Hillary Clinton’s Popular Vote Victory Keeps Growing

"election’s fundamental outcome."

Yet, they couldn't see the detriment of 'Obstruction' nor the futility of 

"Make him a 'One-Term' President!

"That means that Clinton's lead will almost certainly grow in the coming days, as it has since election night.

Al Gore for president !!

"That means that Clinton's lead will almost certainly grow in the coming days, as it has since election night.

There were a total of 538 electoral votes up for grabs. Half of 538 is 269. Trump has over 270. It is now mathematically impossible for Hillary to get 270 electoral votes no matter how much of the popular vote she gets. Game over. Trump won. He was the winner yesterday, he's the winner today, and he'll be the winner tomorrow. 

Kinda sucks those surplus votes were in the wrong states .

No, kinda shows that whiners of 8 years are Oxygen deprived - APPARENTLY party on govnerors because if 2008 is any barometer of the cabinet of donors & pimps along with those they have had on the stroll - how long has McConnell been tricking now & the newbies that

"Wanna give it a go, Joe" like the lame ducks of Congress - priceless!

I think I have just found evidence that some people need to check their crack/ meth pipe , for drano , before they spark up.

Do you? You have given reasons for suspicions.

Well said. I tried using a translate program but it didn't work...

Well said. I tried using a translate program but it didn't work...

Have you tried one set to translate from intelligence? Just wondering?

Which one do you use?

Classy & apparently the COC is loose around news talkers -

"I think I have just found evidence that some people need to check their crack/ meth pipe , for drano , before they spark up."

Well, you apparently "think like randy who THOUGHT rocks - were candy!"

then don't cha, yet what can some expect from persons (questionable @ best) who in this One statement prove

The "compassion" their political representatives offer THEIR drug ADDICTS, is really for a Donor & if they really what rehab for Themselves or a Caucasian Only loved ones ne treatment plan they should "Just Say, No!"

When, I posted "Thanks for your service" received it - so

Let Me Reciprocate:

& the fact you believe your - Not so funny, yet Completely Predatory commentary as Legit response to my post or me

PRICELESSLY telling regarding those who Support, Revolve & 

👏👏👏👏👏👏Back

Like a Clown!

Did ya unstan t'hat

Latest numbers, though I can't verify:   Trump Wins Popular vote too

Too bad it doesn't matter. At all.

To a "Narcist" everything regarding there "Popularity" matters!

 you Really don't know the pervert in chief @ all or that sexual perpetrators are 'All' about the 'control' factor & it is EVERYTHING to them!

& like you - he's not gonna LIKE IT  esp. when the countings done, I guess since bigoted, sychophants aren't on the receiving end

they dont get/know the Que's!

Priceless if they protest its 'whine'

if object (not obstruct 2 'different' animals) loser

if you point out the fallacy 'cry babies'

Slow down dictatorships aren't my strong suit 

I'd reply but I'm not able to parse your "communication".

To a "Narcist" everything regarding there "Popularity" matters!

 you Really don't know the pervert in chief @ all or that sexual perpetrators are 'All' about the 'control' factor & it is EVERYTHING to them!

& like you - he's not gonna LIKE IT  esp. when the countings done, I guess since bigoted, sychophants aren't on the receiving end

they dont get/know the Que's!

Priceless if they protest its 'whine'

if object (not obstruct 2 'different' animals) loser

if you point out the fallacy 'cry babies'

Slow down dictatorships aren't my strong suit 

English as a second language?

TL;DR

It's kind of hard to convince people that although the majority should prevail in a democracy, it can be skewed in such a way that it doesn't.

Yeah, Buzz that's it! /s direct @ comment not you personally, shade a tad, but as I was with the grown up & if you haven't notice

I loathe perverts who manipulate children and assault them, grab -anyone-they-wants🐈 because they think they're a 🎆Star🎆  & can do whatever & whoever they want

WTF

Is this "Sunset Boulevard!?"

It's kind of hard to convince people that although the majority should prevail in a democracy, it can be skewed in such a way that it doesn't.

Hillary got one majority (the total popular vote) but Trump got the majority of votes designated to each state and it's the latter that counts. It's democratic either way.

It's democratic either way.

Not hardly.

Yes, it is.

Like we've heard a million times, we are not a democracy.

But buzz the majority did prevail, those extra million or so votes in California cemented that Hillary would get the 55 EC votes available in California, but that's all , what some myopitic little experimenters in modern chemistry fail to realize is those votes don't count anywhere except in California , or where ever those excess vote happen to happen and even then only in those states. its kinda like health ins , it cant cross state lines , and only works to award the ec vote in state.

too bad she didnt have such a resounding victory in the states she DIDNT win , that have other electoral college votes , she lost 290 of them  if I am right .

 to me it looks like someone went to term in a pregnancy and got aborted on delivery  day.

Obstruct to One-Term much!?

