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Inside The White House : For the first time since the investigation began, the prospect of impeachment is being considered as a realistic outcome and not just a liberal fever dream.

  

Category:  News & Politics

Via:  johnrussell  •  9 years ago  •  133 comments

Inside The White House : For the first time since the investigation began, the prospect of impeachment is being considered as a realistic outcome and not just a liberal fever dream.

( Trump Is Trying to Throw His Son In Law Jared Kushner Under The Bus)

===================

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/11/the-west-wing-trump-is-apoplectic-as-allies-fear-impeachment

Until now, Robert Mueller has haunted  Donald Trump’s White House as a hovering, mostly unseen menace. But by securing indictments of Paul Manafort and Rick Gates, and a surprise guilty plea from foreign policy adviser George Papadopoulos, Mueller announced loudly that the Russia investigation poses an existential threat to the president. “Here’s what Manafort’s indictment tells me: Mueller is going to go over every financial dealing of Jared Kushner and the Trump Organization,” said former Trump campaign aide Sam Nunberg. “Trump is at 33 percent in Gallup. You can’t go any lower. He’s fucked.”

The first charges in the Mueller probe have kindled talk of what the endgame for Trump looks like, according to conversations with a half-dozen advisers and friends of the president. For the first time since the investigation began, the prospect of impeachment is being considered as a realistic outcome and not just a liberal fever dream. According to a source, advisers in the West Wing are on edge and doing whatever they can not to be ensnared. One person close to Dina Powell and Gary Cohn said they’re making sure to leave rooms if the subject of Russia comes up.

The consensus among the advisers I spoke to is that Trump faces few good options to thwart Mueller. For one, firing Mueller would cross a red line, analogous to Nixon’s firing of Archibald Cox during Watergate, pushing establishment Republicans to entertain the possibility of impeachment. “His options are limited, and his instinct is to come out swinging, which won’t help things,” said a prominent Republican close to the White House.

Trump, meanwhile, has reacted to the deteriorating situation by lashing out on Twitter and venting in private to friends. He’s frustrated that the investigation seems to have no end in sight. “Trump wants to be critical of Mueller,” one person who’s been briefed on Trump’s thinking says. “He thinks it’s unfair criticism. Clinton hasn’t gotten anything like this. And what about Tony Podesta ? Trump is like, When is that going to end? ” According to two sources, Trump has complained to advisers about his legal team for letting the Mueller probe progress this far. Speaking to Steve Bannon on Tuesday, Trump blamed Jared Kushner for his role in decisions, specifically the firings of Mike Flynn and James Comey, that led to Mueller’s appointment, according to a source briefed on the call. When Roger Stone recently told Trump that Kushner was giving him bad political advice, Trump agreed, according to someone familiar with the conversation. “Jared is the worst political adviser in the White House in modern history,” Nunberg said. “I’m only saying publicly what everyone says behind the scenes at Fox News, in conservative media, and the Senate and Congress.” (The White House didn’t respond to a request for comment by deadline.)

As Mueller moves to interview West Wing aides in the coming days, advisers are lobbying for Trump to consider a range of stratagems to neutralize Mueller, from conciliation to a declaration of all-out war. One Republican explained Trump’s best chance for survival is to get his poll numbers up. Trump’s lawyer Ty Cobb has been advocating the view that playing ball will lead to a quick resolution (Cobb did not respond to a request for comment). But these soft-power approaches are being criticized by Trump allies including Steve Bannon and Roger Stone, who both believe establishment Republicans are waiting for a chance to impeach Trump. “The establishment has proven time and time again they will fuck Trump over,” a Bannon ally told me.

In a series of phone calls with Trump on Monday and Tuesday, Bannon told the president to shake up the legal team by installing an aggressive lawyer above Cobb, according to two sources briefed on the call. Bannon has also discussed ways to pressure Congress to defund Mueller’s investigation or limit its scope. “Mueller shouldn’t be allowed to be a clean shot on goal,” a Bannon confidant told me. “He must be contested and checked. Right now he has unchecked power.”

Bannon’s sense of urgency is being fueled by his belief that Trump’s hold on power is slipping. The collapse of Obamacare repeal, and the dimming chances that tax reform will pass soon—many Trump allies are deeply pessimistic about its prospects—have created the political climate for establishment Republicans to turn on Trump. Two weeks ago, according to a source, Bannon did a spitball analysis of the Cabinet to see which members would remain loyal to Trump in the event the 25th Amendment were invoked, thereby triggering a vote to remove the president from office. Bannon recently told people he’s not sure if Trump would survive such a vote. “One thing Steve wants Trump to do is take this more seriously,” the Bannon confidant told me. “Stop joking around. Stop tweeting.”

Roger Stone believes defunding Mueller isn’t enough. Instead, Stone wants Trump to call for a special prosecutor to investigate Hillary Clinton’s role in approving the controversial Uranium One deal that’s been a locus of rightwing hysteria (the transaction involved a Russian state-owned energy firm acquiring a Canadian mining company that controlled a large subset of the uranium in the United States). It’s a bit of a bank shot , but as Stone described it, a special prosecutor looking into Uranium One would also have to investigate the F.B.I.’s role in approving the deal, thereby making Mueller—who was in charge of the bureau at the time—a target. Stone’s choice for a special prosecutor: Rudy Giuliani law colleague Marc Mukasey or Fox News pundit Andrew Napolitano. “You would immediately have to inform Mueller, Comey, and [Deputy Attorney General] Rod Rosenstein that they are under federal investigation,” Stone said. “Trump can’t afford to fire Mueller politically. But this pushes him aside.”


