Forget White Privilege, Let's Talk About Leftist Perogative.
I’m beginning to think leftist activists believe that their social views and moral opinions give them some sort of default authority which everyone else has to respect. It is as though they just take for granted that once they step forward and begin to protest that everyone else is supposed to just recognize that they are to be listened to and to step back and allow them to take charge. It’s like when a person is having a medical emergency in public, and then someone steps out of the crowd and confidently declares “I’m a doctor!” at which point everyone else steps back and lets the doctor take charge. Nobody challenges the doctor because everyone recognizes that he has the medical expertise to intervene appropriately, and so they step aside and allow the doctor to do his thing. I think leftists think that they are entitled to the same freestanding culturally sanctioned authority over political and social situations that doctors get to exercise during medical emergencies. They seem to think that once they begin pulling out their signs and start chanting and protesting during an ICE raid (or whatever) that this is like a man saying “I’m a doctor” during a medical emergency, and that the ICE officer or whoever else in attendance is supposed to just step back and let them take control of the entire situation. They seem to think that they can simply gather to protest an ICE raid or confront the border patrol (or whatever else), confidently declare “I’m a social justice activist with a degree in sociology,” and then everyone else is supposed to step back and start taking their cues from the activist.
It would be tempting to call it “leftist privilege,” in order to turn the social justice activists’ own language back around on them, but that doesn’t quite capture the phenomenon I have in mind. Privilege refers to the supposed unearned advantages, benefits, and power that are given to people because they belong to the dominant social group (i.e., straight white males). So the term “privilege” doesn’t quite capture the point because leftists aren’t asking for privilege, they are acting like they ought to be treated with the same deference that we treat doctors during medical emergencies.
I think the right term is “leftist prerogative.” A prerogative is a special and exclusive right, power, or authority that a person holds by virtue of their social position, status, or rank. I think leftist activists see themselves as occupying some sort of de facto social office or position that grants them prerogative to act outside the boundaries of civil society when they want to interfere with the affairs of other people for reasons of social justice. They believe they have some officially sanctioned moral authority or culturally recognized social position that grants them the prerogative to intervene in any situation they happen to stumble upon, and everyone else (including law enforcement) has to defer to them.
Following this line of reasoning they violate the laws, rules, and norms of civil society during their protests (blocking cops, shutting down roads, vandalizing property) while acting as though it should be taken for granted that they have the prerogative to do so. When approached and asked about why they think they are allowed to do this, the leftists very often reply with something like “ICE raids are racist,” or “we’re marching against ICE” as if those things call attention to some relevant feature of the situation which explains why they are allowed to interfere with law enforcement. The only reason they think this is a good explanation is that they think that there is a culturally recognized convention that gives activists the right to protest using whatever methods they want, even if those methods break the law or interfere with law enforcement. So, when they say “we’re resisting ICE” they think this provides the information needed to allow one to intuit the morally and socially relevant factors which, when combined with what they see as their default freestanding moral authority, grant them the prerogative to declare themselves exempt from the normal functioning rules, laws, and norms of civil society. In other words, they think the fact of their leftist prerogative to do as they wish is obvious, all that is needed is to answer questions about why they are protesting is to provide the context within which they are invoking their rightful prerogative to interfere with law enforcement. Further, since they think that their leftist prerogative is a social convention that is widely recognized by everyone, they therefore believe it is the job of everyone else to adjust their actions in order to accommodate the leftists as they exempt themselves from the same norms, rules, and conventions that everyone else has to follow.
The early 2020s were home to the peak of leftist prerogative, as leftist activists and protesters walked around society with impunity canceling people, intervening in other people’s lives, interfering with law enforcement, and generally acting like they owned the place. They held struggle sessions in corporate settings, tried to get their bosses fired by ginning up internet mobs, mobbed people online, and generally engaged in all sorts of horrific antisocial behavior while trying to make society “unpalatable” for those whose social and political views they opposed.
The best explanation for this is that they think their adherence to leftist social and political opinions bestows upon them a sort of moral authority that grants them the prerogative to suspend the typical expectations and conventions of civil society, and to flout the norms, rules, and laws that govern everyday life in the pursuit of their social justice ideology.
All of this comes from the fact that they believe they have leftist prerogative to do whatever they want to advance their cause.
