Arab women ask not to be in the same room with Jews

Are you tellin' me that there are 2 sides to every story?

Come on back, haters.

Come spin for us.

As the topic of separate maternity wards gains attention, a poll on Monday revealed that  69% of the Israeli public  would prefer separate rooms for Jewish and Arab women .

69% of the Israeli public approve of this segregation. 

What  small percentage of the ISRAELI public is Arab? 

Jonathan, do not refer to me as a hater. It will not go well. 

According to Israel's  Central Bureau of Statistics , the Arab population in 2013 was estimated at 1,658,000, representing 20.7% of the country's population. ^[2]  The majority of these identify themselves as Arab or Palestinian  by nationality and  Israeli  by citizenship .

If every one of the Arabs approved of the segregation ( which sounds extremely unlikely) , that would still leave half of the non Arabs agreeing. 

I demurred on your seed, because I felt it was another grossly biased piece of information that you were purveying. Rather than attack, I watched others alternately defend and offend. You constantly whine about the bias on this site, and yet you offered a grossly biased article of your own.

I rescind my inference of racism, and replace it with gross hypocrisy.

Feel better, Johnny?

Is israelnationalnews biased?

The article I seeded had this same element

"The revelation is particularly significant in light of the media uproar since last week, when MK Betzalel Smotrich (Jewish Home) said separate rooms should be an option while noting on  noisy Arab post-birth parties.

After  his wife  was recorded saying she had asked not to be with Arab women, Smotrich said many Jewish women including his own wife "wouldn’t want to lie down (in a bed) next to a woman who just gave birth to a baby who  might want to murder her baby  twenty years from now." In response, his party chairperson Education Minister Naftali  Bennett condemned him  and rejected the idea of "hating Arabs.""

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A Jewish member of the Knesset anecdotally admitted that some Jews ( his wife for example) did not want to be in a room with Arabs.

My major objection to the way the other article was handled was that with the exception of Perrie and one or two others none of them wanted to address the article, they wanted to rant about Palestinians. 

Here you go Jonathan - here is part of an article from your source IsraelNationalNews. It says basically exactly what the article I seeded last week said, the one you call "biased". 

israelnationalnews

Numerous maternity wards around Israel separate Jewish and Arab women, even though such a practice is completely forbidden by the Ministry of Health.

Reshet B  reported Tuesday morning that the hospitals in violation of Ministry instructions include Jerusalem's Sha'arei Tzedek, Hadassah Ein Kerem and Hadassah Mount Scopus; Tel Aviv's Ichilov Hospital; and Kfar Saba's Meir Hospital.

The separation is sometimes due to the patients' requests and sometimes treated as a standard procedure. All hospitals denied any such separation, though some said that they consider patients' requests on the matter.

Of all the hospitals that spoke with the reporters, only Soroka Medical Center in Be'er Sheva and Rambam Hospital in Haifa said that they refuse to separate Jewish and Arab mothers. Numerous maternity wards around Israel separate Jewish and Arab women, even though such a practice is completely forbidden by the Ministry of Health.

Reshet B  reported Tuesday morning that the hospitals in violation of Ministry instructions include Jerusalem's Sha'arei Tzedek, Hadassah Ein Kerem and Hadassah Mount Scopus; Tel Aviv's Ichilov Hospital; and Kfar Saba's Meir Hospital.

The separation is sometimes due to the patients' requests and sometimes treated as a standard procedure. All hospitals denied any such separation, though some said that they consider patients' requests on the matter.

Of all the hospitals that spoke with the reporters, only Soroka Medical Center in Be'er Sheva and Rambam Hospital in Haifa said that they refuse to separate Jewish and Arab mothers.

Well, there ya go. I need to correct myself again.

You took a piece of otherwise journalistically accurate and upstanding information, and used it to foment derision between the members of this site. It predictably swirled into your John Russell toilet, where you once again were in a position to intone your mantra that "NewsTalkers is too pro-Israel blah blah blah.

You asked for it, you got it, and you revel in its continuance.