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JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1  seeder  JohnRussell    9 years ago

Sorry Trumpsters of NT. The handwriting is on the wall. 

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Quiet
1.1  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  JohnRussell @1    9 years ago
The handwriting is on the wall.

Mene mene tekel and upharsin.

 
 
 
Nowhere Man
Junior Participates
1.1.1  Nowhere Man  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @1.1    9 years ago
Mene mene tekel and upharsin.

Belshazzar's feast, or the story of the writing on the wall (chapter 5 in the Book of Daniel )

Wouldn't you all love it if such were actually true.....

And in your version who play Daniel? YOU? John? Mueller? or some unbodied spirit that will bring you what you want by rubbing a glass bottle?

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
2  seeder  JohnRussell    9 years ago

They are going to "hang" Trump and his crooked family for financial crimes. 

 
 
 
Nowhere Man
Junior Participates
2.1  Nowhere Man  replied to  JohnRussell @2    9 years ago

I'll hang him for ya if they ever actually come up with some factual evidence sufficient to prove the allegation......

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
2.1.1  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Nowhere Man @2.1    9 years ago
I'll hang him for ya if they ever actually come up with some factual evidence sufficient to prove the allegation.....

Why do I have the feeling that even when Trump is fleeing to Russia you'll still be screaming:  "Where's the evidence!!!!"

 
 
 
Nowhere Man
Junior Participates
3  Nowhere Man    9 years ago

But by securing indictments of Paul Manafort and Rick Gates, and a surprise guilty plea from foreign policy adviser George Papadopoulos, Mueller announced loudly that the Russia investigation poses an existential threat to the president.

Existential:

denoting or relating to a formula or proposition asserting the existence of at least one object fulfilling a given condition ; containing an existential quantifier .

Ok, We've known for a while now that you liberals, the hard core T-Rump haters, believe this is the end all and be all and that this will take down your hated enemy....

Problem is you only think it will and try as you might, gin up all the fancy words or language you can, you can still only THINK it, doesn't make it real.

Still waiting on actual proof, not speculative assertions, ("claims" for those who can't handle big words) of proof.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Quiet
4  Dismayed Patriot    9 years ago

Watch the Frontline PBS 2 part special "Putin's Revenge". It shows exactly how Putin influenced the election. The next thing we'll get to see is the Mueller investigation tying the Trump campaign to Putin and the active measures deployed as a coordinated effort to screw American democracy.

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
Senior Silent
4.1  Colour Me Free  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @4    9 years ago

For the first time, I was disappointed in a Frontline report .. I recorded and watched Part one and two back to back last night - perhaps I will watch them again, as I must have missed something ... I found myself talking to the TV asking for more information than the speculations I had already read in the media...

Still is mind boggling that the former President did nothing regarding the supposed seriousness of the alleged election interference ... H. was gonna win, so nothing need be done?  If Obama did act, it might be taken in the wrong way?  H. lost, so the Russians actions must have had more influence? .............. candidates spend millions of dollars on campaigns, but Russia can spend a 100k on Facebook and influence the nation with 'fake news and bot accounts???

Perhaps if steps had been taken from the beginning (not waiting til late December) individuals might have taken the Russian interference to heart, and not think things to be such a convenient excuse for H.'s loss ...?  Everyone knows that timing is everything - so the Wikileaks documents were just fodder, that did not bode well for the DNC.  (none of which influenced my vote  -- as I voted for neither candidate, opting instead to vote None of the Above)

Just my thoughts ... 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
4.1.1  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Colour Me Free @4.1    9 years ago
so the Wikileaks documents were just fodder, that did not bode well for the DNC.

Not to mention the Donna Brazile story today about how H "rigged" the DNC. Damn, all it takes is one bad mark (the Dossier) to come out and all of a sudden ...........people grow some. Where was she months ago?Amusing as hell really.

K, nuff off topic.......Great post and Good Morning.

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
Senior Silent
4.1.2  Colour Me Free  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @4.1.1    9 years ago

Things in Political Land might turn into a similar avalanche that is today's Hollywood .. I do not know if it is called 'growing some' - yet accusations from victims rule the day .. apparently no facts necessary?    (Monica elevated PROOF to a whole new level ... gotta admire her for that : )

Not a H. fan nor a Trump fan for that matter - neither one is more/less corrupt than the other!

P.s.... do I need to write a disclaimer? or just say in my opinion? [giggle]

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
4.1.3  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Colour Me Free @4.1.2    9 years ago
I do not know if it is called 'growing some'

Guess I coulda/shoulda said "get a conscience"..thinking ..............peace

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
Senior Silent
4.1.4  Colour Me Free  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @4.1.3    9 years ago

HA!  Conscience indeed! [shakes head and laughs]

 
 
 
Skrekk
Sophomore Quiet
5  Skrekk    9 years ago
When Roger Stone recently told Trump that Kushner was giving him bad political advice, Trump agreed, according to someone familiar with the conversation. “Jared is the worst political adviser in the White House in modern history,” Nunberg said. 

