Putin made maximalist claims to Ukrainian territory in Trump summit: Sources
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
The peace terms that Russian President Vladimir Putin laid out in his summit with President Trump included that Ukraine withdraw entirely from two of its eastern regions, two sources briefed on the call told Axios.
Why it matters: Trump will meet Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky on Monday in Washington. He also told European leaders in a post-summit call that he wants to arrange a trilateral summit with Putin and Zelensky as soon as next Friday, the sources said. But based on Putin's conditions, a major breakthrough appears unlikely.
- Trump also invited the European leaders on the call to join Monday's White House meeting, the sources said.
Breaking it down: Trump and his special envoy Steve Witkoff briefed Zelensky and the leaders of the U.K., France, Germany, Italy, Finland, NATO and the European Commission on Putin's positions last night on their flight back to Washington.
- They said Putin had demanded that Ukraine cede two of the four regions to which Russia has laid claim (Donetsk and Luhansk), and freeze the front lines in the other two (Kherson and Zaporizhzhia). Russia controls nearly all of Luhansk, but only about three-quarters of Donetsk.
- Putin presented his willingness to stop pushing forward in Kherson and Zaporizhzhia as a concession, in exchange for Ukraine withdrawing from Donetsk, one source briefed on the call said. In reality, Russia hasn't made any progress in those areas for some time.
- A Ukrainian source said the U.S. side had the impression Putin was willing to negotiate over the small slivers of the Sumy and Kharkiv regions under Russian control.
Between the lines: This proposal calls for significantly more territory to shift from Ukrainian to Russian control than vice versa — something Moscow might argue is reasonable, as Russia has the upper hand militarily, but which Ukraine would almost certainly reject.
- Putin also requested that the U.S. recognize Russia's sovereignty in the parts of Ukraine it would gain under a peace deal, according to the source.
- Trump called the meeting a success and said he and Putin agreed on most issues, though Putin appears to have stuck to most of his maximalist demands.
The intrigue: Putin did say he was willing to discuss security guarantees for Ukraine, the source said. But he mentioned China as one of the possible guarantors, possibly suggesting he would oppose a security force consisting of NATO troops.
- Ukraine and its European backers have been discussing the idea of a "coalition of the willing" standing behind Ukraine to prevent a future Russian invasion.
- Ukraine was encouraged by the fact that Trump endorsed the idea of security guarantees for Ukraine in the post-summit call, according to a Ukrainian official, who said the matter was not discussed in detail.
- Trump has said this wouldn't be a NATO mission, but Ukraine hopes the U.S. will participate in some fashion. The official said the matter would be discussed further during Zelensky's White House visit.
What to watch: Trump told Zelensky and the other participants in the call that he wants to hold a trilateral summit "fast," as early as August 22, two sources told Axios. Putin has not publicly committed to such a meeting.
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Now we know why Trump had the long face and didn't go into any details about the meeting.
There is no way Zelensky is going to accept such a deal.
It is time for Trump to walk away. He gets credit for going the extra mile, but there is no solution to this war.
Zelensky seems to think that Ukraine can tough it out and achieve some kind of victory, as long as someone else is paying the bills and providing the equipment. Zelensky is going to have capitulate and come to terms, or the senseless killings will continue.
Ukraine is of no strategic use to the US. It's past time for us to walk away from this quagmire. Let the Europeans deal with it,
His soldiers have fought valiantly. American monetary aid over the past 3 years has been enormous and he has had the benefit of some of the best weapons and American intelligence. However, Russia is now on a real wartime footing and is fighting a slow grinding war of attrition.
Ukraine is of no strategic use to the US.
It could be the bulwark against Russian expansion.
Churchill seems to think that Great Britain can tough it out and achieve some kind of victory, as long as someone else is providing the equipment (Lend/Lease). Britain is going to have to capitulate to Hitler and come to terms...
Actually, Churchill wanted the opposite. FDR was reluctant to break the isolationism of the US, but signed the Lend Lease Bill in March of 1941.