That was done After the Oath & THROUGH OUT the Presidency, yet even as Our

"Democracy" Choice that was "SKEWED" (in the total way this hyperbole makes laughable) it was the problem in the "glorified Antebellum" days as well & thus makes it 'All' so Disingenuous - period

By 'All' Reagan -Southern Strategy, bigotry, Contra Drug Running, recessions & the many violations of American Citizens Nation-wide

GHW - more Reaganomics (if it "breaks um" it works), S&L scandal Subprime Millions made (they Were Fraudulent - Beyond their face - Intentionally So! The Best here

After aiding Saddam Hussain (his buddy since installing him into Iraq) in the Gulf War - he intices the Afghan people to turn on the Taliban, then leaves them there in the desert with terrorist killers, but Obama was to fix it!

Clinton left a surplus after cleaning up the debt of two fiscally purported "good ones," ban on automatic weapons (they are not covered in the 2nd, as they never would have imagined them)

GW - shhh! He is in Crawford, TX painting 'dogs' except for special trips - to give paid seminars on "How to Offshore your Money" in the Cayman Islands, while We the people were Voting & 

"Spoiling " unconstitutional dreams regarding the then & now sitting president.

A Good Conversation requires conversation, this Dictate, talk @ festival is Boring as it is Sad & buzz you said election night you had no "skin" (literal for some) in this game, as well as that Canada is closed, so Say what, now!

Protests are a Right of the People, expressing dissatisfaction is as well under the First, yet those who did this should spare those now their Disingenuous 😱

washingtonpost

mcclatchydc

Who knew M🐕tches were such duplicitous 🐩 oooohhhhh,🙋me,me!

Gotta go & Enjoy my Sunday & to my fellow Americans Really going through it - for your Sunday morning listening Pleasure!

bing

At this point, what difference does it make?

Lol!

Hillary's words were prophetic . . . at least as applied to how she could have won but didn't. 

This is one reason why the Electoral College is needed.  So the Fruits, Nuts and Flakes of the Cereal State don't determine what's best for the rest of the Country.

So very inclusive of you Bruce. 

It's never been about inclusivity.  The Trump supporters were very vocal via their vote about what was important to them.

Your comment is just more liberal slander, PJ. Your hostile, intolerant rhetoric is why your candidate lost.

Wait a minute Big C,

Look up the thread at who started the name calling. It wasn't a liberal, hence my comment to Bruce.  

I was referring to PJ's implications.

I live in California and I agree with you.  The bigger the margins from NY and Ca. Become the better.  I guess democrats will have to put their blue wall back together.  In 2012 Obama won virtually all of the closely contested battleground states and this year Trump did.  In both cases New York and California didn't matter.  It's the same in the House of Representatives.  Democrats have all but a few congressional seats from Ca and NY and yet despite that, the GOP has 50 more House seats nationwide and GOP congress persons there are from NY and Ca have more power than the democrats from there.  Ironically in the House the majority and minority leader are from Ca.  

This is one reason why the Electoral College is needed.  So the Fruits, Nuts and Flakes of the Cereal State don't determine what's best for the rest of the Country.

Thank goodness.  Because I would hate it if a pussy-grabbing, minority-hating, woman-bashing,  Vladimir-loving, greedy braggart of a man with ZERO political experience, was elected into a position to determine what's best for the rest of the country. 

Do you think that, if given a choice, he would make a decision that was best for the people of this country over any situation that might negatively affect his own personal interests?  He is his number one priority, and he has made that abundantly clear.  He spent more campaign time calling people fat, ugly, losers, rejects and trailer trash than he did proving he had the temperament and credentials to run this country. 

And by the way, who do you think has paid his taxes in all of the years that he has managed to avoid paying them?  That would be me and you and your children and my granny and my paraplegic neighbor and people who, through no fault of their own, live at or under the poverty level and millions of others.  And guess what?  We are still paying them and will continue to pay them. 

This is a man who said, "The media will believe anything as long as you have beautiful piece of ass on your arm." (Esquire Magazine)

So yeah, yippee-ki-fucking-yay for the electoral collage.

The election is over. There is no point in regurgitating the false liberal propaganda you were fed so successfully. 

There is no point in regurgitating the false liberal propaganda you were fed so successfully.

Propaganda?  Sorry, sugar, but he put every bit of it out there himself.  The man can't keep his trap closed for 5 seconds.  

Just as when in 2000 Al Gore won the popular vote and I rejected and disavowed George W. Bush as my President, Hillary Clinton has won the popular vote and I reject Donald J. Trump as my President. He is not now and never will be my President because the American people have spoken. The American people voted for Hillary Clinton as our President and I bow to the wishes of the majority. It is not just I who voted for her. If the majority of the American people had voted for him, then he would be my President. However they made their wishes clear.

