What person no longer alive would you choose to have lunch with now?
What person no longer alive would you choose to have lunch with now?
In my case, the first person I can think of would be my father. I was in another city at my desk and got the call from a neighbourhood doctor that he had a fatal heart attack. I never had a chance to tell my dad how much I appreciated what a good father he had been to me and that I loved him very much. Those are things that should never be delayed because we never know when we are going to lose the opportunity.
However, there is hardly a person who would NOT choose a dead parent, family member, or sibling, or child, so OTHER THAN A FAMILY MEMBER, who would you choose?
Other than my father, whom I have disqualified, I choose Golda Meir, the first female president of Israel. She was born in the same city as my mother, was known as the “Iron Lady” of Israeli politics before Margaret Thatcher became PM of the UK. She was a teacher, a profession I enjoyed practising and learned to respect since I came to China, was a kibbutznik, and she was often portrayed as the "strong-willed, straight-talking, grey-bunned grandmother of the Jewish people."
Choose one person only, and I know the decision will be difficult. There are all kinds of possibilities. Go as far back in history as you wish. But please give the reason for your choice.
Is there an American who would not want to meet with Thomas Jefferson or Abraham Lincoln or JFK?
A religious Christian might want to meet with Jesus of Nazareth or Martin Luther King, Jr.,
Whereas someone with political interests might want to have lunch with Winston Churchill or Karl Marx or Mahatma Gandhi or Benjamin D’Israeli.
A person who is adept at physics could choose Albert Einstein,
And one who loves classic films and actors could want to spend a little time with Humphrey Bogart, James Dean, Marilyn Monroe or Betty Davis.
A classical music fan might choose Mozart or Beethoven,
But if it’s more current music, Jim Morrison or John Lennon, Al Jolson or Irving Berlin.
A photographer could name Ansel Adams as the one,
And maybe someone would like to meet with a pirate whose treasure has never been found.
An artist might want to meet with J.M.W. Turner, or M.C. Escher.
Anyone who loves English Literature could choose Jane Austen or William Shakespeare or Robert Frost or J.D. Salinger or Ernest Hemingway.
An explorer or mountain climber might want to meet with Sir Edmund Hillary (actually I did, and got his autograph).
There are so many possibilities here. Remember, ONE name only, and the reason for the choice. I know that most of us might choose a family member, but that is not the exercise here. Please do not choose a deity, god, fictional or cartoon character - just an ordinary human being. As well, please assume that you are able to communicate freely with your choice, notwithstanding a difference in language .
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A number of years ago I posted a similar article, but many new members have joined NT since then, so it is giving them an opportunity to reveal something about themselves, depending on whom they choose as that ONE special individual with whom they would like to share a lunch. This time I have disqualified a close relative, because most of us would probably choose one - I would have - but I think it will be a more interesting exercise to go beyond family.
I guess you will have to pick up the lunch tab.....LOL.
There are so many to choose from. Ok, I'm going to pick Winston Churchill. The reason: Because he was a man of conviction who stood fast and alone against the Nazi's and then later was one of the first to see an even greater threat from Communism. I know he had his faults as well (a belief in Colonialism to the very end), but he was among, if not, the most relevant man of the 20th century.
I got to tease ya bit Buzz. Golda was in the labor party and a socialist. You know how those Kabbutizniks are! LOL!
LOL. You KNOW that my politics are as much liberal as they are conservative when it comes to gun controls, the right to abortion, universal health care (even being comfortable living in a Communist country). When I did that test as to which of the four squares would I find myself in, I was JUST a tiny bit below the horizontal line and JUST a tiny bit to the left of the vertical one, and that put me JUST inside the Mahatma Gandhi square - isn't that almost as centrist as it can get?
My Mom. I was with her in hospital on Sunday and had to travel with plans to return the next Friday night. She passed that Thursday.
Yes, Dave, I fully understand your feelings, because they are similar to what my own were, but did you not read the article other than just the headline?
No I did not see this as I was falling asleep. Just got woken up by a phone call.
Apologies.
I would maybe say Giora Epstein or Robin Olds, but I will say Chuck Yeager. But I believe they are all still alive.
Have to give more thought in the morning.
I have amended the article to clarify it.
And the reason for your choice is....?
