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New Biden controversy on classified documents;

  
Via:  Jeremy in NC  •  2 years ago  •  131 comments

By:   Alexis Simendinger and Kristina Karisch (The Hill)

New Biden controversy on classified documents;
On Nov. 2, the day the material was discovered and almost a week before the midterm elections, Biden’s counsel’s office notified the National Archives and Records Administration, which took possession of the materials the following morning, according to the White House. Officials have not said why the matter was not disclosed publicly last fall.

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President Biden, his legal team, the Justice Department and the National Archives have known since early November that some classified documents created while he was vice president were discovered locked in a closet in an office Biden used for years after the Obama administration ended.

Limited details, first reported by CBS News and confirmed in a statement by a White House lawyer, set off a barrage of questions on Monday along with comparisons to former President Trump's ongoing troubles with the Justice Department over his possession of classified records after leaving office. The FBI last year retrieved cartons of presidential and classified materials from Mar-a-Lago, which were destined for the Archives.

Trump, a declared 2024 presidential candidate, on Monday cried foul, setting in motion a new wave of complaints that he is treated unfairly by Democrats for political purposes. The news about Biden's records punctuated the first workday of the new Congress as House Republicans vowed to pursue rigorous oversight and investigations. One topic at the top of their list: assertions that the Justice Department, FBI and intelligence agencies may have politicized actions to the detriment of conservatives.

Monday's revelations about Biden's recovered documents are all but certain to be explored by the House GOP in future hearings.

"When is the FBI going to raid the many homes of Joe Biden, perhaps even the White House? These documents were definitely not declassified," Trump said Monday on his Truth Social platform (The Hill).

Reacting to the November discovery of the Biden classified materials, Attorney General Merrick Garland at the time quietly assigned the U.S. attorney in Chicago to review a "small number" of documents with classified marking, which were removed from the Penn Biden Center for Diplomacy and Global Engagement in the nation's capital and turned over to national archivists by Biden's personal lawyers, CBS reported.

The White House says it is cooperating with the Justice Department (The Hill and The New York Times).

On Nov. 2, the day the material was discovered and almost a week before the midterm elections, Biden's counsel's office notified the National Archives and Records Administration, which took possession of the materials the following morning, according to the White House. Officials have not said why the matter was not disclosed publicly last fall.

The Biden papers came to light when the president's personal attorneys "were packing files housed in a locked closet to prepare to vacate office space at the Penn Biden Center," Richard Sauber, special counsel to the president, said in a statement. It is unclear what the documents included, although sources told CBS that nuclear secrets were not among materials found in the closet.

The Hill: Differences in the Trump, Biden classified documents discoveries.

Trump is under federal investigation for the removal of hundreds of White House classified documents that he stored at his Florida estate after he left office — and was slow to return, decisions that allegedly violated the Presidential Records Act, according to lawyers and analysts in both parties. The FBI last year acted on a search warrant at the request of the Archives in order to search for and seize 200,000 pages from Trump's Mar-a-Lago property, including at least 100 classified or highly classified documents.

The Biden documents were discovered around the time that the attorney general tapped a special counsel, Jack Smith, to oversee the agency's criminal investigation into Trump's actions. Officials have said the investigation tied to the former president concerns possible mishandling of government secrets and possible obstruction of justice or destruction of records (The Washington Post).

To oversee the review of what was locked in Biden's office closet, the attorney general, who was traveling Monday with the president in Mexico, assigned John Lausch, U.S. attorney for the Northern District of Illinois, to conduct a review. Lausch was nominated by Trump, the Post reported, adding that the FBI also is taking part.

The Penn Biden Center opened in Washington in 2018 as a think tank for the University of Pennsylvania with Biden as the anchor for programs involving foreign policy experts and lawmakers. He worked there with a number of long-serving aides who also returned to the White House after his election, including Secretary of State Antony Blinken and Steve Ricchetti, who previously served as the center's managing director and is a top presidential adviser in the West Wing.


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Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC    2 years ago
The Biden documents were discovered around the time that the attorney general tapped a special counsel, Jack Smith, to oversee the agency’s criminal investigation into Trump’s actions. 

The timing is a bit shady.

The question is if the hypocrisy of the Democrats is going to show itself again or if there is going to be equal treatment.  I'm betting we'll see the hypocrisy.

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
1.1  Ronin2  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1    2 years ago

You don't need to bet. The fact there hasn't been a full on raid to retrieve the materials and look for other classified documents at all of Brandon's houses and places of business is proof. Who knows how many other classified documents he is sitting on? He can't even use the excuse that he was President and can declassify anything he wants. He can only declassify documents from his administration- not Obama's.

Expect a shitload of "But Trruuummmmppppp!!!!!!!" from outraged leftists defending the Human Fuck Up Machine.

We all know Garland won't appoint a special prosecutor for this. Since he still hasn't appointed one for Hunter/Brandon illegal pay for play while Brandon was VP. His only job is to protect Democrats and enforce the new two tier justice system.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.1.1  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Ronin2 @1.1    2 years ago
Expect a shitload of "But Trruuummmmppppp!!!!!!!" from outraged leftists defending the Human Fuck Up Machine.

That's a given.  

We all know Garland won't appoint a special prosecutor for this. Since he still hasn't appointed one for Hunter/Brandon illegal pay for play while Brandon was VP. His only job is to protect Democrats and enforce the new two tier justice system.