If it results in Trump's resignation or impeachment, more power to him!

 
 
 
sixpick
Professor Quiet
5.1  sixpick  replied to  Skrekk @5    9 years ago

Gabriel Sherman Vanity Fair Liberal blind quotes edit.jpg

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
5.1.1  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  sixpick @5.1    9 years ago

Wow. That just shows us how accurate and damaging Sherman has been.  You might want to rethink the smear strategy.  It's working against you.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6  seeder  JohnRussell    9 years ago

Does Robert Mueller think Donald Trump should be president of the United States? 

This is the question that matters now. 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.1  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JohnRussell @6    9 years ago

That question matters not. Mueller's "opinion" means nothing and, if it does, he needs to recuse himself immediately. We already know he and Comey are buds. We already know he doesn't personally care for Mr. Trump. But his job is to PROVE there was collusion between the Trump campaign and the Russian GovCo to "fix" the election. Couldn't happen. The only way it could be done would be to infiltrate the voting machines/change the vote count. That would be a YUGE undertaking and practically impossible to achieve. And if you say that just the suggestion that Mrs. Clinton was dirty (and she was and her and the DNC LOST the Berniebot vote when they found out that the damned primaries were rigged against him) then that speaks "volumes" about the Clinton supporters. If they were dedicated to seeing her as POTUS, the leaks would not have swayed them one iota.............except as said for the Berniebots.

And again, Mueller's "opinion" matters not. IT is the letter of the law that does, there is NO Federal law concerning collusion, and it is NOT his call. Period. This is concerning the campaign. Ginning up other more serious charges should NOT be a consideration. And evidently you need the reminder that, MR. TRUMP IS NOT UNDER INVESTIGATION SINGLY.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.1  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1    9 years ago

Excellent regurgitation of the Fox/Breitbart talking points. 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.1.2  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.1    9 years ago

Even better DEFLECTION attempt by you. WHAT did I type that isn't true? The truth, and therefore expression of it, has a tendency to snuff out the candle of hope for an ideologically pleasing outcome............

Sorry to rain on your parade. Have a good day.....

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.3  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.2    9 years ago

It would cover more ground if we asked which fragment of your comment is true. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.4  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.2    9 years ago

I just reread it, and none of it is true. Sorry. 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.1.5  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.4    9 years ago

HAHAHAHAHAHAgood one

laughing dude laughing dude

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.6  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.5    9 years ago

I could go over your comment sentence by sentence and take it apart, but I'm not sure you would appreciate the effort. 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.1.7  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.6    9 years ago

Well if you really want to harvest some laughter and perhaps show some alternate "opinion" feel free. This is NOT about whether or not Mr. Mueller "thinks" Trump should be POTUS. It is about finding collusion between his campaign and the Russian government. That is IT. It isn't about imagined (for the sake of saving face at the embarrassing loss to Mr. Trump) "influence" that may or may not have changed the outcome. That would be a change in the mentality of the US voter and ONLY that which is what ALL campaigns so with negative advertising.  If Mr. Trump was perceived to be SOOOO damned bad, he wouldn't have gotten the votes he did.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.8  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.7    9 years ago

Mueller can investigate and charge for anything related to the Russian attempt to influence the 2016 election. 

If Donald Trump laundered Russian mob money, Mueller can use it in his conclusions. If Jared Kushner had dirty financial dealings, Mueller can use it. 

Also, influencing the election does not require rigging voting machines. If he demonstrates an attempt by the Trump campaign to gain dirt on Clinton from the Russian government, that is collusion and conspiracy. 

Seriously, almost every word in your above comment is wrong. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.9  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.7    9 years ago
This is NOT about whether or not Mr. Mueller "thinks" Trump should be POTUS.

I'm afraid, for your sake, evidently, that it is. He charged Manafort with money laundering. They have found or will find that Trump laundered money. It then become Mueller's choice if he wants to take down the Trump presidency for that reason. I am not sure he would, and as you are a Trump fan you need to hope that is the case. 

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Quiet
6.1.10  The Magic 8 Ball  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.9    9 years ago
They have found or will find that Trump laundered money.

I am thinking your getting trump and the podesta brothers mixed up.

the podesta brothers are next in line to fall... I wonder if their money trail leads to trump or hillary??  

 
 
 
KDMichigan
Junior Quiet
6.1.11  KDMichigan  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.6    9 years ago
I could go over your comment sentence by sentence and take it apart, but I'm not sure you would appreciate the effort.

Well this is a debate forum, what is holding you back? I'm interested in your views. Hell I'm even interested in most all LWNJ views.

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Quiet
6.1.12  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  The Magic 8 Ball @6.1.10    9 years ago
the podesta brothers are next in line to fall... I wonder if their money trail leads to trump or hillary??

