Easter-deniers vs. Easter’s Reality
Expect the anti-Christian left to go all giddily gleeful over the April Fool’s Day date of Easter this Sunday. What a juicy opportunity for the God deniers to amp up their full-throated mock-fest against Christians as gullible morons. Deluded idiots who believe against all reason in a God who callously sacrificed his own Son in order to arrange a heavenly reunion with His followers. All we Christian fools have got is faith, they scoff, and faith is nothing but empty, irrational hope.
These deep thinkers have their own faith that they insist relies on the holy writ of reason and science. Reason and science lead them to their catechism: that life began from primal stirrings of an inorganic hot mess that through lucky trial and error “evolved” itself into complex critters like tarantulas and lobsters and elephants and, eventually, human beings. Just don’t ask where the hot mess originally came from. Their version of reason is to believe by faith that a whole lot of something can come from absolutely nothing. And they call this science?
To be fair, there are some God-deniers who do have an explanation of the origination of life on Earth. Sort of. Celebrated DNA discoverer and Pulitzer Prize winner, the late molecular biologist Francis Crick, along with his colleague the late biochemist Dr. Leslie Orgel among others, argued that life developed from seeds spread here by extraterrestrials from an advanced civilization possibly via spaceship. So the entire planet is an experiment in horticulture.
And more recently British professional atheist, evolutionary biologist, and self-anointed “brilliant” Richard Dawkins, joined them in promoting this theory, called “panspermia,” which is Latin for “we’ll go to any wacky lengths to avoid the obvious truth of God the Creator.” It takes a real genius these days to tell science fiction from science. And these are the very same high-forehead gang as the “scientists” who every Easter pen their splendidly-articulated trashing of Christians as hopeless optimists hooked on an elaborate mythology of a God who loves them.
But as outlandish as the Easter story may seem -- God coming down to earth in a man-suit as Jesus Christ to reconcile us fallen humans with Him -- that panspermia theory certainly beats Christianity for sheer wild-eyed fiction. Bigtime.
Christianity-bashers are also fond of dismissing the Bible as elaborate fairy tales with no basis in fact or history. The marvelous science called archaeology has proved them wrong. Excavations validating the Biblical text have identified hundreds of artifacts, events, ancient place names, and the historicity of individuals such as Herod and Pontius Pilate who figure in Jesus’ story, as well as Jesus of Nazareth Himself. The Popular Handbook of Archaeology and the Bible by Joseph M. Holden and Norman Geisler is a fascinating trove of these discoveries.
There is a factual foundation on which Easter and thus Christianity rests; that the Biblical account is true of Christ’s death as a willing sacrifice by God Himself (as Jesus) so that we could enjoy eternity with Him in Heaven. The philosophical foundation of Christianity is much harder for some to believe than the resurrection miracle itself: that the God who created the heavens and the earth is so crazy about humanity that he arranged this reunion with us at great personal expense and physical pain.
But how do we know that the miracle of Easter actually happened? How do we know the disciples weren’t just inventing a sensational tale that the man they had followed for three years and seen murdered on the cross, after being entombed had conquered death by rising again to life? How do we know that Jesus appeared to them 12 times in the weeks after his “death,” and ate with them, and made them breakfast on a Galilee beach – how can we believe?
The most convincing proof, apart from the first-person accounts of the disciples at the time, may be the dramatic change in His followers who had fled the gruesome scene of Jesus’ crucifixion, their world and their hopes torn apart. But afterwards, when they had seen him, they were instantly transformed from sniveling cowards to bold evangelists.
As they walked and talked with the risen Christ, ate with him and examined the wounds on his hands and side, their emotions turned from despair to overwhelming joy.
His last instructions before he ascended into Heaven were to preach the gospel to all the world. This fragile band of believers became a determined, courageous army that traveled to take Christ’s message throughout the ancient world. The Word would ultimately spread until even in our era, Christianity is the leading religion on the globe with more believers than any other.
Their faith was rooted in reason, as ours is today. All of the disciples except John were eventually murdered by the brutal pagan despots of the time. Many will give their lives for a lie, but who will risk death for a lie they know is a lie?
No, their reason and the miracles they had seen convinced them that Jesus was the Son of God and His parting words were truth: “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teach them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” ( Matt. 28:18-20.) https://townhall.com/columnists/joyoverbeck/2018/03/29/easterdeniers-vs-easters-reality-n2465777
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“The most convincing proof, apart from the first-person accounts of the disciples at the time, may be the dramatic change in His followers who had fled the gruesome scene of Jesus’ crucifixion, their world and their hopes torn apart. But afterwards, when they had seen him, they were instantly transformed from sniveling cowards to bold evangelists.
As they walked and talked with the risen Christ, ate with him and examined the wounds on his hands and side, their emotions turned from despair to overwhelming joy.
His last instructions before he ascended into Heaven were to preach the gospel to all the world. This fragile band of believers became a determined, courageous army that traveled to take Christ’s message throughout the ancient world. The Word would ultimately spread until even in our era, Christianity is the leading religion on the globe with more believers than any other.
Their faith was rooted in reason, as ours is today. All of the disciples except John were eventually murdered by the brutal pagan despots of the time. Many will give their lives for a lie, but who will risk death for a lie they know is a lie?” Joy Overbeck is a Colorado journalist, author and Townhall columnist who has also contributed to The Washington Times, The Daily Caller, American Thinker, BarbWire and elsewhere.“
Shouldn't this be moved to the superstition category rather than be in the news category?
Otherwise it just sounds like you're proselytizing.
It has been moved to the Religion & Ethics category {SP}
It was in the current news and politics articles where it came from and was written by a generally secular issues writer.
Seems like people offended by this type of article would simply skip over it.
It is.
Thumpity, thump, thump thump.
And not stand up to fascism? Pretty sure that is exactly what fascists want.
With a massive dose of blithering.
Only to those who can’t stand exposure to any of our Holiday seasons.
Your holiday is not shared by everyone, despite your religious hyperbole. It is most definitely not an American holiday either.
Religion isn't fascism.
It absolutely is.
If you are in it it is because it demands regimentation. If you are not in it it is because you are a target of it to try to make you a member of the regiment. For your own good of course. /s
I had enough regimentation in the military.
Perhaps somewhere in Liberal La-La Land.
Meanwhile, in the real world, most of think of fascism as:
fas·cism
[ˈfaSHˌizəm]
NOUN
an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.
What were DOMA, DADT, anti-miscegenation laws, sodomy bans and blasphemy laws other than Christofascism and Christian sharia law?
With the obvious exception of not being nationalistic because churches do not respect political borders, that is the description of organized religion. The fact that each church believes that they are the one true church is a religious corollary of nationalism
It is and that each church demands, to the point of public humiliation and even banishment, including banishment that can even include banishment from their own family, that each person obey a strict set of established laws, many times without clear explanation.
Organized religion is every bit as authoritarian and hierarchical as the military. They both executed their traitors in the past. Religion executed people for heresy and the military for spying/treason.
There are no fascists here on NewsTalkers.
Here's an extra bump for your seed, lol.
There are no first person accounts of the disciples.
Easter is a rebranded pagan festival of Spring fertility.
Even the way Easter is calculated every year is based on Pagan ideas.
Easter is always the first Sunday following a full moon after the Vernal Equinox. When I learned that in RCIA I was kinda surprised at how paganistic it sounded but none of the instructors even blinked
We were not supposed to think about that. I didn't know that we were supposed to be obedient little religious drones, so I typically asked the nuns why in CCD.
It seldom ended well.
So let's get back to the dancing around the campfire nekkid thingy. This atheist is intrigued.
It can be dangerous
Well, the Jews won't be happy to hear you call them pagans. The timing of Easter is roughly based on the changing dates of Passover (the Last Supper was a seder) due to a way of reckoning the Hebrew calendar in a way that I have never been able to understand making it the single nod of Christianity to what was supposed to be its roots.
Check out the clothing (very) optional Starwood festival in southern Ohio. I went one year but it was a bit too weird for my taste. It's like Woodstock 1969, without the loud music and a lot less media coverage.
Witchvox website is good to locate pagan activities closer to your home.
I know! scorched a few hairs back in the 60s.
The whole flying sparks thingie...
But what about the Easter Bunny, HA, tell us about Bunny! I like bunnies...
And how does the bunny lay eggs? And different colored ones at that that are already hard boiled? I like bunnies too, especially baby bunnies...
My wolves absolutely love baby bunnies! Sometimes they even swallow before chewing.
painfully
I could tell you but a division of DARPA would make us both sorry for my indiscretion.
In a stew, with red taters...delicious.... Careful with he salt though...
Keep your wolves away from my baby bunnies! One of my Shih-Tzus made friends with a bunny every time I took her on a walk in L.A. Took her about two months to get the bunny to trust her. She ended up licking the bunny on it head every time she saw her.
Taste test.
She's just sucking up to her master. She knows the bunny could take her one on one.
One day my hybrids found where the rabbits were hiding in the yard.....in the 30 seconds it took me to get over there one of them had already swallowed 3 juvenile rabbits. They were pretty big but not yet adults so he'd crunch them once and then swallow before grabbing the next one. I think he regretted it a few days later.
