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Donald Trump cooked a story to justify U.S. Iran attacks, but forgot to share the tale with his own intelligence chiefs -

  
Via:  John Russell  •  8 months ago  •  42 comments

By:   Sadik Hossain (We Got This Covered)

Donald Trump cooked a story to justify U.S. Iran attacks, but forgot to share the tale with his own intelligence chiefs -
America’s top intelligence officials have told Congress that Iran‘s nuclear program has been “obliterated” and does not pose an “imminent” threat to the United States. This testimony directly contradicts President Donald Trump‘s stated reasons for launching Operation Epic Fury, a joint American-Israeli military offensive against Iran. The statements raise serious questions about the factual basis for the military action.

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America’s top intelligence officials have told Congress that   Iran ‘s nuclear program has been “obliterated” and does not pose an “imminent” threat to the   United States . This testimony directly contradicts President   Donald Trump ‘s stated reasons for launching Operation Epic Fury, a joint American-Israeli military offensive against Iran. The statements raise serious questions about the factual basis for the military action.

The Senate Intelligence Committee hearing took place on Capitol Hill. Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard and CIA Director John Ratcliffe appeared before senators, along with FBI Director Kash Patel, DIA Director Lt. Gen. James Adams, and Acting NSA Director Lt. Gen. William Hartman. Together, as   The First Post   reports, their assessments painted a very different picture from what the administration had previously told the public.

Before the operation began, President Trump had claimed that Iran was only weeks away from building a nuclear bomb, calling it an “imminent” threat to the United States. This claim was a central part of the administration’s justification for launching Operation Epic Fury. However, the intelligence chiefs directly contradicted this at the hearing.

Both Gabbard and Ratcliffe stated clearly that Iran’s nuclear program has been “obliterated” and has not resumed any activity. They also said that Iran’s missile program remains nearly a decade away from being able to harm the United States. These assessments directly undercut the idea that Iran posed any immediate danger to American security.

The intelligence directors were clear that Iran does not pose an “imminent” threat to the United States. This matters greatly because the idea of an “imminent” threat is often used as a legal and political reason to justify preemptive military action. Senator Lindsey Graham has also weighed in on the broader Iran situation, and you can read about   Graham’s stance on invading Iranian territory   to understand where key Republican voices stand.








Their testimony essentially rejected the administration’s main reason for attacking Iran and pointed to a lack of factual evidence supporting the claims that led to Operation Epic Fury. A military operation of this scale would normally be backed by strong intelligence, but this testimony suggests that was not the case here.








Despite directly contradicting the president’s earlier statements, Gabbard and Ratcliffe still tried to defend Trump’s actions during the hearing. They found themselves in the difficult position of publicly refuting the factual basis for the operation while still supporting the commander-in-chief. Trump’s legal and political troubles are not limited to foreign policy either, as   a federal prosecutor controversy in New Jersey   has put his administration under further scrutiny.

The gap between what Trump told the public and what his own intelligence chiefs told Congress is now a matter of official record. The political and legal implications of this contradiction are likely to be debated for a long time to come.



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JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1  seeder  JohnRussell    8 months ago

In her written statement Tulsi Gabbard specifically said that Iran did not reinvigorate their nuclear program after the attacks last June. (Operation Midnight Hammer). 

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  JohnRussell @1    8 months ago

(deleted)

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.1  Right Down the Center  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.1    8 months ago
It's the Intelligence Community to determine if there is an imminent threat by analyzing the intelligence data.
AI Overview
The President of the United States holds the ultimate authority to determine if a foreign country constitutes an imminent threat, allowing them to authorize military action in self-defense
. While intelligence officials provide information, they do not officially determine imminence.   
original   The New York Times  +2

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.2  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Right Down the Center @1.1.1    8 months ago

You want a pathologically lying moron to decide what is "imminent" ?  wow. 

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.3  Right Down the Center  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.2    8 months ago

Like it or not is irrelevant. It is his responsibility and his call even if you or the lying Senate and Congress don't think so..

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.4  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Right Down the Center @1.1.3    8 months ago

The top intelligence officer in the United States said, in writing, that Iran did not restart the attempt toward a nuclear weapon after they were "obliterated" last summer.   What does that mean to you? Nothing?

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.5  Right Down the Center  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.4    8 months ago
What does that mean to you?

It is also irrelevant what the top intelligence officer in the United States said, in writing, that Iran did not restart the attempt toward a nuclear weapon.  It is the call of the President if there is an imminent threat.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.6  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Right Down the Center @1.1.5    8 months ago

Yes, he has a feeling in his bones that they restarted. 

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
1.1.7  Gsquared  replied to  Right Down the Center @1.1.5    8 months ago
It is also irrelevant what the top intelligence officer in the United States said, in writing, that Iran did not restart the attempt toward a nuclear weapon.  It is the call of the President.