This isn’t an argument for allowing police to declare open season on protesters, nor is it to serve as a justification for curtailing First Amendment rights. The point here is that the reason so many leftists feel totally comfortable accosting well-known conservatives in public, blocking highways, getting in people’s faces, or surrounding people in restaurants and intimidating them as we saw during the summer of 2020, is that they think they have the social standing, moral obligation, and cultural authority to be able to do those things with impunity and still be immune from the consequences.
art of the reason they think this is that for a period of about 8 years (from 2016-2023) most of our important governmental and civic institutions legitimized this behavior by allowing it, cheering it on, providing support for it, and by refusing to enforce the laws, rules, and norms against such behavior. Charges against vandals were dropped, work-place rules against harassment were not enforced against social justice activists who targeted co-workers, and norms of civility were tossed out the window writ large when it came to leftist activists. The result was that leftist activists essentially DID have the prerogative to engage in any sort of behavior they wanted so long as it was done in the name of social justice, and nobody put a stop to it for fear of reprisals.
For a very long time leftists have believed that everyone else needed to rearrange the world in order to accommodate their activism, and they acted as though the public space belonged to them, and everyone else only got access according to the good graces of the left. This is no longer true, and now the activists are beginning to face consequences for their antisocial behavior. Companies are firing people for trying to take over companies, police are standing their ground, arrests are being made for vandalism, and people are getting fired for trying to bully their co-workers in the name of social justice. Additionally, as shown by the recent dustup over comments made by Zohran Mamdani’s Tenant Advocate, Cea Weaver, leftists are now beginning to face much tougher scrutiny for their bombastic rhetoric, authoritarian social views, and outright communist economic policies. (Cea Weaver’s explicitly stated position is that communist position that property is theft and home ownership is a weapon of white supremacy).
I don’t think that leftist prerogative was ever legitimate, but I do think leftists believe they are entitled to leftist prerogative and that their political views give them moral authority which entitles them to act as though they have the prerogative to enforce their moral views wherever they go using whatever tactics they see fit. So now we are stuck with an entire generation of leftists who think that enforcing their social views on everyone is their cultural and political birthright to which they are entitled by virtue of being leftists. However, as they are about to find out, it is no longer 2020, and people are refusing to be subject to the moral authority of resentful woke scolds and downwardly mobile political activists with an axe to grind. Leftists who continue to act like they have the prerogative to enforce their views on everyone using whatever means they feel like, are about to find out that they really do not have the social standing, moral authority, or cultural power to act as though they run the place.
I predict that we are going to see an uptick in confrontations with police, and in violence against law enforcement as leftists who think that they have the right to act with impunity fail to understand the gravity of the situation when they resist the orders of law enforcement. The 2020’s are over, and the latitude and deference that was given to leftist activists during that era has long since evaporated. Police are no longer willing to negotiate the terms of order with protestors looking to block roads, takeover parks, or otherwise hold the public hostage by illegitimately interfering with other people’s lives…they are looking to enforce the law, and they are not asking the permission of the activists to do it.
Again, none of this justifies over-reach by law enforcement, nor does it venerate the use of force against peaceful orotest by law-abiding people. It merely serves to explain why Social Justice activists behave as though the laws, rules, norms, and expectations that apply to everyone else in society do not apply to them.
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It's not original to note that "progressivism" and other far left movements has by and large replaced religion as the movement that attracts fanatics. T The 20th century certainly demonstrates that. But this article does a good job of translating how that zealotry plays out in modern America. The type of person who was a grand inquisitor 500 years ago is now on the internet exhorting people to poison ICE agents and threatening the people at the hotels they stays at.
They see themselves as above the law. It doesn't matter if what ICE is doing is perfectly legal and authorized by Democratically passed laws. It's offends their morals. Thus they are justified in committing crimes to implement by force the demands of what they perceive as the "higher power" (their morals) over democratically passed law.
Since the article was written, the examples of this keep multiplying. Protesters beat up a guy for wearing patriotic clothing. Like Mao's Red guards, they swarm reports of ICE agents eating lunch and mistakenly swarm and harass 5 software engineers. They invade a church service, disrupt it and gleefully celebrate making kids scared. Nothing matters to the zealot but feeling they are following the truth path of righteousness. Not laws, not norms. It's incompatible with a democracy and when enough zealots ban together, leads to insurrection.
xmas is over, sounds like maga wants to replace those streetlight decorations with something more maga oriented ... /s
What "maga" decorations won't offend you?
I used to think I was pretty much just a regular person, but I was born “white” into a two-parent household which now labels me as "Privileged", racist and responsible for slavery.
I am a fiscal conservative, which by today's standards makes me a fascist because I plan & budget. But I now find out that I am not here because I earned it, but because I was "advantaged”.