A year or two later the other hybrid was hanging out by the burn pile for a while and when I called him in he waddled because he had eaten lots of......something. He coughed up chunks of meat the moment he stepped inside so I put him in the kennel overnight. In the morning I counted 3 pairs of adult-sized rabbit ears in the kennel, all still attached at the base.
By the way all my hybrids (since the first one) have been raised to be very dog friendly so they know that Shih-Tzus are dogs and not prey. They also seem to know that they're too small to play with.
This discussion is a sad commentary on the human race, not to mention Newstalkers.
People who believe in the Christian faith don't deserve the deluge of disdain that flows forth, at any mention of "God" on this site, from a coterie of seemingly professional atheists whose interest only seems to come to life when there are "bible-thumpers" to be attacked.
But neither do non-believers deserve the tsunami of scriptural references and tortured arguments that flood from the minds and mouths of the "Christians" , who often sound like ignorant fanatics.
Tomorrow is Easter, the holiest day in the Christian religion.
What happened to "live and let live" ? Or a truce for Easter week?
If I had a dollar for every time we see the same tired arguments about the existence of God on this site , from both sides, I could start my own church.
Now you are scaring me!
Can't you celebrate your saviors resurrection without bashing those who do not share your faith?
Why is it that the bashers consider believers defending their beliefs as a bashing of their bashing side. Must the secular progressives always consider everything a believer believes to be an attack upon them?
Perhaps it is the venom with which the believers profess their own beliefs as if they are the only ones who have the right to believe the way the choose to believe, and the rest are unworthy of consideration.
I have no qualms with how others believe and respect their right to do so. However, I do expect the same consideration of my own rights to believe how and what I choose to. Just because my belief does not fall in line with those who feel they are the only ones who have the right to choose, it does not make it wrong for me.
We each have our own path to walk in life, and just because it is not in lock step with someone else's path does not mean it is wrong.
If everyone practiced more Harmony and tolerance in their own life, instead of trying to tell everyone else how to live theirs, the would just might be a better place for everyone.
The Bible says that you should care for immigrants and protect them like you do citizens, instead of deporting them. It comes from the book of the Bible that is beloved by bibles that oppose LGBT rights.
I thought you wanted strict separation of church and state?
Why would you quote the Bible on something to do with immigration?
I do support a strict separation of church and state. I am an atheist and I believe that dreamers and such must be protected. We are a nation of immigrants and that doesn't change because some people have embraced xenophobia as a personal crusade. If they want to cite Leviticus I am not going to let them ignore it when it isn't convenient to the conservative cause du jour.
I don't like Heartland claiming to be a Christian with an avatar that supports rounding up and deporting immigrants when his holy book tells him to do the opposite. Hypocrisy is very offensive to me.
That isn't the only Bible passage that talks about caring for others.
Actually, we are a nation of LEGAL immigrants. Like virtually every other country on Earth, we have immigration laws which are supposed to be followed and enforced.
And calling people names simply because they want those laws enforced is silly and childish.
What is so wrong about coming to America legally? Or staying here LEGALLY?
What part of the legal don't you like, and why?
So now you DO want to use the Bible as the basis for immigration policy? But you want a strict separation of church and state?
WTH?
Why must you and other conservatives always be so binary in your thought processes?
No, I don't want to use the Bible as the basis of our immigration policy. I only referenced the Bible to highlight the fact that Heartland claims to be a Christian and yet his own Bible tells believers to do otherwise. Our immigration policy must be based on compassion for people coming here seeking a better life. The ethic of reciprocity is an ancient idea that spans most religions and yet doesn't require the person who supports that idea to believe in any religion or deity.
1. First of all Christians are not under the laws of Moses. That’s why we have a NEW covenant with God
2. Secondly that passage does not forbid deporting those who break and show no respect for our laws. It means we should care for them with respect. But we will still maintain our national sovereignty
Nothing in the Bible about not obeying immigration laws, is there?
And whatever his PERSONAL beliefs are, it really has absolutely NOTHING to do with wanting immigration laws enforced.
If that is true then when did Jesus mention LGBT rights? You cannot ignore Leviticus when it is inconvenient.
I didnt see any mention of national sovreignty or deporting people who didn't walk across a political border at the right crossing in the Bible. Modern conservatives would deport Jesus because he spoke the wrong language, he was of the wrong race and his skin color was just a bit too dark for their Aryan fantasies.
We don't deport people for any of those reasons. That is all in your head.
We deport people who come or stay here illegally, or who commit crimes while here legally.
I actually support immigration. In fact, once the wall is built and the border secured, I would support an increase in legal immigration based on our country’s needs. I even support allowing President Trumps DACA plan and allowing the rest of the illegals here who learn English, work, go to college, etc. to remain here indefinitely as permanent legal resident aliens. Until the wall is built we must deport all illegals ICE can detain.
Sure is hypocritical.
Not really. Epistte is making a point using a book that some use to bash others over the head with
Very true, and the Jewish people were allowed to own slaves and as long as they didn't kill them when beating them, it was all legal. Today, we recognize that each of us are humans and we support human rights, and I know this will come as a surprise to you, but those in the LGBT community are humans deserving of human rights.
Religion is an attack on reality.
No, it isn't. The Bible tells its believers that they must care for others as themselves, even when those people are not citizens of that land. Why is it that conservative embraced Leviticus when you could cite it to oppose LGBT rights but you have a blind spot the size of the Atlantic ocean on its instruction about caring for immigrants? We see that hypocrisy and are calling you out on it. You can't pick and choose when it suits your political agenda.
I am a humanist and I support caring for others who come to the US or other countries seeking political refuge, despite my stance that there is no god. I do not need a holy book or the threat of hell from any god to tell me how to treat others, especially those in distress who are seeking refuge. Political borders will likely be as irrelevant as state and city borders are in the US in under 50 years because we must start thinking as an integrated global community in order to survive. We cannot continue to be insular and xenophobic and survive in the age of a global internet and world trade in under a week. Information, disease, poverty, and communication do not respect borders.
I'm sure if asked if he supported LGBT rights he would have qouted Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; MALE and FEMALE created he them. Jesus wouldn't have considered LGBT rights as a legitimate issue.
Thank god we have you here to speak for Jesus.
They really don't like to have the bible thrown into their faces. Great response.
Women were property and people owned slaves so that period was not a high point of civil rights. If you want to quote Leviticus in the 21st century as the basis of secular policy you are going to get called on it.
You act as if you think that ancient borders had immigration check points, when in fact people moved freely all over the place in those days. For just one well-known example, Marco Polo went all through Southern Asia and into China unimpeded without a passport or a visa (at least by any border guards--local bandits might have been another thing although he didn't report any) stayed for some time to freely roam in the varies countries on the way.
This is something that has always puzzled me about the idea of human evolution. IF God created humans in His own image, then are we to assume that God is an ape? That Adam and Eve were actually apes and not human beings? At what point did Adam and Eve realize they were naked, ergo, without their fur? Somehow what the Bible says and what evolutionists say just does not make a lot of sense. One of them must be wrong. At least it seems so to me.
An interesting claim. Wasn't it on Good Friday or the day before that your hypothetical buddy Jesus ordered his mother to treat his beloved John as her son in law?
OMG....out of the mouths of babes.
Many are. You really aren't paying attention, are you.
So, after all that, can you simply answer the question.....does God supposedly look like an ape or human being? If he looks like an ape then the evolutionists may be right. If He looks like a human being then the creationists may be right. Myself, I find it hard to think of Him as looking like an ape.
And as I pointed out, there weren't any human rights either. So claiming "Jesus wouldn't have considered LGBT rights as a legitimate issue" isn't actually making any sort of valid argument for or against anything. It would be like saying Jesus didn't put a very high value on airplanes.
Skirting the CoC [ph]
I love that and believe it.
there was no such thing as human rights in the time of Jesus ? do you think LGBT individuals are non-human ?
YOU would.
Thanks for the best joke of the day.
Can your DNA prove that or is that just another conservative religious belief?
Can you ever post anything without your hatred for everyone who isn't exactly like you coming out?
Hopefully, with the new CoC, your constant attacks will be toned down.
Seems that you do.
Skirting CoC {SP}
Note that the concept of LGBT folks didn't even exist until the mid to late 1800s. Your hypothetical buddy Jesus would have been a product of his benighted era.
Interesting... How would Jesus view Trump's immigration policies? Biased? Racist? Yep. Would Jesus deny anyone shelter or help? No. Never.
Sorry, but Jesus or God has absolutely nothing to do with immigration law.
Ands why would anyone think it does?
Somebody didn’t.....
It was a joke.. Humor. Something alien 👽 to the powers that be even though it was directed at no individual or member but a broad statement.
Really? An attack? Grow up and develop a sense of humor. 👶
no. you stated this:
nothing about it being an "issue" or not - unless you can see the words "issue" in that sentence that nobody else can see ? looks like the one who made it an issue was you.
i'm glad to hear it
Weird how most critical thinkers don't see it your way.
Jesus was a radical who opposed the political and religious structure of the Jewish hierarchy in that period. To think that the biblical Jesus would have supported the policies of the GOP is to ignore the message of the gospels.
