I really don't want to get into a debate on this; but you are oversimplifying things.
1) Palestinians have to get along with each other first. That means the PA and Hamas (and all of the other factions) need to decide and abide by one leader (or governmental body); one set of laws, and one agenda. (Good luck. Might has well ask the Iranian militias and ISIS/ISIL to hug it out).
2) The surrounding countries have to be willing to absorb the Palestinian populations living within their borders. Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, and Israel must make full citizens of any Palestinians within their countries; with full rights and voting privileges. Even if the Palestinians eventually get their own state it will never be big enough in terms of territory; or stable enough economically; to support all of their population living in other countries.
3) Israel has to allow a viable Palestinian state to exist. There can be no viable state with the way things are now. Which means all Israeli settlements in the West Bank must go. There must be a corridor between the West Bank and Gaza; with free and unrestricted travel for Palestinians between the two. Palestinians must have free and equal access to the Port in Gaza, and to the waters beyond. Israel also needs to work a viable water deal with the Palestinians. Instead of stealing the water from beneath them- and forcing the Palestinians to pay for water from desalination plants operated and owned by Israel. The Palestinian state must have free and unrestricted air space- which means no Israeli military aircraft constantly patrolling it.
4) Jordan is not Palestine; and neither is Syria or Lebanon. None of those countries want the economic, military, or security concerns of being responsible for Palestinians that are at war with each other; and Israel, over whatever land Israel decides to leave them. There is no folding Palestinian land and people into any of those countries.
I was very involved with the Palestinian struggle in the 80's and 90's. I knew several Palestinian exchange students in both high school and college. One of my best friends in college was mostly Palestinian (he was a US citizen with family members in the occupied territories). Did the whole charity drives, donations, and sending of care packages while trying to abide by the ever changing Israeli rules on what goods could be sent; and how they needed to be sent. I was even planning a trip to the occupied lands to meet the families of the people I knew. Luckily I grew out of it in 2000.
The Palestinians are their own worst enemy; and that will never change. Israel will simply continue to confiscate land on the West Bank until they get borders they think they can maintain. They will then force out all of the Palestinians behind their set line into whatever territory remains. Look to the "separation wall" the Israelis are building in the West Bank as to what might remain for a Palestinian state. That is assuming they don't alter it to include more Israeli settlements.
Take into consideration also that BLM supports BDS (an organization devoted to the destruction of Israel) which is why although I am supportive of most of the causes of black people, they can shove their BLM up their asses.
what i want to know us why are they protesting here?
Because it is a concern for them and they live in Chicago.
The US has backed, given loan guarantees, sold arms to the Israelis. For whatever reason, the US has done this despite the actions of the Israelis to colonize the West Bank and create a de facto enlargement of the country, actions which are illegal per the UN.
In short, if it were not for the US backing, the Israelis would not be in the position that they are now in, and that is why they are protesting.
maybe they should hop a plane to the middle east.
Maybe you should be more considerate of other people and try to understand why they do not see the world as you do.
And maybe you should learn a little GENUINE history of the region, why in fact the US DOES back Israel, and not believe the lying propaganda of Palestinians like Hanna Shawari who says the Palestinians are the indigenous people of Israel and the Jewa are no more than colonists who only came there after WW2.
With all due respect, you are not an unbiased observer. I have been watching this for years and there is no side that is pure. It is obvious to me that not enough pain and suffering have been felt by either side, or at least the leadership thereof, for either one to accept any compromise.
IMO, the Israelis smell the eventual end of the conflict in the continued settlement of the West Bank. But more importantly, the shift to the right of the governments of both, aided and abetted by the combined actions of Prime Minister Netanyahu since before the turn of the century and the inconsistent, squabbling approach of the PLO/Hamas makes the polarizing effects of the conflict more severe. Netanyahu has never been pro-peace, and has used the conflict to his political advantage to remain in power. Hamas will exist for as long as Palestinians feel they have been wronged by the Israeli government. The responses of both sides lead to more conflict.
So, in this game of attrition, what do we do? Do we attempt to work it out, or do we continue down the path chosen by people whose main interest is in remaining in power, ie. fight to the death, because that gives those leaders more political traction? As long as this remains the predominant narrative of the conflict, there can be no peace. We should be trying to change the narrative, the story told around and about the conflict, not doubling down on either position, because, quite frankly, both positions do have merit, both positions are "right", but, as we can see by the continuing conflict, both are "wrong" also.
