As expected, a federal court blocks Trump's effort to deny military service to transgender folks.
Anyone who was paying attention knew that this one was coming, but between this and the charges brought today against Manafort & Gates and especially the plea deal of Papadopoulos , we should expect an irate rant by the Twit in Chief around 3am tomorrow.
A federal judge in Washington on Monday blocked President Donald Trump from banning transgender people from serving in the U.S. military, handing a victory to transgender service members who accused the president of violating their constitutional rights.
Trump in July said he would ban transgender people from the military in a move that would reverse Democratic former President Barack Obama's policy and halt years of efforts to eliminate barriers to military service based on sexual orientation or gender identity.
The transgender service members sued in August to try to block the ban. U.S. District Judge Colleen Kollar-Kotelly ruled that the plaintiffs were entitled to an injunction halting enforcement of the ban until their case is resolved.
The service members asserted that Trump's policy violated their rights to due process and equal protection under the law under the U.S. Constitution.
Trump signed a memorandum in August that directed the U.S. military not to accept transgender men and women as recruits and halted the use of government funds for sex-reassignment surgeries for active-duty personnel unless the process is already underway.
Kollar-Kotelly said the plaintiffs were likely to succeed in their claims that the ban was unconstitutional because the reasons given for the ban "do not appear to be supported by any facts." She said that other factors, including "the unusual circumstances surrounding the president's announcement" of the ban, weighed in her decision.
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The full ruling is here:
http://files.eqcf.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/61-Memo-Opinion.pdf
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From the ruling:
handing a victory to transgender service members who accused the president of violating their constitutional rights.
I didn't know that reassignment surgery was a Constitutional right. And you well know that some of the people enlist in order to have the government pay for it. Hope some responsible and reasonable court lets the ban continue.
I 'know' no such thing. Please provide a link to your empirical evidence to support your posit.
Just three days ago, John, who I am sure you would label as someone on the left, provided some pretty clear evidence, did he not?
As the court noted it will be much more expensive to allow the ban to stand.
All the time, sadly even when you present 97% of scientists who agree on something the right dismisses it because their "gut" doesn't want to believe. It makes debating anything with fact deniers rather frustrating.
That's the way preliminary injunctions work, but as the court noted the plaintiffs are quite likely to win since their was no rational basis for the change in policy and there was an unconstitutional animus expressed towards transgender folks.
I felt the title was misleading, so just wanted to clarify that.
Two things on this:
It's ALL a mental problem, and the taxpayers should not be paying for these procedures when health is not an issue.
Like I said, the treatment and surgeries are elective surgeries. No different than breast enlargement or cosmetic plastic surgery. The military hospitals don't do those.
Mental problems aren't a health issue??
The many vets with PTSD will be quite surprised to learn this.
Despite what many people believe, gender identity is not in any way elective treatment. Gender identity is treated by the VA. Their website says so.
Are you referring to mental disorders like PTSD and implying that anyone with PTSD or who has had it should not be allowed to serve in the military?
Not always.
False in general. Usually the person merely gets treated and continues serving......just like those with gender dysphoria.
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That's probably true just as it is for people who are currently experiencing gender dysphoria. But most trans folks don't have that problem. So while both PTSD and gender dysphoria might be an issue for a person seeking to enlist, they're both simply health issues which Tricare treats for active duty military.
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Apparently you weren't aware of the facts at all.
Sorry HoC but that's inaccurate, there are people with diagnosed PTSD continuing to serve. Although I'm more of the opinion they should just walk it off depending on their restrictions they can continue to be employed.
Would you consider a person who regularly sees and talks to imaginary friends to be fit for duty?
A person that lives their life based on something that they can not see, hear, or touch?
How about one whose imaginary friend tells them that raping or murdering is okay to do sometimes, and even encourages them.
Would this keep them out of serving this country?
Not all mental disorders in the DSM 5 disqualifies you for service.
The court noted that action was irrational and lacked a legal basis.
The court noted that action was irrational and lacked a legal basis.
.................................................
To bad the court didn't have the balls to come right out and say "President trump is irrational and lacks a legal basis."
I guess they got as close as they could.
Judges are usually pretty coy when they insult people (and are pretty good at it), but this ruling made her disdain for the Twit in Chief pretty clear:
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However we all know that Trump won't read the ruling. He'll only know what Faux News and Breitbart tell him about it.