The fact that Jesus never mentioned gay people or abortion is lost on social conservatives who claim to be his followers. Most social conservatives are more interested in the ideas of the Old Testament and the letters of Paul than they are with the Gospel of Matthew or John. When was the last time that you heard an evangelical quote the Sermon on The Mount in their angry hateful tirades?
Perrie also didn't think that it was a joke. Personal attacks are not funny, despite your opinions.
Sure can!
And do it every year!
Can you accept one person's faith without criticizing it?
Why do you belive that your faith or the faith of anyone else exists outside of the free speech rights of others?
If you want to criticize my faith or lack thereof, go right ahead. I'm quite secure in my ideas and I welcome the questions and criticisms of others, unlike you appear to be.
I have never once criticized your beliefs---in fact, I have on more than one occasion EXPLICITLY told you that I don't care what you believe or don't believe in.
If you are going to insist that I have, I ask you to prove it so everyone can see what you claim.
My faith is MY faith. I have no need or compulsion to tell you about it. I have NEVER said one word against others believing as they wish. And I don't ridicule those who believe or those who don't believe.
you may WISH to think that is how I am--but reality is totally different.
Not when they weaponize that "faith."
As a scientist I will always criticize those who believe/worship organized religion and mythological beings.
You said it more eloquently than I would have. Thank you.
Who is this "they" you refer to?
Why?
What business is of yours what others believe, and how does MY faith interfere with your life?
he’s also a big fan of the Heartland Institute.
High level martial artist, paramedic and accomplished bassist as well.
We built the golf course when I was a young teen with the help of dad's Cub Cadet, some big yellow Tonka toys and a whole lot of back-breaking labor.
Did you ever post on a political forum at a music site?
One would think so.
I believe the seeder thinks that a greater amount of time is spent by non-believers concocting ways to mess with those of faith than is actually so. The majority (if not all) of my acquaintances spend zero time on this notion, they have greater concerns than the beliefs or non-beliefs of others, as it should be.
Agreed. Those confident in their mastery over death would logically spend zero time hating on non-believers...
Unless, of course, those believers were trying to inject their fantasy beliefs into every facet of secular society, from our government, laws, public spaces and public schools. We have religious freedom in America which means whether you believe or not, you have the same rights as any other citizen, there is no religion that should get a special position in society.
If one religion was trying to push its agenda in our government, laws, public spaces and schools then it would only be logical for non-believers to challenge such undeserved privilege.
Believers (at least as represented by the vast majority of which who show up on discussion sites like this) reap what they sow.
If religionists didn't have an effect on our lives, we would ignore you.
I think the non-believers ask tough questions that believers aren't able to answer with anything other than "Well that's what I believe and you can't change my faith!" which isn't really a valid argument for a position. The non-believers only get "high fives" and praise when they make valid cogent arguments for their position. If the non-believers simply claimed that all that had to support their belief in evolution or the big bang theory was faith and not an explanation of an aspect of the natural world that can be repeatedly tested, in accordance with the scientific method, using a predefined protocol of observation and experiment, then they would be the ones who felt ridiculed and vilified.
If you took some of the all time best adult Jeopardy contestants and pit them against your average 8th grader, the 8th grader might feel "ridiculed and vilified" for not being able to compete on any real level considering they would most likely get destroyed. To try and pit educated non-believers against believers who felt their faith was more important than learning facts, believers who likely had higher education ridiculed by their parents and peers, why be surprised that they get the stuffing knocked out of them every time they try and enunciate their faith based reality that has little to do with facts based reality? You might know everything about Jesus and his ministry, but that won't help you on an actual science or geology test, in fact, it may hinder you rather dramatically.
The USA, demographically , is about 70% Christian, 6% non-Christian religion. The remainder are the irreligious and those not answering.
I doubt this site is so askew of the basic US religious demographics.
As a long time paramedic, I'm pretty sure that nobody has an agreement with death.
"As a long time paramedic"
Oh Wow so now your also a paramedic in addition to being a medical professional, scientist, and golf course owner. In the last two days you've listed four different professions that you claim to be, I can't wait to see what you are tomorrow and the following days to come. At this rate by this next Friday you'll eighteen different professions, I find that amazing, amazing as in BS
Not at all. You are free to believe as you see fit, just don't expect others to believe as you do. As a deist, I can believe in God, but also accept that there is no proof of a god, or many gods. Nor do I believe that if there is a "God", he or she has any influence on humans at all. Believe as you see fit, just do not ever force it on others, or expect our secular government to allow you any more than your constitutional right to believe in whatever you wish, Your religious freedoms end where someone else's civil rights begin... deal with it.
Absolutely right Mr Frost. I never see it as non-believers ridiculing believers in this site as much as I see it as believers showing up here with a real "Fuck You" attitude. They post articles that are are really believe in them or not and then are unwilling to discuss alternatives like agnosticism or atheism which they immediately attack and dismiss. If the "believers" want the be treated more fairly (and I think they are treated as fairly as they deserve now) then they need to cut the confrontational attitude a bit. The come here proselytizing (and they shouldn't bother denying the obvious, because that is exactly what they do) and then expect people to greet them as friends. They expect people to immediately believe as they do, without giving them any reason to, beyond just demands that that's how their holy books says it has to be. I mean what do they expect from their aggressiveness?
Most of the paramedics where I live do it on a volunteer basis so they hold down regular jobs too. A friend in Colorado is a FWS ranger and a paramedic on the side, and also does both mountain rescue and S&R with her dog.
.
Actually that would be Larry Robinson the esteemed pastor, theologian, tax accountant, astronaut, submarine commander, underwear model and international businessman.
So you only do one thing? I enjoy doing many things. Many of them coincide.
What is so odd about that? I've had many different careers during my lifetime. I've worked since I was 12 years old, and each different work experience was a step into a different world that was both enlightening and enjoyable. It helped me grow as a person and in my own knowledge, from Dairy Queen carhop to professional fashion and photography model to owning and operating my own business, to working as a paralegal to being a medical secretary to executive administrative assistance to computer and software technical beta tester to Instructor of computer and software applications at two community college to again owning my own business to Secretary of the Board Of Directors for a technology organization. And during that time I earned a Masters degree in Business Management and became a Microsoft Most Valuable Professional (MVP). So what is so odd about having many careers?
Some people like doing only one type of work in their life, but, some of us like doing different things as our life moves forward and as necessity dictates.
Actually, it might be against the CoC for someone to challenge something like that .. just as it is if I doubt someone who claims they served in the military, when their behavior in here shows they have no respect for our Constitution. I'm still not allowed to bring it up.
Personally, I think .. it's the Internet, I take everyone's personal claims with a grain of salt, but in here we're not allowed to challenge them.
It does not bother me in the least if someone here does not believe me on what I have done in my life. I am good with how my life has turned out, in spite of the many tragedies that I have faced along the way. I feel they have made me stronger and more understanding of others. I don't need to explain jack to anyone, nor do I owe anyone one. I am proud of the accomplishments I have made in life, and have enjoyed the wide variety of learning curves and challenges they have provided as well, as they have made me the person I am, and I make no excuses for who I am.
Whether or not challenging someone's career choices is a CoC violation or not is up to the Mods. As we don't all know the various people here on a personal basis, or are intimate of their private life, it is not our call to sit in judgement of anyone.
Just my own take on it.
I have twin uncles on my father's side (or had, one passed away) and both of them worked for 40 plus years as fork-lift driver for GM in Grand Rapids, Michigan. And I mean that is all they did for their entire working life. The same job. Driving fork-lifts. Every day. Year after year. Now granted they were really great paying UAW jobs and they had great benefits for them and their families, with health, dental, increasing paid vacations, regular raises, job security, employee discounts on new cars, great retirement pensions and health benefits, etc., the whole union gluttonous ball of wax. But all they did for the whole nearly 40 years was drive fork-lifts moving the same type of materials from one part of the production plant, in the same production plant to be made into various car seats for various GM cars and trucks and nothing else. I would have gone out of my fucking mind!
When I was discharged from the Air Force my dad and I got into a big fight because my Uncle Bob and Dick had pulled some strings with the Union and they had said that they could have gotten me on as a fork-lift driver just like them in a few weeks and in the Union in a few months. You know that was 1977 and that was 40 plus years ago and that GM plant is still there in Grand Rapids and still making various car and truck seats for various GM cars and trucks and if I had taken that job I could have been a fork-lift driver there for the whole past 40 plus years, with the same great pay, benefits, etc. And all I would have had to do was to spend my whole working life driving a fork-lift from one end of the same production plant to the other, hauling basically the same production material, to be made into various car seats for various GM car and truck seats day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year, for 40 plus years (and maybe have joined a bowling league) until I retired to Florida.
When I refused and also then refused my dad's offer to get me on with the Teamsters as a Truck Driver like him, he wouldn't talk to me for months because he said I was insulting his and his brother's and his father's (his dad was a working truck driver too) way of life.
Maybe I was?
I don't think you were. You simply realized that you had a different calling in life. Both my Mother and Father worked different types of work over their life, as did both sets of my Grandparents. Perhaps that is where I got my need for occupation challenges. The more things I learned the more I wanted to learn. In return for the various knowledge that I gathered along the way, I did my best to share it with others who I could help do better in their own life.
