The Slap (NT Meta)
Last night I had a huge headache from the days turmoil and took the evening off to watch my TV shows. I have been following this mini-series called The Slap. It's the story of one family and their friends and the events that happen at a birthday party. We bear witness to the pivotal moment, when a bratty little boy is slapped inappropriately by an unrelated family friend and the progression of this singular act is told each week, as perceived by each member who witnessed it. 
I have found the show a very interesting exercise in its analysis of human nature and perception. But last night as I watched the show, I didnt realize the parallels it would have until I went to close NT down for the evening before going to bed, and found a meta article that left me feeling bewildered. After reading the article and the comments made by the author and the members, I felt as if a massive slap was laid on the site, and although each member of NT had their own perception of recent events on the site, the perspectives were just as complex and diverse as the characters on the show.
I guess my role here is the sites matriarch. The person that people go to for advice, complaints, anger, ideas. I am also the person who tries to mitigate the various slaps and the damage they cause on the site. But just like the family matriarch on the show, I can only offer advice, listen and sooth. I cant make anyone do anything they dont want to do that is outside the scope of the CoC. And just like the adult children and friends in the show, the members will do as they please, despite any pleas from me to the contrary.
But what I can tell you about the various slaps that go on, is that they happen on both sides of the political spectrum. I know since they are told to me in confidence daily. So I am well aware that the slapping goes both ways. People are slapped in so many ways, and each slap actually feeds the next one. What are these slaps? Members feel slapped when they see an inflammatory headline. When theres no real discussion on an article, but rather comments that derail. When they get one line snarky remarks that do nothing but add rancor. When they receive personal insults and innuendo from another member. These are just a few ways that members are slapped. And with each slap there is fallout. Some slap back in kind, but others will take to non-participation, since lets face it, no one likes to be slapped. Eventually things begin to unravel, and that is where we are at. We are a family on the brink of not talking to one another. So I guess the question is, does only the matriarch care about the family, or do the adult children care about it, too? Do they not think about how to make their family, NT a better place or are the willing to tear it apart over their petty differences? I cant answer that.
At the end of the day, left or right, we must be able to air our differences and work together if we really want to keep the site together. To all the naysayers I say, if you are not willing to fix the problem, then you are the problem. To those of you who just watch, I understand why. To those who are willing to make a change in the interaction here on the site, I know you care about NT.
Our family is years in the making, and just like any family, we are always going to have our differences. This is normal. But slapping each other never ends well. The outcome is usually people deciding it isnt worth it. I can try the my hardest as the matriarch to keep us together, but we are all adults here and people must understand that they alone are responsible for their own actions and not blame the other person. So look inward and ask yourself, who have I slapped? That would be a good start.
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Jim,
Gotta disagree. If someone is talking to you in an insulting manner, it should be reported. If you don't like their POV, you have the option of debating it with them or moving on. We chose our actions... and those who post stuff that is offensive to us, it is fine to tell them that. But slapping them only makes NT feel like a combat zone. Even I find it mind numbing and it wasn't always this way. We can all do better.
Very well put Enoch!
At one time, I was studying to be an administrator. We were given the book "How to make friends and influence people". I have to say that the book might be as old as the hills but when it comes to human nature, we haven't changed a bit. It has been a guide for me most of my adult life.
Max,
I do recognize that there are people here who follow the "Do as I say not as I do" attitude and yes they do complain to me, which does drive me crazy. I don't deny it. But also our words that we chose, well.. you know. They do amp up situations.
LMAO!!
Me too!
A hypocrite.
I was using racist as one example of an accusation , one of the more commonly used ones . But the principal could be applied to just about any accusation . As far as that previous comment about "another political website " , which one ? Who's comment ?
Here are the rules to political website that some here attend:
I think it is a reality check.
How do you react when someone calls you out on your own ignorance ? Not well in my experience .
OK, that is one way... But still report it instead of leaving the dead avatars around!
Perrie
Well thought out and statedand the analogy to "The Slap" was masterful
It is highly unlikely that more rules is the answer to the never ending insult exchange masquerading as discussion and debate on the front page, but as you suggest treating each other with respect while aggressively disagreeing with the other's viewpoint on an issue will clear the miasma currently being endured.
As you know I have become very selective in my participation, not because I am suddenly without opinions or ideas, but rather because the struggle became more tiresome than rewarding.
We, the members, can make this site work as you and others envisioned it in the beginning (and many of us still envision as possible) but you cannot do it alone - - -
We have seen a number of meta articles about this and similar topics and always there seems to be a coming together of what everyone is going to do and changes that are going to be made in how we act and then the article is forgotten and everyone returns to their old ways.
