MLB pitchers must face three batters or end inning under new rule

  
Via:  transyferous-rex  •  4 months ago  •  46 comments

By:   AFP

MLB pitchers must face three batters or end inning under new rule
Every starting or relief pitcher will be forced to face at least three batters in one of several rule changes for the 2020 season announced Wednesday by Major League Baseball.

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Transyferous Rex
1  seeder  Transyferous Rex    4 months ago

Because forcing a reliever to face three batters, after failing to retire the one he was brought in for, will be much faster than bring a new pitcher in.

 
 
 
Tacos!
2  Tacos!    4 months ago

This is a dumb rule.I could say more than that, but I'm not sure it's necessary. This is just really really dumb.

The rule has an injury caveat, saying a pitcher must remain "unless the substitute pitcher sustains injury or illness which, in the umpire crew chief's judgment, incapacitates him from further play as a pitcher."

Oh, look! A loophole you could drive the team bus through.

 
 
 
Sparty On
2.1  Sparty On  replied to  Tacos! @2    4 months ago

Agreed.    

Looks like MLB is trying to take the “new stupid rule” award from the NFL

 
 
 
Goodtime Charlie
2.2  Goodtime Charlie  replied to  Tacos! @2    4 months ago
Oh, look! A loophole you could drive the team bus through.

That's true. After pitching to the one guy the reliever was brought in to face I can see them faking an injury such as a pulled muscle, hell, they might say "Something is in my eye. I can't see the batter"

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
2.3  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Tacos! @2    4 months ago

Ripe for abuse, and a rule that I really can't see speeding up the game anyway. 

 
 
 
squiggy
3  squiggy    4 months ago

Just set a clock and screw the customer - game's over in two hours no matter where it stands. 

 
 
 
charger 383
4  charger 383    4 months ago

new rules are ruining both Baseball and Football

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
5  Buzz of the Orient    4 months ago

So the purpose of that rule change was to screw the team that's in the field and make it more difficult for it to win the game.  Otherwise what was its purpose?  Next thing they might do is require any batter who hits a home run to sit out the rest of the game. 

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
5.1  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @5    4 months ago
Next thing they might do is require any batter who hits a home run to sit out the rest of the game. 

Never! But, I could see them not requiring said hitter to round the bags, but only to touch first. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
5.1.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Transyferous Rex @5.1    4 months ago

Yeah, that could speed up the game a bit, and the rest of the team could still meet the batter at home plate to high-5 him. It could cut down the cheering although I was there and saw Joe Carter hit the home run that won the Blue Jays their back-to-back World Series, and I think Toronto is still cheering.  It was my lifetime most exciting moment in sports.  Don't tell A.Mac I said so - he's still upset about it. 

 
 
 
Tacos!
5.1.2  Tacos!  replied to  Transyferous Rex @5.1    4 months ago

I can’t imagine losing Kirk Gibson’s iconic limp around the bases.

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
5.1.3  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Tacos! @5.1.2    4 months ago

Right? Fist pump, touch first, walk to dugout.

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
5.1.4  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @5.1.1    4 months ago

Carter! That's one of those moments you'll always remember. Won a dollar bet with my dad that at bat. Had I been older, I'd have wagered more. I called the shot. 3 times now. Carter, Freese, and Muncy.  

 
 
 
Sparty On
5.1.5  Sparty On  replied to  Transyferous Rex @5.1.4    4 months ago

This is one that i'll never forget:

Gibby had an even more famous one with the Dodgers

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
6  Vic Eldred    4 months ago

I don't mind time saving rules, because I realize how long & tedious this 19th century game can sometimes be. However, I'm against restrictions on what managers can do with pitchers. The nature of Baseball is that it is the only team sport in which the DEFENSE controls the ball. Therefore I'm against this one, which is as bad as inter-league play and free agency!