That's the hypocrisy I was referring to. There won't be any raids, special counsel or anything done until somebody's hand is forced.

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
1.1.2  Ronin2  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.1.1    2 years ago

Garland will never do it. Republicans could impeach him in the House; and he knows the Democrat Senate will sit on it and not even hold hearings or bring it to a vote.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.1.3  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Ronin2 @1.1.2    2 years ago
Garland will never do it.

This fool is almost as incompetent as Biden.  He won't do anything that would harm the Check The Block Administration.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
1.1.4  Vic Eldred  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.1.3    2 years ago
Garland will never do it.

In both cases, Garland has elected not to appoint a special counsel.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1    2 years ago

Was Biden wrong to hold classified documents at the Penn Biden Center?

Would Biden have been wrong to NOT cooperate with the National Archives upon discovery of these documents?

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
1.2.1  Snuffy  replied to  TᵢG @1.2    2 years ago
Was Biden wrong to hold classified documents at the Penn Biden Center?

Yes.  And to your second question that is also yes.  Biden has come out with a statement that he didn't know there were classified documents there, but he's in the past talked about how it's ok and correct to take classified documents depending on circumstances and locations.  Kind of biting him in the ass now I would think.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2.2  TᵢG  replied to  Snuffy @1.2.1    2 years ago

Indeed!   Both questions answered as 'yes'.

Any PotUS or V.P. who was holding official records (especially if classified ... (and especially if TS/SCI)) has violated the PRA.   These records should have been turned over to the NARA (or to the succeeding office holder).

Further, any PotUS who does not immediately cooperate in the safe return of these documents, once discovered, is engaging in a more severe wrongdoing because now the act is  willful.


I am not surprised that you answered the questions as you did.

These are, however, questions for Jeremy.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.2.3  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @1.2    2 years ago

How about you answer my question in 1?  Will we see the same treatment for Biden that we saw for Trump or will we see the hypocrisy of the Democrats?

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2.4  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.2.3    2 years ago

A stupid question.   Biden will be attacked by the partisan Rs and defended by the partisan Ds.   Just as you continue to defend Trump and run away from every question which exposes absurdly blind partisanship.

You routinely refuse to acknowledge that Trump was wrong to hold TS/SCI documents and that he was wrong to NOT cooperate with their return.    Thus I ask the same basic questions now of Biden.

Was Biden wrong to hold classified documents at the Penn Biden Center?

Would Biden have been wrong to NOT cooperate with the National Archives upon discovery of these documents?

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.2.5  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @1.2.4    2 years ago
A stupid question.

So you won't answer.  And you expect me to play your games.  Sorry.  Not going to happen. 

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2.6  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.2.5    2 years ago
So you won't answer. 

Did you not read the sentence after what you quoted?:

TiG @1.2.4Biden will be attacked by the partisan Rs and defended by the partisan Ds.   Just as you continue to defend Trump and run away from every question which exposes absurdly blind partisanship.

You ignore my answer, then claim I did not answer and then accuse me of playing games.   

Who do you think is stupid enough to not see this?


Was Biden wrong to hold classified documents at the Penn Biden Center?

Would Biden have been wrong to NOT cooperate with the National Archives upon discovery of these documents?

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.2.7  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @1.2.6    2 years ago

There was no need to.  You went off on the expected TDS driven rants and trolling garbage like the rest.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2.8  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.2.7    2 years ago

And thus concludes the next installment of Jeremy running in fear from direct, spot-on-topic questions:

  1. Was Biden wrong to hold classified documents at the Penn Biden Center?
  2. Would Biden have been wrong to NOT cooperate with the National Archives upon discovery of these documents?
 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Quiet
1.2.10  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.2.3    2 years ago
Will we see the same treatment for Biden that we saw for Trump or will we see the hypocrisy of the Democrats?

Did we see the same reaction from Trump as we did from Biden when documents were found? Had Biden told archives after their request for documents that he had given them everything and then later been found to be lying?

Trying to claim equivalency here is beyond stupid. Only Trump's ass licking loyal dogs are claiming these two situations are the same. The one thing that will be the same will be the non-partisan investigation on both sides.

If you want a prime example of hypocrisy just watch right wing conservatives never accept any justice department conclusions unless they conclude that Trump is completely innocent of any wrongdoing and Biden is convicted of espionage. When the DOJ finds anything wrong or even suspicious that a Democrat did, the right wing conservatives scream in self-righteous indignation and self-congratulatory praise at "being right" about those "sneaky Dems!". But when the DOJ and FBI investigate Republicans and find dozens of campaign staff, the former President and other GOP operatives lying to investigators, robbing and thieving, misappropriating inauguration funds, giving sensitive voter data to Russian operatives and instigating an attack on our Capital and constitution, right wing conservatives scream about 'partisan corruption' in the DOJ and FBI.

I don't really think your average right wing conservative gives a fuck about classified documents, to them their grandma's secret cornbread recipe is more important. All they care about is finding anything sticky they can fling at Democrats in the ongoing partisan poop-flinging contest that our body politic has been turned into in the last few decades.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.2.11  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @1.2.10    2 years ago

It's a simple "Yes" or "No" question.  And you went through all that to not answer it.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Quiet
1.2.12  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.2.11    2 years ago
It's a simple "Yes" or "No" question.

It's not a simple "yes" or "no" question because basically what you're asking is: "Will two completely different situations involving classified documents be treated the same?" The answer of course should be "Of course not, the action of both parties could not be more different, why would they be treated the same?". And yet, according to conservatives that should apparently be considered a display of hypocrisy. It's somewhat akin to that question "So when did you stop beating your wife?".