Right now, it would appear that Israel has constructed a caste system all it's own where the Upper Castes are Right leaning Zionists and the lowest are the Palestinians, whose comings and goings are largely controlled by the Israeli government. There is little wonder that the coals of the fire keep getting stirred up. The Israeli response to these stirrings is so disproportionate that the conflict has become a self perpetuating problem. Until a majority of people on all sides of the issue feel that getting together and talking it out is a better idea than fighting with their neighbors, there will be no peace. As long as the political will is not there, then there will be no peace.
You are right, I AM biased. IMO, when the Palestinians walked away from offers made to them of 95% then 97% of their demands, without even negotiating, making it clear that they will only be satisfied if they have it ALL, they sure as hell lost any sympathy I might have had.
Well, The Jodan Option is pie in the sky, but since the whole world seems to be supporting the Palestinians in their struggle against the big bad Jews, I don't think there will be peace for a long long time, certainly not during my lifetime.
An example of why there is such support of the Palestinians? It's their narrative that is believed and repeated by the mainstream media and most nations and the United Nations and the ICC. I'll give you an example. Obviously China supports the Palestinian narrative. I watched an English language program on CGTN (China Global Television Network) called The Heat. More than half the program was an interview allowing the Palestinians' best mouthpiece, Hanan Ashrawi, spout her propaganda before a panel that had mostly Palestinian supporters on it were allowed to comment. When she said that the Palestinians were the indigenous people of all of Palestine and the Jews were just colonists who came after WW2, and the interviewer sat there like a bump on a log, I jumped up and screamed: "Where was the Temple of David that you buried under your Al Aqsa Mosque built? Mexico? Where was Jesus of Nazereth born and lived? Greenland?" 3000 years of Jewish history in Israel wiped off with a dirty rag. God damn it - the problem is that the general ignorance of the facts and latent Jew hatred cancels any semblance of reason and intelligence.
despite the actions of the Israelis to colonize the West Bank and create a de facto enlargement of the country
Question: If Israel were to end their occupation of The West Bank (which is what they did in Gaza) and return the West bank to its previous rulers-- who would get it?
At one point Israel occupied Gaza but, but they voluntarily ended their occupation of Gaza and totally withdrew-- currently there's not a single Jew in the entire place. The "Palestinians" in Gaza now have complete and total self rule.
But since those rulers aren't ordinary people but rather members of an extremely violent terrorist organization who has vowed to eliminate the Jews from the area-- what can we do?
"Negotiate" with them in an attempt to convince them to stop being terrorists? Good luck with that!
Once again, and with all due respect, this conflict did not start thousands of years ago. It started after the turn of the 20th century.
The present day conflict began when Zionists started moving into, colonizing, the lands that they considered holy and theirs by right. (long before WWII) The hell with the people who had lived their for a generation or much longer, it was "theirs" by divine right. The British and the French thought nothing of this and divided the territory after WWI as the spoils of the old Austro-Hungarian Empire.
Seen from your perspective, all seems well. Jewish people from all over moving back to their "homeland" in the middle east. Seen from the perspective of someone who had been comfortably living in the region for several generations, it can be seen as an invading force. Just ask any of our indigenous peoples on NT.
So, you have to ask yourself if it is in fact worth all of the BS that you need to go through to get this tiny piece of land that is religiously 'Yours" while actually not "yours" any more?
Probably for the same reason that some other people don't comprehend that Israelis have a right to live just like the Palestinians!
So the Palestinians get to control the comings and goings of the Israelis.... how does that work? Is it on a population basis or a territorial control basis?
As long as they are viewed as being terrorists instead of human beings, you will have conflict. The reasons for the conflict can and will change, but the underlying precedent of one group being "Right" and one group (definitionally) being "Wrong" will never produce peace, because we are taking two groups of humans and telling one that they are better, intrinsically, than the other.
So you choose to ignore the Jews who lived there for thousands of years. Yes, Zionists moved to Israel from Europe and elsewhere, just as immigrants move to countries all over the world. But SO DID THE ARABS. They came from Jordan, where most of their ancestors lived, and other surrounding countries to work for the Jews who had developed farms and businesses there. Even Arafat, the "ultimate" Palestinian was EGYPTIAN. Partition was passed by the UN, with the concept that Israel would be the Jewish Homeland. Go back to the UN to reverse that, and watch the movie Exodus while you're at it..