Did you miss where I said many (not all) of the issues?
The military (I've been in and around since late 1978) has never been one to do 'elective' surgery. It wastes the taxpayers money, when there are real needs for emergency surgery. I'm not sure why the taxpayer should have to pay for that. Boob jobs, penis enhancement, etc, all available form your local military hospital now?
You should ask them,
This us from your link
So there is no VA entitlement for the surgery nir should there be the sam can be said of the milutary as a whole.
The VA is for vets, not for the active duty soldiers who use Tricare......which does pay for GRS surgery when it's considered medically necessary. The DoD has a strong interest in getting their soldiers the healthcare they need, which is why they ignore the babbling of homophobes, transphobes, misogynists, racists and others who want some soldiers to be denied healthcare.
Should Tricare cover things like a heart attack? Why should it since a person prone to heart attacks doesn't make for a good soldier? In contrast the DoD says that transgender soldiers perform at least as well as any other soldier, so it's clear that Tricare should cover their healthcare needs.
Did you miss the part where I was responding to epistte abd the link provided and the comment that implied that the VA does?
"Should Tricare cover things like a heart attack?"
Unless you can show that a heart attack is elective yes it should. No they should not be covering elective surgery such as sex reassignment. It is unnecessary and nit worth the cost.
It is never medicalky necessary. It is strictly elective.
Sounds like you're not a doctor or in the military. Tricare would authorize GRS whenever a patient's doctors deem it medically necessary, and they do it for much the same reasons that they'd authorize coronary bypass surgery.....because a patient might die or have a substantially lower quality of life without it.
Just like the military I retired from in July.
An activist liberal judge rebelling against nature and science.
Ummm, no, just a judge doing what is right under the Constitution and, this doesn't go against "nature and, science", it only is effected if you are a RWNJ Christian.
Christianity isn't even a factor here. It's very basic biology. XX is female, XY is male. End of story.
yes, that's biology - not the topic, the topic deals with Gender.
seems like you are upset that Gender Identity is different from Biological Sex and that they don't always align
And what that have to do with their ability to serve in the military?
Mentally ill people aren't allowed in the military. It's called a psych disqualifier.
If the mind is broken then fix that. Don't mutilate a body then demand everyone else play along.
Actually that's not true
Only specific mental disorders are disqualifiers....so once again what does it have to do with them serving?
Transsexuals are by definition delusional and in accepting of reality. They should not be in a position where powerful weapons or the lives of others depend on them.
And is that your medical definition?......because the AMA would truly disagree with you on that one!
very oversimplified explanation that is dishonest at best. besides, a transgender woman living her life as a woman isn't "playing along" if you use female pronouns in reference to her - she's living her life as a woman just as a cisgendered woman does. i suggest you research transgendered individuals a bit more.
so you feel that everyone should live by your definitions and perceptions of their gender ?
Neither is your claim of a left wing activist judge. Not every ruling is based on political views, they are based on the law. Maybe you need to stop blaming the left every time a legal ruling doesn't go your way.
Sounds like you've confused gender identity with genetic sex karyotype , and are also unaware that there are at least 6 viable genetic sex karyotypes in humans.
You also seem unaware that most people have never had their genetic sex karyotype tested. While you claim to be a "dude" you might well be an XXY .
Everybody has to live by my definition of time too, don't they? An eighteen year old trapped in the body of a twelve year old can't enlist, can they?
I don't have to look into astrology or palm reading to know it's junk science either.
E.A Brilliant!!
Well done a " Gender change " is like you Hire a German Shepherd, and then you get a Mexican Pocket Chihuahua!!!
i'm betting you are wishing that was a logical comparison, aren't you ? care to try that again ?
that's quite true, facts don't care about feelings which is why your statement isn't true (check out what medical professionals state)
yes we get it - any science that doesn't agree with your negative viewpoint on transgendered individuals is "junk science" .. *sigh* any science that doesn't agree with your viewpoint that gender identity is the same as biological sex is "junk science" .. *sigh*
The biological gender of the body isn't the same as psychological gender identity. A person's DNA does not determine their gender identity.
so you are unaware of the AMA and other medical professions statements ? gosh, i'm sure they've been posted on these articles before... that might take some work on your part tho to find them instead of having everything spoonfed to you.. good luck
So the fact that I linked the actual regulation that backs up my claim doesn't much matter to you?! But the left do tend to listen to facts as opposed to the right who would prefer their "truth"
Dude! I provided you a link that shows what mental disorder and illness would disqualify you! Not all of them does! The willful ignorance of your statements and refusal to accept facts when given truly shows your bias!