I am heterosexual, which according to some folks, now makes me a homophobe.
I am not a Muslim, which now labels me as an infidel.
I believe in the 2nd Amendment, which makes me a threat to the liberals, and I get labeled as being part of a militia.
I am older than 40, making me a useless person with outdated ideas and values.
I think and I reason, and I doubt much of what the "mainstream" media tells me, which makes me a "Right-wing conspiracy nut”.
I am proud of my heritage and our inclusive American culture, making me a xenophobe.
I believe in hard work, fair play, and fair compensation according to everyone’s merits, which today makes me a target of socialists and Antifa.
I believe our system guarantees freedom of effort - not freedom of outcome, which must make me a borderline sociopath.
I believe in a strong defense and protection of America for and by all citizens, now making me a militant.
I am proud of our flag, what it stands for and the many who died to let it fly, so I stand during our National Anthem - so I must be a racist.
I think that all lives matter, which labels me as a racist.
I think the riots and destruction of property around our country are wrong and are just an excuse to push a political agenda, so I'm labeled a racist.
I support our law enforcement, servicemen and women, which labels me as a racist.
Liberals have tried to make me feel bad about who I am! Based on everything above, some want me to believe I am a bad person; I'm not, I'm a good person who loves my family, my country and my faith.
God bless America!
Sounds good to me
I'm not referring to you personally, but the entire conservative ideology has become "snowflakes". You just listed 16 examples of how your viewpoint is disrespected in America. Disrespected by who? Those who disagree with you. Probably 40-45 % of Americans broadly agree with most of what you say. Another 30 or 40% somewhat agree with what you say. Even I, a liberal agree with some of what you say.
Conservatives and white people are not "victims" of unfair treatment, they are people with a set of beliefs that are sometime in contention, due to inherently prejudicial aspects of our society. It has to be worked out, ultimately hopefully for the better.
You know it is bad when all the names they call you won't fit on a tee shirt, front and back.
The difference is those 40-45 percent that agree with him do not go straight to insults, assaults, threats, murder, when they are told something they do not agree with him.
Much like many of the left tend to do when confronted with a different point of view.
We see it daily, some of it on this very site, where a conservative is called names and lambasted for not agreeing to the progressive lines. I've been called names and told I'm "defending Trump" when all I've done is not follow the crowd and hang him in effigy. I believe you know of a few of those incidents.
I hope it can be worked out, the problem I see is that the two extreme sides have locked themselves into their beliefs and refuse to acknowledge that other people can have a difference of opinion and still not be a bad person. The extreme outlook seems to allow for broadbrush treatment, such as the 'snowflakes' comment. By broadbrush, I mean how you brand 'the entire conservative ideology'. That type of statement tells me that someone refuses to acknowledge any difference of opinion and believe that their opinion is the only correct one.
Will we ever move beyond this contention and become better people? I don't know but I do know that it won't start until people realize that their opinion is not the only correct way of life.
When the Italians, Irish, Poles, German, and others mass migrated to American in the 19th and early 20th centuries none of them had adherence to a heritage related to the United States. When millions of Africans were forcibly migrated to the United States they knew nothing of America's heritage.
The Irish , Italians , and Jews developed a criminal element within their ranks as seen through statistics from the late 19th and early 20th century. Should all of those people have been deported on sight?
If American "heritage" can include all those immigrants, why cant we wait to see if the more recent immigrants develop the same heritage the early 20th century immigrants had?
I would say because 120 years ago there was no threat coming from ethnic demographics.
Trump is deranged. He is mentally ill. On what basis should someone like that be leading America? Just stop defending Trump. I'd be more than happy to go back to debating on another basis than Trump.
I dont have any regrets at all about insulting people who continue to support Trump even though it is totally obvious that he is utterly corrupt, and mentally erratic (at best). [deleted][✘]
I would say because back then the immigrants attempted to integrate themselves with the American culture. They pushed themselves to belong. We don't see that as much anymore.
This is a myth.
From our earliest beginnings as colonies, immigrants have looked to settle near other people with whom they shared a culture, language, ethnicity, or religion. They don’t just plop themselves down in a neighborhood where no one is familiar, and then just immediately set about living with new customs and language.
There is a reason big cities have neighborhoods known as “Little Italy,” “Little Tokyo,” “Chinatown,”or “Germantown.” There is a reason we have celebratory “holidays” like St. Patrick’s Day or Cinco de Mayo and Chinese New Year.