Fundamentally, this is about Hamas and its dedication, in word and deed, to destroying the Jewish state and murdering Jews . And it is about basic morality. Mon, May 17, 2021
I guess they are protesting the reality of the world and that the last 70 years isn’t going to change? Motherfuckers need to accept Israel isn’t going anywhere, Palestine is not going to be a thing (at least not in the way they imagine) and that their constant hostility towards Israel will only result in the lives of the Palestinians continuing to suck ass.
As I have said before, let them do whatever to each other, I am well beyond caring at this point. If neither side is willing to embrace a reasonable (especially Palestinians) solution then fuck them both and whatever happens happens.
Palestinians already have 100% self government in Gaza. (IMO it already is an independent country-- its just that Palestinians don't want to admit it).
Since an independent Palestinian state now already exists, the question is-- whether or not the country of Palestine will get more territory (i.e. the area currently referred to as "the West bank").
From what I am hearing it is the ultra orthodox Jews causing problems within Israel.
They are ones pushing to have the Palestinians evicted from Jerusalem.
They are also targeting the Kenesit and gradually being voted in so they eventually will be come the majourity.
Their plan is then to bring in the equivalent of Sharia law in Israel??? Not sure what that exactly involves..but stoning cars is certainly up there on the Sabbath..
When I was there the general view of the average Israeli was they hated/disliked the orthodox Jews.
Buzz anyone heard or read similar?? I back the Israelis always have and hope somehow this latest stoush calms down.
Yes we had a demo here to. I think about a hundred rolled up down Melbourne. Did the usual chants, flag burning and were basically ignored... One did get arrested for the flag burning..a middle aged woman old enough to know better.
Think the world has enough on its hands.. without this at the moment..
I have absolutely no love for the ultra-Orthodox myself, and can tell you of some personal experiences for why I feel that way, but then I have no love for radical extremists of ANY religion or kind or in ANY place, and that includes where I am now. However, Shona1, I would like you to read the ACTUAL legal history of the eviction situation that started the whole fracas, and maybe you will discover where the REAL fault lay. I posted this on another article on NT about this issue. The media and most everyone else are always quick to blame Israel for everything.
No must admit I am not particularly fussed with the ultra orthodox either from my experience in Israel with them.
If they get into power then it really will hit the fan over there.but that is exactly what they are planning to do..
Yes it is much the same here, the radicals and ferals always blame Israel for everything..but most of the time with the Palestinians it is self inflicted and then they play the victim..and they do it so well.
Found the normal average everyday Israeli lovely people and that includes many soldiers I spoke to. Often stopped me in the street and asked where I was from and wished me well on my travels..
Felt perfectly safe there even though fighting was going on with Syria at the time... another mob I would not trust as far as I could throw them..
Thanks for the article.. nothing like the truth getting in the way of a good story as they say...hope all well your way as it is here..
Felt perfectly safe there even though fighting was going on with Syria at the time... another mob I would not trust as far as I could throw them..
Well, the ongoing war in Yemen is much, much worse than anything that's happening in Yemen....but much of the politically correct western media doesn't give it much coverage (probably most Americans don't even know these ongoing atrocities don't even exist):
And then there are the horrors of the ongoing horrors of the mass murders by the corrupt gov't in Myanmar. But for some reasons, much of our media prefers to focus on the Arab-Israeli crisis:
But for some reasons, much of our media prefers to focus on the Arab-Israeli crisis:
And of course they obsess over their belief that Israel has too much land (Arab countries shown in green, Israel and the YUGE amount of Arab land they "illegally occupy" shown in red)
And of course they obsess over their belief that Israel has too much land (Arab countries shown in green, Israel and the YUGE amount of Arab land they "illegally occupy" shown in red)
Note: That map only show the 20 or so Arab countries. It does not show all of the 50+ Muslim majority countries (for example, 3 major powers in the region that are not Arab but are Muslim majority countries (enemies of Israel) are Pakistan, Turkey, and Iran-- all large countries as well as military powers.
And then there Indonesia....and ....
Yet many fell that Israel (the entire country is about the size of New Jersey) has too much land...