We each have our own path in life, and it may not be one that everyone else would choose. And that is truly one of the beautiful parts that makes the world such an interesting place to be.
I blame my mother's father. Grandpa Ranta always said to try to take the chance to experience as many things as you could because when you got old you would be happier remembering the memories you had then the memories of the things you had a chance to do and didn't. So I did things like when I was in North Dakota and we had a storm and it got down to minus 31 degrees with a minus 105 wind chill when it gusted, I got my gear on and went outside because I wanted to know what it was like to be outside in a blizzard like that and I figured I'd never get another chance to find out, so I grabbed the chance. It was a very strange, incredible and not to be missed sensation.
An old girlfriend of mine when I first came out West to the L.A area to live 27 years ago told me about a place above the San Fernando Valley, up Topanga Canyon Road and then a hike where you could see the whole valley from at night and that it was an incredible sight, so of course I had to go up there that night. We drove up as far as we could and walked for about 1 and 1/2 hours and I was pretty disappointed until were reached a small ledge and then it was something I never thought was possible to see. We were way up and the lights below were like a spray of different colored jewels spread out for dozens of miles below. I was awe struck! I didn't want to leave. I sat there and smoked a joint and just marveled at it for hours. I am glad that I did, because I know that now at my age I could never climb up there again, but I have the memory of it stored safely away.
Then again I also remember being in Minneapolis, Minnesota one day in 1975, stoned out of my gourd, at a White Castle Restaurant and sitting on the curb in front of it. I was eating Turkey sliders with a very, very, very wicked case of the munches and they were going down one right after another. However about three feet away from me was the Red driver's side fender of a Minnesota State Highway Patrol car with two officers sitting in it watching me pretty closely (or so I thought) as I kept eating at a pretty good clip. In my very buzzed conditioned I ate 23 Turkey sliders, one small order of fries and drank one regular Coke. I used to wear a a green golf style beret cap back then that looked like it was made out of an old piece of ratty carpet and I tipped it to the officers as I managed to stand up and walk back to our car on the other side of the restaurant. I guess that qualifies as a remembered experience too. The didn't come after us, so I guess they thought I was OK. LOL.
There are many opportunities given to us in life, whether or not we take advantage of them is up to us. I can never say that my life was boring.
My dad had several occupations over his life. When he left home, he went to Ohio and worked in a mental hospital. Then he went to Delaware and did the same thing there. Then he got a job working at textile mill. Then he worked for Chrysler putting in the seats. Then he bought a half interest in a dairy farm and was a dairy farmer for 3-4 years. Then he worked in the coal mines until he retired, so he spent probably 30 years in the mines. His last job was township supervisor. That was an elected position and I was very proud that he got elected.
My dad was a wanderer and I think I got some of that from him. There's nothing wrong in changing jobs or interests over the course of your life.
Where was the bashing?
Blue laws, DOMA laws, repealing Roe v.Wade, teaching religious ideas in public schools. Discrimination based on your conservative interpretation of the bible.
Why do you think that we have the separation of church and state in the 1st Amendment of the US Constitution? That idea isn't there by accident. It is there to prevent the creation of religious beliefs being enforced by the state that happened in Europe.
Apparently, you failed to read the first two paragraphs of the article.
I am not a denier of Easter. Or, in fact, of God herself (Peace Be Upon Her!).
But cute 'lil 'ole Bunny Rabbits laying Easter Eggs-- that's a bridge too far (to coin a phrase).
So yes, I am a "Bunny Rabbits Laying Easter Eggs" Denier.
I just thought of Robin Trower when you were talking about bridges.
It's interesting how Christianity co-opted the festivals of all kinds of different religions and pagan traditions, in this case the Germanic fertility goddess Eostre. If that's that's where "estrous cycle" comes from then it explains why they kill the rabbit.
The resurrection .. the trinity .. all of these myths were taken from older myths. Noah's Ark is the most famous one, since we have an amazing written record of Gilgamesh. But facts can't thwart fanatics who are emotionally attached to their myths.
I enjoy it as a fun day and will help with an Easter Egg Hunt for kids
I know it is a big day for the religious and hope they have a good time
It's always been one of my favorite holidays, right behind Thanksgiving. It's a day to relax and wait on that ham to be cooked. I'm gonna take a nap, too
So, I did as you asked and reposted Celestina's Elevenish Ways to Kill a Peep. While I was googling to find her blog site, I noticed several news sites with 10 ways to kill peeps ... copycats! I'm guessing they read hers, otherwise why would they say 10? Hmm.
So do I but I get a very strong impression that the ones we meet here just sulk more and use the day to try to devise new strategies to impose their superstitions onto the rest of us.
Yes, instead of going out and doing work of their faith that could really do some good for those who need help. But, I guess even then it would only be for those that were Christians and agree with their own ideology.
I think you're right. Many of my friends are devout, and they're out and about, getting along with pretty much everyone, being good people, not attacking everyone and being all hateful (even to those of their own religion, such as the Catholic vs Protestant, mainstream Protestant vs fundamentalist, creationist vs young earther stuff we see from them when there are no atheists for them to attack) and having bullshit persecution complexes. But then, they're not young earthers or literalists, so their brains haven't shut down.
That's what TRUE Christians do. They are secure in their own faith and have no need to question that of others, whatever their own faith may be. It is only those who do not have faith in themselves or their own belief that feel the need to question or threaten others due to their choice of religious faith, or chastise those who so not believe.
They live their own life and walk their own path in life and let others do the same. They are the true believers, whatever their faith may be.
That's what my mom was like. She wouldn't recognize the religious freaks here.
Christians are called by Christ to spread the gospel. It's not intended that they be mean about it, but if you think Christians are supposed to be quiet and not broadcast their beliefs, you're wrong.
why would Christ need so many advertisers ?
To keep the holy Ponzi scheme from collapsing.
Because God wants us to be social and live as a community. Plus TVs were still very primitive in those days.
He wants all of us to participate in our own way in the great commission.
Nah, you're called by Paul to spread the gospel. Not by Christ. Have you really not even read the bible, and read the differences in what Jesus and Paul said?
It's sad, how few Christians have actually studied what they spout off about.
Yet when anyone else wants to broadcast their beliefs, and get the same consideration as the Christians, the fundies screech about persecution and the war on their religion, and threaten those who disagree with them. It's not that we intend to be mean about it - we just value the Constitution, and your myths have no more value than anyone else's (such as Zeus, Atum, Isis, Krishna, etc.)
Fundies are called by their churches to brainwash people for money and power. I watched the live show of Jesus Christ, Superstar, this evening .. and they nailed the fact that it was all about the power of the Roman government, and the clash with the church. The church ended up winning, and now we've had centuries of mass murders and genocides due to religion.
Is this what God told you ? Do you regularly speak to God or have you heard this from one of his public relations employees like Paul ?
nobody knows 100% for sure what God does/wants/looks like/feels etc. - unless you think you do and can give us a clear and distinct definition for everyone ?
Plus, since God is supposed to be all-knowing, he should have put a clause in that stated "keep spreading the word until TV and Computers are everywhere, then you don't have to do it anymore".
Matthew 28:19-20 New King James Version (NKJV)
19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.
Mark 16:15-16 New King James Version (NKJV)
15 And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.
God and Jesus didn't speak to people in the Bible about material things that had no knowledge of, what would have been the point? That would have been Isacc Newton saying after he proved the law of gravitation " Gravity can not be escaped until rocket ships can leave the earth.
We will do as we always do, celebrate the life, death and resurrection of Jesus the Christ. No Easter eggs, in fact we don’t even mention the word Easter
we speak to each other as the early church (prior to the cult of the Church of Rome)
greeting one another with “He is risen” and the response being “He is risen indeed”. We will worship Him in songs and spiritual songs, bring a teaching from the Word of God, have communion as He commanded, pray for one another, and then share a meal in the fellowship of the body.
sometimes we celebrate at a park so we can share food and His love with others
This has been my style of ministry for nearly 40 years
You speak Aramaic?
You DON'T?
Nope. never.
Even my knowldge of latin is laughable.
How else am I supposed to interpret this statement? Livefree' isn't a Gnostic or Eastern Orthodox Christian so the only alternative translation of that statement is that he speaks Aramaic or possibly Greek.
The language of the early (Roman) Catholic church was obviously vulgar and then classical Latin.
As an old medical professional had to learn a bit of Latin. Too bad it is classified as a dead language.
Et tu, Brute?
I learned the little bit of Latin that I know of was from Catholic teachings and then terms for physics, upper-level math and some philosophy. I know a little greek from my philosophy classes but I wouldn't consider myself to be even passable as a tourist.
I tried to learn Latin from a serious of DVDs but it wasn't a success.
Yes, indeed. And then there are the smart-asses like episette. And thank Zeus for that.
Everyone needs a hobby and an outlet for my stress.
It seems you aren’t happy unless you really extend yourself to find a way to denigrate Christians
the obvious context to any rational person was “in the same manner or custom”
in the meantime may you discover the love and hope that is in Jesus
I am only asking questions of the most obvious of your illogical statements. If you don't like my questions then stop being illogical.
Exhibit A.
Well said live free. Everyone knows exactly what you were talking about. The Christian Church before Rome “converted” was a beautiful thing.