Why does the left want to keep this war going and innocent people dying because Zelensky wants to be the national saviour? Doesn't make sense.
Trump gets credit for trying. But he made matters worse.
He made matters worse because he is not a negotiator, he is a bully. If he cannot bully, he has no game. Trump is a disaster for this nation (and the world).
We have a president who takes a meeting that was a total failure and then comes out and calls it a success. We, as Americans, have allowed this level of bullshit and lying and now we are seeing the results.
Peace negotiations are always tough. In this case they have been impossible.
The blame has to go to Biden, who got us involved in this mess to begin with.
I don't think Putin allowed himself to be bullied.
You mean the Biden who said he would accept a minor incursion? They aren't criticizing him, are they.
(You quoted Greg in your response to me.)
Does it not bother you that the guy you continue to praise as some kind of hero insisted dozens of times that he could end the war with a phone call??
You recognize the difficulty in peace negotiations, yet continue to support and excuse a clown who thinks he has magic negotiation powers? Trump is delusional and a lying sack of shit. He is unfit to be PotUS.
Of course not. Trump cannot bully Putin.
Oh of course, never acknowledge the failure of an R, always blame a D. Partisan nonsense.
The D's need to man up and accept their failures, instead of blaming Trump and the R's for everything.
Partisan nonsense indeed!
That was meant for Greg.
Does it not bother you that the guy you continue to praise as some kind of hero insisted dozens of times that he could end the war with a phone call??
No, it doesn't. It bothers me that your guy said he would accept a minor incursion.
You recognize the difficulty in peace negotiations, yet continue to support and excuse a clown who thinks he has magic negotiation powers?
Trump is trying for peace. The democrats never even made an attempt at a peace deal even when the time was right, back when Russian forces were repulsed around Kiev. Instead, they wanted the US to keep sending $billions to Ukraine, even Republicans voted for that. I wonder if there were kickbacks involved?
Despite your partisan hatred of Trump, you are going to be faced with some hard facts:
If the war continues, Europe will have to pay for the weapons that the US sends to Ukraine and the days of the US sending blank checks to Ukraine are over. Russia is now fully geared for a way of attrition and with 1 million casualties already invested, Putin really can't turn away from it. As much as I would love to see a strong Ukraine come out victorious, the likely winner will eventually be Russia. The only caveat is that something strange might just happen to Putin. I wouldn't be surprised if there was an announcement one day from the Kremlin that Putin's heart stopped during the night and that Dmitry Medvedev was once again taking charge of the government and bringing the Russian troops home. Maybe we can hope for that.
I don't have a guy. I recognize that pure partisans do not believe it possible for others to NOT be partisan, but that is a failure on their part.
He wants peace. He gets credit for that. Most everyone wants peace.
Again, my criticism of Trump is not based on my dislike of him personally but rather based on his words and deeds. And your pathetic projection attempt to deem me partisan does not change the reality of Trump's failures and corruption. My criticism of Trump has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with his party.
Putin can only be defeated by superior force (economic, political, and military).
US funding has never been a blank check, and Trump can continue funding Ukraine. It, in a politically practical sense, is his choice.
Attrition or not, shore up Ukraine to push Russia out.
As I have noted before, the options are to capitulate to Putin and give him what he wants or defeat him. Defeating him is multi-faceted. The most likely defeat is to overwhelm his military to the point where negotiation is his most viable option. The long-term consequences of allowing a brutal thug like Putin to invade and prevail are far more damaging than dealing with this right now.
No, the best way is through secondary sanctions which will bring the Russian economy to a grinding halt.
[deleted][✘]
All of the above. Military, economic, diplomatic.
Were you there? If not, well, no substantive claim it is.
He stated that if Russia did not agree to a cease fire he would impose sanctions. Where are those sanctions?
By his own statements the meeting qualifies as an absolute failure, Putin showed up where Trump kowtowed, praised, and slobbered all over him. Putin agreed to nothing and got everything he expected in return. So yes, Trump deserves credit for that fiasco.