What I'd have loved to see would be any of this vociferous indignation over the mishandling of classified documents coming from right wing conservatives when their own dear Leader was caught red handed with hundreds of classified documents that he'd lied about having. Talk about hypocrisy.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
1.2.13  Sean Treacy  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @1.2.12    2 years ago

So can you provide a link to you arguing that it was no big deal for Trump to take highly classified documents from their proper place and keep them in an unsecure location? 

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.2.14  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @1.2.12    2 years ago
It's not a simple "yes" or "no" question because basically what you're asking is: "Will two completely different situations involving classified documents be treated the same?"

No.  It is a simple "yes" or "no" question.  Quit overthinking it and trying to spin it.  Both are accused of taking classified material without authorization.  Will they be treated the same? 

My money is that they won't.  

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2.15  TᵢG  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.2.13    2 years ago

If Trump had fully cooperated then the document issue would be a blip and now largely forgotten.   There would have been no need to engage in a forced search, etc.    It was the lack of cooperation, the claims of declassification, the claims of executive privilege, the false claims that all documents have been returned, the finding of TS/SCI documents, etc. that elevated the severity of the Trump issue.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2.16  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.2.14    2 years ago

Do you equate a shoplifter with a bank robber?  They are both acts of theft and the perps are both thieves.  

By your bizarre, convoluted logic both thieves should receive the same treatment and same sentences.

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
1.2.17  Drakkonis  replied to  TᵢG @1.2.4    2 years ago
A stupid question.   Biden will be attacked by the partisan Rs and defended by the partisan Ds.   Just as you continue to defend Trump and run away from every question which exposes absurdly blind partisanship.

Wow! A more partisan answer I could not imagine. Good job in making your case, [TiG.deleted]

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2.18  TᵢG  replied to  Drakkonis @1.2.17    2 years ago

It surprised you that I noted Biden will be attacked by the partisan Rs and that he will be defended by the partisan Ds??

What, then, do you think is going to happen? 

Biden will be attacked by _____?

Biden will be defended by _____ ?

Note:  the context was about partisan behavior.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.2.19  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @1.2.16    2 years ago
By your bizarre, convoluted logic both thieves should receive the same treatment and same sentences.

For the same act, it's not a far fetched idea.  The least equal treatment should be applied.  But we aren't even seeing that

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2.20  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.2.19    2 years ago
The least equal treatment should be applied.  But we aren't even seeing that

The discovery of documents of Biden is equivalent to the initial discovery of documents of Trump.   In other words, we must compare the beginning of the Biden case with the beginning of the Trump case (the first few weeks).   In Trump's case, it was not highly publicized in the beginning;  we heard about this after months of 'negotiation' between Trump and NARA, et. al.   Biden's case of course if very highly publicized.   But for the most part, at this stage in Trump's case, the interactions were civil and focused on getting the documents secured.

One other difference though is that Biden is clearly cooperating.   I doubt anyone expects Biden to do anything to slow down the recovery of these documents.

Now what strange alternate reality have you envisioned?

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.2.21  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @1.2.20    2 years ago
The discovery of documents of Biden is equivalent to the initial discovery of documents of Trump.

Still making excuses I see.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
1.2.22  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.2.21    2 years ago

How can you not comprehend this?   

What do you think was taking place in the first week when documents were first discovered at Mar-a-Lago by Trump operatives?    This was months before the Mar-a-Lago FBI search.

Are you aware of this?

In the early stages of both cases, the focus was on interacting with the parties to secure ALL outstanding classified documents.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
1.2.23  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @1.2.22    2 years ago

Yep.  Still making excuses.  

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
2  Vic Eldred    2 years ago

Biden said that a former President taking documents was irresponsible. What does it mean when a former vice president takes them?

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
2.1  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Vic Eldred @2    2 years ago

It's not like he's going to admit to doing the same illegal activity that they raided the previous POTUS over.  It's actually even more reason to carry out the raids on Biden's residences.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
2.1.1  Vic Eldred  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @2.1    2 years ago

Wasn't that the excuse? To see how much more was there?

In both cases it was the National Archives that noticed the improper document handling. In the case of Biden, he was a vice president with zero excuse for taking them. The documents Biden has have been sitting around for 5 years.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
2.1.2  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Vic Eldred @2.1.1    2 years ago

Didn't Democrats state that the reason for the Trump raids was that the National Archives noticed mishandling of documents?  They supposedly caught that pretty quick.  I wonder what their excuse is for overlooking Biden's mishandling for 6 years.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
2.1.3  Vic Eldred  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @2.1.2    2 years ago

It is odd, isn't it?

We may hear a litany of excuses today. I'm not sure if border security is more important to them than Harry & Meghan?

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
2.1.4  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Vic Eldred @2.1.3    2 years ago
Harry & Meghan

Just like the Kardashians.  Useless idiots famous for nothing.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
2.1.5  Vic Eldred  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @2.1.4    2 years ago

And as with the Kardashians, people are tired of hearing about them.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
3  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC    2 years ago

National Archives asks DOJ to investigate classified documents found in private office Biden used

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.1  Vic Eldred  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @3    2 years ago

Let's not forget the difference: A President has some right. A vice president has no right.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
3.1.1  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1    2 years ago

This definitely throws a wrench in the Democrats investigations.  This is going to be fun to watch.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.1.2  Vic Eldred  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @3.1.1    2 years ago

I hope you're not expecting an FBI raid & search of the Biden home?

