These are the Trump associates who’ve pleaded guilty in the Mueller probe. ..... So far.

OK... so Trump has not yet shot anyone... and the fact that he has had so many crooks around him, and his followers don't care... seems to be pretty clear proof that he could!

CoC Rule:     4. Stay on topic per the article

(none of which, crucially, are about colluding with Russia during the 2016 presidential election).

This may not be entirely true, it seems that Manafort during his pleading yesterday admitted to working with a Ukrainian party that was pro-Russian to smear Hillary Clinton during the campaign by saying that she was pro-Russian. In the 18 pages of allocution that were presented yesterday Manafort admitted that he did work with a pro-Russian group out of the Ukraine to try to smear Hillary's name during the campaign.

Manafort does not get a "sweetheart" deal with Mueller, he has to testify, talk to Mueller without his lawyers present, turn over all information he has in his possession, to the satisfaction of Mueller before he is sentenced for as many years as Mueller deems proper, then he gets to be sentenced to his prison term and, gets to start serving it. In the mean time he gets to enjoy the hospitality of the federal government in prison. 

Wait and see....

It would seem that the New York Post ran the story, I'll have to check the history.

This may not be entirely true, it seems that Manafort during his pleading yesterday admitted to working with a Ukrainian party that was pro-Russian to smear Hillary Clinton during the campaign by saying that she was pro-Russian.

Manafort was the pro-Russian former Prime Minister Yanukovych henchman - he promoted Yanukovych as a pro western leader until the 'coup' in 2014 ..  

I guess I am missing out on what some of the differences are between hiring someone to find dirt on an opponent and using the 'Russian connection' to do so … how is hiring someone different than having actual connection with a Russian?  I do not think there has been any link found between the Trump administration - even those that have already made deals - and collusion with Russia to fix he election for Trump .. has there been?  [life has been a bit crazy as of late - so I may have missed something that has unfolded]

As of now there is no public evidence that Trump himself committed a crime. But it’s increasingly clear that when he hired people, he wasn’t hiring the best.

I had to laugh (a lil) at this .. no evidence of wrong doing - but he did not higher the best …. yeah he did, he hired the best at what they do .. it is just now becoming clear what it is the 'best' he hired actually does!

What is implied by the plea deal is that Manafort conspired with the Russians to plant a story in the New York Post that stated that Hillary was working with the Russians, during the campaign in order to smear her and, to cause her to lose, that is fixing the campaign for her opponent to win the election and, that is illegal. Manafort admitted this happened when he was Trumps campaign manager.

Thanks Mr. G ..  

I went looking and did not find the New York Post mentioned .. I did find an article by the Washington Post about Breitbart publishing a story attacking Clinton .. but I have not found the Breitbart article yet, well at least not anything current and cannot open the Washington Post article, that says it is 18 hours old.. I will find it...

I did find this in the guardian .. says the article was last updated 21 hours ago

Paul Manafort, Donald Trump’s former campaign chair, has pleaded guilty to two counts of conspiracy and agreed to cooperate with Robert Mueller’s inquiry into Russian interference in the 2016 election, in a dramatic development could spell legal trouble for the president.

Manafort pleaded guilty to conspiring to defraud the US and conspiring to obstruct justice in return for other charges being dropped

theguardian

I understand, I heard all of this on Rachel Maddows show last night. I just went there and, they had a link to the pdf on the documents from the hearing, I'm posting them here for anyone interested, there's 18 pages so, don't expect a quick find.

media1.s-nbcnews

Well, I was wrong about it being a smear of Hillary working with Russians, it was actually to be an article saying that Hillary was anti-Semitic, from the pdf file I posted,

Yanukovych’s political opponent. 37. In addition to the law firm report, MANAFORT took other steps on behalf of the Government of Ukraine to tarnish Tymoshenko in the United States. In addition to disseminating
stories about her soliciting murder, noted above, in October 2012, MANAFORT orchestrated a
scheme to have, as he wrote in a contemporaneous communication, “[O]bama jews” put pressure
on the Administration to disavow Tymoshenko and support Yanukovych. MANAFORT sought
to undermine United States support for Tymoshenko by spreading stories in the United States that
a senior Cabinet official (who had been a prominent critic of Yanukovych’s treatment of
Tymoshenko) was supporting anti-Semitism because the official supported Tymoshenko, who in
turn had formed a political alliance with a Ukraine party that espoused anti-Semitic
views. MANAFORT coordinated privately with a senior Israeli government official to issue a
written statement publicizing this story. MANAFORT then, with secret advance knowledge of
that Israeli statement, worked to disseminate this story in the United States, writing to Person D1
“I have someone pushing it on the NY Post. Bada bing bada boom.” MANAFORT sought to have
the Administration understand that “the Jewish community will take this out on Obama on election
day if he does nothing.” MANAFORT then told his United States lobbyist to inform the
Administration that Ukraine had worked to prevent the Administration’s presidential opponent
from including damaging language in the Israeli statement, so as not to harm the Administration,
and thus further ingratiate Yanukovych with the Administration.