I just read that and election overseeing committee has determined that there was NO election fraud, a falsehood that was relied upon by the Myanmar military as the excuse for their coup. Do you think they will now reinstate the democratic government?
IMO, where this latest deadly conflict is different than the last two is the part of this war is taking place within Israel between neighbors (Arabs and Jews) this takes the latest conflict to a whole other level. Bibi has said he would use an iron fist to stop the attacks between citizens of Israel.
IMO, where this latest deadly conflict is different than the last two is the part of this war is taking place within Israel between neighbors (Arabs and Jews) this takes the latest conflict to a whole other level. Bibi has said he would use an iron fist to stop the attacks between citizens of Israel.
Netanyahu used to be a much more sensible guy. But in recent years he has not handled things very well.
Netanyahu used to be a much more sensible guy. But in recent years he has not handled things very well.
From my point of view, it seems that Netanyahu was aligned himself with the far-right within Israel. He has not been able to form a government for the last two elections. Is it the right-wing that is keeping him in place, has that become his base?
If that is correct I really don't see any end to the conflict. I'm not excusing Hamas nor Palestine as they bear a huge amount of blame for this but if he is totally aligned with the far-right then if there is ever a minute chance for a settlement from the Palie side it can't happen with the far right in Israel.
As I stated in my above comment, a civil war is brewing inside of Israel, that is the worse thing that could happen.
I have seen reports over the years stating that Netanyahu is a racist who comes from a racist family and I have no reason to doubt it based on how he behaves at times.
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
I was a little taken back by how big this protest was. The overhead helicopter shot by local news appeared to show thousands of protesters.
umm, this YouTube video is from 2014
I guess the more things change the more they stay the same. I didnt loook at the dat on the video because I searched You Tube for "past 24 hours".
Anyway, here is a photo from yesterday
Huge Crowd Marches Through Downtown Chicago In Support Of Palestine (blockclubchicago.org)
seems like people just have way too much time on their hands.
I wonder what they think it will accomplish?
I’m surprised they haven’t starting looting. Maybe when it gets dark.
Fuckin a.
No masks of course.
well. it IS Chicago, after all.
So they support a terrorist organization?
Holy smoke, I actually agree with Greg Jones on something.
I'm beginning to think that possible lingering side effects from being infected by the coronavirus must be either stupidity or insanity.
At the 2:30 - 3:00 mark or so they are walking past the spot where Ferris Buehler sings Twist And Shout in the movie
The only thing stopping the Palestinians from living in an independent, organized, peaceful country of their own, is . . . the Palestinians.
I really don't want to get into a debate on this; but you are oversimplifying things.
1) Palestinians have to get along with each other first. That means the PA and Hamas (and all of the other factions) need to decide and abide by one leader (or governmental body); one set of laws, and one agenda. (Good luck. Might has well ask the Iranian militias and ISIS/ISIL to hug it out).
2) The surrounding countries have to be willing to absorb the Palestinian populations living within their borders. Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, and Israel must make full citizens of any Palestinians within their countries; with full rights and voting privileges. Even if the Palestinians eventually get their own state it will never be big enough in terms of territory; or stable enough economically; to support all of their population living in other countries.
3) Israel has to allow a viable Palestinian state to exist. There can be no viable state with the way things are now. Which means all Israeli settlements in the West Bank must go. There must be a corridor between the West Bank and Gaza; with free and unrestricted travel for Palestinians between the two. Palestinians must have free and equal access to the Port in Gaza, and to the waters beyond. Israel also needs to work a viable water deal with the Palestinians. Instead of stealing the water from beneath them- and forcing the Palestinians to pay for water from desalination plants operated and owned by Israel. The Palestinian state must have free and unrestricted air space- which means no Israeli military aircraft constantly patrolling it.
4) Jordan is not Palestine; and neither is Syria or Lebanon. None of those countries want the economic, military, or security concerns of being responsible for Palestinians that are at war with each other; and Israel, over whatever land Israel decides to leave them. There is no folding Palestinian land and people into any of those countries.
I was very involved with the Palestinian struggle in the 80's and 90's. I knew several Palestinian exchange students in both high school and college. One of my best friends in college was mostly Palestinian (he was a US citizen with family members in the occupied territories). Did the whole charity drives, donations, and sending of care packages while trying to abide by the ever changing Israeli rules on what goods could be sent; and how they needed to be sent. I was even planning a trip to the occupied lands to meet the families of the people I knew. Luckily I grew out of it in 2000.
