MERCED, Calif. — Jeff Marchini and others in the Central Valley here bet their farms on the election of Donald J. Trump. His message of reducing regulations and taxes appealed to this Republican stronghold, one of Mr. Trump’s strongest bases of support in the state.
As for his promises about cracking down on illegal immigrants, many assumed Mr. Trump’s pledges were mostly just talk. But two weeks into his administration, Mr. Trump has signed executive orders that have upended the country’s immigration laws. Now farmers here are deeply alarmed about what the new policies could mean for their workers, most of whom are unauthorized, and the businesses that depend on them.
“Everything’s coming so quickly,” Mr. Marchini said. “We’re not loading people into buses or deporting them, that’s not happening yet.” As he looked out over a crew of workers bent over as they rifled through muddy leaves to find purple heads of radicchio, he said that as a businessman, Mr. Trump would know that farmers had invested millions of dollars into produce that is growing right now, and that not being able to pick and sell those crops would represent huge losses for the state economy. “I’m confident that he can grasp the magnitude and the anxiety of what’s happening now.”
Mr. Trump’s immigration policies could transform California’s Central Valley, a stretch of lowlands that extends from Sacramento to Bakersfield. Approximately 70 percent of all farmworkers here are living in the United States illegally, according to researchers at University of California, Davis. The impact could reverberate throughout the valley’s precarious economy, where agriculture is by far the largest industry. With 6.5 million people living in the valley, the fields in this state bring in $35 billion a year and provide more of the nation’s food than any other state.
The consequences of a smaller immigrant work force would ripple not just through the orchards and dairies, but also to locally owned businesses, restaurants, schools and even seemingly unrelated industries, like the insurance market.
link to complete article.https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/09/us/california-farmers-backed-trump-but-now-fear-losing-field-workers.html?_r=0
Unintended consequences.
"But two weeks into his administration, Mr. Trump has signed executive orders that have upended the country’s immigration laws."
Correction. Trump is enforcing the existing immigration laws.
But, but what about all those republican farmers, insurance dealers, car dealers that knowingly hired, and sold to them...LOCK'EM UP.
As a aside, California exported $23 billion worth of agricultural products in 2015....
"But, but what about all those republican farmers, insurance dealers, car dealers that knowingly hired, and sold to them...LOCK'EM UP."
Democrats don't hire illegal aliens? Are your sanctuary cities a sham?
The article is about the Trump voters in central CA., Cerenkov.
Do you have anything to say regarding the article? Give it a try, I think that you can do it.
BTW, I don't live in a sanctuary city nor do I support them...Again your assuming, not a smart thing to do.
Are you having a hard time reading the quotation I replied to? Not smart.
Not at all Cerenkov....
And your thoughts on the article regarding the farmers, illegal field workers are what?
My thoughts are that illegal aliens should not be here. I also think we should expand provisions for migrant labor. Finally, I think that the lack of illegal aliens and legal migrant aliens would lead to increased food cost and more automation.
Ok Randy, what do you think will happen if Trumps deportation order does take all the CA. (and other states) field workers.
If you don't believe it will happen use by question as a ''what if'' question.
As a "what if" (since I know it won't happen) The vegetable and fruit fields will rot because Americans will not do the work at any reasonable pay. We'll import our tomatoes at $20 a piece for decent ones and $10 for a good bunch of grapes...from Mexico. Nothing will hurt the American agricultural economy and help the Mexican, Ecuadorian and Costa Rica, Peruvian economy like kicking illegal farm worker out of the USA. Might just as well hand them our fields.
I tend to agree with you Randy.
In addition, many of those farmers will lose their farms, the economy will tank and we'll be importing more of our food than we are now.
And because of money alone, some of the greatest land in the San Joaquin Valley will lay fallow. Able to produce a
massive quantity of food for the world, but unable to because of Trump American agricultural polices.
He is simply too ignorant to do his job.
You could always get a job there and do some good for your country.
Dean, the article isn't about Randy..
What are your thoughts on the article?
The article is about less than a dozen the rest of the Republicans they do not represent.
I believe in open borders and no welfare state as Milton Friedman explained you can't have both open borders and a welfare state. It is one thing to come to work and another to come and be eligible for free crap at the expense of others.
