The left's hatred of Mike Pence undermines its hatred of Donald Trump
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
We know why President Trump is so hated. We've heard it time and again. The man is out of control. He's a threat to national security. He has damaged our international standing. He's unstable. He's volatile. He's in totally over his head. No one can work for him.
Just read the latest books about Trump. Listen to his former employees. Look at his tweets. Donald Trump must go!
In the words of Rep. Maxine Waters: "I say 'impeachment, impeachment, impeachment, impeachment, impeachment, impeachment, impeachment.'"
Is there any validity to the charges against Trump? Is there any truth to these concerns?
Perhaps there is some truth to some of them. Perhaps he has been autocratic. Perhaps he has created a White House environment that can be chaotic. He has certainly spoken out of turn at times and given his opponents plenty of fuel for their fire.
But I don't believe for a minute that these are the real reasons the left wants to get rid of President Trump.
I say that because many on the left fear Vice President Pence even more, pledging to get rid of him once they get rid of Trump.
Yet Mike Pence is an experienced politician, having served in the House of Representatives from 2001-2013 and as governor of Indiana from 2013-2017.
And Mike Pence is not unstable or volatile, nor does he have a history of alienating those who work for him, nor has he been accused of being an autocratic narcissist.
He is clearly in control of his words and actions, he has not insulted or maligned his opponents, and he has done nothing to disgrace the office of the Vice President. Yet, they say, he too must go ... he too is a threat ... he too must be removed.
To quote Maxine Waters once again: After getting rid of Trump, "You knock one down, and then we'll be ready for Pence. We'll get him, too."
Yes, Mike Pence must also go. Away with this man too!
Waters' words drew a sharp rebuke from Trump supporter Philip Schuyler, who tweeted :
"When Maxine Waters says, 'We'll impeach Trump,' she's fantasizing, since he didn't do anything wrong. But when she says re Pence, 'We'll get him too,' isn't she admitting that her party is closer to a vengeful mob than to a lawful org?"
But it's not just Maxine Waters saying this. The anti-Pence rhetoric has been building for months. Most recently, it was Omarosa Manigault Newman who echoed these sentiments. As reported on Yahoo News:
"Ms Manigault Newman, who is busy promoting her book, Unhinged: An Insider's Account of the Trump White House , was asked by TMZ which of the top White House executives was worse – the president or the vice president? 'Pence,' she shouted, before being driven away in a black SUV."
Yes, Pence is worse than Trump!
Back in July, New York Times op-ed writer Frank Bruni penned a piece titled "Mike Pence, Holy Terror. Are you sure you want to get rid of Donald Trump?" His article opens with these chilling words:
"There are problems with impeaching Donald Trump. A big one is the holy terror waiting in the wings.
"That would be Mike Pence, who mirrors the boss more than you realize. He's also self-infatuated. Also a bigot. Also a liar. Also cruel."
Mike Pence is a monster! The man would bring a reign of terror!
But there's something even worse, and it lies at the heart of Bruni's concerns: Pence "adds two ingredients that Trump doesn't genuinely possess: the conviction that he's on a mission from God and a determination to mold the entire nation in the shape of his own faith, a regressive, repressive version of Christianity. Trade Trump for Pence and you go from kleptocracy to theocracy."
Yes, Mike Pence wants to turn America into a Christian theocracy, with himself the earthly tyrant ruling in God's stead. Oh, the horror!
The Tylt website conducted a poll (apparently late in 2017), asking the question: "Who should liberals fear more: President Trump or a potential President Pence?" By a vote of 51.9 to 48.1 percent, the answer was that a Pence presidency would be more dangerous.
In support of this claim, Tylt cited a New Yorker article by Jane Mayer dated October 23, 2017. According to Mayer:
"Pence has the political experience, the connections, the discipline, and the ideological mooring that Trump lacks. He also has a close relationship with the conservative billionaire donors who have captured the Republican Party's agenda in recent years."