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
3.1.3  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.2    2 years ago

We all know they won't.  Gotta keep up the double standard.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
3.1.4  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @3.1.3    2 years ago

What makes you think Biden is NOT cooperating?     I have seen no news suggesting Biden is not cooperating.   Do you have something to the contrary or are you just presuming?

It was the lack of cooperation the led to the forced search of Mar-a-Lago.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
3.1.5  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @3.1.4    2 years ago
What makes you think Biden is NOT cooperating?     I have seen no news suggesting Biden is not cooperating.   Do you have something to the contrary or are you just presuming?

Where did I say he wasn't?  

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
3.1.6  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @3.1.5    2 years ago

Can you not follow basic logic?

Trump's problems were a result of his NOT cooperating with NARA.    If Trump had delivered ALL classified documents to NARA as soon as it was discovered that some were missing then this would have been a blip and gone.   

For Biden to be treated like Trump, Biden would have to first enable the situation by NOT cooperating.

Thus I ask if you think Biden is NOT cooperating?

Because if Biden is fully cooperating, this matter will simply be addressed and life will move on.   

And, by the way, this gives Trump cover (categorically) so he will not be prosecuted for holding TS/SCI documents at his home.   The two situations are very different but since both deal with PRA, they will be viewed as the same by the public and no prosecution will ensue.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
3.1.7  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @3.1.6    2 years ago
Can you not follow basic logic?

Can you not answer a simple question?

 
 
 
Wishful_thinkin
Freshman Silent
3.1.8  Wishful_thinkin  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @3.1.7    2 years ago

Well, we all know that you can't answer a simple question.  All you do is deflect.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
4  Vic Eldred    2 years ago

Does a vice president have any right to declassify documents?

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
4.1  Ronin2  replied to  Vic Eldred @4    2 years ago

Surprisingly the VP does have very limited authority to declassify documents.

So much for classification authority. What about declassification?

Declassification authority is defined in Section 6.1(l) of E.O. 13292 . It is granted to: “(1) the official who authorized the original classification…; (2) the originator’s current successor in function; (3) a supervisory official of either; or (4) officials delegated declassification authority in writing by the agency head or the senior agency official.”

So the Vice President has authority to declassify anything that he himself classified. He also clearly has authority to declassify anything generated in the Office of the Vice President, which he supervises.

But is the Vice President, like the President, “a supervisory official” with respect to other executive branch agencies such as the CIA? Did the 2003 amendment to the executive order which elevated the Vice President’s classification authority also grant him declassification authority comparable to the President’s?

“The answer is not obvious,” said one executive branch expert on classification policy.

So the VP can declassify anything that he or his office classifies, Now Brandon just has to prove he/his office classified the materials he had- and he followed proper procedures to declassify it. Holding Brandon to the same standards Trump; there is no way in hell.

Time for a special prosecutor to take this out of Garland's corrupt partisan hands. Republicans in the House/Senate must demand it!

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
4.1.1  Vic Eldred  replied to  Ronin2 @4.1    2 years ago
Time for a special prosecutor to take this out of Garland's corrupt partisan hands.

Amen. I wonder if the DOJ knew about this before the midterms?

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
4.1.2  Snuffy  replied to  Vic Eldred @4.1.1    2 years ago
I wonder if the DOJ knew about this before the midterms?

According to the article the National Archives and Records Administration did know but I cannot find anything to indicate that the DOJ was notified.  But it was known and ignored while the Democrats were making hay all through the election cycle with Trump over the classified records seized at Mar-a-Lago.

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
Professor Quiet
4.1.3  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  Vic Eldred @4.1.1    2 years ago

Bet you a dollar to a donut they most certainly did!

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
5  Sean Treacy    2 years ago

He had nuclear secrets in his unsecured office!

or that’s what the msm would make up if he were a Republican they wanted to damage.

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
Professor Quiet
5.1  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  Sean Treacy @5    2 years ago

Just read that they have found more classified  documents in Biden's other offices. This keeps getting better and better.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
5.1.1  TᵢG  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @5.1    2 years ago

Did you read that those documents were found by Biden's aides who were proactively looking to find more classified docs?

Why is this better?

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
Professor Quiet
5.1.2  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  TᵢG @5.1.1    2 years ago

Just a figure of speech. Either way, it makes no difference who found them. What matters is did Biden have proper authorization to have them? If he did not, there is no moral high ground  to go after Trump for having any. In either case, both parties would be in the wrong.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
5.1.3  TᵢG  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @5.1.2    2 years ago

Biden violated the PRA.    

That established, it does indeed matter how Biden and his staff handled the discovery of the documents.   If Biden had tried to claim executive privilege, claim they were declassified, etc. that would be bad.   And it would go to ill-intent rather than incompetence / accident.

Both Biden and Trump violated the PRA.

If he did not, there is no moral high ground  to go after Trump for having any. 

You see no difference between:

Biden discovering a violation of the PRA and then proactively working to find more violations to clean up one's house

————vs.————

Trump stalling, lying, claiming executive privilege, claiming declassification, claiming rightful ownership, etc.

There is not only a moral difference, but if ill-intent is established due to Trump's behavior, there is a significant legal difference in offense.   