Hopefully it will be different this time.
Thanks you for taking to time to post this article, field the comments and mostly for caring about "our" site, where we can speak our mind, but where we could also mind our manners a little better.
Thanks again.
I'll be honest, Perrie. I'm a fighter. I love a great discussion, but if it turns into a fight, I rarely get it worse than I give. This ISN'T a family for me, with the exception of my one private group. I don't like a lot of the people here. That's not an attack, it's simply fact. In any group, 70+% will not be people with whomI care to interact.. IT's that simple.
I respect what you do here. But it's impossible to do it correctly AND make everyone happy. You have my sympathies.
Although I joined Newstalkers a while ago, I just recently began posting articles here and joining in the discussion. I post on several other sites and Newstalkers is by far the most congenial and the best moderated site. I think that is because of the strong moderation and I would encourage you to continue to do so. I certainly appreciate it.
Here is a comment about trolls that I put in one of my articles .The last half of the article is an article about the behavior of trolls and how to deal with them:
I post a lot of one liners because I don't think it always takes lots of words to make a point. Some of them are snarky responses to inane comments or stupid seed/article titles. I loose patience with seeded articles that are glaringly inaccurate and very easily disproved. If a member just seeds article willy nilly with no thought to accuracy it really pisses me off.
I'm trying to be nice.
Indeed!
But I'm positively afraid of heights!!!!!
First of all Raven, I am moderating this article, so there will be no personal attacks.
ATTACK! ATTACK! ATTACK!
If those rules were enforced here, we'd have a membership of 10...
Much less then that. It's not possible to have non-stilted conversation without violating at least some of those rules!
Taken our rules....and what, the rest of the comment is missing.
This list of things we can NOT say is too long and is WAAAAAY to restrictive!
Are we all supposed to light some incense and start singing kumbaya yet!!
I prefer "All we are saying...... is Give piece of ass..... er, give PEACE a CHANCE"
I am a mouthy, smart-assed, highly opinionated mother fucker and will continue to be just the way I am and have been for the past years. I will not and am not ever going to change from how I always have been!
Please note the lack of a smiley face.
Why is it ignorance? How do you know what the other guy is thinking? Don't you think a line of questioning might be valuable instead of jumping to conclusions?
Me too! Hi, you mouthy, smart-assed,opinionated motherfucker! Welcome to the club!
Robert,
I think that there has been a level of comfort that people got used to when it came to their comments. I think that the only way to handle it might just be the way I am handling it on this article, by deleting the comments in their entirety. If people don't want to do that, but if people don't fall in line, I will.
(Joining the conversation after seven pages of Replies.)
The nitty-gritty is
To reformulate a bit: Are members more concerned about the health of the site or about "winning"?
Lots of people have tempers -- I certainly do. So escalation comes quickly. If someone lights me up, there's no chance I won't react, probably even more strongly. The only way to avoid this is... to not start. We have quite a few members who specialize in drive-by trolling. (missing something? Read my first comment) It's tiresome. Calling in a mod, every time it happens? Seriously? Have we nothing better to do?
Carpet-bombing the Front Page is another form of putting one's own ego above the health of the site. (Unless it's paid work...)
Worthwhile conversation exists only when differing ideas are confronted, POLITELY. It's rare, and getting rarer.
I hope were not the only bastards who are in it!
Well Neale,
I am not asking you to like everyone. I am asking that you would behave as you would with any job you have. You might not like them either... but you have to be civil. Otherwise, I am willing to take this hardcore with the deletions.
In partial answer. I am NOT an adult. I am a man.
Adult man is an oxymoron.
Well, I'm not a bastard (Mom and Pop were married for 11 months before I came out) but there are at least a few of us in here!
I agree with Bruce.
OMG! Did I just say that I agree with Bruce?
The hour is indeed grave...
J.C.,
First thank you for your kind words. I have tried to make this as user friendly as possible. So have the mods here, too!
I think you summed it up well about trolls. We only let them be trolls by feeding them. It something that we all know, but somehow, keep letting it get the better of us. Again, self control is necessary. Take a step back and breath.
I'm a fighter. I love a great discussion, but if it turns into a fight, I rarely get it worse than I give. This ISN'T a family for me, with the exception of my one private group. I don't like a lot of the people here.
And I only like slightly more people.
When Mama Ain't Happy....