You want a logical comparison?
Ok- Explain how it's "normal" to be transsexual but offensive to be transracial like Rachel Dozial.
You cannot logically say one is acceptable and the other isn't.
Can you define, "junk science"?
That's odd......no medical organization supports your claim. Sounds like you pulled it out of your butt.
seems like you don't know the difference between Gender Identity and Race - sounds like you seriously need to do more research
if you know the difference, then perhaps you can present the original logical comparison. Comparing Gender Identity to Race is completely illogical.
very interesting... apparently some people are unaware that the military does pay for elective surgeries depending on circumstance (and depends on the branch of the military it seems) -- also please note that these surgeries must be deemed medically necessary (for the most part, not in every case but for the most part)
i guess everyone is perfectly happy with this:
Chuck Hagel (R) is the person that authorized Manning's treatments.
There is no place in the military for someone who's confused about what's in their shorts.
E.A Bingo!!!!
They are not there for Freebies!!!!
You speak from personal experience?
Actually, yes. When you're at 500ft, with a flooding casualty coupled with a jammed stern plane, a scrammed reactor, and lowering vacuum on both main condensers, I don't need some whiney little bitch boy with mental issues to curl up in a fetal position because he can't take it.
Definitely a fit it the shan situation.... {chuckle}
Not a time to be considering your life's choices.....
So how long were you curled in a fetal position and unable to do your job?
Your attempt at insulting me is rather lame. Try again.
I'm BATMAN. And this is Batdog.
So who were you trying to insult? You said that you spoke from personal experience so I assumed you were talking about yourself rather than a Seal Team 6 member like Kristin Beck.
Ah yes. The SEAL that changed his gender AFTER he got out. His case is moot. Find me one who changed while serving.
Sorry but Kristin Beck was always a transgender woman even before she had GRS, even when she was on Seal Team 6. It's also cute that you misgender her......you must have a lot of antipathy towards transgender folks. Did one of them get promoted rather than you?
It sounds like you're having trouble understanding what gender identity is. Comment removed for skirting the CoC [ph]
When HE was a SEAL, HE was still a HE.
And again, you're attempts at insulting are lame. But then again, that's not surprising that you would result to insulting me. I have not tried to make any of this about you, but you insist on trying to make it about me, in an insulting way. Par for the course for folks like you.
Beck disagrees with your assessment of her. Sounds like you don't even understand what gender identity is.
Look, when Beck served, Beck was a HE. If Beck is a she now, I don't care. I was speaking of the male Beck at the time. Every form Beck filled out in the Navy as a SEAL was marked male. It wasn't until HE got out that HE decided he wanted to be a SHE. And before you start in that "inside he was a she while "she" served", SHE couldn't serve as a SEAL.
Beck was always a transgender woman. You should read the book she wrote.
When she was in the military she presented as male only because she would have been discharged if she didn't pretend to be a manly man.
Know what how?
It's weird that Abnormal....is working its way to Normal these days. The worst part is.....there ARE people that FUCKING LIKE the idea !
It's not Trump that's making this country a laughing stock.......
“He was dressed just like on TV, with lots of silver chains and bracelets, ripped jeans, and a black muscle shirt (Which was kind of stupid, since he didn't have any muscles).”
― Rick Riordan ,
Get It ?
"Stupid" is as "Stupid" does !
I agree.....our society needs to resume the persecution of abnormal people like the left-handed and the blue-eyed.
Sure....that's what I was fucking talking about (Read the article, won't you ?).
Liberal types.......sheeeeeeesh !
They love to use a tad bit of history in a here and now argument, but keep repeating history expecting to win.
Hmmm....it looks like they won and you lost again. But you're right, history does repeat itself.....that's why conservatives are left behind each time society progresses.
I lost nothing.
What did you get out of it ?
According to the court Trump had no justification for issuing the ban:
E.A Brilliant!!
Well done a " Gender change " is like you Hire a German Shepherd, and then you get a Mexican Pocket Chihuahua!!!