The Palestinians are their own worst enemy; and that will never change. Israel will simply continue to confiscate land on the West Bank until they get borders they think they can maintain. They will then force out all of the Palestinians behind their set line into whatever territory remains. Look to the "separation wall" the Israelis are building in the West Bank as to what might remain for a Palestinian state. That is assuming they don't alter it to include more Israeli settlements.
I wish I had your ability to know what is supposed to and what will happen.
The size of the protest isn't that surprising since the Palestinian population of Chicago is 85,000.
Most of the people in the protest do appear to be Arab.
Take into consideration also that BLM supports BDS (an organization devoted to the destruction of Israel) which is why although I am supportive of most of the causes of black people, they can shove their BLM up their asses.
what i want to know us why are they protesting here?
we aren't the ones doing anything
maybe they should hop a plane to the middle east.
Agreed, but with one-way tickets.
Because it is a concern for them and they live in Chicago.
The US has backed, given loan guarantees, sold arms to the Israelis. For whatever reason, the US has done this despite the actions of the Israelis to colonize the West Bank and create a de facto enlargement of the country, actions which are illegal per the UN.
In short, if it were not for the US backing, the Israelis would not be in the position that they are now in, and that is why they are protesting.
Maybe you should be more considerate of other people and try to understand why they do not see the world as you do.
Palestinians have a right to live just like the Israelis.
Why is that so hard for some people to comprehend?
And maybe you should learn a little GENUINE history of the region, why in fact the US DOES back Israel, and not believe the lying propaganda of Palestinians like Hanna Shawari who says the Palestinians are the indigenous people of Israel and the Jewa are no more than colonists who only came there after WW2.
Buzz,
With all due respect, you are not an unbiased observer. I have been watching this for years and there is no side that is pure. It is obvious to me that not enough pain and suffering have been felt by either side, or at least the leadership thereof, for either one to accept any compromise.
IMO, the Israelis smell the eventual end of the conflict in the continued settlement of the West Bank. But more importantly, the shift to the right of the governments of both, aided and abetted by the combined actions of Prime Minister Netanyahu since before the turn of the century and the inconsistent, squabbling approach of the PLO/Hamas makes the polarizing effects of the conflict more severe. Netanyahu has never been pro-peace, and has used the conflict to his political advantage to remain in power. Hamas will exist for as long as Palestinians feel they have been wronged by the Israeli government. The responses of both sides lead to more conflict.
So, in this game of attrition, what do we do? Do we attempt to work it out, or do we continue down the path chosen by people whose main interest is in remaining in power, ie. fight to the death, because that gives those leaders more political traction? As long as this remains the predominant narrative of the conflict, there can be no peace. We should be trying to change the narrative, the story told around and about the conflict, not doubling down on either position, because, quite frankly, both positions do have merit, both positions are "right", but, as we can see by the continuing conflict, both are "wrong" also.
Right now, it would appear that Israel has constructed a caste system all it's own where the Upper Castes are Right leaning Zionists and the lowest are the Palestinians, whose comings and goings are largely controlled by the Israeli government. There is little wonder that the coals of the fire keep getting stirred up. The Israeli response to these stirrings is so disproportionate that the conflict has become a self perpetuating problem. Until a majority of people on all sides of the issue feel that getting together and talking it out is a better idea than fighting with their neighbors, there will be no peace. As long as the political will is not there, then there will be no peace.
You are right, I AM biased. IMO, when the Palestinians walked away from offers made to them of 95% then 97% of their demands, without even negotiating, making it clear that they will only be satisfied if they have it ALL, they sure as hell lost any sympathy I might have had.
But what about Gaza?
Probably for the same reason that some other people don't comprehend that Israelis have a right to live just like the Palestinians!
So what is the answer? How do we get to peace?
Yes, what about Gaza?
The Jordan Option.
Well, The Jodan Option is pie in the sky, but since the whole world seems to be supporting the Palestinians in their struggle against the big bad Jews, I don't think there will be peace for a long long time, certainly not during my lifetime.