However, over the generations, their children and grandchildren become assimilated and identify as American more than wherever their ancestors came from. This process is natural, and hardly unique to a specific time or ethnicity.
America is not supposed to be about assimilation. It is supposed to be a place where peoples of all backgrounds can come together. There is not some kind of requirement that people just give up who they were. There is really only one subset of our culture out there demanding that newcomers assimilate right away.
“It is supposed to be a place where peoples of all backgrounds can come together.”
And we are all the better for it. Unless, of course, one is willing to only dine at some ‘cracker barrel’…
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It is hilarious that so many people think that no matter what they do, no one should have the right to insult them. They vote for a 34 time convicted felon and admitted sexual predator, they're offended that you'd even bring that up. These folk are metaphorically gargling rancid diarrhea aka rightwing conservative lies daily and then they look at the rest of us with that shit eating grin and either go "What?" or get angry and cuss at us. If it weren't so deadly serious for America, I'd just be laughing in these fools shit stained faces and just ignore them, but since they're enabling a disgusting push towards Christo-fascism it forces us to take them seriously.
Nope. But if you're attempting to stop gay people from having all the same privileges that you enjoy, then yeah.
Wrong again. I think all religions should stay the fuck out of our schools, courts and government. Trying to inject any personal brand of religion whether Muslim, Christian or any other faith into our government is what makes one a conceited dick hole.
Wrong again. Lots of liberals and progressives' own guns, they simply want consistent gun safety laws that keep some types of weapons out of the hands of the mentally unstable and criminals.
I'm a lot older than you and I don't feel outdated or undervalued as I keep an open mind and read voraciously.
If you dismiss the "mainstream" because you simply distrust it, then you're clearly not thinking or reasoning. Trying listening and understanding before you dismiss it outright. It's the ignorant dismissing and accepting anything your brand is pushing that makes one a gullible "rightwing conspiracy nut".
If you're proud of your "inclusive" culture, then you must be proud of American diversity and all the cultures we welcome in as none are any better than any others. But if you're pining about some loss of your 'white culture' because of other cultures wanting a seat at the table, then that makes you a xenophobe.
Wrong again. It's hilarious that you somehow don't believe that people who hate fascist or those who believe in having a social safety net don't believe in hard work. I've no doubt they work ten times harder than the average lazy Trump supporter whining about how the fantasy immigrant somehow stole their job which is why they're sitting on their lawn couch day drinking Pabst. I've been working full time for almost 40 years and paying my taxes and helping out in my community and am even a foster parent. I work my ass off so I find it especially hilarious some couch potato warriors try to claim progressives don't believe in hard work.
So do I but it certainly doesn't make me a militant. Supporting and defending militants in our streets shooting Americans in the head when they try to flee would though.
I am proud of our flag, what it stands for and the many who died to let it fly, so I also stand during our National Anthem. But I certainly understand why some Americans, especially those who have been discriminated against for centuries, might feel differently and I believe they have a right to do so. Not being able to understand that is what makes one a racist.
I also think all lives matter, just like I think all birds are equal. But why the fuck would I hold up a sign saying "Pigeons Lives Matter!" in response to others putting up "Bald Eagles Lives Matter!" signs? The Bald Eagles are the threatened species, not the pigeon. So, if a person is so desperate to pull the attention back to themselves that they make counter protest signs just because a person of a different race points out how they've been racially discriminated against, then yeah, they're a racist.
I think they're wrong as do the vast majority of liberals and progressives. Violence and vandalism should never be used to push a political agenda. Anyone doing so should be held accountable for their crimes and that doesn't make one racist at all. If someone sees a black person and thinks "Criminal! Looter! Vandal!" without actually seeing them do anything wrong, then yeah, that makes you a racist.
While I support our law enforcement, servicemen and women, I do not do so blindly. They are not infallible and there are bad apples among those groups who do harbor deep seated racist hate for their fellow Americans which just means we need to be vigilant about both being accountable to law enforcement and holding them to account when they act outside their lawful capacity. If one blindly supports them in all their actions, kneeling on Americans necks and shooting them in the face because they dared to try and get away, well then yeah, that will make one either a racist or a fascist.
LOL. I take it you're claiming you've never tried to make a liberal or progressive feel bad about who they are? Right?