Rest assured, my Dear, I follow your rules- homie don't mess wit' no redheaded honey!!
Pat,
Honestly, I have not seen anything from you that I find offensive.
The irony here is that I have seen far worse and they are not saying a word. Total lack of introspection about who they are.
That list is to another politics site. It is not ours.
Randy, the answer to that (again) was no. But civility yes.
Neale
Yuck, Yuck.
I'm not really a bastard either, but I am a son of a bitch. My mother told me.
Because Annette might read this, I won't take it any farther...........
Then please note, if you are aiming your smart ass at some member and it is a known CoC violation it will be gone.
Notice the lack of a smiley face.
Don't worry, I won't push you over
If I go over the edge, I'll drag ALL Y'ALL over with me! (I'll need the padding when we hit bottom!)
You know there is an expression about God.
He hears all prayers but sometimes the answer is no.
There is no god..
I mostly aim it at public figures, but some of these public figures are members of one or more different ethnic groups. I will not refrain from calling one or more of these public figures JUST about anything I want to. HOWEVER it will always be because that's what I think THEY are, not the group they are from, though some from those groups will accuse me of it anyway and I don't give a fuck if they do.
If you want an example I will give it in private.
I'm happy you're sticking it out here on NT, Raven Wing, because it would be a great loss to this site if we could no longer see your magnificent creative images.
I moved 2000 miles to get away from my family...and most of them are glad for it...
OK back again.
I don't like my brother - but I love him to death.
I love most of my sisters, but I don't like most of them worth a damn.
With some people and there are a few here, ignoring them is the worst thing to do. It just encourages them to see how close to breaking the rules they can get...and that's my territory.
People come here for all the different reasons you can think of, but sometimes I come here just to SCREAM!!!!!! It's my therapy and I don't want to piss off the fine people who paid good money for the houses surrounding mine.
It would be easier to practicecommon sense etiquette if people would stop pissing me off every day hour minute 30 seconds.
(insert angel emoticon here)
Ah Bob, i knew you would present an interesting comment.
Well, yes and no. Obviously the health of the site is important to most of the members ( including me), since without a site how can we discuss? Which leads me to the second part, the concept of "Winning". I think that is a bit problematic for me. I do realize that some of us come here to "win". But there is a whole different group that comes here to learn. I know I have. So I don't see those things as being necessarily related... other than to win, you still need a site.
And may I point out that there are many ways to win. Keeping your integrity is one. Your ethics another. Saving face another. Winning is different things to different people.
Tempers... yes.. people have tempers. I'll let you in with a dirty secret of mine. I have a terrible temper once I lose it. It just takes a long time to do that. I guess if you feel your temper rising, walk away and take a deep breath. If you have a drive by troll, don't get involved. We will take care of it.
Carpet bombing the front page has been dealt with to those that do it.
As for being polite... how are you in the real world? Try that.
With rules like those, Shakespeare would rise out of his grave and say again: "The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers."
I totally agree. And thanks Raven.
Gene,
Everyday we get reports of attacks that turn out to be nothing more than "I don't like that guy" kind of stuff. That is why the answer is no.
LMAO!
You're a pisser!
Aww.. that's sweet Buzz.
Life has gotten in the way, lately... I promise to moderate more!
I love you, Enoch! Sure wish you could come home to my mother's house with me, and soothe me with your gentle words!
Because all seasons are represented there-- all the seasons of life.
My mom (during an argument about me dropping out of high school) called me a son of a bitch and I said then you know what that makes you and she got all 4'10" (I was about 5'9" back then) of herself up in my face and said "And don't you forget it!". My mom is one of the great broads (and that's a compliment) of all time.
I'll jopin y'all. Im a #1 asshole amd all those other words y'all used
Welcome as far as I'm concerned, but I have to give you a heads up that, while I am a vet, I'm ex-Air Force. It's been my experience that some Marines don't consider us to be real military.
I get that Marsha. Life is something none of us have control of. But any little bit of help is appreciated.
I read "The Primal Scream"... I guess it works for some.
Oh brother... boy talk.
Says she who always pulls away the football!
I don't always hit what I'm aiming at though, so be warned! At my age it get's harder and harder to lift my leg that high!
At that point all she can do is to notify the next of kin.
A self-assessment, or were you pointing a finger in someone else's direction?
Whose side are you on?
Why yours of course sweetie. I understand your position. And, I wholeheartedly agree with it.
I AM ON THE SIDE OF NEWSTALKERS!
Just in case anyone didn't understand that.