As Americans we swear nor affirm no vow of loyalty or fidelity to a national leader as if we would if they were a Monarch or a Dictator and no American is required to so in any Presidential election. To do so would be not only UN-American, but anti-American. As such I have no obligation to loyalty toward and no reason to follow any dictates of Donald J. Trump.

This is my right as a free American.

Hillary isn't fighting the electoral college system and she was campaigning with the plan of winning specific states. Did she object to the outcome and is she fighting to change the rules after the game was played?  If Hillary had won the electoral votes and Trump the popular vote would you still hold your position? Would you really be saying Hillary is not my president? 

Trump schlonged her fair and square. 

 If Hillary had won the electoral votes and Trump the popular vote would you still hold your position? Would you really be saying Hillary is not my president?

Yes.

That was the most glib "yes" I have ever seen on NT ...

You have a constitutional right as an American to support who ever is elected in the manner the constitution set up for a President to be elected.  

I have the Constitutional right to acknowledge as my President whoever the American people have voted into power as I interpret it. That is my freedom as an American. As a veteran and as an American I have that right.

When I joined the United States Air Force in 1973 I swore an oath to protect the Constitution of the United States of America. However at the same time I was swearing an oath to surrender all of my rights to be governed by that very same Constitution, to surrender all of my rights under it and to instead agree to be controlled by the Uniformed Code of Military Justice. You see in order to protect the Constitution, I had to give up my right to be protected by it, because I could not do both at once. No active duty military person can. In the military you have no right to free speech or freedom to assembly or freedom against self incrimination, etc. You couldn't have if you were going to protect the rest of the people in the nation's rights to have those. You make many sacrifices of your own rights to preserve those of those who don't serve (and the vast, vast, vast majority don't)

When I enlisted the President was Richard Nixon. Now at the time (and still today) I thought he was a paranoid lunatic criminal. Still he had been elected by a majority of the voters of the American people in 1968 and 1972, so he was my President, so therefore I had to swear as a member of the military to follow all of the lawful orders up the chain of command all of the way up to him, even though I thought he was on crazy mother fucker. He was my President and Commander in Chief. After him was Ford (who took over after Nixon resigned) and Carter who also won the popular vote.

On the other hand if I were considering enlisting during the time that George W Bush was considered by many to be the President, well I couldn't have done so no matter how much my country needed my services to defend it. Even if my country desperately needed me, I would have had to find another way to serve. That's because he had not been chosen by the majority of the American people to be our leader and therefore I could not in good consciousness accept him as my President and Commander in Chief and follow his orders. He had not been chosen as the President of America by the majority of the American people. Most Americans who made the effort to go and vote did not want him. He was not my President.

So you see Donald J. Trump is not my President because the vast majority of the American people have rejected him. Most American voters have said no to him as President and as a good American I have to follow what they think, what their will is. As I said have, if he had received the majority of the popular vote, then I would, perhaps a bit reluctantly but honestly, say he is my President. However I can not because most Americans who voted said he is not and I wouldn't join the military with him in the Oval Office and accept him as my President and Commander in Chief because he just isn't and never could be.

As an American and as a veteran who has stayed trued to my convictions all of my life, even when I was unhappy with them (Nixon) I have earned the right to say he is not my President. If someday we are made to swear a personal loyalty oath to him or any other President as the leader of our country, no matter who they are and no matter if I voted for them, well I guess I'll be standing in front of a firing squad first, because I am an American and I will not. I am loyal to my nation, not to it's leaders. He is not my President. The American people have said so and I defer to their wisdom.

You have a constitutional right as an American to support who ever is elected in the manner the constitution set up for a President to be elected. 

No, I have only a right to support whom I see fit and to me that means who won the popular vote. There is no Constitutional obligation to "support" any President. There is no personal loyalty oath.

the vast majority of the American people have rejected him.

Your exaggeration of the relative numbers is noted . The left coast & the NE corridor have spoken but the rest of the country has rejected their cloistered ways ...

Remember red = trump

               Blue = Clinton

Remember red = trump

               Blue = Clinton

In other words, he kicked her ass.

debatable 1, what that map shows is by county he won must have. the EC vote says he does anyway .  but a little more thought shows the disparity of population.  higher population centers can skew an entire state opposite of what the rest of the state votes . simply look at Nevada , only 2 counties blue but it is counted as Clintons  , Illinois? not much blue there except Chicago . I am sure you can see other states that have the same problem.

 IF anything this map shows why its not the popular vote that is used to elect a president.

debatable 1, what that map shows is by county he won must have. the EC vote says he does anyway .  but a little more thought shows the disparity of population.  higher population centers can skew an entire state opposite of what the rest of the state votes . simply look at Nevada , only 2 counties blue but it is counted as Clintons  , Illinois? not much blue there except Chicago . I am sure you can see other states that have the same problem.

 IF anything this map shows why its not the popular vote that is used to elect a president.

I'm not troubled by the fact that the electors within the state are chosen by a method that is contrary to the electoral college itself (i.e. the state didn't weight votes from areas but rather relied solely on the popular vote). 