I'm also a good person who loves my family and my country. I don't want anyone to think they're a 'bad person', but I do want people to stop being so mind-numbingly gullible when it comes to their support for a known liar and convicted felon. It seems pretty clear that those who continue to support such a maniac have some sort of screw loose or something or aren't able to see the whole picture and can only see their insular brand of rhetoric that has been spoon fed to them since they were young. Distrust of the mainstream is one of those mental diseases that can leave one's brain crippled because they choose to only feed on the 'off brand' rhetoric and confirmation bias of self-proclaimed wise men who claim their knowledge from the bible makes them smarter than the professors and teachers at the universities.
The coal mining towns near where I grew up had the Russian street, the Polish Street, the Ukranian street, etc. So, no, they didn't look to integrate. And there are still the Polish Clubs, the Russian Clubs, etc in that area
Bravo!
That's one unfounded opinion.
There's a big difference between retaining their culture and integrating into American society. I grew up in a town that was probably 80% Polish. They had a Polish Club in town, everybody was always welcome. We had two elementary schools, a public one and a Catholic one and all the kids went to one of those. All kids went to the one High School. Everybody spoke English, even the new (one or two years in the US) immigrants. They worked to integrate themselves with the local society. Just because people have a tendency to want to live near people with similar backgrounds doesn't mean they were not working to integrate themselves into society.
It's not the same anymore. Too many people want to live here but have the same type of lifestyle they had in their previous country. You can dispute it, but living here in Phoenix it seems like every time there is a political protest there are people waving the Mexican flag. If you are protesting against an American institution or law, why would you wave the flag of any other country?
That's not at all what he listed. Which is the point. Try again.
16 strawmen, sitting on a hill.
Thank you!
Thank you.
Thank You
Maybe because it's their ancestry and their heritage and since Arizona was once part of Spain for three hundred years only to finally win independence as Mexico,
before eventually ceding the territories to the USA.
Sure it is. Time has brought you to a point where you pine for the old days. I have experienced it in three generations, now that they are dead, i catch myself doing the same thing but I would never go back to horse drawn wagons for food distribution or black & white TV or analog. We walk around with communicators in our hands that have more computing power than our PCs and laptops with some of the best cameras and camera software available anywhere and call it a phone.
We are blessed and cursed. The journey is fraught with danger but it's worth it.
Since Immigration crack downs have been historically aimed at Mexicans they wave the flag of the down trod, why would they wave the flags of their supposed oppressors? Does ICE have flag?
Protesters today are very much in the vein of previous generations that fought for the rights of workers , racial minorities and women. Over 100 years ago such people were called communists and later MLK was called a communist by the head of the FBI back then, and such people are still being called communists by the right.
Donald Trump has a member of his administration who said “I do have a Nazi streak in me from time to time, I will admit it”. Even after this became public Trump did not withdraw his nomination, and it was only after some GOP senators said they would not confirm him to be head of the office of Special Counsel did Trump give him a different government job.
I heard of a new poll that shows almost 70% of Americans believe that ICE tactics are not making the country any safer. They should have stuck with "the worst of the worst" as their targets and they would much less trouble with "progressives".
Trump sent a letter to the leader of Norway telling him that since he (Trump) did not receive the Nobel Peace Prize he no longer feels obligated to think in terms of "purely peace". This is the monster you created and now you flail around trying to blame Trumps depravity on immigrants from Africa.
If we had someone in the presidency that wasnt mentally ill we could move toward the compromises on immigration policy that could prevent further "invasions" and put the situation under control. But since you accept a maniac being in charge, and you do, the "troubles" will contine at this time.
Then you would agree that if Biden and his DEI VP did not let in millions of unvetted illegals, we would not be needing ICE the way we need them today.
You would agree that if left wing insurgents did not constantly harass, attack, assault and try to kill ICE agents, we would not need the surge of them we see today.
Why didn't you get pissy when Obama used the same department to deport millions of illegals?
I can answer.
Because the left did not attack them, doxx them or otherwise threaten them and you probably didn't even know they were around.
Then you would agree that Biden isn't even president anymore.
Cool. So you believe pro life protesters who feel the same moral zeal on their issue that you do can follow threaten, harass abortionists and anyone who works at abortion. Threaten people who sell them things or food and form mobs to beat up people for wearing cloths that support abortion and disrupt entire communities around abortion centers to try and make their functioning impossible. And if anti-abortion protesters cause enough disruption abortion centers should be shut down to keep them happy?
. Or is it only those causes you morally support that you think protesters should be able to use violence and threats to support without ever having to pay a penalty for?
here’s video of lunatics disrupting a church and terrorizing kids because ice exists
This is where the far left wing nuts are taking us. Violence is fine, as long as they believe they have right on their side
Trump is clearly mentally erratic. Clearly, and he "leads" the worlds most powerful military and economy. This is like the plot of an apocalyptic dystopian Hollywood movie.