Has Mueller indicted Podesta, either one? No. However, he has indicted Manafort, Trumps campaign manager and, one of Trump campaign staff has pled guilty already.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.13  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  KDMichigan @6.1.11    9 years ago

Pick a couple sentences out of his comment and I will go over them for you. 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.1.14  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.9    9 years ago

I am afraid without "collusion" your points don't hold water with me. Perhaps you would be so kind as to post some commentary, accompanied by citations/links that support your position. The "charges" against Manafort have nothing to do with the campaign nor Mr. Trump and most of the activity was, shall we say under scrutiny, prior to 2016 and even 2015. Not saying it didn't continue but, that seems to be the reason Mr. Mueller brought the charges when he did so that a statute of limitations on the "allegations" wouldn't run out.

Thanks in advance..........I will await your legal legs that you stand on........And please, not a blog or opinion piece. That would be a waste of my time and yours so far........

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.1.15  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @6.1.12    9 years ago

Guilty to LYING TO THE FBI only ..................Damn some people get desperate enough to leave out "the rest of the story". He lied about "talking" to Russians FFS

 
 
 
It Is ME
Masters Participates
6.1.17  It Is ME  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.15    9 years ago

Seems ALL the articles say that Popolopalopalises close call ................... TRIED TO !

I guess he ......... Popolopalopalises close call ......... DID NOT SUCCEED in "HIS" endeavors ?

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Quiet
6.1.18  The Magic 8 Ball  replied to  It Is ME @6.1.17    9 years ago
I guess he ......... Popolopalopalises ......... DID NOT SUCCEED in "HIS" endeavors ?

NOPE... the establishment plant did not succeed  :)

fun fact: muellers investigation into that popodopolis character actually cleared trump of any connections with russia by accident.

had the trump campaign worked with poposcrupulous and russia? things would be different today for sure.

 
 
 
It Is ME
Masters Participates
6.1.19  It Is ME  replied to  The Magic 8 Ball @6.1.18    9 years ago
character actually cleared trump of any connections with russia

That's the way I see it.....but "SOME" others will see it the way they would have liked it to have gone.  Digging a whole

I don't get why the "Others" want to keep digging their holes deeper. maybe they'll find gold by the time they reach China ?

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.20  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.14    9 years ago

It's hard to debate with people who get all their information from Sean Hannity or Laura Ingraham.

Such immense ignorance has its own momentum. I guess you will just have to watch in numb disbelief. 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.1.21  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.20    9 years ago
It's hard to debate with people who get all their information from Sean Hannity or Laura Ingraham. Such immense ignorance has its own momentum. I guess you will just have to watch in numb disbelief.

Because.............. you have nothing. Why didn't you just say it was your opinion. Would have saved a lot of time and the ever valuable bandwidth tied up for people loading and unloading comments.

And the disbelief may be yours. You know like when you woke up last November 9th. Oh, and I don't watch Hannity or listen to Laura Ingraham. But I'll bet you watch Morning Joe and Rachel Maddow..............wow this is fun......

Have a great day and let me know if you come up with that legal "scenario" from a reputable source.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1.22  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.21    9 years ago

If Mueller concludes that the Jun 16 meeting between Trump Jr. , Kushner, and Manafort, and the Russian lawyer constituted conspiracy, then Trump could be up for obstruction of justice. 

That is one likely scenario. I am not going to waste my time going down the whole list for you. 

I am perfectly happy to let you be tortured by the drip drip. 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.1.23  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.22    9 years ago

John you have provided nothing but a bunch of ifs.........wishful thinking on your part.........and I have better things to do. Your latest is a bunch of shit. Plain and simple. The "meeting" lasted less than 20 minutes by all accounts so far and concentrated on the adoption issue which was near and dear to the female lawyers heart. Now you will probably come back with the "I love it" statement showed shades of an upcoming covert conspiracy pact. It's BS and as we learned from Mr. Comey, you have to prove intent..........and that instance does NOT afford itself to doing so..... no where near conspiracy.

I fear the only drip drip you are going to witness is the tears rolling off your cheeks........much like they probably did a year ago.

Again, have a great day and don't forget that legal back up I asked for...............

Oh, and "If ifs and buts were candy and nuts, we'd all have a Merry Christmas". Tis' after Halloween and we all know it's time.

 
 
 
Spikegary
Junior Quiet
6.1.24  Spikegary  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.8    9 years ago

So, he can use the Podesta Firm stuff against the Dems too and follow that rat trail down the hole also...

 
 
 
Spikegary
Junior Quiet
6.1.25  Spikegary  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1.15    9 years ago

additionally, there has also been no indictments of Trump, Manafort was the Ex-campaign Manager and the FbiLiar is an ex-staffer.

 
 
 
Rex Block
Freshman Silent
6.1.26  Rex Block  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.8    9 years ago

No he can't  From an article by Gregg Jarret.

"The indictments of Manafort and Gates now present a unique opportunity to challenge the authority of the special counsel.
Until now, no one had legal “standing” to argue in court that the appointment of Mueller was illegal. The criminal charges change all that. The two defendants will be able to argue before a judge that Mueller’s appointment by Acting Attorney General Rod Rosenstein violated the special counsel law.
As I pointed out in a column last May, the law (28 CFR 600) grants legal authority to appoint a special counsel to investigate crimes. Only crimes. He has limited jurisdiction. Yet, in his order appointing Mueller as special counsel (Order No. 3915-2017), Rosenstein directed him to investigate “any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump.” It fails to identify any specific crimes, likely because none are applicable.
To put it plainly, Mueller is tasked with finding a crime that does not exist in the law. It is a legal impossibility. He is being asked to do something that is manifestly unattainable.
If the federal judge agrees, Mueller and his team would be disbanded by judicial order. The Department of Justice would have to seek a new indictment of Manafort and Gates without the special counsel or drop the case entirely?
 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
6.1.27  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.1    9 years ago
MR. TRUMP IS NOT UNDER INVESTIGATION SINGLY.