This is from page 22, so, the pdf is longer than I originally said as well.

I read the whole thing .. just skipped the tables provided...

MANAFORT coordinated privately with a senior Israeli government official to issue a written statement

publicizing this story. MANAFORT then, with secret advance knowledge of that Israeli statement, worked to

disseminate this story in the United States, writing to Person D1 “I have someone pushing it on the NY

Post. Bada bing bada boom.” MANAFORT sought to have the Administration understand that “the Jewish

community will take this out on Obama on election day if he does nothing.” MANAFORT then told his United

States lobbyist to inform the Administration that Ukraine had worked to prevent the Administration’s

presidential opponent from including damaging language in the Israeli statement, so as not to harm the

Administration, and thus further ingratiate Yanukovych with the Administration.

That is from 2012 .. and it was Yanukovych's opponent that was cast as anti Semitic .. Obama was up for reelection and Manafort was pushing the narrative that Yanukovych was pro western ... Manafort was in a way 'black mailing' Obama -  I believe that Obama supported Tymoshenko in the upcoming election in the Ukraine..

Yanukovych’s political opponent. 37. In addition to the law firm report, MANAFORT took other steps on

behalf of the Government of Ukraine to tarnish Tymoshenko in the United States. In addition to

disseminating stories about her soliciting murder, noted above, in October 2012, MANAFORT orchestrated a

scheme to have, as he wrote in a contemporaneous communication, “[O]bama jews” put pressure

on the Administration to disavow Tymoshenko and support Yanukovych.

Sorry my copy/paste is out of order .. the top fit better on the bottom? : )

I believe you are right, Obama wasn't falling for the blackmail thing, I think he figured his rep among the voters was already made one way or, the other and, just decided to let it happen. Gotta love "No Drama Obama".

I think Manafort is totally fried here, what happens next depends on what he can give to Mueller on this.

Agreed he is fried, yet this matter with the Ukrainian election and the pressure applied to Obama is probably just a small finish nail in the big scheme of things regarding what Manafort did as Yanukovych henchmen, when one takes into account the money laundering etc..

Going to be interesting to see how things unfold … I keep wondering if there is nothing Manafort has to offer regarding a Trump involvement - is the investigation over?  I am on the edge of my seat to find out what role if any Trump has played : ) 

Jumping in on this if you don't mind.  You seemed informed on this better than most inventing these charges as something recent.  

Company A and B on this.  One being Tony Podestas company we know... we haven't heard anything about them yet but it was enough to close down his shop.  I'm curious what will come of them. 

is the investigation over?  I am on the edge of my seat to find out what role if any Trump has played

It's not over, yet, but, it's about to get interesting I think, remember Manafort was one of the people involved in the Trump Tower meeting, he helped to plan it and, he was in the room when Jared, Eric and, Don Jr. met with the Russians, he would also be able to tell Mueller if Trump knew of it before the meeting and, if the Russians met with him before or, after the meeting.

I am watching what happens with Podesta .. things are tight lipped .. nothing is current.  Podesta has been linked to Manafort since sometime in 2017 .. it is Podesta Group and Mercury that are A and B..

Things that I have read .. with is as current as July of this year, is that Mueller is aggressively pursuing Podesta's Ukraine connection as well .. yet also in July .. it was said that Podesta was offered immunity to testify against Manafort...…..         Oooo but come to think of it, nothing is current - July was way pre plea agreement with Manafort … so everything is upside down now .. wait, see and speculate is where 'we' are now... !

he would also be able to tell Mueller if Trump knew of it before the meeting and, if the Russians met with him before or, after the meeting.

If Trump himself met with Russians on the same day?

Should read 2012 not 2017

Or within a day or, two before or, after the meeting. It comes back to the question asked about Nixon, "What did the president know, and, when did he know it?"