MAGA as a concept will never be accepted by the majority of the American people, but the Trump administration will metaphorically burn the country to the ground before they will admit that.
From time to time you admit Trump is a no good piece of shit, but still you support him and have even ramped up your defenses of him.
The country is in a lot of trouble and you are being led by a literal lunatic.
I have seen this video several times. Supposedly the idiots thought the pastor had something to do with ICE. Even if he does, they have no right to disrupt the service.
We have seen where complete nutcase leftists have shot up churches for no reason other than the people there are Christian.
Would not have hurt my feelings if someone in the congregation was armed and thought this was going to be another of those situations, and double tapped a couple of the insurgents out of fear for his life.
Of course, this being Minnesota, the person would not have a fair trial and Minnesota politicians do not believe you have the right to defend yourself.
‘Trump is clearly mentally erratic’
When this sentence or one similar starts every post, the argument is lost before you move to the second sentence.
progressives are threatening to kill people, harassing them on the streets, invading churches and making little kids cry because Trump is essentially implementing the Obama deportation policy. Progressive leaders are completely silent about this widespread illegality. They are whipping up ICE is deporting child abusers.
And you think Trump is a lunatic?
And the AG of Minnesota rewards the leader of the church raid by appearing on his podcast…. Unbelievable
Ellison also stated that the insurgents that raided the church did not break any laws, but the feds are looking into fed laws broken.
I personally am getting tired of not seeing perp walks of these leftists that intentionally break the law.
Bondi needs to step up the game.
Yeah. He also stated that the FACE Act only relates to reproduction rights.
It really bothers me that an AG can so blatantly ignore the law when it suits his partisan ideals. (The bolding below is mine)
That idiot agitator leader that took over the church stated that he did not disrupt anything. He said the people were still praying and music was still playing.
Most likely, the members were praying the lunatics did not shoot the place up because we all know what leftists do to churches, especially the mentally ill trans ones.
They do make the most ridiculous excuses.
A Civil Rights investigation is underway. Let's see how that goes.
What really needs to happen is some of these agitators need to be handcuffed and perp walked to prison, especially those that obstruct and assault ICE and civilians.
The DOJ needs to send a message that this behavior is not tolerated and many leftists will be held accountable for their illegal actions.
More correctly, protesters today delude themselves into thinking this.
What a load of Trumpist dog whistles to claim some sort of phony moral standing. The reality is the ICE deployment to Minneapolis (and Minnesota) is a Big Government, Deep State intrusion into communities using the authority of the gun. Jonathon Ross' committed murder and is now protected by the Deep State to prevent accountability to Minnesotans.
ICE is a paramilitary organization deployed on a political mission to intimidate Minnesotans with gun violence. How is that not a Deep State operation? How is that not Big Government imposing its authority on communities and neighborhoods for political reasons?
ICE is not raiding elementary schools, in force, to catch 'bad guys'. ICE sending 20 or more agents to arrest someone doesn't have a damned thing to do with law enforcement. The paramilitary squad is intended to intimidate in a highly visible manner. If this is law enforcement then it must be the most costly, inefficient, inept, incompetent armed force in the United States.
ICE agents have become Big Government jack boots deployed to politically intimidate Minnesotans and who are protected by the Deep State. Donald Trump has become the very thing he promised to fix. Those who claim be Republicans and defend what ICE is doing are not MAGA and frankly, not Republicans. They're members of Donald Trump's cartel.
What a load of Trumpist dog whistles to claim some sort of phony moral standing. The reality is the ICE deployment to Minneapolis (and Minnesota) is a Big Government, Deep State intrusion into communities using the authority of the gun
a prefect example. What ice is doing is perfectly legal thanks to democratically passed laws and since you can’t dispute that you cloak yourself in self righteousness to justify opposing democraticly passed laws though illegal actions.
Jonathon Ross proves it is legal to commit murder. But that doesn't make it right. I always thought real Republicans were upset about Big Government legalizing what was immoral. Hasn't that been a highlight of Republican opposition to Big Government and an unaccountable Deep State?
Trump does not comply with the law. So, defending Trump, Trump's Big Government, and Trump's Deep State is actually an endorsement of criminal behavior. Trump is using the 'rule of law' as a weapon against political opponents (in both parties) and, more importantly, the people of the United States. Government of, by, and for Trump is un-American.