At least you recognize how big this corruption and conspiracy is.  You're right.  Trump isn't the only one going down.  He's the biggest one, though. 

 
 
 
Uncle Bruce
Professor Silent
6.1.29  Uncle Bruce  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.8    9 years ago
Also, influencing the election does not require rigging voting machines. If he demonstrates an attempt by the Trump campaign to gain dirt on Clinton from the Russian government, that is collusion and conspiracy.

Be careful with that line of thinking John.  That is exactly what the DNC and the Hillary campaign did when they funded Steele.

 
 
 
Uncle Bruce
Professor Silent
6.1.30  Uncle Bruce  replied to  JohnRussell @6.1.22    9 years ago
If Mueller concludes that the Jun 16 meeting between Trump Jr. , Kushner, and Manafort, and the Russian lawyer constituted conspiracy, then Trump could be up for obstruction of justice.

You mean the meeting they had with the female Russian lawyer who was on the DNC payroll?  Again, that line of thinking falls flat.

 
 
 
Rex Block
Freshman Silent
6.2  Rex Block  replied to  JohnRussell @6    9 years ago

You would just end up with President Pence. Are you sure you really want that??

It's been said you can indict a ham sandwich, but it gets a bit more complicated to impeach a sitting president.

For what high crimes and misdemeanors??

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.2.1  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Rex Block @6.2    9 years ago

Donald Trump is totally unqualified to be president of the United States. We could pull a name out of a phone book and it would be better than 50 50 that person would make a better president than Trump.  Why we have to constantly go over this is a mystery. 

As for Pence, it is what it is. He is enough tainted by his being a Trump lapdog that if Trump goes down Pence's reputation goes down with it. We could survive him being in power for a year before the GOP loses Congress. After that he is a lame duck. 

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Quiet
6.2.2  The Magic 8 Ball  replied to  JohnRussell @6.2.1    9 years ago
Donald Trump is totally unqualified to be president of the United States.

according to qualifications set by the constitution? he is qualified.

your opinion? simply matters not.

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Quiet
6.2.3  The Magic 8 Ball  replied to  JohnRussell @6.2.1    9 years ago
50 50 that person would make a better president than Trump.

so you are saying almost anyone could beat obamas 2% GDP?

interesting admission :)

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.2.4  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  The Magic 8 Ball @6.2.2    9 years ago

Donald Trump has publicly lied or misstated facts a couple thousand times since he took office. It is written down. 

Is such a person "qualified" to be president? How low are your standards? 

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Quiet
6.2.5  The Magic 8 Ball  replied to  JohnRussell @6.2.4    9 years ago
Is such a person "qualified" to be president?

like the GDP, the left and obama have set the bar so low on HONESTY that even trump can walk right over it.

 
 
 
It Is ME
Masters Participates
6.2.6  It Is ME  replied to  JohnRussell @6.2.1    9 years ago
We could pull a name out of a phone book and it would be better than 50 50 that person would make a better president than Trump.

Not True !

"Joe the plumber" (an ordinary guy from the phone book) was totally excoriated by the "Left" when he said he may run for office.

Of course, it would depend on which 50% YOU liked.

Sooooo.......Maybe you should really spend time going through the phone book to actually find someone "Worthy" in your mind ?

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.2.7  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  The Magic 8 Ball @6.2.5    9 years ago

like the GDP, the left and obama have set the bar so low on HONESTY that even trump can walk right over it.

It's difficult to deal with such profound delusion on a forum where people can babble whatever they want. 

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Quiet
6.2.8  The Magic 8 Ball  replied to  JohnRussell @6.2.7    9 years ago
It's difficult to deal with such profound delusion on a forum where people can babble whatever they want.

I have been putting up with your babble for yrs now....

remember when you said trump would never be elected?

but "difficult to deal with?  nah, I only find it amusing, please carry on :)

 
 
 
NuVeiw
Freshman Silent
6.2.9  NuVeiw  replied to  Rex Block @6.2    9 years ago

Clinton almost got impeached for a blow job. Careful what you ask for as there's so much more going on with Trump and his administration. Please keep projecting, deflecting and by all means keep putting those little laughing icons in your replies. We'll see who's laughing in a few more months but knowing you trump followers you will lie and deny anyway

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
6.2.10  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Rex Block @6.2    9 years ago
You would just end up with President Pence. Are you sure you really want that??

You don't think Pence already has his list of appointments?  He's probably constantly having to wipe the saliva off his chin.  But what makes you think Pence isn't one of the many who's facing indictments?  He's been lying all along the way.  He may be next after Trump if he doesn't go down with him. 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.2.11  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @6.2.10    9 years ago

Damn why don't you guys head on over to DC and tell Mueller all of these facts you know. Hell, that should take a couple of hours and the whole thing would be over in a snap.