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
Professor Quiet
5.1.4  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  TᵢG @5.1.3    2 years ago

With respect, there is no way we are going to agree here so it is probably best just to agree to disagree and let it go. You have a good day.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
5.1.5  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @5.1.4    2 years ago

LMAO.  Good luck with that one.  

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
5.1.6  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @5.1.5    2 years ago

I respect Ed.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
5.1.7  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @5.1.6    2 years ago

And I have a HMMWV.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
6  Sean Treacy    2 years ago

This also means trump isn’t getting prosecuted,  though the hilllary standard pretty much ruled that out anyway.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
6.1  TᵢG  replied to  Sean Treacy @6    2 years ago
This also means trump isn’t getting prosecuted,

I agree.   Trump has dodged another bullet.     Since this will be equated with Trump's acts (in the abstract, in terms of optics) it is near certainty that there will be no prosecution.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
6.1.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  TᵢG @6.1    2 years ago
rump has dodged another bullet.   

He's very fortunate in his enemies.  

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
6.1.2  Ronin2  replied to  TᵢG @6.1    2 years ago

Hillary wasn't prosecuted (Comey saw to that); and Brandon sure as hell won't be (Garland will see to that).

Trump isn't out of the woods yet on being charged; but his lawyers will turn the trial into a side show claiming that Hillary and Brandon set the precedent. The two tier justice system will be on full display; and no one will save the Democrats if Trump is found guilty. Republicans would be harping on them until 2024. Brandon and Garland impeachments running rampant in the House on full media display.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
6.1.3  TᵢG  replied to  Ronin2 @6.1.2    2 years ago

Trump is not going to be prosecuted for his documents fiasco because too many in the public will not understand the situations and consider them equivalent.    Politics will win out and Trump will dodge the bullet.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
6.1.5  TᵢG  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.4    2 years ago

I will explain this to you, Texan.

Our system of justice is not pure justice.   It is integrated with politics.   Thus the choice to prosecute will often have a political consideration.   Political considerations heavily involve calculating the public reaction.

See?

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
6.1.7  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @6.1.3    2 years ago
Trump is not going to be prosecuted for his documents fiasco because too many in the public will not understand the situations and consider them equivalent

Trump won't be prosecuted because the current POTUS has been caught doing the same thing. 

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Senior Quiet
6.1.8  afrayedknot  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.6    2 years ago

[DELETED]

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
6.1.9  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @6.1.7    2 years ago
Trump won't be prosecuted because the current POTUS has been caught doing the same thing. 

You almost have it.   Trump will not be prosecuted because both he and Biden violated the PRA and because many in the public will not consider the details and consider them to be equivalent.   Just like you ignore all the details and simply deem them "the same thing".

Do you understand that both Biden and Trump were wrong to violate the PRA and that it would be wrong if Biden had behaved like Trump and not fully cooperated with NARA?

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
6.1.11  TᵢG  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.6    2 years ago
sounds like excuses for incompetent lawyers to me 

No, Texan you still do not understand how this works.

Let's try a smaller scale example.   Imagine a DA for a city considering a potentially high-profile case.    Are you under the impression that the DA would not factor public opinion in his/her decision to take the case?     If the DA, for example, believes the public is generally supportive of the defendant and the DA is not convinced he/she will win, you can bet that the DAs decision will not be one of pure objective legal reasoning.    

Well the same basic dynamic works in the large with the DoJ, politicians in power, political parties and lobbyists.   If the D party holds that prosecuting Trump now (given Biden's screwup) for his documents behavior will cause the public to demand Biden be prosecuted too, you can rest assured that Trump will NOT be prosecuted.

Lawyers have nothing to do with this.   This is what happens when justice is in bed with politics.    

And if you do not understand by now that justice is in bed with politics you are going to not understand a great many things about how our system works.

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Senior Quiet
6.1.12  afrayedknot  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.10    2 years ago

Just can’t help yourself, can you? 

So easy to predict. And here comes another…..

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
6.1.15  TᵢG  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.13    2 years ago
I am left wondering how I have survived 64 years without you telling me what I do and don't understand.

A very good question. 

But hopefully you now have a better understanding of how our system really works.

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
6.1.17  Ronin2  replied to  TᵢG @6.1.3    2 years ago

You are underestimating TDS driven Democrat morons; the DOJ who has already assigned a pit bull special prosecutor; and TDS driven idiots in the media who have already excused Brandon the Human Fuck Up Machine (just like you have). 

Politics are the reason that Hillary and Brandon will not face prosecution. TDS driven politicians, FBI, and media are the reason Trump will.

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Senior Quiet
6.1.18  afrayedknot  replied to  Texan1211 @6.1.14    2 years ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
7  Sean Treacy    2 years ago

So much for the Mishandling of SCIf documents endangers national security and warrants prosecution argument.  

It had a good four or five months, I guess.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
7.1  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Sean Treacy @7    2 years ago
So much for the Mishandling of SCIf documents endangers national security and warrants prosecution argument.

All Trump has to do in his situation is sit back and see what happens to Biden.  Then make the appropriate moves from there.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
7.1.1  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @7.1    2 years ago

Biden has already handled this differently than Trump.   Biden is cooperating.   Trump was resisting.

But Trump is now safe from prosecution because these two cases will be seen by the public as equivalent.

Partisan politics + public ignorance and apathy = Trump dodges another bullet.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
7.1.2  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @7.1.1    2 years ago
Biden is cooperating.

That ship sailed 6 years ago.  