That is true, but it does show that there are serious concerns in the valley area of CA.
It also states that 70% of workers there are illegal. So there is probably a fear among others growers in the area that they will be affected.
It doesn't seem that the workers in the valley are only getting free stuff...Sounds like they are working and contributing to the economy in many ways.
.....some of the greatest land in the San Joaquin Valley will lay fallow. Able to produce a massive quantity of food for the world, but unable to because of Trump American agricultural polices.
And I guess it was producing great mountains of food stuffs for the world's hungry,
Until Trump took office what? three and a half weeks ago? Now it is all laying fallow cause of his three and a half week old agricultural policies.....
Thousands of acres gone fallow in less than a month....
Interesting.
I wonder just how three and a half weeks of anything except maybe chemical warfare or nuclear warfare is going to make thousands of acres fallow and untenable.
A bit of hyperbole there?
The only reason it will remain fallow is cause it already is fallow. so blame that on your great savior Obama's policies why don't ya... No, no, no, we can't do that, it was all Bush's fault....
Trump's policies haven't done a thing yet.... but it is nice to know that the policies of the Obama administration and it's failures are now getting blamed on Trump.
I thought it was because of the drought. Which is supposedly over with now... Thank heavens!
It was the drought, but when you start cramming too many people in the dessert you know how fine a line between plenty of water and drought becomes Dowser. If you can't supply your own water you certainly don't need to overload the system by adding thousands of people in your area.
Cramming too many people in an area with an iffy water supply has been a pet peeve of mine for years and years... So, yes, I know exactly what you mean!!!
The LA/Phoenix area has the highest evapo-transporation rate of any place in the county, and the least rainfall, (recharge). So, Gee, let's do the smart thing and turn it into a megalopolis with a milion golf courses...
NWM ''And I guess it was producing great mountains of food stuffs for the world's hungry,''
Yes is was and still is. With 6.5 million people living in the valley, the fields in this state bring in $35 billion a year and provide more of the nation’s food than any other state.
Randy's point was if the policy of deporting all the illegals in the country, which would include the SJ Valley, that it could have a devastating effect on the farmers, and their crops. This is from the farmers themselves.
''The only reason it will remain fallow is cause it already is fallow. so blame that on your great savior Obama's policies why don't ya... No, no, no, we can't do that, it was all Bush's fault....''
If it's already fallow, how does the area product $35 billion in food? What Obama policies are those?
Actually, I was directing my comment directly at the "Trump" policies part of the comment.
WHAT TRUMP POLICIES? He's only been in office three and a half weeks for christ's sake!
If there is an issue on presidential agricultural policies, look to the past policies, it is way to early to judge any future policies.
AS far as what to do with illegals?
I haven't a clue.
But I'm also a big believer in the Founders version of immigration rules....
#1 Get here, set up residence; (how you got here doesn't matter)
#2 Be of good moral fibre: (don't be a criminal or otherwise bad actor)
#3 Obey the laws of the nation: (If you want to be a Citizen, then act like one)
Hell, there wasn't even a loyalty oath, no pledge of allegiance, (in fact they specifically talked at length about the need to NOT require one) no requirement to speak English, Particularly no requirement to serve anywhere, and many others.
How about we implement that ideal of immigration today?
Trumps stated policy of ''deporting all illegals''...Video provided in my comment to Six.
The question is what will happen if all the illegals in the SJ valley (field workers) are deported. Will the farms survive, what will happen to the food supply. That is the questions, NWM.
Trumps version of deportation changes on a regular basis. From 2/3 million felons, the rest to be determined later, to all illegals, to some hybrid version. Which of those are we to believe, if any.
The basic question remains of what will happen to the farmers/farms/food supply.
The farmers are concerned with Door number 1. All illegals to be deported.
Well I believe that immigration policy for the last 120 some odd years is a mishmash of competing interest groups trying to control the rest of us in some big protection scheme.
AS far as I am concerned if they are here, they are being good citizens, then they are citizens.
If this is the greatest nation on the planet, then why do we do everything in our power to disprove it?
Which means, (I do believe) that the only illegal alien, are the ones that come here to break the laws. They should be shot on sight cause they cause all kinds of problem for those that come here for the right reasons....
How they got here is irrelevant.