Buzz, again I give my apologies, admittedly I was pretty much disheveled last night.
Okay, so Robin Olds did pass 10 - 11 years ago.
Why would I think of these there Air Combat Righter Aces?
All three of them have set major historical milestones, of interest to me, in air combat aviation.
One might think, why didn't I choose the great tactician and strategist Oswald Boelcke who penned the first documented set of air combat tactical rules known as the Dicta Boelcke? Although I appreciate what he did by establishing a foundation upon which others built upon, the three I mentioned plied their skills in a era that has fascinated me more than Boelcke's era.
So for the purpose of this post I will focus on Robin Olds who eventually became a Triple Ace.
At a young age an early interest aviation eventually led to him becoming a P-38 Fighter Pilot in Europe and and as far as he knew the only Fighter Pilot to score an enemy kill while not under power. While his group was readying to engage enemy aircraft the order to drop tanks was given. Ooops, he forgot to switch on the fuel pumps for the internal tanks. Of course the motors shut just as he lined up a shot. No power, the guns remained on target just long enough squeeze off a few rounds.
Bingo, got a kill.
One of the first stories of his, that I recall was becoming a victim of compressability while making a dive on a, IIRC, BF109 that had another P-38 in it's sights.
I think that shook the BF109 off the tail of the the other P-38. Unfortunately, compressability made the controls useless on the early P-38s (good google search for everyone).
Olds blows right past the BF109 and other P-38 and was heading straight for the ground.
I forgot how, but he managed pull out of the dive with very little room to spare. In fact when pulling out of the dive, the forces on the airframe were great enough to force the very top of the canopy to pop out.
His comment was, he just wanted to go back to base "home" at that point. Not to be. He had some more combat before returning to base.
I call all that, impromptu tactics.
Fast forward to Viet Nam and the F4s. Yes, those F4s without guns. The smart people decided there would never be a need for guns on fighter aircraft again. Somebody forgot to tell the Soviets. BTW, someone forgot to tell the people who designed and made our air to air missiles, because they had their fair share of failures. Someone once said, "there is a reason they are called miss-iles and not hit-iles".
Olds didn't like this. Where most else kept their mouths shut for fear of reprisal about the about this serious problem, Olds made a big deal of it and ruffled all the feathers possible all the way to Washington. Eventually M61 rotary cannons were getting mounted under the belly of F4s.
Time for another one. This is an example of Olds combining strategic thinking with his tactical expertise.
Operation Bolo. F105s (Thuds) were serving as bombers over the North. They were getting beat up by Migs, SAMS and AAA on these runs.
Olds crafted a sting operation. Through the use of electronics, flight patterns, voice communications, speeds, Olds and his team set a trap for the Migs. As usual, the Migs came up as anticipated. Except for a little problem facing the Mig pilots. Instead of finding some easy pickens to down, the were surprised by some mean and hungry F4s.
7 Migs downed in that battle. Upon returning to base Olds had this to say:
“To make a wonderfully long story short, they lost.”
For the remainder of his career he pushed for advanced strategies and tactics.
I would like to have time to pick his brain.
Sounds fantastic, but in a language I hardly understand. My own experiences in airplanes (other than commercial flights) is the first lesson in a Cessna and the first lesson in a glider. I decided not to continue either course.
Thank you Buzz.
I am going to guess the Cessna was a 150. My first piloting experience too.
Like you, I only went so far with that training. Not due to lack of interest, more a financial matter.
The slow pace has a unique and relaxing feeling. To this day I want a Piper Cub. When very young I pronounced them as Paper Cups.
I don't know. I only remember that it was a relatively small single-engine plane with side windows that seemed to wrap around to the floor so that you looked right down to the ground below your feet. I think that unnerved me.
Dave,
I highly recommend the book The Fork Tailed Devil, The Story of the P-38 Lightning by Martin Caidin. He spent a great deal of time dealing with the compressiblity problem as well as the slowness of installing upgrades into the earlier aircraft. In particular, Lockheed had solved the compressibility problem and had loaded the needed parts (dive brakes) onto a ship headed for Europe in order to upgrade planes already in service. The ship was sunk, not by a German submarine but by Allied aircraft (OOPS).
I don't know of one with the door windows extending to the floor, however, the 150s, 172s, etc with above mounted wings gave a full view of the ground when looking out the door side windows. The door/window proportions are similar to that of a car in the 50s/60s.