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Participates
6.2.12  Hal A. Lujah  replied to  It Is ME @6.2.6    9 years ago

"Joe the plumber"

Joe the Plumber was one of the most ignorant political wannabes I had ever heard, but Donald Trump makes him look positively brilliant.

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Quiet
6.2.13  The Magic 8 Ball  replied to  NuVeiw @6.2.9    9 years ago
We'll see who's laughing in a few more months

funny thing, been hearing that from the left for over 4 yrs now on every single prediction they made...

everything the left said will happen to the right? happened to the left and I reckon nothing has changed just yet.

 

 

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
6.4  Sean Treacy  replied to  JohnRussell @6    9 years ago

So that's his job? To throw away the law, throw away the Constitution and Makeup things because, in his opinion, Donald Trump shouldn't be President? 

 
 
 
arkpdx
Professor Quiet
6.4.1  arkpdx  replied to  Sean Treacy @6.4    9 years ago

You forget, he is a liberal and diesnt beieve in the constitution unless it suits him. It abd itger laws are just merely suggestions that thise on the left feel they can ignore if they choose

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.4.2  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @6.4    9 years ago

No it is his job to follow the law and set the stage for trump being thrown out, if his conclusion is that Trump should not be president. 

 
 
 
Spikegary
Junior Quiet
6.4.3  Spikegary  replied to  JohnRussell @6.4.2    9 years ago

No, it's just his job to follow the law with no pre-supposed end goal.

 
 
 
NuVeiw
Freshman Silent
6.4.4  NuVeiw  replied to  Spikegary @6.4.3    9 years ago

Pretty much like they went after Clinton and finally came up with a blow job. You guys and this republican congress are so disingenuous. If pres moron was a Dem you would have started impeachment proceedings on day one. Never fear though Trump will be caught and he and his administration will be gone

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
6.4.5  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Sean Treacy @6.4    9 years ago
So that's his job? To throw away the law, throw away the Constitution and Makeup things because, in his opinion, Donald Trump shouldn't be President?

Oh, Sean, Sean; get a hold of yourself.  Letting some random comment like that upset you so much isn't healthy.  If you're worried that there's something politically nefarious or personally inappropriate about Mueller's investigation I can absolutely guarantee you that the indictments Mueller brings against everyone involved with these crimes will be meticulous, stone-cold factual and absolutely pristinely devoid of even a hint of partisan, personal motive or intent. This process will make the case against Nixon look sloppy by comparison.  Justice will be done in the very best American way. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.4.6  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Spikegary @6.4.3    9 years ago

You're right Spike, I mis worded that. It is not Mueller's job to set the stage for Trump being thrown the hell out, but I highly suspect he may think it is his duty as a conscientious American in a position to do something about it. 

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.4.7  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @6.4.5    9 years ago
Justice will be done in the very best American way.

Let's see if you feel the same should NOTHING come of this beyond Manafort...............................................Ima guess hell no.........nervous

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
6.4.8  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @6.4.7    9 years ago
Let's see if you feel the same should NOTHING come of this beyond Manafort...............................................Ima guess hell no.....

If you believe that's all that's going to happen here, I really feel sorry for you.

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
6.4.9  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @6.4.8    9 years ago

Well I guess I can return the favor. I sincerely hope a little something comes of it. Anything just so the liberal nation doesn't go into full tilt meltdown like they did 51 weeks ago. That was a terribly sad thing to watch. Screaming at clouds, posting tearful "Oh no's" on youtube, embarrassing yourselves with pink pussy hats...........it was just about enough to make a guy feel a little sorry for you...................but............then the memory of the arrogance and elitist attitude came to mind and I realized it was wholly self inflicted due to the realization that rainbows and unicorns aren't real..........and we tried to tell you all along not to be so cocky and sure of yourselves............SIGH............I hate to see a repeat but I fear that is just what we are going to witness.

I'll keep you in my good thoughts....................NAH never mind.........

 
 
 
It Is ME
Masters Participates
6.5  It Is ME  replied to  JohnRussell @6    9 years ago
Does Robert Mueller think Donald Trump should be president of the United States?
This is the question that matters now.

The honest question is....Did "Donald Trump" Truly Collude and accomplish a change in the outcome of an American election ?

What Mueller personally thinks politically, matters not one iota !

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Quiet
7  The Magic 8 Ball    9 years ago

when the podesta brothers fall, they will take hillary with them.... that should send a warning to trump??   LOL  :)

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
7.1  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  The Magic 8 Ball @7    9 years ago

Bully for you.  Stiff upper lip, tight smile, and all that.  Forget that nobody ever heard of Tony Podesta nor does anyone care what (if anything) happens. Nor pay no heed to the fact that nothing is going to happen to Hillary or any other democrat when all this comes out. You go right on believing that this is all just a bad dream, there's nothing there and Trump will always be president. Just make sure you have a sound proof windowless room completely cut off from all communication with the outside world to live in for the next 6 months and you'll be fine.  

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Quiet
7.1.1  The Magic 8 Ball  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @7.1    9 years ago

have you ever noticed the truth takes few words, while BS like yours takes more than that?