"Give us you tired, your poor, these lost souls yearning to breath free"
That is my answer, and yes you can extrapolate it to whatever. As long as they obey the laws and act as good citizens, I have no problem with them at all.
That is also the correct libertarian viewpoint.
We'll import our tomatoes at $20 a piece for decent ones and $10 for a good bunch of grapes
I have fresh tomatoes every year and all through the winter if I want. Fresh grapes when in season as well already.
Why don't you call your governor and tell him they should start paying those migrants $15.00 and hour. Surely picking all those vegetables and fruits are more important than flipping hamburgers. You don't want to be known as the slave wage state, do you?
Excellent point.
Kavika - I want President Trump and the Republicans to be successful in deporting and banning all immigrants and refugees. I also am hoping and praying that the ACA is repealed immediately. Hopefully those pre existing conditions and lack of health care will take care of those pesky complainers and unhealthy people in our society. I agree with your comments to Randy about it costing us more to eat but I'm looking at it as another way to get rid of those citizens that require help and handouts. They will just need to learn to work harder and longer if they want to be able to afford to eat. I feel like we're already making America great again by identifying all these people that aren't worthy to be here or aren't self sufficient enough to be Americans.
The solution is simple. A guest worker program where temporary legal migrants and their immediate nuclear family come here for three years of any five year period and stay home the other two. They come here to to work where there is a certified labor shortage like agriculture and work to get ahead and support their extended families back home. These guest workers would supplement the legal resident aliens and those immigrants who became citizens who are doing that work.
"Deportee (Plane Wreck At Los Gatos)"
(Joan Baez)
The oranges are packed in the creosote dumps
They're flying you back to the Mexico border
To pay all your money to wade back again
Goodbye to my Juan, goodbye Rosalita
Adios mis amigos, Jesus y Maria
You won't have a name when you ride the big airplane
All they will call you will be deportees
My father's own father, he waded that river
They took all the money he made in his life
My brothers and sisters come working the fruit trees
They rode the big trucks till they lay down and die
Goodbye to my Juan, goodbye Rosalita
Adios mis amigos, Jesus y Maria
You won't have a name when you ride the big airplane
All they will call you will be deportees
The skyplane caught fire over Los Gatos Canyon
A fireball of lightning, and it shook all the hills
Who are these comrades that died like the dry leaves
The radio tells me they're just deportees
Goodbye to my Juan, goodbye Rosalita
Adios mis amigos, Jesus y Maria
You won't have a name when you ride the big airplane
All they will call you will be deportees
We died in your hills and we died in your deserts
We died in your valleys we died on your plains
We died 'neath your trees and we died in your bushes
Both sides of the river we died just the same
Goodbye to my Juan, goodbye Rosalita
Adios mis amigos, Jesus y Maria
You won't have a name when you ride the big airplane
All they will call you will be deportees
Some of us are illegal, and others not wanted
Our work contract's out and we have to move on
But it's six hundred miles to that Mexican border
They chase us like outlaws, like rustlers, like thieves.
Goodbye to my Juan, goodbye Rosalita
Adios mis amigos, Jesus y Maria
You won't have a name when you ride the big airplane
All they will call you will be deportees
Is this the best way we can grow our big orchards
Is this the best way we can grow our good fruit
To fall like dry leaves and rot on the top soil
And be called by no name except "deportee"
Goodbye to my Juan, goodbye Rosalita
Adios mis amigos, Jesus y Maria
You won't have a name when you ride the big airplane
All they will call you will be deportees
It should be noted that the song was written by Woody Guthrie and was a true story.
The automation revolution we are about to experience for the most part. Burger King workers replaced by the burger machine.
It possible Dean, but until farmers are able to afford that type of equipment it's a dicey situation.
There was a good article (which I can't find right now) that dealt with that very subject. The few farmers interviewed stated that those that starting purchasing that type of equipment were burying themselves in debt.
Good question Buzz...I don't have an answer.
I'm in favor of making prisoners work for their free room and board. Bring back the chain gangs.
I would like to see all the white collar criminals on those chain gangs as well Dean.
I'm in favor of making prisoners work for their free room and board. Bring back the chain gangs.
The main problem with the forced labor concept is how quickly such systems start getting abused.