There is no democratically passed law that allows ICE to pepper spray and gas peaceful protestors, fire “less-lethal” projectiles at people’s faces, launch flash-bang grenades and tear gas at families with babies, shoot drivers not known to be dangerous felons, or deport anyone without due process. Nevertheless, ICE is doing all of those things.
Personally, I'd like to see a new party emerge, called something like the "Heal Our Nation Over Retaliation", a party led by centrists who ask any American who is feeling overwhelmed by this push towards unaccountable big government to come out, not on the streets, but parks, sidewalks, any public walking space across our nation holding signs of support and encouragement for those standing up against this overreach as well as condemnation of the actions we're seeing.
But this mass protest must be silent and peaceful, let the signs speak for themselves. We need to show what a true silent majority is. And don't block roadways or crosswalks, don't give the authorities any reason to attack. We have a right to peacefully assemble and protest. As unfair as it was, Gandhi told his followers to not retaliate when beaten by the British soldiers, to let themselves be beaten and they lined up and took their beatings in silent protest.
To stand peacefully in the face of this madness, that is the only way I can see how we can honor our constitution and the Republic we were challenged to keep. Heal our nation, over retaliation. Honor our founders by standing up to the bully they predicted would challenge us to a fight one day.
I like your idea
Centrists do not control the press, social media, or the money in the country. Our political system has been perverted into giving the most power to the smallest number of people. Our political battles are over small groups of 2 or 3 percent of our population.
The paramilitary forces shoot peaceful protesters now. And get away with it. What is happening is a reincarnation of Stalinism. And Mahatma Gandhi would not have survived Stalin's state police. There are not any civilized rules of engagement governing the paramilitary forces Trump has deployed within the United States.
Trump is not Hitler. Hitler was motivated by ideology and legacy. Trump is Stalin. Stalin was motivated by his own megalomania. Stalin twisted ideology to fit his personal brand. Stalin used the state as a tool to suppress (not oppress) political opposition, dissent, and, even, simple disagreement.
If you really want to understand what is happening (and how to confront it) then it would be wise to delve deeper into the regime of Joseph Stalin. Trump has even begun efforts to create an American soviet state now. Don't waste time studying Hitler. Adolf Hitler was a 'nice guy' compared to Joseph Stalin.
I like the idea, but I don't think it will work without the government continuing to use excessive violence.
I think we are past the phase where people holding signs are anything but a target for a meme. Really, all nonviolent protest has to have some meat to it. The non-violent protests of Gandhi and King needed the sustained overreaction of the people who were nominally in charge to wake the people around out of their complacent or complicit attitudes. "It is not happening to me," and, "Well, somebody has to control those people," have to be changed to, "Holy Shit! Did you see what they did to that person who was just sitting there?!" Until and unless they are changed, then the powers that be will not change the way they act.
The administration is counting on the support of a few, the apathy of many, and the blatant discriminatory and prejudicial propaganda of news outlets, influencers, and even articles such as this one to push the idea that the Government is the final arbiter of morality and if you do not do what the government says, the government has the moral right to hurt one in any way that it pleases, and that hurt will be ones own fault.
It is up to us, therefore, to keep the pressure on.
We need, as a people, to sacrifice of ourselves.
That is what civil disobedience is all about.
It is not entirely people waving signs and being loud.
It is about people having the courage of their convictions,
when they know that they are going to be beaten,
when they know that they are going to be mauled,
when they know that they are going to be hauled off to jail if they sit down in the middle of that road,
and they en-masse do it anyway.
We cannot change the course of the nation by sitting around on our couches, in our kitchens, in front of our wonderous electronic devices bitching about it.
We have to get in the game and actually do something.
I think that what we really need is civil obedience to the constitution. Fighting back is only going to embolden the authoritarians and give them ammunition for their warped propaganda. Being obedient to our laws while also doing everything we can to speak or just show up in the tens of millions, peacefully, silently in the streets with signs that say, "This ends in November!", and then get out the vote like never before in the midterms.
If this country has any chance of avoiding falling into full on white Christo-fascism, it's this next election where we can right the ship and take the house and stop this out-of-control executive. But we cannot condone violence or vandalism to achieve our goals, that's giving the bigots exactly what they want, a justification to use any and all means to wipe out those opposed to their warped ideology. We have to achieve our goals through pacifism, our laws and trust in the constitution just as all the minorities have had to do over the last 250 years of this nation.