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
6.1  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Vic Eldred @6    4 months ago

That's a good point, and why the line-up is so important. You put Mike Trout in the line-up of any 12 year old team, they may score 3 runs a game, but if you can keep the other guys off of the bags, Trout's not going to hurt you. If someone does get on ahead of him, give him a free pass. 

 
 
 
Heartland American
7  Heartland American    4 months ago

So much for the left handed relief specialist.  Most managers won’t bring in a lefty who has to face two or three right handed batters if the opposing manager pinch hits for the initial lefty batter.  This rule change totally favors the team at bat. 

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
7.1  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Heartland American @7    4 months ago

No surprise there. Can't brush anyone back. The strike zone is as tall as it is wide now, and they want to get rid of the guy behind the plate and replace him with a computer. They are only pissed at the Astros because they got caught sign stealing.

 
 
 
Sparty On
7.2  Sparty On  replied to  Heartland American @7    4 months ago

Problem is, pitching is a very large part of the reason games are longer.   Relief pitching, especially one inning relief specialists are a relatively new thing.   As pitch counts and relievers started limiting complete games, the game got longer.

 
 
 
Texan1211
8  Texan1211    4 months ago

I'm for speeding up the game, but I don't like this.

How about instead say that pitching changes are limited to two minutes each--from the time the manager signals for the reliever until the first pitch by the new pitcher. No longer a number of warmups pitches but a strict time limit. They already limit mound visits, but they should time them starting when the manager steps on the field. Give the umpire discretion to call a ball after a certain number of tosses to first designed to buy time for a reliever to warm up.

I also think they did this to create more offense--which loads of fans love to see.

I can also see managers loving one aspect of it--they can save some position players since they won't need to pinch-hit so often since there won't be all those righty-lefty switch-ups if pitchers have to throw to three hitters.

Teams might like being able to carry one or two fewer pitchers.

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
8.1  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Texan1211 @8    4 months ago
I also think they did this to create more offense--which loads of fans love to see.

Yes, anything to increase the numbers on offense, while shortening the game. In twenty years, your own pitcher will throw to you. In 40 years, we will be playing team home run derby. 

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
9  seeder  Transyferous Rex    4 months ago
 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
9.1  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Transyferous Rex @9    4 months ago

Assuming the accuracy of the stats

From 1970 to 2019:

length of game has increased roughly 40 minutes.

Runs per game: more now.

Plate Appearances: same.

There are a few stats I wish were tracked here. HRs, K's, BB's. The number of K's and HRs are up. K's take more time than a 2nd pitch ground out to short. 

 
 
 
r.t..b...
9.1.1  r.t..b...  replied to  Transyferous Rex @9.1    4 months ago
length of game has increased roughly 40 minutes.

I know I'm in the minority here, but I'd gladly sit for another 40 minutes with my sons at a ball park on a sunny afternoon with a cold beer or two and no clock determining when we are done. We've never, ever left a game thinking the time we just shared took too long.

 
 
 
Sparty On
9.1.2  Sparty On  replied to  r.t..b... @9.1.1    4 months ago

You are not alone.   We're the ones who get there as soon as the ballpark will let us in.   I love the goings ons before and after the games.   Some of the best stuff can happen then.

I sometimes get bored if we aren't playing well and the weather is bad but i agree .... if the weather is good .... "time" is never bother at all.

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
9.1.3  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  r.t..b... @9.1.1    4 months ago

As Sparty suggests, you are not alone. I enjoy the game. Playing to the "instant gratification" crowd isn't going to increase excitement. 

Electronic ball/strike calls will be used in minor league ball this year. To what end I ask? What are they fixing? I had a friend post a figure, suggesting that hundreds of ball/strike calls were missed by major league umps last year. Oh the horror. Sounds terrible, until you flip it on its head and, after doing the math, realize that more than 95% of the ball/strike calls were right. Plate umpires are part of the game. Period. I hope the electronic crap fails miserably. 