But Trump is now safe from prosecution because these two cases will be seen by the public as equivalent.

The only difference, now, is how Trump has been treated vs. how Biden has been treated.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
7.1.3  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @7.1.2    2 years ago
The only difference, now, is how Trump has been treated vs. how Biden has been treated.
  1. Was Biden wrong to hold classified documents at the Penn Biden Center?
  2. Would Biden have been wrong to NOT cooperate with the National Archives upon discovery of these documents?
 
 
 
Greg Jones
Professor Participates
7.1.4  Greg Jones  replied to  TᵢG @7.1.3    2 years ago

How can you be sure the Biden administration is cooperating?

What about all the other documents that Biden may have held back which haven't been uncovered or found yet?

After all his years in "public service", I am sure there are lots of inconvenient truths about Biden that would ruin him if they saw the light of day

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
7.1.5  Ronin2  replied to  TᵢG @7.1.1    2 years ago
Biden has already handled this differently than Trump.   Biden is cooperating.   Trump was resisting.

Buying the the leftist BS line?

6 years later and Brandon is cooperating? WTF. Who the hell knows what other classified documents he is holding? They won't even release what basic information the classified documents contained. Who knows who the hell has seen them? Talk about a broken chain of custody.

But Trump is now safe from prosecution because these two cases will be seen by the public as equivalent.

Trump may not be safe; but Hillary and Brandon getting let off the hook will show the two tier justice system for what it really is. Garland getting questioned in the House screaming "But Trruuummmmppppp!!!!!!" repeatedly during questioning might be worth Trump being brought to trial.

Partisan politics + public ignorance and apathy = Trump dodges another bullet.

Partisan politics + public ignorance and apathy that left Democrats in charge of the Senate + two tier justice system + Garland putting a pit bull special prosecutor in place of the Trump investigation = Democrats having another TDS induced headache they created themselves

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
7.1.6  TᵢG  replied to  Greg Jones @7.1.4    2 years ago
How can you be sure the Biden administration is cooperating?

One cannot be certain, that is why one goes based on evidence to-date.   Do you have any evidence that Biden is NOT cooperating?    All indications are that as soon as the docs were discovered the process to secure them proceeded without controversy.

What about all the other documents that Biden may have held back which haven't been uncovered or found yet?

Again, you speculate.   If there are other documents then they should be returned.   

After all his years in "public service", I am sure there are lots of inconvenient truths about Biden that would ruin him if they saw the light of day

Do you have anything to offer that is factual?

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
7.1.7  TᵢG  replied to  Ronin2 @7.1.5    2 years ago
Buying the the leftist BS line?

What line?   Show me where Biden is NOT cooperating.   Go by facts rather than emotional partisanship.

Trump may not be safe;

How naïve.

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
8  Snuffy    2 years ago

Ahhh ,  and the muddy waters continue to stir up.   

At least 10 senior Biden administration officials were hired to their current or former positions after stints at the Penn Biden Center for Diplomacy and Global Engagement, the president's think tank where a trove of classified documents was recently found .

The Washington, D.C.-based Penn Biden Center — a foreign policy think tank   President Biden opened in 2018   — previously employed current Secretary of State Antony Blinken, Under Secretary of Defense for Policy Colin Kahl and White House counselor Steven Richetti. Blinken and Richetti both served as managing directors while Kahl was a strategic consultant at the center.

In addition, Spencer Boyer, the deputy assistant secretary of defense for Europe and NATO policy, was a senior fellow; Jeffrey Prescott, the deputy to the U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, was a strategic consultant; Ariana Berengaut, a senior adviser to the national security adviser, was a director; Michael Carpenter, the U.S. representative to the organization for security and cooperation in Europe, was a managing director; Juan Gonzalez, a special assistant to the president, was a senior fellow; and Carlyn Reichel, a special assistant to Biden and senior director for speech writing and strategic initiatives, was the director of communications at the Penn Biden Center.

According to financial disclosures filed with the Office of Government Ethics, the Penn Biden Center paid Carpenter a salary of $208,183, Kahl a salary of $185,317, Prescott a salary of $85,714 and Blinken a salary of $79,666, which was during first six months of 2019.

Biden also selected former University of Pennsylvania President Amy Gutmann and David Cohen, the former chairman of the university's board of trustees, to be ambassadors of Germany and Canada, respectively. 

Gutmann and Cohen were both present at the Penn Biden Center grand opening ceremony, where Biden sat down for an interview with NBC's Andrea Mitchell, a Penn alum, and referenced a previous interaction with Gutmann, who also spoke at the ceremony.

Since the Penn Biden Center opened, Penn has been accused of accepting millions of dollars in gifts from Chinese donors. The National Legal and Policy Center, a government watchdog group, filed a complaint with the Department of Justice in October 2020, demanding an investigation into $22 million in anonymous donations earmarked from China.

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
8.1  Ronin2  replied to  Snuffy @8    2 years ago

Brandon is guilty of everything they are trying to accuse Trump of; and then some.

And all Democrats, their media sycophants, and sheeple can do is scream "But Trruuummmmppppp!!!!!!"

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
8.1.1  Vic Eldred  replied to  Ronin2 @8.1    2 years ago
"But Trruuummmmppppp!!!!!!"

They made it a winning formula. 