Those who want it to be a good place are willing to make it work, those who aren't will whine and cry till they get tired and leave, it is a CHOICE. But all it takes is a commitment to not play the game anymore.
Anyone who makes said commitment is welcome to contribute to a great place and a great group of personages.
Those to choose not to, well, they are welcome also, but expect the consequences of your free choice. what's been built here is seldom seen on the internet without such rules as Perrie posted above. This site is a testament that we as adults, do not need to be controlled by such draconian rules. By not acting like adults we prove that we do need such rules.
The choice is an individual one.
Choose wisely...
Love ya girl, keep going, what you've built can only be destroyed if we collectively as a group allow it.
and it seems like the group is saying that we aren't going to allow it.
Thank God...
NWM...
We agree, NWM, once again.
We must all accept the responsibilities of our actions-- and one of the consequences of that action is that we can all work together to build the site, or continue to tear it down. I'm all for building, personally.
None of the above Sister. My funny bone was acting up. Feeling paranoid?
Pfffttttt. Never. Unlessyou are talking about my preoccupation with the little guy that is alwaysfollowing me or spying on me in the shower or listening to my phone calls or hiding in that one part of the frozen food aisle where the light never works or breaking into the dry cleaners at night to press the perfect creases out of my silk blend capris or hiding in the gardening shed and laughing out loudwhen it takes me 15 minutes to start the lawn mower or is waiting to spring out of any body of water deeper than 3 inches or is constantly moving things from where I put them including but not limited to keys purse car bills important correspondence the last two cookies in the pantry my list of on-line passwords or...
I'm sorry...what was the question?
It's a good thing to feel a little ''paranoid'', it's makes for an interesting group of characters that follow you around.
Well that sounds pretty good Sister. I have some of those same afflictions.......
Perrie
Sounds very reasonable to me
But it's just the onetiny littledude. The others are just disembodied voices thatmake medo things...but in a Flip Wilson as Geraldine Jones, the-devil-made-me-do-it, kind of way.
I love Geraldine.
I had forgotten how surprisingly attractive Geraldine was.
Sammy Davis Jr. brings back fond memories, as well.
Yes. This is one of the things that is needed. Authors must have control of their articles. Red Rules are a poor stopgap, because they still require the intervention of a Mod.
Equally necessary is FP cleanup. Good articles get lost amid the red meat, and fall off too quickly. Meanwhile, it is childishly easy to keep the red meat up. One member and the author can maintain an article indefinitely, playing ping-pong. The only way I can see to lessen this problem is to limit each member's number of FP articles -- no new posting as long as there's already one there. A troll-pair could maintain two articles (one each), but no more.
An FP limit would encourage the members who are more and more discouraged when they look at the "quality" of the FP nowadays.
I doubt the FP limit will be very popular (I would be okay with it) but your right on target about the qualityof FP content of late
Authors must have control of their articles.
In principal I agree with you on this, but I am not sure that it would be used wisely and fairly by all authors or if it would be used to eliminate opposing views. Is Perrie talking about authors deleting comments or moderators>
Thanks NWM and Dowser. It's good to know that you are on board.
Total paranoia is total awareness.
Thank goodness. I would hate to becuckoo all by myself.
Gene,
Sometimes a comment is easy to see as offensive and it is removed. Other times it is more ambiguous, and I think that is where you and I are miss communicating. If we remove that kind of a post and it wasn't meant as an insult, than the other party is ticked off, and for the record, this has happened. We try hard to be fair to everyone, but that doesn't mean everyone will be happy.
A quote from that great American, Foghorn Leghorn.
''If your not a little bit crazy, you'll go completely insane''
I doubt it, too. I author a lot, and this would probably limit my articles. But the site's health is more important. Carpet-bombing and ping-pong are wrecking the FP.
I agree that that is a risk. But the answer is simple: if you don't like the way an author runs their articles, don't go there. There are several members whose articles I never bother to visit, because I know how the "conversation" will go down, and I'm not interested.
If an authors wants visitors, then they must manage their articles well.
(I hope that author-moderation will be available in the new platform Perrie is preparing.)
Please supply a link. I've been purple penning all morning, (except when I took a nap).
Here is the problem with authors deleting.
First, this system doesn't allow it. It does on the blogs.
Second, if the system allowed it, removed comments would be gone forever. The mods are the people who log the comments right now.
The new platform will have different features, and I have a dedicated server, which I am hoping I can configure to have this as an option, if the group so votes on it.