But that is not the worrying part. Rather,
"Even as [Governor] Pence argued for less government interference in business, he pushed for policies that intruded on people's private lives. In the early nineties, he joined the board of the Indiana Family Institute, a far-right group that supported the criminalization of abortion and campaigned against equal rights for homosexuals...."
In short, Pence is an evangelical Christian, a biblically-based conservative. As such, he could be a worse threat to the left than Donald Trump. (Really now, if the left could make President George Bush into a religious fanatic who allegedly waged war based on Bible prophecies, what will it do to Mike Pence?)
So, to repeat, I do believe there is some validity to some of the charges raised against President Trump. And at times, he is own worst enemy, spreading disunity and dissent rather than rallying the nation around his very real successes.
But, the truth be told, the vast majority of concerns raised by the left are merely a convenient ruse for the real issue, which is this: They hate the fact that their radical agenda is being thwarted. They despise the fact that some of their strongholds are being demolished. And they will do anything in their power to remove anyone who dares to get in their way, be it Donald Trump or Mike Pence.
The more conservative, the worse. The more Christian, much, much worse.
Let's not take our eyes off the real stakes involved.
Dr. Michael Brown is the host of the nationally syndicated Line of Fire radio program. His latest book is " Donald Trump Is Not My Savior: An Evangelical Leader Speaks His Mind About the Man He Supports As President ."
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Who "hates" either Pence or Trump? What evidence do you have that justifies the use of that verb?
Certainly, there are a lot of people who "hate" the policies defended by these two, but does anyone "hate" the men themselves? Please provide proof - that is to say personal attacks on the men, without any reference to that policies that they apply.
I hate both ofr them and I find their union to be hilarious. You have an uber conservative christian teaming up with a person so amoral that even Satan would take offense. I mean, as if I needed anymore reason to blow off religion, Trump/Pence sealed it.
It demonstrates how deeply Pence's faith runs.... He never compromises.
Hate, schmate. Donald Trump is a truly despicable human being and an absolutely horrible president. Does feeling this way mean I 'hate' him? Dunno, does it really matter? Pence is more delusional than despicable. I would hate to have a delusional president, does this mean I hate Pence? What difference does it make? These guys are both unfit for public office and need to be removed. Whether this or that person hates them or not, means diddly squat.
Vocabulary is never innocent. I can "despise" Donald Trump - find him despicable - but not "hate" him.
"Hate" carries overtones that are visceral. Policy should be based on intellect.
No. I try to be a Christian. You know... "Love one another"...
So all this "hate" bothers me.
I fail to see any significant difference between hating and despising, means basically the same thing to me. They're synonyms, and rather subjective terms anyway. To you, hate is a much stronger term; to others maybe not. I would say policy should be based on facts and common sense. Of course, any policy should be intellectually sound...
Try WHAT sometime? Finding Donald Trump despicable? Basing policy on intellect? What is the 'it' you want Bob to try?
I said "I try".
Pay attention.
That’s the problem with words. They have definitions... and connotations...
Why are you so protective of Trump and Pence?
Or do you just like trying to draw a reaction from the "liberals" on Newstalkers, [deleted]
And they can be twisted and manipulated so easily...
My main objection to Pence at this point in time is that his lips are superglued to trump's butt. His submission to Trump is entire, and a little creepy. One of the news channels played a "greatest hits" compilation of Pence slavering praise on Trump that was painful to watch.
If and when Pence becomes president he will be an instant lame duck, because he is so closely associated to Trump through his role as presidential boot licker. Whatever executive orders he managed to put out could be reversed as soon as a Democrat becomes president in 2020.
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Mike Pence has made himself into a joke.
And the Trumpian-right spews substantive-free demagoguery-pronouncements rather than just shutting-the-fuck-up when it cannot refute inconvenient truth!
Hate Hate Hate...
Every Republican since the "Nazi" Goldwater.
