2  seeder  JohnRussell    3 years ago

CNN is reporting Trump will be charged with 30 counts. 

This may be about more than a mere payoff. 

Tax fraud. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3  Vic Eldred    3 years ago

Put me down for equal justice under the law, the rule of law over political prosecutions and reason over fraudulent claims of being an objective critical thinker.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
3.1  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Vic Eldred @3    3 years ago
The case against Trump might not be a sex-payoff case, or even a campaign-finance case. It could fundamentally be a tax-fraud case, the latest installment of a multigenerational criminal practice that has cheated the people of the United States and New York of huge amounts of money. More indictments by more states in more cases may be filed soon. Donald Trump is not an occasional lawbreaker.
 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
3.2  TᵢG  replied to  Vic Eldred @3    3 years ago
Put me down for equal justice under the law, the rule of law over political prosecutions and reason over fraudulent claims of being an objective critical thinker.

Yes, you should definitely not make fraudulent claims of being an objective critical thinker.

What does that last part have to do with your position on this case?   Your position is that justice should be fair and that justice should not be influenced by partisan views.   Sounds good.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
4  JBB    3 years ago

It's a start...

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
5  seeder  JohnRussell    3 years ago

The shameless fool Lindsey Graham went on Fox news tonight and told the audience, in no uncertain terms, to send Donald Trump money. 

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
5.1  TᵢG  replied to  JohnRussell @5    3 years ago

Unbelievable.   He argues that the Ds fear Trump at the ballot box.   Anyone with a shred of political savvy understands that Trump is an excellent R nominee to almost guarantee a win by the D nominee.   The Ds, I suspect, want Trump to be the GOP nominee and if not that, want Trump to have sufficient political clout to spoil the GOP nominee.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
6  Gsquared    3 years ago

It couldn't happen to a better guy.

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
7  Ronin2    3 years ago

Bragg is a piece of human shit that lets violent criminals walk; and tries to charge misdemeanors as felonies. 

He also likes to charge victims with murder.

Anyone thinking is anything more than another political hit job by Democrats is delusional.

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
Professor Quiet
7.1  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  Ronin2 @7    3 years ago

Amen.

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
Professor Participates
7.2  Thrawn 31  replied to  Ronin2 @7    3 years ago

This is a good thing, should energize his base and make sure he wins the nomination. That is the Dems best chance for 2024.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
7.2.1  TᵢG  replied to  Thrawn 31 @7.2    3 years ago

Odd GOP members cannot figure this out.

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Guide
8  Sparty On    3 years ago

And the TDS wheel goes around and around.

So a Manhattan DA is going get Trump after investigation by the FEC and US Attorneys offices brought no charges?

Bragg is a partisan asshat.

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
Professor Quiet
8.1  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  Sparty On @8    3 years ago

I guess a wet spaghetti noodle did stick to the wall after all....

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
9  Snuffy    3 years ago

Still waiting on the indictment to be unsealed so that the actual charges can be seen.  From all the guessing that has been released, I'm against this indictment as it seems like a stretch and a conviction will be a hard reach.  I always felt that the stronger case was obstruction coming from the classified records issue.

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
Professor Participates
10  Thrawn 31    3 years ago

Unless it results in jail time there isn't much point. 

I suppose on the positive side this should guarantee he wins the GOP nomination and make the Dems the favorite in 2024. 

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Senior Guide
10.1  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Thrawn 31 @10    3 years ago

I think that you are right on both points.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Senior Guide
11  Drinker of the Wry    3 years ago

I think the the classified document obstruction is a much stronger case. The Georgia case might also be stronger.

 
 

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