As for the front page, I do have these present other options;Newest articles, Most Popular, featured (which means I pick them and I am not fond of that idea). We could try any of these.
jwc,
I would like to know where that is. I am wasting no time in taking care of this business.
Took a nap?!?!?!
How dare you?
I see no problem with this, since we are assuming author-moderation. The only reason to conserve deletion is for an ulterior review process, which is illogical with author-moderation.
I hope you will think about the long-term consequences of FP rules. It seems obvious that the current rules are childishly easy to subvert, for any (even very small) group that wants to "occupy" the FP. I think we see it happening. And it isn't healthy for the site, in the long run.
Perrie
Would it be possible that articles would stay on the front page for a set period (new articles)after being posted (unless naturally falling off due to lack of participation) and then would be available in the sub-forums (N&P, H, S & T etc) unless they met the criteria to be among "most popular" or "featured"
Robert,
I have no idea of what you are talking about. Could you be less cryptic?
Well yes and no. On NV the authors could self delete a comment, but it could also be abused. That is when they could recover comments. I had this happen to me, where everyone of my comments were deleted, just because it was me, and I had an outing with the authors friend.
I agree. Ideas? And as I said, I could just have only the newest article on there... but then articles could fall off the board very quickly.
On this system, there is no way to set how long an article would stay up if it was "newest articles". Each new article would push the others further down the line and eventually off the board. This would happen at different rates due to how busy the board was. They would go into the sub forums, which would be found on the tabs at the top of the page. I am not sure what "most popular" does, since I have never tried it. We could give it a go.
What about decreasing the limit on the number of articles one author can post per day to 3? If we check the number of "bumps", limit that to 1 bump, and there is a limit to 3 articles, maybe that would help...
I've been going with one comment when posted and one comment to bump. But I haven't deleted any articles.
We tried another system, once, and no one commented because they were mad about it...
How 'bout this actual offense verbatim
Someone left that yesterday as a "rebuttal" to another member's comment.
Any misconception as to whether or not it could be construed as "offensive"?
What I was suggesting is that unless the article is selected as featured or earns the most popular level it would drop off the front page after a set period of time and be available only in the sub-forums
It's an idea Dowser. But it would put a lot of stress on the mods to keep track of the bumping.. which is a concern.
Not so much, Robert.
Yeah, that is what I thought you would say. Still, it will not prevent the outcome.
The system will allow for only one choice, so I can't feature on the front page and have most popular. And who would pick what would be featured? It's a bit of a problem.
Robert,
You are being purposely obtuse. If you don't like the answer that a person gave you then press on with the questioning." Your full of shit" is a CoC violation and shuts down any further discussion, which is the issue here. You are free not to like Mac's comment, but you are not free to insult.
This is the essence of the issue those who cannot deal with dissenting opinions project their character flaw on those who make viable arguments they cannot factually rebut and hurl personal insults instead.
In fact, the "full of shit comment" was made as the "third-man-in," it involved a conversation between two other members.
A disdain for truth that countermands incorrect, intentional misrepresentations or outright liesiswhat often gets posted, that in the form of insults. The most egregious and most frequent offender among us, when called out, is always good for one more insult thus perpetuating the very "Guru Syndrome," "Final Authority," and last word crap to which he feigns righteous indignation.
His net effect is two-fold egging on others like him and driving those who are not like him from good debate.
Whatever the basis of his malcontent "personality," manifesting it on NT is toxic.
When one plays a "man" in cyberspace, any threat to his macho-bravado brings out his adolescent tendencies and highlights his arrested emotional development.
Equating obnoxious behavior with maturity, that by referencing as "babies,"those with enough intelligence to call you out for making NT an unpleasant venue makes it even more unpleasant.
Confrontation from the shadows tough guy.
Well It Looks Like Right Now Would Be A Good Time For An Intermission
Robert, this is a "Social News Site"-- meaning that some social conventions of decent behavior and conversation should be observed by the members.
Telling someone they are full of shit is not a way to conduct oneself. I would refute your statement by asking, "Can you prove that you are not?" In my view, it is the pot calling the kettle black.
When you exert yourself, you offer insightful and very intelligent comments. Posting an insult is denigrating yourself and your own intelligence, which I know is real.
If one desires and promotes nothing but snark, I'm sure there are lots of places to find it, even here-- what about in Heated Discussions?
I Never said I had a solution only restating the problem
Sorry about that
Let me put it this way and be very clear about it. The snark, when directed personally, will be deleted. End of story.