Thank you TTGA. I will take a look at that. I may have read it before, but if it is a question in my mind, then I have some more to learn or re-learn.
You might find this out of the ordinary but when very young, my Mom is the one who piqued my interest in P-38s and Drag Racing of all things.
She had a car like this 1950 Chevy Deluxe when still single. Also green.
Whereas my Dad taught me the family fine art and skill of long range shooting, and btw, had special interest in the P-47 Thunderbolts and old bi-planes.
I will take a look for that book. I am sure it will be good reading.
Thank you again.
It was so long ago, my mind might have exaggerated the sensation a bit.
The above mount wings have bothered a lot of folks I have spoken to. The bottom mount wings and bi-planes with the lower wings gives a sense of something between you and the ground.
'cept he's alive
So, maybe Paul of Tarsus. I'm gonna need a translator, though.
I'd like to talk to either my grandfather or his father. They came from Russia during the communist revolution and we know little about that part of the family before that.
As I pointed out above, and again pointed out above, relatives are disqualified. As I said, if not for that I would have chosen my father as well, but I thought it would be more interesting if we were to indicate what our greatest interests are by choosing a historical person who was perhaps famous in a field that is of interest to us.
My father, fled from Russia during the revolution as well, and it might make an interesting article about what little we know of the family left behind, so why don't YOU do an article about that so that everyone can explore and comment on that history.
Actually, you said "close relative" and I wouldn't consider either of the relatives I mentioned to be "close." They both died decades before I was born, one in a foreign country. Besides, I gave you someone else. Maybe relax a little?
My apologies, Tacos, for not being crystal clear. I have amended the article so that the exclusion is more explicit.
It's your opinion that Jesus is alive. If so, I guess we differ on that, in that I think of him as having been a good man and a prophet but not necessarily a deity. I think I'm going to have to amend the article yet again to clarify it, in that the choices should be limited to ordinary human beings who lived on Earth all their lives, and were not gods or deities or myths or cartoon characters. As well, everyone should make the assumption that the ability to communicate between the choice and the chooser should be assumed.
Is there anything else that you might wish?
I feel like you're over-thinking and over-policing it. Why argue with me about Jesus or who I pick? I commented because I thought it would be fun. You're making me sorry I bothered.
So be it. I didn't ARGUE with you about Jesus - I merely posted my opinion of him. I withdraw my apology.
"Don't take life so serious son, it ain't nohow permanent." (Churchy La Femme - the Okefenokee swamp philosopher turtle)
Heard an interview with Janice Joplin on NPR recorded a week before she died. She sounded like lots of fun.
I could stand to spend a leisurely lunch with her. Room service with a fifth of Southern Comfort thrown in.
Wasn't that her favourite drink? I knew I should have posted her name with the pop stars I named in the article.
There would be many of course. A few of mine would be Mark Twain, Queen Elizabeth I, one of the early organizers of the Christian faith during the Roman persecution, and Frank Sinatra.
Without a doubt, John Adams. A man of true ethics. A lawyer who defended a Redcoat, because it was the right thing to do. We would not be a nation without him. He was honorable, fair, bombastic and brilliant. He was ahead of his times. Till then, no child colony had ever broken away from its parent nation, yet he saw a path when most did not.
He was indeed Perrie. Of course, he was also possessed of such an abrasive personality that, when his Presidency was over, his own Party in his own State legislature hated him so much that they refused to send him to the Senate. Maybe that's the fate of all honest politicians.
I can add a couple of interesting ones to Mr. Adams. Theodore Roosevelt would be a really interesting lunch companion; at least the lunch would not be dull by any means, since he was known to have a manic personalty. Add Harry Truman to that. He combined all the pithy humor of a wartime soldier and a Missouri politician who had rejected the machine.
I'd say that, with the three of them interacting, you and I could sit on the sidelines and have a great time watching the fireworks.
That is funny TTGA. I almost chose Teddy, but then I realized that would be no Teddy without John. But TR was an amazingly forward thinking man and what he gave to this nation we are still reaping the benefits of.
Could be so many Buzz.
Abe Lincoln or Robin Williams. I guess Robin Williams, loved him dearly. A sweet man who was a comedic genius. That was when we could laugh at ourselves. He was great...just a great man.