We can't let him have the nomination, but we will never forget what he did for the people.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
9  Tacos!    2 years ago
Biden’s counsel’s office notified the National Archives and Records Administration, which took possession of the materials the following morning

This is the difference. Biden’s counsel discovered the problem and notified the authorities. They didn’t try to hide it, deny it, or lie about it. They then willingly gave up the documents the very next day. Easy Peezy.

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
9.1  Ronin2  replied to  Tacos! @9    2 years ago

The very next day- 6 years later.

Now all they need to do is account for every last day they were in Brandon's possession. Confirm no one else saw them. And that Brandon isn't holding any more. Time for a full on FBI raid of every last one of Brandon's residences, offices, and all his friends and relatives dwellings just to be safe.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
9.1.1  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Ronin2 @9.1    2 years ago
Now all they need to do is account for every last day they were in Brandon's possession. Confirm no one else saw them. And that Brandon isn't holding any more.  Time for a full on FBI raid of every last one of Brandon's residences, offices, and all his friends and relatives dwellings just to be safe.

Like I said in 1.  

The question is if the hypocrisy of the Democrats is going to show itself again or if there is going to be equal treatment. 

I don't see equal treatment in this.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
9.1.2  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ronin2 @9.1    2 years ago

It's gone from storing SCIF documents outside of approved areas is  espionage to it's okay if you keep SCIF level documents for years as long as long as you play nice when you decide to return them. 

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
9.1.3  Tacos!  replied to  Ronin2 @9.1    2 years ago
6 years later.

Yeah, that happens when no one looks at a thing for that long. What matters is when they discovered the problem.

Time for a full on FBI raid

FBI raids happen where someone is uncooperative. That describes the situation with the documents at Mar-a-lago, but not the Biden situation. These aren’t my assertions. They’re in the seed.

That’s not to say it’s ok. It’s still a problem, but more on the level of negligence than criminality.

of every last one of Brandon's residences, offices, and all his friends and relatives dwellings just to be safe.

Actually, I think if the FBI had wanted, they could have gotten warrants for all of Trump’s properties. I’m a little surprised they didn’t.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
9.1.4  Tacos!  replied to  Sean Treacy @9.1.2    2 years ago
it's okay if you keep SCIF level documents for years

Who is saying it’s ok? Even the Penn Biden center doesn’t think it’s ok or they wouldn’t have reported it.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
9.1.5  TᵢG  replied to  Tacos! @9.1.4    2 years ago

Expect to have people invent all sorts of positions for you in their desperate defense of Trump.

There is no arguing on the facts, thus Trump supporters use other means to argue.

The facts and the truth as you have noted (and as I have noted) is that it was wrong for Biden to violate the PRA.   Even if by mistake, this is a failure in process and it was ultimately his responsibility to ensure his VP administration followed procedure and preserved national security.

So Biden is clearly at fault.

What is interesting is that the Trump supporters (many of whom refused to acknowledge Trump's wrongdoing in this regard) are now generally trying to equate Biden's failure with Trump.   They seek a fiction where there are no material differences in circumstances, intent, level of national security compromised, honesty, desire to cooperate, etc.

I am sure you have already noticed this.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Senior Guide
9.1.6  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  TᵢG @9.1.5    2 years ago

When they go after Biden they are condemning Trump as well, knowingly or not,

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
9.1.7  TᵢG  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @9.1.6    2 years ago

Indeed.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
9.2  TᵢG  replied to  Tacos! @9    2 years ago

Good luck getting R partisans to acknowledge that.

 
 
 
Ronin2
Professor Quiet
9.2.1  Ronin2  replied to  TᵢG @9.2    2 years ago

Good luck getting D partisans to acknowledge Brandon was wrong for holding classified document for six damn years in an unsecured location; and should be held to the exact same standards under the law as Trump.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
9.2.2  TᵢG  replied to  Ronin2 @9.2.1    2 years ago

Show me one D here who will not acknowledge that it was wrong for Biden to have classified documents in his old office.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
9.2.3  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @9.2.2    2 years ago

Show me one D here who will call for for Biden to receive the exact same treatment Trump did.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
9.2.4  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @9.2.3    2 years ago

That would require finding a D who is not smart enough to recognize the profound differences in the circumstances.

 
 
 
goose is back
Junior Participates
9.2.5  goose is back  replied to  TᵢG @9.2.4    2 years ago
D who is not smart enough to recognize the profound differences in the circumstances

How many circumstances will it take?

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
9.2.6  TᵢG  replied to  goose is back @9.2.5    2 years ago

If that is the very best you can offer, it would be better to not even reply.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
9.2.7  Tacos!  replied to  Ronin2 @9.2.1    2 years ago
Good luck getting D partisans to acknowledge Brandon was wrong for holding classified document for six damn years in an unsecured location;

I’m not partisan, but I certainly haven’t said it wasn’t wrong.

and should be held to the exact same standards under the law as Trump.

The standard is the same. Acknowledge the facts, cooperate with authorities, and the FBI won’t have to raid your place.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
9.2.8  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  goose is back @9.2.5    2 years ago

Depends on how they many different ways they can think of to give the appearance these are different.  You know, was he standing on his left foot instead of his right?  

Oh and we can't forget trying to gaslight people into believing having the documents for 6 years doesn't mean anything.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
9.2.9  seeder  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  TᵢG @9.2.4    2 years ago

So you can't do it.  

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
9.2.10  TᵢG  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @9.2.9    2 years ago

No, offhand I cannot think of a D in this forum who is not smart enough to recognize the profound differences in the circumstances.