Agreed .. thanks for the clarification ..  The president has had some difficulty with memory on that one, for sure …. Manafort is smart though .. I can see him keeping the president [then candidate] oblivious leading up to the meeting ... [but after the fact...?]  

   Papadopoulos was not successful in getting a meeting with the Russians to take place … would have to go back and check old links, but I believe it was Manafort that shut that down quickly..

I cannot even remember when Trump said he found out about the tower meeting .. not going to look it up either .. I do my damn'dest to tune that individual out.  I do not know how anyone can hang on his every word .. I would be whacky in prob less than an hour...

it seems that Manafort during his pleading yesterday admitted to working with a Ukrainian party that was pro-Russian to smear Hillary Clinton during the campaign by saying that she was pro-Russian.

Manafort's success in rigging Yanukovych's election through the use of social media is the model they used with Trump.

Manafort's success in rigging Yanukovych's election through the use of social media is the model they used with Trump.

Yep.  And you know what's amazing about that?  Manafort's efforts in getting Yanukovych elected were not, nor have they ever been, a secret.  Not only that, but he has been lobbying for Russian causes in Washington for years.  It wouldn't surprise me one bit if his real name was Paulef Manafortesky.

Even Manafort's daughters know that he's evil:

In a series of texts reviewed by Business Insider that appear to have been sent by Andrea to her sister, Jessica, in March 2015, Andrea said their father had "no moral or legal compass."

"Don't fool yourself," Andrea wrote to her sister, according to the texts. "That money we have is blood money."

"You know he has killed people in Ukraine? Knowingly," she continued, according to the reviewed texts. "As a tactic to outrage the world and get focus on Ukraine. Remember when there were all those deaths taking place. A while back. About a year ago. Revolts and what not. Do you know whose strategy that was to cause that, to send those people out and get them slaughtered."

businessinsider

Wow!

Unless Trump pardons him . . .

According to those involved, there is something not publicized that makes this deal pardon proof.

Remember when there were all those deaths taking place. A while back. About a year ago. Revolts and what not. "  Do you know whose strategy that was to cause that, to send those people out and get them slaughtered."

300,000 Hacked text messages.. that were allegedly sent in 2015 and released in 2017..? 

It was Manafort that stimulated the violence that began in mid February 2014 .. and ended in a coup that ousted his candidate?  Manafort was the mastermind?  I do not understand .. I have to be missing something in what Andrea is alleged to be communicating...  was not Manafort working for the other side, that sent the cops out to try and stop the 'revolts and what not?'

Trump cannot pardon state convictions

Virginia’s double jeopardy statute bars secondary state prosecutions for committing “the same act” in “violation of both a state and a federal statute.” Filing a state tax return, though, is a separate act from filing a federal return. So filing an unlawful state tax return in Virginia would be separate, prosecutable act from Manafort’s federal filing, one that cannot be pardoned by Trump. The Virginia tax law further covers fraud, and a Virginia return that replicated his federal one would contain the same fraudulent material as his federal return.

Further devastating for Manafort’s pardon hopes, according to Virginia rules of evidence, past convictions can be admissible: “Such evidence is admissible if it tends to prove any relevant fact pertaining to the offense charged, such as where it is relevant to show motive, opportunity, intent, preparation, plan, knowledge, identity, absence of mistake, accident, or if they are part of a common scheme or plan.” So in a Virginia trial against Manafort for tax fraud, these many federal convictions would be admissible and devastating.

Manafort also faces New York state tax fraud liability with no double jeopardy protection. New York has a double jeopardy law, but it won’t help Manafort in another tax case. Leona Helmsley, the hotel magnate known as the “Queen of Mean,” had benefited from the double jeopardy rule to escape state tax prosecution. In 2011, New York fixed the rule to allow state tax fraud prosecutions to follow a federal prosecution. Now Manafort could face New York tax fraud charges, even after a federal pardon.

slate

Virginia’s double jeopardy statute bars secondary state prosecutions for committing “the same act” in “violation of both a state and a federal statute.” Filing a state tax return, though, is a separate act from filing a federal return. So filing an unlawful state tax return in Virginia would be separate, prosecutable act from Manafort’s federal filing, one that cannot be pardoned by Trump.

And, so, we see why Trump cannot pardon Manafort and, why Manafort decided to help Robert Mueller, it still is something that he won't be sentenced until Mueller is satisfied with the information that Manafort gives him and, has testified in court to that information. It would seem to me, if I were in Manafort's shoes, it would benefit me to not play around with the information and, to turn it over as fast as I can and, as accurately as I can so I can get sentence sooner.