I can't open what you posted - perhaps it was a scene with Robin Williams. When I thought about who I would name, his name did cross my mind.
I'm sorry...forgot.
It is his interview on the show Inside The Actors Studio in 2001. If there is another way you can access it, you will love it.
For me, it would be Sequoyah, also known as Sequoya, Sequoia, Sikwayi. He gave the Cherokee people the written Syllabary of their language so that the Cherokee, also known as "The Principle People", could learn to read and write in their own language.
He was a poor, crippled, uneducated and ridiculed half-breed Indian who triumphed over insurmountable odds to bring a gift to his people that was so great that it is unrivaled in all human history.
He was passionate about his goal, and to help his people learn to read and write in their own language in order to preserve their language for future generations when the Europeans were intent in seeing all Native American languages abolished.
I would love to have the opportunity to share his dream, and learn of his hopes for the future of his people, who were being driven from their homes and denied their own beliefs and language by the newcomers to this country.
His Syllabary is truly a gift for his people that keeps on giving, generation after generation, and hopefully, for many generations to come.
You can read more about this quiet man of courage and great determination here, or other sites.
An excellent choice, although IMO this statement: "...to bring a gift to his people that was so great that it is unrivaled in all human history." seems a bit extreme to me. However, that would make a great topic for an article. For such a question I would consider Dr. Jonas Salk to be a contender.
Thanks, Buzz. However, those were not my own words, but, from the subject article I posted the link to. Sorry that I forgot the quoatation marks.
I have always been interested in linguists and the many different languages of the world. I am not proficient in any of the various languages I have studied, but, can speak and understand some of the languages, some more than others. Right now my list is French, Low German, Castilian Spanish, Mexican, Japanese and Italian. I am now learning some Korean and Chinese. While I am not fluent in any of them, I enjoy using what I do know to communicate as best I can with those who do speak the languages, and learning more from them.
And...I am still trying to get up to speed with some of the different dialects of the English language from the different areas here in America as well, which can often sound like a foreign language as well. (grin)
Growing up in Ontario, only English was taught in Public School (K to grade 8) and since French is Canada's second official language it was taught in high school as was Latin. and German was optional. Although my brother won a scholarship to university because of his proficiency in foreign languages, I was never very good at them, and was never fluent in French, only know the odd words or phrases in German and flunked Latin. My Latin teacher, Mr. Cooper, told me I might as well quit school because I was never going to succeed in anything. After I had practised Law for about 13 years and had my Bachelor of Arts, Bachelor of Laws, and was appointed a Queen's Counsel by Elizabeth II (can also put Q.C. after my name) I went back to the high school hoping Mr. Cooper was still there, and he WAS, so I reminded him of what he said to me, and told him of my achievements, and what did he say to me? "Well, maybe you actually worked harder because of what I told you."
Although Russian was my parents' first language, they only spoke English and by doing so became fluent with no accent, and only spoke Russian if they didn't want my brother or me to know what they were saying, so I never learned Russian, and even though I've been in China for more than 12 years, I only know certain words and phrases but am unable to carry on a conversation.
Indeed that does sound like a teacher trying to take credit for the achievement a student made on their own efforts. (smile)
Learning languages was fairly easy for me in a way. My Speech Teacher in high school said that I had the gift of a 'fluid tongue', that I could adapt to the various accents and pronunciations easily.
However, have you ever heard someone speak French with a Southern drawl? ( big grin)
Isn't that what they call "Cajun"? I've never been to Louisiana.
Cajuns seem to speak a whole other language! It is a mix, I don't think a Frenchman would understand even half of what a Cajun speaks!
I've heard Cajun music, and used to love the food.
It's interesting that the Cajuns were originally Acadians, who had first settled in Maritime Canada, and then moved to Louisiana where they became Cajuns. Note how the word "Cajun" is a slurred version of the word "Acadian".
You also have to throw Creoles in the mix.
LA has a lot of different ethnicities and countries represented there.
Jambalaya is one of my favorites! I like mine with chicken, ham, and andouille sausage.
Ok, now we found something to agree on, I also like fresh Gumbo as well, Red Beans and, Rice and, Dirty Rice.
The restaurant I work for specializes in Cajun-Creole cooking.