There are already sanctions, the strongest of which is the secondary tariff on India which got Putin to seek a talk with Trump.
Putin agreed to nothing and got everything he expected in return.
Putin got nothing. Nothing was agreed to.
Okay, so we're all ignoring the Trump promised MORE sanctions if no ceasefire?
Correct. Putin got no sanctions that were threatened. Which was thew entire reason he agreed to the meeting.
"Inflation is transitory"
"Biden is sharp as a tack"
"He does laps around his staff"
I went back and looked and Lordy be.....these claims were ignored by almost all leftists here.
Why are we now worried about claims and ignoring them?
You do not think inflation is transitory?
In fact, it was. Still is. A basic fact of economics.
Lol. Even Biden's economic team admitted they made mistakes about inflation being transitory.[✘]
You're comparing claims by any miscellaneous person you could find, to a specific statement made by the President of the United States?
What would that be? Comparing apples to lightning?
They were not "miscellaneous" they were people like KJP and members of his cabinet.
I guess when you are so out of reality as dementia Joe and his DEI hire VP was, you need someone to speak for you
So none were made by any POTUS? Ssttrreettcchhiinngg.....
Since the past POTUS was unable to string 2 sentences together, much like his DEI VP, someone had to speak for him…..and pretty much do everything else for him.
Rather than critique this ridiculous exaggeration, I thought it would be interesting to see what ChatGPT has to offer. I gave it this prompt:
Critique this: "<your post here>"
It delivered the following:
That sounds like someone else who is trying to turn an utterly losing meeting, into some kind of win. Not going to say who this was, but I just happened to go on a cruise up there recently and saw some beautiful glaciers.
Trump called the meeting a great success.
Trump said before the meeting if there wasnt a cease fire agreed to at the meeting there would be severe consequences for Russia. No cease fire was agreed to.
Marco Rubio has been on tv all morning stammering, disassembling, making excuses, in other words being the good soldier for Trump.
America, writ large, has been babying Trump for years in order to try and avoid his wrath. The media has been disgraceful in the way they treat Trump with kid gloves.
Trump just wants this to be over, he doesnt care how it ends.
Trump never cared about how it ended. His plan (IMO) has always been to 'end the war' by forcing Ukraine to capitulate.
I agree with that, but I think he would just as happy if Russia capitulated. He then would enter into a program to help Russia rehabilitate itself.
True, Trump does not care how it ends. Ukraine capitulating was the easy path because Trump could more easily screw up an ally than pressure the aggressor.
Should Ukraine capitulate, since they have no chance to come out victorious. Should the US devote any more resources to the continued killing?
The US should continue to support Ukraine with military weapons, intelligence, diplomacy, economic sanctions against Russia, etc. to bring Putin to the table with serious intent to negotiate.
That is what we should do
That's exactly what Zelensky is counting on. To keep pouring our resources into this bottomless pit is insane
You underestimate Putin's long game; he's not giving up Crimea or the Donbas region.
He obviously is hoping for continued support.
No I do not. That is why I am calling for a massive multi-dimensional push to get Putin to the table.
He was on ABC's This Week and completely owner Martha Raddatz. He made a lot of important points there. The one I thought most important was this:
"So these negotiations, as much as everyone would love it to be a live pay per view event, these discussions only work best when they are conducted privately in negotiate -- serious negotiations in which people who have to go back and respond to constituencies, because even authoritarian governments have constituencies they have to respond to, people have to go back and defend these agreements that they make and so -- and figure out a way to explain them to people. So we need to create space for concessions to be made. But of course, concessions were asked."
I've been pointing out all along that Putin has to explain to his people (and those behind him) what he got for the 1 million casualties.
And the bottom line:
"Ultimately, at the end of the day, we have to get the Russian side to agree to things that they don't want to agree to if we're going to have peace. if not, they'll just be a war, they'll keep killing each other, and life will go on in America and in the rest of the world, but not for Ukraine."
So, let us wish them well John.