Rome was beautiful before it adopted Christianity and made it the official religion of the empire. Shortly after that Rome collapsed, no doubt in part due to Christianity and the horrors it caused.
I don't let anybody near my back anymore. Especially not good friends.
I learned medical and scientific terminology, but speaking any other language than English is problematic. English is the language of pilots.
Or family.
Skirting the CoC [ph]
And did God die and you got named to judge others in His place? How would YOU know if she or anyone else has any "Good Friends"? And how do WE know that YOU have and any "Good Friends"?
Don't pretend to stand In God's shoes to judge others. Concentrate on your OWN life and try to see how much better YOU can be.
Wow, that tells us more about you than all of your other comments combined. And it didn't improve anything.
I expect Tom Hanks will star in the story of his life.
Sean Penn or Mel Gibson would be more amusing.
Fundies apparently hate all other Christians as much as they hate atheists. Very strange.
I am not a fundamentalist nor have I ever hated anyone
Your comment about Catholics implies otherwise ... at the very least, it shows an arrogance towards other Christians who don't share your interpretation of the Bible. Considering the number of people who have been murdered because of Protestant vs. Catholic faith, even though they all worship the same god - as if their god isn't enough above humans to have different approaches to it, and as if any human could possibly know for certain what it thought - I find that comment to be pretty hateful.
Go read about Henry VIII, then Bloody Mary, then Elizabeth (or, more recently, the Irish "troubles") if you think it's acceptable to pretend Catholics are any less Christian than you are. It's not helpful with the 33,000 different Christian sects in existence when you turn on others as if you are somehow a prophet who can somehow fathom the mind of God, and they're not true Christians.
LOL.
Your Christian views are quite fundamentalist. Maybe you have a different definition of what a fundamentalist is.
Does hating reality count?
I can say the same and I agree with you. I also agree that the Church based in Rome has some serious doctrinal issues. If they didn’t, there would not have been a Protestant reformation in the first place.
Are you truly that ignorant about your religion? The Protestant religion was formed because Henry VIII wanted to divorce Catherine and marry Anne Boleyn. The Pope wouldn't allow it, so he formed his own religion. Then, his two daughters murdered hundreds of people as they went from Papist to Protestant and back.
Geesh. I cannot believe this. Well, actually, I can. Most fundies are ignorant about their own religions, from what I've seen in here.
Now, you're correct about the doctrinal issues of the original Christian religion. It was all about politics, and they picked and chose which gospels they wanted to include in the bible, and corrupted any possible meaning that Jesus had in favor of Paul, assuming either of them existed. And yet this is the bible you base your hatred on - the very bible assembled by the church you so disdain.
Comment removed for CoC violation [ph] to know Henry VIII started the Chruch of England. Protestantism originated from work of several theologians starting in the 12th century, although there could have been earlier cases of which there is no surviving evidence.
The English church renounced papal authority when Henry VIII failed to secure an annulment of his marriage to Catherine of Aragon in 1534.[9] The English Reformation accelerated under Edward VI's regents, before a brief restoration of papal authority under Queen Mary I and King Philip. The Act of Supremacy 1558 renewed the breach and the Elizabethan Settlement charted a course enabling the English church to describe itself as both catholic and reformed:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_England
So, I'm curious - you mentioned communion on this Sunday. Does your church practice communion every Sunday, or once a month, or just on special occasions? I'm curious because to my Mom (she was an Episcopal deacon for years and a chaplain), it's not church without communion. That's the part that makes her feel closest to God, and her joy when she became a deacon and gave communion to her congregation (and her atheist daughter) was amazing (although having to finish up the consecrated wine afterwards since it couldn't be thrown out was a minor issue since she doesn't like the taste of alcohol, lol). I've talked to her former priest back in CO and he's arranging for someone to bring her communion each Sunday as a shut-in, as she did back in her day for others. Other Protestant faiths such as Presbyterians celebrate communion only once a month, and some consider it almost blasphemy and ritual cannibalism and Papist tripe. Anyway, I'm just curious, I always find it interesting to learn how others worship and why.
Also, why don't you mention Easter - is it because of the pagan origins? Or something else?
I think Mom would enjoy your way of celebrating .. song, worship, and communion. Especially if it were held outside. And I don't think she'd give a hoot if Easter wasn't mentioned; not because she takes offense with the pagan origins, but rather because to her it's just all about the resurrection, and is the holiest day of the year, and what it's called doesn't matter at all.
Dipping hard boiled eggs in dye was always my favorite part of easter.
I colored 3 dozen eggs this Easter.
"He is risen" Sounds like a dog whistle for the teavangelical church elders to meet outside the Sunday school classroom.
Knuckle dragging thumper bullshit splattered all over the front page again.
yeah, some adults learn to simply ignore stuff that gets them riled up!
Mentally defective comedy doesn't rile me. Thumpers are the theological keystone cops of the 21st century.
Then why bitch that it is on the front page?
Why not just pass on by?
Tell you what--you don't like religion, fine. Don't have one. No one is hurt by having religion or not having one.
Your constant belittlement of those who are religious is tiresome.
Good day.
Don't you mean good Friday?
if I had MEANT Good Friday, I would have WROTE Good Friday.
What part of that is confusing you so?
Well said Texan.
Again, consider that source.
Like you?
And some of us do something about what pisses us off.
Whining isn't really "doing something" in my book.
How The Grinch Stole Easter? Small c christian fundies surely are a bunch of whiny full time victims. While those who truly believe in Christ's resurrection will celebrate those with no real faith sit in the dark trolling all those who refuse to be as miserable as they are...
Do you think HA is upset about my Easter/April Fool's fun article?
Pissed enough not to use any Jergens lotion until monday.
Lots of angry conservatives on Good Friday.......
So what. Funny how they get all militant defending the Prince of peace. Hypocrites. F'em.
I don't want to hurt the widdle snowflakes feelers.......
God needs no defending.
somebody thinks you're angry. Show 'em that you're not
Show them your funny side
it does seem that God needs a lot of advertisers and can't ever have enough of them
I thought we were talking about his kid. You know, the one born after the spiritual molestation of a 14 year old girl, who was a descendant of some incestuous family fuckfests 3982 years before.
Most successful and longest running Ponzi scheme in history.
I never saw it.
I disagree. If there were a god it'd need defending from its most fanatical believers.
No more than unicorns do. But doesn't your "god" need his gullible followers to carry out his dirty work? No one else will do that for him.
You mean she wasn't a virgin??!?!?!?!?
Then you don't know what God is.
So childish.
Should anyone ever expect anything more from you, or is this it?
Sorry, my God doesn't have dirty work.
Do tell what you have learned.
No, that’s about it.
Tell me which part of my comment isn't true according to the thumper version of the bible.
Deleted, Skirting CoC {SP}
ummm... nobody knows who/what God is since we have no proof of existence nor non-existence, remember ? if you think you know who/what God is for 100% sure - then please share that with everyone since we'll finally have clear and distinct definition.
but we do know that God needs lots of people to advertise for him/her/it (spread the word, right ?) and can't seem to have enough since God is constantly trying to recruit more and more people
Complete bs.
This comment was made earlier on this article:
so you are telling me that Christ doesn't need advertisers but yet calls on all of the believers to "spread the word" (which is advertising... ever hear of "word of mouth" advertising ?) anyway ? sounds like the only one with "complete bs" is you if you believe that to "spread the word" isn't advertising. Plus, on top of all the needed advertising, Christ is constantly trying to recruit more people into believing, and thusly commanding them to advertise as well, correct ?
Also, since you stated my last statement was "complete bs." that must mean you have a clear and distinct definition of who/what God is and you will now share it with everyone to stop all the confusion on who/what God is, correct ?
if any of this is wrong - please feel free to correct the record.
Spiritual rape of a chile, and ritual cannibalism, and zombies .. what's not to like?
My thoughts to you exactly.
Why must you mimic me?
Can't come up with anything original all on your own?
Thanks for confronting their behavior here. The God haters here have well proven the seed to be 100% true regarding them and their war on Easter.
Now there's a war on Easter?
Did the Easter Bunny eat all your chocolates again?
I like it. If my Photoshop or Maya skills were better I would create a graphic in honor of your literary brilliance.
Fucking religious snowflakes... If you spent your time doing as Jesus commands you'd be too busy to write/seed articles about non-Christians.
If you spent your time doing what Jesus commanded, wouldn't you be too busy to respond?
Did you really mean to post that comment?
I asked the same question of him that he asked of others.
Problem?
Well, did you see it on your screen and read it?
SMDH and LMAO!
But you are the conservative Christian so you are the one she will call out among people saying saying similar things. I just impasse her every time she comments on my posts.
Impasse
Impasse is not ignore. You ignore by not engaging. Impasse is use when a discussion is going nowhere and you don't want bad feelings. Please do not use impassed for ignore.
Is that the fast lane or the slooooowwww lane, lol.
A bit slow on the uptake, so it must be the slow lane.
Believe me the bad feelings are there and quite real.
Cry us all a river.
Impasse
Where is the argument with Gordy that is at an impasse? Perrie implicately told you not to do what you did.
Well, of course.
it is what some of them do.
I always just consider the source.
I have already told you nicely, that the impasse rule is to be only used when there has been a discussion and you can't come to an agreement. This is your 1st waring.