One thing about it though--there are different recipes for every dish, and if someone likes it one way and you make it another, you're just flat-out wrong! And the recipes can be vastly different. Etouffee can be tomato-based or roux-based. Gumbo sometimes has oysters and gumbo file (pronounced feel-ay) in it. I tell everyone who complains that it is like meatloaf--if you like it, you usually like how your mom or wife makes it, and everyone knows meatloaf has hundreds of recipes for it!
Yep! I agree.
Did you ever see a guy named Justin Wilson on television?
he was a riot!
Okay, we're getting a little TOO tangential now - let's get back on topic.
loved his stuff, never would use black pepper,
Ok, Buzz, Justin is the last from me on this.
when I first started watching him, it took me a couple of episodes before I understood him very well.
But he always cracked me up.
Sorry, Buzz!
My fault!
No...Cajun is a language all its own. Cajuns are Acadians
I thought I said that:
OK....guess I misunderstood. Tells me that I should not read or post comments after having a tooth pulled and still under the lingering effects of medication and pain.
Sorry I didn't catch it the first time around. (smile)
I used to enjoy watching his shows some time ago.
But I will call him on the black pepper thing. Nothing better than a blanket of black pepper mixed into a gravy and sausage pot pie or all over sliced turkey in a sandwich. Of course JMO.
Welcome to the club Raven Wing. I screwed up when my mind was all disheveled late at night the other day.
Lesson learned.
No problem, RW. Dentistry here is amazing. I had all my bottom teeth pulled, four at a time. The first four, I asked the dentist when he was going to pull them, and he already HAD pulled them. I didn't feel a thing.
I had a choice of either Laughing Gas or a local. I chose the local. No telling what might have happened if I had chosen Laughing Gas. (grin)
It might have been very funny. LOL
Out of curiosity, how much did it cost to pull a tooth. It cost about the equivalent of US$40 here.
My co-pay was $50.00. My insurance covered the rest. I think it is $250.00 all total.
Nostradamus
LOL. Will you be asking him to predict the lottery numbers for you?
That, what ever else he will tell me and where he got his info from
My mother, I miss her every day. She was a amazing woman.
Good man, we don’t agree much in here but I agree with you here brother,
Good on you ... no question.
None, eating with a corpse at the table would be both disturbing and gross
That was my first thought. Who would want some decomposed stiff propped up in a chair across the lunch table.
Is there no imagination? Are there no fantasies? Bah! Humbug!
Mahatma Gandhi. He was a great man of peace who inspired peaceful protest for civil rights all over the world. Also, my lining up with Gandhi politically makes me want to talk to him even more.
Have you read the latest on his views, taken from his own writings? Many years ago an African American, lesbian, activist, Irene Monroe, who "has/had", a local Public radio show on WGBH shocked me with her well sourced, detailed accusations. He was the worst sort of racist, showed homophobic tendencies, and abused young girls. I'm sure a few seconds of googling will confirm what I just said. You may want to reconsider your opinion of him.
Mark Twain ..... just because ......
My sister Beth, I miss more than anything.
I give up. As much as I try...........
You asked, I answered, my sister is about the only person I'd like to have lunch with who isn't alive.
Did you read the article, or through the comments?
I have to admit, I looked at some of the comments, I wasn't even sure if I wanted to comment on this one but, I checked the comments and, decided to post. After I saw your comment I went up and, read the article so, I don't know who in history I'd rather sit down and, have lunch with, there are so many people and, I can only eat so much, if I had to chose one, I think it would be Mary Magdalene, I'd love to get her insight into what it was like 2000 years ago in her world.
Don't fret. You're not the first one who didn't bother to read the article or my first comment, just the title, and chose family members. Only one member was nasty about it. So I've decided to do ANOTHER article - this time NAME ONE DECEASED FAMILY MEMBER TO REVIVE TO SPEND A DAY WITH YOU. I already have ideas for it.
Well, you already know my answer to that one Buzz.
The new article is up now, so please post your comment on it.
Harry Truman. I would love to talk to him about the ordering the use of atomic weapons, his rationale for using them, his decision making process for it, and his take on no one using them since.
Such a heavy (and, IMO, necessary) burden for him to bear.
Those are actually really interesting questions. Wish I knew the answers to them myself.