The federal government was created by the states and the electoral college is a constitutional compromise on the question of the weight each state would get in electing a president. Counties and municipalities, on the other hand, are creations of the state. The state is under no express or implied obligation to apportion votes as a mini electoral college to give rural areas a greater voice (although they could choose to do it). I'd leave the issue to the states as a matter solely within an individual state's discretion.

No you do not XX. Trump was elected under the governing rules (electoral votes) Which makes him the president of the United States for the next four years. That, in no way states that an individual has to support him.

Did all republicans support Obama? Hell no they didn't. It's my right not to support him, or anyone else that I don't agree with, whether on a national, state, county or local level.

If you don't support trump when he is inaugurated , you are a racist. 

At least, that's the sort of reasoning that was applied to those who were not overjoyed at thought of fundamentally transforming America in 2009.

Sean, I would guess that some were racist, your aware that this country did and still does have a racist element. That is a fact.

If you choose to call me a racist for not supporting Trump or his policies you can do it. I also have the right to not accept it.

I am not calling you a racist, I was pointing out the ridiculousness of the arguments advanced here and elsewhere that the simple failure to support Obama without qualifiication made one a racist.

affer 8 years of denouncing any dissent from the Obama line as racism, it's amusing to see the left rediscover that dissent doesn't equal treason at exactly the same time they lost the presidency.

watch how separation of powers and executive overreach get rediscovered next.

Sean, I didn't say you were calling me a racist. Perhaps I didn't word it correctly, but what I'm saying is that there were probably some that didn't support Obama because of racism. They didn't have to accept it if it wasn't true.

On the other hand, if people from the right call be a racist for not supporting Trump, that is their right. It's also my right not to accept the title.

You have a constitutional right as an American to support who ever is elected in the manner the constitution set up for a President to be elected.

Whatever you say, Mr. 'Obama isn't my president because I live in the State of Jefferson'.

The internet is forever.....people just can't erase what they've said the last 8 years and pretend like they put their country first when in reality they put their own self interests and their party first. 

I'm sure you'll be able to find many more examples of him talking out of both sides of his mouth. 

That's amusing coming from you, miss "moderate"...

The moderate independent who sides with the democrat party position on each and every issue that's come up since their arrival here.  

So you had no problem with anyone that said the same thing about Mr Obama right? and their doesnt have to be a thing called the "loyal opposition" some of the younger folks may not even know what that even is , but I know most older folks do.

If President Obama had not won the popular vote of the candidates running both times (and he did) then I would have had to say he was not my President then also.

What twisted logic. Did you not know about the Electoral College? Or the Constitution? 

Regardless of how long or how loudly liberals cry, Trump won the election under American law. Popular vote is meaningless. 

How Unamerican. 

Yeah, but you're a Canadian anyway, so it doesn't much matter.

The Republican leadership has shown no desire to include all Americans in their policies for many years now so the popular vote means nothing.  Whether their candidate didn't receive the backing of the majority of Americans is irrelevant they will not be looking to lead or govern for all Americans just those who they receive money from and those who believe in their platform.  Their plan is to push their agenda through and it will easily be accomplished now that they have control over everything. 

I continue to hope that Donald Trump is able to accomplish every single one of his campaign promises he's made.  I imagine it may accelerate the destruction of the country and undoubtedly deepen the divide between Republicans and Democrats but that seems to have been the overall objective so it will be another win for the Republicans.  We are well on our way for internal fighting like so many other uncivilized countries.  

"The Republican leadership has shown no desire to include all Americans in their policies "

Kinda like the first 2 years of the Obama  Presidency, I have to admit , both sides do tend to do that when they come into power.

 AND IF President Trump uses his phone and his pen , I will remember who set the presedent for that little power grab.

Yep, you're right Mark.  I'm trying to remember when the Democrats have taken away the civil rights of others and nothings coming to mind so if you have examples please share them.   

But let's celebrate your teams win.  Feels good to have the power back in your hands, huh?

Remember I didn't vote for either team alright? not on the Presidential level .

 so your afraid , that women are going to loose their rights? that discrimination is going to allowed based on race , sex gender , sexual orientation, and religious beliefs?

 so when did trump become a MUSLIM ? and before I am called an islamaphobe , they better understand , that's what I witnessed personally IN   muslim countries .

 Oh how about this civil right ? the right not to have to purchase a product that one doesn't deem they need or can afford from a defined list of approved producers ? ACA sound familiar?