( of course not :)

 
 
 
321steve - realistically thinkin or Duu
Sophomore Participates
8  321steve - realistically thinkin or Duu     9 years ago

"Words dont matter much, its deeds that count" President trump

I doubt trump himself did anything illegal, encouraging others to do so on his behalf, I'd say is totally plausible considering trumps win at any cost attitude.

Truth is needed. Will we ever get it ?

 
 
 
Galen Marvin Ross
Sophomore Quiet
8.1  Galen Marvin Ross  replied to  321steve - realistically thinkin or Duu @8    9 years ago

Nixon didn't do anything illegal until he obstructed justice either but, he still got impeached and, had to resign from office.

 
 
 
321steve - realistically thinkin or Duu
Sophomore Participates
8.1.1  321steve - realistically thinkin or Duu   replied to  Galen Marvin Ross @8.1    9 years ago

true, but that was a different case. 

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
8.2  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  321steve - realistically thinkin or Duu @8    9 years ago
I doubt trump himself did anything illegal, encouraging others to do so on his behalf, I'd say is totally plausible considering trumps win at any cost attitude.

So, when Trump told Lester Holt (and the whole country) on camera that he was always going to fire Comey because of that "Rusher" investigation "thing" you don't think that will qualify as an obstruction of justice?  If you're right and Trump had never done anything illegal, that all changed with those words and it makes his decision to fire Comey the most stupid thing a person could do.  Then there's that completely false statement he composed  made Sonny Boy release to explain the latter's meeting with Russian agents in order to get dirt on Hillary's emails.  That's misprision of a felony if Sonny Boy gets convicted of conspiracy with a foreign government to effect US elections. 

 
 
 
Rex Block
Freshman Silent
9  Rex Block    9 years ago

There was no obstruction of justice by firing Comey. Should have fired him immediately after assuming office.

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
9.1  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו  replied to  Rex Block @9    9 years ago
There was no obstruction of justice by firing Comey. Should have fired him immediately after assuming office.

See, that's the problem.  It's the old "shoulda, coulda, didn't" problem.  He mistakenly thought he had Comey in his pocket and when his lying attorney general had to recuse himself from the "Rusher" investigation, Trumpy panicked and did the most stupid thing possible (although, for Trumpy, that's become pretty much a daily thing now) especially if he was really innocent.  But then he did something even more stupid:  he accidentlally blurted out the truth (because he'd only ever be able to say something truthful by accident) to Lester Holt on national TV in full view and hearing of the entire American people.  When he said he'd been planning to fire Comey no matter what because of that investigation, "obstruction of justice" could have started flashing on the TV screens at that moment.  Poor Trumpy and poor the likes of you.   You thought he was some kind of brilliant "new kind" of savior of the rightwing kulturkampl and it turns out he's just a bigmouthed, fat, slobbering, self-promoting, self-centered, psychopathic idiot. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
10  seeder  JohnRussell    9 years ago

That question matters not. Mueller's "opinion" means nothing and, if it does, he needs to recuse himself immediately.

Comey and his team are deciding what or what not to investigate. To say that his opinion doesn't matter is ludicrous. 

We already know he and Comey are buds. We already know he doesn't personally care for Mr. Trump. But his job is to PROVE there was collusion between the Trump campaign and the Russian GovCo to "fix" the election. Couldn't happen. The only way it could be done would be to infiltrate the voting machines/change the vote count. That would be a YUGE undertaking and practically impossible to achieve.

Mueller's job is to conclude whether or not the Russian meddling in the election (which is not in dispute) was accompanied by criminal activity on the part of Americans.  It is NOT to have to prove that there was tampering with voting machines. 

And if you say that just the suggestion that Mrs. Clinton was dirty (and she was and her and the DNC LOST the Berniebot vote when they found out that the damned primaries were rigged against him) then that speaks "volumes" about the Clinton supporters. If they were dedicated to seeing her as POTUS, the leaks would not have swayed them one iota.............except as said for the Berniebots.

Has nothing to do with whether or not anyone in the Trump campaign conspired with Russians to try and effect the election. 

And again, Mueller's "opinion" matters not. IT is the letter of the law that does, there is NO Federal law concerning collusion, and it is NOT his call.

Collusion goes hand in hand with conspiracy. Conspiracy goes hand in hand with obstruction of justice. 

If a conspiracy involving Donald trump is exposed, it wont even need to be a criminal charge. That is when impeachment or the 25th amendment solution would kick in. 

Period. This is concerning the campaign. Ginning up other more serious charges should NOT be a consideration. And evidently you need the reminder that, MR. TRUMP IS NOTUNDER INVESTIGATION SINGLY.

Trump is under investigation the same way everyone else involved is. To say he is not under investigation is absurd. 

 
 
 
Colour Me Free
Senior Silent
10.1  Colour Me Free  replied to  JohnRussell @10    9 years ago

Hi, you may find this read interesting...

Jessica A. Levinson is a professor at Loyola Law School, Los Angeles, and is the president of the Los Angeles Ethics Commission.

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
10.2  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JohnRussell @10    9 years ago
Comey and his team are deciding what or what not to investigate. To say that his opinion doesn't matter is ludicrous.

Ahhhhh so Comey IS still part of the team.........