You are still a hypocrite, and you are in large part a contributor to the constant stirring of the pot.

You took a piece of otherwise journalistically accurate and upstanding information, and used it to foment derision between the members of this site.

Do you read what you write? I fomented nothing. The story was in the news that day and was an interesting story. I am not responsible for people deciding to use it as an opportunity to rant about Palestinians. Go preach to them.

"Interesting story".

 "rant about Palestinians"

Thank your for that dogshit.

I stand by my comment.

It's a sad state of affairs, that the citizens of Israel can't stand to be with one another. It seems to me that only the secular jews are the only reasonable ones. And frankly, I don't think that the government should give into unreasonable requests. I had to share a labor room with a Persian lady, who sprayed herself down with heavy perfume, (I was smell sensitive and the sent was making me nauseous) and with each labor contraction would yell at the top of her voice "Ayayayayayayayayayaaya". All of this is cultural. I remained in the room with her, for the first half of my labor, (she delivered first). If I had asked to be moved, they hospital would have laughed at me, and rightfully so. 

If this intolerance is allowed to go on, where does it stop? They are one country. 

Good post Perrie. 

This will not be solved in the hospital. As far as I'm concerned, it can only be solved in kindergarten. And we know that's not happening.

You should have told her to STFU, Perrie.

You have no idea Kavika. I really wanted to. I was totally quiet and I didn't even curse out Matt once for doing that to me, LOL!

Matt was ayayayayayayayaya. Amazing, that would have been worth the price of admission.

LOLOLOLOLOL... no he wasn't. I meant for knocking me up, and with twins no less, LOLOLOLOLOL!

Being a gentleman I won't comment on that. But the wise ass side of me is in control, and it's known in some circles as a ''double header''...

Getting offensive women together in the same space has a large risk of conflict :

thenewstalkers

Also expecting Israel to have identical standards as the US is something that only a genuine low IQ person would stand on ... Hi John Russell !

Does your own misogyny worry you at all Petey?

Women have very different standards than men . And they are not always beneficent . Does that offend you ? Wake the fuck up !

Jon,

I didn't say it would be solved. I said that it shouldn't be tolerated. There is a difference. The first whites who had to share a room with a black person, I am sure were not happy, but our government said tough nuggies, and that is what the Israeli government should do. No special arrangements for anyone. If they don't like it, let them have babies at home with a midwife. 

But it also needs to be solved in kindergarten, too. Gonna be a lot of teaching, too, since so many groups don't seem to be able to tolerate each other. 

I didn't say it would be solved. I said that it shouldn't be tolerated. There is a difference. The first whites who had to share a room with a black person, I am sure were not happy, but our government said tough nuggies, and that is what the Israeli government should do. No special arrangements for anyone. If they don't like it, let them have babies at home with a midwife.

We agree again, 1.

Crazy year we're having...

LOL Jon,

You are actually agreeing with me. 1 just reposted what I wrote. 

And thanks 1

israelnationalnews

Revital Smotrich, the wife of MK Betzalel Smotrich (Jewish Home), issued an open letter on Friday morning following the backlash she and her husband have received for calling for Jewish and Arab women to have the option of  separate pregnancy wards  at hospitals.

On Tuesday Smotrich said separate rooms should be an option while noting on  noisy Arab post-birth parties.  Later the same day he slammed  Channel 10  for recording an "interview" with his wife Revital without her knowledge.

In her recorded comments, Revital Smotrich said she in the past asked an Arab doctor to leave the delivery room during her birthing, adding, “I am not comfortable staying in the same room as an Arab woman. The way I see it, we are enemies. I was never refused. It seems to me that it is a very natural and clear-cut request."

Smotrich defended his wife from the media backlash, saying that many Jewish women including his own wife "wouldn’t want to lie down (in a bed) next to a woman who just gave birth to a baby who  might want to murder her baby  twenty years from now." In response his party chairperson Education Minister Naftali  Bennett condemned him  and rejected the idea of "hating Arabs."