An example of why there is such support of the Palestinians? It's their narrative that is believed and repeated by the mainstream media and most nations and the United Nations and the ICC. I'll give you an example. Obviously China supports the Palestinian narrative. I watched an English language program on CGTN (China Global Television Network) called The Heat. More than half the program was an interview allowing the Palestinians' best mouthpiece, Hanan Ashrawi, spout her propaganda before a panel that had mostly Palestinian supporters on it were allowed to comment. When she said that the Palestinians were the indigenous people of all of Palestine and the Jews were just colonists who came after WW2, and the interviewer sat there like a bump on a log, I jumped up and screamed: "Where was the Temple of David that you buried under your Al Aqsa Mosque built? Mexico? Where was Jesus of Nazereth born and lived? Greenland?" 3000 years of Jewish history in Israel wiped off with a dirty rag. God damn it - the problem is that the general ignorance of the facts and latent Jew hatred cancels any semblance of reason and intelligence.
Question: If Israel were to end their occupation of The West Bank (which is what they did in Gaza) and return the West bank to its previous rulers-- who would get it?
Sounds like a nonstarter to me:
Link
We don't.
At one point Israel occupied Gaza but, but they voluntarily ended their occupation of Gaza and totally withdrew-- currently there's not a single Jew in the entire place. The "Palestinians" in Gaza now have complete and total self rule.
But since those rulers aren't ordinary people but rather members of an extremely violent terrorist organization who has vowed to eliminate the Jews from the area-- what can we do?
"Negotiate" with them in an attempt to convince them to stop being terrorists?
Good luck with that!
Well, the "Palestinians" are always playing the victim card, complaining that they don't have their own state. But they do...its Gaza!
Yes-- they've had their own country (Gaza) since the Israelis voluntarily withdrew from Gaza totally completely (in 2005) ,thus allowing the "Palestinians" to have their own country!
(of course what they did when they got self rukle was to put a barbaric terrorist group in power (Hamas).
Buzz,
Once again, and with all due respect, this conflict did not start thousands of years ago. It started after the turn of the 20th century.
The present day conflict began when Zionists started moving into, colonizing, the lands that they considered holy and theirs by right. (long before WWII) The hell with the people who had lived their for a generation or much longer, it was "theirs" by divine right. The British and the French thought nothing of this and divided the territory after WWI as the spoils of the old Austro-Hungarian Empire.
Seen from your perspective, all seems well. Jewish people from all over moving back to their "homeland" in the middle east. Seen from the perspective of someone who had been comfortably living in the region for several generations, it can be seen as an invading force. Just ask any of our indigenous peoples on NT.
So, you have to ask yourself if it is in fact worth all of the BS that you need to go through to get this tiny piece of land that is religiously 'Yours" while actually not "yours" any more?
Are they free to come and go as they please?
So the Palestinians get to control the comings and goings of the Israelis.... how does that work? Is it on a population basis or a territorial control basis?
Krish,
As long as they are viewed as being terrorists instead of human beings, you will have conflict. The reasons for the conflict can and will change, but the underlying precedent of one group being "Right" and one group (definitionally) being "Wrong" will never produce peace, because we are taking two groups of humans and telling one that they are better, intrinsically, than the other.
So you choose to ignore the Jews who lived there for thousands of years. Yes, Zionists moved to Israel from Europe and elsewhere, just as immigrants move to countries all over the world. But SO DID THE ARABS. They came from Jordan, where most of their ancestors lived, and other surrounding countries to work for the Jews who had developed farms and businesses there. Even Arafat, the "ultimate" Palestinian was EGYPTIAN. Partition was passed by the UN, with the concept that Israel would be the Jewish Homeland. Go back to the UN to reverse that, and watch the movie Exodus while you're at it..
Why Are They Fighting in the Middle East? Because Hamas Is ...
.
I guess they are protesting the reality of the world and that the last 70 years isn’t going to change? Motherfuckers need to accept Israel isn’t going anywhere, Palestine is not going to be a thing (at least not in the way they imagine) and that their constant hostility towards Israel will only result in the lives of the Palestinians continuing to suck ass.
As I have said before, let them do whatever to each other, I am well beyond caring at this point. If neither side is willing to embrace a reasonable (especially Palestinians) solution then fuck them both and whatever happens happens.
Palestinians already have 100% self government in Gaza. (IMO it already is an independent country-- its just that Palestinians don't want to admit it).