That's a joke, right? 

Based on your comment, if the head of NASA said in writing that the Moon is not made of green cheese that would irrelevant and it would be the call of the President.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.1.8  Trout Giggles  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.6    8 months ago

I have a feeling in my bones but it's arthritis

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.1.9  Trout Giggles  replied to  Gsquared @1.1.7    8 months ago

What's the point in having the NSA if the POTUS is going to make unilateral decisions with nobody's input?

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.10  Right Down the Center  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.6    8 months ago

I get it, you don't think there was an imminent threat.  Based on the limited information I have I don't think there was either.   But whose call it is to make that determination and whose is actually the only opinion that counts before military action is taken (for 60 days anyway)?

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.11  Right Down the Center  replied to  Gsquared @1.1.7    8 months ago

That is a ridiculous comparison

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.12  Right Down the Center  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.1.9    8 months ago
What's the point in having the NSA if the POTUS is going to make unilateral decisions with nobody's input?

The point is not if he should, the point is that he can.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
1.1.13  Gsquared  replied to  Right Down the Center @1.1.11    8 months ago

It's called reductio ad absurdum and it proves how ridiculous your joke of a comment is.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.14  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Right Down the Center @1.1.12    8 months ago

The point is whether or not he is competent to make these decisions.  Its his call as to whether or not we bomb Sri Lanka tomorrow.  He's nuts, so it cant be completely ruled out. 

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.15  Right Down the Center  replied to  Gsquared @1.1.13    8 months ago
It's called reductio ad absurdum and it proves how ridiculous your joke of a comment is.

The comment was:

The President of the United States holds the ultimate authority to determine if a foreign country constitutes an imminent threat, allowing them to authorize military action in self-defense. While intelligence officials provide information, they do not officially determine imminence. 
Neither you not anyone else has shown it to be incorrect yet the whining about it continues.  That is the real joke.
 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.1.16  Trout Giggles  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.1.9    8 months ago

how is it possible for me to see someone's comments in PN when I have them on ignore? I thought TiG fixed that?

go ahead give it a meta ticket

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.17  Right Down the Center  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.14    8 months ago
The point is whether or not he is competent to make these decisions.

No, the point is that it is the call of the President of the United States if we are in imminent danger.  That is the comment I made.  Why is that such a tough concept?

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
1.1.18  Gsquared  replied to  Right Down the Center @1.1.15    8 months ago

The comment was:

It is also irrelevant what the top intelligence officer in the United States said, in writing, that Iran did not restart the attempt toward a nuclear weapon.  It is the call of the President.

I quoted it EXACTLY how it read.  Apparently realizing how absurd it was, you modified it.  Nice job.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.1.19  Trout Giggles  replied to  Gsquared @1.1.18    8 months ago

isn't that dishonest?

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.20  Right Down the Center  replied to  Gsquared @1.1.18    8 months ago

1.1.15 still does read that way.  And it still is the call of the president.  And you still have not disproven it.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.21  Right Down the Center  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.1.19    8 months ago

Only if it is done

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
1.1.22  Gsquared  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.1.19    8 months ago

I will leave that to others to say.  Perhaps His Eminence will decide.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
1.1.23  Gsquared  replied to  Right Down the Center @1.1.20    8 months ago

I am talking about your comment at 1.1.5 as it originally read before you modified it.  See my Comment 1.1.7.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
1.1.24  Right Down the Center  replied to  Gsquared @1.1.23    8 months ago

So in 1.1.7 it said"It is also irrelevant what the top intelligence officer in the United States said, in writing, that Iran did not restart the attempt toward a nuclear weapon.  It is the call of the President."

And in 1.1.5 it says "It is also irrelevant what the top intelligence officer in the United States said, in writing, that Iran did not restart the attempt toward a nuclear weapon.  It is the call of the President if there is an imminent threat."

And the difference is?  Care to respond to the statement and stop with the diversion?

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
1.1.25  Gsquared  replied to  Right Down the Center @1.1.24    8 months ago

The original version of your Comment 1.1.5, before you modified it, did NOT state "if there is an imminent threat".

Clearly, you could see the difference, and how absurd the original version of your comment was, or you would not have modified it.

To make it explicit, your original, unmodified comment stated, in effect, that it would be solely the "call" of the President as to whether Iran was restarting an attempt to develop a nuclear weapon, regardless of the facts.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Participates
1.1.26  Split Personality  replied to  Gsquared @1.1.25    8 months ago

The bottom line is that during Trump 1.0 he was surrounded by mostly level headed adults whose job is solely to make sure every avenue and every possible consequence is addressed and to have a plan for whatever results.