I'm an atheist. I don't write or post broad brush articles on how shitty Christians are either. Some of them participating here, though, prove how shitty they are with every key stroke.
The term snowflakes is not to be used on NTers.
The new CoC doesn't go into effect until April 6
So there's a list of banned words? That's rather pathetic.
"The term snowflakes is not to be used on NTers. "
Not until April 6th. Do try to keep up.
Wow, that's going to really cut back the rightwing vocabulary--by at least half by my estimate.
Conservatives stance on censorship is as variable and hypocritical as their religious beliefs.
Mine, too. I was really starting to like calling conservatives snowflakes
Snowflake, snowflake, snowflake snowflake!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Whew. glad I got that out of my system!
No list of banned words; rules against derogatory references in general. [ new CoC ]
Impasse
Why are you so eager to claim an impasse instead of continuing the discussion?
When you're being trounced by logic and called out on your hatred and hypocrisy, what else is there to do? I mean, other than study the actual history of Christianity so you'd have some actual knowledge?
But Nazi references are acceptable?
Go figure!
If the truth fits.
Snowflake accurately describes some people, too.
It was the alt-right who crawled out from under their Aryan rocks and began to publicly support Donald Trump that began calling people snowflakes during the 2016 elections but now they want that term banned because people are realizing that the conservatives are the ones who cannot handle being criticized.
Why is it that supposed small government conservatives claim to be for freedom but apparently they only want freedom for themselves and of rights, freedoms, and words that they agree with. If you truly supported freedom and censorship you would support equal rights and freedoms for all people regardless if you agreed with the speech or the idea in question, but conservatives don't support equal rights for all people.
Impasse
Who don't I support equal rights for?
Can you name one single group I have ever not supported equal rights for?
Or is this yet another instance where you make claims against me without a shred of proof?
Sigh.
DD__SOS
Should we just pretend that my paycheck has NOT increased under the new tax law?
SMDH
Everyone else is free to continue the discussion.
They are simply referencing something that are a part of and know well.
Aren't snowflakes fragile and extra white? It sounds like a case of projection on the part of conservatives.
Which personality am I talking with today? 2 weeks ago you claimed that you were not Christian, you were spiritual and not religious and you didn't use the Bible.
You oppose LGBT equality because you support the business owners right to refuse service based on their religious views, or did that stance also change? Given that stance we can guess what your views are on women's and minority rights or did you embrace full equality for all people and not the Fox News version of it?
So once again you produce absolutely NOTHING that I have posted against equal rights for all.
Your nasty little habit of attributing posts to me that I never write is growing tiresome.
Maybe, just for a change of pace, and in the interest of truthfulness and honesty, produce ONE post where I stated any such nonsense against equal rights.
You claim it, so produce it. Come on!
The very same personality that has to continually call you out when you keep making false statements about what I have posted or what I believe.
Are you the very same person who keeps doing that without a shred of proof?
This software platform doesn't permit me to search all of your posts, so unless I am going to catalog every post I cannot post word for word statements of yours. I do know your personality and you have a habit of being intellectually dishonest and becoming outraged when you are called on it.
I miss vBulletin software that permits a person to easily search 2-3 years of previous posts. I was temporarily banned on a previous forum because I had a penchant for exposing people, even once the moderator, on their hypocritical statements of the past when it was intellectually inconvenient.
Because he doesn't like what I have to say when I call him on his obvious BS and he has no viable comeback. So this is his way of shutting me out. Or so he thinks anyway.
Skirting the CoC [ph]
No need to reply because I have had it with you.
You have my complete attention. How do I do that?
Thank you very much. I hope that Perrie and others don't ban me for resurrecting previous statements to prove that someone is a hypocrite.
You may be confusing Texan with Texan1211 unless they're the same guy with two different handles both with Texan at the beginning.
If you can do it. You're one of Perrie's pets she would never ban you or delete any of your comments no matter how big of a CoC they are. Same goes for SP.
I quoted you to prove you're a hypocrite but SP deleted it saying it was a CoC violation even though I used your very words to prove it.
This is something that we are working on, but you can see comment history by going to a person's homepage and clicking on their name. The timeline is a complete comment history.
I hope she takes you up on that.
I normally don't engage with these kinds of comments, but I will, since there seems to be a problem with understanding the CoC and what is deemed as favoritism.
epistte has gotten written up, but she has a good comprehension of what is and is not allowed on the site. If you feel that this is favoritism, than you don't understand the CoC.
Her quote:
Seems directed to no particular member. Am I wrong? I read up and down the tread and I can't seem to find who she would be directing this to.
As to who removed your last comment, it was me. You made a direct personal comment to epistte, which is a violation, even before the updated version of the CoC.
My advice would be that instead of thinking that there is something biased about moderation, is to actually learn the CoC.
I do not understand what is going on here Texan.
Her comment was directed at ME.
She claimed I posted something and got pissed off when I demanded proof, because I knew damn well I never posted what she claimed.
And it wasn't the first time she has done that to me. I got tired of it.
OK, at least now I get what is going on.
So now you are stepping in to pile on and accusing Perrie of being a "hard left monitor" and showing favoritism? You really need to get your facts straight before you accuse someone of being from a political party that they aren't, and playing favorites.
Up from the grave He arose! Hallelujah!
Amen! That is the point of it all.
Jah or Yah ( Hebrew : יהּ Yah ) is a short form of Yahweh
Hallelujah literally means "Praise Jah" or "Praise Yahweh".
I often find it interesting that the God of the Hebrews, who was so jealous and violent throughout the Old testament, even sending wild bears to devour children that had teased a prophet about being bald, is considered by many to also be Jesus, the turn the other cheek non-violent minister from the New testament. They say God is perfect and unchangeable, but you could not get two more disparate personalities than Yahweh and Jesus.
Mmmmm.......brains!
A bit of premature re-incarnation there.
Sounds like the plot to a zombie movie.
Seems as though there are quite a few angry anti-Christians here. Do religious holidays (something they don't believe in or celebrate, hence they are unaffected) always make them so angry?
Being anti-teavangelical isn't anti-Christian. Pretty easy to get a tee time today. Thanks thumpers.
The Catholics have to be at the Stations of the Cross by 3 PM. That would be a good tee time
...only if you want to play the last 3 holes in the dark. The only Catholic males interested in chasing little white balls around on Easter are wearing collars.
You can't get in 18 holes in 4 hours? You call yourself a golfer?
You have to allow extra time to smoke some weed, recklessly abuse the golf carts, drive back the balls from the foursome that hit into you, and say suggestive things to the snack cart girl.
Oh. Now, see, I didn't know all that. Mr Giggles just drinks a jugful of Bloody Marys before he golfs, Probably flirts with the cart girls, too
There are "cart girls" in golf? How old is too old to take it up?
Formula One got rid of the scantily dressed grid girls for 2018 so maybe they took a job flirting with the guys on the links.
I'm definitely flirtable (and that's probably just about all) and I wouldn't mind the walk as long as I didn't have to try to hit that silly ball.
I tried to learn golf so I could be part of corporate entrainment but I just cannot get into it. I prefer to ride my bike or very rarely fly fish but it is quite difficult to entertain a corporate client or woo a potential customer in the middle of the stream.
They would have signed any contract after you held their heads under water for 2 minutes.
I gave it a few non-intensive years before I realized, as the old saying goes, golf is a good walk spoiled.
Illogical people who try to force their religious views on others via government laws are a problem for me. You can pray to the proverbial rusty Studebaker hubcap and 3 Pez dispensers if you want to. Just don't try to force me to believe, pay for it, teach it is public schools or take part in your bronze age cosplay and I won't bother you.
I don't come to your church and demand a 5 minute rebuttal time for my Humanist beliefs after your sermon and I didn't knock on your door asking for donations or trying to convert you.
Well, then, complain to THEM.
Who is forcing you to believe? Who is forcing you to pay, and how much are you paying?
They don't teach it in public schools, and last I checked, no one has been forced to play any cosplay games.
So why are you still complaining?
They do teach it in public schools, especially in the South - and when anyone complains, they get harassed and threatened. It's illegal, of course, but they still do it. Once that stops, if it stops, and people like Roy Moore no longer put religious symbols on government grounds (and almost get elected to Congress despite being fired twice for violating the Constitution as a judge due to his religious beliefs), I think you'll find that the atheists and those of other religions (or even different sects within Christianity) will stop making a fuss.
That's why we're still complaining. If creationism is taught in school, which myth will it be? Atum masturbating us into existence (Egypt)? The barfing turtle (Native Americans)? You have to teach all, or none, or else our government is promoting one religion over another. Atum is just as rational as Adam and Eve; it's fascinating to see the stories early humans made up to try to figure out where we came from, but no one myth is more provable than another. A comparative religion class is the place for that; not science.
It's an insult to our students to pretend to them that a myth is on the same level as a scientific theory. No creation myths are scientific theories, and the apologists cry "it's just a theory" about evolution when they either know better or are choosing willful ignorance (gravity is "just a theory" as well, but you won't see the anti-evolutionists jumping off buildings to prove their disdain for science). Many Christians accept evolution and consider it as God's tool for managing the world since it was set in motion; it's only literalists whose faith would be shattered if they accepted any scientific facts which contradict the ancient stories of the bible, which claims that bats are mammals and that unicorns existed.