"Can you refute "you are, in fact, full of shit?""...this just begs for a reply....
with a healthy dose of Exlax yes, I can refute the fact that I am full of shit....
Robert,
I am trying to make NT user friendly. And I would have loved to see you walk over to your boss and tell them they were full of shit. I just don't see that happening, unless your boss was a boob.
And while we are making personal observations, how about the considering that you never, ever conceded a point. Is that not being a guru?
LOL!
LMAO!!! You read my mind!
LMAO...You two...
I am supposed to be serious here. How can I be when I am laugh this hard.
Robert, could I moderate this article, I would delete your first sentence. There is no need for this.
I used to make 6 figures with an indoor parking space plus other perks to copy and paste paper trails to be placed on-the-record where outcomes had real-life significance
and the most gratifying perk of all was to smack the shit out of tough-talkers like yourself, that in a formal venue where one peep uttered in your style would result in a formal reprimand, possible job termination and A LOST CASE.
And my counterpart "opponent" on the other side of the table and myself, once the issue-at-hand was decided one-way-or-the-other, would often shake hands and show mutual respect.
Wanting an end to name-calling, personal insults and complaints about posting facts that validate positions isn't asking for "babysitting," it's requesting the adolescent-like "adults" in the room cease making the room uninhabitable.
You can have the last word; I trust it will reflect on you as do most of your others.
Let's try this again... and this time with some honesty. Tell me you would walk over to your boss and tell him He was "full of shit".
But you know the answer to this question... you just don't like the question.
This has nothing to do with being a babysitter. It has to do with being a civil human being. Are you saying that you have no capacity to be civil or just that you pick and chose when to do it? If so, please pick here to use it.
I did Dowser.
Robert Said,
You are in fact absolutely incorrect on this one. EVERY website that offers serious commentary and discussion has it's set of rules. after 20+ years of doing this I have a smidgen of experience with this. The Best sites are the ones that have a strict set of rules with absolute enforcement. As Perrie pointed out earlier in the thread.
Understand this, EVERY SITE WORTH A DAMN HAS THESE BEHAVIOR ABSOLUTES AS THEIR FOUNDATION.
Your depiction above shows that you really aren't on any good, well run sites and never have been. Otherwise you would understand this and wouldn't make such a whiny crybaby complaint.
Both sides have their members that have behavioral problems. What Perrie is saying is she has had enough, you either play like adults, or you will be moderated. And those that don't like it know what their choice is.
The ideal is to bring forth good involved conversation and content, to leave behind the sniveling tripe that drives people away.
Some people can handle the challenge, others cannot.
Time to separate the adults from the children, and it's about damn time, IMHO.
This site is unique, it proves the naysayers wrong, that we as people CAN be civil online without draconian rules and regulations. But there are those that wish to prove otherwise. those that can't handle it I guess can find an appropriate forum that will accept their brand of social shiving.
But to remain viable here, your going to need to scabbard your shivs & swords, cap your lances, and wet down your magazines.
The war is over.
Thanks. I knew you were on top of things!
Much better than I, for sure!
Go ahead and laugh girl, you need it.
Besides we got your back...
Yep!
Well said NWM!
This isn't about coddling, it is about following rules. In real life, we have social norms. Those are our rules by which we interact in the world.
But if you want to talk about Bullshit... leaving one line snipes is the ultimate derail... to what you by your judgment is blather. You don't like the blather, counter it with some meaningful content, or leave it alone.
Those are the rules in this social construct.
And if you want to see how long you would last, sign up for debate politics...
You have no idea how good you have it here.
Some are more full of shit than others. Constipation causes ''brain farts'', since some seem to have their brains located in their ass....I've seen quite a few of those ''brain farts'' on this article.
Then why do it? Why bother insulting someone that you think of as an idiot?
Hey.. my brain farts all day....
"I find it interesting that some of the most prolific "slappers" on NT are MIA in this article. I can only feel they don't think it applies in any way to them, or have no interest in trying to build a better site for everyone."
Yeah I noticed that, too Raven.
Possibly, but you have periods of ''non-farting'', thus the brain is engaged.
Others, not so much, it's like being stuck on stupid, or the endless fart for many.
Robert,
I know that you don't like moderation, but sadly it has led to people who don't want to participate. The freestyle that you refer, still has its boundaries which have been clearly spelled out a long time ago.
If this had been NV you would have been long gone... as demonstrated to you by Newsvine, so please don't make any comparisons.
The people who you call babies and whiners would shock you. Some you might even call compatriots. The issue has become a global one, whether you like it or not. And since you are not receiving the emails and I am... I have more judgment on what is going on here.