During the Biden Administration, the heritage Foundation and others planned out Operation 2025 and lined up the sycophants, measured military leaders and the GOP for obedience.  No one is this Administration appears to have planned for any outcome except the fairy tale that Trump believes.  The Military Leadership was first gutted for DEI, then partisan loyalty to the Trump..  We are in a dangerous place.  Militarily and financially with lots of wrecked allegiances dotting the globe.

I note that they keep quoting Prof. Tim Snyder weekly if not more.  He saw it all coming.

Sad.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
1.1.27  Gsquared  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.26    8 months ago
We are in a dangerous place.

Yes, we are.  Extreme danger.  The only answer is to remain active, outspoken, get out the vote and resist.

You and I both know what a significant figure Timothy Snyder is.  He did see it coming.  I get his Substack emails regularly.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.1.28  Trout Giggles  replied to  Gsquared @1.1.27    8 months ago

I didn't know he was on Substack. I have to go find him. I'm part way thru the book you recommended

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
1.1.29  Gsquared  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.1.28    8 months ago
I'm part way thru the book you recommended

That's great.  I think it's a very important work.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
2  Right Down the Center    8 months ago

From the link

From Gemini AI

AI Overview
The President of the United States holds the ultimate authority to determine if a foreign country constitutes an imminent threat, allowing them to authorize military action in self-defense
. While intelligence officials provide information, they do not officially determine imminence.  
original The New York Times  +2
 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
2.1  Gsquared  replied to  Right Down the Center @2    8 months ago

So, what you're saying is only His Eminence determines imminence.  Unfortunately, his intellect is de minimis.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
2.1.1  Right Down the Center  replied to  Gsquared @2.1    8 months ago

No, I said The President of the United Sates of America determines imminence.  Feel free to prove I am wrong if you can.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
2.1.2  Gsquared  replied to  Right Down the Center @2.1.1    8 months ago

If there is an asteroid within hours of crashing into Earth, and all the security officials say it is an imminent threat, but the President declares it is not imminent, that should stop it.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Professor Participates
2.1.3  Right Down the Center  replied to  Gsquared @2.1.2    8 months ago

Again, ridiculous comparison.  You are comparing going to war with an asteroid.  That is really a stretch.  So obviously you can't prove my statement (actually Geminis statement) is wrong

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Expert
2.1.4  Gsquared  replied to  Right Down the Center @2.1.3    8 months ago
comparing going to war with an asteroid

They both have the same end result.  Destruction.

You obviously did not understand my comment about the power of the President.

I'm a Gemini.  I'm never wrong.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
2.1.5  Trout Giggles  replied to  Gsquared @2.1.2    8 months ago

LOL! Yep. Sounds like trmpr logic to me

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
2.1.6  Trout Giggles  replied to  Gsquared @2.1.4    8 months ago

Asteroid? Nuclear bomb....

both pack a powerful whomp

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
3  seeder  JohnRussell    8 months ago

‘Why Do You Even Have a Job?’

REP. JIMMY GOMEZ: I just want to kind of get a sense. Were they weeks away of achieving a nuclear weapon? Yes or no?

TULSI GABBARD: Congressman, this is a serious matter, and you’ve made some very serious mischaracterizations here.

GOMEZ: Yes or no? Were they weeks away? Yes or no?

GABBARD: And so it would be a disservice to you and the American people with a mere yes or no.

GOMEZ: Reclaiming my time. Reclaiming my time. Were they weeks away or not? The American people need to know if this was an imminent threat or not. If they were weeks away or not. None of this dodging. Were they an imminent threat? Yesterday, you said that only the president, the only person who can determine what is an imminent threat is the president of the United States. Do you stand by that statement?

GABBARD: Yes, I do.

GOMEZ: Director Ratcliffe, do you agree with that assessment, that the president is the only person that can determine if something is an imminent threat or not?

JOHN RATCLIFFE: The president as commander in chief gets to make a decision about what’s an imminent threat. The intelligence community-

GOMEZ: So no. Reclaim my time! Reclaim my time! Reclaim my time!

[Crosstalk]

GOMEZ:  The reason why, is that if the president can determine and ignore what you’re doing, why do you guys even have a job? Like why do you even advise him? So you’re saying tomorrow, the president of the United States can say China is an imminent threat and he can take — no matter what the intelligence says — take his own action. OK, let’s go on.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  JohnRussell @3    8 months ago

Once again this shows the level of incompetence in this administration

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Participates
3.1.1  Split Personality  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.1    8 months ago

No planning, no evaluations of the unexpected or unintended.  No Way Out,

Call the Japanese and thank them for teaching us about treachery and surprise attacks, yep that's the diplomatic thing to do.  /s

 
 

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