I'm getting a little tired of the puissant little whining because people didnt get what they thought they would get and lost an election, this country made it through Bush 2 for 8 yrs , made it through Obama for 8 years , IT DAMN sure will make it through trump for 4 years ,  AND I damn sure didn't condone , or have done anything that advocated the destruction or the calling for Ill to befall this nation,  and anyone that does? I think they need to start to look for somewhere else to live  volentarilly, because if you want the nation to fail or suffer to prove a point , they you are undeserving of the benefits this nation affords the people here.

and with that statement , I will be leaving the site ,  its nothing but a back biting little puissant show and echo chamber of negativity now .  Ild hand a few a barb wire wrapped baseball bat , tell y'all where to stick it , and tell you to use enthusiasm and vigor.

 Comment removed for CoC violation [ph] 

Mature argument. Gives you a glowing credibility.

I understand his frustration.  It's difficult to apply common sense to something that makes no sense.  As far as the anger and personal attacks towards me I'm a bit confused since I said I'm hoping Trump is able to deliver on all the promises he made during his campaign.  I'm all on board with the Trump train.  Am I worried that women's rights will be taken away.  Yes, he said he is going to punish women and I believe him.  Trump also is lazy and I anticipate that he will leave the governing and policy and law making to his VP who has a record of discriminating against women and the Republican leaders who also have an agenda to defund planned parenthood and to repeal Roe v Wade.  These aren't trivial or silly concerns.  They are real and they will happen because the Republicans have all the power. 

If expressing my concern has upset anyone, sorry but I still have that right until that's taken away too.

Pj, the last part of the rant was not directed at you my apologizes since it looked like it was.

Randy, a person's vote only counts in their state, when you vote your voting for the ec electors.

The popular vote determines who gets the electors in that state only. 

Any excess over what was needed to get those electors doesn't matter after the electors are awarded.

The ec then votes for the president by who won the electors , after the electors are awarded , the popular vote is then disregarded, so the only vote that elects the president is the ec vote, so yes any one who won the ec vote is and was your president.

Popular vote does not elect the president, ec vote does, and the one with the required ec votes is the legitimate legal and constitutional president, like it or not.

Good bye.

Popular vote does not elect the president, ec vote does, and the one with the required ec votes is the legitimate legal and constitutional president, like it or not.

However it (popular vote) does give Americans credibility on who they decide they choose to consider to be their President or not. All Americans have the freedom and right to make that personal decision on their own. Unless you see a required oath of loyalty to whoever the EC elects in the Constitution. I have not found one. Throughout my adult life, if I liked the result or not (and at several times I have not) I have only considered the winner of the popular vote to be my President, because it's obvious that they are the person the American voters really want and not the failed runner up. No one really wants the one who comes in second place.

Mark is 100% correct.  A President elected according to the supreme law of the land, the constitution is the president of all the people.  You are free to not support or like him or her, but in this case he is our president.  Yours and mine.  And I didn't vote for him.  

Mark, 

I for one hope you reconsider that decision. I think right now everyone's nerves are on edge and wounds are still being licked. It's been a tough election cycle and things need to settle down. Take a break, but please come back. 

I like Mark, and I think he's a good guy, but he might have to take a break for four years. The idea that things will normalize under a president Trump is a pipedream.

I have said for a year that Trump is the most unqualified presidential candidate in the history of the country. And I am far from the only one who has said that. In fact , millions of people have said that.

The idea that the election of such a deficient to the office will "normalize" is wishful thinking at best.

Right now Trump has 75+ lawsuits against him, some which can turn into criminal RICO cases to deal with. Plus I doubt if he'll want to give up living full time living in Mar Largo and Trump Tower for the relatively low brow White House except when he has to and is not a known fan of Washington D.C. My guess is we'll be seeing more of a President Pence, either because Trump hands the power over to him willingly, or has the power taken away from him legally through impeachment or hiding out to avoid it. Either Trump moves very aggressively to consolidate his power (which I believe he'll try very very hard to do) and we and up with a Presidency handed down to his son and grandson through mock elections or he decides he is overwhelmed and just plain decides the job is not worth the effort, in which case there is a very, very, very scary second string (like Pence (world is 6,000 years old, women should have funerals for miscarriages, gays should not just be not allowed to not marry, but be imprisoned)) waiting on the bench.

So we have a choice. Trump as a strongman/Putin puppet semi-dictator who turns America into a Russian satellite state or a very radical right wing insane evangelical Christian Whites only Nationalistic America (think burning crosses) under Pence. Or a very, very, very slim chance that there are still some republicans who think America as a free nation is more important then some sort of Pyrrhic victory for the GOP.

I think it was Hillary who had the Pyrrhic victory. She won the battle (more votes) but she lost the war (the Presidency).

I disagree. She lost the Presidency, but only on a technicality. Much like in 2000 it is well known who the majority of the American voters really wanted to be President. Trump is going to take the oath, but like with George W. Bush, it'll be a very hollow victory.

It's like when a murderer walks free because they didn't have their rights read to them properly. They walk free...but everyone knows anyway.

She lost the Presidency, but only on a technicality.

Of course the Constitution is dismissed as merely a technicality. Sums up the Democrats entire attitude towards governance. 