Since an independent Palestinian state now already exists, the question is-- whether or not the country of Palestine will get more territory (i.e. the area currently referred to as "the West bank").
Sad to see once again trouble flaring over there.
From what I am hearing it is the ultra orthodox Jews causing problems within Israel.
They are ones pushing to have the Palestinians evicted from Jerusalem.
They are also targeting the Kenesit and gradually being voted in so they eventually will be come the majourity.
Their plan is then to bring in the equivalent of Sharia law in Israel??? Not sure what that exactly involves..but stoning cars is certainly up there on the Sabbath..
When I was there the general view of the average Israeli was they hated/disliked the orthodox Jews.
Buzz anyone heard or read similar?? I back the Israelis always have and hope somehow this latest stoush calms down.
Yes we had a demo here to. I think about a hundred rolled up down Melbourne. Did the usual chants, flag burning and were basically ignored... One did get arrested for the flag burning..a middle aged woman old enough to know better.
Think the world has enough on its hands.. without this at the moment..
I have absolutely no love for the ultra-Orthodox myself, and can tell you of some personal experiences for why I feel that way, but then I have no love for radical extremists of ANY religion or kind or in ANY place, and that includes where I am now. However, Shona1, I would like you to read the ACTUAL legal history of the eviction situation that started the whole fracas, and maybe you will discover where the REAL fault lay. I posted this on another article on NT about this issue. The media and most everyone else are always quick to blame Israel for everything.
No must admit I am not particularly fussed with the ultra orthodox either from my experience in Israel with them.
If they get into power then it really will hit the fan over there.but that is exactly what they are planning to do..
Yes it is much the same here, the radicals and ferals always blame Israel for everything..but most of the time with the Palestinians it is self inflicted and then they play the victim..and they do it so well.
Found the normal average everyday Israeli lovely people and that includes many soldiers I spoke to. Often stopped me in the street and asked where I was from and wished me well on my travels..
Felt perfectly safe there even though fighting was going on with Syria at the time... another mob I would not trust as far as I could throw them..
Thanks for the article.. nothing like the truth getting in the way of a good story as they say...hope all well your way as it is here..
Well, the ongoing war in Yemen is much, much worse than anything that's happening in Yemen....but much of the politically correct western media doesn't give it much coverage (probably most Americans don't even know these ongoing atrocities don't even exist):
And then there are the horrors of the ongoing horrors of the mass murders by the corrupt gov't in Myanmar. But for some reasons, much of our media prefers to focus on the Arab-Israeli crisis:
Unreported World is on the frontline in Myanmar, where the military has killed hundreds of people after arresting and locking up the country's democratically elected leaders.
And of course they obsess over their belief that Israel has too much land (Arab countries shown in green, Israel and the YUGE amount of Arab land they "illegally occupy" shown in red)
Note: That map only show the 20 or so Arab countries. It does not show all of the 50+ Muslim majority countries (for example, 3 major powers in the region that are not Arab but are Muslim majority countries (enemies of Israel) are Pakistan, Turkey, and Iran-- all large countries as well as military powers.
And then there Indonesia....and ....
Yet many fell that Israel (the entire country is about the size of New Jersey) has too much land...
Why?
I just read that and election overseeing committee has determined that there was NO election fraud, a falsehood that was relied upon by the Myanmar military as the excuse for their coup. Do you think they will now reinstate the democratic government?
IMO, where this latest deadly conflict is different than the last two is the part of this war is taking place within Israel between neighbors (Arabs and Jews) this takes the latest conflict to a whole other level. Bibi has said he would use an iron fist to stop the attacks between citizens of Israel.
Netanyahu used to be a much more sensible guy. But in recent years he has not handled things very well.
From my point of view, it seems that Netanyahu was aligned himself with the far-right within Israel. He has not been able to form a government for the last two elections. Is it the right-wing that is keeping him in place, has that become his base?
If that is correct I really don't see any end to the conflict. I'm not excusing Hamas nor Palestine as they bear a huge amount of blame for this but if he is totally aligned with the far-right then if there is ever a minute chance for a settlement from the Palie side it can't happen with the far right in Israel.
As I stated in my above comment, a civil war is brewing inside of Israel, that is the worse thing that could happen.
JMO
I have seen reports over the years stating that Netanyahu is a racist who comes from a racist family and I have no reason to doubt it based on how he behaves at times.