Revital Smotrich on Friday released an open letter, in which she addressed the controversy.

"I was wrong," she began. "I was wrong when I thought you could say out loud what you think. I was wrong when I thought that the nation of Israel, which bears the flag of democracy, was able to include me too. I was wrong because I was too naive, and I thought that (journalist) Rafi Reshef, whose voice I grew up hearing, called just because he was interested how I was doing."

Taking aim at the backlash, she continued, "maybe I was also wrong when I thought that I could think differently, after my brother was wounded in a terror attack next to Kfar Darom, our good friends Menashe and Racheli Gavish lost four of their family members when a terrorist entered their house, our neighbors lost their cousins - members of the Fogel family, and my dear husband lost his good friend Shuli Har-Melekh...and the list unfortunately goes on..."

"I thought that after all that, I was allowed to give birth to new life when around me there aren't any people who remind me of death, and that isn't my fault."

"I was not wrong"

The MK's wife said, "there are those who would say I also was wrong when I chose to live in Kedumim, to suffer from the mass protests of the Arab residents of Kadum every Friday and Shabbat, to get up in the night for scared children who dream about terrorists coming into the house, to wait for my husband the MK who works around the clock, and to worry when he drives in the middle of the night through Arab villages."

"Maybe that's what caused me not to love those who don't really love me and try to disturb the routine of my life."

Smotrich took aim at the leftist protesters who demonstrated in front of her house on Wednesday, saying sarcastically, "maybe they could have arranged an apartment for me in Tel Aviv, where there are no Arabs and racists."

"I was wrong when I thought that it wasn't just clear to me that the Israeli Arabs completely identify with all that is connected to the 'Palestinian nation,' and the one who stands at their head leads both groups (i.e. those with and without Israeli citizenship - ed.) together and encourages the attacks against us."

She also criticized the press, saying she had expected to find journalists on the political right who would defend her, and "even if it was hard for them to say the truth out loud, would at least not be part of the angry mob."

Sarcastically she added, "and I was wrong when I remembered a history lesson from school where we learned that the Jews didn't try to harm the Germans and didn't even try to occupy Germany, apparently I didn't remember right, correct me if I'm wrong but please don't compare my husband to a Nazi."

Slamming the "flock of hypocrites who try to distort the war being waged here for 100 years already," she continued, "mostly I was wrong because I didn't know what the media could do to a little person like me."

"Just so as to be precise, I imagine that you were expecting more apologies...but no. I was not wrong, I still think what I said. We still are fighting, and sacrificing ourselves for our right and existence in this land, and if there is a place where I can forget about that, it's in the birthing room."

If you have people like this as a sizable part of the majority opinion in a country, how will the minority be treated? 

You have no idea what it is like to live in Israel, so you have no right to criticize those who do.

Will you please stop. You don't know what it's like to live in Iran either, or Dearborn Michigan or Timbuktu or thousands of other places. We don't have to live in a geographic location in order to comment on what takes place there. 

You can criticize a government for what it does and doesn't do which are factual matters if and when they are reported, or comment on acts of terrorism that are reported, but you have no right to criticize the feelings of individuals who live in fear for their lives and the lives of their loved ones. To do that, you would have to live there or at the very least travel there and get to know the people. There is a difference that you obviously ignore in your zeal to criticize Israel.

but you have no right to criticize the feelings of individuals who live in fear for their lives and the lives of their loved ones.

I'm going to disagree with you on this one Buzz. If life is so bad in Israel, then your loved ones should move. Until then every American has the right to criticize a government and a country that would not even continue to exist without us. They are a tenet nation to the US. The only difference is that some how we're getting stuck with paying them rent.

No, they shouldn't move, and you are doing the same thing as John by passing judgment on people's feelings and giving them advice you're not qualified to do because you don't have all the facts or knowledge of what their life is like. The governments that you elect in your country determined that they SHOULD support that only democracy in the Middle East and it seems to me that you're pretty defensive of your government.