An article under Senator Barry Goldwater's byline in the current issue of a right‐wing West German weekly has turned out to be an extract from a campaign brochure on the Republican Presidential nominee's views.
The incident was the latest in a continuing series of flurries involving the Arizonan and the West Germans. Earlier this month, Senator Goldwater canceled a visit to West Germany, and the Muenchner Merkur, a pro‐Government newspaper, said this had been ”because rightist radicalist organizations had tried to exploit his announced visit for political purposes.“
The latest article, in the Deutsche National Zeitung und Soldaten‐Zeitung, had the Senator attacking the United States proposal in the North Atlantic Treaty Organization for a multinational nuclear force as ”an insult to the intelligence of our allies.“
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SAY THE WORD, SEAN and I'll bring you up-to-date on the current Nazi/White Supremacist/Republican-connected contingent!
Be back to the site this afternoon.
Yes, thanks for pointing out the fake smear the leftwing media manufactured during 1964 trying to tie Goldwater to German "Neo Nazis." It was, as has been well documented, completely false.
If you can show such "documentation" I'll have my comment deleted; otherwise, again, SAY THE WORD, SEAN and I'll bring you up-to-date on the current Nazi/White Supremacist/Republican-connected contingent!
You mean your link isn't enough of a refutation?
Goldwater, an ethnically Jewish libertarian, was accused of being a Nazi by the media because the largest paper in Germany excerpted a speech and he mused about taking a European vacation (not even to Germany).
That's how demented the progressives have been for the last 50 years. Maybe you want to start calling McCain a racist again too?
Let's compare ties with racists though. We'll start with Farrakhan, who Democratic leaders still sit with to this day. Sickening.
Truth can be very subjective as I'm sure you are aware. One person's truth is another fantasy and vice versa. Have a good day.
Why don't you give Sean the same message since he raised the "nazi" issue … I just responded!
Unless you're Rudy Giuliani, no, "truth", by its very definition can not be "very subjective." Perception, belief, interpretation, faith … THEY ARE LIKELY TO BE VERY SUBJECTIVE … but not "truth"!
That which is "true" is in accordance with fact or reality.
Six years before Pence prostituted himself by becoming Trump's V.P., he said …
“There is no finer, more moving, or more profound understanding of the nature of the presidency and the command of humility placed upon it.”
Thus, his standard for judging a president!
HYPOCRITE PENCE will be impeached along with Trump, his article of impeachment will be, among others, lying with regard to Mike Flynn's connection during the Trump campaign, to Sergey Kislyak, the Russian ambassador.
I refuse to believe anyone honestly believes that.
You have every right to refuse to believe that anyone honestly believes it … but, unlike a statement of incredulity with no counter-points, my comment was very specific as to my belief.
Other than him being Trump's lackey, I have nothing against Pence so far. Note that I said....so far.
Pence only has his fake piety. I'm sure he wants to believe his own crap, but he is the wolf in sheep's clothing, his faith means nothing when he goes along with the most amoral person in the country, actively defending and praising the moron like the sycophant he is. I have even no respect for the person Pence plays on the national stage. The hypocrisy in his values offends me. Using faith for politics says it all.
I'm not sure it's fake.
I think he believes that by never being alone in a room with any woman other than his wife... he is doing God's will. In other words, Mike Pence imagines God as a dirty old man.
That's far scarier if Pence really believes it, than if it's faked.
I don't believe him anymore. I used to give him the benefit of the doubt, but after the last couple of years, he obviously has no values at all. He's swimming in the amoral pool and he now belongs there. Using his faith for political gains as he ignores the real cesspool of amorality he swims in, no bueno.
There are people who "think" upside down. Something is true because they believe it.
Pence is close to God. The proof is that Pence knows God. Is that circular? Yup.
It's the same for Trump, who knows stuff because he knows it.
Of course they get along.
...who has no problem working with a man who is about as unChristian as it is possible to be... who has no qualms about denying health care to the poor...
A "Godly moral man"...