Like how some private prisons where guilty of paying judges to funnel kids into them for kickbacks, the poor would become highly vulnerable to having some crooked judge or small backwater town's JP sending them to prison just so their labor can be stolen by some corporate farm, or clothing sweet shop, or piece work company.
"The main problem with the forced labor concept is how quickly such systems start getting abused."
As depicted by the warden in the movie "The Shawshank Redemption".
Here in NC the tobacco farmers and peach growers, who supported Trump pretty much 100%, are facing the same concerns.
Thanks for the info Wheel.
There is also a lot of concern in Iowa and Illinois regarding the situation.
The only way some people learn is when it impacts them directly. Maybe next time they will choose more wisely.
In KY, much of the same is happening. All these people who are so in favor of deporting the illegals are finding that they can't afford to pay the wages of the American field workers. We seem to raise a lot of crops or have a lot of agricultural activities that require hand labor. If you deport all the workers, the work won't get done. No farmer can afford to pay minimum wage, or a little more, and still make $$ when they get the money for their crop.
Sometimes things backfire.
Once again, my device is showing that the gif I posted decided to disappear.
I see it Now! Talk about sweet justice.....hahahahahaha
Speaking of church - Hal are you tweeting on your phone from the pew? I can't see the pic you added to your post. lol
If by pew you mean couch, and church you mean the house of Hal A. Lujah ... then yes.
Hahahahaha - I'm glad you referenced couch. Generally men pray in another room.
Full disclosure, sometimes I post from the throne.
Hal,
Could you please send me the gif you are trying to post. I have looked at the code, and it seems to have an error in it.
hal-a-lujah:
Sometimes things backfire.
Once again, my device is showing that the gif I posted decided to disappear.
perrie-halpern:
Hal,
Could you please send me the gif you are trying to post. I have looked at the code, and it seems to have an error in it.
I just did a right click, copy image then pasted the copy over here.
Perfect, " Sometimes things backfire", gif Hal. lol
Trump is centering his attention on farm workers. The media would like you to believe that is the case, but it isn't, unless you have illegal criminals working for you. They also have the H2-2A visa program which has gone up during the last five years with less people entering this country illegally.
Seems these farmers in California don't even pay overtime unless the worker has worked over 60 hours. Seems they want what would be considered slave wages, but want to pay the hamburger worker $15.00 an hour. The main thing is the media is putting a scare in the migrant workers heads needlessly and many are falling for it and promoting it.
Pay the workers a decent wage and use the H-2A visa program more would be a proper way to handle this, but it seems the big farms would rather hire illegals so they can take advantage of them instead.
I know a Mexican who works on a farm every year in Peachland country in South Carolina. They grown everything from peaches to strawberries. At the end of the season he goes home to Mexico and then returns in the early Spring. I saw him a couple of months ago the day before he was leaving SC for Mexico. One good farmer who treats his employees the way they should be treated. Legal and steady work at a higher pay than the 60 hours with no overpay in California.
My mistake. That should have been "Trump is not centering his attention on farm workers".
Good thing!
I have personally found most of our likely "illegal immigrants" who are farm laborers to be lovely people.
I have found most who aren't even farm workers to remind me of the 50's or when I grew up with families they center their attention on, but the MSM and these agitators would rather you believe Trump is out to get them and too many of you are falling for their fake news because that is not the case. It you are a criminal illegal like the ones Obama turned back onto the streets of this country before leaving office, it's a different story.
What in the world are you talking about Six?
Fake news on the concern of the farmers losing their field workers? That is far from fake news.
Just because you are falling for the fake news Kavika, I can't help it. Trump is not centering his attention on law abiding farm workers. I know you would like to thing otherwise, but it isn't true. His attention is on criminal illegals. You do know the difference, don't you?
Show me where Trump has indicated he is going after farm workers, unless some of the rapist, murderers and other criminals Obama released from prison before he left office, there are none he is going after. Maybe they got jobs as farm workers, otherwise the farm workers are safe from Trump. You need to stop pushing fake news.
Six, you believe what you want. I did not say that Trump was going after farm workers. I said, what he said. He is going to deport all illegal aliens.
Spin it the way your want. But I sure listen to farmers and workers before I would believe your take on it.
As for your accusation of me spreading ''fake news''...You, as usual, have no idea what your talking about. Please go back to your conspiracy theories, you do much better there.