I agree with you Sean. Trump won it fair and square under our electoral system.

The point being that he did not win the popular vote, but as our system works that is not the determining factor.

What it does show is that there is a deep divide in the country, and probably that divide will continue.

I accept the results, whether I like them or not.

No, it doesn't sum up the dems view. It is ones persons opinion, so don't be painting with that large of a brush.

I agree with everything you said but the point I was trying to make was not limited to the election results. I was thinking in particular to democrats almost total support in  upending the Constitution in support of their policies, like his executive order on immigration.

Obama himself made the case that he lacked the power to do what he ended up doing . And Democrats in Congress cheered when he announced his intention to ignore Congress's  constitutional power to legislate and would simply impose am unconstitutional executive order on the nation. 

Sean, within the democratic party there are differences. I for one had some real problems with EO's and some other things that the party did. I did not agree with them.

I think what your going to see in the very near future (at least I hope) is a purge within the party to get back to it's roots, which they, IMO, ignored. One can be a moderate dem, liberal dem or a progressive dem and still see mistakes that were made by the party. And I think that was shown in the election.

Regarding the wikileaks, I'm one that believes that if you didn't commit the crimes you have nothing to concern yourself with when they were exposed. That was a big problem for the DNC and really upset me that people would stoop to that level. There is underhanded things done in both parties, but to me the childish things done by the DNC were unacceptable. They crossed the line with me.

I disagree. She lost the Presidency, but only on a technicality . . . It's like when a murderer walks free because they didn't have their rights read to them properly. They walk free...but everyone knows anyway.

I think it's more like thinking a basketball game should have been won by the team with the best dribblers. But it's scoring that counts . . . a technicality perhaps but it's a technicality that wins the game. Game to Trump. 

Never thought of the Constitution as a "technicality".  The rules of the game are that the Electoral elect the President, not the people.  True, the Electoral should pay attention to the wants/needs of its constituents, but they don't have to - they vote per the state's bidding.  Popular vote means nada - that's what we need to do away with, right?

The electoral college make up of each state is determined by the popular vote of the people in that state and DC.  A presidential election is 51 separate popular votes non cumulative.  Maine and Nebraska vary theirs and their model is the only change possible short of amending the constitution .  

and with that statement , I will be leaving the site

Please don't do that Mark.  Take a break, but please don't leave the site.  You are one of the most sensible people on this site and you will be doing a great injustice to all of us by leaving.  I realize you, like many of us didn't have anyone we wanted to vote for in this election as well as many elections in the past.  A bad day, a bad discussion, or just tired of the negativity from both sides, take a break if necessary, but without the common sense and civility you offer you would truly be missed.

Well said, Mark.

and with that statement , I will be leaving the site ,  its nothing but a back biting little puissant show and echo chamber of negativity now.

The site is reflective of a deeply divided society where one side sees no value in what the other side has to say. You are old enough to remember a time of gentlemanly confrontation and respect for an opponent after a heated fight. Without different perspectives and a voice of reason (like yours), balance will be lost. I hope you will continue to participate even though it seems like nobody's listening. There have been a number of times in my life where somebody repeated something to me that I said to them years ago and I forgot having said it. Although I forgot it, that person said it struck a chord with them and they saw things a bit differently. Isn't that what this is all about? Sharing your unique perspective so people might understand and see things differently (not necessarily agree with you but just see things from a different perspective).

Unfortunately 1ofMany, a few of those who don't listen have engaged in massive worthless threads/seeds in an effort to ensure everyone knows THEIR position while staunchly ignoring the other's positions.

Unfortunately 1ofMany, a few of those who don't listen have engaged in massive worthless threads/seeds in an effort to ensure everyone knows THEIR position while staunchly ignoring the other's positions

I think we're all guilty of that to some degree. As long as we recognize that everyone has an opinion and a right to voice it, then I think we're all better off for having had a healthy debate. I don't come on here to change minds but rather to speak mine. I understand and accept that my position may offend some (although that's not my intent) and I expect others to express themselves the same way. If I think I'm right, I will stand my ground whether any others join me or not.

I used to do marital arts sparring every week and we fought hard to win. It was Silat. Pretty much full contact with light grappling gloves. No mats or body armor other than an elastic foot guard. We exploited each other's weaknesses and I went home in pain every time. So did everyone else. But although we were fierce adversaries when when sparred, we were still friends when we left. To me, all we're doing here is verbal sparring and nothing gets hurt but feelings. I guess some people are so weak that they cannot withstand even a difference of opinion. 

 trying to remember when the Democrats have taken away the civil rights of others 

When they forced people to participate in religious ceremonies they don't agree with. When they forced young girls to share bathrooms with any grown man who wanted to use a woman's bathroom. 

I'm not sure what you're referring to regarding the "religious ceremonies" but I would say that the bathroom law was an expansion of civil rights not a repeal.  Although I personally did not agree with the bathroom law.