 
 
 
Sparty On
9.1.4  Sparty On  replied to  Transyferous Rex @9.1.3    4 months ago

For my part i'm for anything that helps stop umps from injecting themselves even more on the game.   If you watch the game you know what i'm talking about.   Some of those pricks intentionally make bad calls just to piss others off.   Especially with calling ball and strikes.   Daring players and coaches to argue with them so they can give them the boot.

With that in mind, i'm all for electronic calling of balls and strikes if it works well.   100%

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
9.1.5  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Sparty On @9.1.4    4 months ago

I'll admit that I'm a bit of a romantic. But, if they are missing less than 5% of the calls now...I'm betting that is around the margin of error. But yes, I have seen some flat erroneous calls. 

I played in college, both as a position player and pitcher. I once started a college game with 2 walks, on 8 straight strikes, 7 if I give the guy the benefit of the doubt on the 1st pitch. You'll have a hard time, still, convincing me that I threw 8 straight balls. Only time in my career that I threw more than 2 in a row. Could have used a little more velocity, but control I had. At the time I would have told you it was home cooking for a team that didn't need it. Now, I'll still say there was some cooking, but I'll also admit that my attitude after the 1st pitch fanned the flames.

 
 
 
r.t..b...
9.1.6  r.t..b...  replied to  Transyferous Rex @9.1.3    4 months ago
Plate umpires are part of the game. Period. I hope the electronic crap fails miserably.

Could not agree more. Called hundreds of games from Little League through the H.S. level and never intentionally missed a call, and as you said, it is part of the game.

 
 
 
Sparty On
9.1.7  Sparty On  replied to  Transyferous Rex @9.1.5    4 months ago

Some are really good at calling balls and strikes and rarely intentionally make the wrong call and others not so much.   I bet the % for those bad ones is well above 5%.   Coaches and/or players arguing balls and strikes and you can almost see the sneer behind the mask as they intentionally make the wrong calls.

I tend to be a purist as well but i hate it when umps make bad calls and thumb their noses at the player and coaches.    Sincerely honest mistakes will be made but the intentional ones are as heinous as it gets IMO.

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
9.1.8  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Sparty On @9.1.7    4 months ago

According to this "massive" study, umpires missed 34,294 ball/strike calls in 2018. Assuming that number is correct, and the numbers of the other link above are correct, 34,294 out of 721,496 pitches in 2018 is 4.75%.

https://brobible.com/sports/article/study-umpires-missed-ball-strike-calls/

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
9.1.9  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Sparty On @9.1.7    4 months ago
Coaches and/or players arguing balls and strikes and you can almost see the sneer behind the mask as they intentionally make the wrong calls.

Right, I didn't help my cause in the story relayed. Oddly, for as cocky a player as I was, it goes right though me when one of my little players makes any motion in apparent attempt to show up an ump. 

 
 
 
Sparty On
9.1.10  Sparty On  replied to  Transyferous Rex @9.1.8    4 months ago

I'd be really interested how they came up with that number.   Specifically, who decided the calls were good or bad.

 
 
 
Sparty On
9.1.11  Sparty On  replied to  Transyferous Rex @9.1.9    4 months ago

I played a bit of ball, shortstop, up through a semi-pro league unaffiliated with college or MLB after HS.

Like the other sports i always tried to take the high road, "act like you been there" attitude and that is what i passed on to the little leaguers i coached back in the day.    In other words don't argue balls and strikes, let the coach do that.   However, watching MLB, sometimes the calls are so egregious i don't blame any player from getting hot.   And i'm not talking the occasional bad call, that happens.   I'm talking when the bad calls keep coming and coming and coming.

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
9.1.12  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Sparty On @9.1.11    3 months ago

I wouldn't say that I watch a ton of pro ball, but I watch every chance I get. If we are being honest, I'd say that I have been impressed a lot of times, especially lately, since they started putting the strike zone/hit trax on the screen. I think they have upped their game a bit. 