My friends with illegal aliens are all worried that their workers will leave, (they do not specify how), and those with legal aliens keep up with their paperwork, and it's hard on all counts. They're all worried. But then, worrying is what farmers do best, isn't it?
Six, you believe what you want. I did not say that Trump was going after farm workers. I said, what he said. He is going to deport all illegal aliens.
You may be correct. It's hard to disprove a negative. Show me him saying that and I'll accept it.
Now you show me where he said he ws going to deport all illegal aliens.
Since you accused me of posting fake news, I just your just going to have to go with that.
You can add it to your conspiracy theories.
Did you look at the video? At least that time he didn't say he was going to export all aliens. I know he is subject to saying one thing and then another.
Kavika, I'm not accusing you of personally posting fake news. I know you are posting an article, but the article is like most of the stuff we see today and it is not true from what I've heard Trump is after anyone other than criminal illegals, but articles and news like this makes people think otherwise and all I want it the truth without the spin, not from you, but from all these articles and MSM I'm seeing. Sorry, didn't mean to get so down in the dirt.
Yes, I looked at the video. Which Donald Trump are we getting. In your video he say's that he is going to deport 2/3 million felons, but the rest is to be determined. What ever that means.
In my video he says that he is going to deport all illegals..I realize that my video is older than yours. But what Trump to we believe?
I know what you mean Kavika, but I just have a feeling Trump isn't going to do near as much as he likes to say he is going to do. First off, we're not going to let him take all the children that grew up here and deport them. He has calmed down quite a bit, even though it may not seem so. I think we may see him a little different because of our feelings. I just don't believe he is going to clean house. I don't see how it is possible for one thing, but I do support sending criminal illegals back to wherever they came from, but I still think it should be a case by case situation even then. All felonies are not the same. Intent, harm and how long ago it happened. I think Trump is going to surprise a lot of people if they don't kill him or badger him down where he can't accomplish anything.
By the way, I know you are disheartened by the Keystone Pipeline and I can understand. You haven't had your normal spunk as you have in the past since Trump was elected. I wish we all could come together more.
''By the way, I know you are disheartened by the Keystone Pipeline and I can understand. You haven't had your normal spunk as you have in the past since Trump was elected'' HUH.
I've noticed that your comment are getting more bizarre since Trump was elected. How's that for a little mind reading, Six.
I should qualify my statement, six. I don't know for sure that the people I've met are illegal aliens, I'm just assuming that some of them are. If their kids are not in school, and they speak no English whatsoever, I'm just assuming that they aren't here legally. Roofers and farm workers. That doesn't mean I'm right. And it is extremely prejudiced for me to say that. We have a lot of LEGAL aliens here in Louisville, but all their kids are in school. It seems, anyway. That's just my impression from having our house roofed, visiting the grocery, visiting farmer's markets, watching people in the field. From camping in the country, etc. My friends who are farmers have legal aliens working for them. I have a good friend that owns a chicken farm, a giant one, and his workers are here legally. Then I have another friend with yet another chicken farm, a smaller one, and a hog farm, as an also ran, and those workers are likely not here legally... If they don't send their kids to school, somewhere, they are trying to remain under the radar...
Dowser, I haven't met any legal or illegal aliens, or should I just say Mexicans I don't really like. I have several who I consider friends. I don't even know if they are legal or illegal, I never bring the subject up and neither do they. One in particular has helped me on several occasions and I have done the same for him and his family.
I hate things are the way they are, but we've brought it on ourselves, not you or I maybe, but farmers and others who looked for that cheap labor under the table pay without any SS taxes or worker's compensation. The politicians have been complacent in allowing this to continue and I wish we could hold them accountable.
Our immigration laws are much too lenient. In the old days people came to this country to find a better life, but the way it is now, people come to this country to find a better life and get on welfare. With each child, they get a little money whether they are legal or not. Illegals work under the table and there are other benefits they receive. Ask your Social Services what benefits they can get. They basically tell us none, but that is not true.
I don't mind helping, but it's kind of like you opening your door and taking in anyone who walks by. Pretty soon you won't have the money to provide for your own family. These people usually don't make enough legally if they are legal to not qualify for Earned Income Tax Credit, which can amount to several thousand dollars a year for the rest of their lives. We shouldn't encourage that with our laws and the way our laws are now we do encourage it.