Don't you even dare to try to tell me what my rights are. My country has made the mistake in the past of supporting the creation of a nation where people already lived! If I had been our UN rep back then I would have vetoed it! Well, it's too late for that now. It's there and the people who don't like living there can move!

If it had been up to me we would have put the nation of Israel in Manitoba.

The governments that you elect in your country determined that they SHOULD support that only democracy in the Middle East and it seems to me that you're pretty defensive of your government.

We all make mistakes!

You say you have the right to criticize a government, and even criticize your own government, and I don't argue with you on that, but then what you did was tell people how they should live their lives when you have no idea what their life is like. I don't know what it's like to live in the desert, but I know I have no right to tell you to move somewhere else. Anyway I'm not going to engage you any more on this because you know as well as I do where it's going to lead us.

but then what you did was tell people how they should live their lives when you have no idea what their life is like.

If they don't like it there, then move! And yes I have a right to say so! If you like it or not, tough shit!

I don't know what it's like to live in the desert, but I know I have no right to tell you to move somewhere else.

If all I did was bitch about how dangerous it was, then yes you'd have a right to tell me if I don't like it here, then I should move!

Okay Randy, I give you the last word. Fuck the whole issue. I'm going to sleep.

I just realized that you're right. The women who aren't happy with their roommates should move into another room. That solves the issue and we can all forget about this can of worms that Jonathon saw fit to re-open.

Then again if all I did was bitch about how dangerous it was here, I wouldn't be living here in the first fucking place!

Now that it’s not 2 in the morning and I’m thinking a little more clearly, Randy, here are a couple of things you had to say, and my responses.

“My country has made the mistake in the past of supporting the creation of a nation where people already lived!”

Jews lived in the land of Israel for thousands of years, sometimes more of them and sometimes less, but always there. Who built and prayed in the Temple of David, the Chinese?

“If it had been up to me we would have put the nation of Israel in Manitoba.”

You think nobody ever lived there before? Kavika can make mincemeat out of that statement. Where in the world did people not already live? How about Antarctica? That should fit your feelings about where the Jews belong.

I remember from when I was a kid "No Jews Allowed" posters, and as a law student searching land titles seeing restrictions forbidding the sale of properties to Jews. I guess there are still people who feel that way.

Hey if Jews from outside of the area wanted to move there, buy a farm, a house, rent an apartment, more power to them, as long as the people they were buying and renting from were doing so willingly, then more power to them. However it was wrong and as I have said if I was our nations UN rep I would have vetoed it, to carve out a whole country and tell the people who are not Jews "We're taking your land and forming a new nation on it and if you don't like it, too fucking bad." No matter how you look at it it was theft pure and simple.

How about Antarctica? That should fit your feelings about where the Jews belong.

At least they would only have the penguins to fight there.

Jews lived in the land of Israel for thousands of years, sometimes more of them and sometimes less, but always there.

And before the Jews lived there other people lived there, who under the orders of "god" were slaughtered because how dare they live on the land "god" was giving to the Jews.

“If it had been up to me we would have put the nation of Israel in Manitoba.”

I was being facetious and you damned well know it.

There are historical, legal, social, moral, emotional and political reasons why the UN, at least a 2/3 majority of the countries making up the UN, voted for Partition. The greatest opposition was from Arab countries that did not want the Jews to have a home so close to their lands - perhaps because it was a threat to their theocracies and dictatorships.

Try starting with the Balfour Declaration, and through the historical mandates and conventions like San Remo to see why Israel was created there. I guess you're also denying that the Rothchilds purchased a lot of the land for settlement from the Arab landlords who laid claim to it, besides purchases made by individuals.

But in my opinion, the Arabs shot themselves in the foot when they invaded Israel, and one loss wasn't enough for them - they kept trying and losing.

No matter how you look at it it was theft pure and simple.

Speaking of theft a much better example was the war that was started by neighboring Arab states against Israel . The theft was thwarted by the effective defense of Israeli against multiple Arab states . The Arabs in Israel were commanded by Arab authorities to leave the area to prevent being overrun by their own forces . Those who ignored that command are now Israeli citizens with full rights of citizenship .