Of course, as Americans, we can defend ourselves and families if directly attacked, I'm not suggesting standing there and doing nothing as you or your family are beaten by these thugs, protect yourselves and family first and foremost by giving them no reason to attack. I think everyone should have a cell phone on a lanyard around their necks filming anytime they're interacting with any LEO. And be the first to say out loud that you're not resisting and lay on the ground if they come after you, struggling and fighting back is what they're hoping for so they can beat you and claim it was justified. It's what these dumb fuck macho bigoted MAGAites joining ICE want. So, disappoint them. And then take their asses to court and sue the fuck out of this administration and their over-zealous white incel Christo-fascist Gestapo for unlawful detainment and whatever else they might have done to you while proving how little their dicks are.
You are right that fighting back is not the answer, and I want to be precise about what that means. The core of nonviolent protest is not merely peaceful intent. It is the deliberate refusal to retaliate even when violence is inflicted. That is not weakness or passivity. It is the mechanism by which the state’s overreach is made undeniable.
The point of nonviolent protest is to show how the state responds when confronted by people who are visibly nonthreatening and noncompliant at the same time. That exposure cannot occur unless people are willing to be physically present and to accept what may follow. You cannot reveal unjust or immoral enforcement practices from the safety of your living room.
You cannot stand up for immigrants who have made their homes in this country by avoiding contact with the machinery being used against them. The “worst of the worst” framing is nonsense. It is a smokescreen designed to justify sweeping actions against anyone who does not align with MAGA ideology. That narrative only holds if it is never tested in public view.
Nonviolence, properly understood, means not striking back, not escalating, and not providing the state with the justification it seeks. It means standing, sitting, or marching peacefully even when ordered to disperse, even when arrested, even when beaten. That refusal to retaliate is precisely what forces observers to confront the moral contradiction between the stated purpose of enforcement and its actual conduct.
I have seen footage where protesters were across the street, holding signs, filming, shouting, or blowing whistles, and nothing more. No objects were thrown. No physical threat was present. Yet federal agents deployed tear gas and so-called nonlethal munitions simply because they could. That was not a response to provocation. It was an assertion of dominance meant to teach people to stay home, stay quiet, and stay out of the way.
That is why nonviolent protest requires people to go where power is exercised and to endure its response without returning harm. Without that moment of exposure, appeals to elections, courts, or constitutional norms remain abstract. History shows that those institutions move only after the public is forced to see what enforcement looks like when it is turned on peaceful people.
All Americans should be able to speak out or protest as a guaranteed freedom as we are absolutely guaranteed.
The J6 violent insurrection was a direct attack on the United States Capitol and those violent rioters were all pardoned. They put up a gallows for Mike Pence the Vice President.
ICE is arresting elected United States representatives in courthouses and at regular visits to ICE facilities.
They have arrested US Veterans, US citizens, and people who were not even protesting, and if they stick it out and are lucky enough to get legal representation they are released.
Every day there are reports of ICE mistakes where Americans are beaten, detained and then released with no offer of restitution to any American who has their home, car, or belongings damaged or phones even stolen by the roving masked goons of ICE.
Lawlessness in search of an excuse to be lawless for the sake of terrorizing Americans into submission to this extremism.
How can MAGA forgive or forget the lawless attack on our Capitol which was massive and then think that the protests we see on a vastly smaller scale are worse?
These street by street protests by American homeowners with loud whistles and chants, Frog and Pickle costumes and handwritten signs are not riots by a long shot.
The level of exaggeration is off the charts.
The state of Texas is a border state with an estimated 2.1 million immigrants. Compared to Minnesota which is predominantly white, there are an estimated 130 to 150 thousand immigrants.
Ask yourself why aren't they in southern border states with far larger influx of immigrants?
To be in Minnesota instead of the southern border makes no logical sense at all on any level.
Everyone in the United States of America should be protesting this because if you think for one second this isn't coming to your neighborhood you're sadly mistaken.
Minnesota schools have had to shut down for remote learning, schools that are in session where ICE hasn't invaded the parents are on patrol.
No excuse for this, absolutely none.
But I guess if what we all saw on J6 was a "day of love" then the neighborhood protests in Minnesota are a love tap.
The state of Texas is a border state with an estimated 2.1 million immigrants. Compared to Minnesota which is predominantly white, there are an estimated 130 to 150 thousand immigrants.
Is this not known? Texas cooperates with ice and honors its detainers for criminals. Minnesota, and other states protects child diddler from deportation so ICE has to go look for them.
do progressives not understand what sanctuary jurisdictions are?