Name the schools then.
In what state are they located in?
Please do tell.
FL, AL, WV, TX and KY have all recently been trying to reintroduce Cretinism into the public school curriculum despite it being blatantly unconstitutional, and in reality most states in the bible-babble-belt frequently attempt to do so. Without watchdog groups like the Texas Freedom Network it's likely the bible-babbling Cretinists would be successful.
You forgot Oklahoma, Indiana, and Louisana.
Teaching abstinence as a sex education policy is also based on conservative religious belief.
So no state did it, then.
As I suspected.
Thanks for confirming it!
Shall talk examine this annual "christian" BS about not hearing enough "merry christmases" and how that's a plot to destroy the holiday (which has been spoiled by commercialism and co-opted by pagan sympols from the beginning) and how stores that don't force their employees to say it need to be punished? After that we can discuss the placement of christian symbols (and only those symbols) on public property and fashioning legislation that's aimed at benefiting only christian institutions or enterprises (see Noah's Ark and the tax breaks given by the state of TN).
Whoa....that should have been edited to "Shall we examine.......
Thanks for proving my point that conservatives don't pay attention.
Try this.
Denial doesn't suit you well.
Arkansas public schools have been putting up "In God We Trust" posters. Only a few are bitching about it, because you know...god. Ignorant people think that "God" encompasses all religions so what's the problem, right?
The anti Christians are always angry. They hate us and all we believe in with a bitter passion.
I don't hate you. I pity you, but maybe ignorance is truly bliss.
I do hate ignorance and sloppy thinking.
I know.
the mere EXISTENCE of religion is enough to set them off.
It is strange in this day and age that there are still people who believe in magical Jewish zombies.
Yeah, real strange.
Some 2.2 BILLION people are Christians. The number of Christians in the world has nearly quadrupled in the last 100 years.
More than 25% of Earth's population is Christian.
Real strange.
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Which means that 75% of all people either believe in the same god but with a different format (Jews, Muslims), in different gods altogether, or in no gods. And among the Christians, there are estimated to be about 33,000 different sects, each claiming to know what God thinks, what it wants, and so on -and murdering each other for centuries over those differences.
Your argument is a classic popularity fallacy that tries to insinuate that just an idea is true because many people agree with it.
The field of psychology also has an explanation for the popularity of illogical theistic religious belief. It is known as the herd mentality.
The fact that many a very large demographic of people around the world believe in an idea that they cannot prove only illustrates that logical and independent thought is not common among humans. The fact that religious belief is most commonly seen among populations of people who are less educated might be a hint that you wanto take into account.
How can it be that the more the Christian population grows, the more they try to wear the mantle of the put upon martyr? As I have said before most of them are fine and wonderful people, but some, as is demonstrated on this site, act as if they are beaten by thin reeds daily and forbidden to celebrate their holidays by some unknown force? When will some the so-called Christians on this site remove their hair shirts?
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Actually I'm wearing gold silk PJ's right now. Why, Do you want to get some sort of sick thrill from describing what I'm wearing under them?
Anyway, as far as sappy trees, during Reagan's recession in order to stay off from welfare one of the things a friend and I did (along with raising pigs and turkeys for food and baling hay and picking cherries for money) was tapping Maple trees for the sap for syrup. If you are willing to work very, very hard (like working for cash under the table harvesting Christmas trees for $2 an hour) in the rural areas you can usually pay your bills and even have a bit left over for Friday and Saturday night shared pot and beer with other hard working country folks
That is a nice personal attack that you have there.
Maybe they don't like have your primitive superstitions shoved down their throats.
It's the practitioners who are odious, not usually just the abstract existence of religion.
I had a Nazarene thumper knocking on my door just after noon. I offered to trade my copy of Dawkins for their bible. They weren't amused.
I wonder why?
I kind of liked my quick thinking. They were passing out small bibles and I saw them drop one off at my neighbors.
So now Nazarenes are “thumpers” too? So it really is all of Christianity that all you atheists refer to as that perjorative name.
LOL!! That is good that you had a heads up from their visit to your neighbor. I had Jehovah's Witness people knocking at my door many times over the years and many of them only spoke Spanish. When they first spoke to me in Spanish I shook my head and then asked,"Capisce Italiano?" or " Parlez-vous français?". "Maybe Sprechen Sie Deutsch?" And they would look at me wide eyed and shake their head while smiling coyly and hurry down the stairs. Worked every time.They never came to my house again until a new crop showed up, then they got the same questions.
Argumentum ad populum fallacy.
Yes, it is strange that in this day and age, people still believe silly superstitions. Strange indeed.
Don't knock on my door and try to sell me your preferred religious scam. I have a no soliciting sign on my mailbox but apparently they thought that didn't apply when they were going to save my heathen soul. It's fine that you have a religion but keep it to yourself if you don't want my opinion of your mythology.
I call the cops on door to door thumpers. Thumping is considered soliciting in my condo complex. I've been in a running battle with a thumper preacher over that policy for months. 2 weeks ago he sent 3 underage girls to my door that wanted to come in and talk about Jesus. I called the cops and then had the cop that responded file a police report. Now I know who the thumper is and where his church is located. Ironically, after the police report was completed and I was talking to the cop in the parking lot, 2 mormon missionaries ride up, I tell them door to door soliciting is prohibited in the complex and that they are trespassing. They claimed they weren't soliciting, but rode away with the cop sitting there. The cop thought it was funny, wished me luck, and drove away. Thumper church is located 3 blocks away, in a hotel conference room. I'm tempted to provide an unsolicited religious experience to his flock. Thumper preacher is 5'4" and gets highly animated, loud, and in your face confrontational. I could have a lot of fun with that.
Just be glad they’re not thumper Muslims those are the ones you need to keep an eye on.
They work the neighborhoods 9000 miles west of me. Same radical religious agenda. Thumpers will attempt to create a xtian caliphate as soon as the majority learn how to spell it correctly.
I've never seen a door-to-door Muslims trying to convert me. I might invite them in for tea and baklava because it could be a chance to exercise my pitiful knowledge of the Arabic language.
I've never seen a thumper Muslim .. or Jew, for that matter, but thanks for showing your bigotry.
It's only the Christian fundies who come to my door trying to peddle their ignorance and brainwashing, claiming that there's an evil bogeyman who will torture me for eternity if I don't join their church, and that I can murder and steal to my heart's content if I get born again (people who can't be moral without threats really bother me). Of course, the next Christian sect who comes to my door claims the last Christian sect is evil and blasphemous ... can't they all get their shit together before they start trying to sell it to me? They can't even agree on what their god is like, what it thinks, what it wants .. but they want me to believe that they, as false prophets, somehow have the one factual track to their god? Talk about blasphemy.
I don't hate them, either. I just don't like them very much
Most won't but then again neither will most Christians. But if you really believe some in the Muslim faith don't want to convert you, then you haven't been paying very good attention to the world lately.
I've had 2 different groups of folks show up on my porch in 2 months. I have a very long driveway, so I give them credit for attempting that. But once they see the overflowing ashtrays and beer bottles on the table on the porch, you would think, we better get out of here. And there's a Virgin Mary and St Francis statues in the flower beds. They should be thinkng...hard drinking Catholics we should skedaddle, but no.
So the last group that pestered me, I told them to "bug off". I think they heard "fuck off". I hope so.
You mistake humor for anger. Lighten up.
When I feel I need advice from you, I will ask you for it.
Sure don't look that will be today, and tomorrow doesn't look too good either.
Why do you seed stuff like this if not to encourage religious debate?
Panspermia is not a religion, it is an hypothesis. The difference between a religion and an hypothesis is profound. Further, Panspermia is highly probable based on actual evidence. The author apparently has done no research on this hypothesis.
The claim of fact that God sent an hypostasis (read: Himself) to Earth to be tortured and murdered by His own creations so that He -by sacrificing Himself- could then forgive them and grant them everlasting life is not only extraordinary , but it does not even make logical sense. To spell it out: God (as defined by the Bible) is omnipotent and could thus forgive without engaging in a self-sacrificial prelude.
That's just it, TiG, he doesn't want to encourage religious debate. This seed is aimed at those of us who won't be going to church on Easter and will be having fun instead. This seed is designed to stir up animosity and get people slap fighting.
I think Jesus would be horrified at the attempt to start fights on the day Jesus himself was tortured and executed.
On behalf of a grateful NT Nation, the Academy of Rationality is proud to present you with it's highest accolade: The Medal of Understatement:
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This explains a lot.....Zombie Jesus must have eaten the brains of all the Christians.
Where exactly did your god come from?
He always was, is, and always will be.
everything has origin, your God included, correct ?
That is pure conjecture and, more importantly, makes no sense (is illogical).
If the most complex possible entity (God) does not require a creator, then why do less complex things (e.g. the known universe) require a creator? (Answer: logically we have a contradiction.) Note, there are no facts to be presented because nobody could possibly know the origin of God. All we have to work with is logic and the logic presented is a contradiction. (That means it is flawed.)
I'd attempt to write that claim out as a formal logical structure but your version is easier to understand for 90% of the population.