I know you have a good heart and you may think I don't, but I have to realize using common sense allows me and others to have a good heart, but when you see what is happening to this country, my heart has to be with Americans, not illegals.
but when you see what is happening to this country,
Can I ask you what that is ?
Are the farmers you know who hire legal aliens making a living?
Me, too, six-- but that's common in KY. For everybody.
At least I don't have to wear white gloves any more if I want to shop downtown and be socially acceptable. Not that I don't have them, because I do...
Trump is centering his attention on all illegals, Six. That would include field workers.
As for the visa situation. A company that I'm very familiar with here in Missouri had used the visa program for the last 7 years. When they applied for 2015 the dozen visa were turned down. The explanation was that our area unemployment was to high and to hire local workers. He had tried that in the past, and once again tried it. In two months he received dozens of apps, many of which could pass a drug test. Of the ones that he accepted and put to work the general rule was they would last a week and then quit.
After three months he brought all the evidence reapplied and the visa were granted. The cost to him was not only in the money wasted on people that didn't really want to work, but in an actual loss of customers.
As for California, it is no different than in many other states that have large agriculture sections. California was highlighted because it's the largest agriculture state in the US. The problem will exist everywhere.
IMO, the bottom line is that you'll not get many Americans to work the fields, it hard back braking work.
Believe me I know it is hard work and you'll find very few Americans who will do the job. Why did they quit? Too hard for them or they just decided to take a hike into the interior of this country to find greener pastures to live here illegally.
I think we should get rid of the anchor baby law. Many United States Citizens are in jail and separated from their children for the offenses they've committed. Does an illegal suppose to get a special break? Many of those USA Citizens will never have custody of their children again. Are we suppose to feel sorry for the illegals but not the USA Citizens?
If you want to come into this country illegally, then you must accept you are an illegal alien with no rights.
'' Too hard for them or they just decided to take a hike into the interior of this country to find greener pastures to live here illegally.''
Are you having a difficult time understanding English language Six?
Those people were local's they were not illegals...Local white guys, and Missouri is in the MIDDLE of the country. Jesus H. Christ Six, get it together or get off the article.
hard back braking work.
That's the darn truth! Dangerous work, too!
No kidding. I know in NC Rattlesnakes, Copperheads and an occasional Moccasin. I guess Coral Snakes and Scorpions in California as well. And that doesn't even include the spiders, Recluse and Black Widows in NC.
And just think, I use to be out there barefooted all summer long with nothing but a pair of shorts on.
I have never been able to do that, because I've always been deathly allergic to bees... (Run around barefoot.)
I also mean the pesticides, herbicides, and fungicides, toxic weeds, etc. One of my best friend's husband is currently dying from pesticide exposure. His lungs are giving out and he is slowly dying. He is not a candidate for a lung transplant. It is really a sad situation!
Not to mention, the farm equipment that breaks down, the problems inherent with farming bottom-land, (I'm thinking of the miscellaneous logs and crap that just show up, in the middle of a field, when they're trying to plant or harvest), etc. It is very dangerous work!
Nobody should be here illegally. Period. If the farmers want agricultural workers from Mexico, then they should get an H-2A visa for them. If the visa conditions are too restrictive and they can prove it, then take the matter to the Labor department -- and if necessary to congress -- to relax the standards. This work is seasonal but illegal aliens are running across the border for other jobs (not just fruit picking), raising families as though they belong here, and then jumping up and down because they are deported for entering illegally. Encouraging illegal immigration undermines a respect for law and does a disservice to the many people who try to do things the right way. A farmer who acts lawfully cannot compete with one who does not. An immigrant who wants to enter legally has no reason to expend the time and money to do so when somebody else can just jump the fence for free with no consequences.
I heard all the same pro illegal alien arguments under Reagan when we had 3 million illegal aliens. Now we have more than 10 million of them . . . and they're certainly not all picking fruit. Nobody in their right mind wants to spend their life working in a field if they can help it. The minute they can do better, they move on to something else and the farmers need to replace them. The original workers don't go home. I don't want to hear this illegal alien bullshit any more. Deport them. They knew they were illegal when they entered and they knew they could be deported if they were caught.