.was accompanied by criminal activity on the part of Americans.  It is NOT to have to prove that there was tampering with voting machines. 

Bingo good job. Now, what would that criminal activity be ......................

Has nothing to do with whether or not anyone in the Trump campaign conspired with Russians to try and effect the election. 

Has everything to do with it. The only reason there IS and investigation is because Mr. Trump won.........and if you deny that, then some are a bit more butthurt than I thought about said result.

Collusion goes hand in hand with conspiracy. Conspiracy goes hand in hand with obstruction of justice.

You MAY have a point there......first one today yet, it isn't a THIN line that separates the three. IF, big if, collusion is found (keep your fingers crossed. It is the only hope you have at this point and for what I don't know) Mr. Trump's first term will be well into the realm of completion before anything of consequence can be implemented not to mention seen to fruition.

If a conspiracy involving Donald trump is exposed, it wont even need to be a criminal charge.

I seriously thought we had left the "IFS' behind us by now but keep holding on to that branch as it cracks.

Trump is under investigation the same way everyone else involved is. To say he is not under investigation is absurd.

Again, the main thrust and whole reason is THE CAMPAIGN and any ties/collusion that MAY have taken place within it with the Russians. Was Mr. Trump part of that campaign. Yep. He was the candidate. He isn't stupid and if anything shows up even close, it will end up a he said/she said scenario as someone tries to save their own ass.

I see you ran down here instead of replying up above. Good move. Had I not come back, you may have gone unchallenged and your opinions would have gained some credibility. Kudos and great try.

Again, have a good day............

 
 
 
Explorerdog
Freshman Silent
10.2.1  Explorerdog  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @10.2    9 years ago

Because Comey was the Director of the FBI he could be compelled to testify, but he is not part of the team. I would be fun to watch the mud pies fly!

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
10.2.2  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @10.2    9 years ago
I see you ran down here instead of replying up above. Good move. Had I not come back, you may have gone unchallenged and your opinions would have gained some credibility. Kudos and great try.

ROFL

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
10.2.3  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  JohnRussell @10.2.2    9 years ago
That is one likely scenario. I am not going to waste my time going down the whole list for you. 
I am perfectly happy to let you be tortured by the drip drip. 

And yet, here you are. And thanks for going down that whole list thing...........

 
 
 
Explorerdog
Freshman Silent
10.2.4  Explorerdog  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @10.2    9 years ago

Anytime there is an indication of untoward activity always look to whom has the most to gain, little or should I say LIDDLE people seldom take big chances for no return.

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
10.2.5  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Explorerdog @10.2.4    9 years ago
LIDDLE people seldom take big chances for no return.

Good point. To go along with that, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.................Unless it would turn out in the favor of the not so LIDDLE one at the top and recognized by the same, the liddle one would be forced to come forward to receive that reward. In this case, I just don't think ANY nefarious plans, if there was any, even got CLOSE to fruition.................. as it turns out.

 
 
 
Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו
Junior Quiet
11  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו    9 years ago

Wow.  Right-wingers are renown for wishful and fanciful thinking but it's in hyperdrive up there.  This always happens when they're faced with the most unavoidable and looming disaster.  I particularly like the grasping of the idea of Gregg Jarret (funny already) that these indictments will actually make it easier to get rid of Mueller. That takes imagination I thought right-wingers weren't capable of but I have greatly underestimated them.

 
 
 
NuVeiw
Freshman Silent
11.1  NuVeiw  replied to  Atheist יוחנן בן אברהם אבינו @11    9 years ago

Yep they smugly insist that pres moron and his crooked administration, family have nothing to worry about..LOL oh well Nixon thought the same way but was totally destroyed by the truth and the outcome. This will exceed that and go down in history as the worst and most corrupt presidency in history. Knowing the trump followers on here they will just shrug their shoulders and say it was worth it as "they irritated Libs"

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Expert
11.1.1  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  NuVeiw @11.1    9 years ago

Nixon went down for the cover up. That's it..................You know, like lying to Congress type cover up..........

 
 
 
NuVeiw
Freshman Silent
11.1.2  NuVeiw  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @11.1.1    9 years ago

And because he was part of it ...you know and resigned before it got real bad...you know ...and then got a pardon before the crap really flew...you know. He was a crook and a low life but nothing like the crooked lying POS pres moron we have now.

 
 
 
magnoliaave
Sophomore Silent
12  magnoliaave    9 years ago

President Trump is great!  He keeps you on your toes and that's a good thing!  Be alert!

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
12.1  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  magnoliaave @12    9 years ago

Please tell me why you think a pathological liar who knows next to nothing about issues is "great". 

Can you put it into words. 

I am not asking why you think Trump is great, I'm asking you why you think a perpetually lying ignoramus is great. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
12.1.2  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to    9 years ago

No president has ever lied anywhere near the extent Trump lies. He has lied or misstated facts a couple thousand times, publicly, since taking office. 

No president has ever been as ignorant of issues as he is. 

He makes Obama look like ten Einsteins. 

He makes GW Bush look like   Carl Sagan.

Don't compare this clown to ANYONE else. 

 
 
 
pat wilson
Professor Quiet
12.1.3  pat wilson  replied to  JohnRussell @12.1.2    9 years ago

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