Is your position that women having health care and a choice an impediment to your right as a white male?

Is your position that women having health care and a choice an impediment to your right as a white male?

Does it tire you out to create  such an elaborate straw man to engage with? I have no idea how to respond to something so far removed from reality.

Sean - You set the precedence for the question when you stated that the bathroom law was encroaching on civil liberties.  If you can't handle questions returned at the same level of stupidity that you set then don't ask them.

"You set the precedence for the question when you stated that the bathroom law was encroaching on civil liberties. "

No he didn't. Your strawman was made up from nothing. You argue disingenuously. 

I would say that the bathroom law was an expansion of civil rights not a repeal.

I agree . I want the right to wave my pecker in front of women in a public restroom !

As the framers intended...

"I'm trying to remember when the Democrats have taken away the civil rights of others and nothings coming to mind so if you have examples please share them."

You need to pay more attention then:

Gun control

Thought crime laws

Persecution of religious behavior 

Using the IRS to target specific ideologies. 

I'm trying to remember when the Democrats have taken away the civil rights of others and nothings coming to mind

Forcing businesses with the power of the federal govt comes to my mind . Why should a bakery be required to make a cake for a gay wedding if it is against their beliefs ? Also the rights of cops have been severely compromised . Working in the black ghetto is no picnic but it is even worse when you're being second guessed on events that transpire .

"The Republican leadership has shown no desire to include all Americans in their policies for many years now..."

The irony of a Democrat saying this is delicious.

I imagine it may accelerate the destruction of the country and undoubtedly deepen the divide between Republicans and Democrats but that seems to have been the overall objective so it will be another win for the Republicans.

The goal is sort of what Karl Rove spoke of when George W. was first elected, a perpetual Republican majority/government. Except I believe that in this case, as far as Trump is concerned, the goal is to turn the United States into a private company. A wholly owned subsidiary of Trump Enterprises with the Presidency handed down from father to son answerable only to the real boss, Vladimir Putin.

Get some tin foil. Delusions of that magnitude need treatment.

😂😢😂

IMO, Trumps stated goals during his campaign will cause a greater divide in this country than anything else.

Trying or succeeding in over turning Roe vs Wade will tear this country apart. That will take us back to the 1950's and for those of you who don't remember that time, it was when women had to break the law and risk their lives in some back alley. If that's what the right wing and evangelicals want, you had best bet that there will be a divide as bad as anything we've see in our lifetimes.

Some of his other stated policies will add to that divide as well. So get ready for a rough ride for the next 4 years.

Trump can't overturn Roe vs. Wade anymore than Obama could overturn Citizens United.  Only the Supreme Court could do either.  For the record, overturning Roe vs. Wade would not end legal abortion.  It would simply return to the states the decision on the matter.  Most of the states where they occur most often would continue to allow them.  For most Americans little would change.  For some the window to have one would shrink and probably no state would outright ban it.  Maybe ten states would go with rape, incest, severe life limiting deformity, life of the mother limits.  

I'm well aware that only SCOTUS can overturn Roe vs Wade XX. Depending who is on SCOTUS at the time it could be done. That, IMO will create a very deep divide.

Returning the power to the states will take us back to the 1950's...

NPR was saying he could possibly appoint as many as three Supreme Court justices and that could be enough to overturn Roe vs Wade. At any rate there is a very good chance his picks will prevent the court from moving to the left. 

The problem with SCOTUS is that it is, left and right. It has, IMO become a political body, and that is not right.

The Supreme Court will be working for the Republican Party and not the Country just like the FBI has become an extension of the Republican Party. 

Paul Ryan just refused to answer the question that Jake Tapper asked about women's birth control.  This was of course after Paul Ryan had no problem answering Jake's earlier questions and right after the birth control question he was happy to answer the other questions.  So the only question he refused to answer was about women.

The Supreme Court will be working for the Republican Party and not the Country just like the FBI has become an extension of the Republican Party. 

And if Hillary was elected?  Would they have been working for her? And the FBI works for the Republican Party?  What utter bullshit.  If they did, why wasn't Hillary indicted before the election?  The court should not be politicized, period.

To be able to overturn Roe vs Wade, a new argument stipulating a Constitutional wrong would be required.  After over 30 years, don't think there are any arguments available.

I don't think there is anything constructive in complaining about the electoral college now, for this election. Everyone knew the rules before it started.  Change it before next time. 

Attention needs to be kept on Trump. Evidently the deplorable Steve Bannon will have an important role in Trump's White House. That comes officially from the Trump team. 

That sounds like good choice.

Steve Bannon is a white nationalist. Nice to see you lay your cards on the table.

No, he's not. Thanks for playing.

Someone who caters to white nationalists is a white nationalist. sorry.

So, Hillary is an antisemite because she caters to BLM? Roger.

Yes he is...and proud of it.