We will see. I think the zone is too tight as it is. Anymore, these guys piss and moan about balls on the knees, which are and always have been strikes. They also piss and moan about anything above the belt. Hell, as a pitcher, you are trying to keep the ball out of the zone today's hitters are bitching about being strikes. 

 
 
 
Sparty On
9.1.13  Sparty On  replied to  Transyferous Rex @9.1.12    3 months ago
I think the zone is too tight as it is

Lol ... spoken like a true pitcher but i agree.   The strike is nothing like it was when i played .... it's much, much smaller.

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
9.1.14  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Sparty On @9.1.13    3 months ago

It is the height of hypocrisy. At the same time hoping the pitcher serves one up on the middle inside half around the numbers, and arguing the called strike when you don't swing at it. 

Look at where the game is. The zone is smaller, you can't knock anyone down, or even appear to be knocking anyone down, and batting averages are still on the decline. Can you imagine Bob Gibson pitching today?

Regardless, this is the worst time of the year. 

 
 
 
Sparty On
9.1.15  Sparty On  replied to  Transyferous Rex @9.1.14    3 months ago

I never liked the bean ball thing.   A brush back is one thing but intentional beaners?  

If a pitcher can intentionally hit a batter, then the batter should be able to run out and try to put a beating on that pitcher.   Seems fair to me but probably not to you since you were a pitcher.

jrSmiley_9_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
9.1.16  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Sparty On @9.1.15    3 months ago

Well...I was both. I'll admit that I was conscious about not showing anyone up, either from the mound or at the plate though. 

I've intentionally hit, and been intentionally hit. But I agree, nothing wrong with chin music. 

One of the guys I grew up watching found out it may be best to trot on down to first. 

 
 
 
Sparty On
10  Sparty On    4 months ago

If they are trying to get more people to ballgames this ain't gonna do it.   Try lowering ticket and concession prices.  

Most MLB parks have pretty much priced themselves out of the common mans price range.

 
 
 
Transyferous Rex
10.1  seeder  Transyferous Rex  replied to  Sparty On @10    4 months ago

Yes.  

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
11  Sean Treacy    4 months ago

I'm ambivalent about the change but it doesn't get to the root of the problem.  It's the time between pitches that has increased dramatically. Mike Hargrove used to be called the human rain delay because of the time he took to reset (fidgeting with batting glvoes etc...) in the box between pitches.  Now his routine is the norm. Combine that with the pitchers taking longer and longer between pitches and baseball has become a contest of who can delay longer between pitches.

Baseball needs a pitch clock and hitters shouldn't be able to leave the box if they haven't swung.  That's the only way you'll get the pace back to what it was. 

 
 
 
Tacos!
12  Tacos!    4 months ago

I found a fun article on the length of games.

WHY BASEBALL GAMES ARE SO DAMNED LONG

It's a single sample study comparing two games - one from 1984 and one from 2014. In most respects, the games were pretty close to identical but the 2014 game took a half hour longer.

Pitching changes doesn't seem to be the culprit because the two games had the same number of changes. The primary villain appears to be basic lollygagging between pitches.

 
 
 
Sparty On
12.1  Sparty On  replied to  Tacos! @12    4 months ago

I hate Lollygaggers

 
 
 
Goodtime Charlie
13  Goodtime Charlie    4 months ago

Mariano Rivera largely regarded as the best relief pitcher in the history of MLB had 652 career saves 406 of the saves came in games where he faced just one or two batters. If the new rule was in effect during the years he pitched I seriously doubt he would have finished his career anywhere's close to 652 saves, he probably would have been lucky to have 500.

Rivera comes into a game in the 9th inning with 2 outs, a 2 run lead and nobody on base. He throws one pitch gets a fly or ground ball out earning the save, that's ridiculous. The new rule will count down on bogus saves, I like it.

 
 
 
arkpdx
14  arkpdx    4 months ago

I have an idea! LEAVE THE DAMNED RULES ALONE!

 
 
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