By being unfalsifiable.
... and contradictory
{complexity requires a creator} AND [ NOT {complexity requires a creator} ]
Resolution:
{complexity requires a creator} -- an unfalsifiable, unevidenced claim
Toss it out and we are left with what we actually know about a first-cause creator: nothing.
So, if you can believe that your god always was, always is, and always will be - yet you claim that matter cannot have always existed - do you not even see the hypocrisy in your statement?
You said everything had to have a creator, so that would include your god. If you can sit there and claim your god came from nothing, while claiming that everything has to come from something, you're just making yourself look ridiculous.
If your god could have always existed, so could matter. Try a decent argument next time.
... or below that ... to energy. Or below that ... to the quintessential substance of existence (whatever that might be).
It is easy to come to the conclusion that existence itself IS (existence ' exists ') and that existence is necessarily eternal. If one can then reason that everything that exists is OF existence one has an abstract but evidence-based hypothesis for how things come to be.
For me, it's a little hard to wrap my mind around existence having always existed. Which is why I find it so laughable that those who deny that possibility are so certain to say that their god always existed. If one thing can have always existed, as they claim their god has done, then it should be an easy transition to accept that matter has always existed.
Here is one way to look at it. Something cannot come from nothing. By definition of the literal nothing. It then immediately follows that existence did not come from nothing. This means existence necessarily is eternal. There is no other option.
To wit, the quintessential substance of existence (whatever that is) has always been.
That's nice. Prove it!
HA continues his self-pity jihad. He wants to label his critics as "anti-Christian" when the truth is they're anti-hypocrite. Christianity isn't the target of the ridicule. Christianity if practiced as taught by its founder is admirable. Trouble is HA and the like who predominate on discussion boards like this, don't even come close. If I believed in god, I'd say it weeps every time of HA'S type claims to be a believer.
Spot on. IF he was truly the devout, pious Christian he and others here profess to be, they would be out doing the work of their faith, not here attacking those of other beliefs and denigrating those who do not agree in lock step with them. But, it is easier to talk the talk than it is to walk the walk.
If I also remember another part of the Bible, it says, "Judge not, lest ye be judged". However, following that part of the book they profess to adhere to seems to be more of the saying, "Do as I say, not as I do" sort of thing. Then they wonder why others do not capitulate to their beliefs.
They seem to conveniently ignore that other thing that their Bible taught about tolerance and acceptance of others. And that Christianity is not the only way to believe in the Creator, as the rest of the world well knows.
I find it amazing that non believers know exactly how a Christian should act, walk, and talk. I wonder how they know this. Was it introduced to them at home at an early age? That's how they claim Christians are indoctrinated. And, then, there are those who say......yes, you are right and they should, also, act like this. Perplexing!
Most non-believers in the US were raised in a Christian home or had it introduced to them by friends or at school. I may be an avowed secular humanist but I was raised in a very conservative Catholic home and I studied theology as part of my college minor. It is a fact that most atheists are better educated in religion than the believers. Being an atheist is the process of studying religion and then coming to the conclusion that it is a very ancient and illogical myth. People just don't wake up from a bad hangover at a Baptist wedding and claim to be an atheist.
We can (and have) read the Gospels. Haven't you?
Have you put anything you read into practice?
I do not need to believe in a god or a savior to live a moral life. Religious belief is more about the government keeping control of the people than it is about teaching them to live a moral life.
Organized religion has always been about controlling the people more than saving their souls. Inflicting fear in them of everlasting damnation as a tool to control them is a large part of their agenda.
The Creator I believe in is kind, loving and forgiving toward His children, and does not need to resort to fear mongering. He understands that mere mortals are fallible, as they are not created nor intended to be perfect. It is what is in our own hearts that matters most to Him, and how we live our lives here on earth and treat our Brothers and Sisters of all walks of live with tolerance and understanding that matters to Him.
There are many ways to prove our worth as a human being than simply belonging to some organized religious belief. Nor does simply belonging to some organized religious belief alone does not prove our worth as a human being.
Just my own belief and opinion.
Your statement isn't close to being true,
You are ignoring the obvious that majority of the current atheists were raised with some religious belief at home, by one or more parents. I am not surprised that some people who were raised without religion have now joined a religion. Nobody would expect otherwise.
Well, I don't ask my neighbors to murder my son if he's disobedient, and if I had a daughter who was raped, I'd never sell her to her rapist, as commanded by the bible. I definitely don't want to put everything I read in the bible into practice.
But yep, if Jesus existed, he wanted us to be good to our fellow humans, and he absolutely spoke out against false prophets who claimed they knew what God thinks and wants, and who use their religion to promote hatred and to think they're better than everyone else. So I'd say I'm probably more "Christian" than most fundies. I'm certainly more moral, since I am able to behave decently without threats of eternal punishment or promises of eternal rewards - unlike the fundies who claim that without belief in their god, people can't be moral. I think it's a shame they can't behave decently without a crutch, but hey, that's their problem. According to the bible, Jesus won't know them after they die.
Okay, but did you release your slaves?
My buddy Jesus didn't require that, he merely said that you shouldn't beat your slaves so hard that they die the same day. It's OK if they die the next day.
Now Skrekk, be fair.
That was Yahweh (the Father hypostasis) who made that rule, not Jesus. And Yahweh said that it is okay to beat your slaves to death as long as they do not die within a couple of days.
Oddly, Jesus did not weigh in on slavery. He chose to not include guidance on one of the most immoral acts of humanity in his moral teachings. We can only presume that Jesus thought the 2 day grace period well reflected objective morality.
Indirectly he did by telling a number of parables about slaves......but then never saying anything like "slavery is a bad thing, so don't beat slaves or own slaves."
Is that not worse? He acknowledges slavery (the subject is on the table) yet does not go to the next step and provide objective moral guidance by denouncing it.
Exactly right.
I was raised as more of a "tribal" Catholic then anything else. In my family you were considered to have been born a Catholic, like people who were Jewish were considered to have been born Jewish. It wasn't so much how much you went to Mass or learned your Catechism, being a Catholic was just something you were. My grandparents were much more of the practicing Catholics then my divorced parents, though both of my parents became very devout in their later years, so when people asked me what religion I was, such as when I joined the Air Force to have it imprinted on my dog tags, it was to me much more a question of asking what race I was, so I said Roman Catholic.
The odd thing is that when I was in my late teens I seriously considered the Priesthood and honestly felt I had the calling. I had read the Catholic Bible from cover to cover and was being guided by a parish Priest and even had visited a seminary near Niagara Falls. Yet I just could not reconcile what I had read and was expected to teach others with the real world that I knew. It just did not fit. I looked strongly at the Jesuits who seemed much more of an intellectual order and much more free thinking, but even there there were restrictions that I didn't think I could handle. Also there was the whole being a member of the community that many people would look up you as a Parish Priest. Calling or not I just didn't feel that I was worthy of that status. At that point in my life Priests practically walked on water and I could not see myself in charge of a Parish being looked up to as a leader with the responsibility of people thinking I was holding their souls in my hands. I guess I chickened out. Surprisingly enough, even though I am now an atheist, I think I would have made a very good Jesuit Priest for the time I was still a believer.
Though I am absolutely certain I would have become an atheist as I am now no matter what.
I have cats. I'm the slave.
"I'm the slave"
I've just been freed....I think a coyote or a great horned owl ate the cat.
Simple common sense. Besides, many Christians also like to talk about how they should act, walk, talk, ect..
Many atheists started out as theists.
A person cannot make an intelligent and defensible statement that there is no god if you haven't put some research into the subject. Saying that God doesn't exist without knowledge of the subject is just as emotional as saying that God does exist because of a religious belief.
The more you learn about religion the more obvious that it is a myth.
With the exception of John (who was merely tortured and exiled) the apostles of Jesus lived in poverty and were murdered for sharing their beliefs. They sure didn't do much in the way of controlling anyone - nor did they have any hope of doing so.
Why are you ignoring the fact that Raven said organized religion? The original 12 disciples were not yet an organized religion.
Indeed. And as TiG has often pointed out, making claims of absolute certainty either way is logically indefensible.
The problem being that there is no evidence of his life or death other than the first council of Nicea hundreds of years later.
Sounds like it is a problem for you.
Did you just admit that Christianity is a pure myth with nothing factual to support it?
Please post where you read anywhere that I posted such nonsense---if you CAN, of course!
SMH and LMAO!
Follow the logical conclusion of your reply to CJcold's previous statement. You might know it better as reading between the lines.
So as usual, you stated something you simply can't prove. What a waste.
Please stop responding to me-Skirting CoC {SP}
Claiming that I am not honest is a personal attack.
Oh come on. That is just not true and you know it. Or at least I hope you know it.
What specifically is not true about his statement?
It’s not true as we and he knows it.
According to your faith. But not necessarily historically accurate. There doesn't seem to be any first hand accounts of Jesus
So you don't know about the divination?
And it should be located on the same shelf other myths that are also tied to people and places that really existed.
I’d like to thank all the believers for their participation on the seed and to point out to those who don’t how they proved the seed and the headline correct. Anyway we’re at over 500 posts and I have other seeds to moderate so this one is now locked.
I am relocking this article. It is no longer relevant and no longer attended to.