"At least they would only have the penguins to fight there."

Is that what you think of Jews? That all they want to do is fight? That they don't want to live in peace? Do you keep one eye open when you go to sleep at night?

Is that what you think of Jews? That all they want to do is fight?

Only some Jews. Like the current warmongering mobsters currently in charge. Likud does not want peace. They want to annex the occupied territories. Which will lead to more and more blood and Bibi will smile as he crushes people under his heel. We should cut them off completely. I don't want any of my tax money going toward his wars.

I'm curious about something - I guess I must have missed it. What war did Bibi start?

The war he is currently waging by having settlements take over the West Bank. That's a war too.

Oh? I never thought of the settlements as being a war. Wouldn't it be more accurate to call Bibi a settlementmonger?

Thanks because it's not your land that is being stolen. The settlements are, according to the UN, illegal and they are a form of war IMHO.

In my opinion, the Arabs gambled and lost what they considered to be theirs, but suit yourself Randy. I won't try to restrict your opinions.

It's still theirs and there will never be peace as long as the settlements exist, which is exactly what mobsters of Israel, the Likud want. They don't want peace, they want to take over. They want to steal. They are not a party, they are an organized crime family.

Oh? I never thought of the settlements as being a war. Wouldn't it be more accurate to call Bibi a settlementmonger?

It would be more accurate to call him a skid mark in need of another wash cycle.

There is a difference that you obviously ignore in your zeal to criticize Israel.

I don't have any zeal to criticize Israel Buzz. 

You've replied to my comment about zeal, now let's see if you're able to reply to the fact that although you have the right to criticize the government, which you cannot deny doing, you have no right to criticize the feelings of those who live in fear for their lives and the lives of their loved ones, which is the meat of the issue here.

People can fear for their lives, of course. The issue was the policies of the hospitals, which I assume are regulated by the government. 

Thank you. I grant you the last word on the issue because I'm going to sleep. It's 2 a.m. here.

Have a good night's sleep Buzz. 

This might not be considered beating a deed horse because it's an existing issue, but in my opinion it's beating a horse to death.

I thought this whole issue was laid to rest with John's article, but even though there was cause in indicating that Arab women were no different in their attitude and wishes than Jewish ones, posting that fact has just opened a can of worms and caused more of a divisive rift. As I said, the horse is being beaten to death. I'm sick of it and going back to sleep. It's 2 a.m. where I am.

OK, I must admit, when I had Matthew, I was 43 years old and asked that I not be put in the same room as a teenager...  They said, no problem, all our rooms are private.  Good!  I didn't think I could take the added stress of a roommate who would be having baby moms and baby daddies and baby drama swirling around-- I was on strict bed rest and trying to keep my blood pressure down.  So, I'm obviously a terrible person.  So what?  My son and I both survived, and that was what mattered-- it wasn't a matter of prejudice, but of common sense.

I don't understand all this fol de rol about Israeli and Arab women being the same room-- can't they just let things be, and be nice to one another?  Or everyone have a private room?  I was in the labor room for about an hour, as they prepped me for C-section.  Alone, (private room too).  I didn't really even want my husband in there, as he was busy exploring, pulling on tubes and wondering what they were, and looking at various equipment, wondering what THAT did, and I needed him to be calm.  The next big surgery I had, open heart surgery, I specifically requested that he NOT be with me until recovery, since he's just a bit too inquisitive when it comes too looking at medical paraphernalia.  The last thing I need is to have to entertain him.  It's one thing to be curious, but it's another thing when you think that item may be what they use on YOU...  ("I bet this is a rib spreader, what do you think?  Oh boy, that would really crack you open!"  SHUT UP.  Shut up, shut up, shut up.)

It seems that it is the Arab women that want more privacy, not the Israeli women...  Who would have thunk it?

My thought:  Do what makes the women comfortable.  You're uncomfortable enough-- why add to it?