So this is not up for discussion. The CoC has been here since the first one was voted on and it will be enforced.
So either get with the program or find a venue that will put up with snarky one liners.
Feronia,
While I agree with you on a philosophical level, it becomes hard to have a serious discussion if everytime you post a comment, someone comes on and says, "You're an Idiot". Not only does it disturb the discussion, adds no content, and actually often deflects when a point is trying to be made, it becomes just tiresome. It's like the kid in high school, who punches you in the shoulder every time you go to the locker... it says a lot about them, but it ruins your experience of school. And while you could punch back with a brawl breaking out, more often than not, you will end up in the Principal's office...
LOL!
Gene,
I am going to give you an example of why that isn't always true.
If someone posts to you:
"I think it is f$cked up that you think that", it might be offensive to you... but it wouldn't be a CoC violation, since it is an opinion. If they say "You are f$cked up", then it is a violation. Subtle but a difference. And since we allow cursing on the site, that could happen. BTW some people find cursing offensive, but it is not a violation per se.
YIKES! Perrie,... that body doesn't have any kidneys. and without kidneys you can't filter out the shit. and if you can't filter out the shit you can't make new blood. and if you can't make new blood you can't stimulate the brain, and if you can't stimulate the brain you can't learn anything new,....
wow, some are masters of the universe and some are masters of shit, ...Me, I lucky enough to be both the Master of a Universe full of shit....
I can put up an umbrella. Yes. I do.
Article temporarily closed until I return.
Gene,
I will meet you halfway. If you give warning that you find something offensive, like using offensive language, and they do it again, I will have the comment removed. But I am also smart enough to know that when you say, "Bless you" that you are really saying "Go to hell". So don't do, what you don't like and then more than half the problems will go away.
That's because I had them for dinner with fava beans and a fine Chianti... favavavavaava...
The best I can find is to limit the number articles any one member may have on the FP at one time. It's easy to manage, and would force us to post only the best we find.
How many "active" members are we? Thirty, maybe? So a two-per-person limit would encourage those who don't post often, and discourage the carpet-bombers.
You won't catch me loling.
Bob,
On the front page we avg. about 45-50 in a week. In the groups actually a lot more, they just never come out due to the tone of the front page.
I was accused of setting policy without asking the group, so I will put this to a vote. I think you make a valid point... it's just that the group should be able to decide how many posts in a day.
How about LMAO?
You do know that I am kidding right?
If there are 45-50 active members, then perhaps the limit should be one per person.
Or try two, and see how it goes.
As for voting... It's your site, so you decide the process.
Perrie
What if a member is allowed to put up as many original articles as they wish (or 2 or 3), but is limited to 1 seed of a media article per day
It would encourage original content and likely provide a little more variety in the topics we see on the front page as well
Gene,
I am aware it is a southern tradition, since I lived in the south, hence why I know what it means, and a phrase that is meant as an insult is still an insult. And from context everyone gets it. And so it becomes an issue of skirting the CoC.
There is nothing here that has to do with minority rules. The whole point of this article is to get more civil conversation, which I believe is what you want, too.
I hate doing meta, yet sometimes it has to be done. It is a huge burden on me, since I actually take a lot of time answering everyone. I know that not all my answers will be taken well, but my job here is to make sure that I please the majority of the people.... not just the few. I didn't write the CoC. The group did. I have to write an update based on our last vote. This is how the majority of people are pleased.
Thank you for caring.
RiO,
Good idea. The only danger I can see is seeds without links. Probably not a problem.
I definitely agree that original writing should not be limited.
Perrie,
Mike is being Lucy , if you see what I mean.
Someone must act. You or me. Your choice.
Perrie,
I've said this before: Insulting a person's thinking is exactly the same as insulting the person. No one, no one ever , makes any difference between their ideas and themselves.
This way of applying the CoC is an engraved invitation to skirting. As an illustration: "Your opinion on this, Perrie, is incredibly stupid !"
Good luck, Perrie...
Absolutely!
Yes.
That figures, buried in a hole somewhere.
No kidneys = "pissed OFF"?
Very educational, Mac. Thanks.
Southern Insults 101: Things Your Mama Taught You
or they did not know about it....
We've been out target practicing and I'm about ready for another nap, too! Sorry, I'm old and need lots of naps.
I don't know but I think I need to make a general comment on what I see beginning to happen here.
The Board has two dominant posting personality sets here "A" persuasion people and "B" persuasion people.