 
 
 
GregTx
Professor Guide
10  GregTx    2 years ago
Biden aides discover second trove of classified documents: Report

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
10.1  TᵢG  replied to  GregTx @10    2 years ago

Do you recognize that Biden is proactively looking to ensure ALL documents are properly handled?

 
 
 
GregTx
Professor Guide
10.1.1  GregTx  replied to  TᵢG @10.1    2 years ago

Sure. Do you recognize that Biden was in possession of ts/sci documents that he shouldn't have had? And was apparently so irresponsible with them that they're having to do treasure hunts for them...

 
 
 
goose is back
Junior Participates
10.1.2  goose is back  replied to  TᵢG @10.1    2 years ago
proactively looking

Why, are you LOOKING for Classified documents, don't you know you have them 

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
10.1.3  Snuffy  replied to  goose is back @10.1.2    2 years ago

Biden replied that night that he didn't know there were any classified documents at the Penn site.  Shows a horrible lack of competence.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
10.1.6  TᵢG  replied to  goose is back @10.1.2    2 years ago

Do you actually think that executives know the whereabouts of every single document that has passed through their office for multiple years?

Really?   These men all have photographic, perpetual memories and spent the time to personally track the whereabouts of each document?

Yeah, goosie, it is entirely reasonable to expect that one needs to search to see if any classified documents were improperly handled over the years.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
10.1.7  TᵢG  replied to  Snuffy @10.1.3    2 years ago
Shows a horrible lack of competence.

How objective and reasonable.  256

So by the same token, Trump must be even more incompetent given hundreds (~300) of classified documents including TS/SCI documents.    Is that your position?

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
10.1.8  Snuffy  replied to  TᵢG @10.1.7    2 years ago

As I said on another thread,  one or a million doesn't matter as WRONG IS FUCKING WRONG.  Period.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
10.1.9  TᵢG  replied to  Snuffy @10.1.8    2 years ago

I stated upfront and have repeated many time now that both Biden and Trump were wrong.   So, yeah, wrong is wrong and I have made that crystal clear.

Now move beyond clinging to only the absurdly simplistic and consider the differences in circumstances between these two wrong events.

Refusal to do so and insisting that these are equivalent circumstances and equivalent levels of security exposure and equivalent behavior is a beyond obvious defense of Trump.   

Give readers some credit for brains.

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
10.1.10  Snuffy  replied to  TᵢG @10.1.9    2 years ago
I stated upfront and have repeated many time now that both Biden and Trump were wrong.   So, yeah, wrong is wrong and I have made that crystal clear.

As have I.  You just continue to push that what Trump did was so much worse because of volume.  I've tried to explain that volume doesn't matter to me, the similar offenses by both of them are equal.  As you and I cannot seem to have a conversation around this, I'm done.  

 
 
 
GregTx
Professor Guide
10.1.11  GregTx  replied to  TᵢG @10.1.9    2 years ago

Was what Trump did wrong and/or illegal? Was what Biden did wrong and/or illegal? The circumstances of a case have nothing to do with the offense, only the plea deals....

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
10.1.12  TᵢG  replied to  Snuffy @10.1.10    2 years ago

What Trump did is much worse because:

  • Trump's volume of documents make it difficult to see this as a mere oversight
  • Trump's lying to NARA that all classified documents were returned
  • Trump's back and forth for over a year on these documents
  • Trump's lying that the found classified documents were declassified
  • Trump's claim of executive privilege

In short, Trump had many more documents, had TS/SCI documents in the mix and was NOT COOPERATING with NARA.    Biden has far fewer documents, immediately cooperated and turned them over and then proactively started a search for more.

How you cannot see the difference here is fascinating.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
10.1.13  TᵢG  replied to  GregTx @10.1.11    2 years ago
Was what Trump did wrong and/or illegal? Was what Biden did wrong and/or illegal? The circumstances of a case have nothing to do with the offense, only the plea deals....

It was illegal for both Trump and Biden to have presidential records offsite.    They both violated the PRA.

The circumstances of a case have nothing to do with the offense, only the plea deals....

Wrong.

If that were true then the circumstance of a theft has nothing to do with the offense.    So compare shoplifting with grand larceny.   

Obviously the circumstances matter greatly.    And in Trump's case, not only do we have the violation of the PRA (which is true for Biden too) but one could reasonably charge Trump with obstruction as well as intent to keep the documents which then brings in the espionage act.

Circumstances matter.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
10.2  Sean Treacy  replied to  GregTx @10    2 years ago

How can this happen? How can anyone be so irresponsible?

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
10.2.1  TᵢG  replied to  Sean Treacy @10.2    2 years ago

Good question.   One would expect that the VP administration and the administration of a PotUS would follow protocols and ensure that this never happens.

Makes one worry about our national security.

Pretty obvious, eh, why people are concerned about Trump's hundreds of documents.    The legitimate concern over Biden's offenses teases out the truth about the reality of the worse offenses of Trump.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
10.2.2  Tacos!  replied to  Sean Treacy @10.2    2 years ago
How can this happen?

I think it’s a miracle it doesn’t happen more than it does. Washington is so full of paperwork anymore, and they have all these different ways of classifying things. 

Still, all documents should be reviewed by a document expert before being packed up, and again when they are unpacked at their destination.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
10.2.3  TᵢG  replied to  Tacos! @10.2.2    2 years ago

That is why processes exist.   

It is disheartening to see process failures at these levels and with such high stakes.

 
 

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