I wonder how he felt about it---especially later in life. I am not criticizing his decision, just curious as to how one handles having to make it.
Got to be a special and strong person to handle all that!
I think Harry Truman's library in Missouri would have most of these answers for you, I think he put his reasoning in his private papers, if I'm not mistaken he said the reason he ordered their use was to prevent anymore U.S. deaths trying to take the main island of Japan itself, the Japanese had already decided to use suicide squads to protect the island against attack and, so many lives had been lost on the out lying islands that Truman wanted it over with fewer lives lost, military and, civilian so, he ordered the bombing hoping it would make the Japanese see reason.
This part is easy, if the first part is true, he would be happy that we haven't used them and, he would wish that we had never discovered them or, that we had totally gotten rid of them by now.
I understand and support his reasoning. The question was who we would like to see and he is my pick.
A man who could decide what he had to and survive is pretty strong, IMO.
Agreed, that isn't something that you decide on the spur of the moment over a hamburger.
I believe living with the consequences of that decision, even knowing in your heart that it was correct, must have been very hard.
Killing so many in one fell swoop like that had to be gut-wrenching.
I don't really believe they knew just how powerful it was at the time, I mean, they knew it was powerful but, they really didn't have a real idea of the devastation it would cause, the people at the epicenter of the blast simply left their "shadows" behind, others were burned and, weren't killed and, the people who came to rescue them and, lend aid said the lucky ones were the ones who were just shadows on the walls.
I have read quite a bit about the test they ran before deployment. Pretty wild stuff--almost unimaginable, except for the fact it does exist.
Truman was pretty well aware that the atomic bomb could heavily damage a large city, the scientists had told him through their reports.
Maybe I will post a seed about the dropping of the A bomb. It is a perennially interesting topic on discussion forums.
A lot of people don't realize that prior to dropping the atomic bombs, the US was already in the process of devastating Japan's cities through conventional bombing.
The number of civilians killed at Hiroshima and Nagasaki, while tragic, was not really a consideration. Civilian populations were bombed throughout the war, by both sides. Millions and millions of civilians died in WW2. Hiroshima and Nagasaki represented just a tiny portion of that total.
But, were the other bombings happened with lots of planes and, many bombs, Hiroshima and, Nagasaki were one plane each and, one bomb each, I think Truman figured the scientist were over estimating the damage that would be done but, they actually underestimated it.
This has been an interesting tangential conversation to follow, and not at all off topic IMO. John, you SHOULD post the article you suggested.
And you DID. LOL
You left out a smartass that likes to joke.
I want to have lunch and not eat with Idi Amin.
Can you imagine how it could go?
"Hi Joel, welcome, we've been expecting you.
I know you must be starving after that long trip across your imagination. We are aware your western eating habits may differ so we've planned a wonderful lunch for your tastes.
Everything is from our garden today. We'll start with the finest escargot that have spent the season devouring the most tender of leaves, along with a fine salad and then the main course of roast Chuck."
"I'm so impressed sir. A fine selection but Chuck roast doesn't come from the garden"
"I didn't say chuck roast, I said roast Chuck.
Charles was the gardener that let the fucking snails eat the garden.
Would you like some muscles in a tomato basil sauce?
LOL
Emperor Wu Zetian/Empress Consort Wu
China experienced a wealth and stability it had never known before during her rule.
If this article is going to turn into one about the best guitar players in the world (and I confess that I contributed to the derail) or the best Cajun food, I'm going to have to lock this article.
Buzz, on really good seeds we just go off East, West, North, South, Up and Down, Sideways and are happy doing so. Just let us go, wherever! That's the best, most rambling and fun threads! Don't know where it might end up
As you can see I've allowed a LOT of leeway, and I usually do, but now maybe it's time to go to my other article, about spending time with family members.
Another good and fun seed
Yeah it is!
Aside from joking I would love to have lunch with Henry Ford amd hand him the keys to one of his products.
Can you just imagine? An F-150 might as well be a space ship to him.
Yeah, it would be interesting to find out about his friendly relationship with Adolph Hitler.
I'm sitting here debating between Queen Elizabeth I, Gilda Radner, and Marilyn Monroe.
I think I'll buy the Queen lunch. I want to know why she never married and what was going thru head when she lopped off Mary's.