The issue seems to center on how many posts are made of one persuasion over the other.
Right now the "A" pers are feeling dominated by the "B" pers. The discussion is slanting towards limiting content addition to the site to one or two seeds per day. the issue mentioned is one of flooding the board with "B" pers type articles to the disdain and disenfranchising of "A" pers articles.
For many years the site itself has had a policy of allowing five newly seeded articles per day, allowing for articles that were previously posted and bumped from previous days.
This worked well for many years and allowed users the freedom to post as they see fit without any undue burden or limitation and was so comfortable that was largely ignored for a long period of time. Of course there were many times where that limit was bypassed by both sides but it really wasn't an issue. (as long as the "A" pers felt that they were dominant)
Recently we have had a "B" pers sign on to the board who is a prolific poster/seeder, which caused all kinds of issues with "A" pers who disapprove of this particular "B" per and raised havoc with the board requiring the policy of the board to be directly restated in very loud terms.
Today, such feelings still persist that the "A" pers are not getting their fair share of the front page for their drivel and they are constantly being bombarded by "B" pers drivel. and are demanding fairness/ equal time.
My question?
Why would any site owner, who cares about their creation, limit content creation to satisfy one certain side of their membership. Particularly when current policy worked for so long a period of time. (when the "A" pers were dominant)
You cannot arbitrarily change the content of a free posting site to favor one side over the other. The best course of action is to allow the long standing policy to hold since it has worked for so long without trouble.
The current issue under discussion is behavior, acting like the adults we are not the children we disolve into when we are feeling butthurt (to steal an expression) cause we are not seeing articles we want to see in the amounts we want to see them, or, they are not getting the play that side wants to see or normally expects to see.
You cannot allow this, it is another form of slap.
I know it seems reasonable on the surface, but it never works in practice.
The only real answer is to have those "A" pers that feel they do not have enough representation post more content, not limit the "B" pers ability to post content. Since the "A" pers only seed one or two a day, they want the "B" pers limited to the same, by creating a more restrictive rule based upon their pattern of posting.
This kind of regulation of content only serves to limit content. It has never worked in the past, I know cause I tried it on one of my sites and have seen other sites try it and fail. It drives those posting away even if they are "B" pers.
The technical term is content balancing.
We need to be aware of such and the potential for this happening here. Affirmative Action, although aiming for a lofty goal, does not work in the long run. If anything the Colleges and Universities clearly established that in the real world and abandoned it 30 years ago.
WE should not start it here under any circumstances.
If the "A" pers are thinking that they do not have enough content, then they should take responsibility to add more, not demand a limit on the "B" pers content.
But this does bring up another issue that is valid.
A content war. Trivial postings from one side against the other side to dominate the FP which is handled by the current policy as long as it is enforced.
That's all I wanted to say, be aware of those claiming there is a problem when there really isn't.
You do say!
Well Brother, Bless Your Heart!
Both You and Mac!
That's the essential statement. It is not true.
"OH MY LORD!"
It's a conjunctive salutation to a statement.
Reading the inflection of the person using it is paramount when attempting to understand it.
With certain inflections imputed to it, it can be it's own statement.
And what is with the southerners angle, I've heard that salutation used all over the country, mostly by older people, younger people view it as quaint and to be avoided in conversations in the younger crowd lest you be categorized as a hick.
I fear that limiting the number of discussions in a "discussion" forum might be counter-productive; some days are sparsely "attended" and limiting posts might make such days almost completely stagnant.
Indeed, this is about decorum; how many outcomes can result from a "slap"? Either a slap-back or a "fuck you I'm outta' here because why do I need to show up somewhere to be slapped!"
I look at it this way when addressing someone in cyberspace, would you address that individual in the same manner if he was standing in front of you? If not, why not, and if so
Really?
What'd I do?
Thank you Mac for making this point, I forgot it in my posting above...
That is the other reason we shouldn't be thinking about changing a long standing policy on content creation that works.
I agree 100%
I didn't make them up, Mike; I posted the history and meanings.
Thanks, Marine being an east coast city boy, I got concerned.
It was a friendly thank you brother, Southern style...
I wish it was as simple as that Robert, but it isn't.
It came from
I'm not taking a position, Mike, just providing information with regard to a discrepancy that arose in the thread.
:I didn't make them up, Mike; I posted the history and meanings."
actually and for the record...that is not the history, those meanings were originated from and by Jeff Foxworthy from his Blue Collar Tour....just so you know.
I have never seen you, personally, as anything other than polite.