Trump can pardon Manafort on the federal charges .. but it most likely would not stop Manafort from serving more time .. I have read so much since Friday .. things are blurring together.. but this is from the same article I linked you from slate .. it is a bit of a biased publication so take this with a grain of salt  … but, it is said that:

A pardon would backfire, though, because Manafort would still face numerous state charges and his federal convictions this week would now be admissible in some of those states. Moreover, Trump would only be strengthening the criminal obstruction and the impeachment cases against him.

I think that is a wee bit of a pipe dream .. I do not think pardoning Manafort would do anything other than cause him [Trump] to be more criticized than he is now .. if that is even possible... all remains to be seen though - at this point it would seem most anything could happen..

Here's the real problem with this idea of a pardon, if Trump grants a pardon, Manafort can refuse it, especially if he knows he will be immediately sentence to the full time of the state crimes he has admitted to. Remember he admitted in D.C. to all 18 charges in Virginia so, that alone is over ten years in prison he would get and, I'm sure the state of Virginia would be willing to throw the book at him if he accepted a pardon from Trump.

It was Manafort that stimulated the violence that began in mid February 2014 .. and ended in a coup that ousted his candidate?  Manafort was the mastermind?  I do not understand .. I have to be missing something in what Andrea is alleged to be communicating...  was not Manafort working for the other side, that sent the cops out to try and stop the 'revolts and what not?

No, she was talking about Yanukovych's brutal response to civil unrest and apparently Manafort's daughters think that he was involved in that decision to use deadly force.    As they observed about their dad,  he has "no moral or legal compass."

Thank you, I have since been able to read the article you linked .. was unable to open it last night.  I read multiple sources on the texts last night, but read nothing pertaining to Yanukovych ...

I find it to be a stretch that Manafort influenced Yanukovych, I concede that he may have "no moral or legal compass" .. but in a world when it is necessary to have one to blame, anything goes? .. his daughters hacked texted can be interpreted several ways .. she said:

A while back. About a year ago. Revolts and what not. Do you know whose strategy that was to cause that, to send those people out and get them slaughtered."

your link says

A human-rights lawyer representing the victims of the mass police shootings, Eugenia Zakrevska, now wants to know who was advising or influencing Yanukovych when he ordered Ukrainian security forces to crush the protests with force. One familiar name that has emerged in recent weeks is Paul Manafort, Trump's former campaign manager who advised Yanukovych for nearly a decade.

So was it Manafort's influence that sent out the security forces?  If so, they were not slaughtered.. perhaps Andrea's alleged texts will never make sense to me - I know I am not seeing what others are...

Here is a reminder of those days in February  …

Ukraine's bloodiest day: dozens dead as Kiev protesters regain territory from police

As Moscow encouraged Yanukovych to crack down harder on the unrest and threatened to withhold crucial financial aid unless he did, and the European Union announced limited sanctions on individual Ukrainian officials, three EU foreign ministers spent almost five hours with the president, desperately seeking a way back from the brink through a compromise between his increasingly hardline regime and opposition leaders.

That would include the key opposition demand for early presidential elections, something Yanukovych has shown no sign of conceding since the trouble erupted in November.

They spoke of "possible signs of progress" after seeing the president. But Thursday's escalation occurred within hours of Yanukovych calling a truce in the dangerous spiral of violence that is also spreading beyond Kiev, splitting the country east to west, and raising fears of Ukrainian meltdown.

The White House said Joe Biden, the vice-president, spoke to Viktor Yanukovych on Thursday by telephone and warned him that the US was preparing to sanction officials responsible for the violence.

While the authorities blocked trains coming to Kiev from the anti-Yanukovych west, protesters in the east lay down on railway tracks to prevent the government transporting military reinforcements to the capital. Crimea, ardently pro-Russian if part of Ukraine, issued threats of secession should the country go into freefall. Reports from the west spoke of protesters ransacking military and police headquarters and seizing weapons, while the security services were said to be shredding documents in scenes that recalled the anti-communist revolutions of 1989 in Romania or East Germany.

But the authorities were willing to hit back hard by bringing in the army. "Military servants of the armed forces might be used in anti-terrorist operations on the territory of Ukraine," a defence ministry statement warned.

The security service announced national "anti-terror" operations, revealing that the authorities were struggling to maintain their grip. "In many regions of the country, municipal buildings, offices of the interior ministry, state security and the prosecutor general, army units and arms depots are being seized," said Oleksandr Yakimenko, the head of the state security service.