Same is true for negotiating trade deals. Explain that to your idiot boss, Marco.
Marco Rubio looked nervous, and was simply trying to put the best face possible on.
I dont believe "private" negotiations have gotten anywhere and I dont believe anything Trump says about it.
Steve Witkoff on CNN this morning
Putin is achieving militarily what Russia obtained diplomatically in the Minsk Agreements. The Minsk Agreements were a trilateral accord that the government in Kiev refused to implement after signing. The 2022 Russian invasion used military force to implement the framework of the Minsk Agreements.
What is Zelensky going to do with the separatists in Luhansk and Donetsk? They fought a civil war for eight years before the Russian invasion. And they were signatories to the Minsk Agreements. The bilateral bullshit negotiations have locked the separatists out. Are the Ukrainian separatists going to just go away?
The military strategy provided Pres. Biden was to fall back to fortress NATO and hold Russia at the borders. The expectation was that Russia would roll over Ukraine pretty quickly and annex the entire country. If Russia is objecting to NATO then why would Russia want to rub up against NATO by annexing all of Ukraine? The military planners deluded themselves into Cold War thinking that proved to be completely wrong. Putin wants Ukraine as a buffer with NATO. Putin wants Ukraine to be a demilitarized zone so that NATO can be held at arm's length. Putin can't achieve that by annexing Ukraine.
The Cold War doofuses in the Pentagon misread the situation, gave Biden bad advice, and now we're stuck in a quagmire. What the hell does Trump think he's doing? Trump can't trust advice from the US military because they are too busy covering their brass over dragging the US into a quagmire. Trump can't ignore the Minsk Agreements because Putin is obtaining what Russia wanted in the Minsk Agreements through unilateral military means.
Trump was elected to revive the industrial base of the US economy. Trump won't get one goddammed thing out of Ukraine. Ukraine is a lose-lose situation for the US because that was the advice given to and implemented by Biden. The only possible things Trump can do is to elevate Russia, Europe, and Ukraine to dominate the world order at the expense of the United States.
“The only possible things Trump can do is to elevate Russia, Europe, and Ukraine to dominate the world order at the expense of the United States.”
It is China that is filling the void as trump has ceded our role as the world’s most influential player on the international stage…economically and diplomatically in his ‘America first’ campaign. A short sighted policy that is only isolating us. Isolationism has never and will never yield positive results in the long term.
china is keeping the Russian economy afloat, the Military in the field and has told the EU it will not let Russia lose. Is it winning friends and allies by ensuring the war continues?
“Is it winning friends and allies by ensuring the war continues?”
Seems after the acquiescent ‘summit’, the same can be asked of this administration.
Explain how the US can end the war by preventing settlement talks and without the deaths of American troops.
Ukraine has created the void. What can the US do about China while being mired in eastern Europe? The Europeans are double dealing with China the same way they have double dealt with Russia.
Why is Ukraine more important to the United States than the threats posed by China? Why is trying to change the outcome of World War II more important than preparing for the 21st century? The Pentagon is still populated by doofuses trying to strategize a nuclear war with Russia. The United States wiping Russia off the map will not regain US dominance in the Pacific.
India seems to be helping Russia's economy, too. Hungary, Germany, France, Italy, and Turkey are doing their share to prop up the Russian economy, too.
With all the double dealing going on, how does the United States challenge Chinese dominance by being mired in a European war that Europe isn't trying to win? China is a Pacific power, not an Atlantic power. Is China afraid of NATO?
The tariffs and trade policies initiated by Trump have shown the United States cannot even dominate North America. The United States has cities and states waving white flags and demanding to open borders to imports from China. How does the United States confront China with a lack of resolve?
How does defeating Russia and reestablishing Ukrainian borders benefit the United States? The United States is carrying a heavier burden that detracts from the real challenges confronting the United States. How does the United States dominating European trading partners with China benefit the United States? What does the United States get out of this deal?
Maybe they are soulmates after all. She has the same kind of chicken scratch signature he does.