Nope. Given that you think the Constitution is a "technicality", I think we need to take your comments with a big grain of salt.

I think there needs to be changes made so that the majority's voice isn't ignored but we have to also make sure that everyone's voice is equal.  That's the challenge and I'm not sure whether there is anything other than the ec that comes close to meeting that objective. 

This is actually a sad commentary on how political expediency has led to a complete lack of an objective standard by which to judge anything. When Trump was at the debate, he would not commit to accepting the results of the election. Hillary called that deplorable because it undermines a peaceful transition of power. Trump later said that he would accept the result . . . if he wins. That got boos from the Hillary supporters (and rightfully so). Now the tables have turned and it's the Hillary supporters who won't accept the election because Hillary lost. Like Trump, they will only accept the outcome if it gives them the result they want. 

In a way, politics is like a sport. You play the game by the rules and you accept the outcome win or lose. You shake hands before you play and you shake hands at the end like gentlemen. It doesn't matter whether it's football or boxing. If you can't accept that you can lose, then you shouldn't have played in the first place. Cursing the game and throwing a tantrum because you lost is one of the most childish and ignorant reactions conceivable. I didn't want either of these two awful candidates but we don't have to make ourselves look even more ridiculous by acting like a nation of spoiled brats. 

The funny thing is, that the candidates did shake ands at the end of all (figuratively, if not actually).  It's the dumbasses of the world that keep fighting the war, not realizing it's been over since Wednesday morning.

Why would anyone want to eliminate the Electoral College?  What other process distributes the rights of all individuals more evenly than giving every state a voice in the election process.  By doing so would be likened to shoveling more coal into a runaway train.

Everywhere I read it's far right this, far right that.  I think the far left have gained control over way too many people's brains here and around the world.  The Electoral College was and is a brilliant means of giving as close to equal rights to all the citizens in this country as I can imagine.  The Democrats do have the majority of voters in this country and will have a larger percentage of voters than the Republicans from here on out.  Should we let mob rule run this country from this day forward?

We already have mob rule in the metropolitan cities in this country and how is that working out for us?  These people in states who need to have a voice will lose that voice from here to eternity if we eliminate the Electoral College.  The Democrats should take a look at themselves and ask themselves how can we say we want equality for everyone when we say "fuck you to all the states who only have a few Electoral delegates and don't have much of a voice in the direction of this country anyway".

So this is where we are today with all this "Hope and Change" more divided than in my lifetime, a party who has gone completely bonkers and have lost every shred of common sense, clams to want to represent everyone equally but wants to take the rights of those who disagree with them away forever.

This is not who we were suppose to be.

Donald Trump is the worst candidate, and thus the worst president elect in our nation's history. You should worry about that more and worry less about the Democrats. 

Donald Trump is the worst candidate, and thus the worst president elect in our nation's history. You should worry about that more and worry less about the Democrats. 

He's worried about the iron curtain mentality that thinks there can be only one voice for us all. It's not about parties, per se, but rather how we can preserve different voices under a party that seems bent on silencing them. That becomes more of a concern when the losers want to eliminate the electoral college so that they can run roughshod over everyone else. 

Someone posted this elsewhere and I thought I'd share

She used too many big words for some. 

There seem to be reports that with the write-in and absentee ballots being counted that Trump is now in the popular vote lead. What is correct?

I guess nobody has the answer to that.

Can you post a link?

It's still not settled.  

And she is still winning.

right up until she lost the legal way and conceded

No, she lost. Based on that "technicality" you despise, the Constitution...

There seem to be reports that with the write-in and absentee ballots being counted that Trump is now in the popular vote lead. What is correct?

Hillary is leading but it's not yet clear by how much. She can pick up a lot more votes in California but, even if every person in the state votes for her, California still only gets 55 electoral votes and she still loses. Trump has 270 electoral votes, which is more than half of the available electoral votes. 

Donald Trump is not my President and that bothers some people. They think I don't have the right or freedom to express that opinion (though I served in America's military to protect that very right). Still it really doesn't matter. In 100 years no one will give a shit. For billions of years humans did not exist and after we die out (in less then a tiny blink of a universal eye) we will be gone for billions of years until the end of the Universe. When you come right down to it, it really doesn't matter if anyone agrees or disagrees with my opinion or if I agree with theirs, on this site or anywhere. In the grand scheme of things we as a species of creatures are infinitesimally smaller then molecular specks of flea shit anyway. I can promise you that in the Universe no one gives a fuck, so why should we really care? We are born. We live We die. Before that we experience nothing and after that we experience nothing. We are overwhelmingly meaningless. Our meaningless is our greatest gift to the rest of existence throughout the Universe. If they even bother to take notice of us, they should thank us for it.

It only bothers us to the extent that we worry about someone who cannot grasp reality. Trump is your president unless you relinquish your citizenship. Whining or stamping your feet won't change that. It's time to grow up.

A lesson, for some, too late for the learning.