The mayor of Kiev, Volodymyr Makeyenko, a Yanukovych appointment, announced he was quitting the president's political party. "The events happening in the Ukrainian capital are a tragedy. I have decided to resign from the Party of the Regions." Ten Yanukovych MPs broke ranks and demanded mediation in the spiralling conflict by the EU and the US.

...

Dependent on Russian money and gas supplies since he spurned trade and political pacts with Europe in November, the spark for the crisis, Yanukovych was told by Moscow to maintain a hard line and warned that the financial aid could be turned off if he did not.

Dmitry Medvedev, the Russian prime minister, said that Yanukovych would have to restore order to qualify for the Russian help and that if he did not the opposition forces would use him as "a doormat".

theguardian

Manafort? even as a decade long advisor …  I am thinking his influence was not even on the radar..   just my speculative interpretation …. Manafort is receiving his punishment for the things he is guilty of (or at least most of them .. as he should be) I do not think the events in Kiev in February 2014 are one of those things … but I could be wrong 

Remember he admitted in D.C. to all 18 charges in Virginia so, that alone is over ten years in prison he would get and, I'm sure the state of Virginia would be willing to throw the book at him if he accepted a pardon from Trump.

I know what he has plead guilty to in DC … I still think Manafort has to be still tried and convicted in the States that opt to bring charges against him … 

From the link I provided in 1.1.26

Federal double jeopardy law would not be an issue here. The doctrine of dual sovereignty allows the federal and state governments to prosecute the same crimes. The problem is that many states broaden double jeopardy protections to prevent the bringing of state charges after a federal prosecution. I’ve explained in Slate that New York and Pennsylvania have such a rule. It turns out that Virginia and California do, too. But because of some likely combination of prosecutorial skill and luck, Manafort still faces prosecutions in those states, plus perhaps Illinois and others.

Colour, my point in stating what I did was to say that Manafort would have to be dumber than Trump to accept a pardon at this stage of the game, it would be better to keep his deal with Mueller and, turn over all that he knows and, has in connection to Russian meddling to Mueller and, to tell Trump where to go and, how to get there.

Manafort? even as a decade long advisor …  I am thinking his influence was not even on the radar..   just my speculative interpretation

The point is that Manafort's own daughters do believe that he has that degree of influence.   Whether he actually does I have no way of knowing.

So many Rump supporters keep saying there is no there there

obviously, just a bunch of coinciding coincidences ,

we're all sure,

could never form any sort of correlation,

that could ever make it appear,

at least to his defenders here at NT,

the Golden Toilet Fellow,

according to them, is incapable of colluding with Russia,

as he and Mueller, slowly keep churning out the evidence 

that they, somehow think, they can eternally deny

The Most Corrupt Administration in History follows on the heels of The Cleanest Administration in History...

Zero Obama campaign or administration officials have ever been indicted for malfeasance in office. Not one.

Meanwhile, the Trumpsters set the bar for their man as low as it can go: They are boasting that he himself won't be indicted.

That's pretty awful when you think about it...

Lack of evidence?  

Thanks to Galen Marvin Ross for posting the link to the charges against Manafort.  It demonstrates again what a corrupt totalitarian government we have. 

Money you make overseas should never be taxed by our government. It shows that there is nowhere you can go in the world that the government doesn’t seek control of our lives.

Money you make overseas should never be taxed by our government

That's not what our laws say, but it sounds like you might have some experience in that area.   Did you try to defraud the IRS like Manafort did?    Wesley Snipes tried the same thing and got caught.

The 'pastor' supposedly spends a lot of time overseas.  Me thinks he doth protests too much.

No. I I have paid taxes on money earned overseas. That doesn’t mean I can’t speak out that taxing overseas income is tyrannical

furthermore I have paid income taxes for 57 years. But that doesn’t prevent or disqualify me from agreeing with our founders that an income is part of tyrannical government 

That doesn’t mean I can’t speak out that taxing overseas income is tyrannical

You said that it "demonstrates again what a corrupt totalitarian government we have", despite the fact that the tax code was duly passed by your elected representatives.

So it's not clear what you think is "corrupt", "tyrannical" or "totalitarian" about that.   It sounds instead like it was representative democracy in action, and you just like to whine a lot.

The founders stated that taxing income is tyrannical. It matters not that power hungry politicians would eagerly vote to steal what people earn